# Controversial question



## Les Toil (Dec 8, 2007)

I'm not even sure if this question belongs on The Weight Board, Hyde Park--or The Paysite Board!! But here goes...

Has the Dim Boards not only inspired you to stop chasing diets and society's demand to be skinny, but has it also inspired you to GAIN weight?

Curious in Cali'.


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## Candy_Coated_Clown (Dec 8, 2007)

I haven't been here as long as others have but I belong to several communities and boards in addition to this one and they certainly offer support and my level of self-acceptance has increased.

However, on a functional level, I have no desire to gain any more weight because my breasts are the first things to gain weight and already I am bothered by a bit of lower back strain due to the heaviness/weight of them. They are quite large. I've got what some call an hour glass shape but this part of my body just fluctuates in size *so*easily whether I lose or gain weight and although they might be a nice asset in some people's minds aesthetically and sexually, they aren't great to carry around all the time. So no more weight gain for me unless I want to further my lower back strain. 

I am always amazed at women who are far bustier and wonder how they manage to carry around their breasts without much or any discomfort. I got to thinking about this when I looked at the site MelonieRose.com not while ago. I saw an advertisement for the site on another discussion board and clicked on it and saw that it features BBWs with very large breasts. There's no way I'd be able to walk if I got any bigger up top or near the chest size of some of those women. I'd be in pain. probably constricted to a wheel chair for the time being...lol But somehow they manage to function...

Outside of this, I've become somewhat more comfortable with my body and I have a feeling I will continue to. I've no need for continual cycle of diets and gimmicks and I've come to accept that due to being a foodie and one who enjoys experiencing/exploring, which will never change, a plus-sized build is sensible for me unless I want to live a lifestyle incompatible to my nature - limited, rigid, restricted and highly disciplined.

and of course, the main thing that helps me is that I have a wonderfully supportive and truly fat-admiring, loving fiance.


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## bexy (Dec 8, 2007)

*it hasnt inspired me to gain weight on purpose, but has inspired me to not care if i do, and to embrace any extra weight or stretchmarks that appear! it has also helped immensly in my realising the men who approach me here in belfast, including my lovely boyfriend, are not just flukes, but that men do like big girls, which is something i did struggle with for a while.
i always knew i thought i was attractive, just wasnt sure about others.
it has inspired me to encourage my bf to gain tho, something he is happy about as it means more chocolate and fried eggs!

xox*


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## goofy girl (Dec 8, 2007)

Dims has neither stopped me from trying to lose weight nor have I been "inspired" to gain. What it has done is help me to accept myself and have confidence, as well as meet the most fabulous people.


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## Keb (Dec 8, 2007)

I would say definitely not. It has made me think very seriously about how I relate to my size, and it's given me a lot of good information and different viewpoints. It does not make me want to get bigger, though. In some ways, it makes me more strongly consider whether I'd like to become smaller (if it's possible), because it makes me stop and think about what I really am and what I really want to be.


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## Edens_heel (Dec 9, 2007)

Candy_Coated_Clown said:


> and of course, the main thing that helps me is that I have a wonderfully supportive and truly fat-admiring, loving fiance.



Awww! I am one damn lucky man:wubu:


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## Aurora (Dec 9, 2007)

Dimensions in and of itself didn't, but it was part of many factors that did.


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## Shosh (Dec 9, 2007)

Dimensions inspired me to have my wobbly, flabby arms on display on the first day of summer here.
I will never be society's ideal in terms of my body, but I can try to be kind to myself and accept myself.


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## Violet_Beauregard (Dec 9, 2007)

Ditto!! Dims has been GREAT for me!!! 




goofy girl said:


> Dims has neither stopped me from trying to lose weight nor have I been "inspired" to gain. What it has done is help me to accept myself and have confidence, as well as meet the most fabulous people.


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## Les Toil (Dec 9, 2007)

Edens_heel said:


> Awww! I am one damn lucky man:wubu:




Very very sweet you guys.


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## k1009 (Dec 9, 2007)

Keb said:


> I would say definitely not. It has made me think very seriously about how I relate to my size, and it's given me a lot of good information and different viewpoints. It does not make me want to get bigger, though. In some ways, it makes me more strongly consider whether I'd like to become smaller (if it's possible), because it makes me stop and think about what I really am and what I really want to be.



Yeah! Finding out just how much weight can affect other people's lives has made me question my own size quite a bit. 

On the other hand if I were living strictly in a fantasy world where everything worked out fine and there were no health or other problems from fat I'd probably want to. I like my fat when it's behaving itself, and I could definitely see myself enjoying more of it.


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## TallFatSue (Dec 9, 2007)

Les Toil said:


> I'm not even sure if this question belongs on The Weight Board, Hyde Park--or The Paysite Board!! But here goes...
> 
> Has the Dim Boards not only inspired you to stop chasing diets and society's demand to be skinny, but has it also inspired you to GAIN weight?
> 
> Curious in Cali'.


No and no. I've never felt the urge to diet, and I've never tried to gain weight, but I never tried to stop either. As others amongst us have said, Dimensions has helped me virtually meet some fabulous people. Somehow I muddled through life pretty well before Dimensions, but now I can share my experiences with others and learn from them too.

Speaking of fabulous people, it was none other than Les Toil himself who helped me better appreciate that delicious condiment known as ranch salad dressing. 

( http://www.dimensionsmagazine.com/forums/showthread.php?p=16283 )


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## elle camino (Dec 9, 2007)

Les Toil said:


> Has the Dim Boards not only inspired you to stop chasing diets and society's demand to be skinny, but has it also inspired you to GAIN weight?
> 
> Curious in Cali'.



nope and nope.

~ succinct in seattle


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## tattooU (Dec 10, 2007)

goofy girl said:


> Dims has neither stopped me from trying to lose weight nor have I been "inspired" to gain. What it has done is help me to accept myself and have confidence, as well as meet the most fabulous people.



Ahh, summed up perfectly! i totally agree


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## Les Toil (Dec 10, 2007)

TallFatSue said:


> Speaking of fabulous people, it was none other than Les Toil himself who helped me better appreciate that delicious condiment known as ranch salad dressing.
> 
> ( http://www.dimensionsmagazine.com/forums/showthread.php?p=16283 )



My WORD Sue! I didn't even know it was possible to archive back to almost three years!! And Sue, I have to admit I *still* find it difficult to put any kind of sauce on my noodles or vegetables that isn't cheese based. I think Ranch dressing is like jazz music to me in that one day I know I'm going to wake up and finally "get it".


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## Les Toil (Dec 10, 2007)

OK, I guess this is where the controversial part comes in.

I'm assuming there must have been at least one person in the history of the Dim Boards that arrived here with low self-esteem because of how their peers and family dealt with their _volupuosity_. And then they notice on the Weight Board or the Paysite Board that the women that have announced they put on a couple pounds over the weekend were being applauded and showered with praises for their nobel achievements. So then that person with low self-esteem suddenly finds they're being treated like a queen because of her weight gain and the attention and praises she's getting is like nothing she's ever experienced and it's making her feel as if she's dancing on Cloud 9. 

So to strip the question down to its bare-bones essential, have the multitude of feeder/gainers on the Dim Boards made you feel as if gaining weight is a virtue and a beauty enhancer?


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## LoveBHMS (Dec 10, 2007)

I think *most* people get that what's on the paysite board is sexually based. In other words women on those boards show off their (real or invented) weight gain because the showing off is intended for an audience who finds it sexually arousing. It's not a "noble achievement" to gain weight, and in many cases, showering somebody with praise because she gained is no different from a guy who's into domination praising a woman who crawls around on the floor or a guy with a big boob fetish praising a woman who gets massive implants. In most cases, it's not "praise" per se, but just encouragement to keep doing what gets those guys off.

This has been talked about on the Weight Board, but there is also a big big big divide between fantasy and reality with this stuff. Deriving sexual excitement over the ideas of feeding/gaining is totally different from dealing with the realities that massive weight gain would cause.

On a more macro scale, and this has been said to death, nobody's self esteem should be dependent on outside approval. It's one thing to say "I like myself and it was great to find there are others who don't beat themselves up for their weight" but quite another to hope that somebody's sense of self worth could be adjusted merely by finding that somebody else approves. More simplified, it's no more appropriate to say "Oh, now I like myself because I found some FA's" than it is to say "I hate myself because my real world friends and family don't approve of my size."


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## Bagalute (Dec 10, 2007)

I have noticed that many of the lovely paysite ladies do feeding/weightgain related stuff and asked myself whether all of them are really into it or whether some may do it because it probably attracts more members to their sites (although it maybe isn't originally "their thing"). Just curious.


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## CandySmooch (Dec 10, 2007)

No, it hasn't inspired me to gain weight but be comfortable with who I am whether thats 50 lbs less or 50 lbs more - so be it. Its also inspired me to not give a fuck when I look in the mirror & my shirt's a little too tight or you can see my muffin top under my shirt. Before I was always "OMG I don't want my husband to be embarrassed by me in public"..........now I'm loud & proud, if I got a roll showing, I got a damn roll showing and thats how it is and I don't care who sees it anymore. I only think maybe there would be a man who would like my fat rolls showing like that and maybe I could give him something to smile about that day.


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## Keb (Dec 10, 2007)

Les Toil, I feel mean for even thinking this, but what I'm hearing in your question, especially rephrased, is a sort of wistful fantasy that I think I see a lot from the FAs here (though I could be wrong). The fantasy that telling a girl it's okay to be fat and it's okay to gain will make her as excited to be fat and as eager to gain as the FA is to see her fat and to see her gaining. While there clearly are some women who do enjoy one or both immensely, and enjoy sharing their pleasure with FAs, there's no magic button that is going to make a woman accept herself or suddenly see things through your eyes. It's just not that easy.

That doesn't decrease the value of Dims; I see it as an encouraging and useful resource. But it's not going to encourage me to be something I'm not.


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## TallFatSue (Dec 11, 2007)

Keb said:


> Les Toil, I feel mean for even thinking this, but what I'm hearing in your question, especially rephrased, is a sort of wistful fantasy that I think I see a lot from the FAs here (though I could be wrong). The fantasy that telling a girl it's okay to be fat and it's okay to gain will make her as excited to be fat and as eager to gain as the FA is to see her fat and to see her gaining. While there clearly are some women who do enjoy one or both immensely, and enjoy sharing their pleasure with FAs, there's no magic button that is going to make a woman accept herself or suddenly see things through your eyes. It's just not that easy.
> 
> That doesn't decrease the value of Dims; I see it as an encouraging and useful resource. But it's not going to encourage me to be something I'm not.


Exactly. I am what I am. 

This "excited to be fat and eager to gain" fantasy reminds me of some of the live chats I used to have (doggone real reality doesn't leave time for my virtual reality anymore, ya know). Every so often an FA would type that that a certain 300lb woman is beautiful and he'd love to take her up to 400lb or 500lb. That was my cue to ask what about all the eligible 400lb or 500lb woman out there, who have their fat ready made? Apparently it's just not the same. Gaining often struck me as a control issue, at least in part. I was quite distressed to hear about feeders who fed feedees up to a high weight, and then dropped them when they couldn't or wouldn't gain anymore, due to health, mobility or other issues. 

It's amazing how fat becomes a control issue, both gaining or losing weight. My mother was both the Queen of Control and the Queen of Mixe Messages, because on the one hand she would be upset if I didn't eat everything she cooked and baked for me, and on the other hand she nagged me to lose weight. Eventually I began to view my fat as a symbol of my independence, so it became a control issue for me too. Damned if I ate, damned if I didn't, so I ate everything. Damn the calories, full speed ahead! :eat2:

Yes, I'm a very tall very fat women, that's how I'm built, so I want to be accepted as I am. Sometimes it's a challenge to be this fat, but life is good, so I'm just vain enough to be proud of my fat. As I said to some of the feeders who have hit on me, I'm very flattered by their attention, but I don't already have enough luscious jiggly fat bouncing around, then I probably can't satisfy them. It was my great good fortune that my Mr. Right was "intrigued" enough with my entire package "as is" to spend the rest of his life with the fattest woman he ever met. :smitten:


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## sweet&fat (Dec 11, 2007)

Keb said:


> Les Toil, I feel mean for even thinking this, but what I'm hearing in your question, especially rephrased, is a sort of wistful fantasy that I think I see a lot from the FAs here (though I could be wrong). *The fantasy that telling a girl it's okay to be fat and it's okay to gain will make her as excited to be fat and as eager to gain as the FA is to see her fat and to see her gaining.* While there clearly are some women who do enjoy one or both immensely, and enjoy sharing their pleasure with FAs, there's no magic button that is going to make a woman accept herself or suddenly see things through your eyes. It's just not that easy.
> 
> That doesn't decrease the value of Dims; I see it as an encouraging and useful resource. But it's not going to encourage me to be something I'm not.



Bingo. I've heard men say "but so-and-so posts how much she loves gaining weight" as if the paysite board were somehow the gold standard of BBW reality. I'm puzzled why anyone would think that anything on the paysite board is necessarily true. Perhaps it is, perhaps it isn't, but the fact remains that the women are being paid to display a fantasy persona (and a sexy one at that!). Would anyone expect that they truly wear nothing but lingerie all day, every day?


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## Jes (Dec 11, 2007)

Keb said:


> I would say definitely not. It has made me think very seriously about how I relate to my size, and it's given me a lot of good information and different viewpoints. It does not make me want to get bigger, though. In some ways, it makes me more strongly consider whether I'd like to become smaller (if it's possible), because it makes me stop and think about what I really am and what I really want to be.



a lot of this resonates with me.


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## Tad (Dec 11, 2007)

Keb said:


> Les Toil, I feel mean for even thinking this, but what I'm hearing in your question, especially rephrased, is a sort of wistful fantasy that I think I see a lot from the FAs here (though I could be wrong). The fantasy that telling a girl it's okay to be fat and it's okay to gain will make her as excited to be fat and as eager to gain as the FA is to see her fat and to see her gaining. While there clearly are some women who do enjoy one or both immensely, and enjoy sharing their pleasure with FAs, there's no magic button that is going to make a woman accept herself or suddenly see things through your eyes. It's just not that easy.



In my younger days I had that fantasy. Learned that it was just that, at least in most cases. I think it is a pretty common human trait though--if your favorite treat in the world is cheesecake, you tend to think that everyone must love chocolate cake, or at least would if they had good cheesecake and were served it in the right environment. How many episodes of politely strained smiles would you have to go through before you realized that someone that you generally liked, who really seemed like you in many ways, and who you shared a lot of tastes with, really did not like cheesecake? 

Or ask the same question about dogs, or your favorite fashion designer, or the TV show that you just never miss. When something is that great for you, surely others will appreciate how great it is? And if they don't, maybe they just have never had the opportunity to do so properly, so with a little help they'll get there....


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## Jes (Dec 11, 2007)

LoveBHMS said:


> In most cases, it's not "praise" per se, but just encouragement to keep doing what gets those guys off.





sublime.




pants.


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## Jes (Dec 11, 2007)

sweet&fat said:


> Bingo. I've heard men say "but so-and-so posts how much she loves gaining weight" as if the paysite board were somehow the gold standard of BBW reality. I'm puzzled why anyone would think that anything on the paysite board is necessarily true. Perhaps it is, perhaps it isn't, but the fact remains that the women are being paid to display a fantasy persona (and a sexy one at that!). Would anyone expect that they truly wear nothing but lingerie all day, every day?



Most men I've spoken to about going to strip clubs have told me that they know the women there have a job to do and have to be nice, but that they made a REAL connection with a dancer there. "Oh, I know every guy says this, and they get conned, but I'm telling you, Sabrina REALLY liked me! She was asking me about myself and telling me I wasn't like the other guys and she invited me to come spend some time with her." Uh, and how much did that special time cost you? And did she ever call you when you left your number? Eh? The job is to please the customer. The customer's job is to be pleased.


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## LoveBHMS (Dec 11, 2007)

If you look at a classic like "The Story of O" the theme is not "chicks dig being dominated" but rather the gradual, ongoing, degradation of a woman who *starts out* leading a normal life but who is introduced to the idea of being degraded and made into a total submissive. If you are into Dom/Sub stuff, it's probably way more thrilling to watch a woman slowly giving into the idea, rather than just finding somebody who wants to immediately go live in your basement and be tied up and collared.

Look at how popular "Before and After" shots are, or how much WG fiction is along the lines of "Mary was a pretty, slender, athletic girl who starts putting on weight and loves it and winds up being a huge fat chick."

And Ed is right, if you really really like something, you'd hope that everyone else secretly really really liked it too. Or could be encouraged to start liking it if only you go about convincing her properly.


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## Jes (Dec 11, 2007)

LoveBHMS said:


> If you look at a classic like "The Story of O" the theme is not "chicks dig being dominated" but rather the gradual, ongoing, degradation of a woman who *starts out* leading a normal life but who is introduced to the idea of being degraded and made into a total submissive. If you are into Dom/Sub stuff, it's probably way more thrilling to watch a woman slowly giving into the idea, rather than just finding somebody who wants to immediately go live in your basement and be tied up and collared.
> .



Anyone who doesn't need to be coerced means you haven't made a conquest. It wasn't your power, or your power of persuasion, or whatever else that made it happen. It was the other person's choice, before he/she met you. Nothing to do with you, except for the fact that you're needed to slap the ass, or gag the mouth or turn the lock of the handcuffs.

That's really unappealing to a lot of people.


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## LoveBHMS (Dec 11, 2007)

Jes said:


> Anyone who doesn't need to be coerced means you haven't made a conquest. It wasn't your power, or your power of persuasion, or whatever else that made it happen. It was the other person's choice, before he/she met you. Nothing to do with you, except for the fact that you're needed to slap the ass, or gag the mouth or turn the lock of the handcuffs.
> 
> That's really unappealing to a lot of people.



It's unappealing to a lot of people, but also appealing to a lot of them, which is why the story is so popular and enduring. It's not a whole lot different from the idea of gently coaxing out a woman's "real" desire to be a BBW or believing a fit, athletic woman doesn't *really* enjoy exercising or that you can somehow flip a switch in her and she'll want to do nothing but eat donuts and fast food all day.

I don't think "O" is popular because the protagonist was forced into submission, I think it's popular because she was brought along into submission and wound up enjoying it.

And the more important point is that it's popular among women. If you look at the idea of rape or gang bang fantasies, a lot of them are *women's* fantasies of having a man overpower them. The fantasy is HER'S, but it's of finding a man to do certain things to her that she finds erotic but can't do for herself.


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## Jes (Dec 11, 2007)

LoveBHMS said:


> It's unappealing to a lot of people, but also appealing to a lot of them, which is why the story is so popular and enduring. .


oh, honey, i know! that's what I mean! that's why consensual doesn't quite work. Or rather, having someone come into the set up with the desire to do it. It has to be the zero to 60. Under someone else's power. You have to be the passenger, not the driver. We're on the same page, ladylumps.

i do, however, see a difference in women fantasizing about being abused or hurt or debased or whatever, and fantasizing about doing that to someone else. It's a fundamental difference.

Anyhoo, it's time for me to pick up my photo reprints (actual film, oooh, how retro) and get myself a really salty cheeseburger for lunch.


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## Tad (Dec 11, 2007)

LoveBHMS said:


> It's unappealing to a lot of people, but also appealing to a lot of them, which is why the story is so popular and enduring. It's not a whole lot different from the idea of gently coaxing out a woman's "real" desire to be a BBW or believing a fit, athletic woman doesn't *really* enjoy exercising or that you can somehow flip a switch in her and she'll want to do nothing but eat donuts and fast food all day.
> 
> I don't think "O" is popular because the protagonist was forced into submission, I think it's popular because she was brought along into submission and wound up enjoying it.
> 
> And the more important point is that it's popular among women. If you look at the idea of rape or gang bang fantasies, a lot of them are *women's* fantasies of having a man overpower them. The fantasy is HER'S, but it's of finding a man to do certain things to her that she finds erotic but can't do for herself.



Im in an opinionated mood today, so the rest of this post is my opinions, or maybe I should say my rant, on this topic. This isn't even so much a reaction to your specific post, as the idea that often seems bandies about that waht FA really want is control of women's bodies. Because Im tired of all FA being portrayed as being inherently controlling.

Im sure that there are more than two flavors of fat admirer, so lets just say that I think that there is at least one type of fat admirer that you are not taking into consideration here. Im pretty sure of that, because I dont think my feelings fit into the analogue of The Story of O very well (Not going into my reasoning of why here. Should anyone actually care, PM me). 

For me, a better analogue might be body modification. Imagine that you are into body modification, and you can think of nothing that makes you feel sexier. It is not that others have to have tattoos and piercing to appeal to you, but this is something that is so sexy to you, surely you want them to share it too? Meeting someone covered in tats and loaded with piercing is great. But finding someone who hasnt gone there, and opening up the world to them, and sharing their pleasure in their journey of transformation, how much more exciting would that be, in a perfect fantasy sort of way. Not that youd probably hold out for the perfect fantasy, but if you were going to write stories, wouldnt they be of the perfect fantasy? In fact, might they not start Heather was a cheerleader, who was proud of her unmarked skin. One day the team decided to all get matching tattoos.

Or to look at it another way, how many stories are about the tenth year of a couple being in love, versus how many are about them just falling in love, despite the barriers in their way? Isnt the process of deciding that this is what you want, despite reasons to do otherwise, and then doing what you want, one of the most essential and exciting stories? Granted in times past I think these were often written as tragedies, advising against putting your desires over social norms. But becoming ourselves is exciting, and so is someone finding that what they want is what you want of them. 

I was just writing in a different thread that it is not just being appreciated, it is being appreciated how and for what we want to be appreciated. Isnt everyones ideal to have this be a perfect match, both ways? That is, that what you essentially are is what you want to be appreciate for is what you are appreciated for, and what you appreciate about your partner is what they want to be appreciated for is what lies at the core of their identify. So if someone loves fatness, the perfect fantasy partner is someone who loves fatness, and wants to be appreciated for their fatness and love of fatness. And the story of them discovering this part of their identity, and embracing it, and find a partner who appreciates this about them, that is the very fundamental story at the heart of the fantasy. 

Are these fantasies something that anyone is ever apt to live out? No, but then again, neither are harlequin romances. Now, if you rail against Harlequin Romances for giving women an unrealistic view of how their life could be, Im totally cool with you railing against the writers here for giving FA unrealistic ideas of how their life could be. That is cool, some people view fantasies as dangerous, other view them as essential to mental health, all points in-between and all around those two. 

Two last points and then Ill get off my soap-box.

I dont think most of the stories here are nearly as well written or reasonable as Harlequin Romances are, but that is what you get in a free web forum. Im not trying to say that the stories here can be directly related to published novels, just that I think they are of related species.

I do agree that some FA have controlling fantasies. I dont know what percentage they are. Id be willing to believe fifty percent, or fifteen percent, and Id listen to arguments going outside of that range. Certainly they are a substantial portion of the whole, and they do create some of the more striking and attention getting imagery. But they are not the whole of FAs.

/rant

LoveBHMs, this really was not aimed at you--I guess this has been building up in me for a while, and today was when it came out. So apologies that it came out *here* in response to *your* post.


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## Aurora (Dec 11, 2007)

This reminds me of something.

Lately I've been confronted more and more by other women badmouthing me for using "bbw" to describe myself, saying that because I do enjoy gaining on occassion and I like being involved in the fat fetish stuff that somehow that leads others to believe all bbws are like me. Granted yeah, I'm sure some people make that correlation, but it's just stereotyping and ignorance on their part. Time and time again I have to explain that no, I'm an individual, and women who do truly enjoy the things I do are rather rare in the community as a whole. Doesn't make anyone better than anyone else, just different.


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## sweet&fat (Dec 11, 2007)

I'm not sure I would characterize it as control so much as a naive and maybe even self-centered projection of personal preference/fantasy onto other people. 

To remove the fat element, I'll cite the movie "Deep Throat" as an example. This is an extreme example, but also a very, very popular one. The premise of this film is that a woman who is sexually unsatisfied realizes that she has an unusual condition where her clitoris is located in her throat instead of her vagina. By giving men (admittedly quite impressive) blow jobs, she herself finally achieves sexual satisfaction. It's the ultimate fantasy of "I find this very exciting, so others must derive the same pleasure that I do from it, even though that's probably unlikely in reality." Again, it's an extreme example, but it does embody a very real desire.


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## LoveBHMS (Dec 11, 2007)

Aurora said:


> This reminds me of something.
> 
> Lately I've been confronted more and more by other women badmouthing me for using "bbw" to describe myself, saying that because I do enjoy gaining on occassion and I like being involved in the fat fetish stuff that somehow that leads others to believe all bbws are like me. Granted yeah, I'm sure some people make that correlation, but it's just stereotyping and ignorance on their part. Time and time again I have to explain that no, I'm an individual, and women who do truly enjoy the things I do are rather rare in the community as a whole. Doesn't make anyone better than anyone else, just different.



You can, and should, describe yourself however you want.

We had this discussion last fall when a couple of posters from here appeared on a talk show, and there was a ton of hand wringing over the notion that these women might represent the SA community in one way or another, or that if a feeder/feedee couple appeared on the same show, then *everyone* would assume all couples in which one partner was plus sized were into feederism.

The only person you're representing is yourself. After all, when we see a BBW who is an athlete, nobody assumes all BBWs are athletes.


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## alienlanes (Dec 11, 2007)

edx said:


> For me, a better analogue might be body modification. Imagine that you are into body modification, and you can think of nothing that makes you feel sexier. It is not that others have to have tattoos and piercing to appeal to you, but this is something that is so sexy to you, surely you want them to share it too? Meeting someone covered in tats and loaded with piercing is great. But finding someone who hasnt gone there, and opening up the world to them, and sharing their pleasure in their journey of transformation, how much more exciting would that be, in a perfect fantasy sort of way. Not that youd probably hold out for the perfect fantasy, but if you were going to write stories, wouldnt they be of the perfect fantasy? In fact, might they not start Heather was a cheerleader, who was proud of her unmarked skin. One day the team decided to all get matching tattoos.



_*You must spread some reputation around before giving it to edx again*_ 

I think you're on to something here. V.S. Naipaul once said that autobiography can conceal, but fiction reveals the writer totally -- facts can be lied about or distorted, but fiction always tells the truth about the way its creator sees the world.

For a long time I've toyed with the idea of going through the entire stories archive and seeing if I could come up with a typology of the different kinds of WG fantasy -- control, revenge, luxury, etc. My enthusiasm cools when I remember that WG fic is no exception to Sturgeon's Law rolleyes... but it'd be a fascinating thing to study.

One question which has disturbed me for a while. Some of the models on the paysite board who cater to feeders have gained weight in real life, and although a few of them have explicity said that they're turned on by gaining and would gain even if they didn't get paid for it, most of them haven't. Are there paysite models who have deliberately gained weight as "part of the job" even though it's not a fetish of theirs? This crosses some sort of moral line for me, although I don't know if I could clearly articulate how and why.


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## Fascinita (Dec 11, 2007)

Bagalute said:


> and asked myself whether all of them are really into it or whether some may do it because it probably attracts more members to their sites



Come now... Is the Pope Catholic? Even if you weren't into it, you'd tout it, if it was good for business. Wouldn't you? I know I would.


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## Fascinita (Dec 11, 2007)

SlackerFA said:


> This crosses some sort of moral line for me, although I don't know if I could clearly articulate how and why.



Could you try to articulate it?

I'm thinking, you know, is gaining weight for the job any different than (this might read as too obvious an example) Robert DeNiro gaining weight for Raging Bull?

Of if you want to stay in the sex industry, of women getting implants or all kinds of plastic surgery to make their bodies more saleable.


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## furious styles (Dec 11, 2007)

Guys; stop bastardizing Les' question. I know what kind of dude he is; extremely down to earth and not the type of guy who would pose a question like this for any reasons other than essential curiosity. Of course he knew it would get a reaction, that's why he titled it as such, and included the disclaimer in the beginning.

Of course some people are going to think about it in _"that"_ way, take a look around this forum. Better yet, take a look around the original site. Look at some of the articles on the left side of the front page, and you can see what it's centered around. Over time it's evolved gracefully into a site more focused on size acceptance, and being a generally fat positive community as opposed to a flesh magazine/website for FAs. 

_Some_ people are going to think about just about everything in _"that"_ way. The problem is that now we've cleft the dims community in twain; on one hand you've got the size activists and "regular ole' FAs and BBWs" , while on the other you have people that embrace the more original, fetishistic purpose of the magazine/website. They've been pushed away and constricted to the weight board as it is, but in a thread like this that blends the two areas of the site, some seem to fear that they may come out of hiding for their own machiavellian purposes (eek!). 

Can we stop for a moment, remove the tinfoil hats, and approach this for what it is, a question?

As for myself : Not really. I've never had any body issues in the first place though. Since coming here I've gained some at times and lost some at times. I used to be pretty big, now I suppose I would be considered "buff" by society's standards. I don't really care either way, XD.


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## Jes (Dec 11, 2007)

there are a few similarities, sure. But I'd get fat for an 8Million dollar paycheck, not for the...[total random guess] $400/month you might get for a paysite.

Sort of like taking a risk with your body as a major athlete. They're paid for their talent (yes, yes, overpaid, that's not my point, follow with me here) but they're also paid for the fact that it's more likely that they will have a major or a catastrophic injury due to their work than you will due to yours. If a certain amount of money per month is enough to justify gaining weight you don't want to gain, then that takes care of that. Though at some point, you can't gain anymore. And having lots of money you can't spend might not do much. ANd if you don't like yourself at your new weight, that's another issue.

I'm getting breast implants. To further my career. But i'm getting 3 extra sets, below my natural breasts. I have a furry pornsite. I'm going to become a cat.


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## Observer (Dec 11, 2007)

I've known dozens of BBWs in real life. Many have been larger all or most of their lives. Most have wished they were smaller because they have thought it would affect their (fill in the blank - health, love life, job prospects, sartorial options, etc). 

Of course virtually none have succeeded long term. A number have been helped out of this negative conundrum by finding guys and resources such as we have here. They have gone on to be more successful, more loving and very much loved by changing not their weight but their view of their own worth.

So far as I know, none (even those who have in fact gained some) have ever been inspired to deliberately gain a pound - even when they have forsaken the dieting treadmill and had FA husbands who tend to tempt them. The only deliberate gainers I've ever met were normal or sub-normal in weight and desirous of being bigger - and they seemed as frustrated in gaining as heavier people are in losing.


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## Lamia (Dec 11, 2007)

If I had a desire to secretly gain I can say this site would probably unleash that desire. I do not have any desire to gain weight. AT ALL. NONE. I come here because it's a place for acceptance. If anything encouragement to gain only makes me want to lose. It's a whole control thing. My father would constantly ride me about being fat. My only way to get back at him was eating. He would get mad when I would eat and say things like "go ahead cram another one into your fat face". Even if I wasn't hungry I would eat more just to spite him. Now that I am engaged to a supportive loving FA who would love for me to gain weight. I maintain and feel compelled to lose. I got some issues.


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## Cynthia (Dec 11, 2007)

I've never been a feedee or a paysite participant, but I can see that there may be a consensual element to some relationships beyond the sexual and financial angles that others have mentioned. Gaining deliberately could be a way to make a radically feminist social statement, especially when a woman gains within an overtly sexual, hyper-feminine context -- becoming the ultimate blow-up / pinup doll. Or, in some cases, so-called "intentional" gaining may be a woman's way of redefining and therefore asserting some psychological control over body changes or behaviors that may actually feel unmanageable.


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## Fascinita (Dec 11, 2007)

Jes said:


> I'm getting breast implants. To further my career. But i'm getting 3 extra sets, below my natural breasts. I have a furry pornsite. I'm going to become a cat.



Oh, God. I'm seeing rows of kittens.

I dig what you're saying about the price to pay for relatively little income, but I still don't see it as a moral issue (as in, "it's amoral to gain weight to make a living.") The moral issues, if there are any, to me might be in choosing to make a living by selling sex, or in why women's work is undervalued compared to that of men. But you know me: devil's advocate.


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## Observer (Dec 11, 2007)

I see nothing amoral about deliberately gaining weight if someone wants to do so from personal erotic desire, whether their own or even someone else's. I'm just saying that while feedees and foodies do exist, they are few in number. 

I have heard anecdotal stories of people who gained weight deliberately to avoid unwelcome sexual attention, which I think is a sad way to address such an issue, but I think that's equally rare. Most people gain weight in my belief not from any deliberate effort. Rsather it is because of the unconscious interaction of seven elements, of which the first two are essential pre-requisites and one or more of the balance must be present.:

1) they are genetically predisposed to do so at one or more points in their life 2) opportunity to ingest more calories than needed for basal metabolism. 
3) proclivity to enjoy food for comfort, socializstion or relief of stress
4) physical inactivity
5) consumption of calories in a form which tend to be used primarily for adipose tissue rsather than energy. 
6) unique life events such as pregnancy 
7) preoccupation with other life activities as a priority


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## superodalisque (Dec 12, 2007)

Les Toil said:


> I'm not even sure if this question belongs on The Weight Board, Hyde Park--or The Paysite Board!! But here goes...
> 
> Has the Dim Boards not only inspired you to stop chasing diets and society's demand to be skinny, but has it also inspired you to GAIN weight?
> 
> Curious in Cali'.



not really. i was never one to diet and i didn't have a bad body image before. i might have gained weigh simply because of all of the food talk lol


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## lipmixgirl (Dec 12, 2007)

no and no...

dims has given me a space to be me and to spread the big applicious love...

the big apple has spoken...
::exeunt:: :bow:


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## Bagalute (Dec 12, 2007)

Fascinita said:


> Come now... Is the Pope Catholic? Even if you weren't into it, you'd tout it, if it was good for business. Wouldn't you? I know I would.



It's a valid question, imo (not the one about Benedetto, my original one )
And no, I wouldn't do anything I don't feel comfortable with just because it is "good for business". Of course it depends on the degree to which it makes me feel uncomfortable and the size of the business we are talking about.


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## NancyGirl74 (Dec 12, 2007)

Les Toil said:


> I'm not even sure if this question belongs on The Weight Board, Hyde Park--or The Paysite Board!! But here goes...
> 
> Has the Dim Boards not only inspired you to stop chasing diets and society's demand to be skinny, but has it also inspired you to GAIN weight?
> 
> Curious in Cali'.




I'm going to say no because I still struggle with my weight issues when it comes to the losing/gaining aspect. I shouldn't gain, period. My health and body just won't tolerate it. That doesn't mean I haven't gained or lost a few pounds here and there. It's a constant struggle. 

On the other hand, Dims _has_ inspired me to be more open about my weight. My every day manner has changed. For example, the word "fat" is no longer forbidden from my vocabulary. Before coming here it was as if saying the word would make my fatness more noticeable to others. Talk about living in denial. Now I say it all the time. Ironically, I notice when I use it others become uncomfortable, as if I just swore. *Shrug*

Anyway, that is only one example of how Dims has inspired me to change but as for gaining, no. I have lost weight while here and I have gained but I wouldn't say Dims has _inspired_ me to do either. :bow:


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## Jes (Dec 12, 2007)

Fascinita said:


> Oh, God. I'm seeing rows of kittens.
> 
> I dig what you're saying about the price to pay for relatively little income, but I still don't see it as a moral issue (as in, "it's amoral to gain weight to make a living.") The moral issues, if there are any, to me might be in choosing to make a living by selling sex, or in why women's work is undervalued compared to that of men. But you know me: devil's advocate.



oh. i didn't realize we were framing this as moral v. immoral. Let me double back...

frankly, when people at Dims talk about gaining weight and moral issues, it's almost always men who like fat (or very fat) women, battling that issue out for themselves. Is this thread about porn? I don't even remember what the hell this is about. But if it's about porn, and a man asked it, and it involves gaining and liking fat women gaining, then i'm guessing THAT is where the moral overtones came from.

You may now pay me 5c.


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## Aurora (Dec 12, 2007)

*drops a nickel in Jes's coinpurse*

...that wasn't meant to be a pun, but now that I think about what the "other" coinpurse is that's kinda funny.

Ahem.

I'll add one more thing into this interesting discussion and say that I get slightly annoyed when people think that I, as a paysite girl, gain weight only for the members/money. Sure, I'm almost positive some do, and I can see where the assumption comes from, but I was gaining for self pleasure long before I was a model. Hell, before I knew what the Internet was. But I guess people are gonna believe what they want to believe I suppose.


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## LoveBHMS (Dec 12, 2007)

Observer said:


> I see nothing amoral about deliberately gaining weight if someone wants to do so from personal erotic desire, whether their own or even someone else's. I'm just saying that while feedees and foodies do exist, they are few in number.
> 
> I have heard anecdotal stories of people who gained weight deliberately to avoid unwelcome sexual attention, which I think is a sad way to address such an issue, but I think that's equally rare. Most people gain weight in my belief not from any deliberate effort. Rsather it is because of the unconscious interaction of seven elements, of which the first two are essential pre-requisites and one or more of the balance must be present.:
> 
> ...



Some people gain weight because they find it erotic. There are numerous examples on here of people saying this pretty openly. Maybe you don't understand it, but you don't have to. It's pretty simple; some people get off on gaining weight or by encouraging somebody else to gain weight. 

Unless a person is coerced into doing something they don't want to do, it really is not any big deal.

And frankly it annoys the heck out of me when I see posts like "Can somebody please explain feederism to me? I just don't get it." That is just like saying "Can somebody please articulate why they have a sexual preference for men instead of women? Or articulate why they like bondage or feet or small Asian women or anal sex." It's hard to articulate why something is arousing, and I can never understand WHY people feel a need to harangue the posters here who are into it into *explaining why.*


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## Observer (Dec 12, 2007)

Ummmm, Fascinita brought up the moral aspect of gaining weight, the OP asked about being inspired by the acceptance of size here at Dimensions to deliberately gain. I responded to those comments and said that deliberate gainers, for instance feedees or foodies, are rare. I made no judgment of them. 

I then went on to discuss the dynamics of what in my experience causes most gains. I don't recall anyone even raising the issue of explaining feederism. That's a whole different subject that I'll likely leave to others in a different thread.


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## Fascinita (Dec 12, 2007)

Bagalute said:


> It's a valid question, imo (not the one about Benedetto, my original one )
> And no, I wouldn't do anything I don't feel comfortable with just because it is "good for business". Of course it depends on the degree to which it makes me feel uncomfortable and the size of the business we are talking about.



Well, your question before did not frame anything in terms of whether it's comfortable or not. I understood that you were asking whether it's possible that some paysite models are not gaining for enjoyment, but that the gaining may be a marketing point.

As someone has already mentioned, some models do gain for pleasure. But it would strike me as disingenuous to hold that what we see on erotic/sex picture sites (spanning the gamut from boudoir to hardcore, I suppose I want to say) is not often a playful simulation of given scenarios that are more or less popular with the paying public. If I were a professional erotic model, I'd certainly be interested in how to maximize returns for my efforts. I imagine that might include projecting a certain exaggerated erotic image of my body, if I knew that was what "sold."


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## Fascinita (Dec 12, 2007)

Jes said:


> oh. i didn't realize we were framing this as moral v. immoral. Let me double back...
> 
> frankly, when people at Dims talk about gaining weight and moral issues, it's almost always men who like fat (or very fat) women, battling that issue out for themselves. Is this thread about porn? I don't even remember what the hell this is about. But if it's about porn, and a man asked it, and it involves gaining and liking fat women gaining, then i'm guessing THAT is where the moral overtones came from.
> 
> You may now pay me 5c.



Only because SlackerFA was questioning whether it was moral to gain weight for profit. So I brought up the parallel of Robert DeNiro, etc.

I think the thread was about whether the Paysites or Dimensions at large (heehehe) ever encouraged anyone to gain weight. I helped hijack it to a discussion over the "morality" of gaining weight. But in my defense I was responding to questions that others had posed.

Ch-Ching! Pay to the order of Jes.


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## Fascinita (Dec 12, 2007)

Observer said:


> Ummmm, Fascinita brought up the moral aspect of gaining weight, .



Observer, no I did not. If you read back far enough (as an editor should  ) you'll see that I was responding to someone else who originally brought up the question of morals in weight gain.


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## Observer (Dec 12, 2007)

Correction accepted. I was inspired to a response by seeing your reference to the moral aspect, but you indeed were not the first to raise that aspect of the original discussion. 

The point of my post was that neither of us were, in my view, referencing feederism as another poster presumed; we and others here have been talking about deliberate weight gain. Such activity does not automatically equate to feederism.


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## alienlanes (Dec 13, 2007)

Fascinita said:


> Observer, no I did not. If you read back far enough (as an editor should  ) you'll see that I was responding to someone else who originally brought up the question of morals in weight gain.



Yah. All my fault .

As per your request, I've been mulling this over. "Moral" was a bad choice of words -- I'm describing a personal reaction, not a general principle -- but as a consumer of paysite product, I get squicked out by the idea of a model gaining solely for the sake of increasing sales. 

Some of my distaste, probably most of it, comes from making assumptions about what's going on inside their heads, but when I sit down and think it through, I realize I that I don't have any solid grounds for those assumptions.

Beyond that, I guess I'm uncomfortable with being "marketed to," especially in something as intimate as sexual desire. But that beef is with capitalism, not with paysite models .


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## LoveBHMS (Dec 13, 2007)

Observer said:


> Correction accepted. I was inspired to a response by seeing your reference to the moral aspect, but you indeed were not the first to raise that aspect of the original discussion.
> 
> The point of my post was that neither of us were, in my view, referencing feederism as another poster presumed; we and others here have been talking about deliberate weight gain. Such activity does not automatically equate to feederism.



If you read my post, what I said is that some people gain weight deliberately because they find it sexually arousing. You listed a number of reasons why people would gain, and said you didn't know of anyone intentionally gaining for reasons not on your list.

My reference to feederism was just an extension of saying that in the same way that many people don't understand erotic weight gain, they also don't understand feederism or have a mistaken view of what it entails.


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