# bbws subjected to more "Hate"?



## StarMoon (Oct 11, 2008)

Is is just me or are bbws subjected to more hate that your everyday bhm? Being a fat guy myself I do not remember being told anything extremely venomous to my face or behind my back about my weight. However I see alot of "hate" (best word that describes it) directed toward women in the media, on the net etc. but never the the opposite happening. Does anyone have any similar experiences with what I am saying?


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## space_dazee (Oct 11, 2008)

I've thought that myself too. It kind of hit me when I was watching TV sitcoms. I see a lot of the husbands being bigger guys and the wives being slender and "pretty"... Where are the bigger wives with the toned husbands?

Also with descriptions. Growing up I'd hear BHMs described as cuddly and 'like a teddy bear'. The nicest I was called was "pleasantly plump" and for some reason it made me feel like a hot dog.. and that was when I was at my smallest size!


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## William (Oct 11, 2008)

Hi 

Person to Person Women will always get more abuse than Men on any issue. 

Fat Men are getting slaughtered by all the negative advertisements about hormones, sex drive, mobility and body shape (moobs).

Fat Women as well as Smaller Women are still the center of attraction for the TV Diet Ads.

William 




StarMoon said:


> Is is just me or are bbws subjected to more hate that your everyday bhm? Being a fat guy myself I do not remember being told anything extremely venomous to my face or behind my back about my weight. However I see alot of "hate" (best word that describes it) directed toward women in the media, on the net etc. but never the the opposite happening. Does anyone have any similar experiences with what I am saying?


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## Shosh (Oct 11, 2008)

In a word yes! There is more societal pressure brought to bear on women to be seen as the perfect physical speciman. Women have to endure and live with this pressure on a constant basis.Women are also compared to each other on the basis of looks and material possessions and husbands etc etc.

That is not to say that BHM'S do not face discrimination, it is just nowhere near as relentless as what BBW'S have to face.

I don't even want to think about the horrible verbal abuse that I went through for years about my weight. It just hurts.


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## LalaCity (Oct 11, 2008)

I really don't know -- I've never been a BHM. I know a lot of bigger guys feel the same low self-esteem that fat women feel, that they are judged and dismissed as not fulfilling an ideal state of masculinity...I know from reading these boards that there is a lot of pain in growing up as a big guy, as well.

But the sheer hatred that is directed toward heavier women daily by our society does not seem to be equally leveled at fat men. After all, heavier guys are still allowed to play romantic leads in movies and on tv shows, whereas this is utterly forbidden territory for women.


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## William (Oct 11, 2008)

Hi Dazee

Well in entertainment Fat Men get more insults in Movies for example in Tombstone Wyatt called a gambler a "Fat Tub of Lard" which would not be in the script for a Fat Female Character. There are plenty of "Fat tub of Lard" comments in movies over the years or the "greasy/eating" comments. Still I think that a part for a Fat Female would be written in a way to not be appealing. 

In a lot of novels where we can "see" what a character is thinking Fat Men receive a lot of derogatory comments and perceptions.

I think that in public people are just more vocal about what they think of Fat Women. Maybe because Men may get violent, they get bothered less 

William

PS I am not suggesting that Fat People start "busting a cap in the butts" of Fat-o-phobics 





space_dazee said:


> I've thought that myself too. It kind of hit me when I was watching TV sitcoms. I see a lot of the husbands being bigger guys and the wives being slender and "pretty"... Where are the bigger wives with the toned husbands?
> 
> Also with descriptions. Growing up I'd hear BHMs described as cuddly and 'like a teddy bear'. The nicest I was called was "pleasantly plump" and for some reason it made me feel like a hot dog.. and that was when I was at my smallest size!


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## B68 (Oct 11, 2008)

It is weird indeed. Maybe it has something to do with the fact that men themselves don't really care the way they look. Society has tried to create male rollmodels as well, but it never got to us.

Let us drink beer and have fun. 

And maybe it has something to do with the fact that a woman is a more sexual and esthetic being because of her shape. The bigger the female curves become, the stronger their sexual presence becomes. This actually causes a lot of jalousy in slim women towards big women. And it scares some men who don't like to be overwhelmed.


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## No-No-Badkitty (Oct 11, 2008)

Well, if you think about it it make sense. 

Women have always been under the media and social pressure for perfection. Perfection FOR the MAN. I can remember reading some old articles in a woman's magazine that talked about how women should greet their husbands when they come home for work. How we should have their meals prepared and the house perfect for them, and be ready to please them...
I was left thinking...what am I a dog?

Any how....women who go against this grain have always been persecuted. Not just fat women...any woman that does not fit this society "norm". Although things are changing, and a hell of a lot better than they were, but the fact is women can be their own worst enemy as well...as in my experience women can be the worst abusers of the bunch.


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## Dr. Feelgood (Oct 11, 2008)

I think there are at least two factors at work here. First, in most European and Asian cultures, women -- upper-class women, that is -- are regarded primarily as ornaments. The phrase "trophy wife" says it all. Among the haves -- whom the have-nots struggle to imitate -- the man is supposed to run the show, while the woman serves as his status symbol. Consequently, women are judged on their appearance, men on their wealth and power.

Secondly, little girls are taught to refrain from violence, whereas little boys are allowed, if not actively encouraged, to fight. And when a guy who weighs 300 pounds punches you in the nose, it carries a lot of momentum.


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## Andy_McP (Oct 11, 2008)

BBWs are one of the most commonly ridiculed groups in Western society. Overt misogyny is mostly unacceptable now, unless of course it is directed towards fat women.

This has lead to many women to view fat as nothing short of a social abyss. As a result many go to war with their own bodies, depriving themselves of food in a manner akin to self-abuse. People at war with their own bodies are very easy to control and manipulate.

For instance, my friend Pamela once ate nothing but oranges for a month in an effort to loose weight. Unsurprisingly, she fell ill as a result. More shockingly, another of my friends decided to console a woman with serve morning sickness by informing her that she was lucky, as she would not have to loose any weight after the birth.:shocked:

Despite the obvious nature of this phenomenon, it remains sadly neglected by some feminists. However, not feminists neglect his issue. I am desperate to get my hands on a book called "The Tyranny of Slenderness" (http://blogcritics.org/archives/2005/06/14/143250.php). My pal Charlotte has a copy and I waiting for her to lend me it!


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## Jon Blaze (Oct 11, 2008)

In everyday life, I honestly think it varies, just like perceptions of size vary depending on area. I would say more on a general level, however.

As for the media: I agree. But not directly I'd say. Fat men in the media tend to have the role of a comedic husband, wise cracking side kick, so on and so forth. They tend to have something to fallback on more commonly. That role isn't positive, but fat women unfortunately get the burden of always being considered unattractive from what I've been seeing, and that's the butt of jokes, et cetera et cetera. That's also the reason for my comment about general level social interactions.

Granted, I'm hearing a lot of exceptions to the rule (Like when I told my airmen in tech school, and they went all anti-skinny on me to my surprise lol), but it's not enough for me to think it's balanced quite yet.


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## StarMoon (Oct 11, 2008)

Here's a question for the ladies, how are bigger guys viewed in female circles?


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## tonynyc (Oct 11, 2008)

StarMoon said:


> Here's a question for the ladies, how are bigger guys viewed in female circles?



*Like a wrasslin match *


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## No-No-Badkitty (Oct 11, 2008)

StarMoon said:


> Here's a question for the ladies, how are bigger guys viewed in female circles?




I'm not sure if I am a good person to try and answer this...but in my experience...thin women don't seem to be as put off about fat guys. I've known several thin girls who are "fat phobic" that have no problems dating bigger guys...and at the same time I have known bigger guys who were "fat phobic" when it comes to women...no...figure that one out???


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## olwen (Oct 11, 2008)

LalaCity said:


> I really don't know -- I've never been a BHM. I know a lot of bigger guys feel the same low self-esteem that fat women feel, that they are judged and dismissed as not fulfilling an ideal state of masculinity...I know from reading these boards that there is a lot of pain in growing up as a big guy, as well.
> 
> But the sheer hatred that is directed toward heavier women daily by our society does not seem to be equally leveled at fat men. After all, heavier guys are still allowed to play romantic leads in movies and on tv shows, whereas this is utterly forbidden territory for women.



I second this. Every word.


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## olwen (Oct 11, 2008)

B68 said:


> It is weird indeed. Maybe it has something to do with the fact that men themselves don't really care the way they look. Society has tried to create male rollmodels as well, but it never got to us.
> 
> Let us drink beer and have fun.
> 
> And maybe it has something to do with the fact that a woman is a more sexual and esthetic being because of her shape. The bigger the female curves become, the stronger their sexual presence becomes. This actually causes a lot of jalousy in slim women towards big women. And it scares some men who don't like to be overwhelmed.



I disagree somewhat. I think men do care about what they look like. I think they care a great deal. I just think it is a bit more taboo for men to express those kinds of concerns out of fear that it is somehow not manly to do so. Like it's more manly to face your problems on your own without input or help from anybody. That just seems silly to me. 

I don't think it's that the female from is more aesthetically pleasing all around, I just think female bodies are held under more open scrutiny and because of that people become very very vocal about the female form, and that scrutiny isn't always questioned. It's taken as folk wisdom and handed down. I must say tho, I had never thought of curves as more womanly until I heard FAs say such things many years ago, but at the same time, I did think that a supermodel's body would be not so feminine....I just didn't connect the dots right away.


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## steely (Oct 11, 2008)

I have a nephew who is fat.His brother was fat as well.They had such different personalities about it.The older brother never worried about his weight and wasn't really bothered about his weight.His classmates just rolled with it.

The younger brother is more sensitive about his weight and gets picked on all the time.Until he got big enough for the other kids to be afraid of him.In guys,IMO,it all depends on how you carry it.How accepting you are of yourself.It's like the scent of fear.You're fair game.


Girls,I have found to be ruthless with each other.Not guys so much.Most girls I've known in my life,I'd rather not have.It's competition for everything.


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## Surlysomething (Oct 11, 2008)

William said:


> Fat Men are getting slaughtered by all the negative advertisements about hormones, sex drive, mobility and body shape (moobs).


 

I've NEVER seen that.


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## olwen (Oct 11, 2008)

No-No-Badkitty said:


> Well, if you think about it it make sense.
> 
> Women have always been under the media and social pressure for perfection. Perfection FOR the MAN. I can remember reading some old articles in a woman's magazine that talked about how women should greet their husbands when they come home for work. How we should have their meals prepared and the house perfect for them, and be ready to please them...
> I was left thinking...what am I a dog?
> ...



There is a song - a standard called Wives and Lovers. The lyrics go something like: 

Hey, little girl, comb your hair, fix your make-up, soon he will open the door,
Don't think because there's a ring on your finger, you needn't try any more.
For wives should always be lovers too,
Run to his arms the moment that he comes home to you.
I'm warning you,
Day after day, there are girls at the office and the men will always be men,
Don't send him off, with your hair still in curlers, you may never see him again.
For wives should always be lovers too,
Run to his arms the moment he comes home to you.
He's almost here. 
Hey, little girl, better wear something pretty,
Something you'd wear to go to the city,
Dim all the lights, pour the wine, start the music, time to get ready for love.
Time to get ready for love, I'm talkin bout love
oh oh oh love
For love.


or something like that....I actually like this song. It's ridiculous in a silly way. It's full of scmaltzy sentiments, but the melody is catchy. It seems quaint, and thank goodness for that.


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## furious styles (Oct 11, 2008)

well yes, we live in an oppressive and dogmatic culture that bases it's standards of merit / value on hyperbolic male fantasies. power. money. skinny women.


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## Green Eyed Fairy (Oct 11, 2008)

No-No-Badkitty said:


> Well, if you think about it it make sense.
> 
> Women have always been under the media and social pressure for perfection. Perfection FOR the MAN. I can remember reading some old articles in a woman's magazine that talked about how women should greet their husbands when they come home for work. How we should have their meals prepared and the house perfect for them, and be ready to please them...
> I was left thinking...what am I a dog?



Ever read "The Feminine Mystique" by Betty Freidan?
She starts her book out with a thorough examination of how women were portrayed in the media back in her time....and she breaks it all down into the historical events/reactions of then. 
She is impressive.....with razor sharp insight and humor. She made me laugh...even while I was growing angry at what she was clearly defining. 
Good read 



No-No-Badkitty said:


> Any how....women who go against this grain have always been persecuted. Not just fat women...any woman that does not fit this society "norm". Although things are changing, and a hell of a lot better than they were, *but the fact is women can be their own worst enemy as well...as in my experience women can be the worst abusers of the bunch*.



I have to agree with this to some extent- we undercut each other a lot....not all but some...
I listen to women that always down other women, seeming to buy into all the stereo-types tossed at us....they don't like themselves that much, it seems........how can they? 



olwen said:


> I disagree somewhat. I think men do care about what they look like. I think they care a great deal. I just think it is a bit more taboo for men to express those kinds of concerns out of fear that it is somehow not manly to do so. Like it's more manly to face your problems on your own without input or help from anybody. That just seems silly to me.
> 
> I don't think it's that the female from is more aesthetically pleasing all around,* I just think female bodies are held under more open scrutiny and because of that people become very very vocal about the female form, and that scrutiny isn't always questioned. *It's taken as folk wisdom and handed down. I must say tho, I had never thought of curves as more womanly until I heard FAs say such things many years ago, but at the same time, I did think that a supermodel's body would be not so feminine....I just didn't connect the dots right away.



This might go back to that same old thinking that women's bodies are "community property". 
However, I did like how B68 broke it down.... from the viewpoint that society's "dislike" or phobia is fear driven.....aren't phobias/biases fear driven? It's just figuring out the fear of what exactly and why that might get muddled.....


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## olwen (Oct 12, 2008)

Green Eyed Fairy said:


> (snipped).....This might go back to that same old thinking that women's bodies are "community property".
> However, I did like how B68 broke it down.... from the viewpoint that society's "dislike" or phobia is fear driven.....aren't phobias/biases fear driven? It's just figuring out the fear of what exactly and why that might get muddled.....



I did too. I probably should Have said I agreed with that part. :doh:

I can understand male fear and intimidation since I've certainly experienced that first hand, more than once, and the concept of "Vagina Dentata" had to come from somewhere. And I can understand any resentful feelings a man might have over the power the female form can have over his libido. Some guys just can't hide it when they are attracted, I wonder if they know we can tell when they are. I suspect that a few just can't and would be shocked to know that we can. 

I have a little trouble with the thought that thin women are jealous of fat women...I'm not saying it doesn't happen and it certainly makes sense. I'm just not sure why a thin woman would need to be jealous of a fat woman, when in many instances it's to her advantage to be thin. I guess that would only make sense if she were going to extremes to maintain a slim figure....


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## Green Eyed Fairy (Oct 12, 2008)

olwen said:


> I have a little trouble with the thought that thin women are jealous of fat women...I'm not saying it doesn't happen and it certainly makes sense. I'm just not sure why a thin woman would need to be jealous of a fat woman, when in many instances it's to her advantage to be thin. I guess that would only make sense if she were going to extremes to maintain a slim figure....



I often time have the impression that when a thin women mocks a fatter one, it is a resentment/jealousy of some sort (just like it's always just instantly assumed must be the case when it's vice/versa). 
Thin women, some trying so hard to fit the mold laid out for them (some, not all) ......while some of us walk this earth just how we were made to be. We must seem fearless......  

I spent many years trying to bend into the mold myself....so yeah, I can see why they might hate the hell out of any bigger woman that loves herself and is happy......I can even see how some might go to the extreme to make sure we think we cannot be attractive/happy how we are. If we are happy this way, then what is all of her struggling for?

The fat phobic ones...........they might feel quite "weak" up beside some of us.....and who likes to be reminded of their weakness/vulnerability?


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## Fascinita (Oct 12, 2008)

William said:


> PS I am not suggesting that Fat People start "busting a cap in the butts" of Fat-o-phobics



lol That would be a sight, though.

Fat power. EXPLOSIVE fat power. Bringin' the pain.

Caps were _made_ for busting on the butts of Fat-o-phobics.


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## JMNYC (Oct 12, 2008)

I'm not a fan of her politics, but Sarah Palin was recently referred to as "fat" on a blog. It's misogyny at its plainest.

I was once in a seminar of about 30 people, and the moderator asked "How many women in here feel 'fat' from time to time?"

Every single female in the room raised her hand, including a 5-foot-tall, 93-pound jewelry designer.

It's ingrained from birth. 

The worst sin a woman can commit, to some people, isn't to slander others, to be selfish, to gossip or to be greedy; it's to gain 5-10 pounds. Or beyond.


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## B68 (Oct 12, 2008)

JMNYC said:


> ...a 5-foot-tall, 93-pound jewelry designer.



Sneeze and she's gone... oops... sorry!:doh:


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## Andy_McP (Oct 12, 2008)

JMNYC said:


> I was once in a seminar of about 30 people, and the moderator asked "How many women in here feel 'fat' from time to time?"
> 
> Every single female in the room raised her hand, including a 5-foot-tall, 93-pound jewelry designer.
> 
> It's ingrained from birth.



That example really illustrates the points that people have made here. It is also rather depressing


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## fiore (Oct 12, 2008)

LalaCity said:


> After all, heavier guys are still allowed to play romantic leads in movies and on tv shows, whereas this is utterly forbidden territory for women.



Absolutely. Big guys sure get a lot of jokes made at their expense, but at least they're allowed to be there for the joke. The fat lady never gets to make a snappy comeback, because she's not even on the screen. Having the guy there sometimes makes it feel like teasing among friends. Think of all the fat jokes that Saturday Night Live has done in the last 30+ years, with John Belushi, Horatio Sanz, Keenan Thompson, Chris Farley, etc etc. Think of how many times those fat men played fat women. And how many fat women castmembers have there been? I can't even think of any. (They've all been beautiful in general, whereas the men not so much, but i digress...) 

The thing that hurts about a fat lady joke on tv is that, just by looking at the people delivering the joke, you can tell that they really mean it. 

Bastards.


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## Your Plump Princess (Oct 13, 2008)

For Generations Women have been the focus of society's "Image" of Perfection. Sure, there's a general image of a "Perfect" Man. But it's more Mold-able than it is for the "perfect" woman. In the Public's Eye. 


Women have been, and will probably always be, the main focus for such things.

I Mean. Honestly. Look back in time. It's rarely mattered what shape the men have been. Only the women.


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## B68 (Oct 13, 2008)

fiore said:


> The thing that hurts about a fat lady joke on tv is that, just by looking at the people delivering the joke, you can tell that they really mean it.
> 
> Bastards.



Well, that's not allways true. I mostly worked with men only and there were a lot of jokes about women. And some about big women. When laughter stopped they noticed i wasn't laughing and then a long discussion followed.

I noticed that most of these guys had never really thought about the matter. They had nothing against fat people/fat women. They just went with the flow. Showing them there are different flows at least puzzled them for a while...

And those people on tv that make jokes at someones expence only do that if they know the stupid majority will laugh. People who's job it is to be on tv rarely say anything they really believe in.


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## Lovelyone (Oct 13, 2008)

Its all marketing. Women seem to be more worried about their outward appearances than men are. (I am by NO means saying that men are slobs, or untidy, unhygeinic,and so forth) I am only saying that women BUY more shit for their faces, waists, hips, legs, hands, arms, hair, etc. The worse the media makes them feel about themselves, the MORE they will buy their products. Its simple marketing logic. Ever notice how most diet advertisements involve WOMEN rather than men? Its cos that is the thing that most women are more insecure about. 

On the flip-side men are being inundated with penis growth meds, hair club for men, bowflex, and such, so maybe they are catching up a little on being bitch-slapped by the media.


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## 1300 Class (Oct 13, 2008)

> PS I am not suggesting that Fat People start "busting a cap in the butts" of Fat-o-phobics


I totally disagree with you. Someone says something. You say something back. Someone shouts, you shout back. Somone pushes, you push back. Someone punches, you punch back. You fight back. None of this appeasement driven non violent shit ever worked or solved any problems. Its only when they get a taste of their own medicine that the bastards/bitches out there will stop. Its about fighting back. Whether through your fists, tongue or actions, its about making a point and fighting back ever since. 

That being said, I'm not suggesting we form a compound and an agricultural society and issue militant proclomations or anything, just that a passive response to this sort of thing is how it becomes engrained and destroying.


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## William (Oct 13, 2008)

Hi 

I agree that Fat Men get fewer comments than Fat Women in public, magazines and etc, but there are no counter statements to merit Fat Acceptance general assumption that Fat Men have it so much easier in life in regards to their Fat. Maybe we have it easier because we are Men but that would happen at any weight. As a Fat Guy I do not get positive Fat Guy comments public or see positive Fat Guy comments in newspapers and magazines. I do not see disclaimers eliminating Fat Guys from comments about Fat People in general.

William





Your Plump Princess said:


> For Generations Women have been the focus of society's "Image" of Perfection. Sure, there's a general image of a "Perfect" Man. But it's more Mold-able than it is for the "perfect" woman. In the Public's Eye.
> 
> 
> Women have been, and will probably always be, the main focus for such things.
> ...


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## StarMoon (Oct 13, 2008)

I get the impression fat guys, fat girls are both made off but with men its more in a comedic sense (Homer Simpson, Peter Griffin) while with women (Tyra Banks in a fat suit) its plain venomous.


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## Roy C. (Oct 13, 2008)

I remember when I was young, my mother (a bbw) had a hispanic friend who was at that time a ssbbw. I was around one time when they were talking about dieting, and she said that her husband would not hear of her dieting. The reason was that in the culture of that day, a man's wealth and success was determined by the size of wife.

I believe that this way of thinking has gone away, but I have seen many more plump hispanic gals in the area lately, making me wonder if it is something that is coming back?


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## Surlysomething (Nov 2, 2008)

I was verbally assaulted today about my weight. That hasn't happened since I was a teenager. 

It was in traffic. I was a bit too centre in the side street for this fellow to go through with his mini-van. As he was telling me what I should do he also called me a #@&% idiot. I was stunned. I was going to back up and reposition my car for him but that made me stop. I'll admit, I told him to shut the %[email protected]# up, but that's when he threw out the 'lose some weight you fat ^%$#@ pig". "You're a disgusting pig" That's all he had to say to me. Over and over. 

I was enraged when I drove off. I actually thought about going back and giving him a beat-down. I was THAT mad. Like blind with rage mad. But i'm so stressed out with work and life that I couldn't wrap my head around it.

It almost ruined my whole day. Seriously. I even called my Mom. Haha. She was pissed but told me he wasn't worth the energy. I know that, but it was so brutal. My ego's been pretty fragile as it is lately and this just about sent me over the edge.

I really fear that if it happens next time I won't just drive off. 

(good thing it's been 20-some years since a similar incident has happened)


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## cute_obese_girl (Nov 2, 2008)

Surlysomething said:


> I've NEVER seen that.



Gotta agree. There are a lot of commercials for Viagra type drugs, but they all portray the men as happy, healthy and vital. I know many men who have no problems in that department and are still interested in those drugs to see if it would make a difference. If Viagra was for women the commercials would depict sad, lonely women in bad marriages. As for the other things that were listed I can't think of any examples.

To me the person to person stuff that women suffer is what is slaughtering. Advertising is slow and subtle, but again women are mostly the target for that as well. Men are sold entertainment like sports, beer, and women. Women are sold self-and home-improvement products. Be beautiful, keep a clean home, and provide delicious meals for your family or you won't get/keep a man!


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## Santaclear (Nov 2, 2008)

William said:


> ...PS I am not suggesting that Fat People start "busting a cap in the butts" of Fat-o-phobics



 ........


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## Shosh (Nov 2, 2008)

Surlysomething said:


> I was verbally assaulted today about my weight. That hasn't happened since I was a teenager.
> 
> It was in traffic. I was a bit too centre in the side street for this fellow to go through with his mini-van. As he was telling me what I should do he also called me a #@&% idiot. I was stunned. I was going to back up and reposition my car for him but that made me stop. I'll admit, I told him to shut the %[email protected]# up, but that's when he threw out the 'lose some weight you fat ^%$#@ pig". "You're a disgusting pig" That's all he had to say to me. Over and over.
> 
> ...



Gosh I am so sorry Tina. That is so horrible. What a jerk. Those kind of people are so pitiful because they have to abuse you about your weight as they do not have the intelect to engage in interaction on a higher level.

I want you to have a look at your many beautiful pics here, and reflect on your journey of self love and acceptance, and refocus your mind on all of those positives.

Let your mind be flooded with your beauty,the physical and the intellectual.

You are one of the sharpest and funniest people here bar none.

Put this man out of your mind, and refocus on all that is good and positive.

You are in a safe space here.

Love to you

Shosh


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## steely (Nov 2, 2008)

You tend to forget here,but not in the real world,sometimes not even here.You're fat it's just one of those things.You live with the ignorance and hate of some and not of others.It's probably the same with other people with differences.It's infuriating but you're not going to change anyones mind.So,you live your life the best you can because after all it is your life.:happy:


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## Fuzzy Necromancer (Nov 2, 2008)

Are bbws subjected to more hate than fat men?

Yup. D=


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## Surlysomething (Nov 2, 2008)

Susannah said:


> Those kind of people are so pitiful because they have to abuse you about your weight as they do not have the intelect to engage in interaction on a higher level.


 
Thanks, Susannah. I felt pretty bad about myself yesterday but then realized that what you wrote up there is exactly how it is. Instead of being charming or kind he played the hate card. Pretty pathetic.

Your kind words mean a lot to me though.


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## Surlysomething (Nov 2, 2008)

cute_obese_girl said:


> Gotta agree. There are a lot of commercials for Viagra type drugs, but they all portray the men as happy, healthy and vital. I know many men who have no problems in that department and are still interested in those drugs to see if it would make a difference. If Viagra was for women the commercials would depict sad, lonely women in bad marriages. As for the other things that were listed I can't think of any examples.
> 
> To me the person to person stuff that women suffer is what is slaughtering. Advertising is slow and subtle, but again women are mostly the target for that as well. Men are sold entertainment like sports, beer, and women. Women are sold self-and home-improvement products. Be beautiful, keep a clean home, and provide delicious meals for your family or you won't get/keep a man!


 

And it's been that way ever since they started this thing called "advertising". Check out all those late night infomercials. They're mostly about 'love connections' 'losing weight' or buying shit no one needs. What market is that aimed at?

I love the checkout counter. All the magazines extoling the virtues of anorexic models but right beside a big rack of candy.

:doh:


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## Smushygirl (Nov 2, 2008)

cute_obese_girl said:


> Gotta agree. There are a lot of commercials for Viagra type drugs, but they all portray the men as happy, healthy and vital. I know many men who have no problems in that department and are still interested in those drugs to see if it would make a difference. If Viagra was for women the commercials would depict sad, lonely women in bad marriages. As for the other things that were listed I can't think of any examples.
> 
> To me the person to person stuff that women suffer is what is slaughtering. Advertising is slow and subtle, but again women are mostly the target for that as well. Men are sold entertainment like sports, beer, and women. Women are sold self-and home-improvement products. Be beautiful, keep a clean home, and provide delicious meals for your family or you won't get/keep a man!



You are so right! My latest favorite commercial like that is for an antiperspirant. Picture a bride and groom lolling on a bed together after the reception, still in their wedding finery, smooching and hugging. The groom's nose comes dangerously close to the bride's armpit. The voiceover breaks in and says "it doesn't take much for a moment like this to get ruined, that's why you need new clinical strength ---------". 

WTF?! I am in my bridal finery and now I am being accused of being a stank ass? Like I didn't prepare for what was supposed to be the happiest day of my life? Like my husband is not going to sleep with me because my pits aren't fresh? Gahhhhh!!!! :doh:


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## superodalisque (Nov 2, 2008)

steely said:


> You tend to forget here,but not in the real world,sometimes not even here.You're fat it's just one of those things.You live with the ignorance and hate of some and not of others.It's probably the same with other people with differences.It's infuriating but you're not going to change anyones mind.So,you live your life the best you can because after all it is your life.:happy:




what steely said. and its was just road rage and really had nothing to do with your weight. i don't know if that helps you or not. if it wasn't your weight it would have been something else. you just would have been a red headead %@*&%@*. you were just the last something that he thought was in his way that day and he lost it. fat was just the thing he noticed about you first that he thought you might be sensitive about. thats how verbal abuse rolls. its not about you being fat. its about him having a life out of control and the need to vent on somebody else. try not to take it to heart if you can help it.


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## Surlysomething (Nov 2, 2008)

superodalisque said:


> what steely said. and its was just road rage and really had nothing to do with your weight. i don't know if that helps you or not. if it wasn't your weight it would have been something else. you just would have been a red headead %@*&%@*. you were just the last something that he thought was in his way that day and he lost it. fat was just the thing he noticed about you first that he thought you might be sensitive about. thats how verbal abuse rolls. its not about you being fat. its about him having a life out of control and the need to vent on somebody else. try not to take it to heart if you can help it.


 

Thanks. I think it just took me off guard. It was filled with such venom. But a day later I can see it for what it was. An asshole being an asshole.


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## superodalisque (Nov 2, 2008)

Surlysomething said:


> Thanks. I think it just took me off guard. It was filled with such venom. But a day later I can see it for what it was. An asshole being an asshole.



if people could learn how to vent about the things that urk them like you have here, instead of just being assholes we'd all be better off.:kiss2:


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## steely (Nov 2, 2008)

Yeah,I love womens magazines that have the front story,She Lost 75 Pounds And So Can You.The big picture in the middle is some decadent chocalate cake or incredible dessert.Talk about your mixed messages.


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## goodthings (Nov 3, 2008)

StarMoon said:


> Is is just me or are bbws subjected to more hate that your everyday bhm? Being a fat guy myself I do not remember being told anything extremely venomous to my face or behind my back about my weight. However I see alot of "hate" (best word that describes it) directed toward women in the media, on the net etc. but never the the opposite happening. Does anyone have any similar experiences with what I am saying?



hells ya, I cannot go a day without someone or something reminding me that I am defective due to my size


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## Your Plump Princess (Nov 3, 2008)

Surlysomething said:


> I was verbally assaulted today about my weight. That hasn't happened since I was a teenager.
> 
> It was in traffic. I was a bit too centre in the side street for this fellow to go through with his mini-van. As he was telling me what I should do he also called me a #@&% idiot. I was stunned. I was going to back up and reposition my car for him but that made me stop. I'll admit, I told him to shut the %[email protected]# up, but that's when he threw out the 'lose some weight you fat ^%$#@ pig". "You're a disgusting pig" That's all he had to say to me. Over and over.
> 
> ...


That's Horrible! 

Kudos to you keeping your cool! ... I would've opend my big mouth and told him something stupid like "I May Be 'FAT' But that's just more of me that can whoop yer ass!" 


Though I think it's quite sad that's all he could say to you.


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## vcrgrrl (Nov 3, 2008)

Yes, definitely! It seems like that is the very first thing people want to insult in a woman is her weight. Sighs*.


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## Victim (Nov 3, 2008)

Personally, I'd like to see BHM and BBW subjected to the exact same amount of hate. Zero.


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## Mack27 (Nov 3, 2008)

My mom would rather I was gay than an FA.


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## Green Eyed Fairy (Nov 3, 2008)

Mack27 said:


> My mom would rather I was gay than an FA.



What if you liked fat guys?  


I one time asked my mother if she would like me better if I was a crackhead since they are usually skinny....and nothing else that I do seems to matter as much as my weight. She got quiet for a minute......


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## JoeFA (Nov 8, 2008)

StarMoon said:


> Is is just me or are bbws subjected to more hate that your everyday bhm? Being a fat guy myself I do not remember being told anything extremely venomous to my face or behind my back about my weight. However I see alot of "hate" (best word that describes it) directed toward women in the media, on the net etc. but never the the opposite happening. Does anyone have any similar experiences with what I am saying?



Clearly you haven't been to a public school. It's the same for women as for men, though maybe the scale does lean more towards women than men (i wish it weren't so, but our society is still a slightly sexist one). Every fat person may experience it at some point in their life, but any will get criticism and those that pick on the fat ones are "taking the easy option" and venting any feelings they may have on those "inferior to them". Ignore these dickheads, they're immorale and are probably doing it to get a few more mates (or just some mates) and think they're being funny at the same time. So screw them, don't even mention them. They're inferior to you my friends.


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## William (Nov 8, 2008)

Hi Joe 

I will be the first to say that fat women get a lot more than just slightly more fat bias than Fat Men. 

What I do not agree with is all the conjectures created by people to fill in the gaps about the experiences of fat men that the above fact does not address.

William





JoeFA said:


> Clearly you haven't been to a public school. It's the same for women as for men, though maybe the scale does lean more towards women than men (i wish it weren't so, but our society is still a slightly sexist one). Every fat person may experience it at some point in their life, but any will get criticism and those that pick on the fat ones are "taking the easy option" and venting any feelings they may have on those "inferior to them". Ignore these dickheads, they're immorale and are probably doing it to get a few more mates (or just some mates) and think they're being funny at the same time. So screw them, don't even mention them. They're inferior to you my friends.


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## olwen (Nov 8, 2008)

William said:


> Hi Joe
> 
> I will be the first to say that fat women get a lot more than just slightly more fat bias than Fat Men.
> 
> ...



Hey Willie, I've been thinking about this issue, specifically moobs. It occurred to me to wonder what is it you want from the size acceptance in this regard? Emotional support? Supportive undergarments? A poster in a really jazzy font making people aware of moob stigma? I'm not being glib here, I'm honestly curious. It seems to me like that is the sort of topic that men would only feel comfortable talking about with other men. It would be something private. I'm not sure that I would want to talk openly about that if I were a man. It would be difficult to open up to anyone about it, especially on a public forum. As a woman, all I could do is nod my head and say "I feel ya." But that's really not very constructive. This kind of stuff has less to do with fat and more to do with the different communication styles of men and women. It might do for you - YOU to organize some support groups around issues that only fat men go thru. 

I really do appreciate the level of frustration you have about some of this stuff, and as much as I know you want the size acceptance movement at large to be more vocal about what fat men go thru - that only fat men go thru - I think the people you should probably appeal to are - other fat men. 

Just think about it.


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## Victim (Nov 8, 2008)

A moob support group would be quite helpful for keeping abreast of the issues.


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## William (Nov 9, 2008)

Hi Olwen

I think that for most Fat Guy Moobs are just part of the entire fat package that Society is so negative about. I have read posts from skinny guys with Moobs who have gone ape shit over the matter. The rounder silhouette of a fat man makes smaller Moobs less noticeable. I think that Gynecomastia (Moobs) Support sites have helped a lot guys choose between surgery and accepting themselves. Most Gynecomastia Sites are not Fat Positive.

Emotional Support for Moobs and for being Fat is always good and here on Dimensions there has been a lot recently. Lack of Abs are another thing Society views as negative on a Guy. Both men and women have to deal with Society's view of love handles, larger butts, abdominal fat and generally just being Fat.

As for garment Support for Moobs I have always found a Compression tee-shirt's best use is as a sweat generator  Also if you are large in the area like me they do not hide much and even make them more pronounced.

There are Fat Men talking about Moobs openly on Fat Acceptance Blogs, I even have a link to my web area in my signature. 

If Fat Men are going to be a part of Fat Acceptance then they have be a part of it. Most talk in Fat Acceptance (including Dimension) is picked up by all the Search Engines. I truly believe that some of the personal/health issues that I have heard Fat Women talk about, out in the open, are therapeutic for themselves and others. I have found plenty support for Moob from many other Fat People from all modes of Gender including Trans-men.

William






olwen said:


> Hey Willie, I've been thinking about this issue, specifically moobs. It occurred to me to wonder what is it you want from the size acceptance in this regard? Emotional support? Supportive undergarments? A poster in a really jazzy font making people aware of moob stigma? I'm not being glib here, I'm honestly curious. It seems to me like that is the sort of topic that men would only feel comfortable talking about with other men. It would be something private. I'm not sure that I would want to talk openly about that if I were a man. It would be difficult to open up to anyone about it, especially on a public forum. As a woman, all I could do is nod my head and say "I feel ya." But that's really not very constructive. This kind of stuff has less to do with fat and more to do with the different communication styles of men and women. It might do for you - YOU to organize some support groups around issues that only fat men go thru.
> 
> I really do appreciate the level of frustration you have about some of this stuff, and as much as I know you want the size acceptance movement at large to be more vocal about what fat men go thru - that only fat men go thru - I think the people you should probably appeal to are - other fat men.
> 
> Just think about it.


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## wrestlingguy (Nov 9, 2008)

olwen said:


> As a woman, all I could do is nod my head and say "I feel ya." But that's really not very constructive. This kind of stuff has less to do with fat and more to do with the different communication styles of men and women. It might do for you - YOU to organize some support groups around issues that only fat men go thru.
> 
> I really do appreciate the level of frustration you have about some of this stuff, and as much as I know you want the size acceptance movement at large to be more vocal about what fat men go thru - that only fat men go thru - I think the people you should probably appeal to are - other fat men.
> 
> Just think about it.


I think you & William *may* have found some common ground here, Olwen. 

I disagree that you saying "I feel ya" is not very constructive. Quite the contrary. There are a lot of things that BBW's experience that I don't, as a FA, and not a fat man. I think that empathy is a start in the right direction, and while you can't host a support group for the moob guys, just knowing that others in the Size Acceptance Movement have some understanding of what you go through can be a consolation compared to the rest of the world that are unwilling or unable to understand.


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## olwen (Nov 9, 2008)

William said:


> Hi Olwen
> 
> I think that for most Fat Guy Moobs are just part of the entire fat package that Society is so negative about. I have read posts from skinny guys with Moobs who have gone ape shit over the matter. The rounder silhouette of a fat man makes smaller Moobs less noticeable. I think that Gynecomastia (Moobs) Support sites have helped a lot guys choose between surgery and accepting themselves. Most Gynecomastia Sites are not Fat Positive.
> 
> ...



A) Women don't care about abs as much as you think. I'm thinking now about all the men I've been with and exactly two had rockhard abs. I honestly could care less, so would most other women I know. We just don't need rock hard abs. 

I can understand why you would notice that Gynecomastia support sites are not fat positive since this is something thin guys go thru too. I also think that a support group like that would better serve fat men if there was one specifically for only fat men. Does one like that exist? As a woman, I can talk to thin women about gynecological health issues and still be supported, but if I wanted to talk about certain aspects of female hygiene I'd only want to talk to other fat women cause I know they'd understand exactly what my concerns would be. See what I mean? 

I'm trying to think of other health issues that would only be specific to fat men, all I can think of are hygiene and some sexual issues. Those are things that women can help with and on these boards we ALL do talk about those things and offer support and solutions. So in that regard there is no lack of empathy or sympathy. It's a good place to start. I still think tho, that it's up to other fat men to bring those issues out into the size acceptance community at large since you can speak to them so intimately. 

B)FFAs love moobs.

As has been pointed out, the kinds of health ads that are usually directed at men involve, workout equipment, the occasional weight loss product, hair loss products, erectile dysfunction, high cholesterol, high blood pressure, diabetes, medicare insurance, and my personal favorite - scented body wash. Seriously, I like interpreting the underlying message of those body wash commercials, cause they say a lot about sexual politics, but I digress.

Now, I could ask, why are fat men are absent from this kind of media discourse, and the answer would be because these kinds of health problems involve all men, not just fat ones. It might actually do more harm to have fat actors in some of these commercials. I wouldn't want to see that.




wrestlingguy said:


> I think you & William *may* have found some common ground here, Olwen.
> 
> I disagree that you saying "I feel ya" is not very constructive. Quite the contrary. There are a lot of things that BBW's experience that I don't, as a FA, and not a fat man. I think that empathy is a start in the right direction, and while you can't host a support group for the moob guys, just knowing that others in the Size Acceptance Movement have some understanding of what you go through can be a consolation compared to the rest of the world that are unwilling or unable to understand.



The reason I say I don't think it is constructive - at least to William is because of how often he points out the level of empathy/sympathy he feels is lacking in the size acceptance movement. I'm sure that many women have in fact voiced such empathy in the past, but it just doesn't seem to be enough if this issue keeps coming up. I don't know how other fat men feel about it, cause they are not as vocal as he is. 

I'm sure fat women would want to help, but you know, we need to be told exactly what the issues are, and more importantly what kind of help is needed. I'm honestly getting sick of hearing about how nobody is doing anything about the lack of representation of fat men in the size acceptance movement AND having all possible solutions that have been offered up, or queries that have been made about the problems get ignored by the very person who's crying foul. I don't know about anyone else, but the way this dialog keeps going in circles is highly frustrating. I want to go in straight lines - Strait lines, and I don't know why my attempts to make that happen don't work. It's just frustrating and it's almost enough to just cease having the discussion altogether. But if you think we've gotten somewhere finally then hallelujah.


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## wrestlingguy (Nov 9, 2008)

olwen said:


> The reason I say I don't think it is constructive - at least to William is because of how often he points out the level of empathy/sympathy he feels is lacking in the size acceptance movement. I'm sure that many women have in fact voiced such empathy in the past, but it just doesn't seem to be enough if this issue keeps coming up. I don't know how other fat men feel about it, cause they are not as vocal as he is.
> 
> I'm sure fat women would want to help, but you know, we need to be told exactly what the issues are, and more importantly what kind of help is needed. I'm honestly getting sick of hearing about how nobody is doing anything about the lack of representation of fat men in the size acceptance movement AND having all possible solutions that have been offered up, or queries that have been made about the problems get ignored by the very person who's crying foul. I don't know about anyone else, but the way this dialog keeps going in circles is highly frustrating. I want to go in straight lines - Strait lines, and I don't know why my attempts to make that happen don't work. It's just frustrating and it's almost enough to just cease having the discussion altogether. But if you think we've gotten somewhere finally then hallelujah.



Again, you may want to say hallelujah as well if you simply rethink what this dialogue might mean to OTHERS, not just to William.

Sometimes, when you're in a tempest at sea, you have to look for the little light in the distance. In your eyes, Mr. William may not be that light for you, but you may be the light for others to see. I think you have to look beyond him, and see that there are other fat men who may find meaning in your words, and even if only to say "I understand, how can I help" may mean more to them. I know you're possibly thinking why someone else hasn't stepped up to the plate to be more prolific in their thoughts of fat men & society, but maybe we haven't said anything that strikes a chord with them, yet............So, there's still a chance that someone may be more articulate about the plights of fat men in society than William is. Until then...................

I've been sorta avoiding the forums here lately, and part of the reason is that I'm trying hard not to be the confrontational person that many have made me out to be. Whether there's truth in their contention or not, I feel it's best for me right now to stay out of the fray, even when some of the actions taken/comments made in both The Lounge and Hyde Park make me want to yell out as I typically do.

Keep on keepin' on, Olwen.:bow:


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## Green Eyed Fairy (Nov 9, 2008)

I don't think you're a "confrontational person" Phil.....and it's usually confrontational people that make such claims against others. 
I like your posts and hope to see you around more - because your input is valuable to me  :bow:


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## olwen (Nov 9, 2008)

wrestlingguy said:


> Again, you may want to say hallelujah as well if you simply rethink what this dialogue might mean to OTHERS, not just to William.
> 
> Sometimes, when you're in a tempest at sea, you have to look for the little light in the distance. In your eyes, Mr. William may not be that light for you, but you may be the light for others to see. I think you have to look beyond him, and see that there are other fat men who may find meaning in your words, and even if only to say "I understand, how can I help" may mean more to them. I know you're possibly thinking why someone else hasn't stepped up to the plate to be more prolific in their thoughts of fat men & society, but maybe we haven't said anything that strikes a chord with them, yet............So, there's still a chance that someone may be more articulate about the plights of fat men in society than William is. Until then...................
> 
> ...



Well Phil, I'm glad you posted to this thread. Confrontation is healthy as long as it's constructive, and I often think your posts are constructive. Don't give up the ship.


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## William (Nov 9, 2008)

Hi Phil

If that is the best way that you can talk about/to me in a post then maybe you should not even include me in your posts. I do not think that I have done anything but address you directly in a normal fashion.

I know that BBWs can give excellent support to a BHM, I have experienced it at other areas. I think that one of first steps is to back away from all the comments stating that Fat Men have little or no need for that support in the first place. You can't give support if there are topics focusing on how BHMs do not need support. 

William




wrestlingguy said:


> Again, you may want to say hallelujah as well if you simply rethink what this dialogue might mean to OTHERS, not just to William.
> 
> Sometimes, when you're in a tempest at sea, you have to look for the little light in the distance. In your eyes, Mr. William may not be that light for you, but you may be the light for others to see. I think you have to look beyond him, and see that there are other fat men who may find meaning in your words, and even if only to say "I understand, how can I help" may mean more to them. I know you're possibly thinking why someone else hasn't stepped up to the plate to be more prolific in their thoughts of fat men & society, but maybe we haven't said anything that strikes a chord with them, yet............So, there's still a chance that someone may be more articulate about the plights of fat men in society than William is. Until then...................
> 
> ...


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## wrestlingguy (Nov 9, 2008)

William said:


> Hi Phil
> 
> If that is the best way that you can talk about/to me in a post then maybe you should not even include me in your posts. I do not think that I have done anything but address you directly in a normal fashion.
> 
> ...



Hi (name excluded here),


I promise not to include you in my current or subsequent posts. Also, please note that it is precisely this kind of misunderstanding of my words that has made me rethink why I even bother posting anymore.

I do my best to understand the ignorant, but know the difference between ignorant and just plain stupid.

Chiding me for looking to find some common ground that you and one of your detractors can possibly build on because you didn't like the tone of my message is just plain stupid.

I like you, and I think you are sincere, but your inability to think their is no side other than your own has brought me to the conclusion that you likely want, which is I will refrain from posting in any threads that you've posted in, since your thoughts are absolute. There is no point of having a dialogue if that is the case.

Goodbye (name excluded here)


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## William (Nov 9, 2008)

Hi Owen

I mentioned Womens Abs because of that TV AD for that diet potion that is always on and talks about AB fat that women retain after pregnancy.

There is a host of issues and a lot of baggage that makes a Gynecomastia Support Group for men of any size hard to run if that group is centered on acceptance, it is hard to explain. 

BBWs do miss the mark on some Fat Male Issues, but what I think is the greatest benefit is acceptance by another group. 

A uniquely Fat Male problem would be hidden penis which is a penis hidden by Fat and surprisingly a guy does not have to be that fat if they are pear shaped. 

Yes FFAs are great!!!

The AD attack on Fat Men is mostly on the Internet, they have infested the Blogs, CaloricLabs is the worse offender. 

I have only said that the empathy for fat men in Fat Acceptance is the on-going conversations about how little Fat Men need support. I would equate that with 100% apathy.

There is a lot more to Fat Men than just Moobs, some hardly even have them. Most of what we have to discuss in not that gender specific. 

William



olwen said:


> A) Women don't care about abs as much as you think. I'm thinking now about all the men I've been with and exactly two had rockhard abs. I honestly could care less, so would most other women I know. We just don't need rock hard abs.
> 
> I can understand why you would notice that Gynecomastia support sites are not fat positive since this is something thin guys go thru too. I also think that a support group like that would better serve fat men if there was one specifically for only fat men. Does one like that exist? As a woman, I can talk to thin women about gynecological health issues and still be supported, but if I wanted to talk about certain aspects of female hygiene I'd only want to talk to other fat women cause I know they'd understand exactly what my concerns would be. See what I mean?
> 
> ...


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## William (Nov 9, 2008)

Hi Phil

I was not being smart or anything. If you want to sent me a message just say it like a regular message.

William



wrestlingguy said:


> Hi (name excluded here),
> 
> 
> I promise not to include you in my current or subsequent posts. Also, please note that it is precisely this kind of misunderstanding of my words that has made me rethink why I even bother posting anymore.
> ...


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## olwen (Nov 9, 2008)

William said:


> Hi Owen
> 
> I mentioned Womens Abs because of that TV AD for that diet potion that is always on and talks about AB fat that women retain after pregnancy.
> 
> ...



BINGO!!! Lookit, I don't believe I've ever been involved in a conversation where I've said fat men don't need support. I can't imagine any of us saying that you don't need support. If that were true there wouldn't be a board just for fat men and FFAs, no?

I can understand how the apparent lack of topics about fat men up for discussion at NAAFA would make you translate that into absolute lack of support. But please understand these two things are NOT the same. Either get some people at NAAFA to listen to you and other fat men and demand to be heard in a public forum or go one on one with people outside of NAAFA and just tell us all what you need support on. NAAFA isn't the be all end all of the size acceptance movement. 

I'm certain moobs are not the only concerns fat men have, but it immediately came to mind. Now to know what those other issues are, you and other fat men just have to speak up. Just tell us, but please stop accusing all of us being apathetic to what fat men go thru. It's just plain untrue. 

And I'm not sure why you blasted Phil's last post when he was sticking up for fat men. There was someone who was being very empathetic to fat men and offering up a workable solution, and I'm sorry you didn't see it that way.


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## William (Nov 9, 2008)

Hi Olwen

I said Fat Acceptance, not you. I have found you to be very supportive and sometimes..................unfathomable. If Fat Acceptance in aggregate is going to mainly consist of conversations on the little or no bias that Fat Men receive then any support from people like you is lost in the flood of apathy.

Denial of the that Fat Men need Fat Acceptance is the most frequent statement made in Fat Acceptance outside of BHM and FFA areas. What is funny is that the Feminist side of Fat Acceptance is widening their viewpoint on Fat Men faster than than the Fat Acceptance/Fat Admirer side of Fat Acceptance.

I do not think that Phil said any thing bad about Fat Men, but if that is the best way he can address me then he should not bother. It is best to leave any personal problems at home before you post.

I will still address any comment I have for Phil in a normal fashion.

William 






olwen said:


> BINGO!!! Lookit, I don't believe I've ever been involved in a conversation where I've said fat men don't need support. I can't imagine any of us saying that you don't need support. If that were true there wouldn't be a board just for fat men and FFAs, no?
> 
> I can understand how the apparent lack of topics about fat men up for discussion at NAAFA would make you translate that into absolute lack of support. But please understand these two things are NOT the same. Either get some people at NAAFA to listen to you and other fat men and demand to be heard in a public forum or go one on one with people outside of NAAFA and just tell us all what you need support on. NAAFA isn't the be all end all of the size acceptance movement.
> 
> ...


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## Surlysomething (Nov 9, 2008)




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## Green Eyed Fairy (Nov 10, 2008)

Surly.....have I been a good girl so far?


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## Surlysomething (Nov 10, 2008)

Green Eyed Fairy said:


> Surly.....have I been a good girl so far?


 

Sorry, I don't follow.


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## Green Eyed Fairy (Nov 10, 2008)

Surlysomething said:


> Sorry, I don't follow.



That means I have then


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