# you guys might wanna see dr oz to day



## gangstadawg

ill let the video show you why.

http://www.doctoroz.com/episode/fattest-women-america-face-off

this is going to turn out to be a train wreck.


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## Fairia

Usually shows like this really make my mind and feelings more messed up than usual and extremely sensitive on which side I should be on. I'm definitely one who isn't achieving fattest person ever (save for any online role plays I do ), but it also took a change as I got older to see that beauty is in all curves and all sizes.

The idea of Dr. Oz forcing his help on some of the ladies reminds me back to what a doctor said, way back on Rikki Lake's show about people being mean to other fat people: You can't really change or help a person unless they personally want to, even if there is an epidemic. Too much forcing can only make things worse most of the time. And now Dr. Ablow saying the idea of feederism is getting off by someone getting sick (there probably is a fetish for that too but I would myself be very leery of when it comes to fetishes that end up being dangerous) and for a super heavy set woman making other heavy women look back. 

To me, I would say a person who thinks or feels that way more than likely allows themselves to feel offended in a way that might reflect on self-esteem issues. So, the mental issues that I've dealt with for a long time and possibly having Asperger's affects me a lot, being easily influenced by any side of a discussion. It's still trying for me to remember to choose and think for myself even with my loved ones bitch and moan about it, or I would assume there's a hint of bitching based on how my mind hears things. So having the feedee/immobility lifestyle is certainly something I won't be trying for anytime soon as an example. Being in the mental health side of the world is just as hard, if not harder, than living in a world where being a larger size assumes you're a walking heart attack.


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## Mindee

February is a "sweep" month in TV. There are 4 sweep periods a year February, May, July & October. These are when local TV ad rates are set, and if you will notice it's when every "dark" and/or "controversial" subject is aired on local TV news and shows like Dr. Oz & Dr. Phil. It was this time back in the day when people like Jerry, Jenny, Sally & Phil trotted out the porn girls with the massive boobie implants or Jenny would stage endless shows about "My mother or daughter dresses like a hooker, please give her a make-over". So now the latest sweep fad are eaters and feeders and those, poor, poor fat girls who are just so heartbroken that they are fat but won't admit it. It gives the "mainstream" people in the audience a time to cluck their disapproval to these poor (obviously low-life & trashy) women and feel superior to them. It drives the ratings through the roof which is EXACTLY what these shows are looking for. Why these people actually agree to go on these shows is beyond me. The same thing happens over & over. The shows always focus on whatever will look freaky to everyday people and the fat people are made to look ridiculous. Show over..ratings winner..higher ad rates..next subject.


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## KHayes666

I could care less about Dr. Oz


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## Marlayna

I missed the show, but I would've liked to have seen it. I'm not a fan of Dr. Oz's, I think he sucks.
Anyone know if they're re-playing it, or if it's available on line?
My motto is live and let live, so if people want help losing weight, fine, but if they don't, it's no one's business but their own.


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## Saoirse

KHayes666 said:


> I could care less about Dr. Oz



You could? I sure as hell couldn't.


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## chicken legs

Wow, what a mess, can't wait to watch the carnage. I recognize some Dimmers. So did you guys have fun on the show?


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## gangstadawg

chicken legs said:


> Wow, what a mess, can't wait to watch the carnage. I recognize some Dimmers. So did you guys have fun on the show?



one woman on the show known as star (aks superstar xxx) might lose a few fans if they seen her on the show.


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## Dr. Feelgood

KHayes666 said:


> I could care less about Dr. Oz



I wish he'd let me help him...


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## KHayes666

Saoirse said:


> You could? I sure as hell couldn't.



Touche...I forgot how that expression went.


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## joswitch




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## Tracyarts

I caught the end of the show, and didn't get a very credible vibe off of the psychology expert they had on. The whole "who made you feel worthless?" angle just struck me as bullshit. Unless you're a narcissist or have had a tremendously fortunate life, somebody, sometime, has made you feel worthless. Everybody has been there, no matter their size. What was the point, aside from hooking them in?

Tracy


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## PeanutButterfly

Out of all the quacks who somehow got a TV show, I hate Dr. Oz the most.


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## truebebeblue

Tracyarts said:


> I caught the end of the show, and didn't get a very credible vibe off of the psychology expert they had on. The whole "who made you feel worthless?" angle just struck me as bullshit. Unless you're a narcissist or have had a tremendously fortunate life, somebody, sometime, has made you feel worthless. Everybody has been there, no matter their size. What was the point, aside from hooking them in?
> 
> Tracy



Getting the fatties to cry ... to prove how 'damaged' all fat people are.Even if we say we are happy we are just fooling ourselves.
Society is getting more and more hostile towards fat people every day it seems.


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## thatgirl08

You have to be a fucking idiot to go on any of these TV shows.


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## Mathias

Dr. Oz is a condescending jerk.


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## thatgirl08

Mathias said:


> Dr. Oz is a condescending jerk.



Truth. xxxxxxxx


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## chicken legs

I feel like I'm being seduced into watching a spin-off reality show staring Dr. Oz's doctor friend.

Edit....

HAHA..you guys blew Dr. Oz's mind. That was too funny.


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## wrestlingguy

Mindee said:


> February is a "sweep" month in TV. There are 4 sweep periods a year February, May, July & October. These are when local TV ad rates are set, and if you will notice it's when every "dark" and/or "controversial" subject is aired on local TV news and shows like Dr. Oz & Dr. Phil. It was this time back in the day when people like Jerry, Jenny, Sally & Phil trotted out the porn girls with the massive boobie implants or Jenny would stage endless shows about "My mother or daughter dresses like a hooker, please give her a make-over". So now the latest sweep fad are eaters and feeders and those, poor, poor fat girls who are just so heartbroken that they are fat but won't admit it. It gives the "mainstream" people in the audience a time to cluck their disapproval to these poor (obviously low-life & trashy) women and feel superior to them. It drives the ratings through the roof which is EXACTLY what these shows are looking for. Why these people actually agree to go on these shows is beyond me. The same thing happens over & over. The shows always focus on whatever will look freaky to everyday people and the fat people are made to look ridiculous. Show over..ratings winner..higher ad rates..next subject.



^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
This!!

Dims would not let me rep you. I don't hate anyone who appears on these shows, I'm just disappointed in them, and their need to get their "fame" at the cost of size acceptance.

In my opinion, via careful manipulation, even made the "good" fatties look bad. If you can't control content, you can't control opinion, and it will always be a losing situation.


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## Ruby Ripples

The DrOz show flooded Fantasy Feeder (where i'm a Mod) with emails and forum posts and pms to site members, without permission, about four weeks ago. When I banned them all I got emails asking if they could have someone on to talk about plus size lifestyle, the woman was trying to make it sound very friendly, then slipped up by saying "we'd like someone to explain it all and defend the fat community".  That one word defend proved their intent, even if I hadn't already realised what it would be like. 

Ugh.


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## GordoNegro

I just hope the hotel stays and other expenses paid were worth it to all on the panel. I can definetly see some webmodels closing their websites down due to purpetrating a fraud. 
I'm kind of glad as it was good to see Star's honesty in wanting to lose lbs, modelling mainly for the $ etc.
Dr. Ablow from his failed talk show, interjecting about how food was for comfort from abuse and molestation.
Seeing those who went nationwide about their gaining, are taking a 180 now.
I'm just sorry for the real time supersized folk who enjoy food just because they do, as this episode made things harder for alot of people.


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## S13Drifter

I would love to see the raw taping of that show, un-cut. What really was missed


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## Webmaster

Very nasty and very unproductive. And a prime reason for why we don't let those vultures use our boards to seek prey for their sensationalist shows.


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## Ivy

S13Drifter said:


> I would love to see the raw taping of that show, un-cut. What really was missed



I spoke with Reenaye right after she left the studio, and she told me all about it. I'm hoping she will post here to shed some light on what actually happened there. I do know that they got her there under false pretenses and she did her best to hold her own. Given the circumstances, I think she did the best that anyone could have.


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## truebebeblue

Ivy said:


> I spoke with Reenaye right after she left the studio, and she told me all about it. I'm hoping she will post here to shed some light on what actually happened there. I do know that they got her there under false pretenses and she did her best to hold her own. Given the circumstances, I think she did the best that anyone could have.




But that's the thing Ivy, and I have spoken to Reenaye she is a nice person, this is not the first person from the community to go on a talk show and later regret it the false pretense,outright lies and creative editing is very well known.This has been happening since the 80s! She had to know it would happen. They all knew or had suspicion and they did it anyway and I think that sucks. The only way I would ever agree is if they formally agreed to allow me to have a copy of the unedited show that I could distribute freely(for no profit) anything else is setting yourself up for humiliation. You can tell she tried to get her point across but they can't and never will allow someone to prove their "doctor" wrong!


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## Reenaye Starr

S13Drifter said:


> I would love to see the raw taping of that show, un-cut. What really was missed



You would certainly be surprised what you missed. They were veryyyy careful to edit out any good points that were made by me, and they also edited out when Dr. Ablo became frothing at the mouth vicious towards me and my loved ones and I called him out hardcore. It was aggrivating, but I walked on with my head held high and walked out the same way. No amount of quack psychiatry can make me hate myself. What a waste of time self-hatred is. What jerks those people are. The schmoozed me hard to get me on the show. LAME.


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## Isa

truebebeblue said:


> But that's the thing Ivy, and I have spoken to Reenaye she is a nice person, this is not the first person from the community to go on a talk show and later regret it the false pretense,outright lies and creative editing is very well known.*This has been happening since the 80s!* She had to know it would happen. They all knew or had suspicion and they did it anyway and I think that sucks. SNIP



No one going on this type of show can claim innocence anymore. Everyone should be honest and admit they wanted the expense free vacation and just live with the results.


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## Reenaye Starr

And also, I just want to say earnestly to anyone who was offended by my appearance on the show that I did know there was a VERY real possibility going into it, that they were lying about their intentions. I know that show was going to happen with or without me on it, and I felt frankly that maybe... just maybe I could make some tiny bit of difference, or at least be one person who represented our community with self-confidence and intelligence.

That being said, after the show, there were some audience members that came to me in the elevator... They were skinny women. And they told me. "We think you did great, we love that you love yourself... We think you are beautiful, and we thought Dr. Ablo was mean and way out of line, especially when he insulted your husband." So that... and the hot dog vendor on the way to the airport, were my highlights of the day. 

Also, I just got a PM from some one who said he is a BHM always has felt that men should be muscular, and that he wanted to learn from my example and love himself more the way he is.

So hey... If it made a difference to those people in the elevator and that one Big Handsome Man... I am a-ok. If anyone else feels that I have embarrassed them, I apologize... But it is what it is.


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## Weirdo890

It's such a shame that shows like this ultimately end up a sideshow. It's an interesting topic by itself, and should be looked with a mature eye and a non-judgmental stance. I hope the documentary for Channel 4 Reenaye is doing goes a lot better.


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## wrestlingguy

There's a wonderful thread that's a sticky at the top of the Main Dimensions Board called "Fat Activism Opportunities".

There are many great suggestions in that thread.

Appearing on Dr. Oz is not among those suggestions.


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## Reenaye Starr

Weirdo890 said:


> It's such a shame that shows like this ultimately end up a sideshow. It's an interesting topic by itself, and should be looked with a mature eye and a non-judgmental stance. I hope the documentary for Channel 4 Reenaye is doing goes a lot better.



I really think it will... I have been talking to these people for 6+ months, and they are much better. There are so few fat women over there that they don't need to sensationalize it for it to be "interesting" TV. The questions they ask, and just their entire manner is much much different and WAY MORE POSITIVE.


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## Reenaye Starr

wrestlingguy said:


> There's a wonderful thread that's a sticky at the top of the Main Dimensions Board called "Fat Activism Opportunities".
> 
> There are many great suggestions in that thread.
> 
> Appearing on Dr. Oz is not among those suggestions.



hahaha. That made me laugh so hard, I literally spit out my soda. :bow: Point taken.


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## Weirdo890

Reenaye Starr said:


> I really think it will... I have been talking to these people for 6+ months, and they are much better. There are so few fat women over there that they don't need to sensationalize it for it to be "interesting" TV. The questions they ask, and just their entire manner is much much different and WAY MORE POSITIVE.



Glad to hear. If all goes well, will you do one about BHMs too?


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## CastingPearls

I think it was before I joined here but wasn't there another webmodel who was also in long-term communication with, if not Channel4, perhaps another UK enterprise and she said they were positive and more enlightened yet they lied to her and sensationalized everything? And if I recall, she had little or no rights to any of that footage and when it trickled down to other 'news sources' it was edited to a shadow of its former glory and to this day she's vilified because of statements she may or may not have made and things she may or may not have done?


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## diggers1917

CastingPearls said:


> I think it was before I joined here but wasn't there another webmodel who was also in long-term communication with, if not Channel4, perhaps another UK enterprise and she said they were positive and more enlightened yet they lied to her and sensationalized everything? And if I recall, she had little or no rights to any of that footage and when it trickled down to other 'news sources' it was edited to a shadow of its former glory and to this day she's vilified because of statements she may or may not have made and things she may or may not have done?



I'm not 100% as to which model you mean, but I do remember that it was Channel 4 that did 'Fat Girls and Feeders' which I think involved Teighlor along the way, the documentary that simultaneous told me what I was and made me hate myself for it for years (until finding this place and learning that while there are screwed up people out there, simply being a feeder doesn't automatically make you one of them)

So while I wish Reenaye the best of luck with the people of Channel 4 (who _are_ capable of putting out some truly great TV when they put their minds to it) and I'll look out for the finished product, I'm far from certain that they wont try to make it a sensationalist freakshow.


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## collared Princess

Dr Oz got mad at me because I refused to do the show ..sigh


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## butch

Now I know Dr. Oz is a fraud, if he'd have the hack for hire Dr. Ablow on his show.


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## DevilynStJames

I have to say I'm truly disappointed that people are bashing the women that appeared on the show. Some were lurred with the promise of help (if they wanted it) and some went to make a soild stand for the community as a whole.Yes its a shame that things get edited for sensationalism. I for one would love to see the unedited version of the show. I dont think anyone went just for the vacation. In my opinion part of the problem is when people to try to step up and positively represent,if it doesn't meet everyone approval, then these people are burned at the proverbial stake so to speak. We need to stick together and uplift each other as a whole not tear each other down like children in a schoolyard. I am looking forward to seeing what channel 4 brings to the table since Renee is an intelligent and positive woman, I dont see her getting burned twice.


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## Russell Williams

I hope that the rest of it was not as appalling as the part that I saw. This person that insisted that people are fat because of some sort of hidden psychological problem ranks right up there with the brand of psychology that insisted that fat women were hiding from their sensuality because they did not want to appear attractive and the so-called expert who said that all fat women are fat because they been molested as children. But according to that particular approach if you see a fat woman you know that she is been molested and if she says that she is not been molested than she is in denial and needs to come out of denial and recognize that she has been molested. Ain't no way for a fat person to win that one.



The trouble was some of what Dr. Oz was allowing to be said was nonsense. The expert that came on and said that the reason people are fat is because they have some sort of a psychological problem and if they find out what the problem is then they will not be fat. If that statement is true then the way to solve the so-called obesity problem is to find out which psychological approach works best. If that is the psychological situation than there is absolutely no need for weight watchers or any of the other such programs. I doubt that weight watchers would agree that their program is pointless because fat people are fat because they have psychological issues that they're trying to hide. If Dr. Oz's expert is correct then the reason Americans are getting fatter is not due to their dietary habits but rather it is due to increasing psychological problems of the American population. Anyone want to try to convince Michelle Obama of that?

Nonsense number two. Introducing a woman as the fattest woman in the world. I have personally met and in one case slept in the swimming pool of women who one point in their life were bigger than 700 pounds. At one point they were both over 800 pounds.


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## Russell Williams

wrestlingguy said:


> ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
> This!!
> 
> Dims would not let me rep you. I don't hate anyone who appears on these shows, I'm just disappointed in them, and their need to get their "fame" at the cost of size acceptance.
> 
> In my opinion, via careful manipulation, even made the "good" fatties look bad. If you can't control content, you can't control opinion, and it will always be a losing situation.



We could not control the content, Mike Wallace controlled it. Yet, most people felt that Mike Wallace did a very good job and at no point was he trying to belittle fat people. He was listening to the heart aches so many fat people have.


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## Russell Williams

GordoNegro said:


> I just hope the hotel stays and other expenses paid were worth it to all on the panel. I can definetly see some webmodels closing their websites down due to purpetrating a fraud.
> 
> .



Perhaps you have some proof that that these were the motivations of the people involved but I think the comment is just an attacking one and likely to hurt people. I believe that they were hurt enough on Dr. Oz and do not need to come here and be hurt again.


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## Russell Williams

Reenaye Starr said:


> You would certainly be surprised what you missed. They were veryyyy careful to edit out any good points that were made by me, and they also edited out when Dr. Ablo became frothing at the mouth vicious towards me and my loved ones and I called him out hardcore. It was aggrivating, but I walked on with my head held high and walked out the same way. No amount of quack psychiatry can make me hate myself. What a waste of time self-hatred is. What jerks those people are. The schmoozed me hard to get me on the show. OAME.[/(QUOTE]
> 
> (with a laugh Louise just commented, "Russell I don't know when your opinion has ever been humble.)
> 
> Reenaye Starr you fought a good fight. You went into the battle prepared to deal logically with concernedd and caring people who were trying to understand. Instead you found yourself in a situation where well trained attack dogs were trying to tear you apart psychologically and exposure to public ridicule. In our society it is no longer acceptable to pull out a gun and shoot such attackers. You did the best you could. Those who attacked you, instead of feeling the shame they should feel, will rejoice in the possibility that they have psychologically injured you and your friends.


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## Marlayna

Russell Williams said:


> I hope that the rest of it was not as appalling as the part that I saw. This person that insisted that people are fat because of some sort of hidden psychological problem ranks right up there with the brand of psychology that insisted that fat women were hiding from their sensuality because they did not want to appear attractive and the so-called expert who said that all fat women are fat because they been molested as children. But according to that particular approach if you see a fat woman you know that she is been molested and if she says that she is not been molested than she is in denial and needs to come out of denial and recognize that she has been molested. Ain't no way for a fat person to win that one.
> 
> 
> 
> The trouble was some of what Dr. Oz was allowing to be said was nonsense. The expert that came on and said that the reason people are fat is because they have some sort of a psychological problem and if they find out what the problem is then they will not be fat. If that statement is true then the way to solve the so-called obesity problem is to find out which psychological approach works best. If that is the psychological situation than there is absolutely no need for weight watchers or any of the other such programs. I doubt that weight watchers would agree that their program is pointless because fat people are fat because they have psychological issues that they're trying to hide. If Dr. Oz's expert is correct then the reason Americans are getting fatter is not due to their dietary habits but rather it is due to increasing psychological problems of the American population. Anyone want to try to convince Michelle Obama of that?
> 
> Nonsense number two. Introducing a woman as the fattest woman in the world. I have personally met and in one case slept in the swimming pool of women who one point in their life were bigger than 700 pounds. At one point they were both over 800 pounds.


Did you mean to say "swam"... not "slept" in the swimming pool?


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## Dromond

I've read the whole thread, and nothing I've seen posted has changed my opinion. If you appear on one of these shows, you are a sucker. I've yet to see any of these afternoon "doctor" shows present fat people in a neutral (nevermind _positive_) light.


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## blubrluvr

I think both Oz and Ablow are closet FAs. Why else do they insist on doing shows that feature all that hotness?


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## Ruby Ripples

Reenaye Starr said:


> I really think it will... I have been talking to these people for 6+ months, and they are much better. There are so few fat women over there that they don't need to sensationalize it for it to be "interesting" TV. The questions they ask, and just their entire manner is much much different and WAY MORE POSITIVE.



Channel 4?? As In UK Channel 4? It can't be the UK you mean if you are saying there are "so few fat women over there". Scotland is one of the fattest countries in the world and England isn't far behind. Have you ever been here or did someone tell you this?? It's MUCH more likely that our fat women know how the UK media treat us, and so we all refuse to be on such tv shows here, so theyre going to the US for participants. 

Believe me when I say that they love sensationalising this kind of thing, and fat people here are generally treated much worse than those in the US, in so much as at least you have some rights there and some places make allowances. There is none of that here. All we have is the media blasting us every day for the "obesity epidemic" as it's being called. and the TV full of programmes such as The Biggest Loser or one where they make a group of supersize people walk five hundred miles to lose weight and face their obesity. It was called "Too Fat to Walk?" and was made by guess who? Channel 4. That programme is just awful, it must be hell on their joints for the future, it's nothing more than an excuse to torture those people for being fat and let the viewers laugh at them and point in disgust. WHO with any brain or common sense would suggest for a 400lb sedentary person to go out one day and undertake a 500 mile walk, walking every single day. The ones that gave up felt like utter losers. 

I would ask you one thing - do you think that programme was made to HELP those people? If you can find an episode, watch it. It was clearly meant for audience entertainment, nothing else. 

On one quick google, I found this broadsheet newspaper article from five years ago. Five years on, things are even worse. http://www.independent.co.uk/news/media/big-ratings-overweight-and-on-tv-422949.html


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## Ruby Ripples

Dromond said:


> I've read the whole thread, and nothing I've seen posted has changed my opinion. If you appear on one of these shows, you are a sucker. I've yet to see any of these afternoon "doctor" shows present fat people in a neutral (nevermind _positive_) light.



Hear, hear!


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## Russ2d

Russell Williams said:


> I hope that the rest of it was not as appalling as the part that I saw. This person that insisted that people are fat because of some sort of hidden psychological problem ranks right up there with the brand of psychology that insisted that fat women were hiding from their sensuality because they did not want to appear attractive and the so-called expert who said that all fat women are fat because they been molested as children. But according to that particular approach if you see a fat woman you know that she is been molested and if she says that she is not been molested than she is in denial and needs to come out of denial and recognize that she has been molested. Ain't no way for a fat person to win that one.
> 
> 
> 
> The trouble was some of what Dr. Oz was allowing to be said was nonsense. The expert that came on and said that the reason people are fat is because they have some sort of a psychological problem and if they find out what the problem is then they will not be fat. If that statement is true then the way to solve the so-called obesity problem is to find out which psychological approach works best. If that is the psychological situation than there is absolutely no need for weight watchers or any of the other such programs. I doubt that weight watchers would agree that their program is pointless because fat people are fat because they have psychological issues that they're trying to hide. If Dr. Oz's expert is correct then the reason Americans are getting fatter is not due to their dietary habits but rather it is due to increasing psychological problems of the American population. Anyone want to try to convince Michelle Obama of that?
> 
> Nonsense number two. Introducing a woman as the fattest woman in the world. I have personally met and in one case slept in the swimming pool of women who one point in their life were bigger than 700 pounds. At one point they were both over 800 pounds.



Apparently these "doctors" have never heard of this little thing called, Genetics...

What a joke


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## ThatFatGirl

DevilynStJames said:


> I have to say I'm truly disappointed that people are bashing the women that appeared on the show. Some were lurred with the promise of help (if they wanted it) and some went to make a soild stand for the community as a whole.Yes its a shame that things get edited for sensationalism. I for one would love to see the unedited version of the show. I dont think anyone went just for the vacation. In my opinion part of the problem is when people to try to step up and positively represent,if it doesn't meet everyone approval, then these people are burned at the proverbial stake so to speak. We need to stick together and uplift each other as a whole not tear each other down like children in a schoolyard. I am looking forward to seeing what channel 4 brings to the table since Renee is an intelligent and positive woman, I dont see her getting burned twice.



Positively represent what community? The fetish community? None of the ladies sitting left of Dr. Oz represent me in the slightest. What's unfortunate is that the typical audience of the show, the better part of society, and stupid Dr. Oz don't know the difference.


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## Ned Sonntag

butch said:


> Now I know Dr. Oz is a fraud, if he'd have the hack for hire Dr. Ablow on his show.


 At least Howard/Tiger DeVore stayed out of this one.:doh:


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## Emma

Reenaye Starr said:


> I really think it will... I have been talking to these people for 6+ months, and they are much better. There are so few fat women over there that they don't need to sensationalize it for it to be "interesting" TV. The questions they ask, and just their entire manner is much much different and WAY MORE POSITIVE.



I hate to say this but channel 4 are one of the most notoriously bad channels for sensationalising things. There are also many fat women over here. I've just got my fingers crossed that you're not with Endemol. Did you ever see fat girls and feeders? They told the people on that it was a documentary about fat admiration.


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## Reenaye Starr

ThatFatGirl said:


> Positively represent what community? The fetish community? None of the ladies sitting left of Dr. Oz represent me in the slightest. What's unfortunate is that the typical audience of the show, the better part of society, and stupid Dr. Oz don't know the difference.



I understand where you are coming from and to tell the truth, I was there in part to represent the feederism community, of which I am a member. So many many women in the feederism lifestyle who do TV are women like Suzanne who "want to be the world's fattest woman" I don't judge her in the the least and I say if that's what you want, go for it. There are many of us (feedees) who have much different expectations of our lives and our bodies... 

But I am also a fat-positive person who loves myself truly and deeply. Being a positive, self-confident, and active bbw and being a feedee are NOT mutually exclusive and THAT was one of the main points I tried to get across on the show that was unfortunately put on the chopping blocking in the editing room. I can't represent every woman in this community nor did I ever intend to. I was simply there to represent myself. Again, I am sorry if any one else feels embarrassed by my actions, but I truly am proud of myself for doing the best that I could in an impossible situation.


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## Reenaye Starr

CurvyEm said:


> I hate to say this but channel 4 are one of the most notoriously bad channels for sensationalising things. There are also many fat women over here. I've just got my fingers crossed that you're not with Endemol. Did you ever see fat girls and feeders? They told the people on that it was a documentary about fat admiration.



BettyTv is the company I am working with, and so far it seems good. I guess if I get twice burned, that is on me... But once again, if I don't do it, some one else will in my place, and frankly... I feel like I can have something positive to convey.


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## DevilynStJames

ThatFatGirl said:


> Positively represent what community? The fetish community? None of the ladies sitting left of Dr. Oz represent me in the slightest. What's unfortunate is that the typical audience of the show, the better part of society, and stupid Dr. Oz don't know the difference.



I was referring to the fetish community, in regards to the show. 

'In my opinion part of the problem is when people to try to step up and positively represent,if it doesn't meet everyone approval,then these people are burned at the proverbial stake so to speak' I was referring to people in general that have tried to put a positive foot forward. I'm sorry if you misunderstood my post.


----------



## DevilynStJames

Reenaye Starr said:


> I understand where you are coming from and to tell the truth, I was there in part to represent the feederism community, of which I am a member. So many many women in the feederism lifestyle who do TV are women like Suzanne who "want to be the world's fattest woman" I don't judge her in the the least and I say if that's what you want, go for it. There are many of us (feedees) who have much different expectations of our lives and our bodies...
> 
> But I am also a fat-positive person who loves myself truly and deeply. Being a positive, self-confident, and active bbw and being a feedee are NOT mutually exclusive and THAT was one of the main points I tried to get across on the show that was unfortunately put on the chopping blocking in the editing room. I can't represent every woman in this community nor did I ever intend to. I was simply there to represent myself. Again, I am sorry if any one else feels embarrassed by my actions, but I truly am proud of myself for doing the best that I could in an impossible situation.



You were awesome!!! Kudos to you for having the balls to represent!


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## Dromond

You're living in a fantasy world. The only way you will be able to represent yourself in a positive light is if you control the message.


----------



## Ruby Ripples

Reenaye Starr said:


> BettyTv is the company I am working with, and so far it seems good. I guess if I get twice burned, that is on me... But once again, if I don't do it, some one else will in my place, and frankly... I feel like I can have something positive to convey.



Betty harrassed members of Fantasy Feeder two to three weeks ago too. Every time I banned them, they made up different accounts. I even had them emailing the main site email too. The guy didn't want to take no for an answer. In fact, he even sent me a pm on Dimensions forums, is that where he found you? I reported him to Conrad, who banned the guy.


----------



## Russell Williams

Marlayna said:


> Did you mean to say "swam"... not "slept" in the swimming pool?




Louise and I were visiting a woman and her husband. This woman at a later point in her life weighed over 800 pounds. Louise and others were at one end of the pool talking with each other. I laid in my back and floated away. As Louise described it to me, as they were talking they started to hear strange noises and were wondering what the strange noise was and where it was coming from. Finally they realize that it was me at the other end of the pool floating on my back, asleep and snoring.


----------



## Fish

I did NOT want to watch this show. I can't stand that condescending ass hat, Dr. Oz, but one of the guests on the show is a friend and had already heard about everything that went down. Sadly, I was NOT surprised in the least that the show was a manipulatively edited joke. And to add injury to insult, Dr. Ablow was aggressively confrontational. Everything about his is designed to intimidate. Did you notice how he never sits in a relaxed posture? He's always leaning at whoever he's talking down to, usually with his hands and arms held in an aggressive fashion.

And to compound it, apparently Ablow is some sort of mental help professional? I've BEEN to therapists and as a general rule, I've never heard one that pretty much literally says that enacting a physical change will somehow address and even cure deep seeded emotional issues.

If, one is in fact overweight due to personal past traumas or issues, then if they lose weight, THAT WON'T CURE THOSE ISSUES.

But ultimately, that's the real issue. Dr. Oz and his ilk aren't interested in actually helping people. Mentally and physically healthy people would have no need for his sanctimonious, pretentious bullshit. So he instead sells quick fix catch phrases, show and tell platitudes and visual gimmicks like that heart nonsense to appeal to those who already hate themselves and sell them his services.

His show exists to take advantage of people with low self esteem and poor self image. He feeds then meaningless mind candy. (Irony alert) It makes them feel better (like a drug) yet effects no real or meaningful change. Is there any other reason why a "Doctor" had an episode "Dress to look thinner instantly!"?


----------



## Russell Williams

Louise tells me that at one point she was a pilot show and she was one of the fat people representing fat acceptance. A heavyset man in the audience stood up and said that he would never date or marry a fat woman. Louise responded with the comment that he better hope he could find women who are willing to date and marry fat man. Louise says, as far as she knows, the pilot program never made it into a series.


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## wrestlingguy

Russell Williams said:


> We could not control the content, Mike Wallace controlled it. Yet, most people felt that Mike Wallace did a very good job and at no point was he trying to belittle fat people. He was listening to the heart aches so many fat people have.



True Russell, but there's a huge difference between them. Mike Wallace represented a NEWS show, whereas OZ represents an editorial type show. As such, Wallace would be nothing less than objective, and OZ will always tilt the bar back in his favor.

You're articulate, and can shoot from the hip, and can see when someone is trying to manipulate. Would you ever consider appearing on Dr. Oz?


----------



## wrestlingguy

DevilynStJames said:


> 'In my opinion part of the problem is when people to try to step up and positively represent,if it doesn't meet everyone approval,then these people are burned at the proverbial stake so to speak' I was referring to people in general that have tried to put a positive foot forward. I'm sorry if you misunderstood my post.



Now that I understand your post, I can express this better to you.

When the average American tunes in and watches this show, they don't know what we know, that this guy edits the hell out of the content to bend the message to suit him, and that he actually doesn't have the support of most of the medical community.

So when that average American looks at any fat person on these shows, and the message Oz sends out, the generalizations are then made about EVERY fat person, not just the one(s) they see on TV. 

Here, imagine this. Jackie Robinson was the first black baseball player to make it to the major leagues. Imagine if he was an idiot, or a scumbag, or worse yet, someone who acted like he was embarrassed of his race. What would that have done to those other players who wanted to make it in major league baseball.

So, when a fat person goes on these shows, keep in mind that you ARE representing all fat people, whether you want that responsibility or not. More important, even if you claim to only represent yourself, your audience isn't seeing it that way.

In my opinion, we'd better get our shit together as a community, and send out a better message that what we've done thus far. We are very much like a dysfunctional family at times, but we should be dysfunctional privately, and be just the opposite to the media.

Wouldn't it have been wonderful to see all the women walk off the show TOGETHER, regardless of feelings about weight gain and feederism, and send a message to Dr. Oz that we won't put up with his theatrics? Think about it.


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## truebebeblue

I think the issue with solidarity comes from the fact that MOST people in The SA community are not interested in and/or do not understand the feeding/gaining community. Encouraging a woman to change her body to become fatter OR thinner is in my opinion directly opposite of the idea of acceptance. You would be hotter if you gained 100 lbs is NO different than someone saying you would be hotter if you lost 100 lbs. I do not think the fetish side of the community lends anything to the notion that the SA is a legitimate movement. Yes fat people have sex,yes some of them are kinky and there are slight differences when it comes to sex with fatties but that should not be the points we are bringing to the media and society in general. If all the GLBT community talked about in the media was fisting and circuit parties do you think people would be as accepting? I do not. Pointing out the difference in society that is fearful of anything different will only lead to more ridicule.
That's my view on it anyway. Yes coming from a girl who makes a living being fat and naked.

True



wrestlingguy said:


> Now that I understand your post, I can express this better to you.
> 
> When the average American tunes in and watches this show, they don't know what we know, that this guy edits the hell out of the content to bend the message to suit him, and that he actually doesn't have the support of most of the medical community.
> 
> So when that average American looks at any fat person on these shows, and the message Oz sends out, the generalizations are then made about EVERY fat person, not just the one(s) they see on TV.
> 
> Here, imagine this. Jackie Robinson was the first black baseball player to make it to the major leagues. Imagine if he was an idiot, or a scumbag, or worse yet, someone who acted like he was embarrassed of his race. What would that have done to those other players who wanted to make it in major league baseball.
> 
> So, when a fat person goes on these shows, keep in mind that you ARE representing all fat people, whether you want that responsibility or not. More important, even if you claim to only represent yourself, your audience isn't seeing it that way.
> 
> In my opinion, we'd better get our shit together as a community, and send out a better message that what we've done thus far. We are very much like a dysfunctional family at times, but we should be dysfunctional privately, and be just the opposite to the media.
> 
> Wouldn't it have been wonderful to see all the women walk off the show TOGETHER, regardless of feelings about weight gain and feederism, and send a message to Dr. Oz that we won't put up with his theatrics? Think about it.


----------



## Reenaye Starr

truebebeblue said:


> I think the issue with solidarity comes from the fact that MOST people in The SA community are not interested in and/or do not understand the feeding/gaining community. Encouraging a woman to change her body to become fatter OR thinner is in my opinion directly opposite of the idea of acceptance. You would be hotter if you gained 100 lbs is NO different than someone saying you would be hotter if you lost 100 lbs. I do not think the fetish side of the community lends anything to the notion that the SA is a legitimate movement. Yes fat people have sex,yes some of them are kinky and there are slight differences when it comes to sex with fatties but that should not be the points we are bringing to the media and society in general. If all the GLBT community talked about in the media was fisting and circuit parties do you think people would be as accepting? I do not. Pointing out the difference in society that is fearful of anything different will only lead to more ridicule.
> That's my view on it anyway. Yes coming from a girl who makes a living being fat and naked
> 
> 
> True



Contrary to popular belief not all of feederism is about weight gain or how many pounds you can pack on to alter your body and for MOST of the women I know who are involved in it, it is far more about personal choice and what we find HOT, than what will make us more acceptable as a partner to some one else. I refuse to apologize for being outspoken about my lifestyle. I know that it is not for everyone. I do not judge others for their personal choices. The point of fat acceptance is about loving and accepting yourself. I can simultaneously love and accept myself and choose to lose weight, just the same as I can love myself and choose to gain. I try to encourage anyone I know to love themselves and do what makes them happy in life. That is what it is all about.


Also, I feel it is important to read AnnMarie's final post on the thread "Has gaining gone too far?" to understand why dimensions is not the appropriate venue to debate my choice to be a gainer.


----------



## wrestlingguy

I don't want to speak for True, but can the feeders put away the whole "I need to tell the world about this" mindset just long enough to work together?

Back in 1979, a movie director named William Friedkin was filming a movie in lower New York City called "Cruising" with Al Pacino. In the movie, he plays a cop who goes undercover as a gay man who frequents fetish clubs, in an effort to track down a killer.

The New York gay community did everything they could to stop the production, by yelling in the streets during filming, throwing things onto the set, protesting around it, and being as disruptive as possible. Why? Because the gay rights community knew that if the fetish side of their ranks were exposed through this movie, the goal of equal rights for gays would not be realized, as they'd all be dismissed as a bunch of S&M crazies who were only there for sex, and nothing more. They even went so far as to take out ads in newspapers in major cities before the film was released, claiming that this movie in no way represented the community of gay people who were there to love each other in the way God intended.

I'm saying this because we're in a similar situation here. I've long been open and honest about my preference for a larger body. A lot of that also comes with a discussion about all the other things that make me, ME........so that in the grand scheme of things, my affinity for fat women seems no less normal than from a guy who likes redheads, or nice legs, or tattoos.

Again, the discussion of weight gain or feederism can degenerate to arguments between the SA people and the feeders, but until the rest of the world catches up to us (and that catch up is always gradual), we should put up a united front, and do the infighting about who's right privately. Otherwise, both sides are wrong.


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## truebebeblue

I agree you can gain or lose and accept yourself but I just don't think SA and fetishism should be linked it makes a normal variation in attraction look like it is something unusual. I am beyond fine with fetishism,I love it,I practice and excel at many types of fetish play. Maybe people in the SA community should stop worrying about what fetishist are saying and treat it like a different unrelated sect? I think it will be impossible because of sites like dims. I don't know what the answer IS but I do not think sensationalism is it. Never apologize for who you are,you are a great person by all accounts. You have to realize by now that you are not on a level playing field with ANY media entity unless you are in complete control of it. They have their own agenda and will use you to further that. If you are interested in making something that is balanced you should make a documentary with someone who expects zero profit aside from telling YOUR truth.Hell we know the porn community has lighting and cameras! We could make a 100 docs pretty easily.



Reenaye Starr said:


> Contrary to popular belief not all of feederism is about weight gain or how many pounds you can pack on to alter your body and for MOST of the women I know who are involved in it, it is far more about personal choice and what we find HOT, than what will make us more acceptable as a partner to some one else. I refuse to apologize for being outspoken about my lifestyle. I know that it is not for everyone. I do not judge others for their personal choices. The point of fat acceptance is about loving and accepting yourself. I can simultaneously love and accept myself and choose to lose weight, just the same as I can love myself and choose to gain. I try to encourage anyone I know to love themselves and do what makes them happy in life. That is what it is all about.


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## MzDeeZyre

ThatFatGirl said:


> None of the ladies sitting left of Dr. Oz represent me in the slightest. What's unfortunate is that the typical audience of the show, the better part of society, and stupid Dr. Oz don't know the difference.



A-freaking Men!!!! Couldn't have said it better myself!!!


----------



## Reenaye Starr

wrestlingguy said:


> I don't want to speak for True, but can the feeders put away the whole "I need to tell the world about this" mindset just long enough to work together?
> 
> Back in 1979, a movie director named William Friedkin was filming a movie in lower New York City called "Cruising" with Al Pacino. In the movie, he plays a cop who goes undercover as a gay man who frequents fetish clubs, in an effort to track down a killer.
> 
> The New York gay community did everything they could to stop the production, by yelling in the streets during filming, throwing things onto the set, protesting around it, and being as disruptive as possible. Why? Because the gay rights community knew that if the fetish side of their ranks, the goal of equal rights for gays would not be realized, as they'd all be dismissed as a bunch of S&M crazies who were only there for sex, and nothing more. They even went so far as to take out ads in newspapers in major cities before the film was released, claiming that this movie in no way represented the community of gay people who were there to love each other in the way God intended.
> 
> I'm saying this because we're in a similar situation here. I've long been open and honest about my preference for a larger body. A lot of that also comes with a discussion about all the other things that make me, ME........so that in the grand scheme of things, my affinity for fat women seems no less normal than from a guy who likes redheads, or nice legs, or tattoos.
> 
> Again, the discussion of weight gain or feederism can degenerate to arguments between the SA people and the feeders, but until the rest of the world catches up to us (and that catch up is always gradual), we should put up a united front, and do the infighting about who's right privately. Otherwise, both sides are wrong.



My voice doesn't have to sound like your voice to be valid. The best thing we can do to promote size acceptance is to embrace and love the subcultures within our midst, just as the Gay and Lesbian community has broadened there horizons to be more inclusive by including bisexual and transgenderred people.


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## wrestlingguy

Reenaye Starr said:


> My voice doesn't have to sound like your voice to be valid. The best thing we can do to promote size acceptance is to embrace and love the subcultures within our midst, just as the Gay and Lesbian community has broadened there horizons to be more inclusive by including bisexual and transgenderred people.



They were broadened as the gay community began to achieve acceptance, and not before. 

Do it your way, and come back in 5 years and let me know how you make out. The notion that "hey, I'm more important than the goal of size acceptance" will get you nowhere. If you're cool with that, then have fun.

You don't have to have my, or anyone else's voice. Sometimes you just gotta know when not to sing.

I'm outs. Send me the next "victim" that is thinking about appearing on Oz.


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## truebebeblue

I do not want to attack anyone because honestly I do not have the answer myself. If we had the answer we wouldn't continue with circular argument. I just think that the RIGHTS of all fat people are more important than the kinky sexuality of a percentage of the population and maybe that's where we should focus. I mean,lots of fat people do not even accept gaining/feeding so why would 'normal' people? It's just too foreign to them. They can more easily understand that people look differently and need to be treated with respect.

Besides part of the fun of kinky sex is that it is taboo and secret!

The whole circular argument that has been going on for years is SO discouraging for me... and I think I am just going to ignore it for a while.


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## moore2me

When we look at the great doctors, healers, scientific minds and men and women that advance our civilization - the cur Dr Oz will not remembered AT ALL. He helps no one but himself or his network handlers. His shows closely resembles the early sideshows in tents of carnivals. The difference is the performers are not paid scale - doc keeps most of the money. 

Someone with his kind of reach in audience could do so much good and sooth the pain and help with relevant medical issues of so many around the world - but this guy chooses not to. In fact, like a spider he even lures people to his den and puts them on camera to inflict his special brand of "torment/public shame/rehab". 

And the the doctors' sacred oath of first Do No Harm - is violated in that people like me who are trying to live a normal life find this man intent on shredding and destroying my confidence and self worth. I figured out early in his career what his "bag" was and don't watch his show. A combination of changing the TV channel, having a strong sense of self worth, and my handy tin foil helment keep his evil programs from harming my mind.


P.S. Russell as usual your amazing complicated stories never cease to entertain. Whether you, were sleeping with a group of women in that pool or swimming with the women (or both) it is a great story. Now, I am thinking what the pool had in it. Jello? Pudding? Whipped cream? . . . . . .


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## CastingPearls

moore2me said:


> P.S. Russell as usual your amazing complicated stories never cease to entertain. Whether you, were sleeping with a group of women in that pool or swimming with the women (or both) it is a great story. Now, I am thinking what the pool had in it. Jello? Pudding? Whipped cream? . . . . . .




Styrofoam peanuts????


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## Fish

wrestlingguy said:


> The notion that "hey, I'm more important than the goal of size acceptance" will get you nowhere. If you're cool with that, then have fun.



To the best of my knowledge, they contacted Reenaye and asked her on the show to give her perspective on her specific lifestyle. Sure, they turned around and changed the dynamic of why she was there in a typical talk show ambush style, but ultimately she wasn't there to speak on behalf of anyone but herself. 

And I do understand the knee-jerk reaction folks have when we see something that is representative of US representing us in a way we don't like. _(For Pete's sake, I'm a comic book fan/nerd... we're HARDLY well represented in media.)_ But that's an inherent part of what happens ANY time you choose to apply the idea of a "community" to a group of people with some connecting trait, interest or idea. Quite instantly, the group starts to splinter from within and we get threads like this. 

At the end of the day, I don't think there really IS a "size acceptance movement". There are countless individuals doing their own thing that occasionally overlap. And to assume that every one of us bears the responsibility to speak for the group at all times is unrealistic and, I feel, wrong. 

The needs of the many outweighing the needs of the few is a romantic ideal and makes for great "Star Trek" sequels. But in the real world, I speak for myself and myself alone. Why should Reenaye or anyone else have to do any different?

Or to put it more succinctly, No one person is a "community". We are all individuals with our own thoughts, feelings, ideas and ideals and nobody should make anyone make anyone else feel *wrong* for expressing themselves.


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## LovelyLiz

I think that as much as these conversations seem repetitive and circular and boring, we need to keep having them, because they bring up really important tensions and issues that are not going away.

Like, what do we do about the fact that even if an individual doesn't want to represent an entire group, it often works out that to the general public who may not have as much exposure to that group, they do? Do we ignore it, do we do serious image management, do we say f*ck people's perceptions and just be however we want to be? What are the implications of each choice? Does it matter? (In some ways this hearkens back to the croissant on a train thread...that for all its lunacy brought up some really helpful discussion points.)

Also, what about the *common good*? Do we really have NO responsibility to each other as a community (not even as a fat community, but as a HUMAN community)? Is it really every person for him/herself, as Fish implies in his above post? I don't think so. I think that we do have obligations to our fellow humans, and we aren't just meant to be out for ourselves as if we exist in a vacuum apart from any other humans. But from there, the more interesting questions to me are what the extent is of that responsibility, where the lines are drawn, etc.

These are good conversations, and I appreciate the arguments, and I often realize something new in reading people's thoughts - so I really hope we don't decide to stop these dialogues because they seem repetitive.


----------



## wrestlingguy

Fish said:


> To the best of my knowledge, they contacted Reenaye and asked her on the show to give her perspective on her specific lifestyle. Sure, they turned around and changed the dynamic of why she was there in a typical talk show ambush style, but ultimately she wasn't there to speak on behalf of anyone but herself.



The solicitation that came from the Dr. Oz show read as follows:



> I am a producer for The Dr. Oz Show. The Dr. Oz Show is doing a segment as a follow up to a show we did with Suzanne Eman - *on feederism and the lifestyle of most BBWs.*
> 
> We had a lot of people disagree with her lifestyle as a bbw superstar, so *we're hoping to have women like yourself on to explain more about the gaining culture *and some of the fetishes people participate in like feederism. I was wondering if you were available to speak and possibly be a part of this segment. We can provide travel to and from NY for this segment.
> 
> Thank you and hope to hear from you soon!
> -Carly



I know most of us can read, and what I've bolded is a solicitation to speak on on the lifelstyle of most bbw's. If that ain't repping, I don't know what is. While it's admirable to want to defend friends, my friendship involves telling them the truth, and when they've made an error in judgment, I prefer to be honest. 

I know you'll disagree, as you already have, but you can't argue that the producers of this show were trying to solicit guests as representative of a lifestyle/community. So when people judge and criticize, it's based on a pre existing knowledge of how the solicitation was made, and the decision that was based on that knowledge, which even some of those who appeared on the show acknowledge that it was not the best idea, albeit for different reasons.

By the way, I am as disappointed of the women on the "other" side as I am those who appeared in defense of weight gain/feederism for exactly the same reason.


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## Reenaye Starr

I am curious how many people commenting on this thread actually watched the show. My decision to be on the show in the first place may not have been the best judgement call, but I don't think my actions on the show, in a situation that NONE of you were in, and one of the most blindsidingly awful moments of my life should be considered an embarrassment.. I carried myself throughout that living hell in a manner that I am nothing but proud of. The funny thing is... I have actually gotten far more hatred from this community which is supposed to be about love and acceptance than anywhere else. There is irony in this.


----------



## Russell Williams

moore2me said:


> P.S. Russell as usual your amazing complicated stories never cease to entertain. Whether you, were sleeping with a group of women in that pool or swimming with the women (or both) it is a great story. Now, I am thinking what the pool had in it. Jello? Pudding? Whipped cream? . . . . . .



I am fat, I float 

Peggy Williams, one of the May West's of NAAFA, tells of the time she was taking a college athletics course that involves swimming. At one point a test was to be able to tread water for a certain period of time (I do not remember how long). Peggy just stayed in the water in an upright position with her mouth quite clear of the water. (Her fat body and especially her two, very large, frontally attached, life preservers kept her head well out of the water). Finally the instructor told Peggy that she was supposed to move her hands. Peggy lifted her hands out of the water and started moving them around. She passed the test.


----------



## Russell Williams

wrestlingguy said:


> True Russell, but there's a huge difference between them. Mike Wallace Would you ever consider appearing on Dr. Tz?




Some of you may remember the stacked panel discussion I was at. The one I titled, "When she threw the 10 pounds of fat on the table I knew I was in trouble."

I pursued the logic of what they were saying. I pursued it to a point they did not like. They kept talking about how dangerous fat was and of how fat people were going to die early. When it came my turn I commented that, if fat people were likely to die early and the average American is getting fatter then Social Security is safe because the life expectancy will be going down not up. 

They did not know what to do with this. If fat people died more quickly than they need to be calling their Congress people to tell them not to worry about Social Security. If Social Security needed to be worried about than they need to stop telling fat people they were going to die sooner.

Yes, with fear and trembling I would go on Dr. Oz. If I was confronted with the person that insisted that all fat people are fat because of psychological problems and that they need to address their psychological problems then I would continually come back over and over to asking him to publicly state that weight watchers and other such programs are absolutely useless because, in his opinion, fat people needed good psychologists and psychiatrists not good weight loss programs.

I am fairly certain that he would not on TV state that weight watchers and such programs were worthless because they did not address the real problems.

If they talked about the medical expenses of fat people than I would come back, over and over, to asking why it is more expensive to society for me to die right now then for me to be like my father who lived to be 96. Between now and 96 I will continue to collect about $4000 a month in pensions and Social Security (not factoring in cost-of-living increases or decreases). $50,000 a year for 25 years adds up to a lot of money saved if I die soon.

Every time they would ask me about FA's I would respond with questions about psychology and medical expenses. They might refuse to answer such questions but, at least the people in the audience, would hear them and realized that I was not being answered.

If I saw an opportunity I might throw in the question my parents frequently asked, "Why is it that all of the nuts go into psychology and psychiatry?" I would explain that I was simply quoting my parents.

Sometimes the best defense is a good offense.


----------



## Russ2d

Reenaye Starr said:


> I am curious how many people commenting on this thread actually watched the show. My decision to be on the show in the first place may not have been the best judgement call, but I don't think my actions on the show, in a situation that NONE of you were in, and one of the most blindsidingly awful moments of my life should be considered an embarrassment.. I carried myself throughout that living hell in a manner that I am nothing but proud of. The funny thing is... *I have actually gotten far more hatred from this community which is supposed to be about love and acceptance than anywhere else. *There is irony in this.



Interesting isn't it?

The first thing i've noticed over the past couple of years is that some people here now talk about "size" acceptance (as in all sizes) instead of "fat" acceptance- as if the thin need accepting. 

Reenaye you did a great job in the face of being slammed by these clowns masqurading as doctors.

There is nothing wrong with feedees or feeders or you expressing and fighting for yourself. In my opinion we need more voices of fat women declaring they love themselves fat or want to be fatter, and that they will not pressured to be otherwise. 

Most so-called normal people naturally expect that many FAs who see a thin or merely chubby woman would love for her to be fatter; they're right and are not going to be fooled otherwise, so the disconnect here is ridiculous.

This community is fractured quite frankly because too many people here who cry they're about "size" "acceptance" and tolerance are nothing of the sort. What they really want is for everyone to completely adhere to what they think is acceptable (which appears to be quite narrow and issue laden), and to attack anyone who falls outside their personal comfort zone.


----------



## Dromond

Reenaye Starr said:


> I am curious how many people commenting on this thread actually watched the show. My decision to be on the show in the first place may not have been the best judgement call, but I don't think my actions on the show, in a situation that NONE of you were in, and one of the most blindsidingly awful moments of my life should be considered an embarrassment.. I carried myself throughout that living hell in a manner that I am nothing but proud of. The funny thing is... I have actually gotten far more hatred from this community which is supposed to be about love and acceptance than anywhere else. There is irony in this.



Speaking for myself only, I don't "hate." As for the "living hell" you experienced, I'm gobsmacked you couldn't see it coming. Clearly you haven't been paying attention to what these afternoon hacks are all about.


----------



## Russ2d

Dromond said:


> Speaking for myself only, I don't "hate." As for the "living hell" you experienced, I'm gobsmacked you couldn't see it coming. Clearly you haven't been paying attention to what these afternoon hacks are all about.




These shows are indeed absurd and insulting. If we could get our hands on the unedited version however, I know unrealistic, it would be very nice to post around the truly nasty stuff that was said and edited out, and showcase all the manipulation that took place.


----------



## Mindee

Wrestling Guy & I are pretty much always in agreement when it comes to these issues, and again, I stand in agreement with him. People from virtually ANY "outside" lifestyle needs to get it in their heads that these talk shows don't give one good goddamn about you, your lifestyle and whatever sort of "acceptance & enlightenment" that you want to tell the public about. These shows are multi-million dollar money printers that cater to the center-middle of straight society and as I've mentioned before they are there for 2 reasons that are symbiotic..Ratings & Revenue. Revenue Rules and Ratings drive Revenue. Doesn't matter if you're into feeding & gaining, massive boob implants or you wish to have carnal knowlege of a table fern, the producers want to get you on that show to make you look like a fool to that center-middle straight audience. They are not going to cast you in a good light, unless you come into their light with a tear-stained faceand cross over to their light and mend your freakish ways. The producers are going to manipulate their questions & invitations to you. Certainly NOBODY is going to positively respond to an invitation to make themselves look like creeps, jerks or perverts. If you want to increase the positive knowledge about your lifestyle then blog about it, write a book, do a podcast, but for god's sake stay off the damned daytime talk shows, and stay away from local TV stations during sweep periods. They all have the same agenda. Making money off of making you look sensational, creepy or perverted. Don't buy into their solicitations to "tell your side of the story" it ain't ever gonna happen sister! They are always going to tell your story THEIR way, and you will never, ever be happy with it.
XO
Mindee


----------



## Surlysomething

Mindee said:


> Wrestling Guy & I are pretty much always in agreement when it comes to these issues, and again, I stand in agreement with him. People from virtually ANY "outside" lifestyle needs to get it in their heads that these talk shows don't give one good goddamn about you, your lifestyle and whatever sort of "acceptance & enlightenment" that you want to tell the public about. These shows are multi-million dollar money printers that cater to the center-middle of straight society and as I've mentioned before they are there for 2 reasons that are symbiotic..Ratings & Revenue. Revenue Rules and Ratings drive Revenue. Doesn't matter if you're into feeding & gaining, massive boob implants or you wish to have carnal knowlege of a table fern, the producers want to get you on that show to make you look like a fool to that center-middle straight audience. They are not going to cast you in a good light, unless you come into their light with a tear-stained faceand cross over to their light and mend your freakish ways. The producers are going to manipulate their questions & invitations to you. Certainly NOBODY is going to positively respond to an invitation to make themselves look like creeps, jerks or perverts. If you want to increase the positive knowledge about your lifestyle then blog about it, write a book, do a podcast, but for god's sake stay off the damned daytime talk shows, and stay away from local TV stations during sweep periods. They all have the same agenda. Making money off of making you look sensational, creepy or perverted. Don't buy into their solicitations to "tell your side of the story" it ain't ever gonna happen sister! They are always going to tell your story THEIR way, and you will never, ever be happy with it.
> XO
> Mindee


 

This. Exactly.

:bow:


----------



## imfree

Mindee said:


> Wrestling Guy & I are pretty much always in agreement when it comes to these issues, and again, I stand in agreement with him. People from virtually ANY "outside" lifestyle needs to get it in their heads that these talk shows don't give one good goddamn about you, your lifestyle and whatever sort of "acceptance & enlightenment" that you want to tell the public about. These shows are multi-million dollar money printers that cater to the center-middle of straight society and as I've mentioned before they are there for 2 reasons that are symbiotic..Ratings & Revenue. Revenue Rules and Ratings drive Revenue. Doesn't matter if you're into feeding & gaining, massive boob implants or you wish to have carnal knowlege of a table fern, the producers want to get you on that show to make you look like a fool to that center-middle straight audience. They are not going to cast you in a good light, unless you come into their light with a tear-stained faceand cross over to their light and mend your freakish ways. The producers are going to manipulate their questions & invitations to you. Certainly NOBODY is going to positively respond to an invitation to make themselves look like creeps, jerks or perverts. If you want to increase the positive knowledge about your lifestyle then blog about it, write a book, do a podcast, but for god's sake stay off the damned daytime talk shows, and stay away from local TV stations during sweep periods. They all have the same agenda. Making money off of making you look sensational, creepy or perverted. Don't buy into their solicitations to "tell your side of the story" it ain't ever gonna happen sister! They are always going to tell your story THEIR way, and you will never, ever be happy with it.
> XO
> Mindee



This is sad, but so true. This century and last century, regardless of subject, people who are freethinkers and refuse to be sheeple, will always be set-up as horrible freaks on those television talk shows. Damn the talk shows and their side-show mentality!!! Preceding was my opinion, your results may vary.


----------



## wrestlingguy

On the Dr. Oz website, he allows the other clown, Dr. Ablow to have the final say about what went on during the show.

Somewhere in between the many negative comments about fatties, I said the following (which will likely be deleted, since they like to control content):
*
Thank you for insinuating that fat women are sheep, that men who are with women who are overweight assume they have some kind of self esteem issue. If what you're claiming is true, then wouldn't it make sense to say that Weight Watchers and Jenny Craig would not be the long term solution, and that therapy, individually and collectively would be the only effective way to combat obesity?

I am sick to death of all the misinformation that's put out about fat people. When you look at a person who's fat, you DON'T know the reason they're overweight. It could be calories in > calories out, but it isn't always that simple. It could be from drugs, it could be genetics, it could be a wealth of different things, but the assumption is always made that women are helpless and feel horrible about themselves, which is why they are fat.

I can give you literally thousands of women from the size acceptance community who would be more than happy to refute your claim, not only about their personal health, but also about their own sense of self worth. Of course, it's ratings week, so you would NEVER put the women I'm talking about on the show, simply because no amount of content editing could make the women I'm talking about look bad.

Speaking of which, did anyone wonder why no FAT MEN were on the panel? 

No wonder few from the medical community support Drs. Oz and Ablow. You are sensationalists, with little regard for the people who are on your shows. If you had the guts, you would have broken this show into several parts and allowed America to see more of the women like Reenaye who walked off the show because she became aware of the content manipulation going on. You let Dr. Ablow speak out after the show, why not allow Reenaye and the other woman who walked out do the same?*


I would strongly urge many of you to go to the page I posted on and do the same. Please note that my response has no criticism of anyone who appeared on the show, as that need not be the message. Just keep in mind that while I may feel you're wrong in here, I sure as hell wouldn't make those feelings known on a page like that

Special thanks to Mindee, Russell Williams, Reenaye Star and the others who posted in this thread, as it helped me to craft my response to these ruthless "medicos" who are more concerned with ratings than they are with people.

http://www.doctoroz.com/videos/america-s-fattest-women-final-thoughts-dr-keith-ablow


----------



## Reenaye Starr

Mindee said:


> Wrestling Guy & I are pretty much always in agreement when it comes to these issues, and again, I stand in agreement with him. People from virtually ANY "outside" lifestyle needs to get it in their heads that these talk shows don't give one good goddamn about you, your lifestyle and whatever sort of "acceptance & enlightenment" that you want to tell the public about. These shows are multi-million dollar money printers that cater to the center-middle of straight society and as I've mentioned before they are there for 2 reasons that are symbiotic..Ratings & Revenue. Revenue Rules and Ratings drive Revenue. Doesn't matter if you're into feeding & gaining, massive boob implants or you wish to have carnal knowlege of a table fern, the producers want to get you on that show to make you look like a fool to that center-middle straight audience. They are not going to cast you in a good light, unless you come into their light with a tear-stained faceand cross over to their light and mend your freakish ways. The producers are going to manipulate their questions & invitations to you. Certainly NOBODY is going to positively respond to an invitation to make themselves look like creeps, jerks or perverts. If you want to increase the positive knowledge about your lifestyle then blog about it, write a book, do a podcast, but for god's sake stay off the damned daytime talk shows, and stay away from local TV stations during sweep periods. They all have the same agenda. Making money off of making you look sensational, creepy or perverted. Don't buy into their solicitations to "tell your side of the story" it ain't ever gonna happen sister! They are always going to tell your story THEIR way, and you will never, ever be happy with it.
> XO
> Mindee



I agree with you and I do write a blog feedersandgainers.com and I am actually working on a book called "America's Fat, Get Over It." I do many positive things in my life, most notably having helped many friends, family members, acquaintances to accept and love people of size, and many fat-bodied friends to learn to love themselves ... And all of THOSE people were in my corner when the show aired. My facebook wall looks the exact opposite of this thread...


----------



## Reenaye Starr

wrestlingguy said:


> On the Dr. Oz website, he allows the other clown, Dr. Ablow to have the final say about what went on during the show.
> 
> Somewhere in between the many negative comments about fatties, I said the following (which will likely be deleted, since they like to control content):
> *
> Thank you for insinuating that fat women are sheep, that men who are with women who are overweight assume they have some kind of self esteem issue. If what you're claiming is true, then wouldn't it make sense to say that Weight Watchers and Jenny Craig would not be the long term solution, and that therapy, individually and collectively would be the only effective way to combat obesity?
> 
> I am sick to death of all the misinformation that's put out about fat people. When you look at a person who's fat, you DON'T know the reason they're overweight. It could be calories in > calories out, but it isn't always that simple. It could be from drugs, it could be genetics, it could be a wealth of different things, but the assumption is always made that women are helpless and feel horrible about themselves, which is why they are fat.
> 
> I can give you literally thousands of women from the size acceptance community who would be more than happy to refute your claim, not only about their personal health, but also about their own sense of self worth. Of course, it's ratings week, so you would NEVER put the women I'm talking about on the show, simply because no amount of content editing could make the women I'm talking about look bad.
> 
> Speaking of which, did anyone wonder why no FAT MEN were on the panel?
> 
> No wonder few from the medical community support Drs. Oz and Ablow. You are sensationalists, with little regard for the people who are on your shows. If you had the guts, you would have broken this show into several parts and allowed America to see more of the women like Reenaye who walked off the show because she became aware of the content manipulation going on. You let Dr. Ablow speak out after the show, why not allow Reenaye and the other woman who walked out do the same?*
> 
> 
> I would strongly urge many of you to go to the page I posted on and do the same. Please note that my response has no criticism of anyone who appeared on the show, as that need not be the message. Just keep in mind that while I may feel you're wrong in here, I sure as hell wouldn't make those feelings known on a page like that
> 
> Special thanks to Mindee, Russell Williams, Reenaye Star and the others who posted in this thread, as it helped me to craft my response to these ruthless "medicos" who are more concerned with ratings than they are with people.
> 
> http://www.doctoroz.com/videos/america-s-fattest-women-final-thoughts-dr-keith-ablow



Thank you for responding to them and speaking out against the message they tried to convey.


----------



## moniquessbbw

I know how hateful the size acceptance community can be. I was once a victim of the hate because I had WLS. I received hate mail from former fans when I had my site. I will never understand why the community treats the people within it so poorly. One guy said that it would be bad for one of the ladies fan base. Who cares about the fan base? Isn't her life more important than her fan base? Being trapped inside of your own body is a living hell. When the fans come over to my house, wash me, wipe my ass, dress me, do my laundry, clean my house then they can have their 2 cents worth of say. In the end it is your own life and do what you need to do to survive. I have nothing positive to say about feeders so I will not comment on them.




Reenaye Starr said:


> I am curious how many people commenting on this thread actually watched the show. My decision to be on the show in the first place may not have been the best judgement call, but I don't think my actions on the show, in a situation that NONE of you were in, and one of the most blindsidingly awful moments of my life should be considered an embarrassment.. I carried myself throughout that living hell in a manner that I am nothing but proud of. The funny thing is... I have actually gotten far more hatred from this community which is supposed to be about love and acceptance than anywhere else. There is irony in this.


----------



## collared Princess

moniquessbbw said:


> I know how hateful the size acceptance community can be. I was once a victim of the hate because I had WLS. I received hate mail from former fans when I had my site. I will never understand why the community treats the people within it so poorly. One guy said that it would be bad for one of the ladies fan base. Who cares about the fan base? Isn't her life more important than her fan base? Being trapped inside of your own body is a living hell. When the fans come over to my house, wash me, wipe my ass, dress me, do my laundry, clean my house then they can have their 2 cents worth of say. In the end it is your own life and do what you need to do to survive. I have nothing positive to say about feeders so I will not comment on them.



I agree completely Monique ...this is where I'm at in my life right now same thinking ....


----------



## FA Punk

I loved the fact that Dr. Ablow was at least honest about his feeling towards FAs, were no better then someone who would rape a child in his eyes. He's a bastard but an honest bastard, most of these assholes would have just beat'en around the bush on that one but not him, Oh no Dr. Ablow tells it like it is. Funny how the men in our community are becoming more and more demonized on television and were not even there to fight back:doh:


----------



## Reenaye Starr

FA Punk said:


> I loved the fact that Dr. Ablow was at least honest about his feeling towards FAs, were no better then someone who would rape a child in his eyes. He's a bastard but an honest bastard, most of these assholes would have just beat'en around the bush on that one but not him, Oh no Dr. Ablow tells it like it is. Funny how the men in our community are becoming more and more demonized on television and were not even there to fight back:doh:



Agreed Dr. Ablow. I spoke up when they were trying to paint the men in this community in a bad light. I tried to explain what a positive and loving influence my husband is (my husband who has never ASKED me to gain weight, and love ME far more than any fetish or fantasy, and has told me numerous times that he would support me losing weight if I so choose... Who is an amazing person, friend, husband and father) 

Then Dr. Ablow then said, and I quote: "Has he ever asked you to lose weight (I responded no)...Then he's abusive." I went off on him telling him how dare he attempt to "diagnose" a man he has never met, and that I didn't appreciate his brand of quack psychiatry. I said my husband loves me for me and that is the most ANY person of ANY size could ever ask for. So according to that idiot, the only way I could ever be in a non-abusive relationship is to be with some one who EXPECTS me to change and be something that I am not, do not care to be and have NEVER BEEN... thin. 

They, of course, cut that part from the show... I guess even the editing room didn't want him opening that can of worms... Honestly, I think he even lost the studio audience at that point...

Also, the quote-unquote help that they offered the ladies who stayed is a couple free sessions with Dr. Ablow's life coaches... LOL. You know how you can become a Dr. Ablow life coach? With $479 and 2 hours of free time.

BE A LIFE COACH WHAT A JOKE


----------



## gangstadawg

moniquessbbw said:


> I know how hateful the size acceptance community can be. I was once a victim of the hate because I had WLS. I received hate mail from former fans when I had my site. I will never understand why the community treats the people within it so poorly. One guy said that it would be bad for one of the ladies fan base. Who cares about the fan base? Isn't her life more important than her fan base? Being trapped inside of your own body is a living hell. When the fans come over to my house, wash me, wipe my ass, dress me, do my laundry, clean my house then they can have their 2 cents worth of say. In the end it is your own life and do what you need to do to survive. I have nothing positive to say about feeders so I will not comment on them.



i was saying it because she has basically outed her self as a fake and a fraud. but on facebook she was saying she was the "baddest bitch in the porn game" and even starting beefs and conflict with other bbw models in the adult industry. one of the models she had a beef with was farah foxx (who is a legend in the bbw adult industry).


----------



## LifeTraveller

GordoNegro said:


> I just hope the hotel stays and other expenses paid were worth it to all on the panel. I can definetly see some webmodels closing their websites down due to purpetrating a fraud.
> I'm kind of glad as it was good to see Star's honesty in wanting to lose lbs, modelling mainly for the $ etc.
> Dr. Ablow from his failed talk show, interjecting about how food was for comfort from abuse and molestation.
> Seeing those who went nationwide about their gaining, are taking a 180 now.
> I'm just sorry for the real time supersized folk who enjoy food just because they do, as this episode made things harder for alot of people.





Ruby Ripples said:


> The DrOz show flooded Fantasy Feeder (where i'm a Mod) with emails and forum posts and pms to site members, without permission, about four weeks ago. When I banned them all I got emails asking if they could have someone on to talk about plus size lifestyle, the woman was trying to make it sound very friendly, then slipped up by saying "we'd like someone to explain it all and defend the fat community".  That one word defend proved their intent, even if I hadn't already realised what it would be like.
> 
> Ugh.




There are so many "well-spoken" folks on this topic, I wish I could quote you all! I have finally figured out the "rep" thing so maybe I can share a bit of love via that. .

I chose the two quotes for two different reasons. . I chose Ruby Ripples, because I have known "of" her and on rare occasion chatted with her online. (seems ages ago somehow) With Ruby, what you see is what you get. I'm sure that's true of most all of us, but she's so consistent. (not to mention, some of my ancestors are from her part of the globe) 

I also like what GordoNegro said as well, it brought to mind some things I've thought about for years. . I appreciate his straightforward comments. "The fantasy of the webmodel, pin-up, or centerfold" has been around for a while, however as a rule, it is a fantasy! Having been a photographer and darkroom operator for years before the advent of Photoshop. . I can assure you few people truly look exactly as a photograph depicts them. Also there are people who do not photograph well. . I'm at a loss to explain it, but it happens.

One of the greatest sayings I've ever heard is this: "If it sounds too good to be true, you can be sure it is in fact, too good to be true". I mean who in their right mind would go on a show, knowing they're going to be humiliated. (with the exception of game show contestants) 

I stand with wrestlingguy on having no animosity towards those who appear on these shows. I'm sure after the fact, many of them wish they had not done so. . Hopefully someone got something positive from the experience. I would like to watch the show, but the trailer for it, just made me too uneasy!

I'm not a big fan of the "medical community" as a whole. I have my own reasons and prejudices when it comes to them. The experience of dealing with them and their, in many cases, shameful treatment of my late SSBBW wife is more than enough for me. 

I like to think as a whole, and as a community, we can work through these differences. We need to either stand together, or stand alone. I prefer the former.. Didn't mean to go on so much. .


----------



## butch

If we need any additional proof that the 'professionals' on this show are full of crap, lets revisit this thread, when Dr. Ablow had his own show, and had members of our community on:

http://www.dimensionsmagazine.com/forums/showthread.php?t=14599&highlight=ablow

Amazing that back in 2006 he wasn't so hateful towards fat women and FAs. I know Emerson said that consistency is the hobgoblin of small minds, and one ahs the right to change their opinion, but Dr. Ablow doesn't give off this vibe. Instead, he kowtows to whoever pays his bills, and says what they tell him to say (Glenn Beck, Fox news, Dr. Oz).


----------



## MzDeeZyre

Reenaye Starr said:


> You know how you can become a Dr. Ablow life coach? With $479 and 2 hours of free time.
> 
> BE A LIFE COACH WHAT A JOKE



I wonder what he'd do if a super fatty such as myself signed up for this class. I have half a mind to do it, just to see the look on his face as the Skype session starts. 

God forbid I be a life coach to anyone..... I'm fat!! :doh:


----------



## Mindee

Reenaye Starr said:


> I agree with you and I do write a blog feedersandgainers.com and I am actually working on a book called "America's Fat, Get Over It." I do many positive things in my life, most notably having helped many friends, family members, acquaintances to accept and love people of size, and many fat-bodied friends to learn to love themselves ... And all of THOSE people were in my corner when the show aired. My facebook wall looks the exact opposite of this thread...


I'm glad your FarceBook wall is full of people who love you. However, that's merely called "Preaching To The Choir". I really don't think that most of the comments here are directly pointed at "you" but at the larger question of where is the proper place to discuss this particular subject. What people like Wrestling Guy, myself and others are saying is that in the circus-style arena of the daytime talk shows, your message is not going to get out in a proper light because THEY, not YOU control the content, and thus the agenda. They will edit the show and your remarks to fit their desired outcome of the show, which is to make you and those who particpated into nothing but sleazy, freaky perverts. And, in the end the vast majority of that center-middle "mainstream" straight viewer went away thinking that's exactly what you are. Again, I don't see people hating on you, I think they are simply expressing the very correct view that a daytime talk show that is searching for revenue & ratings is not the place for a serious discussion. 
XO
MIndee


----------



## FA Punk

butch said:


> If we need any additional proof that the 'professionals' on this show are full of crap, lets revisit this thread, when Dr. Ablow had his own show, and had members of our community on:
> 
> http://www.dimensionsmagazine.com/forums/showthread.php?t=14599&highlight=ablow
> 
> Amazing that back in 2006 he wasn't so hateful towards fat women and FAs. I know Emerson said that consistency is the hobgoblin of small minds, and one ahs the right to change their opinion, but Dr. Ablow doesn't give off this vibe. Instead, he kowtows to whoever pays his bills, and says what they tell him to say (Glenn Beck, Fox news, Dr. Oz).



Dr. Ablow used some of the same tactics on his own show that he used on the Dr. Oz show, he singled out Reenaye no differently then he singled out Rhonda with the only difference being he was more aggressive with Reenaye then he was with Rhonda.

What worries me about Dr. Ablow and Dr. Oz is that they are really starting to carve themselves out a real nich with this type of show, it's not this show that bugs me but the show that will come from this after it.

You have to think if Dr. Ablow's show would have turned out to be a success how bad the update show for "Fatabulous" would have been. And I'm not even going to go into detail on why that would have been so bad for our community if that were to have happened :doh:.


----------



## Dromond

Mindee said:


> I'm glad your FarceBook wall is full of people who love you. However, that's merely called "Preaching To The Choir". I really don't think that most of the comments here are directly pointed at "you" but at the larger question of where is the proper place to discuss this particular subject. What people like Wrestling Guy, myself and others are saying is that in the circus-style arena of the daytime talk shows, your message is not going to get out in a proper light because THEY, not YOU control the content, and thus the agenda. They will edit the show and your remarks to fit their desired outcome of the show, which is to make you and those who particpated into nothing but sleazy, freaky perverts. And, in the end the vast majority of that center-middle "mainstream" straight viewer went away thinking that's exactly what you are. Again, I don't see people hating on you, I think they are simply expressing the very correct view that a daytime talk show that is searching for revenue & ratings is not the place for a serious discussion.
> XO
> MIndee



Yes!

In short, they make bank off making you look like a freak.


----------



## FA Punk

Dromond said:


> Yes!
> 
> In short, they make bank off making you look like a freak.



It's not that cut and dry, I say Sussane Eman is gonna get something out of this.


----------



## ThatFatGirl

moniquessbbw said:


> I know how hateful the size acceptance community can be. I was once a victim of the hate because I had WLS. I received hate mail from former fans when I had my site. I will never understand why the community treats the people within it so poorly. One guy said that it would be bad for one of the ladies fan base. Who cares about the fan base? Isn't her life more important than her fan base? Being trapped inside of your own body is a living hell. When the fans come over to my house, wash me, wipe my ass, dress me, do my laundry, clean my house then they can have their 2 cents worth of say. In the end it is your own life and do what you need to do to survive. I have nothing positive to say about feeders so I will not comment on them.





collared Princess said:


> I agree completely Monique ...this is where I'm at in my life right now same thinking ....



Sorry, ladies, but I think you have things confused. You're using the term "size acceptance community" when talking about responses from fans of your FETISH websites. 

Guys who wank to fat &#8800; Size Acceptance Community necessarily.


----------



## Surlysomething

ThatFatGirl said:


> Sorry, ladies, but I think you have things confused. You're using the term "size acceptance community" when talking about responses from fans of your FETISH websites.
> 
> Guys who wank to fat &#8800; Size Acceptance Community necessarily.


 
THANK YOU!! I was thinking the same thing but didn't know how to word it.

:bow:


----------



## ThatFatGirl

Mindee said:


> I'm glad your FarceBook wall is full of people who love you. However, that's merely called "Preaching To The Choir". I really don't think that most of the comments here are directly pointed at "you" but at the larger question of where is the proper place to discuss this particular subject. What people like Wrestling Guy, myself and others are saying is that in the circus-style arena of the daytime talk shows, your message is not going to get out in a proper light because THEY, not YOU control the content, and thus the agenda. They will edit the show and your remarks to fit their desired outcome of the show, which is to make you and those who particpated into nothing but sleazy, freaky perverts. And, in the end the vast majority of that center-middle "mainstream" straight viewer went away thinking that's exactly what you are. Again, I don't see people hating on you, I think they are simply expressing the very correct view that a daytime talk show that is searching for revenue & ratings is not the place for a serious discussion.
> XO
> MIndee




Agreed. Daytime talk shows are crap. We all know that, don't we? 

Even if their "messages" had made it to air, there was no hope of being taken seriously when their intros begin with them in lingerie and spandex seductively eating donuts and pizza saying, "Men pay to watch me eat." They were representing themselves, their websites, and the fetish community on the Oz show and no one else.


----------



## ThatFatGirl

FA Punk said:


> It's not that cut and dry, I say Sussane Eman is gonna get something out of this.



She's still singing the same "I'm healthy" tune when the blood work she shared on the previous show clearly revealed otherwise. I'm afraid she is "gonna get something" and it will be debilitating or deadly. It's really quite sad.


----------



## FA Punk

ThatFatGirl said:


> She's still singing the same "I'm healthy" tune when the blood work she shared on the previous show clearly revealed otherwise. I'm afraid she is "gonna get something" and it will be debilitating or deadly. It's really quite sad.



She'll go the same route that Donna Simpson did if not worse, I'll give Sussane credit though that she is a very good actress that sticks to her guns. I'm not naive enough to believe she really does enjoy life at the size that she is at, I my have been born at night but not last night, and I'm not going to call her delusional either. Sussane is a full grown woman that knows exactly what she is doing, it's no differnt then a pro-wrestler working a gimmick or pushing an angle.

You know I'll most likely get flamed for this but what the fuck, but this all started when ''Gaining Goddess'' first appeared on VH1 making all her outrageous claims, not to blame Nicki pre-say but thats where Donna and Sussane got thier ideas from. I mean after Sussane gets her WLS and fades into memory whats next, how do you top this, a 19 year old girl that weighs over 600lbs wanting to be the fattest young person in the world? It could happen:doh:.


----------



## musicman

FA Punk said:


> I loved the fact that Dr. Ablow was at least honest about his feeling towards FAs, were no better then someone who would rape a child in his eyes. He's a bastard but an honest bastard, most of these assholes would have just beat'en around the bush on that one but not him, Oh no Dr. Ablow tells it like it is. Funny how the men in our community are becoming more and more demonized on television and were not even there to fight back:doh:




It's definitely a strategic move for them to demonize FAs. They can't sell their "fat is ugly and unlovable" message for the sponsors, unless FAs are made to look as bad as child molesters. And I have to laugh at the FAs who are so rabid in their contempt for Feeders and Feedees because "those evil Feeders hurt our image". Well, guess what? It doesn't matter to the professional fat-haters in the media. They don't make distinctions like that. If you're an FA, you're JUST AS BAD as a Feeder, because that's what the sponsors want their mindless "consumers" to hear.

A big part of the business model for these TV shows is the monetizing of fear and hatred for minority groups. If this was 60 years ago, Oz and Ablow would be doing it to Blacks and Jews. In fact, I think that Oz and Ablow would fit right into the KKK. The Klan and their friends label any White who dates a Black person as a "Race Traitor". I suppose FAs are the "Thin Traitors" who are standing in the way of "Thin Supremacy".


----------



## joswitch

FA Punk said:


> I loved the fact that *Dr. Ablow was at least honest about his feeling towards FAs, were no better then someone who would rape a child in his eyes.* He's a bastard but an honest bastard, most of these assholes would have just beat'en around the bush on that one but not him, Oh no Dr. Ablow tells it like it is. Funny how the men in our community are becoming more and more demonized on television and were not even there to fight back:doh:





That's not the first time I've come across that comparison and it pisses me right off.

When anyone compares what goes on between consenting adults to pedophilia, they are:
1) totally infantilising one half of the couple (almost always women)
2) demonising the other half (almost always men)
3) putting the demonised half in danger of death. In my country an accusation of pedophilia has led to men being killed by vigilante morons (one guy was chased off the top of a multi-story building). At the height of pedo hysteria a pediatrician (child DOCTOR) was attacked by a mob of illiterates. 

because of 3) I would deem it legitimate to defend yourself by any means necessary against anyone calling or comparing you to a pedo, as they are effectively threatening your life. Especially if live on TV in front of millions. It's deadly serious.

Maybe Dr Blowme knows this and that's why he doesn't invite men on his show...


----------



## joswitch

musicman said:


> It's definitely a strategic move for them to demonize FAs. They can't sell their "fat is ugly and unlovable" message for the sponsors, unless FAs are made to look as bad as child molesters. And I have to laugh at the FAs who are so rabid in their contempt for Feeders and Feedees because "those evil Feeders hurt our image". Well, guess what? *It doesn't matter to the professional fat-haters in the media. They don't make distinctions like that. If you're an FA, you're JUST AS BAD as a Feeder,* because that's what the sponsors want their mindless "consumers" to hear.
> 
> *A big part of the business model for these TV shows is the monetizing of fear and hatred* for minority groups. If this was 60 years ago, Oz and Ablow would be doing it to Blacks and Jews. In fact, I think that Oz and Ablow would fit right into the KKK. The Klan and their friends label any White who dates a Black person as a "Race Traitor". I suppose FAs are the "Thin Traitors" who are standing in the way of "Thin Supremacy".



This^

Exept, fat people are the majority in the US now. Yet, there's still big $ in fat-hate. I guess when you get the majority hating themselves, that's the money fountain that just never stops.


----------



## gangstadawg

joswitch said:


> That's not the first time I've come across that comparison and it pisses me right off.
> 
> When anyone compares what goes on between consenting adults to pedophilia, they are:
> 1) totally infantilising one half of the couple (almost always women)
> 2) demonising the other half (almost always men)
> 3) putting the demonised half in danger of death. In my country an accusation of pedophilia has led to men being killed by vigilante morons (one guy was chased off the top of a multi-story building). At the height of pedo hysteria a pediatrician (child DOCTOR) was attacked by a mob of illiterates.
> 
> because of 3) I would deem it legitimate to defend yourself by any means necessary against anyone calling or comparing you to a pedo, as they are effectively threatening your life. It's deadly serious.
> 
> Maybe Dr Blowme knows this and that's why he doesn't invite men on his show...



wtf? this is the first i have hard of this comparison. dont know the logic they used to come up with it because it makes no sense at all.


----------



## musicman

joswitch said:


> This^
> 
> Exept, fat people are the majority in the US now. Yet, there's still big $ in fat-hate. I guess when you get the majority hating themselves, that's the money fountain that just never stops.




"Money fountain that never stops" <-- That sums it up perfectly. For the media, that's all that fat people and FAs are. They are so blinded by bags of money from the diet scammers that they're incapable of seeing anyone as a human being. It's a disgusting situation.


----------



## imfree

joswitch said:


> This^
> 
> Exept, fat people are the majority in the US now. Yet, there's still big $ in fat-hate. I guess when you get the majority hating themselves, that's the money fountain that just never stops.





musicman said:


> "Money fountain that never stops" <-- That sums it up perfectly. For the media, that's all that fat people and FAs are. They are so blinded by bags of money from the diet scammers that they're incapable of seeing anyone as a human being. It's a disgusting situation.



There's the ultimate scam for you! Take the majority, make them hate themselves, then capitalize on that self-hatred!

(SNARKFONT)Being fat is your own fault and for $$$ we can fix that! This post is my opinion, only. Others' results may vary.


----------



## truebebeblue

Porn is fake?! OMG nooooooooooooo



gangstadawg said:


> i was saying it because she has basically outed her self as a fake and a fraud. but on facebook she was saying she was the "baddest bitch in the porn game" and even starting beefs and conflict with other bbw models in the adult industry. one of the models she had a beef with was farah foxx (who is a legend in the bbw adult industry).


----------



## moniquessbbw

I don't see any difference. The same FA's looking at the pay sites is the same FA's you find here. You can be in denial if you want to thats fine by me. I just happen to know a different truth than you do. Having been married to a feeder and dated several closet feeders I can speak from my own personal experiences. I know how Pauline feels and her husband was no where to be found. Now her son has to take on that role as care giver and any other title he needs to have to help his mom. They fatten you up and leave you. I don't see what part people dont get that about feeders. IMO feeders don't care about size acceptance. The community is just a way for them to get a big woman. I don't remember seeing any feeders at the Million Pound march that NAAFA held years ago. I agree with the doctor who said they are getting off on us as we gain and get sicker. I use to say the same things till I developed congestive heart failure at 27. I was young and thought I was healthy too. It all catches up to us one day. That is just the simple truth. I would have taken the help to learn new tools. The tools are the important part. Knowledge is power.



ThatFatGirl said:


> Sorry, ladies, but I think you have things confused. You're using the term "size acceptance community" when talking about responses from fans of your FETISH websites.
> 
> Guys who wank to fat &#8800; Size Acceptance Community necessarily.


----------



## MzDeeZyre

moniquessbbw said:


> I don't see any difference. The same FA's looking at the pay sites is the same FA's you find here.



I beg to differ.... Not every FA that is here looks at the Pay Site board. AND.... not every FA that is here is bad. 

I am so tired of hearing everyone drone on and say..... OMG he's an FA.... he must be a feeder. NO..... Stop with the generalizations. 

I don't see everyone generalizing with the FFA's and how they must be feeders, and how horrible they are. 

Feederism is a FETISH, and while it may not be for you, it may be for someone else. 

:eat1:


----------



## Reenaye Starr

So if an FA looks at the paysite board, does that automatically make him "bad"?



MzDeeZyre said:


> I beg to differ.... Not every FA that is here looks at the Pay Site board. AND.... not every FA that is here is bad.
> 
> I am so tired of hearing everyone drone on and say..... OMG he's an FA.... he must be a feeder. NO..... Stop with the generalizations.
> 
> I don't see everyone generalizing with the FFA's and how they must be feeders, and how horrible they are.
> 
> Feederism is a FETISH, and while it may not be for you, it may be for someone else.
> 
> :eat1:


----------



## MzDeeZyre

Reenaye Starr said:


> So if an FA looks at the paysite board, does that automatically make him "bad"?



I certainly didn't insinuate that, however I think that is what the mentality is here generally. I have no problems with the pay site board, etc. If someone male or female chooses to look there great. (I have been known to look around.)


----------



## wrestlingguy

moniquessbbw said:


> I don't see any difference. The same FA's looking at the pay sites is the same FA's you find here. You can be in denial if you want to thats fine by me. I just happen to know a different truth than you do. Having been married to a feeder and dated several closet feeders I can speak from my own personal experiences. I know how Pauline feels and her husband was no where to be found. Now her son has to take on that role as care giver and any other title he needs to have to help his mom. They fatten you up and leave you. I don't see what part people dont get that about feeders. IMO feeders don't care about size acceptance. The community is just a way for them to get a big woman. I don't remember seeing any feeders at the Million Pound march that NAAFA held years ago. I agree with the doctor who said they are getting off on us as we gain and get sicker. I use to say the same things till I developed congestive heart failure at 27. I was young and thought I was healthy too. It all catches up to us one day. That is just the simple truth. I would have taken the help to learn new tools. The tools are the important part. Knowledge is power.



There is life beyond Dimensions, and Fat Forums, and Bodacious, and the Butterfly Lounge and all of the bashes that take place all over the country.

I won't speak for the person that your response was directed to, but I can assure you that good guys who are attracted to fat women exist. They just don't obsess over women and fetish their preference in all of the places I noted above. The fat woman may have been the initial attraction, but the strength of the relationship is what keeps them together.

*REAL RELATIONSHIPS ARE NOT ABOUT JUST THE FAT.*

Years ago, when I first showed up in Dims, and all of the other sites that existed in the mid 90's, I looked at the pics in awe, just like the other guys. I also talked with men and women in the community back then, and learned, and dated, and eventually got married to a BBW. Then I saw what she went through on a daily basis, and though we're no longer together, and I'm in a relationship now with a wonderful woman, I've become a staunch supporter of size acceptance.

It's kinda like going to a party because you heard they're gonna serve free beer, then stay around to clean up after everyone's gone.

While I'm sorry to read about what's happened to you in your blogs (and you know I read them), I've been through some rough times as well, and have never painted fat women with the same broad brush that you have with FAs. I've just never believed that people of the opposite sex are generally the same.


----------



## BBW4Chattery

I don't want to participate in the in-fighting here because honestly, even though I was once very active around here many, many moons ago, I haven't been around enough lately to have a dog in this fight.

Still, about the Oz show... I never watch but caught this one flipping channels and was so sad to see the parts that aired because of the supposed expert clinical psychologist. Are those even his credentials?

I have worked as a licensed clinician, though I no longer do that work, and I can tell you that I have NEVER run across an endorsed therapeutic modality that involves telling someone you must have had X happen because you're Y today.

I literally only caught half an hour but I dvr'd that to rewatch it again when I had more time to concentrate to make sure I was really getting the message. Even if it was agreed upon to be non-private during the initial meeting, for the "expert" to bring up past abuse as an "I told you so" with an individual on national television is against "do no harm" in my opinion.

Then, as some of you mentioned, the life coach thing... what a joke. In my former field, it's pretty much understood that life coaches are 3 things: 

burnt out clinicians who are tired of dealing with insurance reimbursement and life coaching lets them be "therapists" without those red tape barriers 
clinicians who lost their licenses for various infractions and can't serve under a protected title any more 
uneducated, untrained, non-professionals who shouldn't be advising anyone on delicate life matters.

I'm sorry if that offends any life coaches here but that is what is shared about them within professional counseling/psychology circles. Trust me, I wish there was a short cut to therapy but those hurdles are there to protect the clients. Anyway, I think their help money would be better spent on nutritional counseling, personal trainers, and intensive in-home therapists if a behavior change and weight loss were truly their ultimate goal.

Ugh, makes me so sad when certain groups try to find and exploit any sign of weakness in groups they determine to be less valuable than their own. Obese people are seen as a lower class. I don't say this as a battered fat girl -- in fact, I've had it pretty sweet as far as obesity goes so I have no anger from personal experience. Just from a big picture perspective... stupid television. 

Gah...and I was thinking I could trust Dr. Oz after the episode I caught where he warned me my vagina would fall out because "most women" have vaginal prolapse at some point in their lives. Disappointing.


----------



## FA Punk

Reenaye Starr said:


> So if an FA looks at the paysite board, does that automatically make him "bad"?



Pretty much yeah, now even though most men do find Dims through the paysite board if you post in that section of the forum get ready for some backlash, honestly if the webmaster could afford to delete the paysite board I think he would.


----------



## LordQuas

As a future psychologist watching this show made me wonder if I could achieve career success by doing the opposite of what Dr Oz does


----------



## FA Punk

LordQuas said:


> As a future psychologist watching this show made me wonder if I could achieve career success by doing the opposite of what Dr Oz does



Couldn't hurt, I think doing the doing the opposite of everything Dr. Oz and Dr. Ablow do is a smart idea. Just don't look like Lex Luthor.


----------



## imfree

LordQuas said:


> As a future psychologist watching this show made me wonder if I could achieve career success by doing the opposite of what :dohr Oz:doh: does



Brilliant idea that should work fine!


----------



## LordQuas

ThatFatGirl said:


> Sorry, ladies, but I think you have things confused. You're using the term "size acceptance community" when talking about responses from fans of your FETISH websites.
> 
> Guys who wank to fat &#8800; Size Acceptance Community necessarily.



So the type of porn someone masturbates to determines their character? Im confused


----------



## LordQuas

FA Punk said:


> Couldn't hurt, I think doing the doing the opposite of everything Dr. Oz and Dr. Ablow do is a smart idea. Just don't look like Lex Luthor.



Well Im black and usually shave my head so I'd imagine I'd get a million Montel comparisons, can't say I would mind having his career though


----------



## Dromond

Reenaye Starr said:


> So if an FA looks at the paysite board, does that automatically make him "bad"?



It can give a man a very skewed view of what bbws/ssbbws are really like, especially if the paysite board is his primary source of 'information.'

You're providing a service, of course. But the whole atmosphere of "look how much food I can shovel," and "see what a piggy I am," or "it feels so great to gain," as well as "I'm so huge, look how small these clothes are on me" is toxic to a person who has little to no experience with actual larger ladies.

It's not your responsibility to set them straight. You're a capitalist and caveat emptor and all that. But you can't take the profit without taking the bad press due to your actions. You don't get to have it both ways.


----------



## LordQuas

Dromond said:


> It can give a man a very skewed view of what bbws/ssbbws are really like, especially if the paysite board is his primary source of 'information.'
> 
> You're providing a service, of course. But the whole atmosphere of "look how much food I can shovel," and "see what a piggy I am," or "it feels so great to gain," as well as "I'm so huge, look how small these clothes are on me" is toxic to a person who has little to no experience with actual larger ladies.
> 
> It's not your responsibility to set them straight. You're a capitalist and caveat emptor and all that. But you can't take the profit without taking the bad press due to your actions. You don't get to have it both ways.



But it's not like she's going around saying that the content on her website is a representation of completely "normal" behavior, few porn sites are making money based on how "normal" they are. If a grown man (or woman) can't separate between what is real and what goes in in the world of adult entertainment then I put that entirely on them.


----------



## Dromond

LordQuas said:


> But it's not like she's going around saying that the content on her website is a representation of completely "normal" behavior, few porn sites are making money based on how "normal" they are. If a grown man (or woman) can't separate between what is real and what goes in in the world of adult entertainment then I put that entirely on them.



Our entire society is built on illusion and denial. One look at politics will tell that story.


----------



## FA Punk

Dromond said:


> It can give a man a very skewed view of what bbws/ssbbws are really like, especially if the paysite board is his primary source of 'information.'
> 
> You're providing a service, of course. But the whole atmosphere of "look how much food I can shovel," and "see what a piggy I am," or "it feels so great to gain," as well as "I'm so huge, look how small these clothes are on me" is toxic to a person who has little to no experience with actual larger ladies.
> 
> It's not your responsibility to set them straight. You're a capitalist and caveat emptor and all that. But you can't take the profit without taking the bad press due to your actions. You don't get to have it both ways.



Thats not even the issue, the issue is that if you post any sort of comment on the paysite board your opinions don't matter as much on the other boards:doh:. And I'm sorry but that is bullshit.


----------



## Dromond

Nevermind.


----------



## MzDeeZyre

FA Punk said:


> Thats not even the issue, the issue is that if you post any sort of comment on the paysite board your opinions don't matter as much on the other boards:doh:. And I'm sorry but that is bullshit.



Wait..... who said that?? I don't think anyone here said, or inferred that.


----------



## FA Punk

MzDeeZyre said:


> Wait..... who said that?? I don't think anyone here said, or inferred that.



It doesn't have to be said, I've seen it happen before, ''Well you just post in the paysite board blah..blah..blah'' it's one of those unwritten rules of Dims.


----------



## joswitch

LordQuas said:


> But it's not like she's going around saying that the content on her website is a representation of completely "normal" behavior, few porn sites are making money based on how "normal" they are. If a grown man (or woman) can't separate between what is real and what goes in in the world of adult entertainment then I put that entirely on them.



Exactly! Only morons believe porn = reality! It's acting! Sometimes, really, really bad acting!


----------



## joswitch

BBW4Chattery said:


> *snip*
> 
> Gah...and I was thinking I could trust Dr. Oz after the episode I caught where he warned me my vagina would fall out because "most women" have vaginal prolapse at some point in their lives. Disappointing.



Clearly, Dr Oz medical school made some cuts in the models for the anatomy department:


----------



## Mishty

LordQuas said:


> But it's not like she's going around saying that the content on her website is a representation of completely "normal" behavior, few porn sites are making money based on how "normal" they are. If a grown man (or woman) can't separate between what is real and what goes in in the world of adult entertainment then I put that entirely on them.



Welllllll I kinda feel like porn in general whether it be BBW or gonzo porn,shows a very un-real scene. Okay, look at like anal sex,for decades men have been lead to believe by porn that women love a really big and angry penis in their un-lubbed bum because of porn. Now fat women have to tolerate big and buttery pies crammed into their mouth holes to get these basement dwelling fappers off.


*I like angry penis in my bum almost much as I like pie forced into my face during sex. {riddle me that}


----------



## joswitch

gangstadawg said:


> wtf? this is the first i have hard of this comparison. dont know the logic they used to come up with it because it makes no sense at all.



No logic involved at all. It's purely emotive. (Although, they will try to rationalise their emotional response, afterwards, with a load of BS).

Basically, these people hate pedos and... these same haters also hate adult fat people and FAs - especially adult fat people and FAs having happy sex together. Both things make the haters go *squick* "Ewwww!!!". So, for these haters, the two are the same thing! 

Haters do their thinking with their guts & glands rather than their brains.


----------



## Mishty

FA Punk said:


> Thats not even the issue, the issue is that if you post any sort of comment on the paysite board your opinions don't matter as much on the other boards:doh:. And I'm sorry but that is bullshit.




No. When a man has been a member for four years,has mad less than fifty posts and forty of those are on the paysite board and he realizes he's gonna get no action Jackson from married web models THEN decides to join the rest of the group to play,his view is fucked. Because those fetishes and desires he brings with him. It's almost too easy to pick out the once upon a lurker,fap boys posting on a normal thread.


----------



## joswitch

MzDeeZyre said:


> I beg to differ.... Not every FA that is here looks at the Pay Site board. AND.... not every FA that is here is bad.
> 
> I am so tired of hearing everyone drone on and say..... OMG he's an FA.... he must be a feeder. NO..... Stop with the generalizations.
> 
> I don't see everyone generalizing with the FFA's and how they must be feeders, and how horrible they are.
> 
> Feederism is a FETISH, and while it may not be for you, it may be for someone else.
> 
> :eat1:



Agreed.

Also, there are feeders out there (like me) who can get by perfectly happily just "playing"* at it, just like BDSMers play at it without it ruling their lives.

Not all feeders actually seek to make their feedees gain to a bajillionty immobile pounds, some would be happy with just a few, or even none at all.

(*e.g. if the feedee is already a BBW, and up for a bit of sexy token feeding in the bedroom! Yay!)

And certainly not all feeders up and leave their feedees once they get fat. 
Wtf is up with that anyway? bizarro! surely you'd be all woo! My gf is a (ss)bbw now! Awesomes!

Monique clearly had bad experiences, and did what she needed to do to get out of that, but that doesn't mean that everyone has had or will have those same bad experiences. I can think of three or four long term feeder/feedee couples who've been together for years, straight off the top of my head.


----------



## joswitch

Mishty said:


> No. When a man has been a member for four years,has mad less than fifty posts and forty of those are on the paysite board and he realizes he's gonna get no action Jackson from married web models THEN decides to join the rest of the group to play,his view is fucked. Because those fetishes and desires he brings with him. It's almost too easy to pick out the once upon a lurker,fap boys posting on a normal thread.



Breaking news:

There are two kinds of men. Those who will cheerfully admit to looking at porn. And those who lie about looking at porn.

And:

Learning to tell the difference between porn and real life is one of the very first things that men learn. 


We know that if we go round to do some plumbing we will probably NOT be met at the door by a busty hausfrau in a see-through negligee, and even if we are it'll only be because she's bangin' hubby/bf upstairs when we ring the bell. We know she won't make some crude innuendo while rubbing our monkey wrench before getting her tits out and making a bee-line for our pants. And even if she does, we should probably politely decline and/or flee, because there's a fair to middling chance: she's crazy and will later burst into tears and/or try to stab us, or failing that hubby will show up and try to batter/stab/shoot us. 

We know teh pr0n is a lie!! So we turn up, do the plumbing, hopefully get a cup of tea, leave an invoice and go on about our day.

Men: able to tell the difference between fiction and real life. We be skilled like that, and shiz. Also able to chew gum, walk and talk at the same time.


----------



## Mishty

joswitch said:


> Breaking news:
> 
> There are two kinds of men. Those who will cheerfully admit to looking at porn. And those who lie about looking at porn.
> 
> And:
> 
> Learning to tell the difference between porn and real life is one of the very first things that men learn.
> 
> 
> We know that if we go round to do some plumbing we will probably NOT be met at the door by a busty hausfrau in a see-through negligee, and even if we are it'll only be because she's bangin' hubby/bf upstairs when we ring the bell. We know she won't make some crude innuendo while rubbing our monkey wrench before getting her tits out and making a bee-line for our pants. And even if she does, we should probably politely decline and/or flee, because there's a fair to middling chance: she's crazy and will later burst into tears and/or try to stab us, or failing that hubby will show up and try to batter/stab/shoot us.
> 
> We know teh pr0n is a lie!! So we turn up, do the plumbing, hopefully get a cup of tea, leave an invoice and go on about our day.
> 
> Men: able to tell the difference between fiction and real life. We be skilled like that, and shiz. Also able to chew gum, walk and talk at the same time.



Two types of men may be walkin' this earth but Dim land only has one kind. A man is far more likely to try to feed a fat woman a pie than a normal plumber man is to fuck Bella Donna with a wrench.


----------



## FA Punk

Mishty said:


> No. When a man has been a member for four years,has mad less than fifty posts and forty of those are on the paysite board and he realizes he's gonna get no action Jackson from married web models THEN decides to join the rest of the group to play,his view is fucked. Because those fetishes and desires he brings with him. It's almost too easy to pick out the once upon a lurker,fap boys posting on a normal thread.



And that is not always the case, that man my have forty posts in the paysite section *here* but mybe he interacts more seriously with this community at another forum. Since you know Dims isn't the only FA/BBW community around:doh:. The idea to completely disregard someone's opinion because of where they choose to post isn't fair nor is it right.


----------



## joswitch

Mishty said:


> Welllllll I kinda feel like porn in general whether it be BBW or gonzo porn,shows a very un-real scene. Okay, look at like anal sex,for decades men have been lead to believe by porn that women love a really big and angry penis in their un-lubbed bum because of porn. Now fat women have to tolerate big and buttery pies crammed into their mouth holes to get these *basement dwelling fappers off.*
> 
> 
> *I like angry penis in my bum almost much as I like pie forced into my face during sex. {riddle me that}



So, here's a thing:

Has anyone else noticed? 
When a woman has a wank, she's all empowered! and getting-in-touch with her own sexuality and shiz. And oh, isn't it fabulous how independent and don't-need-a-man, (just a vibe, invented and built by men) she is! You go grrrrl!!
But:
When a man has a wank, ooooh, he must be some "basement dwelling fapper" code for troglodyte loser. How pathetic he is!

Also, I know waaaay more women still living at home with their folks than I know men doing the same, yet they are not mocked as "basement dwellers". Funny that, eh?


Men: also able to notice BS double standards. We be all multi-talented and shiz. Hehehehe.


----------



## joswitch

Mishty said:


> Two types of men may be walkin' this earth but Dim land only has one kind. A man is far more likely to try to feed a fat woman a pie than a normal plumber man is to fuck Bella Donna with a wrench.



And fat women hate teh pieZ. Hate them. Pastryphobics, one and all. Fact.

Also, I think your pr0n is scarier than my pr0n Misty!

Flee! Flee from teh angry penis butthex!!


----------



## Mishty

joswitch said:


> So, here's a thing:
> 
> Has anyone else noticed?
> When a woman has a wank, she's all empowered! and getting-in-touch with her own sexuality and shiz. And oh, isn't it fabulous how independent and don't-need-a-man, (just a vibe, invented and built by men) she is! You go grrrrl!!
> But:
> When a man has a wank, ooooh, he must be some "basement dwelling fapper" code for troglodyte loser. How pathetic he is!
> 
> Also, I know waaaay more women still living at home with their folks than I know men doing the same, yet they are not mocked as "basement dwellers". Funny that, eh?
> 
> 
> Men: also able to notice BS double standards. We be all multi-talented and shiz. Hehehehe.



BECAUSE i can see both sides of an argument about porn, you can't.
I can like something,it can get me off, and I can admit it's not healthy or normal, but men just wanna roar about. blah dee fuckin' blah my penisssss. Men have been discussing jacking off for a super long time,masturbation bragging for the ladies is new,let us have our. our glory,boss.


----------



## joswitch

Mishty said:


> BECAUSE i can see both sides of an argument about porn, you can't.
> I can like something,it can get me off, and I can admit it's not healthy or normal, but men just wanna roar about. blah dee fuckin' blah my penisssss. Men have been discussing jacking off for a super long time,masturbation bragging for the ladies is new,let us have our. our glory,boss.



Wow, now I feel sad for you. Who taught you that masturbation is "not healthy or normal"? 

Really, Misty, don't worry, you will not go blind and you will not grow hair on your palms, or go insane. Those things are not, in fact, true. At all.
There is nothing wrong with masturbation. It's like, totes ok. No matter what that ol'fella in the pointy hat in the Vatican says.

Also, you seem to be like totally fucking obsessed with "angry" penises.

Well, I am happy to bring you wonderful, joyful news:
Penises are NOT compulsory.
You can go your whole life and never, ever have to see, touch, or talk about (or to) penises. EvAR.

Hint: Don't go on ChatRoulette. Don't open picture attachments or texts from people you don't know.

There you go, fixed! You may now go about the rest of your penis-free life!
You're welcome!


----------



## wrestlingguy

All you wise old sages who are far too smart to think that all women must be just like their webmodel counterparts, riddle me this.......

*Why is it that so many women here share the complaint of guys continually asking them things that would typically be asked of paysite girls?*

See, having had to counsel many a guy who's attended a bash thinking that they could take a shot at shagging one of the paysite ladies who wouldn't have sex with them if they had $50 bills hanging out of their butts (well maybe a couple of them would), then when they get enough rejections from them, head over to the other ladies, figuring they can do and say the same things.

Sorry boys, I'm not buying it. Dromond is dead on with his assessment.


----------



## moore2me

> Originally Posted by FA Punk
> 
> I loved the fact that Dr. Ablow was at least honest about his feeling towards FAs, were no better then someone who would rape a child in his eyes. He's a bastard but an honest bastard, most of these assholes would have just beat'en around the bush on that one but not him, Oh no Dr. Ablow tells it like it is. Funny how the men in our community are becoming more and more demonized on television and were not even there to fight back.






joswitch said:


> That's not the first time I've come across that comparison and it pisses me right off.
> 
> When anyone compares what goes on between consenting adults to pedophilia, they are:
> 1) totally infantilising one half of the couple (almost always women)
> 2) demonising the other half (almost always men)
> 3) putting the demonised half in danger of death. In my country an accusation of pedophilia has led to men being killed by vigilante morons (one guy was chased off the top of a multi-story building). At the height of pedo hysteria a pediatrician (child DOCTOR) was attacked by a mob of illiterates.
> 
> because of 3) I would deem it legitimate to defend yourself by any means necessary against anyone calling or comparing you to a pedo, as they are effectively threatening your life. Especially if live on TV in front of millions. It's deadly serious.
> 
> Maybe Dr Blowme knows this and that's why he doesn't invite men on his show...



*I totally agree with Joswitch on this one - with this add on. Not only is the good Dr. putting some men in danger in countries where pedophilia is a death sentence, but the Dr is also trivializing the dangerous & perverted true pedophiles.* Sexually harming a child is a serious crime in the US and an immoral act of a barbarian psychopath. A person (most often males, but sometimes females) should not have their child abuse actions minimized by trivializing their sins. 

Dr Ablow trivializes raping children when he compares raping a child to people who break society's rules - written rules (such as not burning your draft card, not filing income taxes on time, not paying parking ticket fines, etc.) or social rules (no spitting on people's cars, no hanging out in bars all day unless its raining, or not talking dirty to your grandma, etc,).


----------



## Reenaye Starr

wrestlingguy said:


> *REAL RELATIONSHIPS ARE NOT ABOUT JUST THE FAT.*



Amen... This goes for most the feeder/feedee relationships I know as well.. Including my own.


----------



## Reenaye Starr

joswitch said:


> Agreed.
> 
> Also, there are feeders out there (like me) who can get by perfectly happily just "playing"* at it, just like BDSMers play at it without it ruling their lives.
> 
> Not all feeders actually seek to make their feedees gain to a bajillionty immobile pounds, some would be happy with just a few, or even none at all.
> 
> (*e.g. if the feedee is already a BBW, and up for a bit of sexy token feeding in the bedroom! Yay!)
> 
> And certainly not all feeders up and leave their feedees once they get fat.
> Wtf is up with that anyway? bizarro! surely you'd be all woo! My gf is a (ss)bbw now! Awesomes!
> 
> Monique clearly had bad experiences, and did what she needed to do to get out of that, but that doesn't mean that everyone has had or will have those same bad experiences. I can think of three or four long term feeder/feedee couples who've been together for years, straight off the top of my head.



A girl can be a feedee without being a gainer... "playing at it" is always fun!


----------



## joswitch

Reenaye Starr said:


> Amen... This goes for most the feeder/feedee relationships I know as well.. Including my own.



^This.

There's this BS myth floating around out there that says: feeder/feedees aren't real people too, with actual loving feelings for one another. Probably based on that C4 documentary / urban legends that form the popular image of feedism. 

People who believe in this myth forget that being a heartless asshole is not a feeder specific trait, there's a subset of men and women of all orientations and kinks who happen to be heartless assholes, and a much bigger subset who are not.


----------



## Reenaye Starr

joswitch said:


> ^This.
> 
> There's this BS myth floating around out there that says: feeder/feedees aren't real people too, with actual loving feelings for one another. Probably based on that C4 documentary / urban legends that form the popular image of feedism.
> 
> People who believe in this myth forget that being a heartless asshole is not a feeder specific trait, there's a subset of men and women of all orientations and kinks who happen to be heartless assholes, and a much bigger subset who are not.



Another thing that is amusing me in this thread is the distinction between "paysite girls" and "real girls", because what we do for a living makes us somehow less real. Paysite girls don't have feelings, or share the same desires out of a relationship like love or respect... I dunno'... There seems to be WAY too much closed-mindedness in this thread... We are supposed to be an open-minded group of folks who love accept and respect one another... Instead, I am seeing a lot of "if you are not like me, you're thoughts and feelings are immediately invalid..." It's a shame, all the way around.


----------



## KHayes666

Reenaye Starr said:


> Another thing that is amusing me in this thread is the distinction between "paysite girls" and "real girls", because what we do for a living makes us somehow less real. Paysite girls don't have feelings, or share the same desires out of a relationship like love or respect... I dunno'... There seems to be WAY too much closed-mindedness in this thread... We are supposed to be an open-minded group of folks who love accept and respect one another... Instead, I am seeing a lot of "if you are not like me, you're thoughts and feelings are immediately invalid..." It's a shame, all the way around.



There's no difference than paysite girls and "real" girls. A girl is a girl regardless of their occupation. Screw them if they want to act like aristocratic jackasses and put you down.


----------



## Weirdo890

Reenaye Starr said:


> Another thing that is amusing me in this thread is the distinction between "paysite girls" and "real girls", because what we do for a living makes us somehow less real. Paysite girls don't have feelings, or share the same desires out of a relationship like love or respect... I dunno'... There seems to be WAY too much closed-mindedness in this thread... We are supposed to be an open-minded group of folks who love accept and respect one another... Instead, I am seeing a lot of "if you are not like me, you're thoughts and feelings are immediately invalid..." It's a shame, all the way around.



That seems to be an all-too common occurrence all over the internet. It's a shame really, because the internet is supposed to be an area of free discussion. It has however turned into a group of like-minded, prejudiced cults that will attack anybody that disagrees. I do believe that the SA community should represent a united front that accepts all the fetishes. 

"A house divided against itself cannot stand." - Abraham Lincoln (happy birthday to him BTW.  )


----------



## AuntHen

joswitch said:


> Wow, now I feel sad for you. Who taught you that masturbation is "not healthy or normal"?
> 
> Really, Misty, don't worry, you will not go blind and you will not grow hair on your palms, or go insane. Those things are not, in fact, true. At all.
> There is nothing wrong with masturbation. It's like, totes ok. No matter what that ol'fella in the pointy hat in the Vatican says.
> 
> Also, you seem to be like totally fucking obsessed with "angry" penises.
> 
> Well, I am happy to bring you wonderful, joyful news:
> Penises are NOT compulsory.
> You can go your whole life and never, ever have to see, touch, or talk about (or to) penises. EvAR.
> 
> Hint: Don't go on ChatRoulette. Don't open picture attachments or texts from people you don't know.
> 
> There you go, fixed! You may now go about the rest of your penis-free life!
> You're welcome!



She can correct me if I am wrong but I believe she was talking about *porn *not being healthy (not masturbation). And I would agree with that as it can give a person an unrealistic view of women, men, sex, intimacy, etc. And do *not *preach to me about porn just being a fantasy or stimulant because there are actually men out there that think women should have naturally bleached bung-holes among other things.

And just a personal peeve but can you please stop the lolcats lingo? It makes me not want to take you seriously at all.


----------



## FA Punk

*sigh*..size acceptance is doomed to forever fail.


----------



## wrestlingguy

KHayes666 said:


> *There's no difference than paysite girls and "real" girls. A girl is a girl regardless of their occupation.*



I happen to agree with you here. The girls are no different at all. Where I would make the distinction is in the product of the web girls. All I'm saying here is what a girl may say or do or take a pic or video of as a web model might be very different from who they are in real life. 

I know lots of paysite girls who are completely different from their online personal. A couple of them that I've met in person have been quite aloof, so different from the girl who updates weekly.


----------



## wrestlingguy

KHayes666 said:


> *There's no difference than paysite girls and "real" girls. A girl is a girl regardless of their occupation.*



I happen to agree with you here. Generally, the girls are no different at all. Where I would make the distinction is in the product of the web girls. All I'm saying here is what a girl may say or do or take a pic or video of as a web model might be very different from who they are in real life. 

I know lots of paysite girls who are completely different from their online persona. A couple of them that I've met in person have been quite different from their very aggressive (and fetish oriented) webmodel product.


----------



## AuntHen

FA Punk said:


> *sigh*..size acceptance is doomed to forever fail.



What exactly is your definition of size acceptance?


----------



## joswitch

fat9276 said:


> She can correct me if I am wrong but I believe she was talking about *porn *not being healthy (not masturbation). And I would agree with that as it can give a person an unrealistic view of women, men, sex, intimacy, etc.



Only if they're the kind of dumbasses who think Star Trek is a documentary.



> And do *not *preach to me about porn just being a fantasy or stimulant because there are actually men out there that think women should have naturally bleached bung-holes among other things.



So what? You don't have to associate with delusional people, it is NOT COMPULSORY.



> And just a personal peeve but can you please stop the lolcats lingo? It makes me not want to take you seriously at all.



It iz teh pr0n. There's nothing to take seriously, that's where you're going wrong.


----------



## AuntHen

Anyway... I got sidetracked. To get more back on topic, I somewhat like Dr. Oz and some of his "healthy" concepts but this show is probably always going to view fat people as unhealthy, in need of a life-changing moment and pathetic.

The look on his face says it all after the guest said she liked herself the way she was (or something like that). It was the look of "you poor poor thing... you just aren't ready to change". Kind of like one would look at a drug addict that said they were fine. I get the feeling he/the show thinks all of us fatties need to hit *rock bottom *and then see *the light*. :doh:

However, if the other fat lady is unhappy and her fat is hurting her health, quality of life, etc then I am glad she is trying to get help (whether from the show or elsewhere). I do not think anyone should live life miserable, fat or not.


----------



## Weirdo890

fat9276 said:


> Anyway... I got sidetracked. To get more back on topic, I somewhat like Dr. Oz and some of his "healthy" concepts but this show is probably always going to view fat people as unhealthy, in need of a life-changing moment and pathetic.
> 
> The look on his face says it all after the guest said she liked herself the way she was (or something like that). It was the look of "you poor poor thing... you just aren't ready to change". Kind of like one would look at a drug addict that said they were fine. I get the feeling he/the show thinks all of us fatties need to hit *rock bottom *and then see *the light*. :doh:



I think that's how a lot of the media looks upon us fatties. *sighs*


----------



## gangstadawg

truebebeblue said:


> Porn is fake?! OMG nooooooooooooo



way to go over thinking what i said. to really get a summary of how i feel about what superstar xxx said i feel she should really think about taking her site down or doing damage control because of what she said depending on if she wants to keep doing it or get out of the industry. from a business perspective (ignoring the fanbase thing completly) she just outed herself as being a fake and basically said she doesnt like herself which is basically a business talking bad about itself which im pretty sure that wont get you any customers or in this case any subscribers.


----------



## Reenaye Starr

gangstadawg said:


> way to go over thinking what i said. to really get a summary of how i feel about what superstar xxx said i feel she should really think about taking her site down or doing damage control because of what she said depending on if she wants to keep doing it or get out of the industry. from a business perspective (ignoring the fanbase thing completly) she just outed herself as being a fake and basically said she doesnt like herself which is basically a business talking bad about itself which im pretty sure that wont get you any customers or in this case any subscribers.



The one thing about superstar xxx's whole spiel that upset me is that she was trash talking this fan who apparently "wanted to smell her sweat", and yet, she had no problem taking his money and doing it in the first place... I doubt he had any idea that she was going to air his laundry in such a nasty light on National Tele... I would think that her fans would now be thinking twice before engaging her with fetish requests, even if she hadn't ruined the illusion that she loves her fat body.

I am trying not to throw stones here, too much... But that seems questionable to me.


----------



## gangstadawg

Reenaye Starr said:


> The one thing about superstar xxx's whole spiel that upset me is that she was trash talking this fan who apparently "wanted to smell her sweat", and yet, she had no problem taking his money and doing it in the first place... I doubt he had any idea that she was going to air his laundry in such a nasty light on National Tele... I would think that her fans would now be thinking twice before engaging her with fetish requests, even if she hadn't ruined the illusion that she loves her fat body.
> 
> I am trying not to throw stones here, too much... But that seems questionable to me.



agree. also didnt she have a contest on her site a while back that one lucky member would get some oral action? i could have swarn i saw that on her site or from her on Facebook. isnt that prostituting? seriously this is some hoodrat ish.


----------



## Weirdo890

Reenaye Starr said:


> The one thing about superstar xxx's whole spiel that upset me is that she was trash talking this fan who apparently "wanted to smell her sweat", and yet, she had no problem taking his money and doing it in the first place... I doubt he had any idea that she was going to air his laundry in such a nasty light on National Tele... I would think that her fans would now be thinking twice before engaging her with fetish requests, even if she hadn't ruined the illusion that she loves her fat body.
> 
> I am trying not to throw stones here, too much... But that seems questionable to me.



What are you two talking about?


----------



## truebebeblue

She is human that can have conflicting feelings being a kinda public figure can be hurt by that but 
maybe she is unhappy enough that she doesn't care?
I would think shaming fans like she did would be worse for business.
Guys need to realize that porn is FANTASY. There are going to moments that we as models FAKE or sometimes even whole aspects of ourselves because that is entertainment for you....some women are nothing at all like their porn persona....her mistake I guess is sharing it with the world.
Although a lot of men will NOT care because they are getting off to her persona and do not need the two to match up.. there is even a portion that will seek her out because she has shown a vulnerability and that is hot to them.




gangstadawg said:


> way to go over thinking what i said. to really get a summary of how i feel about what superstar xxx said i feel she should really think about taking her site down or doing damage control because of what she said depending on if she wants to keep doing it or get out of the industry. from a business perspective (ignoring the fanbase thing completly) she just outed herself as being a fake and basically said she doesnt like herself which is basically a business talking bad about itself which im pretty sure that wont get you any customers or in this case any subscribers.


----------



## truebebeblue

gangstadawg said:


> agree. also didnt she have a contest on her site a while back that one lucky member would get some oral action? i could have swarn i saw that on her site or from her on Facebook. isnt that prostituting? seriously this is some hoodrat ish.




I have no problem with hookers but unless she was exchanging a bj directly for something of value then no... I've seen loads of porn stars do this.


----------



## Fat Brian

truebebeblue said:


> Guys need to realize that porn is FANTASY.




Even for those of us who do know not to believe life is like the paysite board there is a big let down to know a person you find attractive hates herself. It's not about a burst fantasy but just on a personal level that she is unhappy with something that to us is greatly valued.


----------



## truebebeblue

Fat Brian said:


> Even for those of us who do know not to believe life is like the paysite board there is a big let down to know a person you find attractive hates herself. It's not about a burst fantasy but just on a personal level that she is unhappy with something that to us is greatly valued.



But noone complains when it is a 'normal' woman just models and celebrities.
Ooo boo! So and so lost weight! 
Same as a non FA guy complaining about how fat Kirstie Alley got and I don't think it stops most FAs from oogling her new fat body even though she totally publicly hates it! Guys still fap to her before and afters.


----------



## Reenaye Starr

gangstadawg said:


> agree. also didnt she have a contest on her site a while back that one lucky member would get some oral action? i could have swarn i saw that on her site or from her on Facebook. isnt that prostituting? seriously this is some hoodrat ish.



Ha... I find it hilarious that a woman who gives out free bjs was trying to school me saying I should feel shame for what I do. Ummm... I ate a donut, you ate a strangers [email protected]#k. She specifically called me out on stage (it was cut from TV) and said I looked like the most uncomfortable person up there, because I was "laughing and smiling." Listen, I don't care how you do your thing, whether you do hardcore porn or you attend church on Sunday... Live your life and do what makes you happy, but DO NOT try to attack me for living the way I do, when you are giving away bjs.... Seriously!!!!


----------



## FA Punk

I don't think you can compare Reenaye to Superstar since Reenaye is a fetish model and Superstar is a hardcore model, now even though you might share the same fan base pre-say it's still two very differnt types of modeling with two differnt appeals.


----------



## gangstadawg

Reenaye Starr said:


> Ha... I find it hilarious that a woman who gives out free bjs was trying to school me saying I should feel shame for what I do. Ummm... I ate a donut, you ate a strangers [email protected]#k. She specifically called me out on stage (it was cut from TV) and said I looked like the most uncomfortable person up there, because I was "laughing and smiling." Listen, I don't care how you do your thing, whether you do hardcore porn or you attend church on Sunday... Live your life and do what makes you happy, but DO NOT try to attack me for living the way I do, when you are giving away bjs.... Seriously!!!!



exactly she is a sour/bitter person. like i said in a previous post she was on FB and on youtube dissing other bbw models BY NAME. she seems to enjoy starting BS and conflict.


----------



## gangstadawg

truebebeblue said:


> I have no problem with hookers but unless she was exchanging a bj directly for something of value then no... I've seen loads of porn stars do this.



i thought the contest was for new members (no pun intended). which means you had to pay to be able to be in the drawing.


----------



## gangstadawg

truebebeblue said:


> But noone complains when it is a 'normal' woman just models and celebrities.
> Ooo boo! So and so lost weight!
> Same as a non FA guy complaining about how fat Kirstie Alley got and I don't think it stops most FAs from oogling her new fat body even though she totally publicly hates it! Guys still fap to her before and afters.



maybe the ones that dont mind pay for it after finding out. or they will wait till it its a pirate site (not that i support that kind of thing).


----------



## ThatFatGirl

Reenaye Starr said:


> *Another thing that is amusing me in this thread is the distinction between "paysite girls" and "real girls", because what we do for a living makes us somehow less real. Paysite girls don't have feelings, or share the same desires out of a relationship like love or respect..*. I dunno'... There seems to be WAY too much closed-mindedness in this thread... We are supposed to be an open-minded group of folks who love accept and respect one another... Instead, I am seeing a lot of "if you are not like me, you're thoughts and feelings are immediately invalid..." It's a shame, all the way around.



Can you point me to where you saw this? I may have missed it. What I saw was a distinction between the persona portrayed by some paysite girls on their websites versus the reality of fat girls in every day life. Hopefully anyone with a brain knows there are real women behind all those personas.


----------



## Fat Brian

truebebeblue said:


> But noone complains when it is a 'normal' woman just models and celebrities.
> Ooo boo! So and so lost weight!
> Same as a non FA guy complaining about how fat Kirstie Alley got and I don't think it stops most FAs from oogling her new fat body even though she totally publicly hates it! Guys still fap to her before and afters.



I think it's sad, tragic even, that our society puts so many barriers up to prevent women from loving their bodies. That includes all women, famous or not. As for Kirstie Alley, it's hard to tell one day to the next what her opinion of herself will be, it seems to depend mostly on who is paying her bills.


----------



## ThatFatGirl

moniquessbbw said:


> I don't see any difference. *The same FA's looking at the pay sites is the same FA's you find here.* You can be in denial if you want to thats fine by me. I just happen to know a different truth than you do. Having been married to a feeder and dated several closet feeders I can speak from my own personal experiences. I know how Pauline feels and her husband was no where to be found. Now her son has to take on that role as care giver and any other title he needs to have to help his mom. They fatten you up and leave you. I don't see what part people dont get that about feeders. IMO feeders don't care about size acceptance. The community is just a way for them to get a big woman. I don't remember seeing any feeders at the Million Pound march that NAAFA held years ago. I agree with the doctor who said they are getting off on us as we gain and get sicker. I use to say the same things till I developed congestive heart failure at 27. I was young and thought I was healthy too. It all catches up to us one day. That is just the simple truth. I would have taken the help to learn new tools. The tools are the important part. Knowledge is power.



Denial of what? I completely agree with the statement bolded above. It's a big hop from getting off on fat (be it through fantasy websites, the Dimensions paysite board or with a real life fat partner) and standing up for the rights of fat people to be treated with dignity and respect in their every day lives - size acceptance. That's what I said in my previous post. What are you and I disagreeing on? You seem to think of Dimensions as a size acceptance site/community. I don't. I see it as a fat appreciation site with fetish at its core, hefty sides of fat information and support, a side or two fun and silliness, and a sprinkling of fat activism. 





MzDeeZyre said:


> I beg to differ.... Not every FA that is here looks at the Pay Site board. AND.... not every FA that is here is bad.
> 
> I am so tired of hearing everyone drone on and say..... OMG he's an FA.... he must be a feeder. NO..... Stop with the generalizations.
> 
> I don't see everyone generalizing with the FFA's and how they must be feeders, and how horrible they are.
> 
> Feederism is a FETISH, and while it may not be for you, it may be for someone else.
> 
> :eat1:



^^^Totally agree. There are definitely some people who identify with FA and/or Feeder labels who also care about size acceptance and others who only care about the fat with "the bigger the better" mentality... no matter what the cost it seems.


I think the real argument in this thread is the sexualization of fat, fat fetishism, and whether or not it has any role in size acceptance. True's analogy with the gay rights movement in an earlier post was spot-on. When seeking acceptance from the general public marching through the public square (or appearing on national TV) with your freak flag flying is not the best way to get your message of acceptance heard.


----------



## Marlayna

Fetish at it's core here at Dims? Geeze, I hope not.
I hope SA is at it's core, because that's the way I see it.
Fat sexuality doesn't equate with "fetish". 
The fetishists I've met were in the minority.
Most men weren't into any extremes, just regular sex.


----------



## ThatFatGirl

Marlayna said:


> Fetish at it's core here at Dims? Geeze, I hope not.
> I hope SA is at it's core, because that's the way I see it.
> Fat sexuality doesn't equate with "fetish".
> The fetishists I've met were in the minority.
> Most men weren't into any extremes, just regular sex.




Fat sexuality (sexuality of fat people) and the sexualization of fat are two different things. 

Thousands of weight gain stories in the library, thousands upon thousands of page views for the paysite board, the popularity of the weight board and it's sub boards... lovin' the fat is what it's all about. Of course there's more than that or a lot of us would not be here.


----------



## Mishty

FA Punk said:


> And that is not always the case, that man my have forty posts in the paysite section *here* but mybe he interacts more seriously with this community at another forum. Since you know Dims isn't the only FA/BBW community around:doh:. The idea to completely disregard someone's opinion because of where they choose to post isn't fair nor is it right.



What are we not cool enough to hang with? Are we not sexy enough to post in all our forums? Or maybe we tend to be too mouthy around here? Maybe because we don't lay back and accept every idea and scheme, like some of those other wonderful boards BBW/FA frequent, maybe that's why so many stick to the nice safe haven of the paysite boards,eh? 

When you don't vote,you can't bitch, and if you don't contribute you can't be one of us.

I will give anyone the benefit of the doubt,until given a reason to doubt someones goals. If a man or woman wants to come join the everyday discussions,so be it, the more the merrier. However, don't think we're going to be welcoming and open minded about everything, some things that aren't taboo or out of the ordinary on the Pay Board, might not sit well with the rest of this community as a whole.


----------



## JohnWylde

Hi Ruby

I know one of the ladies who went on the show and she vented that they were all conned by the show staff when they were invited on.
What happened on the show was far from what they were led to expect and they realised they were just used as 'entertainment' as the show tried to humiliate them.
Just typical sick TV - after all TV promotes the ideal of skin and bone alone as healthy.


John W

PS I hope you are fit and well Ruby



Ruby Ripples said:


> The DrOz show flooded Fantasy Feeder (where i'm a Mod) with emails and forum posts and pms to site members, without permission, about four weeks ago. When I banned them all I got emails asking if they could have someone on to talk about plus size lifestyle, the woman was trying to make it sound very friendly, then slipped up by saying "we'd like someone to explain it all and defend the fat community".  That one word defend proved their intent, even if I hadn't already realised what it would be like.
> 
> Ugh.


----------



## LordQuas

Mishty said:


> No. When a man has been a member for four years,has mad less than fifty posts and forty of those are on the paysite board and he realizes he's gonna get no action Jackson from married web models THEN decides to join the rest of the group to play,his view is fucked. Because those fetishes and desires he brings with him. It's almost too easy to pick out the once upon a lurker,fap boys posting on a normal thread.



Maybe that person felt more comfortable posting on the Paysite Board because they felt it was a more accepting board.


----------



## LordQuas

wrestlingguy said:


> All you wise old sages who are far too smart to think that all women must be just like their webmodel counterparts, riddle me this.......
> 
> *Why is it that so many women here share the complaint of guys continually asking them things that would typically be asked of paysite girls?*
> 
> See, having had to counsel many a guy who's attended a bash thinking that they could take a shot at shagging one of the paysite ladies who wouldn't have sex with them if they had $50 bills hanging out of their butts (well maybe a couple of them would), then when they get enough rejections from them, head over to the other ladies, figuring they can do and say the same things.
> 
> Sorry boys, I'm not buying it. Dromond is dead on with his assessment.



Because a lot of people, men and women, are guilty of only acknowledging what reinforces their beliefs (the psychological term escapes me). A woman with a negative view of men can have 50 nice guys approach her but will only talk about the one asshole. Men do it too, only acknowledging the one woman that cheated on him instead of the other nice women he's dated that didn't do him wrong.


----------



## LordQuas

Mishty said:


> What are we not cool enough to hang with? Are we not sexy enough to post in all our forums? Or maybe we tend to be too mouthy around here? Maybe because we don't lay back and accept every idea and scheme, like some of those other wonderful boards BBW/FA frequent, maybe that's why so many stick to the nice safe haven of the paysite boards,eh?
> 
> When you don't vote,you can't bitch, and if you don't contribute you can't be one of us.
> 
> I will give anyone the benefit of the doubt,until given a reason to doubt someones goals. If a man or woman wants to come join the everyday discussions,so be it, the more the merrier. However, don't think we're going to be welcoming and open minded about everything, some things that aren't taboo or out of the ordinary on the Pay Board, might not sit well with the rest of this community as a whole.



Maybe they were afraid to post because people like you made them feel unwelcome


----------



## EMH1701

I never watch talk shows. Most talk shows are just modern-day freak shows with a psychologist in place of a circus ringmaster. They exist to 1. earn money and 2. make people feel better about themselves by completely humiliating others. "Oooh let's all point, stare, and laugh at the freaks with more problems than us!" They are, essentially, a form of bullying.


----------



## Fat Brian

LordQuas said:


> Maybe that person felt more comfortable posting on the Paysite Board because they felt it was a more accepting board.





LordQuas said:


> Because a lot of people, men and women, are guilty of only acknowledging what reinforces their beliefs (the psychological term escapes me). A woman with a negative view of men can have 50 nice guys approach her but will only talk about the one asshole. Men do it too, only acknowledging the one woman that cheated on him instead of the other nice women he's dated that didn't do him wrong.





LordQuas said:


> Maybe they were afraid to post because people like you made them feel unwelcome



Multiquote, USE IT!


----------



## LordQuas

Fat Brian said:


> Multiquote, USE IT!



Too much work


----------



## Fat Brian

LordQuas said:


> Too much work



Not really.


----------



## Mishty

LordQuas said:


> Maybe that person felt more comfortable posting on the Paysite Board because they felt it was a more accepting board.



Maybe because those ladies are being paid to accept their...ideas.


----------



## Mishty

LordQuas said:


> Maybe they were afraid to post because people like you made them feel unwelcome




Or maybe because they didn't get welcomed with opened arms from the non-credit card accepting members. And for your information, I highly doubt that any _real_ member of Dims is going to stop posting because of lil ole me. Even most of the die-hard paysite board posters know me,'cause *shocker*, I like to comment there myself. Those babes be smokin' hawt. 

Of course I don't say creepy shit like most of the creepers...but, I too fap America.


----------



## imfree

EMH1701 said:


> I never watch talk shows. Most talk shows are just modern-day freak shows with a psychologist in place of a circus ringmaster. They exist to 1. earn money and 2. make people feel better about themselves by completely humiliating others. "Oooh let's all point, stare, and laugh at the freaks with more problems than us!" They are, essentially, a form of bullying.



That is an awesome post! Sorry I can't Rep you yet. Talk shows! If a guest were the best person on Earth, those *damned talk show producers would still find that person's "freak zone" to ridicule, exploit, and bully that person for ratings and profit! My opinion only, your results may vary.

*Television: The 21st Century drug of choice


----------



## Dromond

Mishty said:


> Or maybe because they didn't get welcomed with opened arms from the non-credit card accepting members. And for your information, I highly doubt that any _real_ member of Dims is going to stop posting because of lil ole me. Even most of the die-hard paysite board posters know me,'cause *shocker*, I like to comment there myself. Those babes be smokin' hawt.
> 
> Of course I don't say creepy shit like most of the creepers...but, I too fap America.



You rock the house.


----------



## imfree

Mishty said:


> Or maybe because they didn't get welcomed with opened arms from the non-credit card accepting members. And for your information, I highly doubt that any _real_ member of Dims is going to stop posting because of lil ole me. Even most of the die-hard paysite board posters know me,'cause *shocker*, I like to comment there myself. Those babes be smokin' hawt.
> 
> *Of course I don't say creepy shit like most of the creepers...but, I too fap America.*



Great post! Kinda' like smokin' weed, almost everyone does, but there's really no need to make the details public.


----------



## Marlayna

Is there a link somewhere to that particular show?


----------



## ThatFatGirl

Marlayna said:


> Is there a link somewhere to that particular show?



Here's part 1 from Dr. Oz's site. http://www.doctoroz.com/videos/fattest-women-america-pt-1

You can get most of the rest of the show from that same page.


----------



## Marlayna

ThatFatGirl said:


> Here's part 1 from Dr. Oz's site. http://www.doctoroz.com/videos/fattest-women-america-pt-1
> 
> You can get most of the rest of the show from that same page.


Thank you.


----------



## AuntHen

Mishty said:


> Maybe because those ladies are being paid to accept their...ideas.



How *horrible *that all fat ladies do not smile sweetly and giggle at every comment an FA makes in regards to fat and fatness. I mean the nerve! They should all feel flattered... or maybe *fattered *


----------



## FA Punk

Mishty said:


> What are we not cool enough to hang with? Are we not sexy enough to post in all our forums? Or maybe we tend to be too mouthy around here? Maybe because we don't lay back and accept every idea and scheme, like some of those other wonderful boards BBW/FA frequent, maybe that's why so many stick to the nice safe haven of the paysite boards,eh?
> 
> When you don't vote,you can't bitch, and if you don't contribute you can't be one of us.
> 
> I will give anyone the benefit of the doubt,until given a reason to doubt someones goals. If a man or woman wants to come join the everyday discussions,so be it, the more the merrier. However, don't think we're going to be welcoming and open minded about everything, some things that aren't taboo or out of the ordinary on the Pay Board, might not sit well with the rest of this community as a whole.



Dimensions isn't known for being welcoming towards anybody of any gender, more or less if you don't agree with the hive mind mentality around here you'er basically fucked from the get go. You say you'll give someone the benefit of the doubt but you don't lol, each post you've made in this thread has been but judgemental in some way shape or form. So basically if you are a paysite model don't bother posting anywhere else on this forum other then the paysite board cause you are not welcome anywhere else, also if you are a man remember your opinions don't mean jack shit since you are nothing more then a ''second class citizen''.


----------



## AuntHen

FA Punk said:


> Dimensions isn't known for being welcoming towards anybody of any gender, more or less if you don't agree with the hive mind mentality around here you'er basically fucked from the get go. You say you'll give someone the benefit of the doubt but you don't lol, each post you've made in this thread has been but judgemental in some way shape or form. So basically if you are a paysite model don't bother posting anywhere else on this forum other then the paysite board cause you are not welcome anywhere else, also if you are a man remember your opinions don't mean jack shit since you are nothing more then a ''second class citizen''.



So basically YOUR idea of size acceptance and being non-judgemental is to coddle and accept every FA's behavior no matter what they say or do? 

If anything she has tried to show how she sees both sides of the argument but I guess because she doesn't sugar coat it to your liking she is judgemental and part of a hive?

I mean really? You sir, are the pot calling the kettle black (only she is actually pink).


----------



## Dromond

FA Punk said:


> Dimensions isn't known for being welcoming towards anybody of any gender, more or less if you don't agree with the hive mind mentality around here you'er basically fucked from the get go. You say you'll give someone the benefit of the doubt but you don't lol, each post you've made in this thread has been but judgemental in some way shape or form. So basically if you are a paysite model don't bother posting anywhere else on this forum other then the paysite board cause you are not welcome anywhere else, also if you are a man remember your opinions don't mean jack shit since you are nothing more then a ''second class citizen''.



What a weird post.

BCBonnie, Amatrix, AnnMarie, MzPuss, etc., etc., etc. are all part of the Dims community.

Edited to add: The only men who get called out are the creepers.


----------



## Mathias

FA Punk said:


> Dimensions isn't known for being welcoming towards anybody of any gender, more or less if you don't agree with the hive mind mentality around here you'er basically fucked from the get go. You say you'll give someone the benefit of the doubt but you don't lol, each post you've made in this thread has been but judgemental in some way shape or form. So basically if you are a paysite model don't bother posting anywhere else on this forum other then the paysite board cause you are not welcome anywhere else, also if you are a man remember your opinions don't mean jack shit since you are nothing more then a ''second class citizen''.



The only people who pull the "This site isn't welcoming" bullshit are the ones who are rude/snarky and aggressive towards this site as a whole and are pissed because they've probably been called on it by the community.


----------



## FA Punk

fat9276 said:


> So basically YOUR idea of size acceptance and being non-judgemental is to coddle and accept every FA's behavior no matter what they say or do?
> 
> If anything she has tried to show how she sees both sides of the argument but I guess because she doesn't sugar coat it to your liking she is judgemental and part of a hive?
> 
> I mean really? You sir, are the pot calling the kettle black (only she is actually pink).



I didn't say to coddle anybody, she thinks that people who post in the paysite area should be exuded and that I disagree with.



Mathias said:


> The only people who pull the "This site isn't welcoming" bullshit are the ones who are rude/snarky and aggressive towards this site as a whole and are pissed because they've probably been called on it by the community.



No those are the people who thrive around here


----------



## AuntHen

FA Punk said:


> It doesn't have to be said, I've seen it happen before, ''Well you just post in the paysite board blah..blah..blah'' it's one of those unwritten rules of Dims.



ummm... considering you said this in response to MzD... your mind was already in a place to be biased.


----------



## FA Punk

fat9276 said:


> ummm... considering you said this in response to MzD... your mind was already in a place to be biased.



So what? Like everyone here hasn't been biased over one thing or another.


----------



## AuntHen

FA Punk said:


> So what? Like everyone here hasn't been biased over one thing or another.




sooooo, no matter what she says (or anyone who *calls out* creepy for that matter), all you are going to hear is "I am a man-hating-FA paysite-basher hear me roarrrrrrrrrrrrrrr". Like, you can't see the forest for the trees, man.


----------



## FA Punk

fat9276 said:


> sooooo, no matter what she says (or anyone who *calls out* creepy for that matter), all you are going to hear is "I am a man-hating-FA paysite-basher hear me roarrrrrrrrrrrrrrr". Like, you can't see the forrest for the trees, man.



No, but I can read between the lines, if someone is acting like a ''creeper'' fine but to automatically to exuded someone from the discussion because they don't post here that often is krap.


----------



## AuntHen

FA Punk said:


> No, but I can read between the lines, if someone is acting like a ''creeper'' fine but to automatically to exuded someone from the discussion because they don't post here that often is krap.



and again, like you *yourself *said, no one here said that. so we are now officially beating a dead horse


----------



## FA Punk

fat9276 said:


> and again, like you *yourself *said, no one here said that. so we are now officially beating a dead horse



I'm bored anyway, I'm done.


----------



## AuntHen

FA Punk said:


> I didn't say to coddle anybody, she thinks that *people who post in the paysite area should be exuded* and that I disagree with. QUOTE]
> 
> The horse was already dead so that's all fine and dandy but one more point Mr. Treesbutnoforest... Mishty stated is her posts that SHE looks at and posts in the paysite board. Have a nice night


----------



## KHayes666

fat9276 said:


> FA Punk said:
> 
> 
> 
> I didn't say to coddle anybody, she thinks that *people who post in the paysite area should be exuded* and that I disagree with. QUOTE]
> 
> The horse was already dead so that's all fine and dandy but one more point Mr. Treesbutnoforest... Mishty stated is her posts that SHE looks at and posts in the paysite board. Have a nice night
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I have 7 thousand posts and more rep cans than I ever thought I'd get and most of my posts are on the paysite board. Anyone who says people who post there are excluded don't know what they are talking about
Click to expand...


----------



## Fat Brian

There is a high bar for posting here. If someone asks for pics or just posts things of very poor taste and they only have a few posts and no one really knows them they are likely to get called on it. It just so happens that guys who post exclusively on the paysite board are potentially more likely to come to the rest of the site and say things the nonpaysite posters will object to. Nobody gets jumped on until they draw attention to themselves.


----------



## wrestlingguy

Fact. Right now as I post this, there are 19 pages of people who are online in the Dimensions Forums, and 4 and half pages are identified members, with the rest viewing the site as "guests".

Fact. Of those 14 and a half pages of guests, less than a page and a half were people looking at forums that were not the Paysite Board or Library.

Fact. This means that there are nearly 13 pages of unidentified people who are trolling both the Paysite Board, and stories in the Library.

There's nothing wrong with being on the Paysite Board, and participating, I did it myself back in the day. Quite honestly, the people who peruse the pron boards anonymously would likely not want to post in the Main Board, since they probably don't care about size acceptance, and aren't likely to post anywhere else, since they're probably anti social, or want to remain anonymous. They have nothing to contribute anyway, as far as I'm concerned.

I'm as human as any other guy here, I came for the pretty girls, but I'm not into variety, so when I've been involved with women in my life, it seemed senseless to go there. I have/had many paysite girls as friends over the years, and many of them feel like family to me, so it started to get gross if I went and looked at their updates.

I got more involved in size acceptance when I saw what the people that I loved went through on a daily basis, so today my emphasis is less on the sex and more on fat rights/size acceptance. It's like going to a party because they're serving free beer, then deciding to stay and help clean up because you feel like you owe them.

Guys who post nowhere but the Paysite Forum are truly missing out on the full FA experience, and they do themselves a disservice by doing so. Additionally, because their experience is so narrow, when they take it to relationships, they end up hurting women in the process, which causes many of the ladies to stereotype the FAs based on their experience. How fair is that to anyone?

When I was still involved in the NJ BBW Bash, I wanted to conduct a round table discussion for FAs about how to approach fat women, what NOT to say, things like that. One of my good friends who's also a FA messaged me and said it was a great idea, but the problem was that the guys who needed this discussion most wouldn't show up, because they'd be in the lobby of the hotel trolling for fatties.

The Paysite only posters, in my opinion, are those guys.


----------



## KHayes666

I just posted on 3 paysite threads featuring ladies I met in real life. How many of the paysite only boarders actually meet and befriend the ladies they drool over constantly?


----------



## Mishty

FA Punk said:


> Dimensions isn't known for being welcoming towards anybody of any gender, more or less if you don't agree with the hive mind mentality around here you'er basically fucked from the get go. You say you'll give someone the benefit of the doubt but you don't lol, each post you've made in this thread has been but judgemental in some way shape or form. So basically if you are a paysite model don't bother posting anywhere else on this forum other then the paysite board cause you are not welcome anywhere else, also if you are a man remember your opinions don't mean jack shit since you are nothing more then a ''second class citizen''.



Oh you silly bastard.

I hate to repeat myself,but I'm a little hungover and you are annoying me:



> Even most of the die-hard paysite board posters know me,'cause shocker, I like to comment there myself. Those babes be smokin' hawt.
> Of course I don't say creepy shit like most of the creepers...but, I too fap America.



I like the paysite ladies, I even like some of the men that only post there, I like the men giving these sexy women feedback,okay?

ALL the hell I'm saying is, SOMETIMES men on the paysite boards think that ALL women *here* are into ALL the things those ladies gettin' paid are into. Let me break it down for you: Only a small amount of the female population of Dimensions* likes to dress in a tight sexy mini dress,full makeup, and eat Chinese buffet while crooning. 




*_I like to dress in tight clothing and croon with a mouthful pie,so you can't say I be hatin' _


----------



## Angel

Mishty said:


> ALL the hell I'm saying is, SOMETIMES men on the paysite boards think that ALL women *here* are into ALL the things those ladies gettin' paid are into. Let me break it down for you: Only a small amount of the female population of Dimensions* likes to dress in a tight sexy mini dress,full makeup, and eat Chinese buffet while crooning.



that was an ice cold glass of water 


Some live in a fantasy world and believe every fantasy presented to them to be reality. Their sexuality is so deeply entertwined with their fantasy world, so much so that they may spend hours a day looking at and even subconsiously replaying over and over again in their mind those images they have viewed. The way they communicate and respond in their fantasy world, even when sometimes inappropriately, is accepted, thus they then believe it is acceptable any time they deal with someone resembling their fantasy ideal or with someone who possesses any of the physical characteristics they find sexually appealing. It's as if they never learn to differenciate between what is acceptable in their fantasy world and what is in actuality reality.


----------



## Dromond

Sociopathy is a subset of Antisocial Personality Disorder. It is characterized by an outwardly normal aspect, hiding the antisocial tendencies of the individual. The sociopathic individual has a lack of empathy for others and is amoral in their conduct.

Serial killers are sociopathic, but by no means are all sociopaths serial killers. That's an extreme outlier. The vast majority of sociopaths operate within the margins of society. They are the users, abusers, corrupt businesspeople, etc. It's not that they actively don't care, it simply doesn't occur to them that they should care.


----------



## KHayes666

Dromond said:


> Sociopathy is a subset of Antisocial Personality Disorder. It is characterized by an outwardly normal aspect, hiding the antisocial tendencies of the individual. The sociopathic individual has a lack of empathy for others and is amoral in their conduct.
> 
> Serial killers are sociopathic, but by no means are all sociopaths serial killers. That's an extreme outlier. The vast majority of sociopaths operate within the margins of society. They are the users, abusers, corrupt businesspeople, etc. It's not that they actively don't care, it simply doesn't occur to them that they should care.



Not all serial killers are sociopathic either


----------



## Dromond

KHayes666 said:


> Not all serial killers are sociopathic either



Citation needed.


----------



## CastingPearls

Dromond said:


> Citation needed.


C'mon John. Whatever happened to the 'cos he said so' defense?


----------



## KHayes666

Dromond said:


> Citation needed.



Alright you got me. I was going to say Timothy McVeigh but he was a mass murderer, not a serial killer. 

My bad


----------



## GoldenDelicious

moniquessbbw said:


> I don't see any difference. The same FA's looking at the pay sites is the same FA's you find here. You can be in denial if you want to thats fine by me. I just happen to know a different truth than you do. Having been married to a feeder and dated several closet feeders I can speak from my own personal experiences. I know how Pauline feels and her husband was no where to be found. Now her son has to take on that role as care giver and any other title he needs to have to help his mom. They fatten you up and leave you. I don't see what part people dont get that about feeders. IMO feeders don't care about size acceptance. The community is just a way for them to get a big woman. I don't remember seeing any feeders at the Million Pound march that NAAFA held years ago. I agree with the doctor who said they are getting off on us as we gain and get sicker. I use to say the same things till I developed congestive heart failure at 27. I was young and thought I was healthy too. It all catches up to us one day. That is just the simple truth. I would have taken the help to learn new tools. The tools are the important part. Knowledge is power.



I would agree with the Size acceptance bit. I am in a few SA groups on Facebook. One called Big Fat world has about 650 members and you could count on your hands the number of those there who are men. I actually found that a bit disheartening. It seems there has to be sexual content/potential for relationships for a lot of non fat guys (non Fas?) to become involved in Size acceptance. I know the rest of the women there feel it too. As for NAAFA, you probably didn't see any feeders because it is now their policy not to admit them. I don't know much about their history but I know that for a while the group had a lot of high up members that were feeders and the group really had to shake off that image if they were to make any headway to becoming a serious group. I believe Peggy and Darlene Howell are both members of BFW and If you wanted to know more about that you could just ask them. x


----------



## GoldenDelicious

KHayes666 said:


> Not all serial killers are sociopathic either


One of the diagnostic criteria that defines sociopaths is that they lack empathy. I would imagine to kill more than 2 people would require this element. In saying that there are a lot of people who have killed a lot more than two people eg. Those in a war situation- generally we don't call them serial killers though, we call them heroes. A lot of it is about definition I guess, which humans make up themselves. .. Wait, are we still on the Dr Oz thread? :huh: Actually, this might be apt because he seems like a sociopath to me!


----------



## GoldenDelicious

Hmm.. In my post 2 up it should read (Fas?) not (Non Fas).. Sorry!


----------



## Webmaster

GoldenDelicious said:


> ... I don't know much about their history ...



That much is obvious. So perhaps you should stay with topics where you have actual firsthand knowledge. But for a brief history lesson, NAAFA was started by an FA in 1969, has always benefitted greatly from FA support and participation, and always had special interest groups that supported friends and allies, including FAs. NAAFA activism projects always had substantial FA support (including our protest in front of the White House in the early 90s). As longtime chairman of the board (as well as Life Member and recipient of one of the very few Lifetime Achievement Awards) I personally oversaw the separation of the social component (among other, by taking Dimensions out of NAAFA) and the establishment of corporate policies to sharpen NAAFA's focus on the political side of its corporate mission. The organization deserves credit where credit is due, and that goes for all who contributed.


----------



## KHayes666

GoldenDelicious said:


> One of the diagnostic criteria that defines sociopaths is that they lack empathy. I would imagine to kill more than 2 people would require this element. In saying that there are a lot of people who have killed a lot more than two people eg. Those in a war situation- generally we don't call them serial killers though, we call them heroes. A lot of it is about definition I guess, which humans make up themselves. .. Wait, are we still on the Dr Oz thread? :huh: Actually, this might be apt because he seems like a sociopath to me!



You're right, you're right....I was wrong. Everyone else from Bundy to Gacy were sociopathic.


----------



## Dromond

Webmaster said:


> That much is obvious. So perhaps you should stay with topics where you have actual firsthand knowledge. But for a brief history lesson, NAAFA was started by an FA in 1969, has always benefitted greatly from FA support and participation, and always had special interest groups that supported friends and allies, including FAs. NAAFA activism projects always had substantial FA support (including our protest in front of the White House in the early 90s). As longtime chairman of the board (as well as Life Member and recipient of one of the very few Lifetime Achievement Awards) I personally oversaw the separation of the social component (among other, by taking Dimensions out of NAAFA) and the establishment of corporate policies to sharpen NAAFA's focus on the political side of its corporate mission. The organization deserves credit where credit is due, and that goes for all who contributed.



Dimensions is the only place I've ever heard of NAAFA. They have zero impact on the popular culture at large. I want to know what they've done for me. What lasting impact they've had on my life, because I am not seeing it.


----------



## KHayes666

Dromond said:


> Dimensions is the only place I've ever heard of NAAFA. They have zero impact on the popular culture at large. I want to know what they've done for me. What lasting impact they've had on my life, because I am not seeing it.



Go to a NAAFA convention sometime. Maybe you'd enjoy it Mr. Scrooge


----------



## Dromond

There is life outside the fatosphere, Mr. Cratchit.


----------



## KHayes666

Dromond said:


> There is life outside the fatosphere, Mr. Cratchit.



There's magic in the air this evening
Magic in the air
The world is at her best, you know
When people love and care
The promise of excitement
Is one the night will keep
After all, there's only one more sleep 'til Christmas

The world has got a smile today
The world has got a glow
There's no such thing as strangers when
A stranger says hello
And everyone is family
We're having so much fun
After all, there's only one more sleep 'til Christmas

'Tis the season to be jolly and joyous
With a burst of pleasure, we feel it arrive
It's the season when the saints can employ us
To spread the news about peace and to keep love alive

There's something in the wind today
That's good for everyone
Yes, faith is in our hearts today
We're shining like the sun
And everyone can feel it
The feeling's running deep
After all, there's only one more sleep 'til Christmas
After all, there's only one more sleep 'til Christmas day


----------



## GoldenDelicious

Webmaster said:


> That much is obvious. So perhaps you should stay with topics where you have actual firsthand knowledge.



I am good friends with a few people on the NAAFA board atm, including the chairwoman and from what I do know I understand they are totally embarrassed by their past and are trying to do everything in their power to detach themselves from it. This is why both my partner and myself are fully paid up NAAFA members. I will participate in any topics I want to and won't take suggestions from you. NAAFA seems to do a lot more for SA than they used to do. Everyone in SA agrees with this. You should keep up to date with these SA topics and breakthroughs.


----------



## BBWAzrael

This kind of crap really makes me mad. It reminds me of when I was first getting on the "MS rollercoaster" and I had a doctor refuse to treat me until I lost 50 lbs at least. If they are happy with their bodies the way they are and are healthy in any other way than who's flipping business is it? I say, as long as you live a healthy lifestyle then that's all that matters. The scale is just a number!


----------



## imfree

BBWAzrael said:


> This kind of crap really makes me mad. It reminds me of when I was first getting on the "MS rollercoaster" and I had a doctor refuse to treat me until I lost 50 lbs at least. If they are happy with their bodies the way they are and are healthy in any other way than who's flipping business is it? I say, as long as you live a healthy lifestyle then that's all that matters. The scale is just a number!



Here's a nice, old song where Segar says "I'm not a number, dammit, I'm a man!", a message that's more timely, these days, than ever!


----------



## Russell Williams

Dromond said:


> Dimensions is the only place I've ever heard of NAAFA. They have zero impact on the popular culture at large. I want to know what they've done for me. What lasting impact they've had on my life, because I am not seeing it.




What is NAAFA done for you.( I hope I have the correct restaurant). My wife and I went into a Denny's restaurant and there were no chairs that my wife could fit in. I talked with the manager, explained the situation, and asked him which member of his competition did he recommend we go to. I then either called or wrote a letter to the corporate office explaining what had happened and pointed out that sending potential customers to the competition was not the way to increase business volume. I identified myself as a NAAFA member. (I cannot remember if I was still a member of the Board of Directors at that time) After some discussion with the corporate offices of Denny's the corporate offices of Denny's told NAAFA that in all future Denny's built there would be some armless and movable chairs and that in every Denny's restaurant remodeled there would be some armless and movable chairs.

Somewhat later I went back to the Denny's restaurant mentioned in the second sentence of the above paragraph and told the manager what had happened. The manager said something to the effect of, "That explains it. We are scheduled for remodeling and the guidelines point out that we must have some armless and movable chairs and a remodeled restaurant." 

So if you eat in a Denny's restaurant and are large or with someone else who is large the fact that you could eat there is one of the things that NAAFA has done for you.

Conrad, if you remember something differently please correct me.


----------



## Russell Williams

What has NAAFA done for my wife. Starting about 20 years ago I started bugging the local medical facilities that do body scans, CAT scans and MRIs and those type of things, I continually pointed out that Washington County had one of the highest percentages of fat people in the whole country. I talked with manufacturers to find out what was available and why larger ones were not being made. Since I was a cochairperson of Cumberland Valley NAAFA I would occasionally get calls from people needing body scans and I would give them the information I had.

When the wonderful Louise Wolfe went through her heart attack and cancer she needed a full body scan. Only at Johns Hopkins would they do the operation on her. Aohns Hopkins did not have any body scanner that would handle her size. Washington County Maryland did have body scanners that would handle her size. I do not know for certain that the fact that Washington County has them and Johns Hopkins does not is in any way related to my actions. However, when I was telling a friend about Washington County having the scanners and Johns Hopkins not having one her response was, "Of course, Russell Williams lives in Washington County!"


----------



## Russell Williams

There is a local complex of doctors offices. For years I bugged them about the need to have some wide chairs in each office. It got to the point where in the medical lab where I had to go once a month or so for blood tests I started doing sit- ins. I came close to being arrested but as the discussion was being held everybody else in the lab and waaiting area could hear what I perceived the problem to be. Eventually that lab and more and more other doctors offices, in that complex, started having some wide chairs. I was later told that news of my activities had reached the person who designed that medical facility. I was told that he designed and built such medical complexes all over the country and that in the future he would make sure that every one he built had some wide chairs in every office.


----------



## Russell Williams

GoldenDelicious said:


> I am good friends with a few people on the NAAFA board atm, including the chairwoman and from what I do know I understand they are totally embarrassed by their past and are trying to do everything in their power to detach themselves from it. This is why both my partner and myself are fully paid up NAAFA members. I will participate in any topics I want to and won't take suggestions from you. NAAFA seems to do a lot more for SA than they used to do. Everyone in SA agrees with this. You should keep up to date with these SA topics and breakthroughs.



When I was a member of the NAAFA Board of Directors my position was that the social activities funded the activism activities. Many people were willing to come to social activities and pay a lot of money to get into them. While at the social activities they would sometimes complain about the way they were treated as fat people but they would not participate in activities that might help reduce size discrimination.

So, if we could not get them to donate money to activism we could get them to pay money to come to social activities and use some of the profits to fund activism projects.

Former board member Louise Wolfe agrees with the above and just commented that sometimes as they were exposed to the activism activities at the social activities, they would start becoming more involved in the activism activities.


----------



## Russell Williams

GoldenDelicious said:


> I am good friends with a few people on the NAAFA board atm, including the chairwoman and from what I do know I understand they are totally embarrassed by their past and are trying to do everything in their power to detach themselves from it. This is why both my partner and myself are fully paid up NAAFA members. I will participate in any topics I want to and won't take suggestions from you. NAAFA seems to do a lot more for SA than they used to do. Everyone in SA agrees with this. You should keep up to date with these SA topics and breakthroughs.


 
Once at some sort of a NAAFA social function a woman said to me, "Three days at a NAAFA weekend has done more for my self-image than three years of psychotherapy."


----------



## KHayes666

Russell Williams said:


> What is NAAFA done for you.( I hope I have the correct restaurant). My wife and I went into a Denny's restaurant and there were no chairs that my wife could fit in. I talked with the manager, explained the situation, and asked him which member of his competition did he recommend we go to. I then either called or wrote a letter to the corporate office explaining what had happened and pointed out that sending potential customers to the competition was not the way to increase business volume. I identified myself as a NAAFA member. (I cannot remember if I was still a member of the Board of Directors at that time) After some discussion with the corporate offices of Denny's the corporate offices of Denny's told NAAFA that in all future Denny's built there would be some armless and movable chairs and that in every Denny's restaurant remodeled there would be some armless and movable chairs.
> 
> Somewhat later I went back to the Denny's restaurant mentioned in the second sentence of the above paragraph and told the manager what had happened. The manager said something to the effect of, "That explains it. We are scheduled for remodeling and the guidelines point out that we must have some armless and movable chairs and a remodeled restaurant."
> 
> So if you eat in a Denny's restaurant and are large or with someone else who is large the fact that you could eat there is one of the things that NAAFA has done for you.
> 
> Conrad, if you remember something differently please correct me.



What if he doesn't eat at Dennys? What if he rarely leaves the house? What if he eats at IHOP instead? Forget about all the good things NAAFA has done for you and everyone else the last 30 years, WHAT ABOUT HIS NEEDS GOD DAMMIT!!!???


----------



## Dromond

KHayes666 said:


> What if he doesn't eat at Dennys? What if he rarely leaves the house? What if he eats at IHOP instead? Forget about all the good things NAAFA has done for you and everyone else the last 30 years, WHAT ABOUT HIS NEEDS GOD DAMMIT!!!???



The Americans with Disabilities Act provides the legal teeth for any accommodation of fat people in public spaces. I don't feel particularly indebted to NAAFA for that.


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## Mishty

I would like to say,in college I had very few desks I could actually fit in,and I did ask my professors about it and I was promptly sent to the prudish Dean to complain. One mention of the NAAFA and my rights had him nodding and offering to place larger desks in each of my classes. I wasn't even a card carrying member at the time,but he knew a ruckus could be made. 

I can't just toss out what has been done. 
My own Mama was denied rights years ago,when being fat wasn't a disability but a gross thing you were to ignorant to control/fix. When the only time fat disabilities were acknowledged was during a law suit toward someone for physical injuries and such. 

I think the NAAFA has died down in the last couple of years,but considering they were the path makers,the trail blazers,the people blasted and taunted for even thinking they had rights because of their size, I think I do owe them respect. I was only 17 when I found the old NAAFA website and a light bulb started burning bright for me and my body and my body's rights.


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## KHayes666

Dromond said:


> The Americans with Disabilities Act provides the legal teeth for any accommodation of fat people in public spaces. I don't feel particularly indebted to NAAFA for that.



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KBthi_An5qQ&feature=related

That about covers it


----------



## Deadbolt100

After reading this entire post over the course of a few days I have to feel a bit insulted. I identify as a feeder, but i feel empathy, i care about size acceptance issues, I don't just fatten and leave a significant other, and above all I take into consideration the well being of the person who I am with above my needs. So some of the statements made are gross stereotypes, Dims is a place for everyone to come together and it is because of this that I am saddened that there is so much arguing and bickering. I think this article has lost its focus and should be locked seeing how it has devolved from something we can all hate (Dr.Oz) into a debate about NAAFA and so i suggest start a new post about NAAFA.


----------



## KHayes666

Deadbolt100 said:


> After reading this entire post over the course of a few days I have to feel a bit insulted. I identify as a feeder, but i feel empathy, i care about size acceptance issues, *I don't just fatten and leave a significant other*, and above all I take into consideration the well being of the person who I am with above my needs. So some of the statements made are gross stereotypes, Dims is a place for everyone to come together and it is because of this that I am saddened that there is so much arguing and bickering. I think this article has lost its focus and should be locked seeing how it has devolved from something we can all hate (Dr.Oz) into a debate about NAAFA and so i suggest start a new post about NAAFA.



No self respecting human being does that. Its not a feeder thing, its a sociopathic deformity thing.


----------



## GoldenDelicious

Russell Williams said:


> Once at some sort of a NAAFA social function a woman said to me, "Three days at a NAAFA weekend has done more for my self-image than three years of psychotherapy."



Nice anecdote. Perhaps I should be more clear. When I said that the current NAAFA members are embarrassed by their past and want to remove themselves from it totally and move on a huge part of this has to do with the fact that a lot of the ex board members were feeders. The SA movement wants to detach itself totally from this fetish. I have been told of other embarrassments too, in I guess the sort of unwritten history of NAAFA. 
NAAFA are doing more now for fat people that they ever did. From what I am told, the old NAAFA was more about people 'dating' each other than political movement of any kind.


----------



## chocolate desire

I know I am late fr the rodeo but had to put in my two cents.As for me I did not go on Dr Odd fr 15 minutes of fame I have had that already years ago.I did not go for the so called vacation as it was cold there and if I wated a vacation I would have went bac to L.A. Now for the reasons I did go.. I was contacted about doing show about people of size and happy with their life. I happen to fit that catagory so I went.Upon arrival is when I was told four other people would be there to help convince Dr Odd that you can b overweight and happy. It was not until the morning of the show that I found out there would be four other ladies and it would be a debate.When given the option to leave I stayed to be noisey as I said because nothing the had said thus far clicked to me why I should be fat and unhappy.Not naming names but 2 ladies on the other side have kept in contact with me and has even gone so far as to threaten to sue because they did not get the help they was promised. I can only hope someone somewhere watched the show and said if they are fat and happy the I can be too. I made it clear I am not a feedee although I see nothin wrong wth it. The only thing I hate about the whole experince was bcause I would no say I wanted to bethe biggest lady in the world they felt none of my other words were important.I had a great time met new friends and even get famous grey papaya hotdogs. Down me if you must but do so for the right thing not because I will use any means that come my way if I can make a difference in one persons life who thinks life is over because diets dont work for them. You can be fat and happy.


----------



## LoveBHMS

NAAFA taking a position on feederism makes as much sense as the National Organization for Women taking a position on BDSM.

Fetishes are just sexuality. You can practice them in a bad way but having them doesn't make you a bad person.


----------



## bigmac

LoveBHMS said:


> NAAFA taking a position on feederism makes as much sense as the National Organization for Women taking a position on BDSM.
> 
> Fetishes are just sexuality. You can practice them in a bad way but having them doesn't make you a bad person.




Actually no! Like it or not the feeder/feedee issue undermines efforts to gain meaningful rights and protections for fat people. To be effective any fat rights organization needs to separate itself from feederism.


----------



## KHayes666

bigmac said:


> Actually no! Like it or not the feeder/feedee issue undermines efforts to gain meaningful rights and protections for fat people. To be effective any fat rights organization needs to separate itself from feederism.



That's like saying gay rights activists need to separate themselves from the type of gays that wear assless chaps in public.

Separation is not acceptance.


----------



## bigmac

KHayes666 said:


> That's like saying gay rights activists need to separate themselves from the type of gays that wear assless chaps in public.
> 
> Separation is not acceptance.




No -- more like separating themselves from guys who bareback in bathhouses.


----------



## KHayes666

bigmac said:


> No -- more like separating themselves from guys who bareback in bathhouses.



Would the gay rights activists do that? No.

So why should the size acceptance community turn their backs on feederism and those who partake in it?

Otherwise its "Then they came for me" and all the people with their noses in the air looking down at feederism, the seriously overweight, the pornstars, the ones who take pictures of food in public and the bbw bash goers....will be all alone when society condems them too.


----------



## bigmac

KHayes666 said:


> Would the gay rights activists do that? No.



Actually they did turn their backs on bathhouse culture.


----------



## KHayes666

bigmac said:


> Actually they did turn their backs on bathhouse culture.



That sucks for them. If their message is "be gay our way or you don't count" then they're just as pathetic as the size acceptance people who turn their backs on feederism.


----------



## LoveBHMS

bigmac said:


> Actually no! Like it or not the feeder/feedee issue undermines efforts to gain meaningful rights and protections for fat people. To be effective any fat rights organization needs to separate itself from feederism.



They do? How? The existence of a sexual fetish isn't going to affect a civil rights movement. They're 2 entirely different things.

Feederism is about gaining sexual gratification from feeding, stuffing, and/or erotic weight gain. It hasn't got f**k all to do with a lack of acceptance. You're either into it or not. It's not a matter of "oh, 300 pound women aren't hot and thus I will engage in feederism to make them into 400 pound women." It's about the fact that weight gain arouses you, and that can include the one who is gaining or fantasizing about it.

And tangentially let me point out that a lot of people who are sexually aroused by feeding or gaining can practice the fetish without anyone gaining an ounce. Some people just masturbate to fantasy, some engage in role play or fat talk, and some feed in a limitted way. There's even a thread on a feederism oriented site where people exchange ideas for foods to eat for stuffing without weight gain because they're aroused by eating or feeling full but don't want to gain.

And there are people who do in fact make a choice to gain for sexual pleasure. And if you are fighting for free airline seats, movie theaters with arm rests that go up, and more tables than booths in restaurants then everyone who's fat should access those things whether you got fat because of genetics, laziness, depression, a love of cheesecake and Taco Bell or because being fat gets you off.


----------



## bigmac

The bottom line is that people who purposefully feed or are fed in order to gain large amounts of weight play right into the hands of those who claim that being fat is an immoral lifestyle. Just like gays who participated in 70s and early 80s bathhouse culture played right into the hands of those who claimed that being gay was an immoral lifestyle.

Its interesting to note that after they marginalized the self-destructive portion of their community gays became much for successful in their push for equal rights and recognition.


----------



## Wild Zero

bigmac said:


> The bottom line is that people who purposefully feed or are fed in order to gain large amounts of weight play right into the hands of those who claim that being fat is an immoral lifestyle.



The problem isn't with feedee/gainers but people who make the assumption that all fat people are immoral. To people like that you can shove HAES or Feederism down their throats all you want, it's not going to change their childish, bigoted views. Fat people, ewwwww.


----------



## bigmac

Wild Zero said:


> The problem isn't with feedee/gainers but people who make the assumption that all fat people are immoral. To people like that you can shove HAES or Feederism down their throats all you want, it's not going to change their childish, bigoted views. Fat people, ewwwww.



Yes -- haters will always be haters -- but we can take their audience away.


----------



## Diana_Prince245

KHayes666 said:


> That's like saying gay rights activists need to separate themselves from the type of gays that wear assless chaps in public.
> 
> Separation is not acceptance.



All chaps are assless.


----------



## KHayes666

bigmac said:


> The bottom line is that people who purposefully feed or are fed in order to gain large amounts of weight play right into the hands of those who claim that being fat is an immoral lifestyle. Just like gays who participated in 70s and early 80s bathhouse culture played right into the hands of those who claimed that being gay was an immoral lifestyle.
> 
> Its interesting to note that after they marginalized the self-destructive portion of their community gays became much for successful in their push for equal rights and recognition.



What about the people who aren't into feeding and gaining yet take pictures of their food in public while people look on in disgust?

What about the ladies who aren't into feeding or gaining that wear bikini's in public to pools and beaches while people look on in disgust?

What about the overweight men and women that arent into feeding and gaining yet take the "all you can eat" buffet literally that other customers look on in disgust?

What about 500-600 pound men and woman that aren't into feeding and gaining that wear normal clothing just walking or scooting around a grocery store that get stared at in horror?

In your facist view of how society should be does NAAFA do away with them too because people are disgusted with them the same way they are with feeders and gainers? Take away their audience right?


----------



## LoveBHMS

bigmac said:


> The bottom line is that people who purposefully feed or are fed in order to gain large amounts of weight play right into the hands of those who claim that being fat is an immoral lifestyle. Just like gays who participated in 70s and early 80s bathhouse culture played right into the hands of those who claimed that being gay was an immoral lifestyle.
> 
> Its interesting to note that after they marginalized the self-destructive portion of their community gays became much for successful in their push for equal rights and recognition.



Ok...wrong.

People engaging in feederism are expressing their sexuality. What consenting adults do in private isn't a statement. 

If you're suggesting that being anti-feeder is going to promote SA, that's really unfortunate. You seem to be fixated on the notion that SA is only applicable if it's held as a truism that nobody is ever responsible for his or her own size.


----------



## KHayes666

LoveBHMS said:


> Ok...wrong.
> 
> People engaging in feederism are expressing their sexuality. What consenting adults do in private isn't a statement.
> 
> If you're suggesting that being anti-feeder is going to promote SA, that's really unfortunate. You seem to be fixated on the notion that SA is only applicable if it's held as a truism that nobody is ever responsible for his or her own size.



No no, size acceptance is only applicable if you follow Big Mac's rules:

You can be fat but not too fat
You can't be into feederism
You can't take pics of food in public
You can't wear anything offensive
You can't say you like being fat, you have to always admit you want to lose weight
You can only eat one cupcake a day
No hunting
No fishing
No shoes, no shirt, no service.


----------



## Lovelyone

Russell Williams said:


> What is NAAFA done for you.( I hope I have the correct restaurant). My wife and I went into a Denny's restaurant and there were no chairs that my wife could fit in. I talked with the manager, explained the situation, and asked him which member of his competition did he recommend we go to. I then either called or wrote a letter to the corporate office explaining what had happened and pointed out that sending potential customers to the competition was not the way to increase business volume. I identified myself as a NAAFA member. (I cannot remember if I was still a member of the Board of Directors at that time) After some discussion with the corporate offices of Denny's the corporate offices of Denny's told NAAFA that in all future Denny's built there would be some armless and movable chairs and that in every Denny's restaurant remodeled there would be some armless and movable chairs.
> 
> Somewhat later I went back to the Denny's restaurant mentioned in the second sentence of the above paragraph and told the manager what had happened. The manager said something to the effect of, "That explains it. We are scheduled for remodeling and the guidelines point out that we must have some armless and movable chairs and a remodeled restaurant."
> 
> So if you eat in a Denny's restaurant and are large or with someone else who is large the fact that you could eat there is one of the things that NAAFA has done for you.
> 
> Conrad, if you remember something differently please correct me.



I am NOT a member of NAAFA. I had a similar experience at an Olive Garden and at Denny's and several other restaurants in my area. ALL of the chairs had arms and there weren't any that I could sit comfortably in. I politely went to the managers and informed them of the situation. I asked them if they could see to it that there were chairs for plus sized people in the future and every one of them--in return--politely informed me that they would see to it that they had a few chairs for plus sized people. 

The next time I went to one of those restaurants, they had several armless chairs. NAAFA didn't do that for me...I did. I have spoken up about this issue and many others--such as the chairs in the college that I attended--I requested new chairs so many times that when the time came to order them, they asked me to choose which ones were best. All I am saying is NAAFA doesn't make ALL the changes necessary for the comfort and acceptance of fat people. There ARE other forces at work. To give NAAFA ALL the credit for every tiny little advance we get...does not do justice to everyone else whom is working so hard for the acceptance, too.


----------



## bigmac

KHayes666 said:


> No no, size acceptance is only applicable if you follow Big Mac's rules:
> 
> You can be fat but not too fat
> You can't be into feederism
> You can't take pics of food in public
> You can't wear anything offensive
> You can't say you like being fat, you have to always admit you want to lose weight
> You can only eat one cupcake a day
> No hunting
> No fishing
> No shoes, no shirt, no service.




Not my rules -- its the rules of the world. *Every group that has ever sought to advance itself has distanced itself from elements that brought disrepute. * The Irish disavowed drunkards. Italians distanced themselves from organized crime. Black civil rights leaders portrayed themselves and their supported as solid middle class citizens.

You may not like it but if fat people want to be taken seriously in the political arena they have to distance themselves from feederism.


----------



## LoveBHMS

bigmac said:


> The bottom line is that people who purposefully feed or are fed in order to gain large amounts of weight play right into the hands of those who claim that being fat is an immoral lifestyle. Just like gays who participated in 70s and early 80s bathhouse culture played right into the hands of those who claimed that being gay was an immoral lifestyle.
> 
> Its interesting to note that after they marginalized the self-destructive portion of their community gays became much for successful in their push for equal rights and recognition.



Distancing is fine. Just don't mention it. When Naafa issues a statement about it, it ceases to distance.

And I can't help but think that if your wife lost weight, you'd be on here crying about it. All the while denouncing feeders.


----------



## bigmac

LoveBHMS said:


> Distancing is fine. Just don't mention it. When Naafa issues a statement about it, it ceases to distance.
> 
> And I can't help but think that if your wife lost weight, you'd be on here crying about it. All the while denouncing feeders.



Actually my wife is about 70 pounds lighter than when I met her four and a half years ago. No crying on my part.


----------



## amandasevie

Why on earth would you watch daytime TV trash?


----------



## FA Punk

chocolate desire said:


> I know I am late fr the rodeo but had to put in my two cents.As for me I did not go on Dr Odd fr 15 minutes of fame I have had that already years ago.I did not go for the so called vacation as it was cold there and if I wated a vacation I would have went bac to L.A. Now for the reasons I did go.. I was contacted about doing show about people of size and happy with their life. I happen to fit that catagory so I went.Upon arrival is when I was told four other people would be there to help convince Dr Odd that you can b overweight and happy. It was not until the morning of the show that I found out there would be four other ladies and it would be a debate.When given the option to leave I stayed to be noisey as I said because nothing the had said thus far clicked to me why I should be fat and unhappy.Not naming names but 2 ladies on the other side have kept in contact with me and has even gone so far as to threaten to sue because they did not get the help they was promised. I can only hope someone somewhere watched the show and said if they are fat and happy the I can be too. I made it clear I am not a feedee although I see nothin wrong wth it. The only thing I hate about the whole experince was bcause I would no say I wanted to bethe biggest lady in the world they felt none of my other words were important.I had a great time met new friends and even get famous grey papaya hotdogs. Down me if you must but do so for the right thing not because I will use any means that come my way if I can make a difference in one persons life who thinks life is over because diets dont work for them. You can be fat and happy.



So they told you one thing then did another pretty much, no offense to you but you hear this story every single time. Sorry that happened to you but you would think people get a clue by now.


----------



## FA Punk

LoveBHMS said:


> Distancing is fine. Just don't mention it. When Naafa issues a statement about it, it ceases to distance.
> 
> *And I can't help but think that if your wife lost weight, you'd be on here crying about it. All the while denouncing feeders.*



Wow, great insult, it was uneeded and underhanded.


----------



## KHayes666

bigmac said:


> Not my rules -- its the rules of the world. *Every group that has ever sought to advance itself has distanced itself from elements that brought disrepute. * The Irish disavowed drunkards. Italians distanced themselves from organized crime. Black civil rights leaders portrayed themselves and their supported as solid middle class citizens.
> 
> You may not like it but if fat people want to be taken seriously in the political arena they have to distance themselves from feederism.



So if your wife goes to the grocery store and buys nothing but junk food its ok but if a feedee were to do the same thing they need to be separated?

Is that what you're telling us?


----------



## LoveBHMS

Yes, see it's kind of like how paysite girls can be considered "too fat" and how weight gain is unhealthy if done in front of a camera.

Let's say you have some regular fat person. He or she has decided life is too short to not enjoy yourself and isn't going to give up treats like Doritos and ice cream. So when that person is buying junk food, he or she is an adult and can do whatever.

If a fat person loves being fat and wants to gain more weight because it feels sexy, that fat person going out and buying the ice cream and Doritos is destroying size acceptance.

If you, as an FA went and scouted out a restaurant to make sure it had tables rather than boooths, you'd be a great guy and all around praiseworthy FA. If you said "it turns me on knowing she's gotten so fat that I have to check out anyplace we go to make sure she fits" then you'd be an evil superficial creep.


----------



## musicman

LoveBHMS said:


> Yes, see it's kind of like how paysite girls can be considered "too fat" and how weight gain is unhealthy if done in front of a camera.
> 
> Let's say you have some regular fat person. He or she has decided life is too short to not enjoy yourself and isn't going to give up treats like Doritos and ice cream. So when that person is buying junk food, he or she is an adult and can do whatever.
> 
> If a fat person loves being fat and wants to gain more weight because it feels sexy, that fat person going out and buying the ice cream and Doritos is destroying size acceptance.
> 
> If you, as an FA went and scouted out a restaurant to make sure it had tables rather than boooths, you'd be a great guy and all around praiseworthy FA. If you said "it turns me on knowing she's gotten so fat that I have to check out anyplace we go to make sure she fits" then you'd be an evil superficial creep.




Exactly! Some people aren't happy unless they get to be the "Thought Police". It's not enough that other people have to act a certain way, they have to think correctly as well. If only everyone thought exactly like Them, then the world would be perfect. They can't see the real problem, so They blame everyone else. To them, I say, "Sorry, but I'm not politically correct, and I never will be."

Fat discrimination is not about how fat people or their admirers act. It's not about whether we think correctly. It's about how the fat-haters (like Dr. Oz) act toward us, and how they treat us. We're hated for our very existence. This is WRONG, and it must change. Period. End of story.


----------



## LoveBHMS

I'm not even saying NAAFA should be pro-feederism, just that they should leave it alone. It's a sexual fetish, not a civil rights issue.

Besides, is this really that big of a problem? The number of people who are into it is really small and the number of people open about being into it is even smaller. I've never seen couples frolicking around supermarkets gleefully loading shopping carts with frozen lasagnas and donuts while openly saying how they can't wait to eat all this and gain weight. 

Most people who are fat aren't gainers.


----------



## FA Punk

LoveBHMS said:


> *Yes, see it's kind of like how paysite girls can be considered "too fat" and how weight gain is unhealthy if done in front of a camera.*
> 
> Let's say you have some regular fat person. He or she has decided life is too short to not enjoy yourself and isn't going to give up treats like Doritos and ice cream. So when that person is buying junk food, he or she is an adult and can do whatever.
> 
> If a fat person loves being fat and wants to gain more weight because it feels sexy, that fat person going out and buying the ice cream and Doritos is destroying size acceptance.
> 
> If you, as an FA went and scouted out a restaurant to make sure it had tables rather than boooths, you'd be a great guy and all around praiseworthy FA. If you said "it turns me on knowing she's gotten so fat that I have to check out anyplace we go to make sure she fits" then you'd be an evil superficial creep.



And when you have somebody like Susanne Eman who goes on national television and exploits this community for 15 minutes of fame thats a differnt story. Now this my insult you but we've heard enough from both the porn stars and the people who practice feederism, I'm sorry but I like to believe we've got more going on around here then what gets us off. Lets see a show that really talks about size acceptance rather then change subject matter to feederism every fucking time!


----------



## KHayes666

FA Punk said:


> And when you have somebody like Susanne Eman who goes on national television and exploits this community for 15 minutes of fame thats a differnt story. Now this my insult you but we've heard enough from both the porn stars and the people who practice feederism, I'm sorry but I like to believe we've got more going on around here then what gets us off. Lets see a show that really talks about size acceptance rather then change subject matter to feederism every fucking time!



lol I'll give you a reference you'll understand.

Susanne Eman is like Hulk Hogan and the rest of the community is Dean Malenko. Everyone wants to see Hogan because he's entertaining the same way every time Susannne farts its national news. Now you have someone normal that stays out of the spotlight like Malenko and nobody listens nor cares because they're not entertaining.

That's why you barely see Heather's NYU seminars or the Adipositivty Project mentioned in the news yet we see everyday life updates from Donna Simpson and Susanne Eman.


----------



## bigmac

KHayes666 said:


> So if your wife goes to the grocery store and buys nothing but junk food its ok but if a feedee were to do the same thing they need to be separated?
> 
> Is that what you're telling us?



Why would you think my wife would even buy *any* junk food? One of the nice things about California is that you can get great fresh fruit and vegetables at the farmers' markets all year round.


----------



## bigmac

LoveBHMS said:


> I'm not even saying NAAFA should be pro-feederism, just that they should leave it alone. It's a sexual fetish, not a civil rights issue.
> 
> *Besides, is this really that big of a problem?* The number of people who are into it is really small and the number of people open about being into it is even smaller. I've never seen couples frolicking around supermarkets gleefully loading shopping carts with frozen lasagnas and donuts while openly saying how they can't wait to eat all this and gain weight.
> 
> Most people who are fat aren't gainers.



Its a problem because it validates preconceptions. In the minds of the general public feederism confirms that being fat is a lifestyle choice -- that fat people could all be thin if they just chose to put the fork down -- that the ailments associated with obesity are self-inflicted.

So yes feederism does indeed hurt the majority of fat people who as you point out are not gainers.


----------



## LoveBHMS

So your version of size acceptance is predicated on the idea that nobody is responsible for his or her size and it's only a valid concept if people are fat due to circumstances beyond their control? That seems to be a pretty dangerous road to go down.

What about fat people who are in fact fat because they just love Taco Bell and loathe exercise. Compulsive overeaters? How about people who like being fat but aren't gaining for sexual pleasure like a woman who loves "having an ass" or a man who "just feels more masculine" when he's heavier.

As much as you say you don't distinguish between good and bad fatties, that is just what you're doing. Also if you set aside the aspect of sexual pleasure, isn't every fat person who buys a dozen donuts or takes the elevator rather than the stairs doing the exact same thing in promoting misconceptions about fatties all being lazy junk food eaters?


----------



## LillyBBBW

bigmac said:


> Its a problem because it validates preconceptions. In the minds of the general public feederism confirms that being fat is a lifestyle choice -- that fat people could all be thin if they just chose to put the fork down -- that the ailments associated with obesity are self-inflicted.
> 
> So yes feederism does indeed hurt the majority of fat people who as you point out are not gainers.



Compulsive overeating and other disordered eating is not a lifestyle choice. It is a disease that requires treatment and care. Size acceptance isn't about eating habits and lifestyle choices, it's about basic human rights. No one should have to earn these rights. They are equally endowed by our Creator and we should not have to justify receiving them by getting on the scale or opening the doors to our bedrooms and refrigerators.


----------



## LoveBHMS

bigmac said:


> Why would you think my wife would even buy *any* junk food? One of the nice things about California is that you can get great fresh fruit and vegetables at the farmers' markets all year round.



Some people rock at missing the point.

Editted to add: When an FA seems hyperconcerned with the whole "DNA/genetics/we don't know why people are fat" line of thinking, it can come off as more a combination of a need to alleviate FA guilt and a way to convince yourself that no woman anywhere will ever lose weight.


----------



## bigmac

LillyBBBW said:


> *Compulsive overeating and other disordered eating is not a lifestyle choice.* It is a disease that requires treatment and care. Size acceptance isn't about eating habits and lifestyle choices, it's about basic human rights. No one should have to earn these rights. They are equally endowed by our Creator and we should not have to justify receiving them by getting on the scale or opening the doors to our bedrooms and refrigerators.



Yes, I agree that in the vast majority of cases compulsive overeating//disordered eating is NOT a lifestyle choice. My point is that this fact is obscured by feederism.

Also, I've personally encountered feeders who take advantage of their partners pathological eating for their own sexual pleasure. Rather than helping their partner get the care and treatment they need they actively encourage the compulsive/disordered eating.

I oppose feederism for both these reasons.


----------



## bigmac

LoveBHMS said:


> Some people rock at missing the point.
> 
> Editted to add: When an FA seems hyperconcerned with the whole "DNA/genetics/we don't know why people are fat" line of thinking, it can come off as more a combination of a need to alleviate FA guilt and a way to convince yourself that no woman anywhere will ever lose weight.




If you don't believe that we as a society know very little about obesity you're the one missing the point.

Regardless of cause we do know that people can loose weight and keep it off if they commit to a lifetime of intense exercise (unfortunately most people cannot commit to a lifetime of Biggest Loser type exercise). WLS also works for many but not all people (but at significant risk).

My philosophy is that people should eat well (no dieting/good food/no extreme eating) and be as active as possible. That given I would like people and society to be happy with the resulting range of body sizes.

IMHO the FA's that should feel guilt are those that encourage their partners to engage in extreme eating. Its not sexy to undermine your partner's health.


----------



## KHayes666

bigmac said:


> If you don't believe that we as a society know very little about obesity you're the one missing the point.
> 
> Regardless of cause we do know that people can loose weight and keep it off if they commit to a lifetime of intense exercise (unfortunately most people cannot commit to a lifetime of Biggest Loser type exercise). WLS also works for many but not all people (but at significant risk).
> 
> My philosophy is that people should eat well (no dieting/good food/no extreme eating) and be as active as possible. That given I would like people and society to be happy with the resulting range of body sizes.
> 
> *IMHO* the FA's that should feel guilt are those that encourage their partners to engage in extreme eating. Its not sexy to undermine your partner's health.



Your opinion isn't humble at all. Joseph Stalin would be proud of you. What you're saying is do things a certain way or be kicked out and ignored.

What you're saying are feeders and feedees are eyesores because of their lifestyle choices and anyone who goes to the store and buys ice cream should be extradited because its not "eating well".

I'll remember that the next time you post somewhere your wife was eating cupcakes or you wish she was 500 pounds again or posting something that one of us evil feeders would say.


----------



## LoveBHMS

bigmac said:


> If you don't believe that we as a society know very little about obesity you're the one missing the point.
> 
> Regardless of cause we do know that people can loose weight and keep it off if they commit to a lifetime of intense exercise (unfortunately most people cannot commit to a lifetime of Biggest Loser type exercise). WLS also works for many but not all people (but at significant risk).
> 
> My philosophy is that people should eat well (no dieting/good food/no extreme eating) and be as active as possible. That given I would like people and society to be happy with the resulting range of body sizes.
> 
> IMHO the FA's that should feel guilt are those that encourage their partners to engage in extreme eating. Its not sexy to undermine your partner's health.



What about the feedees or gainers who choose to gain for sexual pleasure, rather than because they're being encouraged to do so? Are they undermining SA or just adults who are making a conscious choice to pursue pleasure? You seem to equate feederism with manipulative feeders who are just out to satisfy their bases desires, and you're leaving the feedees out of it.

The reason I don't think the Susanne Enman's of the world do the damage you claim is quite simple. Most of society assumes fat people want to be thin. The existence of Susanne or anyone else on daytime tv hardly reverses that belief.


----------



## bigmac

KHayes666 said:


> ...
> 
> I'll remember that the next time you post somewhere your wife was eating cupcakes or you wish she was 500 pounds again or posting something that one of us evil feeders would say.




My wife and daughters do indeed make and eat cupcakes. You might have missed the part where I said I'm against dieting too. A few cupcakes with homemade cream cheese frosting are not what I'm against (there're very good). What I"m against is guys trying to get their partners to eat entire sheet cakes in one sitting (one of the guys who was pursuing my wife before we were married wanted her to do this).

I have no desire for my wife to gain weight. She'd like to loose a bit more and I'll help her in any way I can.


----------



## bigmac

LoveBHMS said:


> ...
> 
> You seem to equate feederism with manipulative feeders who are just out to satisfy their bases desires, ...




That pretty much describes several people of my acquaintance.


----------



## Wild Zero

Second verse, same as the first!


Wild Zero said:


> The problem isn't with feedee/gainers but people who make the assumption that all fat people are immoral. To people like that you can shove HAES or Feederism down their throats all you want, it's not going to change their childish, bigoted views. Fat people, ewwwww.


----------



## KHayes666

bigmac said:


> My wife and daughters do indeed make and eat cupcakes. You might have missed the part where I said I'm against dieting too. A few cupcakes with homemade cream cheese frosting are not what I'm against (there're very good). What I"m against is guys trying to get their partners to eat entire sheet cakes in one sitting (one of the guys who was pursuing my wife before we were married wanted her to do this).
> 
> I have no desire for my wife to gain weight. She'd like to loose a bit more and I'll help her in any way I can.



Ahhhhh so that's it.

You're mad that ONE GUY wanted to feed your wife so you equate all of us as being the same. Now it makes sense.


----------



## bigmac

KHayes666 said:


> Ahhhhh so that's it.
> 
> You're mad that ONE GUY wanted to feed your wife so you equate all of us as being the same. Now it makes sense.



That's just one example. I've personally know several women who've had their lives made much more difficult by feeders. Indeed there are (or were given that several have died) women on this site who's position was made worse by feeders.

There's nothing wrong with enjoying good food -- i.e. being a foodee -- but encouraging a partner to eat extreme amounts of food so you can get off is just wrong. Its the extreme amount of food many feeders want their partners to eat that I have an issue with. Eating can be erotic (even for thin people). I have no problem with erotic eating -- which of course does not require participants to eat extreme quantities.

Its not erotic if you're desires destroy your partner's quality of life.


----------



## KHayes666

bigmac said:


> That's just one example. I've personally know several women who've had their lives made much more difficult by feeders. Indeed there are (or were given that several have died) women on this site who's position was made worse by feeders.
> 
> There's nothing wrong with enjoying good food -- i.e. being a foodee -- but encouraging a partner to eat extreme amounts of food so you can get off is just wrong. Its the extreme amount of food many feeders want their partners to eat that I have an issue with. Eating can be erotic (even for thin people). I have no problem with erotic eating -- which of course does not require participants to eat extreme quantities.
> 
> Its not erotic if you're desires destroy your partner's quality of life.



The morality aspect of it is debatable for another day, what the current smear you concocted is that NAAFA should turn their backs on anyone who doesn't live up to your standards.

Luckily you're not in charge and that won't happen


----------



## CastingPearls

'A little dog is really brave in front of his masters house.' - Haitian Proverb


----------



## Ample Pie

I know a shit ton of woman who've had their lives almost (and maybe more than almost) ruined by a man in general--and certainly not a feeder.

What the hell does that have to do with the men who didn't do it?


----------



## LillyBBBW

bigmac said:


> Yes, I agree that in the vast majority of cases compulsive overeating//disordered eating is NOT a lifestyle choice. My point is that this fact is obscured by feederism.
> 
> Also, I've personally encountered feeders who take advantage of their partners pathological eating for their own sexual pleasure. Rather than helping their partner get the care and treatment they need they actively encourage the compulsive/disordered eating.
> 
> I oppose feederism for both these reasons.



No, that fact is obscured by hopelessly bigoted people clinging to their hate and fear.


----------



## LoveBHMS

bigmac said:


> That's just one example. I've personally know several women who've had their lives made much more difficult by feeders. Indeed there are (or were given that several have died) women on this site who's position was made worse by feeders.
> 
> There's nothing wrong with enjoying good food -- i.e. being a foodee -- but encouraging a partner to eat extreme amounts of food so you can get off is just wrong. Its the extreme amount of food many feeders want their partners to eat that I have an issue with. Eating can be erotic (even for thin people). I have no problem with erotic eating -- which of course does not require participants to eat extreme quantities.
> 
> Its not erotic if you're desires destroy your partner's quality of life.



What about the fact that are women and men who want to eat a whole sheet cake and would do it with or without a feeder? Many of them seek out feeders that will encourage them.


----------



## bigmac

LoveBHMS said:


> What about the fact that are women and men who want to eat a whole sheet cake and would do it with or without a feeder? Many of them seek out feeders that will encourage them.



Encouraging someone with an eating disorder for your sexual gratification -- not good!


----------



## Wild Zero

bigmac said:


> Encouraging someone with an eating disorder for your sexual gratification -- not good!



That wasn't the question, Delimac.


----------



## LoveBHMS

I said nothing about eating disorders. My point is feederism involves feedees as well as feeders. There are both men and women who eat and gain weight for sexual pleasure. They often do so even without a partner. Some guy wanted your wife to eat a sheet cake and she wasn't interested, but there are women (and men) who want to be encouraged to eat one, maybe even be handfed one while being told how fat they are because that gets them off.

I'm also unsure where you draw the distinction between a "foodee" (acceptable) and feedee (unacceptable). Is "extreme" pretty much "one bite more than your wife is eating"? If you buy your wife cupcakes and frosting that's ok because you're only a foodee and she's not dieting? A lot of people would look at a man whose wife is fat and had WLS and think "that's pretty messed up if he's out buying her cupcakes". And you'd say that you don't believe in dieting and she's just enjoying good food. But if some other guy's wife gets off on being fat and he buys her cupcakes because they both want her to gain weight, he's exploiting somebody.


----------



## LillyBBBW

Ample Pie said:


> I know a shit ton of woman who've had their lives almost (and maybe more than almost) ruined by a man in general--and certainly not a feeder.
> 
> What the hell does that have to do with the men who didn't do it?



**subscribed to this newsletter**


----------



## CleverBomb

bigmac said:


> Its not erotic if you're desires destroy your partner's quality of life.



Except when that's what's erotic about it (for either participant, or both). And I don't doubt that there are people out there for whom it's the case. 

I do have questions about free and informed consent in such situations, but that's a separate issue. 

-Rusty


----------



## Ample Pie

Also, destroying health is NOT (that's right, NOT) a requirement in feedism.

Weight gain can happen within safe parameters.
Fat isn't the same as unhealthy.
And sometimes weight gain is more a fantasy element in feedism.

Also, fuck off for creating the need for someone, anyone, to say this YET AGAIN.


----------



## KHayes666

Ample Pie said:


> Also, destroying health is NOT (that's right, NOT) a requirement in feedism.
> 
> Weight gain can happen within safe parameters.
> Fat isn't the same as unhealthy.
> *And sometimes weight gain is more a fantasy element in feedism.*
> 
> Also, fuck off for creating the need for someone, anyone, to say this YET AGAIN.



That's what me and my fiancee do. We talk about it during our playtime but we never practice in real life. I know someone else who only talks about it in playtime with their partner but doesn't actually do it in real life.

But hey, I doubt Joseph Stalin over there cares or is even listening at this point. After all he completely ducked my serious question about other folks besides feeders/feedees that "need to go" in his mind.


----------



## LoveBHMS

CleverBomb said:


> Except when that's what's erotic about it (for either participant, or both). And I don't doubt that there are people out there for whom it's the case.
> 
> I do have questions about free and informed consent in such situations, but that's a separate issue.
> 
> -Rusty



Free and informed consent is a requirement in all sexual situations, hence the term "consenting adults." Harm or manipulation should never happen.

Something else that apparently has to be pointed out again is the fact that your body doesn't process food differently if it's ingested via feederism or "not dieting". All your body knows it's getting the fat and calories and nutrition value of a cream cheese frosting covered cupcake. It won't know if you ate it cause you don't believe in dieting, because your partner fed it to you in bed while calling you a fat piglet, or if you ate it in front of a camera while taking pictures for a paysite.


----------



## Ample Pie

LoveBHMS said:


> Free and informed consent is a requirement in all sexual situations, hence the term "consenting adults." Harm or manipulation should never happen.


True.

And when they do and when consent isn't given, then it moves out of the realm of sex into the realm of violence.

Calling it sex when harm is done using sex would be like calling it baseball when someone is beaten with a bat.


----------



## bigmac

LoveBHMS said:


> Free and informed consent is a requirement in all sexual situations, hence the term "consenting adults." Harm or manipulation should never happen.
> 
> ...



Yes! The problem is that you don't see that it is harmful and/or manipulative to encourage a partner to gain large amounts of weight (sometimes hundreds of pounds). Massive weight gain is harmful (as the growing list of supersize people who are no longer with us will attest). Furthermore, feeders of my acquaintance do indeed employ manipulative tactics.


----------



## LoveBHMS

bigmac said:


> Yes! The problem is that you don't see that it is harmful and/or manipulative to encourage a partner to gain large amounts of weight (sometimes hundreds of pounds). Massive weight gain is harmful (as the growing list of supersize people who are no longer with us will attest). Furthermore, feeders of my acquaintance do indeed employ manipulative tactics.



The problem is you're equating those tactics with feederism as a fetish. That's like equating rape with intercourse. If feeders of your acquaintance employ those tactics then you need a new social circle. They're not "feeders", they're sociopaths. I know plenty of feeders who wouldn't dream of using tactics and who for the most part seek out gratification with like minded partners.

Also you can't call it manipulative if the person wants to do it, as the single feedees and feedees with non-feeder partners will tell you. There are personal ads all over the internet with feedee/gainers looking for a partner to feed or encourage them.

Nobody is saying that gaining hundreds of pounds is ideal, healthwise. But the overwhelming majority of feedists aren't doing that. The ones who are will probably tell you straight out that they're aware of the risks but the benefits and pleasures make it worth the risks. The majority of feedists are working either working with actual weight gain in agreed upon boundaries or in fantasy/role play situations that don't result in any weight gain at all or in a very small amount.

If you're so concerned about health and weight, stop buying the cupcakes and start buying fruit salad for your wife.


----------



## KHayes666

bigmac said:


> Yes! The problem is that you don't see that it is harmful and/or manipulative to encourage a partner to gain large amounts of weight (sometimes hundreds of pounds). Massive weight gain is harmful (as the growing list of supersize people who are no longer with us will attest). Furthermore, feeders of my acquaintance do indeed employ manipulative tactics.



Earth to Stalin: You keep ducking my question.

If your mindset is fat people who are offensive to normal society need to go, does that include:

People that take pictures of food in public
Women and men that wear revealing clothing (bikini's and short shorts) in public
People that overload their plates at buffets in public
People buying groceries in public
People waddling in public

Because none of those ppl have anything to do with feederism yet normal people will stare at in horror because they don't understand. Are you saying that all of them need to go to? Need to thin out the audience right?


----------



## LoveBHMS

KHayes666 said:


> Earth to Stalin: You keep ducking my question.
> 
> If your mindset is fat people who are offensive to normal society need to go, does that include:
> 
> People that take pictures of food in public
> Women and men that wear revealing clothing (bikini's and short shorts) in public
> People that overload their plates at buffets in public
> People buying groceries in public
> People waddling in public
> 
> Because none of those ppl have anything to do with feederism yet normal people will stare at in horror because they don't understand. Are you saying that all of them need to go to? Need to thin out the audience right?




I'm guessing all that stuff is ok so long as you aren't filming it for a clips4sale video.

Also overloading your plate at a buffet is fine if you just don't believe in dieting. If you overload a plate because your boyfriend gets off on watching you eat, then you're a bad fattie.


----------



## Mathias

bigmac said:


> Yes! The problem is that you don't see that it is harmful and/or manipulative to encourage a partner to gain large amounts of weight (sometimes hundreds of pounds). Massive weight gain is harmful (as the growing list of supersize people who are no longer with us will attest). Furthermore, feeders of my acquaintance do indeed employ manipulative tactics.



It isn't always about someone manipulating someone else. There's plenty of people who gain weight on their own without another person's influence. A point that you keep conveniently ignoring.


----------



## imfree

Mathias said:


> It isn't always about someone manipulating someone else. *There's plenty of people who gain weight on their own *without another person's influence. A point that you keep conveniently ignoring.



Agree. I am such a person, and I'm sure there are others, who struggles with being at peace in a very heavy body, versus the dangers of gaining weight and/or being so heavy.


----------



## bigmac

Mathias said:


> It isn't always about someone manipulating someone else. There's plenty of people who gain weight on their own without another person's influence. A point that you keep conveniently ignoring.



Yes, one of the many reasons there's no reason to encourage anyone to gain. There are plenty of off-the-rack fatties out there.


----------



## bigmac

KHayes666 said:


> Earth to Stalin: You keep ducking my question.
> 
> If your mindset is fat people who are offensive to normal society need to go, does that include:
> 
> People that take pictures of food in public
> Women and men that wear revealing clothing (bikini's and short shorts) in public
> People that overload their plates at buffets in public
> People buying groceries in public
> People waddling in public
> 
> Because none of those ppl have anything to do with feederism yet normal people will stare at in horror because they don't understand. Are you saying that all of them need to go to? Need to thin out the audience right?



Uncle Joe was just misunderstood.

But seriously there's world of difference between fat people enjoying life and and feeding a partner to the point that joy is impossible. If you can't see the difference I can't help you.


----------



## LillyBBBW

LoveBHMS said:


> I'm guessing all that stuff is ok so long as you aren't filming it for a clips4sale video.
> 
> Also overloading your plate at a buffet is fine if you just don't believe in dieting. If you overload a plate because your boyfriend gets off on watching you eat, then you're a bad fattie.



No, you're not a bad fattie. You're a victim. See?


----------



## Mathias

bigmac said:


> Yes, one of the many reasons there's no reason to encourage anyone to gain. There are plenty of off-the-rack fatties out there.



There's a lot of judgmental people too.


----------



## bigmac

LoveBHMS said:


> ...
> 
> Also overloading your plate at a buffet is fine if you just don't believe in dieting. If you overload a plate because your boyfriend gets off on watching you eat, then you're a bad fattie.



Everyone overindulges now and then (skinny people too) its part of human nature. Indeed I just got back from a nice Mother's Day lunch. But there's a great big difference between normal eating (including the occasional excess) and the type of day in and day out extreme eating advocated by many feeders.

People engage in all sorts of self-destructive behaviors. Its a bad idea to smoke -- its a bad idea to drink too much -- its a bad idea to drop out of high school -- its a bad idea to do hard drugs -- and its a bad idea to eat yourself into oblivion. The fact people who engage in such behaviors are making personal choices does not make it right or moral for others to support or encourage these self-destructive behaviors.


----------



## Mathias

bigmac said:


> Everyone overindulges now and then (skinny people too) its part of human nature. Indeed I just got back from a nice Mother's Day lunch. But there's a great big difference between normal eating (including the occasional excess) and the type of day in and day out extreme eating advocated by many feeders.
> 
> People engage in all sorts of self-destructive behaviors. Its a bad idea to smoke -- its a bad idea to drink too much -- its a bad idea to drop out of high school -- its a bad idea to do hard drugs -- and its a bad idea to eat yourself into oblivion. The fact people who engage in such behaviors are making personal choices does not make it right or moral for others to support or encourage these self-destructive behaviors.



The fact that your on a _size acceptance_ site shouldn't give you the right to say how good or bad someone is because of what they choose to do with their lifestyle.


----------



## bigmac

Mathias said:


> The fact that your on a _size acceptance_ site shouldn't give you the right to say how good or bad someone is because of what they choose to do with their lifestyle.



What I'm against is people who encourage *others* to participate in self-destructive behavior.


----------



## Mathias

bigmac said:


> What I'm against is people who encourage *others* to participate in self-destructive behavior.



Then you're probably against the people who choose to do so on their own.


----------



## Ample Pie

body and sex police are worth no time.


----------



## KHayes666

bigmac said:


> Uncle Joe was just misunderstood.
> 
> But seriously there's world of difference between fat people enjoying life and and feeding a partner to the point that joy is impossible. If you can't see the difference I can't help you.



No, what you're saying was feeders and feedees give NAAFA a bad name because they offend normal society. So if we're talking offending normal society, that includes every group of people I mentioned including your wife who's guilty of it.

So yes, using your own logic, since your wife offends other people with her waddling or grocery shopping she needs to go. Hey, just going by your rules. Since you support her in this "self destructive" behavior such as grocery shopping, you got to go to. Yup, we all have to go and there will be no one left.


----------



## bigmac

KHayes666 said:


> No, what you're saying was feeders and feedees give NAAFA a bad name because they offend normal society. So if we're talking offending normal society, that includes every group of people I mentioned including your wife who's guilty of it.
> 
> So yes, using your own logic, since your wife offends other people with her waddling or grocery shopping she needs to go. Hey, just going by your rules. Since you support her in this "self destructive" behavior such as grocery shopping, you got to go to. Yup, we all have to go and there will be no one left.



The logic of this post escapes me.


----------



## FA Punk

Why keep throwing bigmac's wife into this!?


----------



## KHayes666

FA Punk said:


> Why keep throwing bigmac's wife into this!?



Because he wants to point the finger at feedees and feeders as being these evil creatures that piss off normal society and need to be eradicated. My point is his wife whether by intent or accident also pisses off normal society so his logic is very flawed. Nothing against her, just his logic.


----------



## LoveBHMS

KHayes666 said:


> Earth to Stalin: You keep ducking my question.
> 
> If your mindset is fat people who are offensive to normal society need to go, does that include:
> 
> People that take pictures of food in public
> Women and men that wear revealing clothing (bikini's and short shorts) in public
> People that overload their plates at buffets in public
> People buying groceries in public
> People waddling in public
> 
> Because none of those ppl have anything to do with feederism yet normal people will stare at in horror because they don't understand. Are you saying that all of them need to go to? Need to thin out the audience right?





FA Punk said:


> Why keep throwing bigmac's wife into this!?[/
> QUOTE]
> 
> Because he's passing judgement on others' sexuality while being married to an SSBBW and saying he "doesn't believe in dieting" and that her eating cupcakes is ok despite having had WLS. He talks about how feedists are all immoral and killing their partners (despite the fact that the two partners I've had as feedees weigh less than bigmac's wife) and suggests that feedees have eating disorders.


----------



## tonynyc

bigmac said:


> What I'm against is people who encourage *others* to participate in self-destructive behavior.



Bottom line on that it is all about "free will" and you may have "some" folks who choose to participate and be perfectly happy in their lives... What may not work for some - others are happy with that...


----------



## musicman

KHayes666 said:


> No, what you're saying was feeders and feedees give NAAFA a bad name because they offend normal society. So if we're talking offending normal society, that includes every group of people I mentioned including your wife who's guilty of it.
> 
> So yes, using your own logic, since your wife offends other people with her waddling or grocery shopping she needs to go. Hey, just going by your rules. Since you support her in this "self destructive" behavior such as grocery shopping, you got to go to. Yup, we all have to go and there will be no one left.




Yes, and it's even worse than that. Using his logic, you can justify all sorts of terrible behavior. He gives cover to anyone who wants to judge a group by the actions of a few. With that logic, bigots of every stripe can justify their actions by pointing out a few people in any group they choose to hate.

I believe that BigMac really wants to help fat people, but it's wrong to let people judge individuals by the actions of others, regardless of whether you're doing it to HELP people or to HURT them. I take responsibility for my own thoughts and actions, and I refuse to surrender my individuality to others. I won't let people judge me by the actions of complete strangers, and no one else should, either. Aren't we all here on these discussion boards because of the way society judges and stigmatizes fat people and their admirers as a GROUP?

As for the effects on size acceptance, I say this: If society won't respect fat people AS HUMAN BEINGS unless we all march in lock-step, and completely conform to their misguided expectations, then that's NOT acceptance. I don't know what it is, but it's NOT what I'm fighting for.


----------



## petunia805

LoveBHMS said:


> If you buy your wife cupcakes and frosting that's ok because you're only a foodee and she's not dieting? A lot of people would look at a man whose wife is fat and had WLS and think "that's pretty messed up if he's out buying her cupcakes". And you'd say that you don't believe in dieting and she's just enjoying good food.





LoveBHMS said:


> If you're so concerned about health and weight, stop buying the cupcakes and start buying fruit salad for your wife.





KHayes666 said:


> My point is his wife whether by intent or accident also pisses off normal society so his logic is very flawed. Nothing against her, just his logic.





LoveBHMS said:


> FA Punk said:
> 
> 
> 
> Why keep throwing bigmac's wife into this!?[/
> QUOTE]
> 
> Because he's passing judgement on others' sexuality while being married to an SSBBW and saying he "doesn't believe in dieting" and that her eating cupcakes is ok despite having had WLS. He talks about how feedists are all immoral and killing their partners (despite the fact that the two partners I've had as feedees weigh less than bigmac's wife) and suggests that feedees have eating disorders.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> First of all, Piss off. You two have spent the last couple of days bitching at Bigmac about how people have free will to do what they want and that should be respected and there are no bad fatties, and blah blah blah, and then you proceed to insult ME for no apparent good reason, by suggesting that I'M a bad fattie, because I had WLS and still have the balls to enjoy a cupcake from time to time. "FOR SHAME WOMAN!!" Not only that, but you imply that I wouldn't be eating them unless of course my lord and master Bigmac buys them for me instead of fruit salad. well, allow me to retort...
> I can buy my own fucking cupcakes, what with all that free will and all.
> 
> I did have WLS - not that its ANYYONE's business, but to clear things up, I INTENDED to have WLS about 12 years ago, and I INTENDED to lose weight so I could FINALLY start living, but the procedure was so botched, that all I ended up getting was a malapsorpitve condition that still causes me a great deal of grief. I tried dieting for a very long time, and HATED myself for my inability to loose "enough" weight. So several years ago, I decided to simply accept my body as it is, and enjoy the life I have. Sometimes, that means that I make cupcakes or cookies with my daughters and then GASP, I eat one! I don't believe in dieting either. Like Bigmac, I do believe in eating good food and striving to be as active as possible.
> 
> The fact that YOU take it upon yourselves to drag out my personal health issues without so much as a "by your leave" makes you assholes.
> 
> I fail to see why Bigmac is a hypocrite for being married to a SSBBW and not believing in dieting at the same time. Are these things mutually exclusive? and why does whether or not I choose to eat the occassional cupcake or not have any bearing on HIS opinions at all.
> 
> The reason that someone like me, with all that waddling and whatnot "pisses off normal society" is that the general populous thinks:  that ALL FAT PEOPLE ARE FAT BY CHOICE. That we all sit around stuffing our fat faces like out of control gluttons day in and day out. And why should they accept us since we're bringing this on ourselves? Why should accommodations be made by other people, by government, by businesses for us fat asses that are so out of control that we've rendered ourselves so disgustingly disfigured that we no longer Fit among normal people  When feederism makes the news, it feeds into this fucked up view.
Click to expand...


----------



## Marlayna

Too bad the feeders and the anorexics can't get together... it would be a win-win!

JMHO, but I think a loved one should not encourage an addict of any kind to over-indulge.


----------



## KHayes666

petunia805 said:


> snipped



You must have failed to see my last post where I said I WASN'T insulting you, just pointing out the flaw in his logic.

Second of all, whether you have gotten WLS or not or why you needed it isn't apart of my argument either. Its the fact your husband says NAAFA should turn their back on people who make fatties look bad which is pretty much everyone when you really think about it. 

It doesn't matter if a woman waddles into a buffet wearing a t-shirt 2 sizes too small that says "Wide load" and a pair of leggings so tight you can see the dimples on her butt....or a woman walking in dressed in a business suit, the fact is society will equate the two being equal no matter what. 

So rather than your husband stick his nose in the air, primp his hair in the mirror and say "Well, I never, such behavior is predominantly atrocious!" He should start accepting people for who and what they are because if we're not all in this together then ACCEPTANCE is never going to happen internally or ex. Trying to round people up for acting a certain why when they're going to be judged by the exact same crowd even if they don't act like that is absurd.


----------



## FA Punk

KHayes666 said:


> Because he wants to point the finger at feedees and feeders as being these evil creatures that piss off normal society and need to be eradicated. My point is his wife whether by intent or accident also pisses off normal society so his logic is very flawed. Nothing against her, just his logic.





LoveBHMS said:


> Because he's passing judgement on others' sexuality while being married to an SSBBW and saying he "doesn't believe in dieting" and that her eating cupcakes is ok despite having had WLS. He talks about how feedists are all immoral and killing their partners (despite the fact that the two partners I've had as feedees weigh less than bigmac's wife) and suggests that feedees have eating disorders.



I'm sorry but you both could have disputed his argument without throwing his wife under the bus, so it's ok for someone to gain massive amounts of weight but if someone gets WLS and wants to eat a cupcake now and then thats ''immoral'', isn't that right?

I my not agree with everything Bigmac has said but he has the right to say it and the fact that both you can't see how the media has used feederism to hurt our community just shows how blind both of you are.

Who's the real hypocrites here people?


----------



## petunia805

KHayes666 said:


> You must have failed to see my last post where I said I WASN'T insulting you, just pointing out the flaw in his logic.



That's like that douche bag acquaintance that everyone knows, that goes around saying shitty things and thinks it's OK because he follows every insult with "Just Kidding!"

Still doesn't make it OK.

And if you can't argue your point on the merits of your own opinion, without dragging other people's VERY PERSONAL experiences out, then your opinion might be flawed.


----------



## petunia805

KHayes666 said:


> You must have failed to see my last post where I said I WASN'T insulting you, just pointing out the flaw in his logic.



You must have failed to see the part of my post where I quoted your "nothing against her" statement. I read it. I just think it and the rest of your posts related to me are bullshit.


----------



## KHayes666

petunia805 said:


> You must have failed to see the part of my post where I quoted your "nothing against her" statement. I read it. I just think it and the rest of your posts related to me are bullshit.



Nice double post.

If your husband wasn't making douchebaggery statements regarding what NAAFA should and shouldn't do then we wouldn't have to point out the flaws in his own argument.

After all, if fatties are supposed to act a certain way according to him but you don't yet he says its ok, very hypocritical doncha think?


----------



## petunia805

KHayes666 said:


> Nice double post.
> 
> If your husband wasn't making douchebaggery statements regarding what NAAFA should and shouldn't do then we wouldn't have to point out the flaws in his own argument.
> 
> After all, if fatties are supposed to act a certain way according to him but you don't yet he says its ok, very hypocritical doncha think?



Yeah, there was going to be a third and a fourth too, but I felt it not worth the additional effort.

As to this current statement, I'm confused about the point you're trying to make here. 

How is my behavior the same as these "fatties" your talking about? Is it that you think that eating an occasional treat is the same as the purposeful stretching of my stomach to accommodate ever increasing amounts of food without regard to my health? 
IT'S NOT. 

Do you think that Bigmac thinks that would be just fine for me but not for others? 
HE DOESN'T 

What the fuck do you or LOVESBHMS know about my behavior anyway? 
Other that what you assume because I'm Fat (and isn't that what you're arguing against?) You don't know a damn thing.

The fact that he prefers his women on the fat side does not diminish the argument that feeder-ism sets Fat Acceptance back rather than propel it forward.


----------



## KHayes666

petunia805 said:


> Yeah, there was going to be a third and a fourth too, but I felt it not worth the additional effort.
> 
> As to this current statement, I'm confused about the point you're trying to make here.
> 
> How is my behavior the same as these "fatties" your talking about? Is it that you think that eating an occasional treat is the same as the purposeful stretching of my stomach to accommodate ever increasing amounts of food without regard to my health?
> IT'S NOT.
> 
> Do you think that Bigmac thinks that would be just fine for me but not for others?
> HE DOESN'T
> 
> What the fuck do you or LOVESBHMS know about my behavior anyway?
> Other that what you assume because I'm Fat (and isn't that what you're arguing against?) You don't know a damn thing.
> 
> The fact that he prefers his women on the fat side does not diminish the argument that feeder-ism sets Fat Acceptance back rather than propel it forward.



The point is according to him the behavior of feeders and feedees are eye sores in the eyes of normal society but fails to realize that ALL fatties are eye sores in the eyes of normal society regardless of sexual fetish, race, gender, etc. It doesn't matter if you eat 1 cupcake or 12 the fact is you're going to be judged the same way. Its bad enough that its like this but what makes it worse are people like your husband who want to judge people the exact same way. If normal society shuns feeders and if BigMac got his way the community too should shun feeders, they'd have no place left to go. That's not acceptance, that's bigotry. Its no different than BigMac owning a restaurant in the 1950's and not allowing blacks to eat there in fear it would drive away his white customers. BigMac doesn't want him or his wife to be judged so he doesn't want feeders and feedees around to give society the wrong impression. Its bigotry, pure and simple.

Obviously he thinks your behavior is acceptable because your behavior IS acceptable....according to us. According to normal society it isn't. You're right, I personally don't know a god damn thing about you other than what BigMac says and what he's said is that you eat cupcakes and its ok because you're not intentionally trying to gain weight, meanwhile society doesn't give a damn if you're intentionally gaining or not...they're going to judge everyone the same. So rather than judge your own kind, accept and fight together. That's what this is about...ACCEPTANCE. If we can't accept ourselves how will anyone else be able to do it?

No, feederism doesn't set back size acceptance. What sets size acceptance back is selfish, self-centered bigotry which is what BigMac displayed in this thread. If he (and you too I assume) doesn't accept his own kind then the outside world won't either.

Ever read "First They Came"? If BigMac had his way anyone with a fetish would be in a concentration camp or whatever and there won't be anyone left to defend you two when normal society passes on judgement to you.


----------



## Ample Pie

petunia805 said:


> feeder-ism sets Fat Acceptance back rather than propel it forward.



Feedism.

And yeah, because choosing what size you want to be fucks with SA and choosing how much fat you have fucks with FA.

Except, of course, it doesn't.

What does is nosy judgmental people.


----------



## Marlayna

All I know is, if I had a dog and fed him with high-calorie goodies till he couldn't hold his weight up on his legs, I'd be guilty of animal abuse. Just sayin'.


----------



## KHayes666

Marlayna said:


> All I know is, if I had a dog and fed him with high-calorie goodies till he couldn't hold his weight up on his legs, I'd be guilty of animal abuse. Just sayin'.



Nobody is doing that. One of my feedees weighed 219 pounds by the time we were done. Not 750 or whatever the judgemental people think we're doing.

Loves said earlier her 2 feedees weighed as much combined as Petunia did by herself.

Who's the REAL demon here?


----------



## Ample Pie

Marlayna said:


> All I know is, if I had a dog and fed him with high-calorie goodies till he couldn't hold his weight up on his legs, I'd be guilty of animal abuse. Just sayin'.



Thank you for comparing me to a dog. Thank you for implying that I have no more ability to choose for myself than a dog. Thank you for implying that I am an animal.

Just because I like being more fat.

You people make me want to give up on people.

ETA: I take this sort of back. After reading what does it for you in the fetish thread (ie someone to pay for things for you and pamper you), I can see that being treated like a pet/dog/animal is kind of a compliment to you. Still.


----------



## Marlayna

Ample Pie said:


> Thank you for comparing me to a dog. Thank you for implying that I have no more ability to choose for myself than a dog. Thank you for implying that I am an animal.
> 
> Just because I like being more fat.
> 
> You people make me want to give up on people.


I wasn't posting to, or about you, even though my post was right under yours. :doh:
I'm sorry. The fact of the matter is, I totally AGREE with you, that it's YOUR business to eat as much as you want, whenever you want, and whatever you want.
We have the freedom to be whatever size we please, and too bad if someone doesn't like it. 
BTW, I prefer dogs and cats to people, so it would never be an insult coming from me.


----------



## Marlayna

KHayes666 said:


> Nobody is doing that. One of my feedees weighed 219 pounds by the time we were done. Not 750 or whatever the judgemental people think we're doing.
> 
> Loves said earlier her 2 feedees weighed as much combined as Petunia did by herself.
> 
> Who's the REAL demon here?


Well, 219 isn't that bad. I imagined that feeders don't stop until a much higher number. I'm happy I was wrong.


----------



## Marlayna

Ample Pie said:


> ETA: I take this sort of back. After reading what does it for you in the fetish thread (ie someone to pay for things for you and pamper you), I can see that being treated like a pet/dog/animal is kind of a compliment to you. Still.


LOL! Yes! I prefer shopping trips to getting tied up and flogged. Different strokes, for different folks.
Fact of the matter is, I'm a natural giver, and I love to spoil my loved ones.


----------



## petunia805

KHayes666 said:


> Nobody is doing that. One of my feedees weighed 219 pounds by the time we were done. Not 750 or whatever the judgemental people think we're doing.
> 
> Loves said earlier her 2 feedees weighed as much combined as Petunia did by herself.
> 
> Who's the REAL demon here?



That's not what she said. What she did say was rather lame anyway because she has really no way of knowing WHAT I weigh all by myself.


----------



## KHayes666

petunia805 said:


> That's not what she said. What she did say was rather lame anyway because she has really no way of knowing WHAT I weigh all by myself.



That's the thing, you're right in the sense that neither of us would know anything about you.....until your husband starts talking. The only reason she knows you eat cupcakes and weigh what you did is because he said it himself.

Don't blame her or I for putting out facts that's already been put out in the open.


----------



## bigmac

Marlayna said:


> Well, 219 isn't that bad. I imagined that feeders don't stop until a much higher number. I'm happy I was wrong.




*You're not wrong!!! * The archives of this board contain many sad stories of women who were in feeder/feedee relationships that ended badly. Most of these ladies were quite large to start with -- met feeders who encouraged them to get even larger -- but when the feedee became too much of a burden or their health declined many of these feeders headed for the proverbial hills leaving only friends and family to help clean up the mess.

Several of the aforementioned feedees are now dead -- their feeders moved on to new targets.


----------



## bigmac

KHayes666 said:


> Nobody is doing that. One of my feedees weighed 219 pounds by the time we were done. Not 750 or whatever the judgemental people think we're doing.
> 
> Loves said earlier her 2 feedees weighed as much combined as Petunia did by herself.
> 
> Who's the REAL demon here?




That's nice for you and Loves. It doesn't change the fact that many feeders encourage partners that are already supersize to get bigger -- often with severe consequences to the feedee's health (up to and including death).

As I've said several times I support my wife in her attempts to loose a bit of weight -- which she has. If you can't see the difference you're blind.

Also, people reading this, ask yourself this. If you had a mother, sister, or daughter who was already large, would you want them dating someone who's express goal was to make them even fatter?


----------



## KHayes666

bigmac said:


> *You're not wrong!!! * The archives of this board contain many sad stories of women who were in feeder/feedee relationships that ended badly. Most of these ladies were quite large to start with -- met feeders who encouraged them to get even larger -- but when the feedee became too much of a burden or their health declined many of these feeders headed for the proverbial hills leaving only friends and family to help clean up the mess.
> 
> *Several of the aforementioned feedees are now dead -- their feeders moved on to new targets*.



Proof please. Kthxbye


----------



## Surlysomething

There is no point in debating with these people. They think they're the royalty of the SA movement.




Boooring.


----------



## KHayes666

Surlysomething said:


> There is no point in debating with these people. They think they're the royalty of the SA movement.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Boooring.



They can take a royal flush down the toilet. Arguing feeder/feedee morality is up for debate but saying all feeders commit murder and all feeders and feedees should be eradicated is unwanted bigotry.

You gotta love how they never addressed the bigotry either.


----------



## Surlysomething

KHayes666 said:


> They can take a royal flush down the toilet. Arguing feeder/feedee morality is up for debate but saying all feeders commit murder and all feeders and feedees should be eradicated is unwanted bigotry.
> 
> You gotta love how they never addressed the bigotry either.




Boring. You're not the end all be all of fat issues. Hell, you're not even *gasp* obese.


----------



## KHayes666

Surlysomething said:


> Boring. You're not the end all be all of fat issues. Hell, you're not even *gasp* obese.



I find your passive aggressiveness disturbing.

Speaking of boring, instead of going around rolling your eyes at everything why don't you actually contribute to a topic instead of fly by like a mosquito.


----------



## Ample Pie

KHayes666 said:


> I find your passive aggressiveness disturbing.
> 
> Speaking of boring, instead of going around rolling your eyes at everything why don't you actually contribute to a topic instead of fly by like a mosquito.


True on just about every one of hir posts!

And, while I tend to disagree with KHayes666 on just about everything, he's right in this case and he IS/HAS BEEN a feeder so he knows the kind of smack they take. Therefore, he's got a right to speak about this.

Obesity isn't the fucking problem anyway; it's personal choice. Bigmac isn't bitching that people are fat, he's just pissed that they might enjoy choosing to get FATTER. It's the same shit all the time. Something's okay if it gives the Cisguy a boner, but if it doesn't, it's SCARY!


----------



## Wild Zero

Marlayna said:


> Well, 219 isn't that bad. I imagined that feeders don't stop until a much higher number. I'm happy I was wrong.



Wait, did I really just see that?



Marlayna said:


> *Well, 219 isn't that bad*. I imagined that feeders don't stop until a much higher number. I'm happy I was wrong.



I did. That's fucked up, you're on Dimensions making statements about how fat is too fat. Weights higher than 219 lbs, bad. Fat people, ewwwwwww.

Please see yourself out.


----------



## Marlayna

Wild Zero said:


> Wait, did I really just see that?
> 
> 
> 
> I did. That's fucked up, you're on Dimensions making statements about how fat is too fat. Weights higher than 219 lbs, bad. Fat people, ewwwwwww.
> 
> Please see yourself out.


Look, it's obvious I'm talking about from a health standpoint, not aesthetics. We're all beautiful.
If someone is already struggling with walking, killing them with "kindness" by feeding them yummy junk food, versus non-tasty healthful food, is sad imo.

Sorry to burst your bubble, but Fat People don't make me go "ewwwwww".

I know what too much excess weight does to a person's quality of life.


----------



## Wild Zero

Marlayna said:


> Look, it's obvious I'm talking about from a health standpoint, not aesthetics. We're all beautiful.
> If someone is already struggling with walking, killing them with "kindness" by feeding them yummy junk food, versus non-tasty healthful food, is sad imo.
> 
> Sorry to burst your bubble, but Fat People don't make me go "ewwwwww".
> 
> I know what too much excess weight does to a person's quality of life.



So you're concern trolling everyone who weighs more than 219lbs. Doesn't make it any better.


----------



## Surlysomething

KHayes666 said:


> I find your passive aggressiveness disturbing.
> 
> Speaking of boring, instead of going around rolling your eyes at everything why don't you actually contribute to a topic instead of fly by like a mosquito.




Disturbing, how? I like to remind people that arguing with the likes of you is pointless.

You aren't fat. You don't walk in a fat person's shoes and just because you worship the ground fat web "models" walk on doesn't mean you're the best advocate for what's right and what's wrong in the SA movement.


----------



## Marlayna

Wild Zero said:


> So you're concern trolling everyone who weighs more than 219lbs. Doesn't make it any better.


If you're looking for some kind of argument from me, you're not going to get it, because you're trying to twist my words, and I don't play that game.
I don't "troll" anyone, I just think feeders that endanger their loved ones are selfish, and not too bright. JMHO.


----------



## Wild Zero

> Well, 219 isn't that bad.



No twisting necessary, anyone who weighs more than that and doesn't conform to your ideas of acceptable fatness or sexuality is obviously worth your contempt.

But by all means keep encouraging models fatter than that on the paysite board.


----------



## Marlayna

Wild Zero said:


> No twisting necessary, anyone who weighs more than that and doesn't conform to your ideas of acceptable fatness or sexuality is obviously worth your contempt.
> 
> But by all means keep encouraging models fatter than that on the paysite board.


I compliment the women I think are cute or sexy, I *NEVER* encourage them to gain weight. 
I don't have any contempt for big people, only sympathy for those who are too heavy to enjoy daily living.
I do have contempt for idiots though.


----------



## bigmac

KHayes666 said:


> Proof please. Kthxbye




The posts are all right here on this site -- I'm sure you could find them if you wanted to.


----------



## BBWHearts

bigmac said:


> What I'm against is people who encourage *others* to participate in self-destructive behavior.



You should give up. You are standing in the temple of feeeeeederism, profaning its holiest sacrament. These people have invested a lot in this religion--all their future orgasms depend on it!

Eventually, if you don't keep your gob shut, you will simply be modded out of existence.

A losing battle, my friend!

:eat1::eat1::eat1::eat1::eat1::eat1::eat1::eat1::eat1:


----------



## bigmac

BBWHearts said:


> You should give up. You are standing in the temple of feeeeeederism, profaning its holiest sacrament. These people have invested a lot in this religion--all their future orgasms depend on it!
> 
> Eventually, if you don't keep your gob shut, you will simply be modded out of existence.
> 
> A losing battle, my friend!
> 
> :eat1::eat1::eat1::eat1::eat1::eat1::eat1::eat1::eat1:




Well put -- and good advice -- I'm out of this thread.


----------



## Angel

Kevin, I sincerely hope that no one ever makes comments about your fiance in the same manner in which you and loves have made comments about petunia. 

Debate or arguement aside, the behavior you both expressesd is the same exact behavior and mentality exhibited by those who think of fat people as not being deserving of common courtesy or respect. If you believed in fat acceptance or size acceptance at all you wouldn't have tried to make an example of a member of this community in the way you did just to get your point across. 

Evidently there are boundries and ethics with regards to human relationships that you don't understand. Bigmac and petunia are married. If they want to disclose information about each other that is their choice and if wise anything disclosed should be mutually agreed upon before hand. Like most married couples I'm sure they have an understanding of what is acceptable to share and what isn't, and that any personal information or facts shared would be done in a respectful manner. 

You and loves, on the other hand, are not in a relationship with petunia, much less even know her. Referencing her in a disrespectful manner and grasping at bits and pieces of personal information (whether accurate or embellished) and using them with negative connotations as a means to dispell bigmac's opinions does nothing to help you prove your point. The only thing it does is hurt an innocent person and, well, make you look rude and uncaring to put it nicely.

Go back and read your posts and pretend it was bigmac posting the same things about the person you are in love with. How would you feel then? How do you think your fiance would feel?


----------



## LoveBHMS

The only reason anyone knows a single thing about Petunia is because Bigmac has been all over this board using her as an example of a "good fattie" when he criticizes paysite girls, feedists, and those he considers to be "too big". You can't cry unfair when others use an example he's put out there. 

What many of you refuse to understand is feederism isn't a behaviour, it's a sexuality. Criticizing somebody's sexuality is not an ok thing to do. It's furthermore not ok to take any behaviour you've seen exhibited by somebody with that sexuality and attribute it to everyone. If a man tells you he's gay, you don't say "Well it's wrong and very dangerous to placed ads on Craigslist looking for bareback sex". If you criticize what people masturbate to or what they use with a consenting adult partner to get off, you are being innappropriate.

Furthermore, feederism has the same overall relationship to size acceptance as BDSM has to wife beating. You can't tell sex shops to not sell handcuffs and whips or dominatrices to stay off talk shows because their presence will make some guy think it's ok to beat his wife.


----------



## Ample Pie

Marlayna said:


> If you're looking for some kind of argument from me, you're not going to get it, because you're trying to twist my words, and I don't play that game.
> I don't "troll" anyone, I just think feeders that endanger their loved ones are selfish, and not too bright. JMHO.



So does every shit head who drives too fast.

But feeders aren't always in control. The feedee (and I know this will be shocking) is sometimes (and really quite frequently) the one who calls the shots. Again, I know it's shocking but feedees are humans and have the ability to make choices about their health, sexuality, practices, etc. We can say stop. We can say "let's do this only in fantasy." Or we can say "make me too huge to walk." And we can stop it.

If we can't stop it, it isn't because our partner is a feeder. It's because our partner is abusive. They aren't the same thing. They just aren't. And abusive people come in all sexual flavors.

Oy, why do I feel I'm constantly repeating myself? Oh, that's because I am.


----------



## KHayes666

Surlysomething said:


> Disturbing, how? I like to remind people that arguing with the likes of you is pointless.
> 
> You aren't fat. You don't walk in a fat person's shoes and just because you worship the ground fat web "models" walk on doesn't mean you're the best advocate for what's right and what's wrong in the SA movement.



Shows how much you know about me. Anyone that knows me knows I do NOT worship the ground web models walk on. In fact, I'm one of the few who talk back to them. I don't give a damn who they are, if they do something out of line I'll be the first to step up and call bullshit.



Angel said:


> Kevin, I sincerely hope that no one ever makes comments about your fiance in the same manner in which you and loves have made comments about petunia.
> 
> snipped



All Loves and I said were FACTS, yes, FACTS that BigMac himself has made public in other posts of his. The difference is I don't try to run people off the road and then give my fiancee a pass even if she's exhibiting the same behavior as what I'm preaching against. That's like me saying all drunk drivers should be exterminated but letting my fiancee drive home after 3 glasses of wine.

I do admit that Petunia was used as a harsh example and in some ways I'm legitimately sorry it came to this but Bigmac's previous posts about her needed to be pointed out in order to show the flaws in his logic.


----------



## Wild Zero

If you're over 219 lbs, please leave the thread. You're too fat to be of any use or have the ability to pursue your own sexuality.


----------



## petunia805

Wild Zero said:


> If you're over 219 lbs, please leave the thread. You're too fat to be of any use or have the ability to pursue your own sexuality.



Or if you've ever fattened anyone up to over 219 pounds or if your two previous feedees weighed in at more than 346lbs, please leave, because you're one of those BAD (possibly mythical) feeders that gives good responsible feeders a bad name.


----------



## Wild Zero

petunia805 said:


> Or if you've ever fattened anyone up to over 219 pounds or if your two previous feedees weighed in at more than 346lbs, please leave, because you're one of those BAD (possibly mythical) feeders that gives good responsible feeders a bad name.



ok to recap: if someone intentionally gains past 219lbs, they're BAD. And if someone for whom feedism is a kink starts dating a fat person said fatty must weigh less than 346lbs or the fat person and their SO are both BAD.


----------



## Wild Zero

Alternatively, don't start posting about what NAAFA or other SA groups should do while setting acceptable weight limits for which fat people are acceptable.


----------



## imfree

Feeders are great. We couldn't have lights, A/C, and music without a few good feeders in our town!


Trainwreck anyone? 

View attachment feeder_bays_3phase_distri wb md.jpg


View attachment Thread train wreck.jpg


----------



## Marlayna

Ample Pie said:


> So does every shit head who drives too fast.
> 
> But feeders aren't always in control. The feedee (and I know this will be shocking) is sometimes (and really quite frequently) the one who calls the shots. Again, I know it's shocking but feedees are humans and have the ability to make choices about their health, sexuality, practices, etc. We can say stop. We can say "let's do this only in fantasy." Or we can say "make me too huge to walk." And we can stop it.
> 
> If we can't stop it, it isn't because our partner is a feeder. It's because our partner is abusive. They aren't the same thing. They just aren't. And abusive people come in all sexual flavors.
> 
> Oy, why do I feel I'm constantly repeating myself? Oh, that's because I am.


Ample Pie, you're obviously an expert on this whole thing, where I am not, so I respect your views.

There was a time, a long time ago, that I believed that my constant gaining and loneliness could be solved by finding a man who would: feed me- fuck me- feed me- fuck me, and it sounded like a perfect solution.

I can understand why people can get turned on by the whole scene, even though it's not my thing.


----------



## petunia805

Wild Zero said:


> Alternatively, don't start posting about what NAAFA or other SA groups should do while setting acceptable weight limits for which fat people are acceptable.



I didn't set the acceptable limit. Loves and KHayes both made statements that their partners only got up to x and y. And KHayes stated something to the effect that no one even does the extreme fattening we're talking about. 'cept they do, because They're the ones on the telly every time Size or fat people are the subject at hand! That's a problem. As much as YOU and yours don't want Bigmac being the voice of size acceptance I take issue with Feeders and Feederism being trotted out to represent me and mine all the damn time. 

I have EVERY RIGHT to say what I think the SA community ought to do or not do, because I'm a part of it. So do you. And we should be able to engage in civil discourse over our differences of opinion. What you don't have a right to do is tell me what I can and cannot think, nor do you have a right to be mean, to mount a personal and unprovoked attack, and then to hide behind "no offense" or "he started it."


----------



## Saoirse

KHayes666 said:


> Anyone that knows me knows I do NOT worship the ground web models walk on.



Thats right! He has a deep, personal connection to ALL the models and they are all his best friends! DUH!


----------



## Saoirse

> I do admit that Petunia was used as a harsh example and in some ways I'm legitimately sorry it came to this but Bigmac's previous posts about her needed to be pointed out in order to show the flaws in his logic.



How can you be legit sorry for only a little bit?


----------



## LoveBHMS

petunia805 said:


> I didn't set the acceptable limit. Loves and KHayes both made statements that their partners only got up to x and y. And KHayes stated something to the effect that no one even does the extreme fattening we're talking about. 'cept they do, because They're the ones on the telly every time Size or fat people are the subject at hand! That's a problem. As much as YOU and yours don't want Bigmac being the voice of size acceptance I take issue with Feeders and Feederism being trotted out to represent me and mine all the damn time.
> 
> I have EVERY RIGHT to say what I think the SA community ought to do or not do, because I'm a part of it. So do you. And we should be able to engage in civil discourse over our differences of opinion. What you don't have a right to do is tell me what I can and cannot think, nor do you have a right to be mean, to mount a personal and unprovoked attack, and then to hide behind "no offense" or "he started it."



The only reason I made a reference to the size of my partners was to point out that feederism and its practice may have little or nothing to do with health or massive weight increases. And to point out that it's pretty common for people who talk shit on feeders to have bigger partners than I have.

Feeders aren't trotted out to represent you. Extreme stuff is put on tv for ratings and because nobody turns on the tv to see a 200 pound person or to see somebody say "my partner isn't gaining weight but we talk about it during sex". It's no different from a talk show featuring women with huge 50HHH breast implants. Viewers tune in to see extremes; they won't watch a show about a woman who gets implants to be a C cup because that's mundane.


----------



## Surlysomething

Saoirse said:


> Thats right! He has a deep, personal connection to ALL the models and they are all his best friends! DUH!



Totally! I'm sure his fiance is BFF's with them too.


----------



## KHayes666

Surlysomething said:


> Totally! I'm sure his fiance is BFF's with them too.



My fiancee lives across the street from one of them.

She also is good friends with another and we've had dinner with more.

Once again showing how much you know about me. Oh and let me take a page from your book =


----------



## Lovelyone

BBWHearts said:


> You should give up. You are standing in the temple of feeeeeederism, profaning its holiest sacrament. These people have invested a lot in this religion--all their future orgasms depend on it!
> 
> Eventually, if you don't keep your gob shut, you will simply be modded out of existence.
> 
> A losing battle, my friend!
> 
> :eat1::eat1::eat1::eat1::eat1::eat1::eat1::eat1::eat1:



Just so that you know...not EVERYONE on this site is into feederism. That's a mighty big brush you are painting with.


----------



## Marlayna

KHayes666 said:


> My fiancee lives across the street from one of them.
> 
> She also is good friends with another and we've had dinner with more.
> 
> Once again showing how much you know about me. Oh and let me take a page from your book =


You're so lucky! I would love to hang out with some of the models. People who have unusual occupations really interest me. I think fat women posing is artistic and fascinating.:smitten:


----------



## Marlayna

Lovelyone said:


> Just so that you know...not EVERYONE on this site is into feederism. That's a mighty big brush you are painting with.


I don't know if we have a Poll option here, but it would be interesting to find out what the stats are on it.


----------



## Surlysomething

KHayes666 said:


> My fiancee lives across the street from one of them.
> 
> She also is good friends with another and we've had dinner with more.
> 
> Once again showing how much you know about me. Oh and let me take a page from your book =




Haha. Ok, Kevin. I forgot for a second that you're the King of FA's and every fat web "models" best friend.

You've got their backs. Yadda yadda.


----------



## LoveBHMS

Marlayna said:


> I don't know if we have a Poll option here, but it would be interesting to find out what the stats are on it.



There are already dozens of "feeders/feedees show yourselves" threads all over the Weight Board.

Also the question posed to Kevin was if his fiancee knew he was friends with paysite girls and if she was also friends with them. He was merely answering a question. He's never held himself up as any sort of deity or best friend to all web models.


----------



## Surlysomething

LoveBHMS said:


> He's never held himself up as any sort of deity or best friend to all web models.



You're kidding, right?

He never lets up on the talk, L-BHMS. Even you have to know that.


----------



## Marlayna

LoveBHMS said:


> There are already dozens of "feeders/feedees show yourselves" threads all over the Weight Board.
> 
> Also the question posed to Kevin was if his fiancee knew he was friends with paysite girls and if she was also friends with them. He was merely answering a question. He's never held himself up as any sort of deity or best friend to all web models.


Oh, I never explored the Weight Board, but now I know, thanks. I always thought it was a small minority of posters who labelled themselves as such, so I was curious, percentage wise.

Anyway, as far as Kevin goes, his girl is a cutie pie and I'm glad he's proud of her.


----------



## Ample Pie

Anyone who doesn't want to be labeled a sexist pig, shouldn't act like one.


----------



## petunia805

Ample Pie said:


> Anyone who doesn't want to be labeled a sexist pig, shouldn't act like one.



You seem like a very angry person. That's so sad, but I wonder, is it only this thread or a general disposition? You say that you "have a low tolerance for stupid" but other than referring to Bigmac as "PIGMAC" (Very clever - Kudos) or calling him a Sexist Pig, or making sarcastic comments from the sidelines, you've added very little in the way of intelligent debate to this thread.


----------



## LoveBHMS

I don't know Rebecca at all and so don't know if she's angry or what her disposition is.

But when people talk mess about your sexuality and say you and people like you don't belong in SA and constantly mischaracterize the most personal and private aspects of who you are, it might become annoying. If you or your husband were slamming gays or transgendered people you'd be attacked for it. So let me once more make it clear that it's not at all ok to insult people's sexuality. It is personal and it's part of us and totally beyond our control.


----------



## petunia805

LoveBHMS said:


> I don't know Rebecca at all and so don't know if she's angry or what her disposition is.
> 
> But when people talk mess about your sexuality and say you and people like you don't belong in SA and constantly mischaracterize the most personal and private aspects of who you are, it might become annoying. If you or your husband were slamming gays or transgendered people you'd be attacked for it. So let me once more make it clear that it's not at all ok to insult people's sexuality. It is personal and it's part of us and totally beyond our control.



I don't know her either, that's why I asked her.

Are you saying that feederism is your sexual orientation just like being homosexual is someone else's? Is it your position that it's the same thing? Please be clear this time, because I was under the impression that it was a Fetish, not an orientation.

I have NEVER said that people of one group or another do or don't belong. What I DID say is that when EXTREME feederism get's dragged in front of the world, on THAT is what the world will base what they think of all of us. The fact that people only tune in to see the most extreme cases is undesputed, but I don't see what is WRONG with pointing out that this level of extremism isn't representative of the SA movement as a whole? 

What you all want to do in your bedroom with a consenting adult who is mentally and physically capable of said consent, is on you. That said, I DO know of feeders who are not shy about making manipulative demands that their partner continue to gain beyond the point at which the feedee ceased to enjoy herself, and I DO know of Feedees to afraid to be abandoned, or unloved to say no. It does happen. Maybe you don't do that and maybe 99% of others who share your sexual inclinations don't do that, BUT YOU'RE NOT THE ONE on TV and as much as you want to say that those people aren't representing me and this community, They ARE. 

If I was debating whether or not Gay men ought to have unprotected sex because it feels good, I would point out the inherent health risks involved in doing that, and I'm pretty sure I wouldn't be labeled a Gay Hater because of that. 

I wasn't (in this or any other thread) slamming anyone. Your attack on me was entirely unprovoked. You want call Bigmac on his shit when you disagree, you have at it. He can handle it. But to attack someone who wasn't even part of the argument just to make your point is bad form. No, worse than that, it's just plain shitty behavior.


----------



## Jooplef

I just read this whole thread because I'm an insomniac.

Found an irony.

First, the thread started with some people suggesting that the people who went on TV like lambs to the slaughter were clearly idiots.

The thread continued for many pages. Two of the ladies that went on the OzBlows show posted briefly, but their posts were more intelligent and far more even-keeled than most, especially Reenaye's.

Just an outsider's observation, but you guys might want to look into that...


----------



## LoveBHMS

If you really need to split hairs, and apparently you do, most would consider it a fetish. If you need a better analogy, I guess I can suggest that it makes the news when a shoe fetishist breaks into somebody's house and steals their shoes but the vast majority of shoe fetishists are probably not felons and probably just masturbate to websites or ask their wives to walk around in stilettos.

Your continued insistence that you "know feeders who are manipulative" is just bigotry. Full stop. If I insist that the Jews I personally know are cheap and that I personally know numerous blacks on welfare, I am still being a bigot. If you know people who use dishonesty or manipulation to get off, then you know assholes. It has nothing to do with feederism. Neither does somebody's willingness to do stupid or harmful things to keep a man. That's universal.

There are also millions of women who get breast implants. The ones on tv are the ones with 88HHH cups. Because it sells. I honestly don't care who goes on tv because it's not relevent to me or my private behaviour.

And lastly nobody has attacked you. Bigmac has held you up as an example of a "doing it right/good fattie" and that's between the two of you.


----------



## FA Punk

KHayes666 said:


> My fiancee lives across the street from one of them.
> 
> She also is good friends with another and we've had dinner with more.
> 
> Once again showing how much you know about me. Oh and let me take a page from your book =



That really didn't help you pal, you still come off as a total jackass, and I feel legitimately sorry for you because of that:doh:.


----------



## petunia805

LoveBHMS said:


> If you really need to split hairs, and apparently you do, most would consider it a fetish. If you need a better analogy, I guess I can suggest that it makes the news when a shoe fetishist breaks into somebody's house and steals their shoes but the vast majority of shoe fetishists are probably not felons and probably just masturbate to websites or ask their wives to walk around in stilettos.



If it's a fetish, then please stop comparing yourselves to Gays and Transgender people or Jews and Blacks for that matter - you're not a protected class. 

As to your example, as far as I know, there is no Shoe Fetish acceptance community out there cringing every time Shoe thieving pervs are in the news. Plus, No one would know who is or isn't getting off on stilletos because there are no outward signs of this fetish. However, My fat is right out there in the open. When people see me, they form opinions about the most personal and private aspects of who I am without having the benefit of ever even talking to me. And they make these assumptions based on what they think they know of fat people. Their knowledge base is those extreme examples they see on TV. 

I don't deny that those feeders I have known are assholes, they certainly are. I've also known feeders who were very cool people - But I'm not talking about them here. The bottom line for me is that manipulative and extreme feeding of a partner that is to weak to say no, or who has an eating disorder is fucking wrong. Why do you take such issue with that? I didn't say that getting off while your partner feeds you something yummy is WRONG, it isn't. If it turns you on to take your best guy out for a nice big dinner and rub his full belly after then go nuts. I have no problem with erotic eating or feeding. It's feeding past the point that it harms the health of another person, or using manipulation to get your rocks off that's wrong in my opinion. And it's those people who engage in that extreme behavior that I don't want representing me as a part of this community. If it makes me a bigot just to have differing views from you, then your intolerance of my opinions makes you a bigot too. So let's not fling poo, and just try to see each other's points without being all shitty.


----------



## KHayes666

Surlysomething said:


> Haha. Ok, Kevin. I forgot for a second that you're the King of FA's and every fat web "models" best friend.
> 
> You've got their backs. Yadda yadda.



So you're going to make fun of the fact I've made legitimate friends with women who just happen to web model either for a job or on the side? This includes meeting their husbands, boyfriends, children, dogs, cats, etc and spending time at their houses or out in public. You're going to sit there and sarcastically downplay the fact I've spent time with them, spoken to them, listened to them when they needed someone to and cared about their feelings? How about driving 50 miles with no sleep to attend a memorial service or taking care of them when they're laid up after knee surgery? You going to downplay that too? Is that the kind of person you are, to make fun of someone defending friends they've actually spent time with and care about them?

I don't know every single webmodel out there and some of them sure as hell aren't my friends, but for the friends I have made, its all legitimate. In fact, sometimes I've gone above and beyond the call of duty to make someone feel better. Which is more than I can say for a lot of other men, especially below.



FA Punk said:


> That really didn't help you pal, *you still come off as a total jackass*, and I feel legitimately sorry for you because of that:doh:.



Takes one to know one, pal. Your posts make you look like an arrogant a-hole just as much as mine do. Least I never claimed to be otherwise.


----------



## LoveBHMS

FA Punk said:


> That really didn't help you pal, you still come off as a total jackass, and I feel legitimately sorry for you because of that:doh:.



I'm not a paysite girl but I am friends with Kevin in real life. He's not even close to being a jackass. There are a lot of men who don't respect women in adult entertainment, but he does.

It's got to take real effort to feel sorry for a man who's engaged to an SSBBW and who trusts and respects him enough to have lots of female friends....many of whom she's also friends with. Take a look at his fiancee in one of the picture threads and then add in the fact that as a couple they're friends with women you have to pay just to look at. Believe me he doesn't need any sympathy.


----------



## LoveBHMS

petunia805 said:


> If it's a fetish, then please stop comparing yourselves to Gays and Transgender people or Jews and Blacks for that matter - you're not a protected class.
> 
> As to your example, as far as I know, there is no Shoe Fetish acceptance community out there cringing every time Shoe thieving pervs are in the news. Plus, No one would know who is or isn't getting off on stilletos because there are no outward signs of this fetish. However, My fat is right out there in the open. When people see me, they form opinions about the most personal and private aspects of who I am without having the benefit of ever even talking to me. And they make these assumptions based on what they think they know of fat people. Their knowledge base is those extreme examples they see on TV.
> 
> I don't deny that those feeders I have known are assholes, they certainly are. I've also known feeders who were very cool people - But I'm not talking about them here. The bottom line for me is that manipulative and extreme feeding of a partner that is to weak to say no, or who has an eating disorder is fucking wrong. Why do you take such issue with that? I didn't say that getting off while your partner feeds you something yummy is WRONG, it isn't. If it turns you on to take your best guy out for a nice big dinner and rub his full belly after then go nuts. I have no problem with erotic eating or feeding. It's feeding past the point that it harms the health of another person, or using manipulation to get your rocks off that's wrong in my opinion. And it's those people who engage in that extreme behavior that I don't want representing me as a part of this community. If it makes me a bigot just to have differing views from you, then your intolerance of my opinions makes you a bigot too. So let's not fling poo, and just try to see each other's points without being all shitty.



You and your husband are equally good at missing the point. I didn't compare feedists with minorities. What I said was that you're insisting that feedists "make everyone look bad" and that peoples' negative attitudes about it are justified because you personally know people who fit the stereotype so it must be true.

People were anti-fat long before talk shows, and I can't imagine that you're the only fat person anyone knows to the point where they make judgements about you based on seeing Suzanne Enman on tv.


----------



## petunia805

LoveBHMS said:


> *snipped. I didn't compare feedists with minorities. What I said was that you're insisting that feedists "make everyone look bad" and that peoples' negative attitudes about it are justified because you personally know people who fit the stereotype so it must be true.
> 
> People were anti-fat long before talk shows, and I can't imagine that you're the only fat person anyone knows to the point where they make judgements about you based on seeing Suzanne Enman on tv.



Yes you did. You equate my criticism of extreme feederism with an attack on gays. Which it's not. You equated being a feedist with being Gay by calling it your Sexuality. Which it isn't. You said yourself it's a fetish. And those words are NOT interchangeable. 

I used my personal experiences as examples (not stereotypes) of what I was talking about, which by your rules is A-OK, since you have no problem using my experiences as examples to further your points. 

and, Yes, people have long been anti fat, hence the SA movement. My point is that people like Suzanne Enman and Extreme feedists in general, set back our collective progress because they further the predudicial thinking rather than advance acceptance.


----------



## FA Punk

KHayes666 said:


> Takes one to know one, pal. Your posts make you look like an arrogant a-hole just as much as mine do. Least I never claimed to be otherwise.



Oh I admit to being a total asshole, in fact I like being a total asshole, but still I don't go around around bragging about how I know this paysite model or that paysite. I am honestly shocked a woman would ever go out with you let alone marry you! I can hear his brain rattle round in his skull people, no offense.


----------



## FA Punk

LoveBHMS said:


> I'm not a paysite girl but I am friends with Kevin in real life. He's not even close to being a jackass. There are a lot of men who don't respect women in adult entertainment, but he does.
> 
> It's got to take real effort to feel sorry for a man who's engaged to an SSBBW and who trusts and respects him enough to have lots of female friends....many of whom she's also friends with. Take a look at his fiancee in one of the picture threads and then add in the fact that as a couple they're friends with women you have to pay just to look at. Believe me he doesn't need any *''sympathy''*.



But when you have the IQ of a number two pencil I think that counts for sympathy:happy:.


----------



## LoveBHMS

It's really just like gay rights movement. You and bigmac are like the sedate suburban couple who get angry with the fags sashaying down Fifth Aveue clad in chaps and feather boas because you worry people will think "we're all like that." Well uncomfortable though it may make some, those guys have the right to express themselves and their sexuality. Nobody really has the burden or the responsibility of representing all FA or all fat people.


----------



## LoveBHMS

FA Punk said:


> But when you have the IQ of a number two pencil I think that counts for sympathy:happy:.



Excuse me? F**k off. Kevin doesn't have the IQ of a pencil. You don't know him and I do. It's over the top nasty to say you don't know why somebody would marry him. He loves his partner and treats her very well and thinks she's hot and tells her all the time. Even if somebody talks about being friends with paysite girls, that's hardly some massive character flaw. I sincerely hope you're less of a dick in real life; if you are maybe you can find a young blond SSBBW to be in love with you.


----------



## FA Punk

LoveBHMS said:


> *It's really just like gay rights movement*. You and bigmac are like the sedate suburban couple who get angry with the fags sashaying down Fifth Aveue clad in chaps and feather boas because you worry people will think "we're all like that." Well uncomfortable though it may make some, those guys have the right to express themselves and their sexuality. Nobody really has the burden or the responsibility of representing all FA or all fat people.



You'er so full of shit, people have died for gay rights but has anybody died for feederism or SA for that matter? No, end of story.


----------



## KHayes666

FA Punk said:


> Oh I admit to being a total asshole, in fact I like being a total asshole, but still I don't go around around bragging about how I know this paysite model or that paysite. I am honestly shocked a woman would ever go out with you let alone marry you! I can hear his brain rattle round in his skull people, no offense.



You want to talk about brains? You admit to LIKE being an asshole which I assume means you're probably NOT engaged to a young, blonde ssbbw (Loves words) nor will you ever be. If you want to steal a Jim Cornette promo and claim my brain is so small it'll rattle around like a bb in a boxcar that's fine because you have proven you have no brains at all. 

Have A Nice Day


----------



## LoveBHMS

FA Punk said:


> But when you have the IQ of a number two pencil I think that counts for sympathy:happy:.





FA Punk said:


> You'er so full of shit, people have died for gay rights but has anybody died for feederism or SA for that matter? No, end of story.



I was refering to Petunia and bigmac's attitudes towards feedists. You couldn't figure that out?

And the original point I was trying to make is that a sexual fetish and SA don't really have much to do with one another. If NAAFA simply left feederism alone, that would be pretty reasonable. Or if they said something like "We believe everyone has the right to feel comfortable with their size and nobody should ever attempt to affect weight loss or gain in anyone whose satisfied with him or herself."


----------



## FA Punk

KHayes666 said:


> You want to talk about brains? You admit to LIKE being an asshole which I assume means you're probably NOT engaged to a young, blonde ssbbw (Loves words) nor will you ever be. If you want to steal a Jim Cornette promo and claim my brain is so small it'll rattle around like a bb in a boxcar that's fine because you have proven you have no brains at all.
> 
> Have A Nice Day



So you'er Mick Foley now haha!

Whatever KHayes666, I'll be laughing my ass off when that ''blonde ssbbw'' of yours (love how you label her like a piece of meat btw) kicks you out to the curb cause she doesn't want to pile on another 100lbs for you. Not like that doesn't happen between feeders and feedes at all though.


----------



## Surlysomething

KHayes666 said:


> So you're going to make fun of the fact I've made legitimate friends with women who just happen to web model either for a job or on the side? This includes meeting their husbands, boyfriends, children, dogs, cats, etc and spending time at their houses or out in public. You're going to sit there and sarcastically downplay the fact I've spent time with them, spoken to them, listened to them when they needed someone to and cared about their feelings? How about driving 50 miles with no sleep to attend a memorial service or taking care of them when they're laid up after knee surgery? You going to downplay that too? Is that the kind of person you are, to make fun of someone defending friends they've actually spent time with and care about them?
> 
> I don't know every single webmodel out there and some of them sure as hell aren't my friends, but for the friends I have made, its all legitimate. In fact, sometimes I've gone above and beyond the call of duty to make someone feel better. Which is more than I can say for a lot of other men, especially below.



Pretty much.


----------



## Surlysomething

Jooplef said:


> I just read this whole thread because I'm an insomniac.
> 
> Found an irony.
> 
> First, the thread started with some people suggesting that the people who went on TV like lambs to the slaughter were clearly idiots.
> 
> The thread continued for many pages. Two of the ladies that went on the OzBlows show posted briefly, but their posts were more intelligent and far more even-keeled than most, especially Reenaye's.
> 
> Just an outsider's observation, but you guys might want to look into that...



Yeah, I think we'll all stop and look into your observation....you know, because you've posted less than 10 times in 5 years. We're going to take the time....


----------



## LoveBHMS

FA Punk said:


> So you'er Mick Foley now haha!
> 
> Whatever KHayes666, I'll be laughing my ass off when that ''blonde ssbbw'' of yours (love how you label her like a piece of meat btw) kicks you out to the curb cause she doesn't want to pile on another 100lbs for you. Not like that doesn't happen between feeders and feedes at all though.



That was how I referred to her, not how Kevin did. And she is in fact blond and and an ssbbw so it's hardly innacurate. And she won't be kicking his ass to the curb for that because as he's already said, they use fantasy and role play and talk during intimate time. And since I so enjoy mentioning people's partners and their personal situations, she is actually trying to lose weight and he's gone for walks with her and encouraged her to go to the gym. That's because he's respectful and considerate and believes women should make their own choices about their bodies.


----------



## petunia805

LoveBHMS said:


> I was refering to Petunia and bigmac's attitudes towards feedists. You couldn't figure that out?
> 
> And the original point I was trying to make is that a sexual fetish and SA don't really have much to do with one another. If NAAFA simply left feederism alone, that would be pretty reasonable. Or if they said something like "*We believe everyone has the right to feel comfortable with their size and nobody should ever attempt to affect weight loss or gain in anyone whose satisfied with him or herself*."



If this is how you feel, then we're arguing for the same side, but clearly from different perspectives. I'm OK with that. 

Loves, I don't believe you are a bad person, or that being a feeder in and of itself makes anyone a bad person. Like I've said I have ZERO problem with feeding and eating as part of a healthy sexual appetite (pun intended). As long as the physical or mental health of either partner isn't harmed. 

I'm not a bigot because I don't agree with you, I'm just a person who doesn't agree with you. That a little debate inspires such rage in some of you is odd. I don't sit around on my "Sedate Suburban" ass tsk-tsking at everyone and everything I don't like. 

If I _were_ Gay I wouldn't have a problem with feather boa wearing, flamboyant Gay men, or Gay women who dress and act like men. I would however have a problem with the Subculture of Bare-backing, which is deliberately having unprotected sex to try to "Cheat Death" because the risk is Erotic. This fetish isn't part of the Gay person's sexuality, its reckless and dangerous to their own health and their partner's health. Some Gay men who practice this Fetish never bother to get tested because knowing whether or not they are HIV+ would take away from the Eroticism of the act. THAT'S FUCKED UP!!! If every time the Gay rights movement was seen by middle america, a proponent of Bare-backing was paraded around, and the general consensus became that all gay people are immoral deviants, then yeah, I guess I'd be pissed off.

And before you go putting words in my mouth saying that I'm saying bare-backing is the same as feederism, I didn't say that, I'm simply answering the analogy that you presented.


----------



## LoveBHMS

This whole discussion came about because it was pointed out that naafa is opposed to feederism and I said that it makes no sense to oppose a fetish. A secondary argument pointed out that fat rights are fat rights no matter how the person got that way.

The feedists on this board are clearly and openly opposed to any non consensual activity. If you spend time on feeder-oriented sites you'll find it's pretty common for renegades to be attacked, and by renegades I mean stealth feeders or feeders who say their partner doesn't want to gain but how can they get them to. Even tactics like buying ice cream when she's dieting "knowing she can't resist" are frowned upon. It's also commonly understood that some people may be aroused by it but find weight gain to be undesirable in real life, and you see lots of personal ads stating "online/role play".

Most people are pretty benign about it all.


----------



## Angel

LoveBHMS said:


> The feedists on this board are clearly and openly opposed to any non consensual activity.



That is bullshit. Some of you (meaning feeders, encouragers, or whatever term you prefer) are open about your preferences and "openly opposed to any non consentual activity" but there are plenty others here who are the 
epitome of the exact opposite. There are plenty of us women who have encountered them or who have been in relationships with them to know that for a fact!


----------



## Miss Vickie

Angel said:


> That is bullshit. Some of you (meaning feeders, encouragers, or whatever term you prefer) are open about your preferences and "openly opposed to any non consentual activity" but there are plenty others here who are the
> epitome of the exact opposite. There are plenty of us women who have encountered them or who have been in relationships with them to know that for a fact!



Yes.

What about the numerous threads and posts about how to "sneak" more calories into the feedees? While there are occasionally verbal chastisement from the other "encouragers", there is at least as much support.


----------



## petunia805

Angel said:


> That is bullshit. Some of you (meaning feeders, encouragers, or whatever term you prefer) are open about your preferences and "openly opposed to any non consentual activity" but there are plenty others here who are the
> epitome of the exact opposite. There are plenty of us women who have encountered them or who have been in relationships with them to know that for a fact!





Miss Vickie said:


> Yes.
> 
> What about the numerous threads and posts about how to "sneak" more calories into the feedees? While there are occasionally verbal chastisement from the other "encouragers", there is at least as much support.



Careful ladies, you're about to unleash a shit-storm culminating with you being called bigots, fascists, and possibly misogynists...


----------



## FA Punk

LoveBHMS said:


> That was how I referred to her, not how Kevin did. And she is in fact blond and and an ssbbw so it's hardly innacurate. And she won't be kicking his ass to the curb for that because as he's already said, they use fantasy and role play and talk during intimate time. And since I so enjoy mentioning people's partners and their personal situations, she is actually trying to lose weight and he's gone for walks with her and encouraged her to go to the gym. That's because he's respectful and considerate and believes women should make their own choices about their bodies.



So the count down has already started then, must be real tough for Kevin to watch his prized ''SSBBW'' waste away to nothing, when you consider his orientation is feederism I imagine he dies alittle inside every time she drops a pound.


----------



## FA Punk

Angel said:


> That is bullshit. Some of you (meaning feeders, encouragers, or whatever term you prefer) are open about your preferences and "openly opposed to any non consentual activity" but there are plenty others here who are the
> epitome of the exact opposite. There are plenty of us women who have encountered them or who have been in relationships with them to know that for a fact!



I want to rep you but I can't!


----------



## petunia805

LoveBHMS said:


> This whole discussion came about because it was pointed out that naafa is opposed to feederism and I said that it makes no sense to oppose a fetish. A secondary argument pointed out that fat rights are fat rights no matter how the person got that way.
> 
> The feedists on this board are clearly and openly opposed to any non consensual activity. If you spend time on feeder-oriented sites you'll find it's pretty common for renegades to be attacked, and by renegades I mean stealth feeders or feeders who say their partner doesn't want to gain but how can they get them to. Even tactics like buying ice cream when she's dieting "knowing she can't resist" are frowned upon. It's also commonly understood that some people may be aroused by it but find weight gain to be undesirable in real life, and you see lots of personal ads stating "online/role play".
> 
> Most people are pretty benign about it all.



I stated OVER AND OVER again that it is the EXTREMISTS among you that I take issue with. Not you benign non-renegade type feeders. If you have agreed with this all along, then what the hell are you arguing with me about?I hope you realize that not only do they give ALL fatties a bad Rep, they give you a bad rep too. And if you will chastise them when they out themselves as renegades, why the fuck can't I?? 

The only reason I got involved at all, was to defend myself against you and Kevin using me and my personal issues to further your argument when a) I wasn't in this conversation and b)you weren't invited to do so. If my husband has spoken of these issues in other threads, it is because they were germane to the conversation, and he had my permission to do so. You don't. All you needed to do was just say: "yeah, sorry, that was uncalled for" but instead you kept insisting that you were justified in using me as an example because well, Bigmac is an ass in your opinion. And then you proceeded to make claims that any criticism of Feederism is out of line because it is akin to being anti-gay and that I'm a bigot and my husband is a bigot, because we make stereotypes against feeders which is the same as making racist comments about Blacks and Jews. Your logic boggles the mind really. 

I don't care how fat people got fat. I do care that size acceptance is hindered by those people who make their personal and private sexual acts public and representative of all fat people as a whole.

Naafa should distance itself from Feederism, if only to further the cause of the collective community.


----------



## Saoirse

FA Punk said:


> So you'er Mick Foley now haha!



Hahaha I WAS JUST THINKING THAT!! Not to go off topic, but there are things that I want to do to Mick Foley. Lots of dirty, sexy things. OMG i love that man. :eat2:


----------



## Marlayna

petunia805 said:


> I stated OVER AND OVER again that it is the EXTREMISTS among you that I take issue with. Not you benign non-renegade type feeders. If you have agreed with this all along, then what the hell are you arguing with me about?I hope you realize that not only do they give ALL fatties a bad Rep, they give you a bad rep too. And if you will chastise them when they out themselves as renegades, why the fuck can't I??
> 
> The only reason I got involved at all, was to defend myself against you and Kevin using me and my personal issues to further your argument when a) I wasn't in this conversation and b)you weren't invited to do so. If my husband has spoken of these issues in other threads, it is because they were germane to the conversation, and he had my permission to do so. You don't. All you needed to do was just say: "yeah, sorry, that was uncalled for" but instead you kept insisting that you were justified in using me as an example because well, Bigmac is an ass in your opinion. And then you proceeded to make claims that any criticism of Feederism is out of line because it is akin to being anti-gay and that I'm a bigot and my husband is a bigot, because we make stereotypes against feeders which is the same as making racist comments about Blacks and Jews. Your logic boggles the mind really.
> 
> I don't care how fat people got fat. I do care that size acceptance is hindered by those people who make their personal and private sexual acts public and representative of all fat people as a whole.
> 
> Naafa should distance itself from Feederism, if only to further the cause of the collective community.


I admire your restraint and eloquence. :bow:


----------



## FA Punk

Saoirse said:


> Hahaha I WAS JUST THINKING THAT!! Not to go off topic, but there are things that I want to do to Mick Foley. Lots of dirty, sexy things. OMG i love that man. :eat2:



If it has to do with Mick Foley it's always worth going off topic, the BHM who's been giving FFAs lady bonners since the early 90s, hmmm..I wonder if Mick is aware of his massive FFA fan base.


----------



## Saoirse

FA Punk said:


> If it has to do with Mick Foley it's always worth going off topic, the BHM who's been giving FFAs lady bonners since the early 90s, hmmm..I wonder if Mick is aware of his massive FFA fan base.



I dont even consider myself an FFA. I just love that big, hairy, toothless, earless, teddy bear man! I love watching him wrestle, reading his books and hearing interviews. He's a big kid!!

And fucking hot as all get out.


----------



## FA Punk

Saoirse said:


> *I dont even consider myself an FFA. I just love that big, hairy, toothless, earless, teddy bear man!* I love watching him wrestle, reading his books and hearing interviews. He's a big kid!!
> 
> And fucking hot as all get out.



You hear this alot when it comes to Mick Foley, my ex was a big time Mick Foley fan and she wasn't into big dudes at at all! She loved role play and me playing Mick was her favorite, now granted swicthing between Dude Love, Mankind, and Catcus Jack could be tasking at times but still worth it:blush:.


----------



## Saoirse

FA Punk said:


> You hear this alot when it comes to Mick Foley, my ex was a big time Mick Foley fan and she wasn't into big dudes at at all! She loved role play and me playing Mick was her favorite, now granted swicthing between Dude Love, Mankind, and Catcus Jack could be tasking at times but still worth it:blush:.



Cactus Jack was my MAN! For the longest time, I wanted black sweats that said Cactus down the leg.


----------



## tonynyc

*Mick Foley... best moment was when Vince tasted "The Chair" ... I think Dr. Oz should get the same*


----------



## vardon_grip

_NAAFA'S OFFICIAL POSITION:
*FEEDERISM*
NAAFA supports an individual's right to control all choices concerning his or her own body. NAAFA opposes the practice of feeders, in which one partner in a sexual relationship expects and encourages another partner to gain weight.
NAAFA ADVOCATES:
	That all bodies, of all sizes, are joyous and that individuals of all sizes can and should expect and demand respect from sexual partners for their bodies just as they are.
	That individuals who seek sexual partners accept and celebrate the current weight of their partner as one aspect of the whole person.
	That people of all sizes become empowered to demand respect for their bodies in the context of sexual relationships, without attempting to lose or gain weight in order to win a partner's approval or attract or retain that partner's desire.
NAAFA RESOLVES TO:
	Educate its membership and the public about individuals' right to be respected and admired in their sexual relationships without being expected to change their weight by either losing or gaining weight.
	Advocate for people who have been pressured to lose or gain weight by sexual partners. Support people of all sizes in demanding respect for their current weight in all of their relationships, sexual or otherwise._

NAAFA doesnt want to be associated with feederism. It is their descision to denounce what most call a fetish and others a lifestyle choice. The outside world doesnt separate feederism and fat people (out of ignorance) so they want to remove any sexualization of fat because it gets in the way of politics. Maybe they want to eliminate the idea of "choice" in relation to being fat. If fat people actively "choose" to gain more weight then there is no reason to change attitudes and no reason to create and enforce laws that surround size discrimination because fat people can simply "choose" to lose weight, but dont. Maybe they just don't like the politics of feederism. 

The feeder/feedee world doesn't want to think that what they do hurts size acceptance. NAAFA disagrees. (So much so, they issued an official stance) You can accept it or not, but for the moment, it isn't going to change. You can also not accept what NAAFA has to say and start your own Size Acceptance (non-profit) group.


----------



## FA Punk

tonynyc said:


> *Mick Foley... best moment was when Vince tasted "The Chair" ... I think Dr. Oz should get the same*



Mick did have the best chair shot in the biz, but honestly I rather see Dr. Oz have a long talk with ''Barbie'' instead...BANG BANG!


----------



## KHayes666

FA Punk said:


> So the count down has already started then, must be real tough for Kevin to watch his prized ''SSBBW'' waste away to nothing, when you consider his orientation is feederism I imagine he dies alittle inside every time she drops a pound.



I finally was able to stop laughing long enough to type this out.

You are completely and utterly brainless in every aspect possible. I have posted many times on different threads on how me and my fiancee do NOT practice feederism as she is against it. In fact, I routinely go on walks with her and go to the gym in order to maintain her health. I've told Loves this in person many times as I've gone to the gym with her as well. 

You are no different than those pathetic, pimple faced ssbbwchan geeks that gave me "6 months tops" and I'm now almost a year into the engagement. Now normally I'd point out the fact you have no pics, profile information nor a past history with BBW's but then when I saw your last 3 viewed threads were all SSBHM x-tra weight gain stories, I figured women were not your intended targets to begin with.

So enjoy your SSBHM's....and Mick Foley apparently.....while I enjoy going for a walk in the sunset on the blvd overlooking the ocean with my fiancee who's NOT gaining and never has to.

Now can you dig that....SUCKKKKKKKKKKAAAAAAAAAAAA!!!!


----------



## Surlysomething

The cheese factor has reached an all time high in this thread. Wrestling clips and Kevin talking about romantic sunset walks. Someone play a Bee Gees song, stat.

Haha.


----------



## imfree

Truly, this thread needs a Bee Gees song.


----------



## Surlysomething

imfree said:


> Truly, this thread needs a Bee Gees song.




Hahahaha. I really *LOL*'ed, Edgar.


----------



## FA Punk

KHayes666 said:


> I finally was able to stop laughing long enough to type this out.
> 
> You are completely and utterly brainless in every aspect possible. I have posted many times on different threads on how me and my fiancee do NOT practice feederism as she is against it. In fact, I routinely go on walks with her and go to the gym in order to maintain her health. I've told Loves this in person many times as I've gone to the gym with her as well.
> 
> You are no different than those pathetic, pimple faced ssbbwchan geeks that gave me "6 months tops" and I'm now almost a year into the engagement. Now normally I'd point out the fact you have no pics, profile information nor a past history with BBW's but then when I saw your last 3 viewed threads were all SSBHM x-tra weight gain stories, I figured women were not your intended targets to begin with.
> 
> So enjoy your SSBHM's....and Mick Foley apparently.....while I enjoy going for a walk in the sunset on the blvd overlooking the ocean with my fiancee who's NOT gaining and never has to.
> 
> Now can you dig that....SUCKKKKKKKKKKAAAAAAAAAAAA!!!!



Me brainless!? Haha, oh Kevin if anybody here is brainless it's you Mr. Manchild, you claim you'er against feederism yet you've been defending it the entire time you've been in this thread lol, honestly Kevin did you ride the short bus when you went to school? And gay jokes? Really gay jokes!? Thats all you got, this coming from the guy with the majority of his posts coming from the paysite section I'll take that as a complaint haha!

I'll you've done is give me more ammo Kevin, you hate gay people don't you? Why wouldn't you throw this up at my face if you didn't, so I guess you'er voteing for Mint hugh? 

LOL! I have to be frank with you Kevin and say I've never had more fun mocking someone, it's like you'er fucking five!


----------



## imfree

Surlysomething said:


> Hahahaha. I really *LOL*'ed, Edgar.



Glad you liked that. It's title was just too good to resist!


----------



## Surlysomething

imfree said:


> Glad you liked that. It's title was just too good to resist!




I just *lol'ed* again thinking about it.

hahahahaha


----------



## KHayes666

FA Punk said:


> Me brainless!? Haha, oh Kevin if anybody here is brainless it's you Mr. Manchild, you claim you'er against feederism yet you've been defending it the entire time you've been in this thread lol, honestly Kevin did you ride the short bus when you went to school? And gay jokes? Really gay jokes!? Thats all you got, this coming from the guy with the majority of his posts coming from the paysite section I'll take that as a complaint haha!
> 
> I'll you've done is give me more ammo Kevin, you hate gay people don't you? Why wouldn't you throw this up at my face if you didn't, so I guess you'er voteing for Mint hugh?
> 
> LOL! I have to be frank with you Kevin and say I've never had more fun mocking someone, it's like you'er fucking five!



I never said I was against feederism.....I just said I didn't practice it with my current fiancee. When did I ever once say I was against feederism? So now you can't read on top of not being able to think on top of being delusional. Whatever short bus you claimed I was on must have picked you up first, hit a pothole which caused you to fall out the back of it and land on your head.

You call THAT a gay joke? That's even funnier. It wasn't a gay joke as it was an explanation of your shitty attitude towards women. If you're not attracted to them they serve no purpose, which is the vibe you're giving off so I ran with it. The majority of my posts come from the paysite section, that's the best you can come up with? The paysite board has the least amount of drama on it. Maybe drama queens like you feed off of this kind of shit but I sure don't. 

I love how I point out you look at SSBHM weight gain stories and hypothesize that's the reason toward your shitty attitude towards paysite girls and somehow that makes me a gay basher lol. You're delusional on top of illiterate on top of brainless, you my friend are the weakest link. Goodbye


----------



## FA Punk

KHayes666 said:


> I never said I was against feederism.....I just said I didn't practice it with my current fiancee. When did I ever once say I was against feederism?.


Ughmmm..I didn't say you were againest, but you did say that your fiancee was againest it though and I asked why would you defend something that you'er not into. You also mentioned practiceing your ''feederism fantasies'' with your fiancee, so yeeeah.



KHayes666 said:


> You call THAT a gay joke? That's even funnier. It wasn't a gay joke as it was an explanation of your shitty attitude towards women. If you're not attracted to them they serve no purpose


Wow, you couldn't be more wrong, but it's like you to aim low and what I mean by aiming low is you hit the dirt lol. I like the fact you looked on my profile to find something to use againest, and what makes it funny is you think you really found something. You accused me of being gay plan and simple and don't try and twist it cause you'er not very good at it. 


KHayes666 said:


> which is the vibe you're giving off so I ran with it. The majority of my posts come from the paysite section, that's the best you can come up with? The paysite board has the least amount of drama on it. Maybe drama queens like you feed off of this kind of shit but I sure don't.


You see thats the differnce between you and me, I don't need the paysite models to justify my preference, I don't need them to stroke my ego, I don't need to mention ''I know such and such model'' every other post, but obviously you do Kevin and god help your fiancee in that regard.

And you as you put it ''I don't feed off of this shit'' then why are you still here Kevin? Just walk away, oh wait but you can't!


KHayes666 said:


> I love how I point out you look at SSBHM weight gain stories and hypothesize that's the reason toward your shitty attitude towards paysite girls and somehow that makes me a gay basher lol.


Why bring it up if not to call me gay lol? You moron don't you know you can't throw something like that out there then say ''well I was just pointing this out'' you wanted to find something on me and you think that is your smoking gun, again this is like talking to a five year old haha.



KHayes666 said:


> You're delusional on top of illiterate on top of brainless, you my friend are the weakest link. Goodbye



...^this looks bad enough as it is without me saying anything further.


----------



## KHayes666

FA Punk said:


> Ughmmm..I didn't say you were againest, but you did say that your fiancee was againest it though and I asked why would you defend something that you'er not into. You also mentioned practiceing your ''feederism fantasies'' with your fiancee, so yeeeah.



My fiancee was against doing it herself, not in general. The key word to the second part is FANTASY as in not real. Great spelling by the way so far.




FA Punk said:


> Wow, you couldn't be more wrong, but it's like you to aim low and what I mean by aiming low is you hit the dirt lol. I like the fact you looked on my profile to find something to use againest, and what makes it funny is you think you really found something. You accused me of being gay plan and simple and don't try and twist it cause you'er not very good at it.



I looked on your profile to see if you had any pics or profile information and I found none as I expected (which confirms you as a troll). While I was there you happened to be online and it said you were viewing a SSBHM weight gain story. With your past history of arrogant, antagonist behavior toward women it would make sense if you were into men and not women. 



FA Punk said:


> You see thats the differnce between you and me, I don't need the paysite models to justify my preference, I don't need them to stroke my ego, I don't need to mention ''I know such and such model'' every other post, but obviously you do Kevin and god help your fiancee in that regard.



Great spelling of difference too. I don't need paysite models to justify my preference, I just happen to be friends with some of them. The feedee I mentioned earlier that was 219 pounds and subsequent others I was with were when I was gone from Dimensions and had no ties to paysite models. In fact, I didn't start meeting models until 2007 about 2 years after I started being a feeder. Then when I started meeting them either locally or at size acceptance events (that you don't go to) I got to know a few real well and still hang out with them to this day. My fiancee also hangs out with them too so there's no need to "help" her. Once again you show complete and total ignorance to the fact not only is my fiancee ok with me having paysite models as friends, she's also friends with them herself.



FA Punk said:


> And you as you put it ''I don't feed off of this shit'' then why are you still here Kevin? Just walk away, oh wait but you can't!



I can walk away anytime I feel like it but its fun to mess with trolls. As far as I'm concerned you're just a common troll that offers nothing to size acceptance and even admitted to enjoying being an asshole. That's a troll defined.



FA Punk said:


> Why bring it up if not to call me gay lol? You moron don't you know you can't throw something like that out there then say ''well I was just pointing this out'' you wanted to find something on me and you think that is your smoking gun, again this is like talking to a five year old haha.



The only smoking guns are Billy and Bart so that reference means nothing here. I "found" something on you by accident when I was looking for something else to begin with. I never actually came out and said you were gay, all I said was it wouldn't surprise me given your past erratic behavior regarding women as I already mentioned.

The bottom line is you come on here flapping your gums about how gaining paysite girls suck, men that support them suck and a lot of other people suck with no pics, profile information or confirmed history of dating bbw's. That says only one thing: "Troll"


----------



## petunia805

KHayes666 said:


> *I looked on your profile to see if you had any pics or profile information and I found none as I expected (which confirms you as a troll).* While I was there you happened to be online and it said you were viewing a SSBHM weight gain story. With your past history of arrogant, antagonist behavior toward women it would make sense if you were into men and not women.


But...but....but... I know this has devolved into a pissing contest between you and FAPunk, but you don't have a pic of yourself on your profile page either. Does that confirm you as a troll too?


----------



## KHayes666

petunia805 said:


> But...but....but... I know this has devolved into a pissing contest between you and FAPunk, but you don't have a pic of yourself on your profile page either. Does that confirm you as a troll too?



I thought I did. My bad, I forgot I still had Hugo Stiglitz there.


----------



## Saoirse

i love big weiner contests!


----------



## Miss Vickie

petunia805 said:


> Careful ladies, you're about to unleash a shit-storm culminating with you being called bigots, fascists, and possibly misogynists...



LOL. Nah, mostly I just get ignored around here, but if a shit storm it must be, then they can, as the man says, bring it!


----------



## Diana_Prince245

Saoirse said:


> i love big weiner contests!



Naked male insecurity rarely leaves me breathless.


----------



## Angel

KHayes666 said:


> I looked on your profile to see if you had any pics or profile information and I found none as I expected (which confirms you as a troll).
> 
> 
> 
> The bottom line is you come on here [snip] with no pics, profile information or confirmed history of dating [snip]. That says only one thing: "Troll"




That is funny on so many levels.


----------



## vardon_grip

KHayes666 said:


> I looked on your profile to see if you had any pics or profile information and I found none as I expected (which confirms you as a troll).









No pics and no profile information. Troll CONFIRMED. 

Maybe you should revise your statement? 

Or not.



KHayes666 said:


> .....so there goes that theory lol



The man is no pencil. True genius!


----------



## KHayes666

vardon_grip said:


> No pics and no profile information. Troll CONFIRMED.
> 
> Maybe you should revise your statement?
> 
> Or not.
> 
> 
> 
> The man is no pencil. True genius!



Ah Sir Vardon.....long time no see. Haven't seen you since you tucked your tail and bravely fled following the prisoner thread.

Loves has said on numerous occasions she works for a company that can actually fire her for putting personal information on the internet. I don't remember Punk ever saying anything similar.

Also you don't see Loves insulting paysite models and claiming to enjoy being an asshole.


----------



## vardon_grip

KHayes666 said:


> Ah Sir Vardon.....long time no see. Haven't seen you since you tucked your tail and bravely fled following the prisoner thread.
> 
> Loves has said on numerous occasions she works for a company that can actually fire her for putting personal information on the internet. I don't remember Punk ever saying anything similar.
> 
> Also you don't see Loves insulting paysite models and claiming to enjoy being an asshole.


No LoveBHMS does not claim to being an asshole...that claim is all your own and it is irrelevant.
When confronted by your screw ups you avoid the topic and try another attack. Poor misdirection has been your M.O. for years. 

You said, "no pictures, no profile info = TROLL"
By your own definition that means that LovesBHMS is a troll. 

As far as the "prisoner thread" goes, are you referring to this?
http://www.dimensionsmagazine.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1707700&postcount=173

Yeah, you really had me running there tough guy!

A couple of posts later, you tucked your sacrococcygeal teratoma and backed down from your false accusations and admit to being a troll by saying you knowingly made false accusations for the purpose of trying to wind me up. 

_def. TROLL:
"a troll is someone who posts inflammatory, extraneous, or off-topic messages in an online community, such as an online discussion forum, chat room, or blog, with the primary intent of provoking readers into an emotional response"_

I find this definition fits what you have done on numerous occasions. 

As for the threats you made to a Dimensions member who is in a wheelchair that you would push him down an empty elevator shaft, the threat of rape you made to a female member and the threat of brandishing guns at several members (just to name a few) all because you were arguing with them just proves to me that LovesBHMS' claim that you are a nice guy is full of shit. 

At least you (and LovesBHMS) are consistent.


----------



## LoveBHMS

My observations on Kevin are based on being personally acquainted with him, not an online persona or some akin to "road rage" comments he's made. People say mean stuff all the time. It at least one of those cases the target is one of the rudest individuals on this site who hurls nasty attacks and insults from the safety of the keyboard and expect total immunity because of Dims longevity.


----------



## Mishty

:blink: 

​

:blush:​

:happy:


​




el oh el I had the greatest time readin' this shit it's kind of like a really sad episode of My So Called Troll Life


----------



## FA Punk

LoveBHMS said:


> My observations on Kevin are based on being personally acquainted with him, not an online persona or some akin to "road rage" comments he's made. People say mean stuff all the time. It at least one of those cases the target is one of the rudest individuals on this site who hurls nasty attacks and insults from the safety of the keyboard and expect total immunity because of Dims longevity.



Oh please if I were to meet Kevin in real life I'm sure I would insult him no differently, in fact I think it be funnier cause I could use sight gags then:happy:.


----------



## vardon_grip

LoveBHMS said:


> My observations on Kevin are based on being personally acquainted with him, not an online persona or some akin to "road rage" comments he's made. People say mean stuff all the time. It at least one of those cases the target is one of the rudest individuals on this site who hurls nasty attacks and insults from the safety of the keyboard and expect total immunity because of Dims longevity.



Your comments remind of a group of girlfriends complaining about one of the groups boyfriend. They tell her about a bunch of rude and mean shit he has said, his violent outbursts and deliberate troll behavior. After hearing everything they have to say about her boyfriend she replies, "Well, he isn't a dick to me."


----------



## vardon_grip

LoveBHMS said:


> My observations on Kevin are based on being personally acquainted with him, not an online persona or some akin to "road rage" comments he's made. People say mean stuff all the time. It at least one of those cases the target is one of the rudest individuals on this site who hurls nasty attacks and insults from the safety of the keyboard and expect total immunity because of Dims longevity.



This is a separate idea, so I'm making it a separate post. 

Every last one of us posts behind the safety of the keyboard. You, me, KHayes666...everyone. The playing field is completely level in that regard. It is our choice to be as anonymous or open (and varying degrees in between) about our personal lives when posting on Dimensions or any other forum/social network. KHayes666 states that you refrain from posting pictures and personal information because you say you can get fired from your job. You might feel that any association to Dimensions and that of someone who supports/practices feederism would be a liability to your career. You cannot be associated with Dimensions or your fetish. You put as much distance as you can between your fetish/lifestyle and your job because you think it can come back to hurt you. 

NAAFA is doing the same thing.


----------



## bigmac

vardon_grip said:


> This is a separate idea, so I'm making it a separate post.
> 
> Every last one of us posts behind the safety of the keyboard. You, me, KHayes666...everyone. The playing field is completely level in that regard. It is our choice to be as anonymous or open (and varying degrees in between) about our personal lives when posting on Dimensions or any other forum/social network. KHayes666 states that you refrain from posting pictures and personal information because you say you can get fired from your job. You might feel that any association to Dimensions and that of someone who supports/practices feederism would be a liability to your career. You cannot be associated with Dimensions or your fetish. *You put as much distance as you can between your fetish/lifestyle and your job because you think it can come back to hurt you.
> 
> NAAFA is doing the same thing.*




I know I said I was done with this thread -- but I just have to say EXCELLENT POINT.


----------



## KHayes666

vardon_grip said:


> Your comments remind of a group of girlfriends complaining about one of the groups boyfriend. They tell her about a bunch of rude and mean shit he has said, his violent outbursts and deliberate troll behavior. After hearing everything they have to say about her boyfriend she replies, "Well, he isn't a dick to me."



I'm not a dick to her because she doesn't post personal attacks every 5 seconds like you and FAPunk. You two personally attacked the members of the paysite board and expected NOT to be told off? Well I guess Punk is ready to fight fire with fire but you on the other hand, see below.

Like I said on the other thread you're like the kid that likes to run up and kick other kids but when you get punched in the face in return, you cry for the principal. I give credit because at least Punk never pulls that stuff.

Also Punk never photoshopped pictures to make women look smaller.


----------



## FA Punk

KHayes666 said:


> I'm not a dick to her because she doesn't post personal attacks every 5 seconds like you and *''FA Punk''*. You two personally attacked the members of the paysite board and expected NOT to be told off? Well I guess *''Punk''* is ready to fight fire with fire but you on the other hand, see below.
> 
> Like I said on the other thread you're like the kid that likes to run up and kick other kids but when you get punched in the face in return, you cry for the principal. I give credit because at least *''Punk''* never pulls that stuff.
> 
> Also *''Punk''*never photoshopped pictures to make women look smaller.



Oh how cute, Kevin missed me everybody lol:wubu:. Anyway, Kevin this would be the right time to walk away buddy, I'll give'ya credit you have put up a decent fight but it doesn't change the fact you've lost my friend. Now boys and girls I give you The Doors:happy:.
http://youtu.be/aGmAmJFUvzM


----------



## LoveBHMS

vardon_grip said:


> Your comments remind of a group of girlfriends complaining about one of the groups boyfriend. They tell her about a bunch of rude and mean shit he has said, his violent outbursts and deliberate troll behavior. After hearing everything they have to say about her boyfriend she replies, "Well, he isn't a dick to me."



No, once again I'm saying that my observations are based on being personally acquainted with him rather than just reading posts on an internet forum.

And to address your second point, most people no matter what fetish or preference or orientation they have, want to keep it private. It's not about feederism per se, but rather it's a matter of personal privacy. NAAFA is an organization which is misrepresenting what feederism really is, not simply distancing itself.


----------



## KHayes666

FA Punk said:


> Oh how cute, Kevin missed me everybody lol:wubu:. Anyway, Kevin this would be the right time to walk away buddy, I'll give'ya credit you have put up a decent fight but it doesn't change the fact you've lost my friend. Now boys and girls I give you The Doors:happy:.
> http://youtu.be/aGmAmJFUvzM



Lost? The argument was whether or not members of NAAFA should eradicate feeders and feedees holocaust style and obviously that's not going to happen. Those fighting for acceptance (Loves, myself, Ample Pie, etc) have won.

If you're talking about our personal battle, I've spent the last 2 nights sleeping with a young, blonde ssbbw and you were most likely jacking off to Vince Russo interviews, who's the winner there?'


----------



## Marlayna

I guess Vince Russo is the winner.


----------



## Wild Zero

Marlayna said:


> I guess Vince Russo is the winner.



SWERVE buhgawd!


----------



## Celestial Ceece

wrestlingguy said:


> The solicitation that came from the Dr. Oz show read as follows:
> 
> 
> 
> I know most of us can read, and what I've bolded is a solicitation to speak on on the lifelstyle of most bbw's. If that ain't repping, I don't know what is. While it's admirable to want to defend friends, my friendship involves telling them the truth, and when they've made an error in judgment, I prefer to be honest.
> 
> I know you'll disagree, as you already have, but you can't argue that the producers of this show were trying to solicit guests as representative of a lifestyle/community. So when people judge and criticize, it's based on a pre existing knowledge of how the solicitation was made, and the decision that was based on that knowledge, which even some of those who appeared on the show acknowledge that it was not the best idea, albeit for different reasons.
> 
> By the way, I am as disappointed of the women on the "other" side as I am those who appeared in defense of weight gain/feederism for exactly the same reason.



WOW...I had no idea that they (the show's producers) assumed that all/most BBW's lead an unhealthy lifestyle. But then again, I should have known in the beginning that they weren't going to be of the opinion that big is beautiful - or healthy. What happened on the show was most definitely counter-productive to size acceptance, and I feel bad for my part in it all. 

Okay, so I am not sure if it is known, but I appeared on the "anti-feederism" side of the argument. Much like Reenaye, and many of the others on BOTH SIDES, I was led to believe the show was going to be a certain way, and it didn't turn out the way I originally thought. I was under the impression that I would be able to tell my story and I wanted things to happen so much differently than they did. They made me look like a total, fat-hating, self-loathing BITCH. Since going on the show, I can clearly see that these folks can not be trusted! 

The irony is that I was referred to the show by CC Banana, who put out a fat chick tribute CD that I was on several years ago. I was supposed to represent the "fat and happy" side of things, but once they found out my story, they decided I would and should be on the "fat and miserable" side. I thought it would be an honest dialogue, and I was taken aback by the format of things and just the way it all went down in general. They edited out the part where I told the women on "the other side" that I thought they were beautiful and that I BELIEVE IN SIZE ACCEPTANCE. 

Lesson learned, I will NEVER allow myself to believe for one minute that things are as they appear on the surface when it comes to programs such as Dr. (whomever - since I signed a waiver saying I couldn't and wouldn't talk about my appearance on the show). I felt like I divorced myself from SA/FA due to my participation, and knowing everything I know, I will never turn my back on this community, because this community is who I am.


----------



## KHayes666

Wild Zero said:


> SWERVE buhgawd!



Now I know how Booker T feels


----------



## BBWHearts

KHayes666 said:


> If you're talking about our personal battle, I've spent the last 2 nights sleeping with a young, blonde ssbbw and you were most likely jacking off to Vince Russo interviews, who's the winner there?'



Heh. I like this.


----------



## FA Punk

KHayes666 said:


> Lost? The argument was whether or not members of NAAFA should eradicate feeders and feedees holocaust style and obviously that's not going to happen. Those fighting for acceptance (Loves, myself, Ample Pie, etc) have won.
> 
> If you're talking about our personal battle, I've spent the last 2 nights sleeping with a young, blonde ssbbw and you were most likely jacking off to Vince Russo interviews, who's the winner there?'



You fucking some random fat chick doesn't mean shit lol, Kevin all you've done is shown how much of a arrogant ass you are and nothing more. And the thing is you seem to do this alot and I thank you for that because for the last two nights I've been laughing at you almost none stop, you really aren't that much differnt then the jackass in high school who brags about screwing the head cheerleader.


----------



## FA Punk

BBWHearts said:


> Heh. I like this.



Shouldn't you be bitching at Brie Brown?


----------



## BBWHearts

FA Punk said:


> Shouldn't you be bitching at Brie Brown?



Hmmm....I have never bitched at Brie Brown. Never spoken to her at all! No, I said I liked that because he made himself sound like a real player. For a moment I think he have an open marriage, haha.


----------



## fatgirlflyin

Celestial Ceece said:


> . Much like Reenaye, and many of the others on BOTH SIDES, I was led to believe the show was going to be a certain way, and it didn't turn out the way I originally thought. I was under the impression that I would be able to tell my story and I wanted things to happen so much differently than they did.



Have you been living under a rock? Normal doesn't sell advertising space... 

I dont know, I just can't beleive that anyone would go on one of those shows thinking that it was for the greater good, and it not being about their own 15 minutes of fame. 

Want to be a role model for other fat women? Want to show people that not all fat people do nothing but sit on the couch stuffing twinkies in their mouths? Get out there and live your life. Be active in your community. Become a big brother or big sister to some random fat kid... So many better opportunites out there to bring about change than Dr. Oz.


----------



## KHayes666

FA Punk said:


> You fucking some random fat chick doesn't mean shit lol, Kevin all you've done is shown how much of a arrogant ass you are and nothing more. And the thing is you seem to do this alot and I thank you for that because for the last two nights I've been laughing at you almost none stop, you really aren't that much differnt then the jackass in high school who brags about screwing the head cheerleader.



Now I'M the one who can't stop laughing. That "random fat chick" is my fiancee I've been with for 3 years, engaged the last 1 and I've posted all over Dimensions with pictures and proof of our togetherness....which makes you look like an even bigger jackass than before. 

But hey....if your goal in life is not to get laid or fall in love but rather go on the internet to argue with other guys and jack off to SSBHM stories that's your choice, the rest of us have better things (and people) to do.

Speaking of high school, when I was there I didn't want the head cheerleader because some of the others were much cuter not to mention I digged the gothic chicks better. Actually my g/f my junior year was just as beautiful and a hell of a lot nicer than most of the cheerleaders.


----------



## Marlayna

Well, if there's one thing I'm sure we can all agree upon... it's that Dr. Odd sucks!


----------



## KHayes666

Marlayna said:


> Well, if there's one thing I'm sure we can all agree upon... it's that Dr. Odd sucks!



You win the thread.


----------



## vardon_grip

LoveBHMS said:


> No, once again I'm saying that my observations are based on being personally acquainted with him rather than just reading posts on an internet forum.
> 
> And to address your second point, most people no matter what fetish or preference or orientation they have, want to keep it private. It's not about feederism per se, but rather it's a matter of personal privacy. NAAFA is an organization which is misrepresenting what feederism really is, not simply distancing itself.



Why should I care that you are acquainted with each other? You keep saying that like it is a pass on bad behavior. You are an anonymous poster on this forum with no personal information or even a profile picture. I have no idea who you are aside from what you post on this forum. By KHayes666's own definition you fit the description of an internet troll so why should anyone listen to you?* I don't mean this harshly, I am making a point.

If I wrote this to you:
**puts thumb and index finger on my chin* Aw little girl there ain't no time to wash your stinky hand, go head and roll over I'm goin in you again nowwwww.*
If you were physically challenged and in a wheelchair and I wrote this to you:
*"Remind me to wheel you to the nearest empty elevator shaft..."*

Would you say to yourself, "This is just harmless internet 'road rage' and shouldn't be held against this guy."? I think you would be offended (especially about the rape part) if I wrote that to you and possibly report me to a mod. If you saw this type of behavior from me often, you would be offended as often as others like myself are.
I can only respond to and make judgments based on what is written on this internet forum. If this is the only place I will ever come into contact with either of you why should I care what either of you are like "IRL"? 

In regards to the NAAFA issue:
You are not a member of the club. This is neither good nor bad. It just is.
By your own choice, you don't want exist to NAAFA. As such, you don't have a voice that counts. NAAFA made a declaration on its stance on feederism and you don't like it. You don't define feederism the same way NAAFA does. Tough cookies. I'm not saying that NAAFA is the be all, end all; but they are the leading "governing" body. 

Lets face it, I don't think you are going to stop expressing that part of your sexuality just because NAAFA doesn't like you, right? So, if you don't really care what NAAFA says...why do you care what NAAFA says?

Feederism is bad according to NAAFA. You don't have to like everything NAAFA stands for to support size acceptance. The question is, do you really care about size acceptance or just don't want to be singled out?


*(I am not saying that you are an internet troll)


----------



## Surlysomething

vardon_grip said:


> Why should I care that you are acquainted with each other? You keep saying that like it is a pass on bad behavior. You are an anonymous poster on this forum with no personal information or even a profile picture. I have no idea who you are aside from what you post on this forum. By KHayes666's own definition you fit the description of an internet troll so why should anyone listen to you?* I don't mean this harshly, I am making a point.
> 
> If I wrote this to you:
> **puts thumb and index finger on my chin* Aw little girl there ain't no time to wash your stinky hand, go head and roll over I'm goin in you again nowwwww.*
> If you were physically challenged and in a wheelchair and I wrote this to you:
> *"Remind me to wheel you to the nearest empty elevator shaft..."*
> 
> Would you say to yourself, "This is just harmless internet 'road rage' and shouldn't be held against this guy."? I think you would be offended (especially about the rape part) if I wrote that to you and possibly report me to a mod. If you saw this type of behavior from me often, you would be offended as often as others like myself are.
> I can only respond to and make judgments based on what is written on this internet forum. If this is the only place I will ever come into contact with either of you why should I care what either of you are like "IRL"?
> 
> In regards to the NAAFA issue:
> You are not a member of the club. This is neither good nor bad. It just is.
> By your own choice, you don't want exist to NAAFA. As such, you don't have a voice that counts. NAAFA made a declaration on its stance on feederism and you don't like it. You don't define feederism the same way NAAFA does. Tough cookies. I'm not saying that NAAFA is the be all, end all; but they are the leading "governing" body.
> 
> Lets face it, I don't think you are going to stop expressing that part of your sexuality just because NAAFA doesn't like you, right? So, if you don't really care what NAAFA says...why do you care what NAAFA says?
> 
> Feederism is bad according to NAAFA. You don't have to like everything NAAFA stands for to support size acceptance. The question is, do you really care about size acceptance or just don't want to be singled out?
> 
> 
> *(I am not saying that you are an internet troll)



Quit making so much sense!


----------



## Diana_Prince245

We can only judge people by what they post on here. What someone is in real life is irrelevant to a large degree on a message board because most other posters don't know you. If you post mean spirited things, people will assume you are a jerk. If you post puppies, kitties, babies and other sweet things, people will assume you are nice. Not to mention that our true personalities usually come through the more we post


----------



## KHayes666

lol @ Sir Vardon.

I needed a good laugh, thanks troll.


----------



## bigmac

fatgirlflyin said:


> Have you been living under a rock? Normal doesn't sell advertising space...
> 
> I dont know, I just can't beleive that anyone would go on one of those shows thinking that it was for the greater good, and it not being about their own 15 minutes of fame.
> 
> Want to be a role model for other fat women? Want to show people that not all fat people do nothing but sit on the couch stuffing twinkies in their mouths? *Get out there and live your life.* Be active in your community. Become a big brother or big sister to some random fat kid... So many better opportunites out there to bring about change than Dr. Oz.




Yes! Yes! Yes!

All the fat people who get up everyday and go to work, to school, who volunteer, who raise their families, ... who go to park, who hang out with friends, ... these are all positive roll models.


----------



## LoveBHMS

Look I'm not going to change anyone's mind so I'm going to drop the Kevin thing. We're hanging out tomorrow and I feel perfectly safe.

I don't have an issue with Naafa per se. I have an issue with feederism being mischaracterized and judged by a bunch of people who worry endlessly about being mischaracterized and judged. The simple truth is when it comes to feederism most people don't understand it. The feedist community has self feeders, male feedees, people who masturbate thinking about weight gain who forget about it after they get off, people who get off on nothing more than "fat chat" and being called names or namecalling. And yes there are people who choose to gain weight for sexual pleasure. That's their life, their body, and their business. They have the same right to be left alone as regular fat people have to buy junk food.

If feederism has any affect on SA, it's positive. Why? Because what better way to promote acceptance than to say "I fucking love this. I'm happy. I want to look this way." That's why there's black pride with big afros and gay pride with feather boas and leather jockstraps. They're proud of who and what they are and they celebrate and revel in it. They're not always trying to assimilate and blend in. It's a lot better for SA to have 500 pound paysite girls saying how totally happy are than to sit on Dimensions and whinge about the $88 billion diet industry.

What is the worst thing that's going to happen if anyone sees that somebody intentionally gained weight by eating a ton of food. That some random stranger sees you and thinks you ate a ton of food? Who cares? Maybe if they see enough feeders they'll think you're happy and not try to sell you a Jenny Craig membership.


----------



## LoveBHMS

bigmac said:


> Yes! Yes! Yes!
> 
> All the fat people who get up everyday and go to work, to school, who volunteer, who raise their families, ... who go to park, who hang out with friends, ... these are all positive roll models.



Lol at "roll models". Assuming you mean "role".


----------



## vardon_grip

LoveBHMS said:


> Look I'm not going to change anyone's mind so I'm going to drop the Kevin thing. We're hanging out tomorrow and I feel perfectly safe.



You are avoiding the question I asked about how you would react if I threatened you with rape or threatened you by saying I would push you down an empty elevator shaft. Would you dismiss it as nothing or would you take offense?


----------



## KHayes666

vardon_grip said:


> You are avoiding the question I asked about how you would react if I threatened you with rape or threatened you by saying I would push you down an empty elevator shaft. Would you dismiss it as nothing or would you take offense?



If you consider a sarcastic joke from a Frank Zappa song a threat of rape then you must be as stupid as your photoshopped pictures of women.


----------



## LoveBHMS

vardon_grip said:


> You are avoiding the question I asked about how you would react if I threatened you with rape or threatened you by saying I would push you down an empty elevator shaft. Would you dismiss it as nothing or would you take offense?



In at least one of those cases, the instigator has harassed, insulted, and attacked me. So getting "threatened" shouldn't be so unexpected. If I was nasty and launched personal attacks at people and their loved ones, I would expect it to come back to me. Something brought on those statements, they weren't made in the proverbial vacuum and you won't find one situation where Kevin draws first blood. There's one target of Kevin's who has made fun of my religion. Am I going to say he's a bad guy for attacking her? No. When you have everything from your looks to your intelligence to your job to your religion attacked, don't get surprised or offended when somebody strikes back.


----------



## FATcha

KHayes666 said:


> lol @ Sir Vardon.
> 
> I needed a good laugh, thanks troll.



How can you call someone a troll when they have had more than one meal with multiple other members? 

You seem jealous.

Keep on stapling brother.


----------



## Surlysomething

KHayes666 said:


> lol @ Sir Vardon.
> 
> I needed a good laugh, thanks troll.



You keep digging bigger and bigger holes for yourself, Kevin. It might be time to walk away and save yourself the embarrassment.


----------



## bigmac

LoveBHMS said:


> Lol at "roll models". Assuming you mean "role".



Freudian slip or dyslexia -- one of the two.


----------



## FA Punk

FATcha said:


> How can you call someone a troll when they have had more than one meal with multiple other members?
> 
> You seem jealous.
> 
> Keep on stapling brother.



Kevin would only be jealous if those other members were paysite models, normal people mean nothing to him.


----------



## LoveBHMS

FA Punk said:


> Kevin would only be jealous if those other members were paysite models, normal people mean nothing to him.



Do you try to make each one of your posts stupider than the last one?


----------



## FATcha

Surlysomething said:


> You keep digging bigger and bigger holes for yourself, Kevin. It might be time to walk away and save yourself the embarrassment.



I've watched him be a complete fool for years Surly;embarrassment doesn't phase him.


----------



## KHayes666

FATcha said:


> How can you call someone a troll when they have had more than one meal with multiple other members?
> 
> You seem jealous.
> 
> Keep on stapling brother.



How stupid are you? I've had many meals with many members on here. I've been to a few of their houses and them to mine. Some have met my family as I've met theirs as well. 

Sir Vardon also continues to dodge the fact...yes...a proven fact...that he is on a size acceptance website and he photoshops pictures to make women look smaller. Not exactly acceptance is it?

Take your 17 posts (mostly saying how nice someone's belly is that I've met in real life) and your lack of knowledge and shove them up your you know what.



FA Punk said:


> Kevin would only be jealous if those other members were paysite models, normal people mean nothing to him.



Today a normal friend and I caught a local baseball game before he went to work so there goes that theory. I know its a strange concept for you and certain other people on this thread to leave the house but some of us enjoy sunlight. Oh and see below



LoveBHMS said:


> Do you try to make each one of your posts stupider than the last one?



When we go to the gym tomorrow we can laugh about all this.


----------



## vardon_grip

KHayes666 said:


> If you consider a sarcastic joke from a Frank Zappa song a threat of rape then you must be as stupid as your photoshopped pictures of women.



I would lay odds that if I said to your girlfriend, "aw' little girl, there ain't no time to wash your stinky hand. Go 'head 'n' roll over, I'm goin' in you again nowwwww.", you would get into your Halloween costume of Ajax from that old gang movie "The Warriors" and then pull out your twin .45 cal semi-automatic pistols like a character from that slightly old vigilante movie, "The Boondock Saints", sacrifice a goat basted in curry in honor of your parents and then start blasting away ala Columbine. 

It is ridiculous to think that most people would know lyrics to a Zappa song that was written before you were born. It is idiotic to think that the words aren't offensive and not about rape, given the context, just because _you say_ it was a "sarcastic joke". The words are offensive regardless. Axel Rose (another offensive brother with anger issues) tried a similar tact when he denounced blacks, immigrants and gays in the song, "One In A Million".

I don’t air dirty laundry about my past relationships in public or in a Dimensions forum/chat room to strangers. It is obvious that not everyone feels the same way I do. When a couple breaks up, it often isn’t pretty and sometimes one or both talk trash. I find it extremely difficult to care about something that happened 5 years ago. I believe that if you say nothing there is no way to exaggerate or spin the truth and/or flat out lie. 

Of course I photoshop pictures of women, I'm a photographer. I also photoshop pictures of men, children, animals, buildings, clouds, food and countless other things. One time, at the request of an ex-girlfriend's son, I photoshopped two front teeth where there were none in a portrait that I took of him and his brother for a mother's day gift. 
The only reason you have brought that subject up is to imply that I don’t like fat women and/or want to change them. Simply, this is not true. Looking at it from a different angle, if this were true, I would think that you would praise me for doing exactly like you do. I am amazed that you can't recognize and appreciate the irony.

As you like to say, "So much for that theory."


----------



## KHayes666

vardon_grip said:


> I would lay odds that if I said to your girlfriend, "aw' little girl, there ain't no time to wash your stinky hand. Go 'head 'n' roll over, I'm goin' in you again nowwwww.", you would get into your Halloween costume of Ajax from that old gang movie "The Warriors" and then pull out your twin .45 cal semi-automatic pistols like a character from that slightly old vigilante movie, "The Boondock Saints", sacrifice a goat basted in curry in honor of your parents and then start blasting away ala Columbine.
> 
> It is ridiculous to think that most people would know lyrics to a Zappa song that was written before you were born. It is idiotic to think that the words aren't offensive and not about rape, given the context, just because _you say_ it was a "sarcastic joke". The words are offensive regardless. Axel Rose (another offensive brother with anger issues) tried a similar tact when he denounced blacks, immigrants and gays in the song, "One In A Million".
> 
> I dont air dirty laundry about my past relationships in public or in a Dimensions forum/chat room to strangers. It is obvious that not everyone feels the same way I do. When a couple breaks up, it often isnt pretty and sometimes one or both talk trash. I find it extremely difficult to care about something that happened 5 years ago. I believe that if you say nothing there is no way to exaggerate or spin the truth and/or flat out lie.
> 
> Of course I photoshop pictures of women, I'm a photographer. I also photoshop pictures of men, children, animals, buildings, clouds, food and countless other things. One time, at the request of an ex-girlfriend's son, I photoshopped two front teeth where there were none in a portrait that I took of him and his brother for a mother's day gift.
> The only reason you have brought that subject up is to imply that I dont like fat women and/or want to change them. Simply, this is not true. Looking at it from a different angle, if this were true, I would think that you would praise me for doing exactly like you do. I am amazed that you can't recognize and appreciate the irony.
> 
> As you like to say, "So much for that theory."




You know....more and more you sound like the head elf from Rudolph because all I hear from you is:

*WHYYY WEREN'T YOU AT ELF PRACTICE!!??*


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## Surlysomething

Good lord. It's just so painful.


And hilarious. Haha.


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## FATcha

KHayes666 said:


> How stupid are you? I've had many meals with many members on here. I've been to a few of their houses and them to mine. Some have met my family as I've met theirs as well.
> 
> Sir Vardon also continues to dodge the fact...yes...a proven fact...that he is on a size acceptance website and he photoshops pictures to make women look smaller. Not exactly acceptance is it?
> 
> Take your 17 posts (mostly saying how nice someone's belly is that I've met in real life) and your lack of knowledge and shove them up your you know what.



Wow,you sure told me you squint eyed rebel you. You keep calling him a troll,he's not a troll. Stop it. I don't give a rats ass who has been to your house or who's house you've been to,you missed the point again. Guess that makes you the stupid one but I think you're used to that,eh?

Knowing fat women and treating them respect makes a person a member of the SA movement, not knowing models and bash goers only. A fat woman is a fat woman on this board or on the sidewalk. 

His job requires him to photoshop women so he does it,if you had to staple together one of Boston's stories about disgusting fat women or lose your job;you'd do it. So,shut up about that too. 

I have only made 17 post and yes 2 were telling models[that you may have met,but I promise you son,a large number of the models you've met think you're creepy and immature] I was recently divorced and I got a bit carried away you see Kevin; I was married and my wife didn't like me being on fat forums because she felt it was cheating,so I having the most respect for my lady stopped. You never have. You've continued to comment and cyber stalk these poor ladies you've met briefly in a group right under your poor ladies nose. Classless really. All those girls you've been "fattening" on the side & your lady love doesn't give a shit? I've heard things from some of these lovely girls you talk shit to. I just don't think I like you very much. I'm willing to see pass all of that if you'd just stop making a fool of yourself.

Jesus Christ I've been in three wars and your the kind of youth I've defended? Really? My own son would be back handed had he posted the Zappa lyrics without a proper explanation but then again he was raised right.

Grow up baby Kevin.


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## FA Punk

KHayes666 said:


> Today a normal friend and I caught a local baseball game before he went to work so there goes that theory. I know its a strange concept for you and certain other people on this thread to leave the house but some of us enjoy sunlight.



I work outside you fucking dumbass lol! Can somebody tell me what is wrong with him? Does he normally go this far or is this new haha?


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## Angel

vardon_grip said:


> The question is, do you really care about size acceptance or just don't want to be singled out?



vardon, the first half of that question has been answered numerous times on these forums. 


Sexual gratification does not equal caring about or contributing anything whatsoever to size acceptance.

Encouraging someone (be they male or female) to gain weight or to stuff their stomach does not equal caring about or contributing anything whatsoever to size acceptance.

Rubbing someone's belly or giving a fat person physical attention or physical affection does not equal caring about or contributing anything whatsoever to size acceptance.

Telling a fat person that they are sexy or that they look good does not equal caring about or contributing whatsoever to size acceptance.

Telling a fat person they are sexy or hot or desirable with the sole intent being personal sexual gratification or as an attempt at getting in someone's pants does not equal caring about or contributing anything whatsoever to size acceptance.

Taking a fat person out to eat, or feeding them behind closed doors, or sending them food or gift cards for food, or buying or sending them gifts does not equal caring about or contributing anything whatsoever to size acceptance.

Complimenting a fat person about their body when you are sexually attracted to them does not equal caring about or contributing anything whatsoever to size acceptance. Sure, it might make the fat person feel appreciated as an *individual* but that in and of itself has nothing to do with size acceptance as a whole.

You could even change size acceptance to fat acceptance and the result would stay the same.


All too often certain individuals are either confused, don't know the difference, or mistakingly believe that sweet talking a fat individual into feeling momentarily sexy is doing something positive for size acceptance. Even if it helps the fat individual to begin to feel confident about their body it is not doing anything for size acceptance as a whole. Telling a fat person they are attractive or sexy does not change the world that the fat person lives in; nor does it change society's perception of fat people. A fat admirerer's sexuality or aspects of a feeder's sexuality, fetish, or kink are not what size acceptance is about. Size acceptance and fat acceptance is about making the world and society a safer place for fat individuals and a place free of preconceived notions about those fat individuals; or at least it should be.


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## Angel

FA Punk said:


> Kevin would only be jealous if those other members were paysite models, normal people mean nothing to him.





KHayes666 said:


> Today a normal friend and I caught a local baseball game before he went to work so there goes that theory.



hmmmm....

so.....

there are paysite models.... and fat women....

and there are "normal" people and "normal friend" (s).

Very interesting. 








Not like any of us have noticed that multiple times before.


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## vardon_grip

Angel said:


> vardon, the first half of that question has been answered numerous times on these forums.
> 
> 
> Sexual gratification does not equal caring about or contributing anything whatsoever to size acceptance.
> 
> Encouraging someone (be they male or female) to gain weight or to stuff their stomach does not equal caring about or contributing anything whatsoever to size acceptance.
> 
> Rubbing someone's belly or giving a fat person physical attention or physical affection does not equal caring about or contributing anything whatsoever to size acceptance.
> 
> Telling a fat person that they are sexy or that they look good does not equal caring about or contributing whatsoever to size acceptance.
> 
> Telling a fat person they are sexy or hot or desirable with the sole intent being personal sexual gratification or as an attempt at getting in someone's pants does not equal caring about or contributing anything whatsoever to size acceptance.
> 
> Taking a fat person out to eat, or feeding them behind closed doors, or sending them food or gift cards for food, or buying or sending them gifts does not equal caring about or contributing anything whatsoever to size acceptance.
> 
> Complimenting a fat person about their body when you are sexually attracted to them does not equal caring about or contributing anything whatsoever to size acceptance. Sure, it might make the fat person feel appreciated as an *individual* but that in and of itself has nothing to do with size acceptance as a whole.
> 
> You could even change size acceptance to fat acceptance and the result would stay the same.
> 
> 
> All too often certain individuals are either confused, don't know the difference, or mistakingly believe that sweet talking a fat individual into feeling momentarily sexy is doing something positive for size acceptance. Even if it helps the fat individual to begin to feel confident about their body it is not doing anything for size acceptance as a whole. Telling a fat person they are attractive or sexy does not change the world that the fat person lives in; nor does it change society's perception of fat people. A fat admirerer's sexuality or aspects of a feeder's sexuality, fetish, or kink are not what size acceptance is about. Size acceptance and fat acceptance is about making the world and society a safer place for fat individuals and a place free of preconceived notions about those fat individuals; or at least it should be.



You should not be seen talking to me. I have been declared to be an enemy of women and of size acceptance. 

On a serious note:
I hear what you are saying. I have read some people on this board say that doing all of things you describe makes them the strongest supporters of size acceptance. Why do you think there is such a disconnect?


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## Tracyarts

" Telling a fat person they are attractive or sexy does not change the world that the fat person lives in; nor does it change society's perception of fat people. "

Truth and reality.

Knowing that there are men who find my body attractive gives me a little bit of an ego boost and makes me feel a little bit more confident in my skin and in my clothes. Which is great.

But...

Knowing that there are men who find my body attractive did nothing to help me when I was facing a medical crisis and received a substandard level of care (that could have cost me my life) solely because of my size.

Knowing that there are men who find my body attractive did nothing to help me when I was outright and openly denied jobs I was more than qualified for because the employer felt that my size either made me slow and lazy, or visually off-putting to customers and clients. 

Knowing that there are men who find my body attractive did nothing to help me when I was denied a chair and table instead of all in one seat and desk in a classroom because the director told me that they were under no legal obligation to provide accomodations for size alone.

Flattery and admiration feels good. But as far as helping you make it through the serious realities of life in a fat body? There's not enough substance there, it's just a bunch of fluff. Fun fluff, but fluff all the same.

Tracy


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## LoveBHMS

Angel said:


> vardon, the first half of that question has been answered numerous times on these forums.
> 
> 
> Sexual gratification does not equal caring about or contributing anything whatsoever to size acceptance.
> 
> Encouraging someone (be they male or female) to gain weight or to stuff their stomach does not equal caring about or contributing anything whatsoever to size acceptance.
> 
> Rubbing someone's belly or giving a fat person physical attention or physical affection does not equal caring about or contributing anything whatsoever to size acceptance.
> 
> Telling a fat person that they are sexy or that they look good does not equal caring about or contributing whatsoever to size acceptance.
> 
> Telling a fat person they are sexy or hot or desirable with the sole intent being personal sexual gratification or as an attempt at getting in someone's pants does not equal caring about or contributing anything whatsoever to size acceptance.
> 
> Taking a fat person out to eat, or feeding them behind closed doors, or sending them food or gift cards for food, or buying or sending them gifts does not equal caring about or contributing anything whatsoever to size acceptance.
> 
> Complimenting a fat person about their body when you are sexually attracted to them does not equal caring about or contributing anything whatsoever to size acceptance. Sure, it might make the fat person feel appreciated as an *individual* but that in and of itself has nothing to do with size acceptance as a whole.
> 
> You could even change size acceptance to fat acceptance and the result would stay the same.
> 
> 
> All too often certain individuals are either confused, don't know the difference, or mistakingly believe that sweet talking a fat individual into feeling momentarily sexy is doing something positive for size acceptance. Even if it helps the fat individual to begin to feel confident about their body it is not doing anything for size acceptance as a whole. Telling a fat person they are attractive or sexy does not change the world that the fat person lives in; nor does it change society's perception of fat people. A fat admirerer's sexuality or aspects of a feeder's sexuality, fetish, or kink are not what size acceptance is about. Size acceptance and fat acceptance is about making the world and society a safer place for fat individuals and a place free of preconceived notions about those fat individuals; or at least it should be.



I can't speak for anyone else, but I've never claimed to be an SA activist. Many feedists aren't and that includes the fat ones. A gaining friend of mine said when he gets too fat for one airline seat he fully expects to pay for two. Another online friend who yes, happens to have a paysite said she doesn't think fat people should get special treatment. Given that we've just agreed that NAAFA can be anti-feeder, you should fully expect feedists to not be worried over SA since they're two different things.

But as I said upthread, any affect feederism or being an FA has is positive. Not because I'm helping the fat person by saying he's hot, but rather because it shows society that fatties can be hot. I work at a bar. Whenever a coworker points out a hot guy I mention I'm into fat dudes. When our hostess's fat husband came in, I told her she was really lucky. Whether or not all that is enough? I don't really care.


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## vardon_grip

LoveBHMS said:


> I can't speak for anyone else, but I've never claimed to be an SA activist. Many feedists aren't and that includes the fat ones. A gaining friend of mine said when he gets too fat for one airline seat he fully expects to pay for two. Another online friend who yes, happens to have a paysite said she doesn't think fat people should get special treatment. Given that we've just agreed that NAAFA can be anti-feeder, you should fully expect feedists to not be worried over SA since they're two different things.
> 
> But as I said upthread, any affect feederism or being an FA has is positive. Not because I'm helping the fat person by saying he's hot, but rather because it shows society that fatties can be hot. I work at a bar. Whenever a coworker points out a hot guy I mention I'm into fat dudes. When our hostess's fat husband came in, I told her she was really lucky. Whether or not all that is enough? I don't really care.



If you have no stake or desire to participate in size acceptance then why get upset over NAAFA's stance on feederism? I know that you think your fetish was misrepresented as you define it, but wanting recognition from an organization that you don't care about nor want to be part of is ridiculous. You didn't want to have anything to do with the club until you were told you couldn't be in the club.


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## FA Punk

Angel said:


> hmmmm....
> 
> so.....
> 
> there are paysite models.... and fat women....
> 
> and there are "normal" people and "normal friend" (s).
> 
> Very interesting.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Not like any of us have noticed that multiple times before.



It won't let me rep'ya and for that I'm sorry.


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## LoveBHMS

vardon_grip said:


> If you have no stake or desire to participate in size acceptance then why get upset over NAAFA's stance on feederism? I know that you think your fetish was misrepresented as you define it, but wanting recognition from an organization that you don't care about nor want to be part of is ridiculous. You didn't want to have anything to do with the club until you were told you couldn't be in the club.



I don't care fuck all about Naafa. It's not about Naafa. Lots of pro-choice voters don't like the Republican Party's stand on abortion even though they're not Republicans.


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## fiddypence

I think there's a really interesting argument at the heart of this thread, despite the various flame wars.

Although, I agree that extreme feedism can be destructive, I don't think it has much of an impact on society's view of fat people. I think that most people view obese people as possibly lazy or in denial. I don't think people assume that they are getting fat because they are trying to.

Having said that...

I think that, in a way, "size acceptance" is linked to feminism. Anti-fat stigma in this country is directed against women more so than men. I don't think I'm breaking any new ground here when I say that this is because being "attractive" is important to a woman.

When women are not only fat, but are *gasp* happy that they are fat, then they are flouting male authority in a sense. They are finding happiness/acceptance independently from their physical appearance or in a manner that is not explicitly pleasing to a man.

All of that gets destroyed when the women is now pressured in the other direction. If a woman is once again altering her appearance because of a male standard, then that freedom is gone. It's definitely not the case that all FA/BBW relationships are like this, but there is nothing empowering about telling someone they are beautiful _because_ they are fat.


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## CastingPearls

Angel said:


> vardon, the first half of that question has been answered numerous times on these forums.
> 
> 
> Sexual gratification does not equal caring about or contributing anything whatsoever to size acceptance.
> 
> Encouraging someone (be they male or female) to gain weight or to stuff their stomach does not equal caring about or contributing anything whatsoever to size acceptance.
> 
> Rubbing someone's belly or giving a fat person physical attention or physical affection does not equal caring about or contributing anything whatsoever to size acceptance.
> 
> Telling a fat person that they are sexy or that they look good does not equal caring about or contributing whatsoever to size acceptance.
> 
> Telling a fat person they are sexy or hot or desirable with the sole intent being personal sexual gratification or as an attempt at getting in someone's pants does not equal caring about or contributing anything whatsoever to size acceptance.
> 
> Taking a fat person out to eat, or feeding them behind closed doors, or sending them food or gift cards for food, or buying or sending them gifts does not equal caring about or contributing anything whatsoever to size acceptance.
> 
> Complimenting a fat person about their body when you are sexually attracted to them does not equal caring about or contributing anything whatsoever to size acceptance. Sure, it might make the fat person feel appreciated as an *individual* but that in and of itself has nothing to do with size acceptance as a whole.
> 
> You could even change size acceptance to fat acceptance and the result would stay the same.
> 
> 
> All too often certain individuals are either confused, don't know the difference, or mistakingly believe that sweet talking a fat individual into feeling momentarily sexy is doing something positive for size acceptance. Even if it helps the fat individual to begin to feel confident about their body it is not doing anything for size acceptance as a whole. Telling a fat person they are attractive or sexy does not change the world that the fat person lives in; nor does it change society's perception of fat people. A fat admirerer's sexuality or aspects of a feeder's sexuality, fetish, or kink are not what size acceptance is about. Size acceptance and fat acceptance is about making the world and society a safer place for fat individuals and a place free of preconceived notions about those fat individuals; or at least it should be.


I'm sorry I couldn't rep you for this post although rep isn't enough. It deserves applause.


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## vardon_grip

LoveBHMS said:


> I don't care fuck all about Naafa. It's not about Naafa. Lots of pro-choice voters don't like the Republican Party's stand on abortion even though they're not Republicans.



I like your comparison with Republicans, but unlike any major political party, NAAFA has no real power to affect and effect laws, taxes, policy etc...yet. I understand that you don't give a f*ck about the NAAFA's and yet you are angered by the NAAFA's stance against feederism. So how does NAAFA's stance really affect you? Maybe you are angered or afraid that the NAAFA is going to cramp your lifestyle by helping (or from your views-creating prejudice against feeders) fat people to be self aware and confident. It can be very difficult to influence a confident and self aware person. In effect, NAAFA is cock-blocking your swerve.


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## LoveBHMS

vardon_grip said:


> I like your comparison with Republicans, but unlike any major political party, NAAFA has no real power to affect and effect laws, taxes, policy etc...yet. I understand that you don't give a f*ck about the NAAFA's and yet you are angered by the NAAFA's stance against feederism. So how does NAAFA's stance really affect you? Maybe you are angered or afraid that the NAAFA is going to cramp your lifestyle by helping (or from your views-creating prejudice against feeders) fat people to be self aware and confident. It can be very difficult to influence a confident and self aware person. In effect, NAAFA is cock-blocking your swerve.



Yes that is it. Once feedees get self aware and confident they won't be feedees anymore. No seriously.....how stupid are you? Feedees are feedees long before they meet me or anyone else. I don't aim to influence anyone; most feedees knew what they were for years. You don't think feedees are confident or self aware? Really? You must be new here. Feederism has nothing to do with influencing anyone. The idea that naafa is cock bllocking me is literally the most silly thing I've ever seen on this site.


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## fatgirlflyin

KHayes666 said:


> Sir Vardon also continues to dodge the fact...yes...a proven fact...that he is on a size acceptance website and he photoshops pictures to make women look smaller. Not exactly acceptance is it?
> 
> .



A job is a job, and not everyone has the luxury to decide to up and leave a stable job because they may not like a requirement of their job, especially in today's economy!


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## FA Punk

LoveBHMS said:


> Yes that is it. Once feedees get self aware and confident they won't be feedees anymore. No seriously.....how stupid are you? Feedees are feedees long before they meet me or anyone else. I don't aim to influence anyone; most feedees knew what they were for years. You don't think feedees are confident or self aware? Really? You must be new here. Feederism has nothing to do with influencing anyone. The idea that naafa is cock bllocking me is literally the most silly thing I've ever seen on this site.



It's a fetish not a sexual orientation:doh:.


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## vardon_grip

LoveBHMS said:


> Yes that is it. Once feedees get self aware and confident they won't be feedees anymore. No seriously.....how stupid are you? Feedees are feedees long before they meet me or anyone else. I don't aim to influence anyone; most feedees knew what they were for years. You don't think feedees are confident or self aware? Really? You must be new here. Feederism has nothing to do with influencing anyone. The idea that naafa is cock bllocking me is literally the most silly thing I've ever seen on this site.



Self awareness and confidence are just my interpretations of NAAFA"s stance on feederism. YMMV

_NAAFA'S OFFICIAL POSITION:
FEEDERISM
NAAFA supports an individual's right to control all choices concerning his or her own body. INFLUENCE NAAFA opposes the practice of feeders, in which one partner in a sexual relationship expects and encourages INFLUENCE another partner to gain weight.
NAAFA ADVOCATES:
&#8226;	That all bodies, of all sizes, are joyous and that individuals of all sizes can and should expect and demand respect from sexual partners for their bodies just as they are. SELF AWARENESS
&#8226;	That individuals who seek sexual partners accept and celebrate the current weight of their partner as one aspect of the whole person. CONFIDENCE
&#8226;	That people of all sizes become empowered CONFIDENT AND SELF AWARE to demand respect for their bodies in the context of sexual relationships, without attempting to lose or gain weight in order to win a partner's approval or attract or retain that partner's desire.
NAAFA RESOLVES TO:
&#8226;	Educate its membership and the public about individuals' right to be respected CONFIDENCE and admired in their sexual relationships without being expected to change their weight by either losing or gaining weight.
&#8226;	Advocate for people who have been pressured to lose or gain weight by sexual partners. Support people of all sizes in demanding respect for their current weight in all of their relationships, sexual or otherwise._

I threw out the cock blocking theory because you have denied everything else why you are so angry at NAAFA over its stance on feederism.

You are not fat
You don't care about NAAFA
You don't want to be a part of NAAFA
You don't care about size acceptance activism 
They are wrong with their viewpoint
NAAFA's viewpoint has no affect on your fetish practice/lifestyle


Why are you giving something you say you care absolutely nothing about so much power over you?

That is stupid.






I know, I know...I don't get it. I am sorry that I do not understand you.


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## GordoNegro

I think sometimes people let their opinions rule over everything and cannot truly see. Naafa used to be alot stronger, especially years ago when wls was not an option and some reluctant 'fatties' were forced to deal with their issues as opposed to a cosmetic life altering change that has been successful, but by itself did not clear the initial issues that plagued some who underwent the proceedure. (Hence at some bbw parties where some former fatties still flock to/attend as they don't feel accepted at the other clubs where they can blend in easier).

NAAFA wasn't perfect but it allowed those who felt isolated, the chance to be together, share common thoughts/goals. People who were world's apart were able to come together as they started get togethers and meets before the big girl parties became popular and profitable.

Yes, I felt blighted with Naafa's anti-feeder stance, but I understood as it was for the greater good. Being pro-feeder would have had the movement be seen as too militant and cost itself members plus open the door to alot of other things, taking away from its initial focus.

Though Naafa may have diminished, it allowed people to experience what they may never had especially back in its first few years with the pool parties, dances and such. Naafa allowed me to see my present doctor knowing he was on the fat friendly list that goes state to state, knowing I needed to change practitioners when I felt friction back then much less now.

I would also like to say that; some here have a misguided view of the Paysite models. Yes, some models do have that genuine desire to flaunt their fat like the Maxim counterparts but some have bills/cosmetic surgeries to pay for..hence the disappearing act or don't return at all. Appreciate the imagery while you have them.

For the recent Dr Oz episode, something is indeed up as I'm not sure how someone planning to gain from their first meeting, mysteriously dropped 160+lbs to the episode that aired yesterday.

Finally, I have to say reading posts and remarks here that some are in deep denial over their feelings and desires. Feederism/Feedism/Encouraging may have light hearted roots for some, like the Pigs is Pigs/Violet Beauregarde-Inflationist side some were exposed to while growing up but there are very dark roots as well. The name calling, insults, struggles, humiliation/embarassing moments, helplessness, lack of ability, shortened life span (for some) are the dark side.
I can see why some try to stay light-hearted from a moral standpoint, but its condescending to villify those consenting to its darker nature as its the same coin. You don't want to throw out the baby with the bathwater, but you still need bathwater for the baby.


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## LoveBHMS

FA Punk said:


> It's a fetish not a sexual orientation:doh:.



Right. And people that have the fetish know about it long before they meet a feeder. My point is there are feedees and they are not victims. There are fetishists who want to be fat, want to be fed, want to be stuffed, want to gain either in fantasy or reality. There are feedees who actively seek out feeders to satisfy them. It isn't about making somebody fat or changing somebody who is satisfied with his or her body. Feederism is about both people involved.


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## Webmaster

Okay folks, 500 posts on this is enough, especially since a lot of it was simply arguing back and forth and a good bunch of most unbecoming namecalling. 

This is Dimensions, Where Big is Beautiful. If preferring fat is just a "fetish" to some, so be it. To the great majority of us, fat is beautiful. Fat people are beautiful, and they are our beloved fellow human beings, friends, lovers and partners.


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