# POLL: what's the worst thing about FAs?



## exile in thighville (Apr 1, 2009)

Most or all of these traits will bother the majority of reasonable women around here. Please only vote for the one that bugs you the most. If you selected "other," please say what it is. The poll results and notable comments from this thread will be posted on my blog. And we're off.


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## Shosh (Apr 1, 2009)

Um where is the poll Dan?


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## Ned Sonntag (Apr 1, 2009)

Susannah said:


> Um where is the poll Dan?


 No I changed my mind. This thread should bring out some our finest wits and wags. And remind me of lame stuff I did back in the day.:doh:


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## tonynyc (Apr 1, 2009)

Susannah said:


> Um where is the poll Dan?



It's a Closeted Survey


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## Keb (Apr 1, 2009)

I voted closeted, but the most annoying thing is that I don't seem to get asked out by them, either. So I assume it's because if there are any single FAs within my radius...either they're too closeted to ask me or I'm still not their type. 

*sigh*


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## Wild Zero (Apr 1, 2009)

Was this inspired by "waht happned to yur goal, yuo lots 20 puonds! why arenot you ganning?"

Because stuff like that deserves its own category between "creepy" and "size criticism": "Socially inept tools posting in broken English"

And if that were an option I'd vote for it a million times.


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## exile in thighville (Apr 1, 2009)

yes that guy


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## exile in thighville (Apr 1, 2009)

i just realized "penis size" should be "bad penis size" but y'all knowhamean


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## kayrae (Apr 1, 2009)

I'm not fond of the creepy ones though.


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## Santaclear (Apr 1, 2009)

I'm fond of creepy BBWs.


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## kayrae (Apr 1, 2009)

Hahahaha!!!


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## Fascinita (Apr 1, 2009)

People that find fat people sexy come in all flavors, just like people who don't necesarily find fat people sexy. Some FAs are bound to be creeps, and that shouldn't be held against the rest of FAs. If we see a higher prevalence of "creepy" behaviors here on Dimenions, maybe it's related to the fact that the community has made it a rule to be tolerant in the extreme. A high incidence of "creepiness" doesn't happen out of the blue. Since we tend to open-mindedness here when it comes to extremes, it's not surprising to me that excess and transgression in general is often cited a one of the main attractions that people find in fat fantasy at Dimensions. And so it doesn't surprise me that we have an "excess" of creepiness. It's just that creepiness doesn't exist in a vacuum but on a continuum of behaviors that range from mild to extremely extreme (allow me to hyperbolize). I think we need hard lines drawn in the sand about what we definitely will not tolerate, but generally expressing a desire to see women gain weight, as far as I know, is not discouraged at Dimensions. Maybe that's where some want to draw the line? I think it's a good discussion to have. My preference about this is personal--I'll gain or lose only because I want to, and never because anyone badgers me into it, and woe betide the feeder who takes it upon himself to badger me about my weight, for he shall be quickly put in his place (though I reserve the right to give in, if he's particularly alluring)--but I don't see creepy behavior that tries to get women to put on weight as any creepier than certain other behaviors that express fantasies. There are more ways that creeps try in attempting to manipulate others than there are ways of skinning a fat cat. And those others have a choice to opt out of being manipulated.

I'm more worried about user types who encourage gains only to disappear when things get difficult, than I am about types who just try to express their fantasies. Meanwhile, fat people need to choose the people they let into their lives with care, just like un-fat people do.


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## exile in thighville (Apr 1, 2009)

there's a pretty distinct difference between "a desire to see weightgain" and "telling someone they're too small" and it's obvious which one i'm positing as negative.


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## kayrae (Apr 1, 2009)

I would like to interject here to say that I hope this doesn't turn into an FA bashing thread.


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## Fascinita (Apr 1, 2009)

exile in thighville said:


> there's a pretty distinct difference between "a desire to see weightgain" and "telling someone they're too small" and it's obvious which one i'm positing as negative.



I see your point and agree that it's detrimental and manipulative to criticize with an eye to shaming someone into gaining. I do think that a line has to be drawn somewhere, and "no shaming criticisms" may as well define it, where it pertains to feeding--though others may not agree with us. I do think there are many, many other negative/manipulative behaviors that are manifest on these boards, some intentional and some not. I appreciate your efforts to watch out for fat people's best interest, but I think you know that it's a fine line between "i'd like you to gain some weight" and "you're too small." It's a good policy to expect the best from the people we let into our lives. Fantasy is one thing, but you can tell me I'm too small a million times and it's not going to make a difference in what I choose to do with my body--that's my right and my responsibility. In the end, I am just saying that, yes, there are creeps out there--of all kinds--and that deciding on which fantasy is creepiest doesn't really protect me from creeps, but that choosing to take care of myself is a pretty good deterrent to creeps, in all cases, and that on the other hand what's creepy for one person, where fantasies are concerned, may not be creepy enough for another. Reality is what bites, yes?


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## BothGunsBlazing (Apr 1, 2009)

finds a way to make sexual comments on a weight loss surgery thread

YOU LOOK ABSOLUTELY SO HOT AFTER IT WENT SO BAD UR HUGE NOW!! 

oh, I guess that'd fall under creepy.


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## steely (Apr 1, 2009)

Never met one so I can't answer your poll.


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## mergirl (Apr 1, 2009)

Fascinita said:


> My preference about this is personal--I'll gain or lose only because I want to, and never because anyone badgers me into it, and woe betide the feeder who takes it upon himself to badger me about my weight, for he shall be quickly put in his place (though I reserve the right to give in, if he's particularly alluring)--but I don't see creepy behavior that tries to get women to put on weight as any creepier than certain other behaviors that express fantasies. There are more ways that creeps try in attempting to manipulate others than there are ways of skinning a fat cat. And those others have a choice to opt out of being manipulated.
> 
> I'm more worried about user types who encourage gains only to disappear when things get difficult, than I am about types who just try to express their fantasies. Meanwhile, fat people need to choose the people they let into their lives with care, just like un-fat people do.



Totally! I agreed with the other part of your post too, i wanted to focus on this though. I think that the Fa's that come across as creepy because they seem to be obsessed with talking about weight are mostly new. Firstly they seem to think that the women they are talking to will automatically 'share' their fantasies and secondly they dont seem to realise that once people know them they will be able to talk about their fantasies and with people who share them without seeming creepy. Its all about context and timing and i guess differing sexualities. Fa's and fat people are here for different reasons. I know that within the groups 'Fa' and 'Fat', people have maby slightly different reasons for being here but generally Fa's are here because they are Fa's and fat people because they are fat. This seems like such and obvious statement but i think a lot of the acrimony or misunderstandings between groups often come because of this very reason. It would be interesting to see a poll or even a thred where both Fa's and Fat people discuss why they come here. Whatever the differences were i imagine would be where the cracks usually appear at times...though i could be wrong.


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## mergirl (Apr 1, 2009)

oh.. and i voted 'penis size', cause then i am totally excluded from the creepyness.  Maby to make the poll less hetrocentric/forgetful of FFA's, next time you could put 'penis size/vagina width.


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## chunkeymonkey (Apr 1, 2009)

Other.... The FA's who's choice to settle because their fantasy girl is to much to deal with and flip flops more than a politician.


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## mergirl (Apr 1, 2009)

chunkeymonkey said:


> Other.... The FA's who's choice to settle because their fantasy girl is to much to deal with and flip flops more than a politician.


Oh that TOTALLY should have been on the poll!! I bet a lot of people will think that!
Also..i'm wondering what would happen.. if there was a poll 'whats the worst thing about fat people?'. I'm wondering if things would stay as civillised for so long!! lmao. 
Anyway, worst thing about fat people is-They are too damn sexy!... did i pass??


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## missy_blue_eyez (Apr 1, 2009)

Closet cases for me! How dare you wanna sleep with me and then treat me like Im a nobody in front of your friends, but then also tell me that Im too small and would look better if I gained some....repeatedly!....hmmmmphhh! Gain some balls and a spine and we may be in business!


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## Kortana (Apr 1, 2009)

I posted closeted but I would like to add to that. I have a friend that is recently single and we were looking for ways she could meet FA's. Out of curiosity we did a search on Craigslist. In the personals section we searched the term "BBW" to see if any FA's were looking. Turns out the only FA's searching for BBW's is in the Casual Encounters section. That to me is beyond closeted- that is that the FA's in our area are looking to get intimate with BBW's but not necessarily have relationships with them.

Ugh- ok sure it is Craigslist but you would think you would find at leats one looking for the full package...but nope. Very discouraging!


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## Tooz (Apr 1, 2009)

I cannot pick between closeted, creepy and poor "fatiquette."


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## JMNYC (Apr 1, 2009)

ain't steppin' in this trap


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## mergirl (Apr 1, 2009)

JMNYC said:


> ain't steppin' in this trap


lmao.. i know what you mean.. haha.. this is like the closeted Fa's thread cept with crunchy bits! Though, in a way maby its a good thing..maby the air will be cleared, maby we can have a reasoned debate about our differences and simmilarities and all just get along!! muwhahahaha! yeah right.. *goes to get popcorn*


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## butch (Apr 1, 2009)

For me, the worst personal thing I've come up with for guys is the whole fact that they want to live online and not in real life. I have no desire to just 'talk' about sexy stuff and/or meet ups with people, I want to do it, and yet the few guys who have contacted me only want to live in some fantasy land that stays on the net.

Someone I know told me recently that one of the things that annoy them about this site is the number of people who talk a good game about being a FA, and yet this all exists in their head, as they've never actually dated a fat person before. They're like 'put up or shut up,' and I have to say, I agree. I don't mind staying in fantasy land if someone is up front about it, but why so many keep up the illusion that one day they'll move from make-believe to reality is beyond me.

Granted, my experience with the men folk is limited, but yeah, I wonder what it was like for the fantasy FAs before the advent of the internet?


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## missy_blue_eyez (Apr 1, 2009)

butch said:


> For me, the worst personal thing I've come up with for guys is the whole fact that they want to live online and not in real life. I have no desire to just 'talk' about sexy stuff and/or meet ups with people, I want to do it, and yet the few guys who have contacted me only want to live in some fantasy land that stays on the net.
> 
> Someone I know told me recently that one of the things that annoy them about this site is the number of people who talk a good game about being a FA, and yet this all exists in their head, as they've never actually dated a fat person before. They're like 'put up or shut up,' and I have to say, I agree. I don't mind staying in fantasy land if someone is up front about it, but why so many keep up the illusion that one day they'll move from make-believe to reality is beyond me.
> 
> Granted, my experience with the men folk is limited, but yeah, I wonder what it was like for the fantasy FAs before the advent of the internet?


Agree, agree, agree!


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## johnnywonder (Apr 1, 2009)

missy_blue_eyez said:


> Closet cases for me! How dare you wanna sleep with me and then treat me like Im a nobody in front of your friends, but then also tell me that Im too small and would look better if I gained some....repeatedly!....hmmmmphhh! Gain some balls and a spine and we may be in business!



Who would want to be a 'closet' case with a lady like you...Idiots!lol.x


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## thatgirl08 (Apr 1, 2009)

Closet cases are the worst by far. The rest are avoidable/ignorable.. closet isn't always as obvious until it's too late.


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## mergirl (Apr 1, 2009)

thatgirl08 said:


> Closet cases are the worst by far. The rest are avoidable/ignorable.. closet isn't always as obvious until it's too late.


hmm.. i guess you are right. Its not really good dating ettiquette to say on a first date "Ok i want to meet ALL your friends AND all your family".. might get your date running for the hills.


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## thatgirl08 (Apr 1, 2009)

mergirl said:


> hmm.. i guess you are right. Its not really good dating ettiquette to say on a first date "Ok i want to meet ALL your friends AND all your family".. might get your date running for the hills.



Exactly. You talk online or whatever for awhile.. go on a few dates just the two of you.. you really like him.. then BAM. Closet cases aren't always 'come over my house at midnight to fuck so I don't have to be seen in public with you.' Sometimes its more like, all the sudden you realize it's been 10 dates and you haven't met any of their friends yet.


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## BothGunsBlazing (Apr 1, 2009)

thatgirl08 said:


> Exactly. You talk online or whatever for awhile.. go on a few dates just the two of you.. you really like him.. then BAM. Closet cases aren't always 'come over my house at midnight to fuck so I don't have to be seen in public with you.' Sometimes its more like, all the sudden you realize it's been 10 dates and you haven't met any of their friends yet.



Girl: Why haven't I met any of your friends?
FA: I don't have any friends!
Girl: THAT'S EVEN WORSE!


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## thatgirl08 (Apr 1, 2009)

BothGunsBlazing said:


> Girl: Why haven't I met any of your friends?
> FA: I don't have any friends!
> Girl: THAT'S EVEN WORSE!



Is was more like this: 

BothGunsBlazing(12:00:09 PM): oh and what if the guy doesn't have any friends?
Me (12:00:25 PM): thats a problem. 
Me (12:00:33 PM): i wouldnt date someone who was friendless.


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## BothGunsBlazing (Apr 1, 2009)

thatgirl08 said:


> Is was more like this:
> 
> BothGunsBlazing(12:00:09 PM): oh and what if the guy doesn't have any friends?
> Me (12:00:25 PM): thats a problem.
> Me (12:00:33 PM): i wouldnt date someone who was friendless.



actually, it was more like this.

BothGunsBlazing(12:00:09 PM): oh and what if the guy doesn't have any friends?
Me (12:00:25 PM): thats a problem. you are so hot. omg
Me (12:00:33 PM): i wouldnt date someone who was friendless.


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## thatgirl08 (Apr 1, 2009)

BothGunsBlazing said:


> actually, it was more like this.
> 
> BothGunsBlazing(12:00:09 PM): oh and what if the guy doesn't have any friends?
> Me (12:00:25 PM): thats a problem. you are so hot. omg
> Me (12:00:33 PM): i wouldnt date someone who was friendless.



Mhm. That's how it happened.


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## mergirl (Apr 1, 2009)

hahahahaha!


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## exile in thighville (Apr 1, 2009)

mergirl said:


> oh.. and i voted 'penis size', cause then i am totally excluded from the creepyness.  Maby to make the poll less hetrocentric/forgetful of FFA's, next time you could put 'penis size/vagina width.



different variables, tough cookies



Fascinita said:


> I see your point and agree that it's detrimental and manipulative to criticize with an eye to shaming someone into gaining.



i'm gonna repeat that answer has nothing to do with gaining or feederism



chunkeymonkey said:


> Other.... The FA's who's choice to settle because their fantasy girl is to much to deal with and flip flops more than a politician.



ok


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## mergirl (Apr 1, 2009)

exile in thighville said:


> different variables, tough cookies



Ok, maby you could make the variables less hetrocentric/inclusive of FFa's in your next poll.


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## elle camino (Apr 1, 2009)

if the last two (before 'other') were combined, it'd have my vote. 
i think both of them pretty much fall under 'attracted to fatties but considers them desperate enough to overlook promiscuity and shitty hygiene because hey - it's not like they have better options'.


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## mergirl (Apr 1, 2009)

btw.. can you clarify what "lets themselves become unattractive" means? Is this a physical thing or just that you find out they are a dick? 
hmm..you know..i'm not so sure that the worst thing about Fa's isnt the same as the worst thing about arseholes in general.


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## Wild Zero (Apr 1, 2009)

BothGunsBlazing said:


> finds a way to make sexual comments on a weight loss surgery thread
> 
> YOU LOOK ABSOLUTELY SO HOT AFTER IT WENT SO BAD UR HUGE NOW!!
> 
> oh, I guess that'd fall under creepy.



Alternately, woman posts youtube video diary about family member with cancer or some other grave illness and creepo FA comments

OMG YOU ARE SO BEAUTFUIL YOUR SO SEXXXY I WOULD LOVE TO SQUEEZE YOUR SOFT BELLY

Because when Aunt Beth's going in for chemo the only support I'd need is some stranger feeling up my gut.


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## mergirl (Apr 1, 2009)

Wild Zero said:


> Alternately, woman posts youtube video diary about family member with cancer or some other grave illness and creepo FA comments
> 
> OMG YOU ARE SO BEAUTFUIL YOUR SO SEXXXY I WOULD LOVE TO SQUEEZE YOUR SOFT BELLY
> 
> Because when Aunt Beth's going in for chemo the only support I'd need is some stranger feeling up my gut.


NO WAY!!!!??? Are you friggin serious???
ok..i have to try to not belive you here cause this is just the worst thing EVER! ok.ok.. THAT is NOT and Fa.. that is a socially retarded sex pest who needs some sort of lobotomy!!!!
ok..i need a cuddle now..


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## BothGunsBlazing (Apr 1, 2009)

Wild Zero said:


> Alternately, woman posts youtube video diary about family member with cancer or some other grave illness and creepo FA comments
> 
> OMG YOU ARE SO BEAUTFUIL YOUR SO SEXXXY I WOULD LOVE TO SQUEEZE YOUR SOFT BELLY
> 
> Because when Aunt Beth's going in for chemo the only support I'd need is some stranger feeling up my gut.



I HEAR PPL LOOSE WEIGHT FROOM CANCER WHAT AN ASSHOLE *kiss on the cheek* ;-)


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## Mathias (Apr 1, 2009)

I voted for the creepy option because, my family and friends know I'm an FA and am proud to be an Fa. What I don't like is the creepy aspect of it. I've said this before and it bears repeating here: Just because it's a fantasy of mine to see a bbw get bigger that means it'll stay just that; Fantasy. If she decides that on her own, that's great, but if not, I have to respect that.


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## thatgirl08 (Apr 1, 2009)

Wild Zero said:


> Alternately, woman posts youtube video diary about family member with cancer or some other grave illness and creepo FA comments
> 
> OMG YOU ARE SO BEAUTFUIL YOUR SO SEXXXY I WOULD LOVE TO SQUEEZE YOUR SOFT BELLY
> 
> Because when Aunt Beth's going in for chemo the only support I'd need is some stranger feeling up my gut.



This actually happened to me. I added an FA from the same town as me on Myspace and I was looking on his page, and saw a blog about how a family friend of his has commited suicide. Because of the fact that we are from the same town, and from the details/names he gave in the blog, I could tell that he was talking about someone I knew from my church that had just commited suicide so I messaged him about it, telling him I was sorry for his loss, and that I hoped that the kids of this person (who I knew quite well from confirmation classes with the older one, and teaching VBS to the younger one) were okay and such and he wrote back telling me how cute I am and asking me on a date. No mention of the person whatsoever.


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## exile in thighville (Apr 1, 2009)

mergirl said:


> btw.. can you clarify what "lets themselves become unattractive" means? Is this a physical thing or just that you find out they are a dick?
> hmm..you know..i'm not so sure that the worst thing about Fa's isnt the same as the worst thing about arseholes in general.



physically. they don't take care of themselves or attempt to preserve what makes their partner attracted to their body and don't have a good reason. this could involve weightgain, weightloss, hygiene, just a greatly disparate ratio between the two partners of how much care they take of themselves.



mergirl said:


> Ok, maby you could make the variables less hetrocentric/inclusive of FFa's in your next poll.



the only one that doesn't really apply to ffas is penis size and you don't have to vote for it, but this is intended to scrutinize male fas. 

the short answer is i've rarely seen much of a conflict between female fas (i hate the term ffa) and bhms so there's not much to study there. 

the only points of contention i've noticed particularly is that females who identify themselves as an fa are rarer (however, females who will date a fat guy regardless of personal preference are not) and that female feeders are granted a serious free ride (either due to their rarity or what guys are willing to put up with in general). that's not really my area though, and if you're an fa you should start your own poll.


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## Fascinita (Apr 1, 2009)

butch said:


> For me, the worst personal thing I've come up with for guys is the whole fact that they want to live online and not in real life. I have no desire to just 'talk' about sexy stuff and/or meet ups with people, I want to do it, and yet the few guys who have contacted me only want to live in some fantasy land that stays on the net.
> 
> Someone I know told me recently that one of the things that annoy them about this site is the number of people who talk a good game about being a FA, and yet this all exists in their head, as they've never actually dated a fat person before. They're like 'put up or shut up,' and I have to say, I agree. I don't mind staying in fantasy land if someone is up front about it, but why so many keep up the illusion that one day they'll move from make-believe to reality is beyond me.
> 
> Granted, my experience with the men folk is limited, but yeah, I wonder what it was like for the fantasy FAs before the advent of the internet?



Agree, agree, agree again!!


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## mergirl (Apr 1, 2009)

exile in thighville said:


> physically. they don't take care of themselves or attempt to preserve what makes their partner attracted to their body and don't have a good reason. this could involve weightgain, weightloss, hygiene, just a greatly disparate ratio between the two partners of how much care they take of themselves.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


ok...i see i see.. 
I dont want to start a poll.. i didnt realise your poll was for male Fa's only. Though i must admit i am glad.


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## exile in thighville (Apr 1, 2009)

Mathias said:


> I voted for the creepy option because, my family and friends know I'm an FA and am proud to be an Fa. What I don't like is the creepy aspect of it. I've said this before and it bears repeating here: Just because it's a fantasy of mine to see a bbw get bigger that means it'll stay just that; Fantasy. If she decides that on her own, that's great, but if not, I have to respect that.



again, it's totally acceptable to ask someone to gain weight, at least in somewhat of an intimate situation, or flirting knowingly with someone into weightgain. but i'm not the first person to point out that lots of girls on this board, particularly models, receive messages from people that aren't just rude but have an air of entitlement. and yes, natasfan, it negatively affects the female population of the board on the whole and ruins it for newcomers.


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## JoyJoy (Apr 1, 2009)

I chose other, although several of the other choices are pretty annoying. 

The type that bugs me most is the one who is so completely ruled by his "FA-ness" that he can't focus on anything else - everything revolves around how much he loves fat and the effects/consequences of it....to the point of mind-numbing boredom that makes me want to jump out a window.


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## mergirl (Apr 1, 2009)

exile in thighville said:


> again, it's totally acceptable to ask someone to gain weight, at least in somewhat of an intimate situation, or flirting knowingly with someone into weightgain. but i'm not the first person to point out that lots of girls on this board, particularly models, receive messages from people that aren't just rude but have an air of entitlement. and yes, natasfan, it negatively affects the female population of the board on the whole and ruins it for newcomers.


Would natasfan's comments have been out of hand if he directed them to a model who said she was an 'active gainer'? whether or not she was saying this just to get people to buy into her particular brand of pornography? Surely not. Surely if a model is getting feeders to engage in her pornography by advertising she is a gainer and she loses weight it is their consumer right to ask why they didn't get 'what was on the tin'. ..no?


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## exile in thighville (Apr 1, 2009)

JoyJoy said:


> I chose other, although several of the other choices are pretty annoying.
> 
> The type that bugs me most is the one who is so completely ruled by his "FA-ness" that he can't focus on anything else - everything revolves around how much he loves fat and the effects/consequences of it....to the point of mind-numbing boredom that makes me want to jump out a window.



that's pretty valid as a choice, but is it really worse than being creepy or closeted?


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## exile in thighville (Apr 1, 2009)

mergirl said:


> Would natasfan's comments have been out of hand if he directed them to a model who said she was an 'active gainer'? whether or not she was saying this just to get people to buy into her particular brand of pornography? Surely not. Surely if a model is getting feeders to engage in her pornography by advertising she is a gainer and she loses weight it is their consumer right to ask why they didn't get 'what was on the tin'. ..no?



this is like saying it's ok to grope a girl who's wearing skimpy clothes because she's "asking for it." in no way does advertising yourself as a gainer entitle your customers to you gaining x amount of weight, and i feel bad for anyone who gains weight solely for anonymous wallets on the internet, which is _not_ the same as say, a runway model staying in shape. and i felt the need to speak up because the model usually won't, for fear of alienating her base. which is good reasoning from the model perspective but doesn't solve a widespread and widely-tolerated problem.

while it's unwise to advertise yourself as a gainer in general (and many models who do are not actually and their gains are both circumstantial and profitable), it encourages shitty behavior from fas (unrealistic expectations, which bleeds into the non-paysite areas) and creates a shitty precedent for yourself (models having to lie about their weight or gain at a certain rate for real...until what?).

i know this argument's a slippery slope and models can really do whatever they want, i bear them no ill will for how they choose to make money, but i've never known a model who considered demands about her weight to have positive effects.


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## Fascinita (Apr 1, 2009)

exile in thighville said:


> i'm gonna repeat that answer has nothing to do with gaining or feederism



I understand that that's how you feel about it. Cool. I think it's a fine poll.

As for me, Fattie: I'd rather advocate--be vocal about--setting real-world boundaries on a case-by-case basis, than try to define who qualifies as good or bad across the board based on expression of fantasies. Though again I'll repeat that with expression of fantasies, we may choose to draw the line somewhere, and that somewhere depends on what we're comfortable with as a community. That's where your poll comes in, I guess.

Fat people's bodies are our own bodies. Regardless of how creepy or intense the pressure gets, _we _are responsible for deciding how small or how large we get, to the extent that gain or loss is controllable (may not be for everyone, but that's a separate issue.)


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## mergirl (Apr 1, 2009)

exile in thighville said:


> this is like saying it's ok to grope a girl who's wearing skimpy clothes because she's "asking for it." .



Lmao!! NO its not! 
Its like saying ..If someone has a porn site where she has huge implants and her customer loves big tits, then comes back to find she has had her implants removed.. and they complain.. like.."erm..where are your huge tits that i paid to see.. cause you advertised them".. 
Groping someone is a sexual act and whether or not someone is wearing a skirt or a sack should not be engaged in..
someone who advertises that they are a 'gainer' so that 'feeders' give them money to watch them 'gain' is a totally diffferent story..
its funny that you even tried to compare the two..


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## exile in thighville (Apr 1, 2009)

Fascinita said:


> Regardless of how creepy or intense the pressure gets, _we _are responsible for deciding how small or how large we get, to the extent that gain or loss is controllable (may not be for everyone, but that's a separate issue.)



this is true, but a friend of mine pointed out something i reluctantly agreed with: there are girls who arrive here that don't even know if they like gaining weight or not, but they know it's one of the quickest routes to male attention, and they essentially assimilate the fetish in the most pavlovian sense. this bodes well for me as a feeder, but i can't say that it doesn't trouble me or that i don't feel guilty somewhat.


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## furious styles (Apr 1, 2009)

voted dick size


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## exile in thighville (Apr 1, 2009)

mergirl said:


> If someone has a porn site where she has huge implants and her customer loves big tits, then comes back to find she has had her implants removed.. and they complain



nevermind.


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## mergirl (Apr 1, 2009)

furious styles said:


> voted dick size


well thats four of us now..i wonder when it will become funny.  lmao


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## Cat (Apr 1, 2009)

Couldn't all of these poor traits apply to any man in general, and not just FAs? 

Even the "closeted" question. Some insecure guys don't want to bring girls home who don't meet their parent's standards for ______ (side of the tracks, heritage, race, clothing style, height, etc). I think the key is poor self-esteem in general with men like that. 

Also, I'm not sure how misspelled words = creepy, but I got a giggle out of it.


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## Mathias (Apr 1, 2009)

exile in thighville said:


> again, it's totally acceptable to ask someone to gain weight, at least in somewhat of an intimate situation, or flirting knowingly with someone into weightgain. but i'm not the first person to point out that lots of girls on this board, particularly models, receive messages from people that aren't just rude but have an air of entitlement. and yes, natasfan, it negatively affects the female population of the board on the whole and ruins it for newcomers.



I understand what you're saying but with me, I don't want to just obsess over her body and looks. Personality is important as well.


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## exile in thighville (Apr 1, 2009)

mergirl said:


> well thats four of us now..i wonder when it will become funny.  lmao



score one for "margin of error"


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## mergirl (Apr 1, 2009)

exile in thighville said:


> nevermind.


Exaggerated advertising IS false advertising. 
It doesnt matter what a reasonable human 'belives'. The punter is 'engaging' in a fantasy.. the very same fantasy sold to him by the model.


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## mergirl (Apr 1, 2009)

exile in thighville said:


> score one for "margin of error"


yeah..i'm glad your stats are up to scratch cause your definitions of assimilation and pavlovian behaviour are very wrong.


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## exile in thighville (Apr 1, 2009)

Cat said:


> Couldn't all of these poor traits apply to any man in general, and not just FAs?
> 
> Even the "closeted" question. Some insecure guys don't want to bring girls home who don't meet their parent's standards for ______ (side of the tracks, heritage, race, clothing style, height, etc). I think the key is poor self-esteem in general with men like that.
> 
> Also, I'm not sure how misspelled words = creepy, but I got a giggle out of it.



these certainly apply to non-fas, and females too, but in general i asked around what bugs fat girls the most about fas and these came up.

mispelled words...HAI CAN I FATTN U UP IZ U PIG


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## exile in thighville (Apr 1, 2009)

mergirl said:


> yeah..i'm glad your stats are up to scratch cause your definitions of assimilation and pavlovian behaviour are very wrong.



i implore you


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## mergirl (Apr 1, 2009)

i implode you.

Also, its really sneaky to change your post after someone answers it and to semi quote people.. gah. whit?


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## TraciJo67 (Apr 1, 2009)

mergirl said:


> i implode you.
> 
> Also, its really sneaky to change your post after someone answers it and to semi quote people.. gah. whit?



I just unabashedly adore you, mergirl.


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## exile in thighville (Apr 1, 2009)

mergirl said:


> Exaggerated advertising IS false advertising.
> It doesnt matter what a reasonable human 'belives'. The punter is 'engaging' in a fantasy.. the very same fantasy sold to him by the model.



it's the punter's choice to pay for content that is hardly possible to realistically achieve. if she lost the weight due to illness or something, she's not obligated to explain her personal issues to an anonymous customer. and if it was false advertising, you'd be able to sue her for fraud.


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## exile in thighville (Apr 1, 2009)

mergirl said:


> i implode you.
> 
> Also, its really sneaky to change your post after someone answers it and to semi quote people.. gah. whit?



there's nothing sneaky about going back to check the original post and redacting something that i wrote that was incorrect.


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## BothGunsBlazing (Apr 1, 2009)

The worst is an out of the closet FA who is a total prick asshole douchebag anyway. 

A damn shame it is.


----------



## Cat (Apr 1, 2009)

exile in thighville said:


> these certainly apply to non-fas, and females too, but in general i asked around what bugs fat girls the most about fas and these came up.



I'm just thinkin' that it applies to all in general and for some reason making it "FA" specific makes it almost offensive or stereotyping. Dunno why. 

In any event, I'm just going out on a limb but I think specific to _FAs only_, most fat girls would say that _the worst thing about FAs_ is the scarcity.


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## mergirl (Apr 1, 2009)

exile in thighville said:


> there's nothing sneaky about going back to check the original post and redacting something that i wrote that was incorrect.


But.. its was a VERY long reply you gave.. then when you realised it was totally wrong, ..instead of admitting..yes, perhaps you were wrong, you just changed it! I find that really sneeky. 
Anyway..whatever.. there is no point in trying to have a reasoned discussion with you cause you change your replies and answer in one liner madlibs, that i'm sure you feel are intelligent in some way but are just usually arogant and borish, so, i will let you get back to your wee poll there...


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## mergirl (Apr 1, 2009)

TraciJo67 said:


> I just unabashedly adore you, mergirl.


:blush: aww.. right back attcha!


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## thatgirl08 (Apr 1, 2009)

Cat said:


> I'm just thinkin' that it applies to all in general and for some reason making it "FA" specific makes it almost offensive or stereotyping. Dunno why.



I think some of these things, such as fattiquette and being closeted are FA specific and things like creepy and size criticism seem to occur a lot more often in FA's than non-FA's. I suppose it might be stereotyping, but I wouldn't consider it all that offensive. These options are based on what many BBW's common complaints are about FA's.


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## JoyJoy (Apr 1, 2009)

exile in thighville said:


> that's pretty valid as a choice, but is it really worse than being creepy or closeted?


 Yes, for me, because creeps are very easy to identify and deal with, closets almost equally so. The one-track minds usually end up wasting more of my time than I'm happy with, because it takes more than one discussion to realize what a snooze they are.


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## thatgirl08 (Apr 1, 2009)

I don't think closet cases are always as obvious as everyone thinks.


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## exile in thighville (Apr 1, 2009)

mergirl said:


> But.. its was a VERY long reply you gave.. then when you realised it was totally wrong, ..instead of admitting..yes, perhaps you were wrong, you just changed it! I find that really sneeky.
> Anyway..whatever.. there is no point in trying to have a reasoned discussion with you cause you change your replies and answer in one liner madlibs, that i'm sure you feel are intelligent in some way but are just usually arogant and borish, so, i will let you get back to your wee poll there...



i made a factual error. you have that in writing in two posts now. three if you count "nevermind."

if you don't want to discuss then get out of the thread, i was happy to engage you until you started belittling the poll and chose "dick size" to fuck up my research.


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## mergirl (Apr 1, 2009)

exile in thighville said:


> i made a factual error. you have that in writing in two posts now. three if you count "nevermind."
> 
> if you don't want to discuss then get out of the thread, i was happy to engage you until you started belittling the poll and chose "dick size" to fuck up my research.


Haha.. this is serious research?
hahahahahaha...really..i just didnt know..sorry..i shall bow out of your sociopsychological discussion right away.
I have no idea why 'dick size' was an option to begin with if this was the case..
You are so blindsighted by yourself that even if you had included 'real' possible answers and considered all the variables (which you just couldnt btw) You would be a million miles away from research. 
Btw..Do you really think the three other people think 'dick size' is the worst think about Fa's?? hahaha.. That would mean Only Fa's had dicks.. or else it doesnt make scientific sense as an answer.. Silly silly poll.. maby you should have went down a more qualitative line of enquiery??


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## exile in thighville (Apr 1, 2009)

mergirl said:


> Haha.. this is serious research?
> hahahahahaha...really..i just didnt know..sorry..i shall bow out of your sociopsychological discussion right away.
> I have no idea why 'dick size' was an option to begin with if this was the case..
> You are so blindsighted by yourself that even if you had included 'real' possible answers and considered all the variables (which you just couldnt btw) You would be a million miles away from research.
> Btw..Do you really think the three other people think 'dick size' is the worst think about Fa's?? hahaha.. That would mean Only Fa's had dicks.. or else it doesnt make scientific sense as an answer.. Silly silly poll.. maby you should have went down a more qualitative line of enquiery??



what are you on about? yes, yes, i suck, etc. you haven't ripped me a new one with your astonishingly correct brand of pavlovian theory yet or contributed anything but willful contrarianism and barely coherent ripostes. i.e. stop biting my shit.


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## Fascinita (Apr 1, 2009)

exile in thighville said:


> this is true, but a friend of mine pointed out something i reluctantly agreed with: there are girls who arrive here that don't even know if they like gaining weight or not, but *they know it's one of the quickest routes to male attention*, and they essentially assimilate the fetish in the most pavlovian sense. this bodes well for me as a feeder, but i can't say that it doesn't trouble me or that i don't feel guilty somewhat.



Yes, this is something to keep in mind.


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## mergirl (Apr 1, 2009)

exile in thighville said:


> what are you on about? yes, yes, i suck, etc. you haven't ripped me a new one with your astonishingly correct brand of pavlovian theory yet or contributed anything but willful contrarianism and barely coherent ripostes. i.e. stop biting my shit.


pretentious jobby=:eat1:


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## exile in thighville (Apr 1, 2009)

mergirl said:


> pretentious jobby=:eat1:



aren't we all


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## mossystate (Apr 1, 2009)

mergirl said:


> pretentious jobby=:eat1:



hey, mer, whatcha eatin?


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## mergirl (Apr 1, 2009)

mossystate said:


> hey, mer, whatcha eatin?


yum..see above..
Pretentious jobby has 20% more iron than normal jobby!


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## mergirl (Apr 1, 2009)

exile in thighville said:


> aren't we all


i know i am but what are you? :eat2:


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## mossystate (Apr 1, 2009)

mergirl said:


> yum..see above..
> Pretentious jobby has 20% more iron than normal jobby!



A spoonful of sugar helps the jobby go down. Now, don't go ruining your dinner eating too much jobby, young lady!


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## mergirl (Apr 1, 2009)

mossystate said:


> A spoonful of sugar helps the jobby go down. Now, don't go ruining your dinner eating too much jobby, young lady!


m'kay. I'll try not to mossy. I feel so shit ruining this important scientific study.. think i'm going to go now, eat my jobbies in peace while watching the real world news Fox channel.


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## TallFatSue (Apr 2, 2009)

Another reason why Dimensions and the Internet in general would have been soooo helpful when I was actively dating in the 1970s as a big tall awkward fat girl. I had only a vague idea that FAs existed. My experiences were mostly with boys and men who were attracted to me either *despite* my fat or *because* of my fat. That ran the gamut from "you'd be so beautiful if you lost 100lb" or "what would my friends think if I dated a fat girl?" to "you'd be so beautiful if you gained 100lb".

Anyway, based on my semi-ancient experiences, I'd say the closeted FAs are the most annoying. The creepy, critical, promiscuous and slovenly are part of every stripe, FA and non-FA, I can avoid them, and besides some of them are downright funny. My all-time favorite pick-up lines happened when I was an internet novice back around the turn of the millennium, and a message suddenly popped up on my screen.

He: "Hey baby, you have all them fat curves, you are so fine, can you help me?"
Me: "What's the problem?"
He: "I have this pressure and I need to release it."
Me: "Go ahead and burp."
He: "No it's lower than that."
Me: "Then maybe you'd better open all the windows."
He: "No it's in front."
Me: "Sounds like you have more pressure than bubble wrap."
He: "Yeah can you help me?"
Me: "Well, when I need to take care of bubble wrap I usually run over it several times with my desk chair."

The poor fattiquette FAs can probably be educated, because they might be just plain oblivious to our needs. Such was the case of my husband when we first began to date (we laugh about it now: "Okay, Mr. Engineer, look at the restaurant booth and guesstimate whether my big fat ass, which you have been squeezing half the evening, can possibly fit there. Extra credit if you find seating that does fit me. Now!").

Therefore the closeted FAs are the worst as far as I'm concerned, because they just plain waste my time, whereas I managed to filter out the rest pretty easily. I remember dating this one guy who seemed very nice, but after a few weeks I gradually noticed a pattern emerge: he avoided being seen with me when his friends or relatives were around. Fat or no fat, every woman deserves the simple dignity of being seen and acknowledged in public.

That's why I knew that, despite his poor fattiquette at first, Art was the man for me. He was downright happy to be seen with me in public. (Then again, maybe Art was completely oblivious to the fact that dating a big tall fat girl might have potential social pitfalls. Works for me!  )
Idiot: "What can you possibly see in Sue? She's so fat!"
Art: "You tell me. What do you look for in a woman, or doesn't it matter as long as she's not fat?" :smitten:


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## mergirl (Apr 2, 2009)

I think there we have to remember there is a difference between Fa's and people who want you to gain weight. Although people who want you to gain are generally Fa's Not ALL Fa's want/need/desire weight gain. 
I identify as Fa and do not have any desire for my partner to gain weight, so i would never say something like 'you would look better if you were x amount fatter' because its just not the way i feel.


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## JMNYC (Apr 2, 2009)

Cat said:


> Couldn't all of these poor traits apply to any man in general, and not just FAs?
> 
> Even the "closeted" question. Some insecure guys don't want to bring girls home who don't meet their parent's standards for ______ (side of the tracks, heritage, race, clothing style, height, etc). I think the key is poor self-esteem in general with men like that.
> 
> Also, I'm not sure how misspelled words = creepy, but I got a giggle out of it.



Hi, Cat. (waving)


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## LillyBBBW (Apr 2, 2009)

A lot of these are things that aren't really FA specific. It's mostly bad manners that almost any guy is capable of. Just about everyone has the same complaints about men in general. I picked Promiscuity though. Fatty collectors irritate me most of all.


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## SSBBBWVeuveJenCoBu (Apr 2, 2009)

butch said:


> For me, the worst personal thing I've come up with for guys is the whole fact that they want to live online and not in real life. I have no desire to just 'talk' about sexy stuff and/or meet ups with people, I want to do it, and yet the few guys who have contacted me only want to live in some fantasy land that stays on the net.
> 
> Someone I know told me recently that one of the things that annoy them about this site is the number of people who talk a good game about being a FA, and yet this all exists in their head, as they've never actually dated a fat person before. They're like 'put up or shut up,' and I have to say, I agree. I don't mind staying in fantasy land if someone is up front about it, but why so many keep up the illusion that one day they'll move from make-believe to reality is beyond me.
> 
> Granted, my experience with the men folk is limited, but yeah, I wonder what it was like for the fantasy FAs before the advent of the internet?




I second that emotion. You've got the closeted, so-called FAs. And the worst ones of that lot are the 'rich prick' FAs. Yeah there are broke ass jerk FAs too, but the one wealthy a-hole I know of outside of D.C., is a horrendous jekyll/ hyde type. He's primarily only into BBBWs. He thought of himself as an FA. Nope. I told him he's just a fat & ginormous boob fetishist. He whines and bitches about some of the complications we bbws/ ssbbws have. How we're not fond of stairs, venues w/ booths, being easily winded whilst walking briskly or for extended periods, etc. He's emotionally void, is rude, condescending, controlling, uncaring, mean spirited and terribly insecure; thus he takes his hideous short comings out on the poor female in his company. This could occur in a phone call or in his presence. But you never know when he's gonna spout off like Vesuvius. Its like a sucker punch. I've been sprayed by his venom three times. Three strikes & he's out. I shoulda made it one strike & he's out. But I was guilty of "giving him the benefit of the doubt". Never again. 

I say the wealthy ones are the worst because they feel as though they're _entitled_ to be a douchebag. He admitted it himself. He's just a self-hating, fat black girl fetishist. Not to mention that his stereotypical upbringing fucked him up. but that's not a complete excuse for him. he knows what went wrong in his life and how people should be treated. Period. He's old enough to know better. Millionaire or not, he's a BRAT! What a tool.

Last night I broke it down & I told him, "Look, if you want the rainbow you've gotta take the rain. You're wasting lots-o-dough on a shrink for two(+) years & the only thing she's helped do is shrink your bank account. Pay me what you gave her & I'll tell you what the hell's wrong with you and I'll tell you where you can go for free. You neglect & disrespect women, regardless of their size, the same way you do your cats. You're a poser, shallow and demanding, & despite ur ducats and the fact that you look like a catch on paper, honey in reality *YOU'RE NO CATCH!* No woman gives a damn how many poor souls you managed to bump uglies with. That just proves you're the biggest ho' on two legs. And we don't wanna hear you bang on about paramours that you let get away. Frankly they were smart to dodge your sorry butt once they scraped your surface. They didn't have to chip too much paint on you. In the end you were too busy trying to find fault w/ every female. So you sabotaged it and buried yourself. You've got no one to blame but yourself, idiot. Notches on a bedpost impresses no one but your sad ego. Maintaining a mutually contented, LTR w/ one lady; that carries some weight. Pun intended You know you're doing wrong so stop perpetrating a fraud, breaking/ disappointing ssbbbws & straighten up. Otherwise get used to living a very unfulfilled and lonely life w/ only your downloaded porn to keep you warm you schmuck!" 
**(No wonder even your skinny wife cheated on your ass!)- I said that part to myself & not out loud. But it's true.**

So knowing how the fake, wannabe, closeted, fetishistic FAs tend, like the cat above, they're a pain in the neck and ruin the ride for all of us. Ladies the only thing this one guy is good for [not nec. the others- just this one I know] is just for a good shag. So I'm just gonna USE him for a weekend to suit MY needs for once & that's it. He's too far away in my own state to be a reg. booty call. I'll just do to him what he's done to others. Hit it & quit it. That should hold me for another 3-5yrs. I'm a sex camel, folks. A little goes a long way w/ me.:doh:


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## mossystate (Apr 2, 2009)

SSBBBWVeuveJenCoBu...after reading your post, I can't see how fucking him will make you any more than notch on his bedpost.  If he is as clueless and mean and horrible as you say, he will just look at the weekend as one more fat woman who could not help but want him. If he has a huge ego...you are not going to be using him. I don't know you, but this man sounds like a horror. I wish you would reconsider. Find another watering hole, camel.


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## Jon Blaze (Apr 2, 2009)

mergirl said:


> I think there we have to remember there is a difference between Fa's and people who want you to gain weight. Although people who want you to gain are generally Fa's Not ALL Fa's want/need/desire weight gain.
> I identify as Fa and do not have any desire for my partner to gain weight, so i would never say something like 'you would look better if you were x amount fatter' because its just not the way i feel.



I concur. :bow:


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## superodalisque (Apr 2, 2009)

allowing preferences to take precidence over building relationships


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## Violet_Beauregard (Apr 2, 2009)

When EVERYTHING is about my being fat. 

E V E R Y T H I N G 

All conversation, all sex, all activities.

It gets old.

I'm a person who happens to be fat. Fat does not define who I am.


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## bigsexy920 (Apr 2, 2009)

I needed an "all of the above" they all equally bother me. Could be the answer to my epic singleness.


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## kioewen (Apr 2, 2009)

I'm surprised to see the most signifcant one left off here - *poor* (as in, "*not wealthy enough*").

Money is still the governining criterion for most women when selecting a mate, much as beauty is for men pursuing women.

Has anyone ever done a study to determine where FAs place in terms of mean salary? I'm guessing it would be below average, sadly. Most (not all, but most) financially successful men care obsessively about image, and would be most vulnerable to peer pressure about the type of women they "should" be worth. Poorer men are often more independent, sooner to flout conventional rules and social strictures -- but that tends not to advance their careers.


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## thatgirl08 (Apr 2, 2009)

I think it's because it's not FA-specific. Plus, there's 'other' for a reason.


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## kayrae (Apr 2, 2009)

How superficial is this shit? I can't believe you're perpetuating a stereotype about women being gold-diggers. 



kioewen said:


> I'm surprised to see the most signifcant one left off here - *poor* (as in, "*not wealthy enough*").
> 
> Money is still the governining criterion for most women when selecting a mate, much as beauty is for men pursuing women.
> 
> Has anyone ever done a study to determine where FAs place in terms of mean salary? I'm guessing it would be below average, sadly. Most (not all, but most) financially successful men care obsessively about image, and would be most vulnerable to peer pressure about the type of women they "should" be worth. Poorer men are often more independent, sooner to flout conventional rules and social strictures -- but that tends not to advance their careers.


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## Mini (Apr 3, 2009)

kayrae said:


> How superficial is this shit? I can't believe you're perpetuating a stereotype about women being gold-diggers.



To be fair, I read it more as him calling us brokeass losers.


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## Santaclear (Apr 3, 2009)

kioewen said:


> I'm surprised to see the most signifcant one left off here - *poor* (as in, "*not wealthy enough*").
> 
> Money is still the governining criterion for most women when selecting a mate, much as beauty is for men pursuing women.
> 
> Has anyone ever done a study to determine where FAs place in terms of mean salary?....



None of us can afford to do a study.


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## Fascinita (Apr 3, 2009)

kioewen said:


> Money is still the governining criterion for most women when selecting a mate, much as beauty is for men pursuing women.



OFF TOPIC:

I have to tell you, this seems like a very jaded view of mating to me. Would you say that human beings are capable of love at all?


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## wrench13 (Apr 3, 2009)

kayrae said:


> How superficial is this shit? I can't believe you're perpetuating a stereotype about women being gold-diggers.



Kayrae, unfortunately there is a LOT of truth to his statements, born out by more in-depth studies then this froo-froo poll. Hell my ex-wife basically divorced me cuz I was not ambitious 'enough to earn more, to be able to provide her with the things she wanted ( gambling money, travel money, new car money, BIG house money). In our therapy sessions together, the Dr. 
( a well respected man in the profession) basically said women are attracted by a mans ability to provide for her , ie: money. When I put forth the notion that personality, SOH, ability to give love, wittyness, etc were more imporant and could not be taken aay by a bad economy, I got beat down from both sides. Bear in mind I was making 70K + at the time - not poor! Not Rich!

*Are ALL women like that - NO! and the ones that realize that $$ is not the goal in life are the real treasures, fat or skinny. *

Do I think marrying a BBW affects a mans carreer? It might. Depends on the job, the company, the man and the WOMAN. Also not so great to hear, but I think it may. 

FWIW - this little poll does have some interesting results.


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## mergirl (Apr 3, 2009)

kioewen said:


> I'm surprised to see the most signifcant one left off here - *poor* (as in, "*not wealthy enough*").
> 
> Money is still the governining criterion for most women when selecting a mate, much as beauty is for men pursuing women.
> 
> Has anyone ever done a study to determine where FAs place in terms of mean salary? I'm guessing it would be below average, sadly. Most (not all, but most) financially successful men care obsessively about image, and would be most vulnerable to peer pressure about the type of women they "should" be worth. Poorer men are often more independent, sooner to flout conventional rules and social strictures -- but that tends not to advance their careers.


This is not actually true. I studied this last year, so unless there is a new study just published that i dont know about.. maby you can show me it? Financial security is 'important' to women but not the 'governing criterion' for most women..
Also, why do you think that Fa's would be any less well off financially than anyone else? I see no reason for this. I would argue that financially successful people have to know what they want and will set out to get it, thus making them MORE likely to be with someone they are attracted to. HU! With faux science you have managed to offend women and men and fat people in general. Please dont do that..because its YOUR theories not REAL theories.!!


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## exile in thighville (Apr 3, 2009)

kioewen said:


> Money is still the governining criterion for most women when selecting a mate



i'm going to stop you here.

two terrible, baseless accusations in your post:

1. women marry rich

2. that people in a position of wealth and power are uniformly fearful tools (you're thinking of their lackeys and goons, leaders get to where they are by leading, followers kiss their asses and hope for the best, trying as hard as they can NOT to stand out from the billions of do-alikes)

even if you were right, that a private sector gig forces FAs into the closet (and a few have mentioned it) and that women care about er, job security, and that's giving you a huge benefit of the doubt with no citations and good-faith misanthropy, the beginning of your post sums up all i need to know about your credibility: you called money the _most_ important issue for women. yet you're a guy and not one female in this thread has brought it up. oh right, they're all lying now. you understand women about as well as you understand FAs...from a standpoint of delusion, fear, and self-fulfilling prophecies of rejection. loosen up dude.

you're also wrong about poorer men; rejecting convention runs the gamut from "not showering" to "painting." now matter how smart ot admirable someone is for their principles, an inability to understand and work within the system makes them unemployable, especially in this economy. i don't harbor a cent of rage over an employed woman not wanting to put up with that shit.


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## exile in thighville (Apr 3, 2009)

bigsexy920 said:


> I needed an "all of the above" they all equally bother me. Could be the answer to my epic singleness.



of course we can all agree most of these are reprehensible, except for penis size, and there are (surprise!) women who aren't bothered by promiscuity, but i specifically said i wanted people to vote with their gut on the single one that most enrages your personal principles.


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## TraciJo67 (Apr 3, 2009)

kioewen said:


> Money is still the governining criterion for most women when selecting a mate, much as beauty is for men pursuing women.



Please. 

Snort.

*I* make more money than most of the men I know. I prefer to take care of my own needs, thanks very much.

Money has nothing ... NOTHING ... to do with criteria in selecting a mate for any but the most shallow (and insecure) of women. 

Lack of ambition, however, is a major turn-off to most.


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## SocialbFly (Apr 3, 2009)

TraciJo67 said:


> Please.
> 
> Snort.
> 
> ...



I disagree TraciJo, mostly though because i saw what my sister went through when she continued to do well in her job and advance and her husband didnt...it caused so many issues for her, so i always wanted someone who could support themselves and pay their own way if need be...i am far from insecure, and i promise you, i am far from a money grubbing gold digger, but i also dont want a husband or partner counting all my money and not wanting to advance himself...i want an equal partner, and if he was rich too, i wouldnt argue...at all...and would prolly make vacation plans (joke)

i think there is some basis to it, cause when it comes down to it, in traditional family roles (note the word, traditional) we see the woman as taking time off from work, to have or take care of the kids and she wants someone that can provide for the family while the family is growing..so yes, some men might see that as money grubbing but in sociology forms it is the survival of the family in every sense...


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## TraciJo67 (Apr 3, 2009)

SocialbFly said:


> I disagree TraciJo, mostly though because i saw what my sister went through when she continued to do well in her job and advance and her husband didnt...it caused so many issues for her, so i always wanted someone who could support themselves and pay their own way if need be...i am far from insecure, and i promise you, i am far from a money grubbing gold digger, but i also dont want a husband or partner counting all my money and not wanting to advance himself...i want an equal partner, and if he was rich too, i wouldnt argue...at all...and would prolly make vacation plans (joke)
> 
> i think there is some basis to it, cause when it comes down to it, in traditional family roles (note the word, traditional) we see the woman as taking time off from work, to have or take care of the kids and she wants someone that can provide for the family while the family is growing..so yes, some men might see that as money grubbing but in sociology forms it is the survival of the family in every sense...



Di, I actually agree with most of what you've said, and I don't think it's in conflict with my feelings. There is nothing more unattractive to me than a person who lacks ambition and just wants to float through life. That really has nothing to do with someone's ability to provide me with all of the finer things in life. I can manage to provide myself with those things, quite well (keeping in mind that to me, the 'finer' things are trashy paperback novels and $5 lattes ). If I were single, and looking for a mate, how much money he makes wouldn't be a deciding factor for me. That he does *something*, and does it well, and how responsibly he lives, would be. 

With regard to the sociological aspect of things, I'd agree that this played a huge role in the past. But now? Women are educated, they work, they can provide quite well for themselves. They don't need a man to provide for them. What they do need is a man who will carry his own weight (and I think this is exactly what you said above).


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## mergirl (Apr 3, 2009)

SocialbFly said:


> i think there is some basis to it, cause when it comes down to it, in traditional family roles (note the word, traditional) we see the woman as taking time off from work, to have or take care of the kids and she wants someone that can provide for the family while the family is growing..so yes, some men might see that as money grubbing but in sociology forms it is the survival of the family in every sense...



Dont know if you would find that many 'traditional' families these days, outside 1950's detergent commercials.


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## Blackjack (Apr 3, 2009)

exile in thighville said:


> i'm going to stop you here.
> 
> two terrible, baseless accusations in your post:
> 
> ...


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## OzGuy (Apr 3, 2009)

I'm Just a guy who happens to find fat women adorable and sexy. 

Must I be psychoanalised al la Sigmund Freud for that?


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## Weeze (Apr 3, 2009)

kioewen said:


> I'm surprised to see the most signifcant one left off here - *poor* (as in, "*not wealthy enough*").
> 
> Money is still the governing [fixed it for ya there, buddy] criterion for most women when selecting a mate, much as beauty is for men pursuing women.



this is where you, sir, are wrong.
most of the people I date are one pack of cigarettes short of becoming a hobo. 
Money has nothing to do with it.

Spelling and grammar are what really get my heart pounding. :wubu:


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## exile in thighville (Apr 3, 2009)

he's right that something like "unemployed/doesn't make enough money" would've been a valid addition though.


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## BothGunsBlazing (Apr 3, 2009)

women be shoppin'


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## BarbBBW (Apr 3, 2009)

That there are almost none in Arizona at all and none near me in AZ:doh:


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## BothGunsBlazing (Apr 3, 2009)

BarbBBW said:


> That there are almost none in Arizona at all and none near me in AZ:doh:



I'm sure this doesn't really bother your husband though, eh?


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## BarbBBW (Apr 3, 2009)

BothGunsBlazing said:


> I'm sure this doesn't really bother your husband though, eh?



Bother him, No hahah But it does bother me, Although I am married, it would still be nice to find some FA's, not just for SEX.


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## thatgirl08 (Apr 3, 2009)

Money really isn't FA specific though whereas most of these options are. I mean, there's lots of turnofs women have of men.. this isn't.. what's the worst thing about men? It's whats the worst thing about FA's.


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## bigsexy920 (Apr 3, 2009)

Ok If i must pick then I will pic closeted I dont know why it just bugs the shit out of me. 



exile in thighville said:


> of course we can all agree most of these are reprehensible, except for penis size, and there are (surprise!) women who aren't bothered by promiscuity, but i specifically said i wanted people to vote with their gut on the single one that most enrages your personal principles.


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## SSBBBWVeuveJenCoBu (Apr 3, 2009)

mossystate said:


> SSBBBWVeuveJenCoBu...after reading your post, I can't see how fucking him will make you any more than notch on his bedpost.  If he is as clueless and mean and horrible as you say, he will just look at the weekend as one more fat woman who could not help but want him. If he has a huge ego...you are not going to be using him. I don't know you, but this man sounds like a horror. I wish you would reconsider. Find another watering hole, camel.



You're right, mossystate. I'm reconsidering. He's not worth surrendering the 'pink' to. As I typed that post I was riding on a combination of feelings:
1. My disgust of the particular 'wannabes' rudeness &
2. Horny~ness. Is that a word, or a misspelling of it? Oh well, it stays in. It's been a long time, the pickins are slim or not up to snuff or just not local. Oddly enough I've been getting responses, on BBW/SSBBW date sites, from chaps from the Seattle region. I've not lived out there since my family was stationed there in Ft. Lewis 1975-76 & I was five years old. 

The desert is brutal. Not even a mirage.

Thx. a bunch & take care.

JenCoBu:bow:


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## superodalisque (Apr 3, 2009)

bigsexy920 said:


> Ok If i must pick then I will pic closeted I dont know why it just bugs the shit out of me.



cuz your just much too beautiful sexy and smart to be ashamed of. :kiss2::smitten:


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## mossystate (Apr 3, 2009)

* chuckle *

Gee, I have always heard that looks don't matter...and that money does not matter....yet....only when someone is honest about money, do the people really come out to get outraged and call people names. 

Come on...people don't have to require a mansion and jewels around their necks, to have money/security matter to them...just as lots of people out here are very vocal about what they find physically attractive....and neeeeeed, in order to be truuuuuuly satisfied in their lil worlds. Oh, but I forgot...that is alllll about haaaaard () wiring. 

I see so much about how it is of course natural for men to like women whose weight falls here or there, because it is ancient programming. I will wait for another thread out here, talking about wiring and how " ah-HA..see..what I like makes actual biological sense ". Individually, many of us ( women and men ) are not slaves to our wiring...but many do crow about it to a wacky extreme. 
Just remember that, when you whine about honey wanting more...stuff...you want your own...stuff.

Now, who doesn't like......stuff.


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## Fascinita (Apr 3, 2009)

The following bad FAs have approached me to ask me to convey their discomfort with this thread to the community. Please let's try to be sensitive, everyone.

DateBunglerFA
Bernard the Broke FA
TimTheTitSmasher5000FA
InappropriateTouchFA
OCD_PCP_OctogenarianFA
SkirtChaserFA
FetishFoolishFA
IDreamofHaremsFA
NormanMailer-Be-AlikeFA
FeedYouSillyFA
Earl the Cheapskate FA
Raymond the Rattlesnake1971
NowYouSeeHimNowYouDon'tFA

Several additional FAs wished to remain anonymous, but hope there's a time and a place in the future when they will be able to associate with fat people openly without fear of retribution from the important people in their lives.


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## swordchick (Apr 3, 2009)

I am absolutely with you on this, Tooz. 



Tooz said:


> I cannot pick between closeted, creepy and poor "fatiquette."


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## olwen (Apr 4, 2009)

kioewen said:


> I'm surprised to see the most signifcant one left off here - *poor* (as in, "*not wealthy enough*").
> 
> Money is still the governining criterion for most women when selecting a mate, much as beauty is for men pursuing women.
> 
> Has anyone ever done a study to determine where FAs place in terms of mean salary? I'm guessing it would be below average, sadly. Most (not all, but most) financially successful men care obsessively about image, and would be most vulnerable to peer pressure about the type of women they "should" be worth. Poorer men are often more independent, sooner to flout conventional rules and social strictures -- but that tends not to advance their careers.



The kind of guy who cares about his image re his career is likely to be closeted. At that point how much he makes just doesn't matter. A closet case is a closet case, which is what I voted for. Who cares how much he makes as long as he's capable of taking care of himself.


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## olwen (Apr 4, 2009)

exile in thighville said:


> he's right that something like "unemployed/doesn't make enough money" would've been a valid addition though.



More like "unemployable/irresponsible and doesn't want to work." That would be a turnoff for any woman - or man.


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## olwen (Apr 4, 2009)

Also, I thought the size criticism option was referring to the kinds of guys who just say things like "Baby, you'd be so hot if you gained 100lbs" which to me is not the same as trying to manipulate someone into gaining weight. A comment like that can be easily dismissed by no longer dealing with that person. I'd think someone who could actually manipulate someone into gaining would have to be "smart enough" to know not to say something like that, especially if they wanted the other person to gain. I'd think they'd try to find sneaky ways to get the other person to eat. If they wanted the person to loose they'd just nag and badger. People who want to see someone loose feel morally justified in that, so no reason to sneak. If the fat person is comfortable with their bodies then I imagine they'd be able to dismiss that person too.


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## exile in thighville (Apr 4, 2009)

olwen said:


> More like "unemployable/irresponsible and doesn't want to work." That would be a turnoff for any woman - or man.



right, but that's not the same thing



mossystate said:


> Gee, I have always heard that looks don't matter



good luck


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## Jon Blaze (Apr 4, 2009)

Once again, Kioewen leaves a :doh::doh::doh::doh::doh::doh::doh::doh: set of posts. I see a pattern here. :doh:


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## mossystate (Apr 4, 2009)

exile in thighville said:


> good luck



whoooooosh


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## Teecher (Apr 7, 2009)

Hello all. I happen to have read some of the comments of this thread and I can see some of my own poorer traits here.

I've been the closeted FA, that did not even realize that in keeping his BBW away from his judgmental friends and family, that he was indirectly and unknowingly, hurting his own lover's feelings

I've been the closeted FA, because of self-consciousness. Which for the more 'confident' types here means, dealing with a world of 'What is everybody thinking of me? and what can I do to stop them from hurting my already broken ego with their opinions of me?'

I've been the creep - who has posted comments about the many beautiful BBW's here on this website, that may or may not have wanted them.

I've been the 'Not-so-wealthy' FA, who is just a schoolteacher making less than 50 grand a year and is trying to keep his own house, car and utility payments up.

I am not perfect. I do have shortcomings that come with low self-esteem and I want to change - my question is how.


How does one change one's own shattered self-esteem as well as it's ill affects upon others?

I know I'm placing myself out there, but if there is help for it - I'm all ears.


Thank you.


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## LillyBBBW (Apr 7, 2009)

Teecher said:


> Hello all. I happen to have read some of the comments of this thread and I can see some of my own poorer traits here.
> 
> I've been the closeted FA, that did not even realize that in keeping his BBW away from his judgmental friends and family, that he was indirectly and unknowingly, hurting his own lover's feelings
> 
> ...



I have a rather unconventional approach. It's really simple. Cozy up to the very people you admire. Involve yourself tightly within the social set of the very people who make you aprehensive about accepting or revealing parts of yourself. Enjoy it, play it out for all it is and be their confidante. I think once you lose a healthy amount of respect for these people in viewing them as they truly are you will ask yourself out loud why you ever bothered. It will practicaly be a point of embarassment in and of itself. You'll ride a moped with a fat girl on the back grinning the whole way while wearing a blonde wig and pair of bright yellow Crocs and you wont give a shit what they think.


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## SamanthaNY (Apr 7, 2009)

Teecher said:


> Hello all. I happen to have read some of the comments of this thread and I can see some of my own poorer traits here.
> 
> I've been the closeted FA, that did not even realize that in keeping his BBW away from his judgmental friends and family, that he was indirectly and unknowingly, hurting his own lover's feelings
> 
> ...


You start by making a post like this. One that shows you're sincere and thoughtful (and it does). Then, perhaps you study the people you admire - the ones who've gotten it right, in your eyes. The ones who are maybe not loudly




*OUT AND PROUD!!!!!* (not that there's anything wrong with that), but the ones for whom being an FA - for lack of a better term - is as much a part of them as their eyesight. It's just there, a part of them. It's something they fully appreciate as part of their life, but not something they need to crow about. Their preference is not a novelty they exploit, it's just part of who they are. 

Some of the people that impress me the most are those who have recognized they'd like to change something about themselves, and then go ahead and do just that. Not because they have to, or because people say they should - just because they think it's right for themselves. There's a few of those people here at Dim, and I find them remarkable and inspiring. 

Congrats on your first step .


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## Teecher (Apr 7, 2009)

SamanthaNY and LillyBBW, I just want to thank you both for being supportive of me. It's hard to own up to ones one shortcomings.

Thanks again.

Teecher


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## missy_blue_eyez (Apr 7, 2009)

kioewen said:


> Money is still the governining criterion for most women when selecting a mate.





TraciJo67 said:


> Please.
> 
> Snort.
> 
> *I* make more money than most of the men I know. I prefer to take care of my own needs, thanks very much.



So, was just wondering TraciJo hows about getting a little somethin' somethin' going on?


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## TraciJo67 (Apr 8, 2009)

missy_blue_eyez said:


> So, was just wondering TraciJo hows about getting a little somethin' somethin' going on?



Well, that depends. How big are your boobs?


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## mergirl (Apr 8, 2009)

TraciJo67 said:


> Well, that depends. How big are your boobs?


*nudge* Look at her profile!! Go for it Daddy tracibucks!!


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## MsGreenLantern (Apr 8, 2009)

Right now my biggest problem with FAs, my own in particular, is the fact he seems strangely unaware that I have different limitations than him... like too small seats, weight restrictions, things not fitting. He considers me an equal in all respects and doesn't stop to ponder what may be a bit more difficult for me.

Example: being on my feet for 6 hours straight at work playing whiffle-ball and such with kids = lots of foot pain and tired. He could do it all day no problem and seems to not understand my intense tired after I get home. Its only an hour recoup usually... but he's had to be broken of the fast walking as well. He loves holding hands when we walk anywhere together and since I'm rounder and shorter, he had to really snail it down.


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## snipermb435 (May 11, 2009)

Well i am not going to vote in the pole, figured i just wont.

But i will say this, i am not trying to offend anyone or piss anyone of etc. but this is my view. I love larger women dont deny it, but telling your freinds and loved ones is difficult, telling my parents i like larger women was like well i dont know, it felt aweful, but once it was done, i thought, what was i scared about, lol, it is my preference. 

Now the one thing i get jabbed in the sides about most is, loving boobs, and my family mainly dad and brother omg grandmother(not going there) have a dig at me. i am used to it, but thats family. Now, i think i told my best friend and a couple other by just being a brave sod that i prefer larger women but not actually saying it, know what i mean?

So actaully i have found that when i find my gf, fiance, wife, i should not be ashamed of what people think, but care and love her for who she is. 

so to all those pissed of man and women out there who have been fucked over by someone in life, i guess all i can say, dont think all people are like that, we are not.

I hope I got my message across i do, if not tell me and i will try and explain further.


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## chris_yvr (May 12, 2009)

> Poor fattiquette - walks too fast when you're out or selects restaurants with tiny booths



'fattiquette' .. nice.


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## Teresa (May 12, 2009)

Teecher said:


> ........
> I've been the closeted FA, that did not even realize that in keeping his BBW away from his judgmental friends and family, that he was indirectly and unknowingly, hurting his own lover's feelings
> 
> I've been the closeted FA, because of self-consciousness. Which for the more 'confident' types here means, dealing with a world of 'What is everybody thinking of me? and what can I do to stop them from hurting my already broken ego with their opinions of me?'
> ...



Ok, I have to be honest here. At first I thought some of your comments were written "tongue in cheek". I mean, what fat girl actually WANTS to meet the judgmental family or friends? BBW's just don't want the guy they're dating to suddenly duck around a corner when they're out with them because they come across a friend or family member. Or even worse, the FA only wants to stay in and never be seen in public with them. 

And to say you're a creep for commenting about the beautiful women on these boards made me grin. Come on....you guys know us ladies love the compliments. But if some of the other things you wrote were heartfelt, let me give you my two cents. Just remember, they probably not even worth that, especially in this economy.

You're self conscience, you're worried about what someone else might think of you. Welcome to the club.  It's hard to get around those things, but if you slowly but surely push yourself past your comfort zone you'll find confidence grows and worry decreases. I've found this in my own life when I put myself out there into situations and areas that I'd be much more comfortable staying away from. Because I hate when someone responds to me with vague answers, I'll give you a specific example of what you can do to try and build confidence and lessen your self-consciousness. As a man I'm guessing when you are with male friends there are times the topic of women and their bodies come up. Mention that you like curves on a woman or that you enjoy having something to hold onto when you make love, etc. You don't have to go into specifics, or height/weight ratio, but you can get the idea across that the swimsuit models aren't your type. As your confidence/comfort level grows be more specific, say you like chubby chicks, or wide asses, etc. 

As far as being the "not so wealthy FA", I don't believe anyone on these boards or even women in general look at a man who works a job and takes care of himself as someone unattractive because he isn't wealthy.

I can offer you no advice on how to repair your shattered self-image. Any advice would depend on how it was shattered in the first place and I would think a public forum like this wouldn't be conducive to helping you.

Hope some of what I wrote WAS helpful though. 

Teresa


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## katherine22 (May 13, 2009)

Kortana said:


> I posted closeted but I would like to add to that. I have a friend that is recently single and we were looking for ways she could meet FA's. Out of curiosity we did a search on Craigslist. In the personals section we searched the term "BBW" to see if any FA's were looking. Turns out the only FA's searching for BBW's is in the Casual Encounters section. That to me is beyond closeted- that is that the FA's in our area are looking to get intimate with BBW's but not necessarily have relationships with them.
> 
> Ugh- ok sure it is Craigslist but you would think you would find at leats one looking for the full package...but nope. Very discouraging!



Other: Fat admirers that assume that when a woman is fat she is less than and so starved for male attention that she will put up with any boorish behavior from the fat admirer.


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## GutsGirl (May 14, 2009)

Teecher said:


> Hello all. I happen to have read some of the comments of this thread and I can see some of my own poorer traits here.
> 
> I've been the closeted FA, that did not even realize that in keeping his BBW away from his judgmental friends and family, that he was indirectly and unknowingly, hurting his own lover's feelings
> 
> ...



Well, I think the first step to changing your behavior is to recognize what you've done wrong/where you've gone wrong (as you have done) and change your behavior one bad habit at a time. It will take time, and change will not happen all at once, but it is worthwhile. If you need to apologize to anyone, do so and then amend your behavior as you go along.

About introducing your beloved to those who may be critical of her, introduce her if she is fine with meeting these people, but be prepared to defend her should unkind comments arise. Whether they are said to her face or behind her back, if you hear them, defend her, and do so with the understanding that if those comments are repeated, that that means you will be ending your relationship with the person who makes them. If you and your girlfriend/fiancee/wife are a team, "two against the world", then you need to have each other's backs. NO ONE should criticize her for her weight or you for your choice of her, and be allowed to get away with it. Not even if they are members of your own immediate family. Your relationship with her supercedes any prior relationship. 

Trust me, if you do this for your girlfriend, she WILL respect you and love you for it, and, conversely, if she senses that you can't stand up for her rights when she is teased or criticized, she will wonder if you can you stand up for her for anything else.

About the 'creep' part; if you feel you need to apologize to anyone in particular, PM them and apologize.  But, also realize that recognizing and acknowledging a woman's beauty is not the same as harassing her or making a crudely sexual comment.

About the 'not-so-wealthy' part, don't sweat it. Be prudent with what you have, but generous when/if you can. Being neither a penny-pinching miser nor a spendthrift is attractive; as with most things, moderation is the key.


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## StarMoon (May 14, 2009)

I wonder if there is ever going to be a reverse thread based on this?


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## BarbBBW (May 15, 2009)

StarMoon said:


> I wonder if there is ever going to be a reverse thread based on this?



there is LOL


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## Fuzzy Necromancer (May 15, 2009)

Fascinita said:


> The following bad FAs have approached me to ask me to convey their discomfort with this thread to the community. Please let's try to be sensitive, everyone.
> 
> DateBunglerFA
> Bernard the Broke FA
> ...




...Raymond the Rattlesnake?


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## The Orange Mage (May 15, 2009)

Fascinita said:


> The following bad FAs have approached me to ask me to convey their discomfort with this thread to the community. Please let's try to be sensitive, everyone.
> ...
> *TimTheTitSmasher5000FA*
> ...



I think I know this fellow. Is this him? http://smiswi.sasktelwebhosting.com/Images/Mammo machine.jpg


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## Russ2d (Jun 13, 2009)

I usually avoid threads like this as if it were a plague but I have a few complaints about my fellow FAs too (by no means is this indicative of FAs in general but a select few)

The closeted FA- This is a tough one as it's understandable given the pressures that exist for FAs not to surface until they are ready but I wish more would hurry up and realize the 'outside' world is nothing more than fraud and marketing manipulation- cause we need the numbers.

The secret FA- yeah these guys really do suck. A horrible experience for a BBW to discover the man they're with won't be seen with them in public or introduced to his family...unacceptable

The guilty and apologetic FA- Annoying is the word that comes to mind. I have little tolerance for guilty FAs especially if they're out of their 20s.

The infantile FA- I cringe with embarrassment when I see posts from grown men like "is it wrong to be an FA?" Or "how do I let my girlfriend know I like her fat?" Guys like this give the impression that FAs couldn't resemble a man if their life depended on it.

The pandering FA- I hate these types where if a woman says something stupid or outrageous these worms are ready to slither over and jump to their defense, not because they agree with them but because they're hoping to win favor by doing so.


That's it for me except to say that other than a few bad apples I think it's important to recognize that FAs are vastly superior beings, and one I happen to be.


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## Power_Metal_Kitsune (Jun 14, 2009)

BothGunsBlazing said:


> actually, it was more like this.
> 
> BothGunsBlazing(12:00:09 PM): oh and what if the guy doesn't have any friends?
> Me (12:00:25 PM): thats a problem. you are so hot. omg
> Me (12:00:33 PM): i wouldnt date someone who was friendless.



No, get it right, BothGunsBlazing, it was me you PM'd and it went like this:


BothGunsBlazing(12:00:09 PM): oh and what if the guy doesn't have any friends?
Power_Metal_Kitsune (12:00:25 PM): thats no problem. i don't have any friends either.
Power_Metal_Kitsune (12:00:33 PM):will you be my friend...my friend 'til the end? *cackles evilly*


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## joswitch (Jun 23, 2009)

TraciJo67 said:


> Please.
> 
> Snort.
> 
> ...



Now that's an interesting point - what do you mean by "ambition"?

For instance: 
I have ambitions to get my music out to people all over the world, (currently self-published and being processed by all major online retailers, via my distributer - cdBaby) and get my second book of poetry published (currently awaiting word from a local small press, failing that I'll self-pub using cafepress and/or lulu.com) .... and more stuff like that... none of which - let's face the truth! present high odds of raising me much in the way of $$$ - cos I'm not a "commercial" artist, probably 1 in 100 or maybe 1 in 1,000 people "get" what I do, enough to spend money on it... 

Does this creative / "non-money" ambition "count" by your lights?

btw - for background: 
I've been a self-employed musician/teacher earning my living at it for almost the last 5 years (with close to zero disposable income to spare - I earn about the same as the average Ukranian, which after expenses = not enough to break into the "taxpayer" bracket in the UK)...
I'm a river gypsy and I love my life on the water, but it is far from materially luxurious...

so be honest would you date a guy with my kind of "ambitions"??


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## joswitch (Jun 23, 2009)

SocialbFly said:


> I disagree TraciJo, mostly though because i saw what my sister went through when she continued to do well in her job and advance and her husband didnt...it caused so many issues for her, so i always wanted someone who could support themselves and pay their own way if need be...i am far from insecure, and i promise you, i am far from a money grubbing gold digger, but i also dont want a husband or partner counting all my money and not wanting to advance himself...i want an equal partner, and if he was rich too, i wouldnt argue...at all...and would prolly make vacation plans (joke)
> 
> i think there is some basis to it, cause when it comes down to it, in traditional family roles (note the word, traditional) we see the woman as taking time off from work, to have or take care of the kids and she wants someone that can provide for the family while the family is growing..so yes, some men might see that as money grubbing but in sociology forms it is the survival of the family in every sense...



Applauding your honesty here - SocialbFly - I don't think there's anything wrong at all - if you really want to raise a family - to expect your partner to be able to make an equal financial contribution to this, or indeed to "shoulder the burden" completely at times... 

One of the major factors cited by one ex of mine when she split with me was that I didn't want to buy a house/have kids (more to the point - I don't want to work 40years at a job I hate to do so... I don't want either house or kids badly enough for that, if I came by pots of money without having to give up my life to the pursuit of it, that would be different).... and I don't think it's bad or gold-digging of her to want that at all... It's something she envisions wanting in the future and she needs someone who's going to work with her on that.... Fair enough.... It's good that you know what you want out of life and if you're honest with your partner then they get the choice as to whether or not they wish to spend their lives working and raising a family with you... 

I think where people get resentful with each other is where their expectations are concealed from each other OR when one partner just *assumes* that of course they will do X, Y, Z together... 
It's very easy, for instance, to fall into the the assumption that a relationship will progress from dating through living together, engagement to house, marriage, kids, cars, holidays etc... because that's the received societal norm... but hey, not everyone wants those things! 

Obviously being honest may mean fewer partners (that's been my experience) but less stress and heartbreak in the long run and more chance of finding someone you're truly compatible with... even if only for a while... *sighs*


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## Green Eyed Fairy (Jun 23, 2009)

butch said:


> For me, the worst personal thing I've come up with for guys is the whole fact that they want to live online and not in real life. I have no desire to just 'talk' about sexy stuff and/or meet ups with people, I want to do it, and yet the few guys who have contacted me only want to live in some fantasy land that stays on the net.
> 
> Someone I know told me recently that one of the things that annoy them about this site is the number of people who talk a good game about being a FA, and yet this all exists in their head, as they've never actually dated a fat person before. They're like 'put up or shut up,' and I have to say, I agree. I don't mind staying in fantasy land if someone is up front about it, but why so many keep up the illusion that one day they'll move from make-believe to reality is beyond me.



Yes....something I have noticed in the Brave New World of dating.....the disconnect or fear of reality. 





JoyJoy said:


> I chose other, although several of the other choices are pretty annoying.
> 
> The type that bugs me most is the one who is so completely ruled by his "FA-ness" that he can't focus on anything else - everything revolves around how much he loves fat and the effects/consequences of it....to the point of mind-numbing boredom that makes me want to jump out a window.



I don't trust that attitude if I detect it. FAs are just men with a different prefernce.....I like it when the menfolk realize that, too......



furious styles said:


> voted dick size



I didn't pick it.....didn't even think twice about it either. I am slipping... 



Cat said:


> Couldn't all of these poor traits apply to any man in general, and not just FAs?
> 
> Even the "closeted" question. Some insecure guys don't want to bring girls home who don't meet their parent's standards for ______ (side of the tracks, heritage, race, clothing style, height, etc). I think the key is poor self-esteem in general with men like that.



I picked closeted---those people just bug me. If a person cannot accept and weather some dissension from family and friends, then that person simply should not be dating. 



thatgirl08 said:


> I don't think closet cases are always as obvious as everyone thinks.



True.....they don't advertise that the truth of how they feel. They are under-handed and sneaky....with everyone. 



mergirl said:


> pretentious jobby=:eat1:



I have to confess.....I really don't know what a jobby is.....:blush:



kioewen said:


> I'm surprised to see the most signifcant one left off here - *poor* (as in, "*not wealthy enough*").



This 'splains why I married two different poor guys. Husbands 3, 4 and five are definitely going to have jobs.......:doh: 



TraciJo67 said:


> Lack of ambition, however, is a major turn-off to most.





TraciJo67 said:


> With regard to the sociological aspect of things, I'd agree that this played a huge role in the past. But now? Women are educated, they work, they can provide quite well for themselves. They don't need a man to provide for them. *What they do need is a man who will carry his own weight (and I think this is exactly what you said above).*






olwen said:


> More like "unemployable/irresponsible and doesn't want to work." That would be a turnoff for any woman - or man.



Yep....it's about responsibility.....not about money. Who wants a person in their life that cannot take care of themselves? It's just flat out stupid to not expect adults to be adults. 

Man children = too much of a burden


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## Fish (Jun 23, 2009)

I'm a guy and I suppose the tag "FA" certainly applies to me, though I personally dislike the lable. And the reason I dislike the label is part of why I voted "Other".

Personally, AS a man, I'm generally disgusted listening to other men talk about women and always have been. The sad majority of my fellow Y chromosome carriers, FA or not, all have the same obnoxious tendency to look on women as objects and break them down into little more that carriers of the anatomical part they like best. I've sat around too many people who discuss their love for a specific body part with such disregard to the actual OWNER of said part that it seems like many of them would be perfectly happy with little more than an isolated ball of fat in the shape of a belly, breast or butt. I just don't understand that level of objectification on any level.

So, I suppose that's what bugs me the most AS a man. FA's who seem interested in nothing but the fat of the women and not in the woman herself as a person.


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## Crystal (Jun 23, 2009)

Fish said:


> I'm a guy and I suppose the tag "FA" certainly applies to me, though I personally dislike the lable. And the reason I dislike the label is part of why I voted "Other".
> 
> Personally, AS a man, I'm generally disgusted listening to other men talk about women and always have been. The sad majority of my fellow Y chromosome carriers, FA or not, all have the same obnoxious tendency to look on women as objects and break them down into little more that carriers of the anatomical part they like best. I've sat around too many people who discuss their love for a specific body part with such disregard to the actual OWNER of said part that it seems like many of them would be perfectly happy with little more than an isolated ball of fat in the shape of a belly, breast or butt. I just don't understand that level of objectification on any level.
> 
> So, I suppose that's what bugs me the most AS a man. FA's who seem interested in nothing but the fat of the women and not in the woman herself as a person.




I wish most FA's had your attitude.


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## EllorionsDarlingAngel (Jun 23, 2009)

Fish said:


> I'm a guy and I suppose the tag "FA" certainly applies to me, though I personally dislike the lable. And the reason I dislike the label is part of why I voted "Other".
> 
> Personally, AS a man, I'm generally disgusted listening to other men talk about women and always have been. The sad majority of my fellow Y chromosome carriers, FA or not, all have the same obnoxious tendency to look on women as objects and break them down into little more that carriers of the anatomical part they like best. I've sat around too many people who discuss their love for a specific body part with such disregard to the actual OWNER of said part that it seems like many of them would be perfectly happy with little more than an isolated ball of fat in the shape of a belly, breast or butt. I just don't understand that level of objectification on any level.
> 
> So, I suppose that's what bugs me the most AS a man. FA's who seem interested in nothing but the fat of the women and not in the woman herself as a person.


Yes.. this is how I feel! :bow: You said it perfect!


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## TraciJo67 (Jun 24, 2009)

joswitch said:


> Now that's an interesting point - what do you mean by "ambition"?
> 
> For instance:
> I have ambitions to get my music out to people all over the world, (currently self-published and being processed by all major online retailers, via my distributer - cdBaby) and get my second book of poetry published (currently awaiting word from a local small press, failing that I'll self-pub using cafepress and/or lulu.com) .... and more stuff like that... none of which - let's face the truth! present high odds of raising me much in the way of $$$ - cos I'm not a "commercial" artist, probably 1 in 100 or maybe 1 in 1,000 people "get" what I do, enough to spend money on it...
> ...



I think that any person who isn't overly materialistic would love to date someone like you. Don't get me wrong -- there's nothing wrong, IMO, with desiring the finer things in life. I respect and admire people who have the courage to go after what it is that they really want for themselves, whatever that may be. You wish for success as a respected artist, and you're willing to make sacrifices to achieve that goal. That's ambitious in my book.


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## exile in thighville (Jun 24, 2009)

joswitch said:


> Now that's an interesting point - what do you mean by "ambition"?



she meant motivation.



Fish said:


> I'm a guy and I suppose the tag "FA" certainly applies to me, though I personally dislike the lable. And the reason I dislike the label is part of why I voted "Other".
> 
> Personally, AS a man, I'm generally disgusted listening to other men talk about women and always have been. The sad majority of my fellow Y chromosome carriers, FA or not, all have the same obnoxious tendency to look on women as objects and break them down into little more that carriers of the anatomical part they like best. I've sat around too many people who discuss their love for a specific body part with such disregard to the actual OWNER of said part that it seems like many of them would be perfectly happy with little more than an isolated ball of fat in the shape of a belly, breast or butt. I just don't understand that level of objectification on any level.
> 
> So, I suppose that's what bugs me the most AS a man. FA's who seem interested in nothing but the fat of the women and not in the woman herself as a person.



this is very silly. if you were gay, but 90% of gays embarrassed you, you'd still be gay. and i'm sure being holier-than-thou is a turn-off too.


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## katherine22 (Jun 24, 2009)

Santaclear said:


> I'm fond of creepy BBWs.



Thank goodness!


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## joswitch (Jun 24, 2009)

TraciJo67 said:


> I think that any person who isn't overly materialistic would love to date someone like you. Don't get me wrong -- there's nothing wrong, IMO, with desiring the finer things in life. I respect and admire people who have the courage to go after what it is that they really want for themselves, whatever that may be. You wish for success as a respected artist, and you're willing to make sacrifices to achieve that goal. That's ambitious in my book.



OK, Cool! Nice one! Thanks for responding!


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## joswitch (Jun 24, 2009)

exile in thighville said:


> she meant motivation.



Yeah, I was talking to Tracijo there Exile... Trust me, when I want *your* opinion about someone else's opinion - I'll ask you for it.

Oh, good news for ya though! You just got selected to represent your country in the London Olympics Patronising Marathon! 

Enjoy!


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## LillyBBBW (Jun 24, 2009)

Fish said:


> I'm a guy and I suppose the tag "FA" certainly applies to me, though I personally dislike the lable. And the reason I dislike the label is part of why I voted "Other".
> 
> Personally, AS a man, I'm generally disgusted listening to other men talk about women and always have been. The sad majority of my fellow Y chromosome carriers, FA or not, all have the same obnoxious tendency to look on women as objects and break them down into little more that carriers of the anatomical part they like best. I've sat around too many people who discuss their love for a specific body part with such disregard to the actual OWNER of said part that it seems like many of them would be perfectly happy with little more than an isolated ball of fat in the shape of a belly, breast or butt. I just don't understand that level of objectification on any level.
> 
> So, I suppose that's what bugs me the most AS a man. FA's who seem interested in nothing but the fat of the women and not in the woman herself as a person.



This does seem awfully judgemental. Many times I've made known my utter disgust for people who have perfect hair that doesn't frizz in high humidity. A person who has been around the block has an understanding for where that passion is coming from. They know I don't actually have it out for perfectly cioffed people. I can't help but think that people who come away from that conversation thinking I'm shallow about people's hair are either very slow or they dislike me enough so that they're just looking for negative things to say. How can you be so certain that every man who has ever raved about the beauty of a woman or the particular parts of a woman he finds beautiful is low brow? Fish we've seen your art. It's probably why people feel so free to share with you the parts they find so visually beautiful because they sense you have eyes to see the same thing. I think you are being overly harsh in your thinking towards most of these guys you've encountered. Notice I said MOST.


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## mergirl (Jun 24, 2009)

CrystalUT11 said:


> I wish most FA's had your attitude.





EllorionsDarlingAngel said:


> Yes.. this is how I feel! :bow: You said it perfect!



Hmm..maby its just another form of chat up?? Many i night in my single days i would hear myself saying "There, there..men ARE bastards..have another drink" 
Take out the competition!! POW!! Haha
Hellz i didn't ever SAY i was a nice person!! 
I always find it funny when i hear people telling my tits .."Grrr i really hate those bastards who objectify women".. ..


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## EllorionsDarlingAngel (Jun 24, 2009)

mergirl said:


> Hmm..maby its just another form of chat up?? Many i night in my single days i would hear myself saying "There, there..men ARE bastards..have another drink"
> Take out the competition!! POW!! Haha
> Hellz i didn't ever SAY i was a nice person!!
> I always find it funny when i hear people telling my tits .."Grrr i really hate those bastards who objectify women".. ..


I have times when I don't mind it then other when I do. I mean don't we do the same thing sometimes. I think men and women alike have times when they do that we can't help it we are only human..lol..


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## mergirl (Jun 24, 2009)

Exactly!! ....yes, men ARE bastards..I hope you are drunk!  lmao
but..yes.. I think that sometimes a certain type of person being a bit sleazy can get away with it somehow and some people can't. I think everyone has their own way of chatting people up and i'm pretty sure most people objectify people at least some of the time. 
Is everyone drunk yet???


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## EllorionsDarlingAngel (Jun 24, 2009)

mergirl said:


> Exactly!! ....yes, men ARE bastards..I hope you are drunk!  lmao
> but..yes.. I think that sometimes a certain type of person being a bit sleazy can get away with it somehow and some people can't. I think everyone has their own way of chatting people up and i'm pretty sure most people objectify people at least some of the time.
> Is everyone drunk yet???


Nope...Would be nice tho! I need a night of drunken fun!


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## mergirl (Jun 24, 2009)

EllorionsDarlingAngel said:


> Nope...Would be nice tho! I need a night of drunken fun!


See, thats the answer i used to always hope for!! lmao


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## EllorionsDarlingAngel (Jun 24, 2009)

mergirl said:


> See, thats the answer i used to always hope for!! lmao


LOL I have had plenty, but I am due for one!


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## Russ2d (Jun 24, 2009)

Fish said:


> I'm a guy and I suppose the tag "FA" certainly applies to me, though I personally dislike the lable. And the reason I dislike the label is part of why I voted "Other".
> 
> Personally, AS a man, I'm generally disgusted listening to other men talk about women and always have been. The sad majority of my fellow Y chromosome carriers, FA or not, all have the same obnoxious tendency to look on women as objects and break them down into little more that carriers of the anatomical part they like best. I've sat around too many people who discuss their love for a specific body part with such disregard to the actual OWNER of said part that it seems like many of them would be perfectly happy with little more than an isolated ball of fat in the shape of a belly, breast or butt. I just don't understand that level of objectification on any level.
> 
> So, I suppose that's what bugs me the most AS a man. FA's who seem interested in nothing but the fat of the women and not in the woman herself as a person.




Wow this is such a PC rehearsed regurgitated kiss-ass BS answer... but hey Fish you are very talented and a nice guy so I will go easy here.  

Reality check: Guys are hard-wired to lust after women's bodies... guys are not going to change no matter how many silly little words (like objectify or sexist) is conjured up from PC la la land, NOR should we. 

Are there guys who are rude or could use more tact? Sure but as a man I am a getting a little tired of male-bashing, either by bitter women or by guys who curry favor via public self-castration.


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## fatgirlflyin (Jun 24, 2009)

Russ2d said:


> Reality check: Guys are hard-wired to lust after women's bodies... guys are not going to change no matter how many silly little words (like objectify or sexist) is conjured up from PC la la land, NOR should we.




Not only guys. I see Vin Diesel only for all the muscles on his body, I lust after Hugh Jackman and I will go see any movie they are playing in even if its a shitty movie just so I can stare at them for 90 minutes out of my day. 

What I think of when I hear the word objectify are those guys out there that only see tits, ass, belly, thighs and ignore the rest of the woman they are attached to. You have to admit those guys (and girls) are out there and they are annoying as hell. 

There is nothing wrong with being attracted to a person physically, there's not even anything wrong with admitting that the initial reason you got to know a person or dated a person was because you found them attractive, or just plain out wanted to do them. I don't know many people who could be in a relationship with zero physical attraction to their partner. I know I couldn't.


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## TraciJo67 (Jun 24, 2009)

Russ2d said:


> Wow this is such a PC rehearsed regurgitated kiss-ass BS answer... but hey Fish you are very talented and a nice guy so I will go easy here.
> 
> Reality check: Guys are hard-wired to lust after women's bodies... guys are not going to change no matter how many silly little words (like objectify or sexist) is conjured up from PC la la land, NOR should we.
> 
> Are there guys who are rude or could use more tact? Sure but as a man I am a getting a little tired of male-bashing, either by bitter women or by guys who curry favor via public self-castration.



I'm not sure that you read a word that he wrote because I didn't see anything about how awful men are for admiring an attractive woman. What I saw was objection to viewing and treating women as if they are nothing BUT what is being admired about their bodies. It brings to mind the "Family Guy" episode in which Peter gets caught making love to a great big quivering bag of fat (I think it's implied that it was what was left over from Lois' liposuction) and he says "um, it's exactly what it looks like." 

We get that men are visual creatures, get turned on by attractive bodies, don't have to fall in love with every pretty thing they see, and that objectification of a stranger is far different than doing it with one's partner. Men do not corner the market in this area. The objectification that Fish was talking about, if you care to read it again, was far more insidious viewing online pics or seeing a pretty fat girl strolling by and thinking about how much fun it would be to hop all over that. WE ALL DO THAT, not just men, and welcome to 2009.

And when I say 'welcome to this century' it is because you're using antiquated terms like 'public self-castration' (coz that would, of course, be the worst fate possible) and applying them to men who may not ... surprise ... may not actually be trying to step into a pair of owner-occupied frilly panties. Perhaps they just intuitively *get* it. 

Wow. For a man-hating shrew, I do love me some men


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## mossystate (Jun 24, 2009)

Public self-castration. *L* Jesus H Macy...if a few men, here and there, dare to not sit around in a circle and jack off over the purty pictures other dudes are passing around, and they are not making it known, on a constant basis, that they are RED BLOODED SEXUAL MEN...why, they MUST be looking to score points with women, and are not sexually healthy men. *L* Really? For Real? Bitter women....LOL A title that is becoming a Dims classic. So delicate, russ!


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## Tad (Jun 24, 2009)

TraciJo, apparently I've given out too much rep lately, and for some reason there is no special 'man-loving/man-hatingshrew' rep supply. But I do want to take that post and nail it to a few foreheads.


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## Fascinita (Jun 24, 2009)

I, myself, am a hepatic creature, which means I am hard-wired to act from my liver. Everything my liver commands, I do.


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## JoyJoy (Jun 24, 2009)

As a woman who has wasted many conversations with men who were only interested in talking about the size of my belly or ass and had *zero* interest in me as a person, I have to back up what Fish is saying. 

Sure, guys are hard-wired to lust after women. No one has said there's anything wrong with that. What is wrong is when they use that lust as an excuse to behave badly. I don't give two shits about what's PC or not PC, if a guy can't see beyond his physical attraction and talk to me about things besides the size of my flab, he's not worth my time. The guys who catch my attention are the ones who realize that YES, they do have to change if they want a quality relationship, rather than acting like cavemen. 

That said, lust in a relationship is a wonderful thing. A man who loves my body - who craves my belly and drools over my ass or my thighs or whatever body part cranks his chain is a huge turn on to me. But that can't exist for me personally without knowing that he values every other part of me as well...and that's where it has to start for me. 

The biggest difference I see between Fish's post and Russ's response is that while Fish is actually attempting to see things from both the female and male perspective, Russ is puffing up and beating his chest, grunting about not being able to drool openly about whatever womanly part is the meat du Jour. If Fish is trying to curry my favor, I'll take that dish any day...and Russ...it seems you do bitter very well, yourself.


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## Famouslastwords (Jun 24, 2009)

Russ hates women who don't stay in the kitchen and who speak when they aren't spoken too and who don't smile and nod, and who don't thank you when you beat them.


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## mossystate (Jun 24, 2009)

Repped, Joy.

Also, I thank all the men I have had the pleasure of knowing/loving/lusting after, who have been dynamic... sexual...fun... infuriating ( and having liked all those things about me )...preferring to not be bogged down so totally with, not natural impluses, but the insipid chattering of some men, who don't have the personalities to use those natural impulses to the advantage of all involved, and, instead, use them to bulldoze.

I have five brothers...all heterosexual...all love sex...yet, I cannot imagine any of them acting like creeps, and using the ' hard wired ' excuse ( and that's what it can become ). Hmmmmm.


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## Green Eyed Fairy (Jun 24, 2009)

mergirl said:


> Exactly!! ....yes, men ARE bastards..I hope you are drunk!  lmao
> but..yes.. I think that sometimes a certain type of person being a bit sleazy can get away with it somehow and some people can't. I think everyone has their own way of chatting people up and i'm pretty sure most people objectify people at least some of the time.
> Is everyone drunk yet???



Blah blah! 



edx said:


> TraciJo, apparently I've given out too much rep lately, and for some reason there is no special 'man-loving/man-hatingshrew' rep supply. But I do want to take that post and nail it to a few foreheads.



It's okay- I got her 



Castration....?

Gawd, I'm all hot and bothered again.....THANKS FOR NUTTIN PEOPLE! :doh: :blush:


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## olwen (Jun 24, 2009)

Russ2d said:


> Wow this is such a PC rehearsed regurgitated kiss-ass BS answer... but hey Fish you are very talented and a nice guy so I will go easy here.
> 
> Reality check: Guys are hard-wired to lust after women's bodies... guys are not going to change no matter how many silly little words (like objectify or sexist) is conjured up from PC la la land, NOR should we.
> 
> Are there guys who are rude or could use more tact? Sure but as a man I am a getting a little tired of male-bashing, either by bitter women or by guys who curry favor via public self-castration.



Dude, no one is objecting to male lust in and of itself or asking men to not be turned on. It's the way that lust is expressed that is the problem. I don't see how asking guys to be considerate is an idea conjured up from PC la la la la land. 

I also find it amusing to know you think there's no way in hell a man could hold women in high enough regard to actually care about how what men do affects them. 

If some men get sick of people telling them how they think they should react to their own sexual urges, then you're right, no one has a right to tell them anything. But if the way they react is utterly inappropriate - as is often the case - then well, they all deserve pow pows and corner time don't they. It's the impropriety that we object to.


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## Teresa (Jun 25, 2009)

Ella Bella said:


> Not only guys. ......
> 
> There is nothing wrong with being attracted to a person physically, there's not even anything wrong with admitting that the initial reason you got to know a person or dated a person was because you found them attractive, or just plain out wanted to do them. I don't know many people who could be in a relationship with zero physical attraction to their partner. I know I couldn't.



I so agree with what you're saying. Had a first date with this really nice man the other night and as I sat across the table from him I couldn't help but appreciate his shoulders, arms and hands (oh wow...what hands). I actually faded away into... I don't know where... but some place where all I saw were his shoulders, arms and hands. I didn't even hear what he was saying. I came back to myself pretty fast, but zoning in on certain body parts is definitely not just a male phenomenon. I'm interested in the whole package, but it sure is nice when the wrappings are good.

Teresa


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## BarbBBW (Jun 25, 2009)

Teresa said:


> I so agree with what you're saying. Had a first date with this really nice man the other night and as I sat across the table from him I couldn't help but appreciate his shoulders, arms and hands (oh wow...what hands). I actually faded away into... I don't know where... but some place where all I saw were his shoulders, arms and hands. I didn't even hear what he was saying. I came back to myself pretty fast, but zoning in on certain body parts is definitely not just a male phenomenon. I'm interested in the whole package, but it sure is nice when the wrappings are good.
> 
> Teresa



that is a simple and short story,.. but IS IT hotter THAN HELL!! LOVE IT!!
THANKS FOR SHARING!


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## Fish (Jun 26, 2009)

Russ2d said:


> Wow this is such a PC rehearsed regurgitated kiss-ass BS answer... but hey Fish you are very talented and a nice guy so I will go easy here.
> 
> Reality check: Guys are hard-wired to lust after women's bodies... guys are not going to change no matter how many silly little words (like objectify or sexist) is conjured up from PC la la land, NOR should we.
> 
> Are there guys who are rude or could use more tact? Sure but as a man I am a getting a little tired of male-bashing, either by bitter women or by guys who curry favor via public self-castration.



Wow, thanks for going so easy on me, Russ. I appreciate not having my personal feelings on a subject belittled and chalked up to little more than rehearsed, regurgitated bullshit ass kissing and public self-castration. Had you not gone so EASY on me, I might have cause to take that personally.

But hey, I've been told that I'm pretty judgmental, overly harsh and holier-than-thou while I'm talking to women's tits, so what else does one expect. Thanks for not trying to devalue my opinions in order to elevate your man-status. That would've been rude.


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## superodalisque (Jun 26, 2009)

Russ2d said:


> Wow this is such a PC rehearsed regurgitated kiss-ass BS answer... but hey Fish you are very talented and a nice guy so I will go easy here.
> 
> Reality check: Guys are hard-wired to lust after women's bodies... guys are not going to change no matter how many silly little words (like objectify or sexist) is conjured up from PC la la land, NOR should we.
> 
> Are there guys who are rude or could use more tact? Sure but as a man I am a getting a little tired of male-bashing, either by bitter women or by guys who curry favor via public self-castration.



guys may be hardwired to appreciate women's bodies but does it mean they are supposed to be hardwired to be emotionally disconnected assholes? i hope not. this hardwired thing has lost its steam anyway. men are human beings with minds and hearts and the personal strength and fortitude to manage thier desires when they want to--not some whimpy guy so afraid of his own shadow that he is too uncomfortable to admit in front of other men he actually has feelings. or maybe he is too ashamed or childish to even say he finds a woman beautiful so he just reduces it to sexual comments. those who operate like walking disembodied penises have no right to chastise men who are trying to be grown up responsible respectable men with thier own minds and opinions. i hope no one would uphold any guy who can't ever think beyond "the fat". from what i know of men most who are always doing the talking --they are generally the ones who can't do. so the ones who are truly self castrating are the ones always talking about body parts like little boy virgins instead of the sexually able men they will hopefully grow into one day. so i guess we aren't male bashing here. there is a lot of little boy misbehavior bashing going on though.

i resent conscious FAs being called PC ass kissers . a lot of nice men have left dims because they don't want to associate themselves with the juvenile things said and done by some men here--so much so that some of the women think all FAs are unconscious men with no true feelings for the women here. its good to know that everybody is not like that. not every guy here spends all of his time on the paysite pages. not every man here would rather if you gained no matter whether you die or not. there are some real men here and i'm glad they have started speaking out. the FA forum is a breath of fresh air and totally different from what a lot of women feared it would be --thankfully. keep talking guys! we luv ya too!


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## Smushygirl (Jun 26, 2009)

Russ2d said:


> Wow this is such a PC rehearsed regurgitated kiss-ass BS answer... but hey Fish you are very talented and a nice guy so I will go easy here.
> 
> Reality check: Guys are hard-wired to lust after women's bodies... guys are not going to change no matter how many silly little words (like objectify or sexist) is conjured up from PC la la land, NOR should we.
> 
> Are there guys who are rude or could use more tact? Sure but as a man I am a getting a little tired of male-bashing, either by bitter women or by guys who curry favor via public self-castration.




Russ, I got the perfect thing for your love life right here. Oprah is pulling it in the red wagon.


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## mossystate (Jun 26, 2009)

If loving Smushy is wrong...I don't wanna be right.


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## Green Eyed Fairy (Jun 27, 2009)

Just couldn't help but share.........


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## Ernest Nagel (Jun 27, 2009)

Most of the allegedly _shrill and strident feminist_ comments some people seem so offended by are to male bashing as clan bashing would be to racism. Abhorrent behavior is unacceptable independent of the gender, race, age, religion, size, musical tastes, etc. of the person(s) engaged in the questionable practice. 

Objection to a behavior isn't _de facto_ prejudice simply because most of the perpetrators of that behavior belong to a particular subset. The fact that many of your peers are engaged in something despicable doesn't earn you a pass. Decrying hit-and-run fatherhood doesn't make someone a sexist or a misandryst anymore than faulting looters makes someone a racist. The only difference is there's no such thing as hit-and-run motherhood. It's a broader analogy than the deniers will accept, I realize.

I know I'm not going to change a single mind with what I say here. It still doesn't relieve me of the obligation to say something. Despite consequences and criticism I hope women here and at large will continue to bless men with higher expectations for us. It's sad that some will presume a demand for something better is demeaning. The truth is a lack of demand and low expectations are what's truly demeaning. I'm honestly and deeply grateful for the women who can still hold men to a higher standard. Sadly, I really can't fault those who don't. :bow:

For the men here who feel the lowest common denominator is their highest attainable aspiration, how do I thank you? You're doing for FA's almost what polyester has done for high fashion. :doh:


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## Santaclear (Jun 27, 2009)

Russ2d said:


> Wow this is such a PC rehearsed regurgitated kiss-ass BS answer... but hey Fish you are very talented and a nice guy so I will go easy here.
> Reality check: Guys are hard-wired to lust after women's bodies... guys are not going to change no matter how many silly little words (like objectify or sexist) is conjured up from PC la la land, NOR should we.
> Are there guys who are rude or could use more tact? Sure but as a man I am a getting a little tired of male-bashing, either by bitter women or by guys who curry favor via public self-castration.



Quit your clownin', Russ! *_aw, big hugs to you!*_


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## exile in thighville (Jun 27, 2009)

joswitch said:


> Yeah, I was talking to Tracijo there Exile... Trust me, when I want *your* opinion about someone else's opinion - I'll ask you for it.
> 
> Oh, good news for ya though! You just got selected to represent your country in the London Olympics Patronising Marathon!
> 
> Enjoy!



boom, roasted


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## Paquito (Jul 3, 2009)

Russ2d said:


> Wow this is such a PC rehearsed regurgitated kiss-ass BS answer... but hey Fish you are very talented and a nice guy so I will go easy here.
> 
> Reality check: Guys are hard-wired to lust after women's bodies... guys are not going to change no matter how many silly little words (like objectify or sexist) is conjured up from PC la la land, NOR should we.
> 
> Are there guys who are rude or could use more tact? Sure but as a man I am a getting a little tired of male-bashing, either by bitter women or by guys who curry favor via public self-castration.




Oh Russ, if only everyone knew this little reality check. Then maybe those silly women with their self respect and dignity would realize their place right? Because as a man, I get so tired of women not letting me objectify them and just treat them like any other fap material. Equals? Nah, that's not enough for my hard-wired sex drive.

And dontcha just hate it when those women actually present opinions - ooops, meant bash males? You deserve to be the arrogant ass that you are, naysayers be damned! After all, you're not the one that could change for the better, it's those pesky womenfolk. If only they would stay attached to the kitchen stove like they're supposed to.

*shakes fist angrily at the sky*


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## katherine22 (Jul 3, 2009)

free2beme04 said:


> Oh Russ, if only everyone knew this little reality check. Then maybe those silly women with their self respect and dignity would realize their place right? Because as a man, I get so tired of women not letting me objectify them and just treat them like any other fap material. Equals? Nah, that's not enough for my hard-wired sex drive.
> 
> And dontcha just hate it when those women actually present opinions - ooops, meant bash males? You deserve to be the arrogant ass that you are, naysayers be damned! After all, you're not the one that could change for the better, it's those pesky womenfolk. If only they would stay attached to the kitchen stove like they're supposed to.
> 
> *shakes fist angrily at the sky*



The Cro-Magnum man is becoming obsolete. There are more women sitting in universities now than men. We make money and own property. The only reason for a woman to be with a man is that he treats her well, period. You can cry and balk all you want, accuse us of being shrews reduced to body parts for your titillation - acting like bastards will only hasten your irrelevance.


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## Paquito (Jul 3, 2009)

katherine22 said:


> The Cro-Magnum man is becoming obsolete. There are more women sitting in universities now than men. We make money and own property. The only reason for a woman to be with a man is that he treats her well, period. You can cry and balk all you want, accuse us of being shrews reduced to body parts for your titillation - acting like bastards will only hasten your irrelevance.




Ummm, I was using sarcasm to point out his idiotic and outdated point of view. :blush:


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## katherine22 (Jul 4, 2009)

free2beme04 said:


> Ummm, I was using sarcasm to point out his idiotic and outdated point of view. :blush:



That's nice.


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## Darkeyes (Jul 4, 2009)

Dang...I can't get into corners with this brush...it is too broad...


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## Famouslastwords (Jul 4, 2009)

free2beme04 said:


> Ummm, I was using sarcasm to point out his idiotic and outdated point of view. :blush:




It's ok free, I smell ya. 

You smell fresh.


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## Green Eyed Fairy (Jul 7, 2009)

Famouslastwords said:


> It's ok free, I smell ya.
> 
> You smell fresh.




You smell him? Hell, I'd do him....:wubu:


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## Paquito (Jul 7, 2009)

Green Eyed Fairy said:


> You smell him? Hell, I'd do him....:wubu:




Please and thank you


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## Crystal (Jul 7, 2009)

I have only been with one FA, so my experience is rather limited...but he treated as merely a sexual object, nothing more.

He couldn't view me as a friend, a lover, or even a nice person. He literally thought, "Mmm, fat tummy" when I walked into a room. 

It took a rather drastic event to make me see what I had gotten myself into and I'm so happy that I am free from that. I wouldn't mind continuing a friendship with this person, but a relationship would never happen. I'm not sure with his view on women that he could ever have a healthy romantic relationship anyway. 

I do hope to encounter future FA's that are not this shallow and out of touch.


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