# Made an FA?



## Emma (Dec 15, 2006)

My little 16 year old mate turned up at my house yesterday begging me to go out with him and his friend (who is my age). So I jumped into a shower and then walked up to meet him. The whole night went on until it was about 2:30am and we were all sat in the corner of the club. We were all high on something and my little 16 year old friend wanted a hug. I gave him a hug and he loudly exclaimed. "Ohhhhhhh my God you're SO soft" with a big grin on his face. I laughed and said that's one of the best things about fat girls. He said with a cheeky smile on his face, "you're not fat, just more chushin' for the pushin'" bless him. I think an FA might just have been born though


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## This1Yankee (Dec 15, 2006)

KUDOS.... haha, I love the "high on something" bit. Classic 

Good job, Girl!


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## KuroBara (Dec 15, 2006)

CurvyEm said:


> My little 16 year old mate turned up at my house yesterday begging me to go out with him and his friend (who is my age). So I jumped into a shower and then walked up to meet him. The whole night went on until it was about 2:30am and we were all sat in the corner of the club. We were all high on something and my little 16 year old friend wanted a hug. I gave him a hug and he loudly exclaimed. "Ohhhhhhh my God you're SO soft" with a big grin on his face. I laughed and said that's one of the best things about fat girls. He said with a cheeky smile on his face, "you're not fat, just more chushin' for the pushin'" bless him. I think an FA might just have been born though


 


Yes, YES, YESSSS!!! Convert them all!!


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## Webmaster (Dec 15, 2006)

CurvyEm said:


> My little 16 year old mate turned up at my house yesterday begging me to go out with him and his friend (who is my age). So I jumped into a shower and then walked up to meet him. The whole night went on until it was about 2:30am and we were all sat in the corner of the club. We were all high on something and my little 16 year old friend wanted a hug. I gave him a hug and he loudly exclaimed. "Ohhhhhhh my God you're SO soft" with a big grin on his face. I laughed and said that's one of the best things about fat girls. He said with a cheeky smile on his face, "you're not fat, just more chushin' for the pushin'" bless him. I think an FA might just have been born though



Cool story, but man, times must have changed. When I was 16 I was doing nothing but studying and studying, and being in a club during the week at 2:30AM would have been utterly unthinkable.


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## ChickletsBBW (Dec 15, 2006)

woohoo.. that's awesome Em !! convert all the boys over there to big girl lovers


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## Jon Blaze (Dec 15, 2006)

Splendid!

I've only converted one person in my life, and at the time we were both only 14. It's kind of funny because he did make fun of me once he found out. Then I had to support him later on...


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## snuggletiger (Dec 15, 2006)

what if you are already born a big girl lover?


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## T_Devil (Dec 15, 2006)

16 is a crucial age. That's when the peer pressure is at it's worst. If he can be so open about it at 16, then that shows he has no "peer fear". 

This one is _strong_ with the force!


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## moonvine (Dec 15, 2006)

CurvyEm said:


> He said with a cheeky smile on his face, "you're not fat, just more chushin' for the pushin'" bless him.



Anyone who says that around me is highly, highly likely to get a drink dumped over their head. And that's if I'm in a GOOD mood. Such a nasty little saying...


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## T_Devil (Dec 15, 2006)

moonvine said:


> Anyone who says that around me is highly, highly likely to get a drink dumped over their head. And that's if I'm in a GOOD mood. Such a nasty little saying...


I used to think so too, but after a while I just sort of excepted it as the skinny worlds form of a compliment because they don't know what else to say. It sounds awkward and crude and it _is_ awkward and crude.... but that's the best they can do. It's not a full on, insult so that's a good thing.

We've got to take the compliments where we can get them in whatever form we can get them in. It's not desperation, it's being able to take a compliment in any form. We have to loosen up. We have to let go of some of these issues that we have with certain terms and expressions or otherwise we are just going to be seen as a bunch of up tight cry-babies that can't take a joke and/or can't take a compliment. And that's not helping anyone.


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## moonvine (Dec 15, 2006)

T_Devil said:


> I used to think so too, but after a while I just sort of excepted it as the skinny worlds form of a compliment because they don't know what else to say. It sounds awkward and crude and it _is_ awkward and crude.... but that's the best they can do. It's not a full on, insult so that's a good thing.
> 
> We've got to take the compliments where we can get them in whatever form we can get them in. It's not desperation, it's being able to take a compliment in any form. We have to loosen up. We have to let go of some of these issues that we have with certain terms and expressions or otherwise we are just going to be seen as a bunch of up tight cry-babies that can't take a joke and/or can't take a compliment. And that's not helping anyone.



Sorry, but anyone who hasn't got the good sense to figure out how to say "You look really nice today" or "Don't you look pretty?" isn't anyone I particularly want to be dealing with. It doesn't take much. Don't ask me to take locker room talk as a compliment, though, because I am not going to. Keep it in the locker room. If people want to see me as an up tight cry-baby who can't take a compliment, that is their perogative. They'll still be just as wet from the drink over their head if they start with the locker room talk.


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## James (Dec 15, 2006)

ChickletsBBW said:


> woohoo.. that's awesome Em !! convert all the boys over there to big girl lovers



haha... some of us dont need converting...


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## T_Devil (Dec 15, 2006)

moonvine said:


> Sorry, but anyone who hasn't got the good sense to figure out how to say "You look really nice today" or "Don't you look pretty?" isn't anyone I particularly want to be dealing with. It doesn't take much. Don't ask me to take locker room talk as a compliment, though, because I am not going to. Keep it in the locker room. If people want to see me as an up tight cry-baby who can't take a compliment, that is their perogative. They'll still be just as wet from the drink over their head if they start with the locker room talk.


Throw as many drinks as you want then, it's a waste of pefectly good drink though.


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## metalheadFA (Dec 15, 2006)

James said:


> haha... some of us dont need converting...



Damn straight!


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## moonvine (Dec 15, 2006)

T_Devil said:


> Throw as many drinks as you want then, it's a waste of pefectly good drink though.



I said that is if I was in a good mood. If I was in a bad one they'd get a knee to the crotch. Much cheaper.


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## T_Devil (Dec 15, 2006)

moonvine said:


> I said that is if I was in a good mood. If I was in a bad one they'd get a knee to the crotch. Much cheaper.


That's called assault.


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## Fairia (Dec 15, 2006)

Awesome. Now I wish for all the FA's in my area would come out of hiding  .


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## BigBeautifulMe (Dec 15, 2006)

T-Devil - your argument that fat women should take a compliment like that because it's at least _some_ sort of compliment and would show that we know how to take one is tenuous at best.

Would you expect a skinny girl to take "Hey, nice rack!" as a compliment, and accept it graciously? Of course not!

I for one, get frequent compliments, and know how to take them all in stride. I'm not out to prove anything to anyone, and if someone's "compliment" looks more like (in moonvine's words) "locker room talk," you can bet your sweet arse I'm going to call them on it. 

And the "assault" thing? Sometimes it's warranted.


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## TallFatSue (Dec 15, 2006)

T_Devil said:


> Throw as many drinks as you want then, it's a waste of pefectly good drink though.


Agreed. If I had doused a certain fella with as many drinks as he deserved for the less-than-eloquent things he said to me when we were dating, he probably would have drowned! Then I never would have married that well-intentioned but socially inept sweetheart. Good thing I recognized a diamond in the rough. He's MUCH better now.


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## ripley (Dec 15, 2006)

The "cushion for the pushin" guy is 16. I wouldn't expect flowery compliments from anyone that age, lol, and I certainly wouldn't do something horrid back to him for saying it. Perhaps tell him that "You're absolutely breathtaking" is a far better compliment....maybe in ten or fifteen years he'll be able to pull it off.


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## Rosie (Dec 15, 2006)

moonvine said:


> Sorry, but anyone who hasn't got the good sense to figure out how to say "You look really nice today" or "Don't you look pretty?" isn't anyone I particularly want to be dealing with. It doesn't take much. Don't ask me to take locker room talk as a compliment, though, because I am not going to. Keep it in the locker room. If people want to see me as an up tight cry-baby who can't take a compliment, that is their perogative. They'll still be just as wet from the drink over their head if they start with the locker room talk.




I soooooooo agree with you on this. I find that expression vulgar and find nothing complimentary about it. IF that makes me "uptight", so be it. ::shrug::


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## Fuzzy Necromancer (Dec 15, 2006)

T_Devil said:


> 16 is a crucial age. That's when the peer pressure is at it's worst. If he can be so open about it at 16, then that shows he has no "peer fear".
> 
> This one is _strong_ with the force!



Well, they _were_ high at the time. That might have something to do with peer fear and reduction thereof.


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## moonvine (Dec 15, 2006)

ripley said:


> The "cushion for the pushin" guy is 16. I wouldn't expect flowery compliments from anyone that age, lol, and I certainly wouldn't do something horrid back to him for saying it. Perhaps tell him that "You're absolutely breathtaking" is a far better compliment....maybe in ten or fifteen years he'll be able to pull it off.



Well, I'm 40. If a 16 year old came up to me and tried to come on to me I'd be...concerned, to say the least. 

16 is plenty old enough to learn that for every action, there is a reaction, though. I'm sure things have changed greatly since I was in school, but way back in the dark ages after I walked 20 miles uphill in the snow both ways barefoot to get to school you wouldn't say the thin girl equivalent of that (whatever that might be) to a cheerleader and expect to get a positive reaction. 

16 might be too young for "you're absolutely breathtaking", but I don't think it is too young for "you look nice today." I don't think six is too young for "you look nice today."


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## BigCutieSasha (Dec 15, 2006)

CurvyEm said:


> My little 16 year old mate turned up at my house yesterday begging me to go out with him and his friend (who is my age). So I jumped into a shower and then walked up to meet him. The whole night went on until it was about 2:30am and we were all sat in the corner of the club. We were all high on something and my little 16 year old friend wanted a hug. I gave him a hug and he loudly exclaimed. "Ohhhhhhh my God you're SO soft" with a big grin on his face. I laughed and said that's one of the best things about fat girls. He said with a cheeky smile on his face, "you're not fat, just more chushin' for the pushin'" bless him. I think an FA might just have been born though



I love this story. It reminded me of this summer. I work at a camp during the summer for a week. The same camp I went to as a teen. And the kids there are high school age. Well... after talking about it with a few FA's I know, I might have either made a few FA's, or really made the week of a few exisiting FA's at camp. I had this group of guys making me jewlery, giving me candy, telling me I should go swimming and the same guys sitting with me at practically every meal! lol It was so cute. Big hugs all the time. One of them even picked me up during a hug circle and said, " I love you." And I replied," Awww hun, I luv you too." And again he said," No, I love you." I just smiled and was like..."ok"...  I hope he finds a nice fat high school girl his age.


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## T_Devil (Dec 15, 2006)

BigCutieSasha said:


> I love this story. It reminded me of this summer. I work at a camp during the summer for a week. The same camp I went to as a teen. And the kids there are high school age. Well... after talking about it with a few FA's I know, I might have either made a few FA's, or really made the week of a few exisiting FA's at camp. I had this group of guys making me jewlery, giving me candy, telling me I should go swimming and the same guys sitting with me at practically every meal! lol It was so cute. Big hugs all the time. One of them even picked me up during a hug circle and said, " I love you." And I replied," Awww hun, I luv you too." And again he said," No, I love you." I just smiled and was like..."ok"...  I hope he finds a nice fat high school girl his age.


That's awesome!


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## Carrie (Dec 15, 2006)

moonvine said:


> Well, I'm 40. If a 16 year old came up to me and tried to come on to me I'd be...concerned, to say the least.
> 
> 16 is plenty old enough to learn that for every action, there is a reaction, though. I'm sure things have changed greatly since I was in school, but way back in the dark ages after I walked 20 miles uphill in the snow both ways barefoot to get to school you wouldn't say the thin girl equivalent of that (whatever that might be) to a cheerleader and expect to get a positive reaction.
> 
> 16 might be too young for "you're absolutely breathtaking", but I don't think it is too young for "you look nice today." I don't think six is too young for "you look nice today."



You expect a great deal from the average 16 year old. When I was 16, I said stupid shit constantly, and I learned most from people who corrected me graciously and constructively, vs. those who overreacted and assumed I was an evil, ill-mannered child who deserved some form of corporal punishment for my faux pas. T-Devil is right. In anything, not just size acceptance, if people perceive you (and I mean the general "you") as humorless, or a zealot, they shut down, assume you're a jerk, and don't hear a word you say. 

I think it's all a matter of the perception of the sincerity of a compliment given, really. The sincerity behind it is much more important than the words themselves. This past summer I was driving somewhere with my windows down when two guys in a pickup truck pulled up beside me rather purposefully and kept pace with me for a mile or so. I finally glanced over at them and saw them both looking at me and grinning. Sadly, I actually steeled myself for an insult, until one of them yelled out, "We LOVE big girls! You're beautiful!!" I really wasn't sure how to react until it hit me that they were being sincere, and that that was their way of paying a pretty girl a sincere compliment. Inappropriate to some? Sure. Unusual, in my world? Definitely. But obviously sincere. So I blushed five hundred shades of red, smiled, waved at them, and yelled "Thank you!". It pretty much made my day. Much more so than, say, someone walking up to me and blandly saying, "You look nice today." 

Last, re. the hypotheticals "what I would do if someone said that to me": let's not forget that this kid is a friend of Em's. He's bound to say things to her that he probably would not dream of saying to a 40 year old woman he doesn't know.


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## T_Devil (Dec 15, 2006)

Carrie said:


> You expect a great deal from the average 16 year old. When I was 16, I said stupid shit constantly, and I learned most from people who corrected me graciously and constructively, vs. those who overreacted and assumed I was an evil, ill-mannered child who deserved some form of corporal punishment for my faux pas. T-Devil is right. In anything, not just size acceptance, if people perceive you (and I mean the general "you") as humorless, or a zealot, they shut down, assume you're a jerk, and don't hear a word you say.
> 
> I think it's all a matter of the perception of the sincerity of a compliment given, really. The sincerity behind it is much more important than the words themselves. This past summer I was driving somewhere with my windows down when two guys in a pickup truck pulled up beside me rather purposefully and kept pace with me for a mile or so. I finally glanced over at them and saw them both looking at me and grinning. Sadly, I actually steeled myself for an insult, until one of them yelled out, "We LOVE big girls! You're beautiful!!" I really wasn't sure how to react until it hit me that they were being sincere, and that that was their way of paying a pretty girl a sincere compliment. Inappropriate to some? Sure. Unusual, in my world? Definitely. But obviously sincere. So I blushed five hundred shades of red, smiled, waved at them, and yelled "Thank you!". It pretty much made my day. Much more so than, say, someone walking up to me and blandly saying, "You look nice today."
> 
> Last, re. the hypotheticals "what I would do if someone said that to me": let's not forget that this kid is a friend of Em's. He's bound to say things to her that he probably would not dream of saying to a 40 year old woman he doesn't know.



No, it's ok. Let her think the way that she wants. Let the world TRY and live up to her expectations. Meanwhile, here on the planet Earth we take things as they happen and we deal with them in the moment. We can either just let it go and go about our day and work on our own self image... OR we can scold and curse and swear and cry and complain and eventually make an even bigger scene.

Yeah, that's real mature. I liked it when she talked about kneeing guys in the crotch. Yeah, that's classic. It's not like that would be an assault charge that would end up tying up our court system by some jackass that wanted some payback on a fat chick that couldn't have just walked away but instead she had to go and smash him in the joeys.


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## Emma (Dec 15, 2006)

To the people that have taken offence to this: The boy was trying to give me a compliment. Both him and the rest of society think of fat as an insult. Which is probably why he tried to tell me that I wasn't fat. Because at 16 (before he's had chance to learn about life, body sizes and preference) he doesn't realise that fat is anything BUT offencive. He was probably trying to re-assure me that I wasn't this 'offencive' fat, that he's heard about. If that makes sense? You must remember that out of our community people think the word FAT is offencive, and an insulting word. He was trying to be nice. And to be honest, I'd rather people that age could be accepting over all sizes than be horrible, and i'd NEVER throw a drink over someone who was trying SO hard to be nice to me.


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## T_Devil (Dec 16, 2006)

CurvyEm said:


> To the people that have taken offence to this: The boy was trying to give me a compliment. Both him and the rest of society think of fat as an insult. Which is probably why he tried to tell me that I wasn't fat. Because at 16 (before he's had chance to learn about life, body sizes and preference) he doesn't realise that fat is anything BUT offencive. He was probably trying to re-assure me that I wasn't this 'offencive' fat, that he's heard about. If that makes sense? You must remember that out of our community people think the word FAT is offencive, and an insulting word. He was trying to be nice. And to be honest, I'd rather people that age could be accepting over all sizes than be horrible, and i'd NEVER throw a drink over someone who was trying SO hard to be nice to me.


I totally understand. He was just saying what he felt, but he didn't want to step on any pride and he was being mindful of your feelings. It's awkward, ESPECIALLY at 16. I give this kid a world of respect and I hope that he grows into a fine fat loving man!  I think that because he's in touch with that part of himself that he is already on the road to accepting that and growing from that realization.

I think he's awesome!


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## Fuzzy Necromancer (Dec 16, 2006)

moonvine said:


> Well, I'm 40. If a 16 year old came up to me and tried to come on to me I'd be...concerned, to say the least.
> 
> 16 is plenty old enough to learn that for every action, there is a reaction, though. I'm sure things have changed greatly since I was in school, but way back in the dark ages after I walked 20 miles uphill in the snow both ways barefoot to get to school you wouldn't say the thin girl equivalent of that (whatever that might be) to a cheerleader and expect to get a positive reaction.
> 
> 16 might be too young for "you're absolutely breathtaking", but I don't think it is too young for "you look nice today." I don't think six is too young for "you look nice today."




In his defense, *he was high*. Isn't that what the opening post said?


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## T_Devil (Dec 16, 2006)

BigBeautifulMe said:


> T-Devil - your argument that fat women should take a compliment like that because it's at least _some_ sort of compliment and would show that we know how to take one is tenuous at best.
> 
> Would you expect a skinny girl to take "Hey, nice rack!" as a compliment, and accept it graciously? Of course not!
> 
> ...


I just saw this one, So, I want to clairify a few things.

First. I'm saying you can take the satement however you want, it's your business and I do not care how you take it. Light 'em on fire for all I care. *MY OPINION* is to just let it go, there are worse things in the world like "PUT THE FORK DOWN FATTY!":shocked: There are things to get upset over, for real. Hell, there are somethings I'll get into fights over. _More cusion for the pushin'_ is hardly one of them.

Second. Ever get charged with assault? I haven't, you know why? Because I don't put my knees into peoples crotches that upset me. You don't think a guy would press charges over that kind of stuff? In this day and age? Never underestimate the other guys greed. Besides, if women thinks it's ok to knee a guy in the crotch, is it ok for a guy to slap a girl in the boob? Remember, we're talking equal rights here... you can't have it both ways. You can't think you can go and beat up on men and think that they can't touch you. _What if you're wrong?
_


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## Fuzzy Necromancer (Dec 16, 2006)

I want to come out here and point out that, in matters of the heart, many guys have the brains of a walnut, and honestly, a kick to the nuts is a grossly inappropriate, disproportionate, immature, agressive, and immoral reaction to a verbal insult, particularly if its something that a doped up teenager thinks is a complement. 

Seriously, why would you think it's okay to do that? That doesn't even exist in options other than self defense or humorous hyperbole. And what if they want to hit back? If somebody kneed me in the groin, I would not pause to consider how my words my have injured their self esteem. I would scream like musk ox in labour and flip out and bite them.


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## T_Devil (Dec 16, 2006)

Fuzzy Necromancer said:


> I want to come out here and point out that, in matters of the heart, many guys have the brains of a walnut, and honestly, a kick to the nuts is a grossly inappropriate, disproportionate, immature, agressive, and immoral reaction to a verbal insult, particularly if its something that a doped up teenager thinks is a complement.
> 
> Seriously, why would you think it's okay to do that? That doesn't even exist in options other than self defense or humorous hyperbole. And what if they want to hit back? If somebody kneed me in the groin, I would not pause to consider how my words my have injured their self esteem. I would scream like musk ox in labour and flip out and bite them.


You are my hero!


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## TallFatSue (Dec 16, 2006)

CurvyEm said:


> To the people that have taken offence to this: The boy was trying to give me a compliment. Both him and the rest of society think of fat as an insult. Which is probably why he tried to tell me that I wasn't fat. Because at 16 (before he's had chance to learn about life, body sizes and preference) he doesn't realise that fat is anything BUT offencive. He was probably trying to re-assure me that I wasn't this 'offencive' fat, that he's heard about. If that makes sense? You must remember that out of our community people think the word FAT is offencive, and an insulting word. He was trying to be nice. And to be honest, I'd rather people that age could be accepting over all sizes than be horrible, and i'd NEVER throw a drink over someone who was trying SO hard to be nice to me.


Exactly. We've been brainwashed almost since birth that fat is bad, and the word "fat" is an insult. There are more fat people than ever, but most don't like _being_ fat. Then combine the fact that most men find it hard to express their feelings, and it gets interesting. As a girl I hated being fat, but people told me I had such pretty eyes, hair etc. So when they said "you have such a lovely face" I assumed they insulted my weight by omission. When I began to blossom during adolescence and I heard compliments about my arms, legs, figure etc., I didn't know what to think. Nice legs? Couldn't they see how fat I was?  

Nowadays I'm perfectly happy with my size, but it still knocks me a little off balance when someone comes right out and says I have such gorgeous FAT. As a girl I would have cringed. It takes a lot of maturity to give and receive weight-related compliments in general society. I probably reached my next level of maturity when I could accept a weight-related compliment, even one that was awkwardly expressed. "Too bad I'm so fat, right?" "Believe me, it's in all the right places." Awwww.  

Even here in the context of Dimensions where men practically worship our fat, it gets interesting sometimes. Just try telling a woman in the street that she has a beautiful huge hanging belly!


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## Wayne_Zitkus (Dec 16, 2006)

CurvyEm said:


> My little 16 year old mate turned up at my house yesterday begging me to go out with him and his friend (who is my age). So I jumped into a shower and then walked up to meet him. The whole night went on until it was about 2:30am and we were all sat in the corner of the club. We were all high on something and my little 16 year old friend wanted a hug. I gave him a hug and he loudly exclaimed. "Ohhhhhhh my God you're SO soft" with a big grin on his face. I laughed and said that's one of the best things about fat girls. He said with a cheeky smile on his face, "you're not fat, just more chushin' for the pushin'" bless him. I think an FA might just have been born though



It's a cute story and all, Em, but as a father I have a problem with it.

You were clubbing with a 16-year-old until 2:30 AM??? I don't know what the law is where you are, but here in the US of A that could be considered "contributing to the delinquency of a minor".


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## Emma (Dec 16, 2006)

We were out till 4. lol The rules here are 18 but hardly anyone has a problem getting in a club at 16/17. I doubt there's any rules about it, I dunno. His Dad doesn't care, he gives him money and picks him up from the club. It's not really my problem.


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## Aireman (Dec 16, 2006)

ripley said:


> The "cushion for the pushin" guy is 16. I wouldn't expect flowery compliments from anyone that age, lol



I agree, he is 16 talking to a friend (mate)! While I'm for the most part willing to admit that most of us guy's shouldn't be allowed to even be considered off the leash until 30! :doh: Hopefully some considerations can be made!


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## EtobicokeFA (Dec 18, 2006)

Good work on the convertion!


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## This1Yankee (Dec 18, 2006)

Fuzzy Necromancer said:


> I want to come out here and point out that, in matters of the heart, many guys have the brains of a walnut, and honestly, a kick to the nuts is a grossly inappropriate, disproportionate, immature, agressive, and immoral reaction to a verbal insult, particularly if its something that a doped up teenager thinks is a complement.
> 
> Seriously, why would you think it's okay to do that? That doesn't even exist in options other than self defense or humorous hyperbole. And what if they want to hit back? If somebody kneed me in the groin, I would not pause to consider how my words my have injured their self esteem. I would scream like musk ox in labour and flip out and bite them.



I would never flip out on a guy that said anything like that to me. NOW, if he said "You dirty ho scumbag, I pity the man that eventually has sex with you," then that might deserve a knee in the groin or THREE. But not something that was intended as a compliment and just came off the wrong way. In that case, I would just laugh and smack him on the ass, playfully. SO I wholeheartedly agree with your statement. 

ESPECIALLY the "men have brains the size of walnuts" part. 
*crosses legs to prevent kick in the ovaries*


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## BigCutieSasha (Dec 18, 2006)

I have had comments directed at me that were pro fat and some that were putting down my fat. In any case I would NEVER kick a guy in the balls. I've had male friends tell me its like a feeling of wanting to throw up and die. Even when the comments have been as harsh as to say," Isn't it illegal to be that fat?" Granted I wanted to punch that guy in the face, I still just went on. I've never been in a physical fight before, so call me a passivist. I would however do some kicking in the family jewels if my safety was threatened.


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## Wagimawr (Dec 18, 2006)

Just thought I'd chime in here - you don't have to land a shot exactly on the spot to cause that *hurk!* sensation >_>


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## Fuzzy Necromancer (Dec 18, 2006)

Aireman said:


> I agree, he is 16 talking to a friend (mate)! While I'm for the most part willing to admit that most of us guy's shouldn't be allowed to even be considered off the leash until 30! :doh: Hopefully some considerations can be made!



Another problem is that flowery comments can be misconstrued even worse. I think that if I told a girl what I thought of her in impromtu free verse, she'd quickly edge away or suspect me of being a con artist or something. >.>;


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## duncwa (Dec 18, 2006)

The compliment "more pushin....." is not really a compliment by many standards. Yet, I must mention that I have, more than once, professed to a a fat woman how beautiful she is and the result was a great deal less thank you. 

You must cut the 16 old some slack. He's only saying what he hear's in the pop culture....I mean, I have an 11 year old daughter and when she was 5 she blurted out in a store aisle, in a most unpleasent tone, the fatness of a woman. 

She had learned to be negative towards fat at such an early age. I was dismayed.

Duncan


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## James (Dec 18, 2006)

BigCutieSasha said:


> I have had comments directed at me that were pro fat and some that were putting down my fat. In any case I would NEVER kick a guy in the balls. I've had male friends tell me its like a feeling of wanting to throw up and die. Even when the comments have been as harsh as to say," Isn't it illegal to be that fat?" Granted I wanted to punch that guy in the face, I still just went on. I've never been in a physical fight before, so call me a passivist. I would however do some kicking in the family jewels if my safety was threatened.



shut up you plum... 

i've heard all about your (lack of) ass kicking skills....

you couldnt kick your way out of a paper bag...lol


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## fatgirlflyin (Dec 18, 2006)

Wayne_Zitkus said:


> It's a cute story and all, Em, but as a father I have a problem with it.
> 
> You were clubbing with a 16-year-old until 2:30 AM??? I don't know what the law is where you are, but here in the US of A that could be considered "contributing to the delinquency of a minor".



You know I'm actually glad that this point was brought up because I was thinking the same thing as a mom. That and the getting high part...


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## Emma (Dec 18, 2006)

Hey I didn't give him the E's, infact he got mine for me! He'd do it anyway. So what if I'm there or not.


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## fatgirlflyin (Dec 18, 2006)

CurvyEm said:


> Hey I didn't give him the E's, infact he got mine for me! He'd do it anyway. So what if I'm there or not.



I wouldn't spend time with a 16 year old boy in a social situation, but if for whatever reason I did find myself in the company of a 16 year old child and he was doing drugs or drinking I would have to say something to him about it being inappropriate behavior. Maybe its just me but I'd feel awful if he were hurt as a result of him being high and I didn't say or do anything to try to prevent it.


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## Emma (Dec 18, 2006)

Ella Bella said:


> I wouldn't spend time with a 16 year old boy in a social situation, but if for whatever reason I did find myself in the company of a 16 year old child and he was doing drugs or drinking I would have to say something to him about it being inappropriate behavior. Maybe its just me but I'd feel awful if he were hurt as a result of him being high and I didn't say or do anything to try to prevent it.



He goes to college with my best mate. And he tags along with our group. Even if I said something it wouldn't matter, he'd do it anyway. Better someone is keeping an eye on him than having him doing it, than him doing it alone which he would.


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## Wayne_Zitkus (Dec 18, 2006)

Ella Bella said:


> You know I'm actually glad that this point was brought up because I was thinking the same thing as a mom. That and the getting high part...



THANK YOU.

At least one other person saw this from a parent's perspective.


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## Cutie 1985 (Dec 19, 2006)

CurvyEm said:


> He goes to college with my best mate. And he tags along with our group. Even if I said something it wouldn't matter, he'd do it anyway. Better someone is keeping an eye on him than having him doing it, than him doing it alone which he would.



I'm with u here ... when I was 19, my lil bro was 16, and my boyf and my bro would smoke out all the time together, they still do. Often, it would be my boyf, his friends, my bro and his friends, and i would be there (but i don't smoke) ... If I told my bro to stop he wouldn't listen, he would go smoke out with someone else ... ALSO, this is just like when underage college students get older students to buy them alcohol b/c they are not 21 yet ... it's the norm, many parent's just don't know.

... I understand this may sound irresponsible to a parent, but I'm not parent yet, sorry.


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## Wayne_Zitkus (Dec 19, 2006)

Cutie 1985 said:


> ... I understand this may sound irresponsible to a parent, but I'm not parent yet, sorry.


When you become a parent and are fully responsible for the care and nrturing of another human being, you'll see this from a different perspective.


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## Emma (Dec 19, 2006)

Wayne_Zitkus said:


> When you become a parent and are fully responsible for the care and nrturing of another human being, you'll see this from a different perspective.



Or prehaps she'll remember what it was like being 16 herself.


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## Wayne_Zitkus (Dec 19, 2006)

CurvyEm said:


> Or prehaps she'll remember what it was like being 16 herself.



Believe me, Em - when YOU become a mother, you'll see this in a different perspective, too. I'm sorry, but I see this as irresponsible behavior on your part.


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## Emma (Dec 19, 2006)

Wayne_Zitkus said:


> Believe me, Em - when YOU become a mother, you'll see this in a different perspective, too. I'm sorry, but I see this as irresponsible behavior on your part.



Well I don't. I see it as not being my problem. I was doing a lot worse at 16, and I know I'd rather my kids be in a club on a couple of E's rather than getting pissed in the park.


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## mmm12mmm (Dec 19, 2006)

CurvyEm said:


> To the people that have taken offence to this: The boy was trying to give me a compliment. Both him and the rest of society think of fat as an insult. Which is probably why he tried to tell me that I wasn't fat. Because at 16 (before he's had chance to learn about life, body sizes and preference) he doesn't realise that fat is anything BUT offencive. He was probably trying to re-assure me that I wasn't this 'offencive' fat, that he's heard about. If that makes sense? You must remember that out of our community people think the word FAT is offencive, and an insulting word. He was trying to be nice. And to be honest, I'd rather people that age could be accepting over all sizes than be horrible, and i'd NEVER throw a drink over someone who was trying SO hard to be nice to me.



Actually now priorities have a little changed, and 2 centuries ago priorities of female beauty were declined aside fatties, and to receive a compliment: " As you are charmingly fat " was perceived absolutely in another way. 
Yes, this young guy has understood, that it likes thick and very thick ladies, than thin more. I as and on its place would pay lady the same compliment. I do not see in it anything especial.
CurvyEm: perceive it as due and do not experience in occasion of your delightful superfluous pounds, they at you are fine, I know!


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## fatgirlflyin (Dec 19, 2006)

CurvyEm said:


> Or prehaps she'll remember what it was like being 16 herself.



I remember very well what it was like being 16. I did plenty of stupid stuff, nothing illegal though, and nothing with so much disregard for my own health. 

I also remember what it was like being 21, and I didn't spend my time hanging around with children helping them get high...


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## James (Dec 19, 2006)

easy all... come on... Em probably opened herself up to the criticism by over-elaborating on the details here but is this the right place for moralising and preaching at her?

and for all of you people getting ready to cast the first stone and what-not... dont tell me you've never done anything outside of the law with regards to this kind of thing...

and if you havent... then you really arent speaking from a position of knowledge about the matter... 

I've never done E... but i know a load of people who have... and there is pretty much NOTHING more immoral or wrong about these people than the next man... in relative terms, its a drug that's less harmful than fags and booze and is no more or less responsible for any presumed social decay or any other social ills than a whole load of other stuff...

basically, be less fast to judge is all i'm saying...


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## fatgirlflyin (Dec 19, 2006)

James said:


> easy all... come on... Em probably opened herself up to the criticism by over-elaborating on the details here but is this the right place for moralising and preaching at her?
> 
> and for all of you people getting ready to cast the first stone and what-not... dont tell me you've never done anything outside of the law with regards to this kind of thing...
> 
> ...



I could care less about her doing drugs, she can do drugs until she passes out behind a dumpster in an alley for all I care. Her body, her brain, and her decision. What bothers me is that she's doing them with a minor. That in my book is wrong...


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## xeeb (Dec 19, 2006)

As much as I dislike "cushion for the pushing" phrases it was given out by a teenage boy. When you _know_ that fat is not a good thing, and someone freely says they're fat, you tend to automatically say "you're not fat ..." insert compliment of choice at the end, when fat is viewed as unattractive it is important for the individual who likes the person who has just stated they're fat that they are not fat. And more explanations that have already been gone over. It was a compliment typical of what i'd expect from a teenager.

And yes this has been repeated over and over, apologies.


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## James (Dec 19, 2006)

Ella Bella said:


> I could care less about her doing drugs, she can do drugs until she passes out behind a dumpster in an alley for all I care. Her body, her brain, and her decision. What bothers me is that she's doing them with a minor. That in my book is wrong...



well... look... i dont want to cause negativity here... i'm just saying that in the "real" world... whether parents like it or not... this is the kind of thing that a lot of "minors" do... 

the very concept of "minor" is different between the US and UK anyway. People can smoke here at 16. If the government licences a drug like tobacco, for sale at that age, that kills and harms 10s of thousands of brits each year... what kind of a crazy double standard is it for them to outlaw one like E that takes the life of less than a dozen?

Its cos it isnt socially acceptable... it would lose votes...it isnt a moral decision based upon a medical position on the matter.

maybe its wrong to be facilitating or condoning the use of any illegal substance just because its been deemed illegal... maybe it isnt... 

It *isnt *something i'd do... but i'm not going to judge Em or make a fuss telling her off about it.

wrong and right are totally relative concepts... there are no absolutes... I still think its a poor show for people to come down heavy on Em... even if she did kinda bring it on herself...


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## Wagimawr (Dec 19, 2006)

What exactly is she supposed to do?

She said his dad doesn't care. He's probably been doing drugs as long as she has, and he's not going to stop. It wouldn't matter what Em, you, Wayne or anybody (save perhaps the authorities - maybe not even them) has to say about it.



CurvyEm said:


> Better someone is keeping an eye on him than having him doing it, than him doing it alone which he would.





Cutie 1985 said:


> he wouldn't listen, he would go smoke out with someone else



Besides, give him a few years on Ecstasy, and he'll have irreversible brain damage - then he can switch to more acceptable nursing home drugs.


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## Carrie (Dec 19, 2006)

I agree with James, not to mention the fact that the scolding has nothing to do with the original point of the thread, which was actually pretty interesting. I'm not into a fan of illegal activities with minors myself, but we're not the morality police here. The point has been made.


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## Emma (Dec 20, 2006)

Ella Bella said:


> I could care less about her doing drugs, she can do drugs until she passes out behind a dumpster in an alley for all I care. Her body, her brain, and her decision. What bothers me is that she's doing them with a minor. That in my book is wrong...



Yes, I have a minor with me who does drugs. Is it your problem? No. Am I giving him drugs? No. Would he do them anyway? Yes? Should I stop being his friend because he takes drugs? No. Do you honestly think that if I didn't hang with him he would stop doing them? Do you think the rest of *my* group give a flying fuck if he does drugs? He gets *my* drugs for me a lot of the time, and I can assure you that if he couldn't get them and I could that I would NEVER EVER IN A MILLION GOD DAMN YEARS sell him any drugs EVER. 

And for your infomation. I'm sat here at 04:55 with him FAST asleep IN MY BED because he's been out with a few of our friends, (I've not) they've all gone home and left him with no way of getting home. So I've gotten OUT of my bloody bed and let him go to sleep. You have NO idea what life is like here. So don't judge.


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## Emma (Dec 20, 2006)

Ella Bella said:


> I remember very well what it was like being 16. I did plenty of stupid stuff, nothing illegal though, and nothing with so much disregard for my own health.
> 
> I also remember what it was like being 21, and I didn't spend my time hanging around with children helping them get high...



How is me being friends with a person that gets high me helping them get high? Next you'll be telling me that me talking to a smoker is contributing to cancer.


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## Cutie 1985 (Dec 20, 2006)

CurvyEm said:


> How is me being friends with a person that gets high me helping them get high? Next you'll be telling me that me talking to a smoker is contributing to cancer.



ITA ... THANK YOU


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## lemmink (Dec 20, 2006)

Gee, this is completely unfair. She's his friend not his keeper.


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## Emma (Dec 20, 2006)

Wagimawr said:


> Besides, give him a few years on Ecstasy, and he'll have irreversible brain damage - then he can switch to more acceptable nursing home drugs.



I don't really think we know enough about ecstasy to say that. What most people read is propaganda. I know lots of people who have been doing it for years with no ill effect. (I've been doing it for 7 years) I've known ONE person who ended up in hospital after taking it (he'd had around 9 pills) but I know about 20 that have ended up in hospital from drinking too much and that's not including the thousands that end up there EVERY weekend. Be it from fights, accidents or alcohol poisening.


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## Wayne_Zitkus (Dec 20, 2006)

lemmink said:


> Gee, this is completely unfair. She's his friend not his keeper.


But by taking him where he can get drunk and use drugs, she's an enabler.


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## Emma (Dec 20, 2006)

Wayne_Zitkus said:


> But by taking him where he can get drunk and use drugs, she's an enabler.



Ok well NEXT time shall I sit at home while he goes anyway? Shall I not hang with my friends because he is there? You make it sound like I take him to these places, when actually the first time I met him was when I went out with my best mate to meet her college friends in a CLUB.


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## lemmink (Dec 20, 2006)

Wayne_Zitkus said:


> But by taking him where he can get drunk and use drugs, she's an enabler.



Okay, no. He's going to go out and do drugs and drink anyway, no matter what she does. But at least this way if something happens to him when she's around, she'll be able to help him out. 

Em, you sound like a great friend. I wish I had an older friend around to lend me their bed when I was a 16 year old party-girl.


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## KuroBara (Dec 20, 2006)

Ultimately, the only person who can take responsibility for this kid's action is him. He made a conscious choice to begin drugs and continue them. Well, he may be addicted, so he may not have chosen to continue them, but he did chose to take them. Until he gets sick of being deserted by friends, until he stops enjoying his high, no one can make him stop doing E. If Em were to say, "Dude, I don't like you doing that" all that would happen, unless he was ready to make a change and needed one more catalyst, would be he would get high before seeing Em, or stop seeing her all together. I don't see Em sitting there screaming "Chug-a-Lug" This kid is old enough to start making his own decisions and taking responsibility for his actions.


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## T_Devil (Dec 20, 2006)

Hey parents, maybe the lesson here is to pay attention to who *YOUR* kids go out with. Why is everybody elses children such a priority for you? Don't you already have your hands full? Geez us, keep your own kids out of trouble and don't think that they can't be tempted before you start fingering other people and their parenting.

Some people just suck at parenting. Unless you're offering to take _their_ kids under _your_ wing, don't you think you should perhaps worry about your own parenting issues. You could be screwing up your own kids and not even know it. It's not likely they're going to tell you ya know.


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## Wagimawr (Dec 20, 2006)

I see no reason Ella or Wayne would be screwing up their own kids, but I agree.

Whether or not EVERYTHING he does is dangerous, this kid's already in a mess, whether it's cause he's doing something illegal, dangerous or just plain stupid.

I fully second the "some people just suck at parenting" - in this case, it's not Em's job to act as a parent to the kid. She MET him in a bar, he's already knee deep all by himself.


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## Wayne_Zitkus (Dec 20, 2006)

T_Devil said:


> Hey parents, maybe the lesson here is to pay attention to who *YOUR* kids go out with. Why is everybody elses children such a priority for you? Don't you already have your hands full? Geez us, keep your own kids out of trouble and don't think that they can't be tempted before you start fingering other people and their parenting.
> 
> Some people just suck at parenting. Unless you're offering to take _their_ kids under _your_ wing, don't you think you should perhaps worry about your own parenting issues. You could be screwing up your own kids and not even know it. It's not likely they're going to tell you ya know.


Um, my kids turned out great, thank you. Their mother was a recovering alcoholic and they were both involved in Alateen when they were in high school. And they learned first-hand what abusing your body can do to you when their mother died at age 46 of heart and kidney failure. In other words, they both lost their mother before they were 25...... And BTW, my kids and I have a GREAT relationship, thank you.

I'm not gonna respond to this thread any more, because I can see it's going nowhere. Not as long as people are finding reasons to excuse bad behavior....


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## Wagimawr (Dec 20, 2006)

Wayne, how would you handle the situation? You obviously disapprove of Em continuing to allow the child to do drugs, so what would your approach be? 

Not as a father, but as someone in Em's position - a friend to the child.


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## Wayne_Zitkus (Dec 20, 2006)

Wagimawr said:


> Wayne, how would you handle the situation? You obviously disapprove of Em continuing to allow the child to do drugs, so what would your approach be?
> 
> Not as a father, but as someone in Em's position - a friend to the child.


Simple - get him to see that his drinking and drug use can kill him. Personally, I learned this first-hand when teh kid who sat next to me in Home Room for two years died of a heroin overdose near the start of my Senior Year of high school. Short of that, stop taking this kid to places where he can get high.


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## metalheadFA (Dec 20, 2006)

Ella Bella said:


> I could care less about her doing drugs, she can do drugs until she passes out behind a dumpster in an alley for all I care. Her body, her brain, and her decision. What bothers me is that she's doing them with a minor. That in my book is wrong...



There does come a point where if you dont experiment you look back and think what did I do with myself. Ive done drugs and illegal stuff not all of it was the cleverest and some of it was the best times of my life. I personally wouldnt hang out with someone that much younger than me but I also wouldnt feel it was my responsibility to moralise about the ills of our society and to be fair it was E it wasent like he was shooting up. The only reason E gets such a bad press is because governments havent found away of making money taxing it... One girl dies taking ecstacy fifteen will probably die of alcohol poisoning or wiping someone out drink driving.

As Bill Hicks said: Anyone who jumps out of a window while on acid deserves to die. If you think you can fly, take off from the ground first."


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## Tina (Dec 20, 2006)

Wayne_Zitkus said:


> Simple - get him to see that his drinking and drug use can kill him. Personally, I learned this first-hand when teh kid who sat next to me in Home Room for two years died of a heroin overdose near the start of my Senior Year of high school. Short of that, stop taking this kid to places where he can get high.



Yeah, drugs can definitely kill. But one person cannot control another that way. I don't think Em should allow this kid to get drugs for her, but other than that, there's not much she can do. It is not her responsiblity to parent him, and his parents have seemingly abdicated their job of raising him and he seems to be having to do it himself. 

Frankly, my teen years were spent getting fairly high and there was no person who could have controlled me or told me not to do it. If they would have told me nicely what could happen I would have listened politely and then gone on to do just what I wanted to. Had they ordered me not to do drugs, I would have told them to get fucked.

The ones at fault here are the parents, and maybe they should be turned in. I would advise Emma to distance herself from the kid as much as possible while still living her life; but I would also advise her to stop getting drugs from the kid. Doing that only keeps his hands in it, and I do believe that is ethically wrong.


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## GWARrior (Dec 20, 2006)

My parents are old hippie stoners. Hell, they taught me how to roll a joint and they give me some of their stuff. They certainly arent bad parents. They always told me to go to them for weed instead of some dealer I dont know.


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## Wayne_Zitkus (Dec 20, 2006)

Tina said:


> Yeah, drugs can definitely kill. But one person cannot control another that way. I don't think Em should allow this kid to get drugs for her, but other than that, there's not much she can do. It is not her responsiblity to parent him, and his parents have seemingly abdicated their job of raising him and he seems to be having to do it himself.
> 
> Frankly, my teen years were spent getting fairly high and there was no person who could have controlled me or told me not to do it. If they would have told me nicely what could happen I would have listened politely and then gone on to do just what I wanted to. Had they ordered me not to do drugs, I would have told them to get fucked.
> 
> The ones at fault here are the parents, and maybe they should be turned in. I would advise Emma to distance herself from the kid as much as possible while still living her life; but I would also advise her to stop getting drugs from the kid. Doing that only keeps his hands in it, and I do believe that is ethically wrong.


All I know is that if any adult had been taking one of my kids to clubs and/or getting high with them, I would have called the cops on them. AND gotten my kid into rehab.

I really need to back out of this thread - it's going nowhere. And it won't as long as Em doesn't see the harm she's causing, IMHO...


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## Wagimawr (Dec 20, 2006)

The child is harming himself, and will do so, Em or no Em.

Why?

Because he doesn't have a parent that thinks like you do, Wayne. You're absolutely in the right to want something better for this child, but he won't get it from anybody except his parents or those qualified in rehabilitation.

What Tina says is right on, especially this part:


Tina said:


> Frankly, my teen years were spent getting fairly high and *there was no person who could have controlled me or told me not to do it*. If they would have told me nicely what could happen I would have listened politely and then gone on to do just what I wanted to. *Had they ordered me not to do drugs, I would have told them to get fucked.*



Sounds just like this kid.


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## Wayne_Zitkus (Dec 20, 2006)

Wagimawr said:


> The child is harming himself, and will do so, Em or no Em.


True. But it's wrong IMHO for Em to enable this behavior. And she may be putting herself in a position where she could get in legal trouble over this.


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## Wagimawr (Dec 20, 2006)

Right, and like Tina said, she needs to stop letting the kid bring her drugs.

I don't think it'll make a difference whether she does it around him or not, though - the authorities are probably more to go after the club management for letting a minor in in the first place.


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## Tina (Dec 21, 2006)

Wayne_Zitkus said:


> All I know is that if any adult had been taking one of my kids to clubs and/or getting high with them, I would have called the cops on them. AND gotten my kid into rehab.


Yes, Wayne, because you are a good parent. There are a lot of crappy parents out there, and it sounds like this kid has them. Em is not his parent, however, and she holds no responsibility for grabbing things away from him and trying to forcibly stop him from doing drugs. Do you think such a thing would even work? I doubt it. 


Wayne_Zitkus said:


> True. But it's wrong IMHO for Em to enable this behavior. And she may be putting herself in a position where she could get in legal trouble over this.


The only thing Em is doing to enable him, and it really doesn't _enable_ him, per se, but does exacerbate it, is scoring drugs from him. That should stop. But her responsibility ends there. Her being in the same club he is does not enable him. I don't think you're able to see beyond your own parental worries and hangups on this one, Wayne. Em is not his mother, and evidently his mother doesn't give a shit. Lovely parents.


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## Wagimawr (Dec 21, 2006)

Tina said:


> Em is not his mother, and evidently his mother doesn't give a shit. Lovely parents.


That's assuming he's still got a mother.


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## Tina (Dec 21, 2006)

True. . . . . . . . . .


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## Sandie_Zitkus (Dec 21, 2006)

Am I not my brothers keeper?


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## Tina (Dec 21, 2006)

What? A cage and a key? 

It's not always up to others to save us from ourselves, given the situation. I just think it's a big much to demonize Em for this. I do believe she could do more to distance herself, but what, exactly, do you think she should, and can, do?


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## Sandie_Zitkus (Dec 21, 2006)

Well, Tina off the top of my head, she could say "You are 16 years old and you have a drug problem. I am not going to be a part of this anymore." BUT I don't expect she will do that - nor would most people. Because - to be brutally honest - most people don't have the balls to take a stand in a situation where you are dealing with an addict.

I had several friends who were heavy drug users when I was in my 20's. I (to this day) have never done more than smoke some pot. I could not watch my friends slowly kill themselves with drugs and alcohol. So I backed out of the friendships. Was it easy? No. Were they going to do the drugs anyway? Yes. But that excuse never held water with me. I could not condone the behavior that I saw as slowly killing themselves - so I ended the friendships. I do know one of the girls Od'd years ago. And the others - I have no idea. But - I did what I had to do in order not to feel like I was contributing to their drug use.

Drug users and alcoholics like company and like people doing their drug of choice with them. Making a stand may or may not make a difference. But if this person you do drugs with OD's with you there - is saying "they would have done it anyway" going to be of any comfort at all??

People who do drugs and drink with addicts are enablers. What should Em do? Get help for herself first - then give her friend an ultimatum - it may save his life. And who gives a damn if his parents don't care, does that mean the rest of the world shouldn't care either? If his parents don't care why should anyone? Because he's a child crying out for help. 




Tina said:


> What? A cage and a key?
> 
> It's not always up to others to save us from ourselves, given the situation. I just think it's a big much to demonize Em for this. I do believe she could do more to distance herself, but what, exactly, do you think she should, and can, do?


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## Tina (Dec 21, 2006)

Thanks for answering, Sandie. I don't disagree, on many counts, but if she's at the club and he comes in, I don't see where she should leave in protest. From my own experience, I would say that the kid's going to do what he's going to do. As long as she is not actually enabling him (and it his parents who are the _real_ enablers, IMO), I don't see why she should be strung up.

Em has drug and alcohol problems; she knows this, so it's not news. Were it my son, he would not have been allowed to run around like that, but it wasn't; he is the son of parents who evidently don't give a damn. It is they who people should have the real issue with, IMO.


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## Sandie_Zitkus (Dec 21, 2006)

In no way do I want to say anything to hurt Em I like her and I only want the best for her. And yes the parents of this kid are to be held responsible.

I don't have a solution here - it's all very sad. 




Tina said:


> Thanks for answering, Sandie. I don't disagree, on many counts, but if she's at the club and he comes in, I don't see where she should leave in protest. From my own experience, I would say that the kid's going to do what he's going to do. As long as she is not actually enabling him (and it his parents who are the _real_ enablers, IMO), I don't see why she should be strung up.
> 
> Em has drug and alcohol problems; she knows this, so it's not news. Were it my son, he would not have been allowed to run around like that, but it wasn't; he is the son of parents who evidently don't give a damn. It is they who people should have the real issue with, IMO.


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## Tina (Dec 21, 2006)

It really is. And that, and much worse, goes on every day and night. I have ceased being shocked and surprised by the things that shitty parents do on a regular basis.


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## Emma (Dec 21, 2006)

Wayne_Zitkus said:


> True. But it's wrong IMHO for Em to enable this behavior. And she may be putting herself in a position where she could get in legal trouble over this.



I'm not enabling his behaviour. 



Tina said:


> The only thing Em is doing to enable him, and it really doesn't _enable_ him, per se, but does exacerbate it, is scoring drugs from him. /QUOTE]
> 
> He doesn't make a profit. It's just if I can't get a few pills and he's getting some I'll ask him to get a few extra for me. I never ever get him them though and I never would.
> 
> ...


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## Wayne_Zitkus (Dec 21, 2006)

CurvyEm said:


> I'm not enabling his behaviour.


Bullshit, Em. Any time you as an adult hang out with this child while he is drinking and using drugs and say nothing, you are enabling his bad behavior. Period.


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## Emma (Dec 21, 2006)

Wayne_Zitkus said:


> Bullshit, Em. Any time you as an adult hang out with this child while he is drinking and using drugs and say nothing, you are enabling his bad behavior. Period.



No. *That* is bullshit and you know it. I've tried to be as nice as possible while dealing with you because I know you have a hard time accepting that other people have a different point of veiw but you are honestly really annoying me now. 

How the HELL am I enabling him? Do I pay him into the club? No. Do I ring him up and ask him if he wants to come to a club with me? No. Do I give him drugs? No. Do I give him money for drugs? No. 

Had I been the person to take him to a club, or the person to introduce him to drugs then I would understand where you're coming from. Had I given him money for drugs or gave him contacts then I would understand where you're coming from. He's certainly the youngest in our group but in the whole group of us that hang around together in the same club there's a few 16 year olds, 17, 18, 19, + I think the oldest is 25. I'm about the middle aged of the whole group. Are they all enabling him too? Or is it just me? 

I think you need to get off your highhorse and see the world as it is. There's a whole world out there, Wayne. And it isn't all buttercups and fairycakes no matter how much you want it to be. Not everything can be solved your way, some things don't need to be solved. Learning that just because people choose not to live your way is the only way forward. I don't enable him to do anything, he'd do it if I was there or not. The only difference would be I'd lose MY friends because I'd have no one to hang out with. I couldn't care less if he's there or not but the fact of the matter is, he is.


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## Emma (Dec 21, 2006)

Sandie_Zitkus said:


> most people don't have the balls to take a stand in a situation where you are dealing with an addict.



I'm not dealing with an addict. Rest assured that I would have to distance myself from an addict.


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## fatgirlflyin (Dec 21, 2006)

Tina said:


> I don't think you're able to see beyond your own parental worries and hangups on this one, Wayne.



Me either, which is why I stopped responding to this thread. All I will say is that if my son ever decides to go out and do something stupid, like all teenagers do, and he does it in front of an adult, I hope that adult takes a minute to say "hey kid you shouldn't be doing that". I really really really hope that someone cares enough to do that for my child.


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## chubscout (Dec 21, 2006)

I would like to point out that, while I find CurvyEm's story quite charming, I would like to point out what I find to be a slight inaccuracy. If we are to believe that being an FA is primarily an intrinsic trait, she didn't so much make an FA as bring out the FA that was there in the boy all along. I think there are actually few men in this world who are not FAs to some extent. The fact that they can't admit it, in many cases even to themselves is simply a result of our current society's brainwashing about what a beautiful woman should look life. Afterall, Marilyn Monroe, who was a major sex symbol in her time, was a size 14 at the height of her career, which is relatively huge by our current pop culture standards.


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## moonvine (Dec 21, 2006)

chubscout said:


> I think there are actually few men in this world who are not FAs to some extent. The fact that they can't admit it, in many cases even to themselves is simply a result of our current society's brainwashing about what a beautiful woman should look life. Afterall, Marilyn Monroe, who was a major sex symbol in her time, was a size 14 at the height of her career, which is relatively huge by our current pop culture standards.




I disagree with you, based on my experiences, and those of many other fat women. I guess it is kind of hard to prove or disprove something if you say the person can't admit it even to themselves, though. :doh: 

Marilyn Monroe was never a size 14 by today's standards at any time in her life. I wish people would quit spreading this piece of inaccuracy, as false information doesn't help anyone with anything.

Marilyn Monore was 5' 6 1/2" and weighed anywhere from 118-140. That would probably be anywhere from a size 4/6 to at most a size 10 in today's sizes. In a world where size 0 is to be strived for, that's getting pretty chunky, but not a size 14.

http://www.snopes.com/movies/actors/mmdress.htm


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## Sandie_Zitkus (Dec 21, 2006)

CurvyEm said:


> I'm not dealing with an addict. Rest assured that I would have to distance myself from an addict.



Em - he is an addict. It can be hard to see when you are that close to the situation but he is.

I think when you are older you will see this situation completely differently. You do not have to do anything to enable someone. You simply have to stand by while they do it - or do it with them.

My husband is a father and as such he has a much different way of seeing this situation. He's not a hardass, nor does he not see your side of things. He's just been through so much more in life than you Em, and he sees a child doing drugs and having no one give a shit and it hits him in a visceral way - being a dad and all.

Maybe when you have children you will understand.

No what this kid does is not your problem. But at some point we all have to take a stand and at the very least help someone who is drowning. I know you can't see it Em, but he is.

I am stepping out of this conversation - I meant no harm Em. I just worry about you and I hope you too get help really soon.


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## missaf (Dec 21, 2006)

Does anyone else see that this is the equivelant to the US felonies of transportation, distribution, posession, posession with intent to distribute, AND posession with intent to distribute to minors-- totally around 30 years jail time?


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## Sandie_Zitkus (Dec 21, 2006)

Yes but that is in the US so I didn't think it mattered.




missaf said:


> Does anyone else see that this is the equivelant to the US felonies of transportation, distribution, posession, posession with intent to distribute, AND posession with intent to distribute to minors-- totally around 30 years jail time?


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## Emma (Dec 21, 2006)

Sandie_Zitkus said:


> Em - he is an addict. It can be hard to see when you are that close to the situation but he is.



Sandie, I know you mean no harm but as you know nothing about the situation then I don't think you can say he is an addict. Is anyone who uses drugs recreationally an adict? Is our whole group addicts? Just because they use E's once or twice a week on nights out?


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## Emma (Dec 21, 2006)

missaf said:


> Does anyone else see that this is the equivelant to the US felonies of transportation, distribution, posession, posession with intent to distribute, AND posession with intent to distribute to minors-- totally around 30 years jail time?



Eh, are you talking about me? Did you even read the thread? I said at no point have I ever, nor do I ever intend to, give/sell him drugs.


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## moonvine (Dec 21, 2006)

missaf said:


> Does anyone else see that this is the equivelant to the US felonies of transportation, distribution, posession, posession with intent to distribute, AND posession with intent to distribute to minors-- totally around 30 years jail time?




They live in England. To be fair, the culture surrounding drugs and especially alcohol is very different there, and the laws are different too.


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## Emma (Dec 21, 2006)

moonvine said:


> They live in England. To be fair, the culture surrounding drugs and especially alcohol is very different there, and the laws are different too.



It's very true. The police are more interested in stopping the fights/murders/attacks that happen after big clubs close than arresting small time drug users who cause no trouble. Hence the reason weed has been decriminalised here too, you don't even get arrested for possesing it.


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## Emma (Dec 21, 2006)

I've just asked my friend who is educated to an MA in social work what he thinks about the matter.



> At 16 years old the individual has the capacity to make their own decisions. People may consider it irresponsible, but essentially it's none of their business and it is down to the individual if they feel that it's worth risking their life for!
> As people make life risking decisions all the time, taking an E is compartively mild compared to other things that go on in the world
> I myself, have used E's at different points in my life, including at age 16 and the only person I could find accountable in this situation is the dealer who sold the minor the drugs, not someone who happened to be in their company.



As I said, this guy has a masters and as of next week starts a 6 month placement in an alcohol and drug dependancy unit. This is a man who I did drugs with at 16 (he's only one year older than me) and do occasionally with now. 
A few weeks ago I was out with him and his boyfriend (3rd year nursing degree student) We scored 5 pills and his boyfriend went mad. My friend and I took them and his NURSE boyfriend drank 20 pints and ended up being carried out of the club by the bouncers, we ended up staying in the club and being well behaved. Yet, his boyfriend went mad at us. Hypocrit. 

This is really just the end of the matter now.


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## Sandie_Zitkus (Dec 21, 2006)

Em if you cannot see how ridiculous it is to ask someone who is a drug user - masters or not - about this situation then there really is no need to continue this conversation.

Take care. 




CurvyEm said:


> I've just asked my friend who is educated to an MA in social work what he thinks about the matter.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


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## Tina (Dec 21, 2006)

I believe the person _was_ a drug user, not _is_, is how I read it. What that means, is the person knows more about it than someone who has never tried it. Everyone has an opinion, so what? None of it helps that kid at all, and Em, I still think you need to divest yourself of any connection with that kid as related to drugs. You are still part of it if he is scoring for you, whether he's getting it for himself or not.


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## Sandie_Zitkus (Dec 21, 2006)

It is possible I read it wrong. I'm very tired today. I just worry about Em. 

But this is the part that bothered me:



> This is a man who I did drugs with at 16 (he's only one year older than me) and do occasionally with now.





Tina said:


> I believe the person _was_ a drug user, not _is_, is how I read it. What that means, is the person knows more about it than someone who has never tried it. Everyone has an opinion, so what? None of it helps that kid at all, and Em, I still think you need to divest yourself of any connection with that kid as related to drugs. You are still part of it if he is scoring for you, whether he's getting it for himself or not.


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## Tina (Dec 21, 2006)

You're right, guess I missed that. Well, of course he's going to say it's okay then. No point in worrying, though.


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## Emma (Dec 21, 2006)

Occasionally as in once in 2 years according to him.


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## chubscout (Dec 21, 2006)

moonvine said:


> I disagree with you, based on my experiences, and those of many other fat women. I guess it is kind of hard to prove or disprove something if you say the person can't admit it even to themselves, though. :doh:
> 
> Marilyn Monroe was never a size 14 by today's standards at any time in her life. I wish people would quit spreading this piece of inaccuracy, as false information doesn't help anyone with anything.
> 
> ...



Okay, my dear, maybe Marilyn Monroe is not a good example. But my point is that in anthropological terms, fat has more often than not been extolled as a virtue, especially for women (Venus of Willendorf, Rubens, Botticelli, etc.). Now when I say that there is a fat admirer inside of almost every man, I don't mean to insinuate that every man has a certain part of him that lusts for a SSBBW. Rather almost every man has an innate attraction to a rounded female form that is created by strategic positioning of adipose tissue. They tend to be conditioned by society to resist this natural attraction, and lust after the scrawny size zero models, but this is not the natural attraction for the majority of males. But almost every man will admit to preferring a large bosum which is certainly a form of fat admiration, in my view. The bottom line for me is that the dearth of admitted FAs does not necessarily correlate with a true lack of FAs. I am convinced that so many are unable to deal with this issue that we have no idea how many of us are out there. But again not every 'FA' desires a SSBBW, many want a smaller BBW, and that's okay too. Different strokes for different folks, right?


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## Emma (Dec 22, 2006)

Well Mr Zitkus and others will be pleased with this story. 

Tonight I came into the club late, (like 12:15) and found him off his face.. I asked him how many pills he had taken and he told me 7. So I went straight to the bouncers, told them HIS age, told them what he's taken and let them deal with it. 

Sooooo I am done with this all. Thank you.


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## Wayne_Zitkus (Dec 25, 2006)

CurvyEm said:


> Well Mr Zitkus and others will be pleased with this story.
> 
> Tonight I came into the club late, (like 12:15) and found him off his face.. I asked him how many pills he had taken and he told me 7. So I went straight to the bouncers, told them HIS age, told them what he's taken and let them deal with it.
> 
> Sooooo I am done with this all. Thank you.


You may feel like a rat fink now, Em, but you actually did the kid a favor. It wasn't easy for you to do what you did, but you did the right thing.

Good for you.


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## Emma (Dec 25, 2006)

Wayne_Zitkus said:


> You may feel like a rat fink now, Em, but you actually did the kid a favor. It wasn't easy for you to do what you did, but you did the right thing.
> 
> Good for you.



It didn't make any difference. He was still in the club last night. *meh*


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## Wayne_Zitkus (Dec 25, 2006)

CurvyEm said:


> It didn't make any difference. He was still in the club last night. *meh*



Well, at least you tried, and did what you could. It's sad that no one else in that kid's life is doing anything to help him.....


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## Emma (Dec 25, 2006)

Wayne_Zitkus said:


> Well, at least you tried, and did what you could. It's sad that no one else in that kid's life is doing anything to help him.....



It's probably because it's reasonably normal where I am. He's not the first, the only or the last I'm sure. It's sad but there's honestly nothing else to do here. The kids here hang around the band stand drinking/taking drugs until they look old enough to get into the local club.


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