# Are we confusing fear of acknowledging plus-admiration with ordinary shyness?



## kioewen (Dec 22, 2010)

The subject line expresses the question. I thought about the other day when a poster in a different thread asked:



> How have u dealt with the stigma or the perception (incorrectly) that you may be dating big girls because u cant get a skinny girl?



I responded by saying that this implied that dating "big girls" was somehow easier than dating skinny girls, and that in my experience, the opposite was true. In my life, I've had a reasonable bit of interest from thin women (who only moderately interested me), but always had trouble dating full-figured girls -- the girls I was really attracted to.

And that makes me wonder -- when people here talk about being nervous about "coming out as "FAs" and such, is that really the issue? Is it really fear of having one's preferences revealed?

Or is it rather the simple fact that approaching girls that one finds extremely attractive is much more difficult than approaching girls whom one finds only moderately attractive?

A guy who approaches a girl he considers a "10" will usually be a lot more nervous and unsure of himself than when he approaches a "6." He may not have the guts to approach the "10" at all; and if he does, his nervousness will increase his chances of failure.

For the guy who likes full-figured beauty, the bigger girl will be the 10 and the thinner girl the 6.

Thus, perhaps the guys who think they are "afraid of coming out as FAs" may simply be afraid of approaching the girls whom they really, really find attractive -- afraid because of the girls' attractiveness, not afraid because of the girls' size.

And it's not social stigma that they really fear, but something that all guys can relate to, whatever their size preference -- fear of rejection.


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## Dr. Feelgood (Dec 22, 2010)

I think the anxiety you're talking about is logically prior to the anxiety about "coming out": you're talking about approaching a BBW, and most of the "coming out" posters are talking about what to do once the two of you have become an item. Forging a new relationship means introducing a new person into your social life (and being introduced into his/hers), and that always involves stress. When you're introducing a big girl into a group of people who have been exposed to/inspired by fatphobia all their lives. it is bound to be a bit fraught. You're right that in both cases there is a fear of rejection, but as I read it there is a difference between fearing rejection BY your _inamorata_ and fearing rejection OF her.


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## meepmeep (Dec 23, 2010)

im the orginal poster you so speak of  

from my experience...ive had skinny girls all over me...if only due to the fact that because i give them no time of day (because im not attracted to them). They then try harder to gain my affections. but its to no avail. I like big girls bottom line. I think im just not completely comfortable with my FA'ness....due in part to my upbringing (i came from a strictly traditional...non fat loving mom and paw).


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## bmann0413 (Dec 31, 2010)

But for some of us, the shyness comes when we try to approach attractive women of ANY size. I, for one, am shy when talking to attractive women in general. Even more so around bigger women I find attractive. I don't really think it's fear of acknowledgement.


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## tonynyc (Dec 31, 2010)

bmann0413 said:


> But for some of us, the shyness comes when we try to approach attractive women of ANY size. I, for one, am shy when talking to attractive women in general. Even more so around bigger women I find attractive. I don't really think it's fear of acknowledgement.



*Your mission for 2011 .. Go to a BBW Bash. That is all *


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## Adrian (Jan 5, 2011)

Also, one must really care what someone thinks of your choice in attractive women. If someone does not think BBWs are a good choice for, I will correct them but, after that any other negative attitude towards BBWs simply alienates our acquaintance.
I have had thin women attracted to me but, other than simple friendship, I would not seek anything else. I am biased in favor on BBWs.


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## Webmaster (Jan 6, 2011)

kioewen said:


> ... And that makes me wonder -- when people here talk about being nervous about "coming out as "FAs" and such, is that really the issue? Is it really fear of having one's preferences revealed?
> 
> Or is it rather the simple fact that approaching girls that one finds extremely attractive is much more difficult than approaching girls whom one finds only moderately attractive?....



I think it's two different things entirely. 

"Coming out," as in finally realizing that this different preference is not just a fantasy but part of our real everyday lives, deals with the insecurity we have over the realization that we are different. It's an internal process, one that we must sort out in our heads before we can go out there and live as we were meant to.

Fear of rejection is a universal issue for almost all people. No one likes to be rejected, though some can deal with it better than others (I've never been good at it and so shied away from risking it). That said, it's absolutely true that it's more difficult approaching someone we find wildly attractive than someone who leaves us cold. For us, fat women are the wildly attractive ones, and so, between the heart pounding and the sweaty palms and the sudden inability to say anything meaningful, it can be very difficult to approach someone who, to us, is a "ten."


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## Emma (Jan 6, 2011)

I don't really feel that FA have to come out. How about just dating the girls that you like and getting on with your life? I don't feel the need to pressure someone into saying they like fat girls. People who like skinny girls, girls of different races or anything like that don't have to come out.


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## Webmaster (Jan 6, 2011)

Em, I think there is that pressure. It's not about making a grand public statement or anything like that, but it is an internal process that we must see through its conclusion. Most FAs go through a lot of internal questions and doubts, and that will never end unless we do finally think it all through and act accordingly. And for some, it IS a stressful coming out; friends and family make sure of that.


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## disconnectedsmile (Jan 6, 2011)

tonynyc said:


> *Your mission for 2011 .. Go to a BBW Bash. That is all *



i really feel bmann0413 when he talks about shyness.
i can deal well in an intimate, one on one setting with someone, where i can really get to know them.
but i feel like if i was at a BBW bash, my insecurities would overwhelm me and i'd be sitting in the corner of the room drinking my coke zero, waiting for someone to come up and say hi.
(i don't really drink coke zero, it's just a reference.)
this was nothing to do with shyness/awkwardness around beautiful fat women.
it's more to do with shyness/awkwardness overall.


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## kioewen (Jan 6, 2011)

CurvyEm said:


> I don't really feel that FA have to come out. How about just dating the girls that you like and getting on with your life? I don't feel the need to pressure someone into saying they like fat girls. People who like skinny girls, girls of different races or anything like that don't have to come out.



I agree with this 100%. It's not even an either/or proposition. Most people have a pretty big range in terms of what they find attractive, although they may have an ideal. And even someone who is below or above the weight range may attract them if they have a sufficiently beautiful face. (Hence a thread that I started on this board a long while back, "Face or figure," where the outcome, as I predicted, was overwhelmingly that the beauty of the face is more important than the beauty of the figure -- even here, a board where people are united by their appreciation of a larger figure type.)

I always reject these "coming out" analogies. It seems like a weird kind of self-marginalization. I am secure in the knowledge that the attraction to fuller-figured women is the normal, default, historic aesthetic. The people who have a fetish for boniness and emaciation, they're the aberrant ones, even if they dominate the modern media.

Having a preference for curvaceous female beauty is no different than being a paleoconservative amidst a peer group of political Leftists, or something like that. It doesn't need to be formally announced. It's implicit in the views that you state.



Webmaster said:


> it's absolutely true that it's more difficult approaching someone we find wildly attractive than someone who leaves us cold.



That's what I'm getting at. I have a feeling that a fair number of so-called FAs, feeling nervous about approaching a curvy girl, are analyzing this as, "I'm afraid of admitting my preference," when really it's just, "I'm afraid of approaching this girl because she's so beautiful." The guy who is pining for the skinny girl is feeling the exact same thing, but he isn't confusing this with fear of acting on his preference.


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## Fat Brian (Jan 6, 2011)

Guys are always more nervous when approaching a 10 than a 5 or 6, its just something ingrained in the vast majority of us. And, the 10 can be anyone, its truly in the eye of the beholder here. If he likes the typical model type they will make him nervous, if he likes 5 feet tall 400 pound apples they will make nervous. I guess with the 10 there seems to be more on the line, the stakes feel higher so the tension goes up.


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## Rasputin (Jan 7, 2011)

First, great thread. Second, YES, I've been in this situation. I'm not sure if this is slightly off topic, but I'll tell my story anyway: Last summer, in fact, I went down to LA to visit family. While I was there I spent time with one of my old friends. Normally we hang out in a group setting but we happened to be one-on-one that night, drinking and chatting about life. 

We eventually came to the subject of relationships and sex. My friend, 24 years old like myself, is a virgin. I'm not a virgin, so I take it upon myself to throw down some tips, you know, like listening is a good thing on a date, or just have no fear, the basics! I'm not being condescending either, keep this in mind. 

Eventually he busts out this story about how the only reason I am able to have an active sex life is because I shoot for women who are not attractive. I stopped him dead in his tracks, told him flat out that I don't date or have intimate relationships with women I find unattractive, physically at least (you can't see crazy, mind you). He stopped me and explained his unique 1-10 point system which everyone uses to evaluate the opposite sex. 

My friend explained that the only reason he's a virgin is because he shoots for 9s and 10s. I laughed, of course everyone is going for that, right? No, you see, because his scale is universal. So he tells me I go for 2s (the fatties as it happens), my other pal goes for 6s (he likes really, really skinny girls). Now I'm just pissed by this point. 

Never have I ever witnessed, in person, such a lack of empathy. I use the word in the sense of being able to understand other people's point of views, that is, that other people perceive differently than the next person. Anyway, I ramble. This was a huge challenge for me and now the entire circle of friends and I ream the hell out of him for being such an asshole.

As far as coming out? I'm not one for public speaking or explaining myself with words, I just let my actions tell the story. My uncle and his boyfriend caught on quick and support me, with just a bit of grin and wink because they think it's cute and different. I'm not ashamed in the least, but then again, I have huge anxiety asking a very attractive woman out, and when I say attractive, I mean by FA standards, despite what society or my friend may think in that it is somehow easier.


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## Fat Brian (Jan 7, 2011)

See, thats exactly what I was talking about. The scale is highly subjective and every mans will be different. I married a 10 on my scale but I know she will not be everyones cup of tea so to speak. And I'm not talking about actually assigning a number value to everyone around you but merely trying to convey that we all find some people more attractive than others.


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## Dromond (Jan 7, 2011)

Webmaster said:


> Em, I think there is that pressure. It's not about making a grand public statement or anything like that, but it is an internal process that we must see through its conclusion. Most FAs go through a lot of internal questions and doubts, and that will never end unless we do finally think it all through and act accordingly. And for some, it IS a stressful coming out; friends and family make sure of that.



It's only stressful if you make it that way. For me, I never stressed. Once I decided I enjoyed bigger ladies, I simply started dating them. I never bothered to hide it. It never occurred to me that I should.


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## Webmaster (Jan 7, 2011)

Dromond said:


> It's only stressful if you make it that way. For me, I never stressed. Once I decided I enjoyed bigger ladies, I simply started dating them. I never bothered to hide it. It never occurred to me that I should.



Well then, good for you. That was your path. For me it was different, and for many others it is/was, too.


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## Dromond (Jan 7, 2011)

It wasn't until I came to the Dimensions site that I had ever heard of the "closeted FA."


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## lovelocs (Jan 7, 2011)

You may not have heard of the term, but does that mean it didn't exist? I had never heard of the term "FA" period before I came to Dimensions, but they were out there.


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## J34 (Jan 7, 2011)

disconnectedsmile said:


> i really feel bmann0413 when he talks about shyness.
> i can deal well in an intimate, one on one setting with someone, where i can really get to know them.
> but i feel like if i was at a BBW bash, my insecurities would overwhelm me and i'd be sitting in the corner of the room drinking my coke zero, waiting for someone to come up and say hi.
> (i don't really drink coke zero, it's just a reference.)
> ...



Yea same here. Everyone is built differently in a mental sort of way. I spent the last several months trying to understand myself. I read many books on psychology, etc which I was glad to do since I know understand myself better.

Some people can approach others effortlessly, people like you or me may find such social interactions as daunting. For me I have no problem being with a larger woman. What makes it difficult is social anxiety and rejection. Sure we all face these issues, however some can overcome it much easier than others.


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## Dr. P Marshall (Jan 7, 2011)

Dromond said:


> It's only stressful if you make it that way. For me, I never stressed. Once I decided I enjoyed bigger ladies, I simply started dating them. I never bothered to hide it. It never occurred to me that I should.



I think a lot depends on the individual F/FA's background and particularly his/her family. For some of us, myself included, we come from families that are more open minded or less fat phobic or less intrusive about who their son/daughter/grandchild/niece etc dates. But some families are extremely fat phobic and some families are very intrusive. My family isn't fat phobic, but they are pretty intrusive, so had they been fat phobic, I probably would have had a harder time coming to terms with being an FFA. I also know that if my family had talked a lot about how unhealthy fat was, I would have felt very badly about being an FFA. 

I know a lot of times closet cases are just guys and gals who need to own up to their attraction, but for many there is a gray area full of confusion and fear that is based on more than "my friends will make fun of me." I only have one other relative who is an FA, but lots of my family members are what we'd call bisizual and I know that made it easier for me.


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## kioewen (Jan 7, 2011)

I think two factors are significant here. One is, just how large is the guy's preference. If he finds women 200-300 lbs his ideal, then that's not a big deal, as it's not that far outside social strictures. But if he prefers, say, women over a size 30, then I imagine that it is more difficult to publicly acknowledge such a taste because it's more extreme.

Also I think it has to do with how popular or unpopular someone is used to being, or how used they are to being in tune with the tastes of society. My whole life I've different from almost everyone I know in tastes in politics, art, culture, etc., and pretty socially unpopular, so this was just one more way in which everyone else I met seemed to have tastes that were incomprehensible different from my own, and I had no social status to lose. But if someone is used to being in a social circle where their tastes broadly agree with those of their peers, where they like the music that is popular, or their politics are fashionable, or whatever, then finding themselves "out there" in this particular area might trouble them.


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