# Have We Gone Too Far?



## ChristianFA (May 28, 2006)

Just gotta get something off my chest...

As one speaks with various BBWs/SSBBWs around the net, one is struck by certain of them (not naming any names here, note) that have an attitude similar to that of your most stuck-up Hollywood starlet... like speaking to a mere FA is beneath them.

Have we gone too far with the whole idea of celebrating the beauty of BBWs and SSBBWs, and turned some of those we adore into people who believe they are truly above those of us doing the adoring? Have websites like ratingbbw.com turned our beloved ladies into (pardon me, but it's the only word that fits) arrogant women?

I obviously can't speak for every FA, but one of the primary things I enjoy about BBWs/SSBBWs is that they're mostly down-to-earth people, not interested in what others think (except for that one special someone).

The attitude I've been seeing from some, however, has definitely turned me off.

Just my $0.02. I expect this thread will probably disappear and so will I as soon as some mod sees it, but at least I got it off my chest.


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## NFA (May 28, 2006)

No.

That's all the response that is warrented, but I apparently have to say more to get the system to allow this post.

Again, no.


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## Carrie (May 28, 2006)

I don't think it's any different for fat women than thin. Some are approachable and down-to-earth, some less so. In my experience most of us, in this forum in particular, accept compliments graciousy, appreciate them, but don't let them go to our heads. A lot of us, in fact, are still getting used to hearing compliments on our appearance! 

I don't know what your experiences have been, but I'm sorry they've been negative. It just might be a matter of you needing to reconsider where you're pointing your attentions, possibly? 

Good luck!


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## Observer (May 28, 2006)

ChristianFA said:


> Have we gone too far with the whole idea of celebrating the beauty of BBWs and SSBBWs, and turned some of those we adore into people who believe they are truly above those of us doing the adoring? Have websites like ratingbbw.com turned our beloved ladies into (pardon me, but it's the only word that fits) arrogant women?
> 
> I expect this thread will probably disappear and so will I as soon as some mod sees it, but at least I got it off my chest.



Moderators don't bounce people simply for starting treads with provocative issues. Why do you feel the need to infer otherwise?

As to whether sites like the one you mention have gone "too far" I would need more information. Is listing on the site participatory or simply by nomination? If the former I wouldsay "no," if the latter then highly objectifying. But that's just my opinion.


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## thislittlepiggy (May 28, 2006)

ChristianFA -- I don't think you should be concerned about FAs going too far in praising the beauty of BBWs and SSBBWs. Whatever praise we may receive here or in other "virtual" communities is a mere mist compared to the tidal wave of negativity toward fat in the "real" world.

The greater concern that I hear in your post involves defining beauty only in terms of the physical. Some women--whether fat or thin--are conceited, and for them, praise of their physical beauty feeds certain ugly inner traits. Some men--whether FAs or not--are shallow and obsessed with the surface, so they aren't troubled by conceit or arrogance. But clearly, for you beauty isn't just skin deep. 

Don't let the attitude of a few BBWs or SSBBWs turn you off: we're no more perfect--and certainly no worse--than any other group. For me, I think being fat has made me a better woman, more compassionate and empathetic toward others' suffering.

Just my $0.02.


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## CurvaceousBBWLover (May 28, 2006)

The reactions you are getting depend on the women. Some of these women have been told all their lives they are beautiful. As a result, they have swollen heads. Others are not used to hearing people call them beautiful and they get an attitutude. I feel your pain, my brother. It's an interesting world that we fat admirers live in.


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## Santaclear (May 28, 2006)

We have definitely gone too far. Some of these dames get too uppity and end up giving swell head. Then they disappear. Others are just too big for their britches.

I say we storm the Paysite Board. Who's with me?


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## CurvaceousBBWLover (May 28, 2006)

I'm with you!



Santaclear said:


> We have definitely gone too far. Some of these dames get too uppity and end up giving swell head. Then they disappear. Others are just too big for their britches.
> 
> I say we storm the Paysite Board. Who's with me?


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## NFA (May 28, 2006)

Well, apparently "no" wasn't enough, since I see some FA's are entertaining the notion that "we" have done too much to make fat women feel worthy and desirable. Guess what? Men of all preferences and backgrounds complain about women who are too "stuck up" to appreciate their advances. They say this of thin women just as some say it of fat women. This is NEVER a justified complaint. Never. As in not once. As in not if you were really hot for some woman who wasn't properly interested back. As in not if you totally think she owes it to you since she's fat and no one should want her. Not once.

The suggestion that we've done "too much" is absurd. Frankly, FA's haven't done remotely enough. Much of the gains in women feeling self-worth and self-esteem have been driven by the women themselves. And kudos to them. Self-esteem should never be granted upon you external approval. Still, FA's as a whole haven't done much to distinguish themselves for contributing to this message. Some here and there get it, and kudos to them as well. But there are still those who look upon fat women with scorn and shame. There are those who hide their preference from others, even while enjoying the joy of fat coupling in the shadows, forcing these women to bear their shame and hatred. There are others who feel fat women "owe" FA's something for their appreciation. They have decided to regard their attraction as a transaction and they scowl and moan when they feel they are not given proper compensation for their lust. This isn't all FA's. I hope it isn't even most. But they are there. And the idea that as a community we have done "too much" while any of that nonsense exists is an insult.

Can we do too much? I highly doubt it. Unless we someone attain a tipping point and start going in the other direction where thin women are treated with the same social condemnation as fat women, I cannot see how we have gone too far. Any level of self-appreciation and self-love that we FA's may somehow inspire is never going to be "too much".


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## CurvaceousBBWLover (May 28, 2006)

There are a lot of women of any build who are too stuck up to appreciate men. But, the man has to be genuine about how he approaches the woman. If the man takes the attitude that he is doing the woman a favor, the woman will pick up on it and will not appreciate that type of condescension.

FAs cannot carry the entire burden of making large women feel appreciated. This culture will also have to carry that burden.




NFA said:


> Well, apparently "no" wasn't enough, since I see some FA's are entertaining the notion that "we" have done too much to make fat women feel worthy and desirable. Guess what? Men of all preferences and backgrounds complain about women who are too "stuck up" to appreciate their advances. They say this of thin women just as some say it of fat women. This is NEVER a justified complaint. Never. As in not once. As in not if you were really hot for some woman who wasn't properly interested back. As in not if you totally think she owes it to you since she's fat and no one should want her. Not once.
> 
> The suggestion that we've done "too much" is absurd. Frankly, FA's haven't done remotely enough. Much of the gains in women feeling self-worth and self-esteem have been driven by the women themselves. And kudos to them. Self-esteem should never be granted upon you external approval. Still, FA's as a whole haven't done much to distinguish themselves for contributing to this message. Some here and there get it, and kudos to them as well. But there are still those who look upon fat women with scorn and shame. There are those who hide their preference from others, even while enjoying the joy of fat coupling in the shadows, forcing these women to bear their shame and hatred. There are others who feel fat women "owe" FA's something for their appreciation. They have decided to regard their attraction as a transaction and they scowl and moan when they feel they are not given proper compensation for their lust. This isn't all FA's. I hope it isn't even most. But they are there. And the idea that as a community we have done "too much" while any of that nonsense exists is an insult.
> 
> Can we do too much? I highly doubt it. Unless we someone attain a tipping point and start going in the other direction where thin women are treated with the same social condemnation as fat women, I cannot see how we have gone too far. Any level of self-appreciation and self-love that we FA's may somehow inspire is never going to be "too much".


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## Carrie (May 28, 2006)

Santaclear said:


> We have definitely gone too far. Some of these dames get too uppity and end up giving swell head. Then they disappear. Others are just too big for their britches.



_Giving_ swell head? Was that a Freudian slip? Surely you meant _getting_? 

Or maybe not. 



P.S. All fat chicks are too big for our britches. Literally.


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## Ericthonius (May 28, 2006)

Carrie, you wrote what I was thinking. But if I wrote this?
It'd read like sarcasm. Thank you for preventing my possible loss of face.

[/TONGUE-IN-CHEEK]






Carrie said:


> I don't think it's any different for fat women than thin. Some are approachable and down-to-earth, some less so. In my experience most of us, in this forum in particular, accept compliments graciousy, appreciate them, but don't let them go to our heads. A lot of us, in fact, are still getting used to hearing compliments on our appearance!
> 
> I don't know what your experiences have been, but I'm sorry they've been negative. It just might be a matter of you needing to reconsider where you're pointing your attentions, possibly?
> 
> Good luck!


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## PolarKat (May 28, 2006)

ChristianFA said:


> Just gotta get something off my chest...
> 
> As one speaks with various BBWs/SSBBWs around the net, one is struck by certain of them (not naming any names here, note) that have an attitude similar to that of your most stuck-up Hollywood starlet... like speaking to a mere FA is beneath them.


Well.. there's this old line "two to tango", your behavior will incite the other person's, so if you're putting them on some sort of artifictial pedelstal in your mind. They'll automatically fall into the role.. but since it was "in your mind" and "artificial".. what do you expect a genuine responce??


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## Tina (May 28, 2006)

Santaclear said:


> We have definitely gone too far. Some of these dames get too uppity *and end up giving swell head*. Then they disappear. Others are just too big for their britches.
> 
> I say we storm the Paysite Board. Who's with me?



 If you're getting this through your monitor, Santa, you've obviously got some pull. Or you're getting some. 

Women are women, fat or thin, just like men are men, fat or thin. Variations within and without. We're still just human with the same frailties and strengths, though there are some differences, of course, that come from living as a paraiah, from one degree to another, depending.


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## Buffie (May 28, 2006)

ChristianFA said:


> Just gotta get something off my chest...
> 
> As one speaks with various BBWs/SSBBWs around the net, one is struck by certain of them (not naming any names here, note) that have an attitude similar to that of your most stuck-up Hollywood starlet... like speaking to a mere FA is beneath them.
> 
> ...



This reminds me of an episode of Sex in the City... The line was "He's just not that into you". But substitute 'she' for 'he'. 

Haven't you ever been approached by a girl, discovered you weren't interested and instead of bluntly telling her so, you tried to be elusive, hoping she would get the message on her own? 

I'm pretty sure many people have done just exactly that. But must it be because they were sooooo stuck up or due to an over-inflated ego? No, not always. 

BBWs, SSBBWs and every other 'type' of person has a preference. You can't expect yourself to fit everyone's preference, therefore some amount of (for lack of a better term) rejection is normal. It's not YOU, it's not HER, it's just life. It happens to everyone, so maybe try not to take it personally and perhaps try not to have a lesser opinion of a girl just because the two of you didn't have the right chemistry. 

If someone in particular dissed you (which is what it sounds like to me, correct me if I'm wrong) and it bothers you that much, address that person directly. Difficult to do, sure. But it will answer your questions and may give you a different perspective you'll find useful in the future.


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## Ned Sonntag (May 28, 2006)

"...Whose God is their belly." O ye who enter here, please leave your jesus at the door.


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## ChristianFA (May 28, 2006)

Buffie said:


> If someone in particular dissed you (which is what it sounds like to me, correct me if I'm wrong)


Consider yourself _*gently*_ corrected.  

It's actually been my experience going way back to Carolyn Owens' old board, The Big Picture, in the pre-web days (yes, Buffie, I am probably old enough to be your father), that some BBWs have taken their self-esteem classes way too seriously.

Please note the plural. It's not just one person, there are always new ones coming around.

By the way, please understand that it's definitely not _you_, personally, Buffie... having never tried to say hi to you I have no idea how you'd respond.  It's rather those women who not only accept being placed on a pedestal, but who appear to demand being placed there, that really bother me.


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## ripley (May 28, 2006)

When I first started coming online about two years ago I was very naive. I still am, to some extent. I was polite to everyone, even those who did not deserve it. 

It did feel wonderful, getting comments on my appearance. I've been complimented in the outside world, but rarely in an "I'm attracted to you sexually" way. It was _very_ heady. I put up with a lot of bad behavior (and engaged in some of my own) because I didn't know how to handle it, or what was expected of me. 

There were the men that wanted cybersex. There were the men that wanted naked pictures. There were the men that wanted to single-handedly save my self-esteem with their recycled smarmy compliments. I was polite to everyone (hey, I'm a small town girl from the midwest) even when I shouldn't have been. 

I think there is a learning curve with women that discover Dimensions chat. I think after awhile, like me, they learn to put up some roadblocks. I mean, how many times can you respond with gratitude and grace to things that in former days would get a guy slapped in the face? How can you think "Wow, this is a guy I'd like to get to know" when the first thing he asks you is "Does your belly hang? I love hanging bellies." I think that's why when a new woman comes to chat the sidebar-surfers swarm her; they want to get in there while she is new and doesn't know any better and they have a better chance of getting away with their bad behavior. Then, after awhile, she gets sick of it, she learns she doesn't have to tolerate it. She gets REAL self-esteem, and then they call her a stuck-up bitch. 

Out of frustration once, I told a guy in chat who was private messaging me "You know, I can talk about hundreds of other things besides my fat." Did he think I was a stuck up bitch? Maybe. Did he want to talk about other things? Nope. Just because I'm fat doesn't mean I owe it to anyone to entertain them with my fat body or my fat life. I don't owe them eternal gratitude for them deigning to give me a compliment. 

Does that mean I'm stuck up? Absolutely not. I still have all those image worries that practically every single woman in the world has. All it means is that I want to be related to as a _person_ first. I've never spoken to you, ChristianFA, and I am not inferring that anything I've said here pertains to you. I am just trying to give you a peek into what it's like from the female side of things. 

Maybe the women you are referring to are stuck up, I don't know, I don't speak for every woman. My advice though...if you want to get a woman's attention, compliment something she's said, her sense of humor...or don't compliment at all! Just strike up a conversation that is not immediately based on her outer appearance. Relate to her in a different way, and maybe she won't automatically classify you as one of "those type" of guys.


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## ChristianFA (May 28, 2006)

ripley said:


> Maybe the women you are referring to are stuck up, I don't know, I don't speak for every woman. My advice though...if you want to get a woman's attention, compliment something she's said, her sense of humor...or don't compliment at all! Just strike up a conversation that is not immediately based on her outer appearance. Relate to her in a different way, and maybe she won't automatically classify you as one of "those type" of guys.


Kinda hard when they don't even respond to a polite "good afternoon." That's the kind of stuck-up I am referring to, not those who engage in conversation and then find that we're not on the same wavelength.


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## ripley (May 28, 2006)

ChristianFA said:


> Kinda hard when they don't even respond to a polite "good afternoon." That's the kind of stuck-up I am referring to, not those who engage in conversation and then find that we're not on the same wavelength.




It's hard to say what's going on at the other end of the keyboard. She could be away from her computer. She could have a boyfriend or a husband and makes it a rule for herself not to private message with random men. Do you try saying hello in the open room? Do you try conversing with her in the open room before going to PM? Did you even read the rest of my post? LOL


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## Santaclear (May 28, 2006)

ChristianFA said:


> Please note the plural. It's not just one person, there are always new ones coming around.
> 
> It's rather those women who not only accept being placed on a pedestal, but who appear to demand being placed there, that really bother me.



My above tongue-in-cheek comment aside, what you're talking about is a human trait and true of all conceited people, male or female, fat or thin. All you have to do is step around the pedestal and ignore them. No way would I say that fat women as a group get complimented too much. Or deal badly with being complimented.


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## ChristianFA (May 28, 2006)

ripley said:


> It's hard to say what's going on at the other end of the keyboard. She could be away from her computer. She could have a boyfriend or a husband and makes it a rule for herself not to private message with random men. Do you try saying hello in the open room? Do you try conversing with her in the open room before going to PM?


Why assume it's a PM? Why assume men don't try talking in public? Why assume it's in chat at all? The same thing happens in e-mail. One must be very careful with one's assumptions, as you were just saying.

I've said hi to people in the room, responded to things they have said, etc, to people who were responding to others, and been completely ignored.


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## NFA (May 28, 2006)

ChristianFA said:


> Kinda hard when they don't even respond to a polite "good afternoon." That's the kind of stuck-up I am referring to, not those who engage in conversation and then find that we're not on the same wavelength.



Other people don't exist for your benefit. Not everyone's gonna want to chat whenever YOU feel like it. Taking that and transforming it into a character flaw on their part is phenomonal act of arrogance and self-importance on *your* part. Your insistance that some women should feel more beholden to your attention is flat out mysogonistic. A man waxing on about how women should act like the owe him something for his troubles is pathetic and absolutely undeserving of the coddling and understanding your received. You are the one who is placing himself above others and you are behaving in a manner that outside of the FA/BBW community would rightly earn you a condemnation. You'll get no more from me. Frankly, I'm not much surprised at the ability these phantom hordes of ungrateful women had in reading you right off the bat.


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## ChristianFA (May 28, 2006)

NFA said:


> Other people don't exist for your benefit. Not everyone's gonna want to chat whenever YOU feel like it. Taking that and transforming it into a character flaw on their part is phenomonal act of arrogance and self-importance on *your* part. Your insistance that some women should feel more beholden to your attention is flat out mysogonistic. A man waxing on about how women should act like the owe him something for his troubles is pathetic and absolutely undeserving of the coddling and understanding your received. You are the one who is placing himself above others and you are behaving in a manner that outside of the FA/BBW community would rightly earn you a condemnation. You'll get no more from me. Frankly, I'm not much surprised at the ability these phantom hordes of ungrateful women had in reading you right off the bat.


Yeah, I guess you're right. We men have no right to simple courtesy from women, do we? I mean, I am sure that it's a terrible imposition for someone to respond to a kind hello that has nothing sexual at all in it. Or maybe "good afternoon" does have a sexual connotation to it... I guess I should stop saying that.

:doh: I feel so stupid for not having realized that 40 years ago.


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## ripley (May 28, 2006)

ChristianFA said:


> Why assume it's a PM? Why assume men don't try talking in public? Why assume it's in chat at all? The same thing happens in e-mail. One must be very careful with one's assumptions, as you were just saying.
> 
> I've said hi to people in the room, responded to things they have said, etc, to people who were responding to others, and been completely ignored.




Why assume that women that don't respond to you are stuck-up? I put a lot of thought and honesty into my post...you didn't respond to it in a great way...but that doesn't make me condemn you as a person. 

And by the way...discourtesy and arrogance are two different things. Why do you assume that discourteous people are stuck up, and even farther, stuck-up from too many compliments?


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## MisticalMisty (May 28, 2006)

First off, I think Ripley hit the nail on the head..especially when it comes to chat.

I've been chatting for over 5 years and with dimensions, a girl has to be cautious because some of the men raid the sidebar. Granted, you may not be that type of person, but we have to be cautious.

Now, you have to remember that it could be that they just remained logged in and didn't sign off..that happens.

Some people may also be put off by your nickname. Now, don't get all crazy on me..I'm a Christian as well, but some people could be leary that you are going to be a bible thumper and they don't want to deal with that in chat.

Here's my question..what's wrong with a fat girl being arrogant? Would you ever suggest that non-fas stop paying attention to thin women because they are arrogant? I mean come on.


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## MisticalMisty (May 28, 2006)

ripley said:


> Why assume that women that don't respond to you are stuck-up? I put a lot of thought and honesty into my post...you didn't respond to it in a great way...but that doesn't make me condemn you as a person.
> 
> And by the way...discourtesy and arrogance are two different things. Why do you assume that discourteous people are stuck up, and even farther, stuck-up from too many compliments?


Because it's the easiest answer..it couldn't possibly have anything to do with him or his personality..it can only be the fault of a arrogant, stuck up bbw/ssbbw that's had the world laid at her feet by the Knight in Shining Armor FA


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## ChristianFA (May 28, 2006)

ripley said:


> Why assume that women that don't respond to you are stuck-up? I put a lot of thought and honesty into my post...you didn't respond to it in a great way...but that doesn't make me condemn you as a person.


A valid point. However, if the person in question is engaging in conversation with others but pointedly ignoring some people (generally those not members of the person's "clique,") it seems a valid working hypothesis in the absence of evidence to the contrary.

Given new evidence, I am always willing to revisit my opinions of a person.


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## Santaclear (May 28, 2006)

ChristianFA said:


> Yeah, I guess you're right. We men have no right to simple courtesy from women, do we? I mean, I am sure that it's a terrible imposition for someone to respond to a kind hello that has nothing sexual at all in it. Or maybe "good afternoon" does have a sexual connotation to it... I guess I should stop saying that.
> 
> :doh: I feel so stupid for not having realized that 40 years ago.



Christian, you're referring to some incidents that happened to you personally and applying them to people here in general. That's why your rant won't get a happy response.


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## Carrie (May 28, 2006)

I'm with Ripley here, ChristianFA, especially if you're referring to Dim Chat interactions. I myself am frequently guilty of logging into the chatroom, finding it slow, and opening another browser window and forgetting that I was in chat in the first place. I'm sure I'm not the only one. A lot of women have alternate ways to contact them in their profiles, i.e. IM and email - if you don't have much luck in the chat room, you might consider reaching out in a different way. 

And seriously - do you really think that body size has anything to do with this phenomenon? Some women are more approachable than others, regardless of size. I'll give you an example - our own AnnMarie. Extremely well known in this community, a beautiful paysite girl... I'm willing to bet that she gets lots of compliments on her appearance here online, but you'd be hard pressed to find a sweeter, more genuine, approachable woman here at Dim. Same with Buffie....I could go on and on. 

I doubt that guys who are shot down by thin women complain about _thin_ women being snotty - I think they probably just complain about women being snotty.


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## ChristianFA (May 28, 2006)

MisticalMisty said:


> Because it's the easiest answer..it couldn't possibly have anything to do with him or his personality..it can only be the fault of a arrogant, stuck up bbw/ssbbw that's had the world laid at her feet by the Knight in Shining Armor FA


Having never spoken to me, you come to that conclusion so quickly?

Yet, if I come to a conclusion that a BBW/SSBBW is acting stuck-up, I am the devil incarnate?

Whatever.

If anyone wishes to continue this discussion, they can send me e-mail. I shall not return.


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## MisticalMisty (May 28, 2006)

ChristianFA said:


> However, if the person in question is engaging in conversation with others but pointedly ignoring some people



Ok, if they are engaging in a conversation with someone else..it's a bit rude to interrupt..It's like if you were at a dinner party..you wouldn't just walk up to someone with them in midconversation and demand their attention..if you did..that would be highly rude and would definitely lead you to being ignored. 



ChristianFA said:


> (generally those not members of the person's "clique,")


 What, are we in high school again? 



ChristianFA said:


> Given new evidence, I am always willing to revisit my opinions of a person.



You know what they say about opinions..


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## ripley (May 28, 2006)

ChristianFA said:


> A valid point. However, if the person in question is engaging in conversation with others but pointedly ignoring some people (generally those not members of the person's "clique,") it seems a valid working hypothesis in the absence of evidence to the contrary.
> 
> Given new evidence, I am always willing to revisit my opinions of a person.




I guess part of it might be guilt on my part; I have ignored people that have private messaged me in chat, and I feel bad for being rude. I go in there to be social, to joke and chat with my friends, and act silly. I sometimes don't answer people who don't speak in the room yet want my attention in PM. In a way, that's rude of _them_. Would they walk up to a group of people at a party and try to draw one woman away, into a solo conversation with just them?

I used to respond to everyone that spoke to me in PM. I don't anymore. Perhaps I am rude, but I am not stuck up. 


Edited to add: Darn it, you arrogant hoochies scared him off!


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## MisticalMisty (May 28, 2006)

ChristianFA said:


> Having never spoken to me, you come to that conclusion so quickly?
> 
> .


I would say that about any person who was not willing to own up to his/her share of the responsiblity. Instead of making asinine generalizations about the bbw/ssbbws of the world, maybe examine how you are approaching people, etc. You can't blame it all on arrogance..

I never once said you were the devil..those are your words and not mine

and if you can't engage in a debate about an issue without throwing a tantrum and running off..you are pretty much proving my point.


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## MisticalMisty (May 28, 2006)

ripley said:


> *Would they walk up to a group of people at a party and try to draw one woman away, into a solo conversation with just them?*
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Dude..you like totally stole my line..you arrogant FAT GIRL you


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## ripley (May 28, 2006)

MisticalMisty said:


> Dude..you like totally stole my line..you arrogant FAT GIRL you




That's "arrogant, THIEVING fat girl" to you! 



See if I ever answer _your _PMs again!


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## NFA (May 28, 2006)

ChristianFA said:


> Yeah, I guess you're right. We men have no right to simple courtesy from women, do we? I mean, I am sure that it's a terrible imposition for someone to respond to a kind hello that has nothing sexual at all in it. Or maybe "good afternoon" does have a sexual connotation to it... I guess I should stop saying that.
> 
> :doh: I feel so stupid for not having realized that 40 years ago.



Yeah, I'm still stunned that anyone could find you off-putting.

Again, you're defining "courtesy" as a willingness to respond to you in the manner YOU desire. That's not courtesy. Its subservience. And given that your conclusion is that fat women are getting too "uppity" for your pleasure, I don't think I'm going out on a limb to conclude that your initial complaints probably are exaggerated to begin with. Even if they were what you say, its NOTHING. Not everyone will want to chat with you. FOR MANY DIFFERENT REASONS. They aren't obligated to give everyone a full explanation.

I've tried to chat to people who weren't interested. Even if I was disappointed, I MOVED ON. You, however, sulked about it because you think they owe it to you to. That they should be happy for your attention. After all, you like BBW's because they are more "down to earth". You know why I like BBWs? Because they are fat. I don't pretend they are a better brand of human just because I'm physically attracted to them. Maybe you did and maybe you attached all sorts of values to "down to earth" that were even further removed from reality. So you take it as a personal slight against you where they aren't appreciative of your advances. Well, get over yourself, already. If you want to spend another 40 years inventing expectations just to pout and whine when they aren't met, go ahead. It'll be your loss and your fault.


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## MisticalMisty (May 28, 2006)

ripley said:


> That's "arrogant, THIEVING fat girl" to you!
> 
> 
> 
> See if I ever answer _your _PMs again!


lol..I already changed my tag line to arrogant fat girl..you should change yours to arrogant thieving fat girl


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## CurvaceousBBWLover (May 28, 2006)

No one should have to behave desparately to obtain attention from the opposite sex. But at the same time, some of these BBWs and SSBBWs are excessively arrogant and picky when members of the opposite sex try to approach them. It doesn't make sense!

Thankfully, there are a lot of women who exist between the two opposite poles.




ChristianFA said:


> Consider yourself _*gently*_ corrected.
> 
> It's actually been my experience going way back to Carolyn Owens' old board, The Big Picture, in the pre-web days (yes, Buffie, I am probably old enough to be your father), that some BBWs have taken their self-esteem classes way too seriously.
> 
> ...


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## CurvaceousBBWLover (May 28, 2006)

Very good advice. A sure way to turn a strange woman off is to attempt to engage her in sexual banter before she even knows you. But some of these guys have never learned how to approach a woman. They need to be schooled. LOL 



ripley said:


> When I first started coming online about two years ago I was very naive. I still am, to some extent. I was polite to everyone, even those who did not deserve it.
> 
> It did feel wonderful, getting comments on my appearance. I've been complimented in the outside world, but rarely in an "I'm attracted to you sexually" way. It was _very_ heady. I put up with a lot of bad behavior (and engaged in some of my own) because I didn't know how to handle it, or what was expected of me.
> 
> ...


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## CurvaceousBBWLover (May 28, 2006)

I don't know what to say. NFA's posts are excessively negative. But what I will say is that some women have no concept of simple courtesy. I don't understand rude behavior by women, but I do not tolerate it.



ChristianFA said:


> Yeah, I guess you're right. We men have no right to simple courtesy from women, do we? I mean, I am sure that it's a terrible imposition for someone to respond to a kind hello that has nothing sexual at all in it. Or maybe "good afternoon" does have a sexual connotation to it... I guess I should stop saying that.
> 
> :doh: I feel so stupid for not having realized that 40 years ago.


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## CurvaceousBBWLover (May 28, 2006)

Generally if I instant message someone and she does not answer, it could mean that she might be in the middle of something or she might not even be on her computer. I don't worry about it.

Confidence is a major turn-on for me. Arrogance is a major turn off. When you are truly confident in yourself, you don't have to turn up your nose at others or tear someone else down to build yourself up. Everything is wrong with a fat girl (or any other girl) behaving arrogantly. Politeness and kindness are paramount rules of good behavior.




MisticalMisty said:


> First off, I think Ripley hit the nail on the head..especially when it comes to chat.
> 
> I've been chatting for over 5 years and with dimensions, a girl has to be cautious because some of the men raid the sidebar. Granted, you may not be that type of person, but we have to be cautious.
> 
> ...


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## MisticalMisty (May 28, 2006)

CurvaceousBBWLover said:


> I don't know what to say. NFA's posts are excessively negative. But what I will say is that some women have no concept of simple courtesy. I don't understand rude behavior by women, but I do not tolerate it.


Courtesy goes both ways...there's no reason to jump to conclusions about a woman because she doesn't answer a pm or an im or an email.

NFA's post wasn't excessively negative..and if it a nerve..then maybe you need to take a step back and take a good long look at your own behavior.


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## CurvaceousBBWLover (May 29, 2006)

Actually, Mistical Misty, everyone should be courteous. I was simply pointing out the obvious.


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## NFA (May 29, 2006)

Yes, Misty. Everyone should talk to a man if the man wants to talk to them irregardless of their personal feelings. Its just courtesy to give a man what he wants, after all. Clearly, you've been told that your beautiful too often. Men-folk best stop with that. Its giving you ideas and what not. Can't go too far with that encouraging self-worth thing. Otherwise, you won't feel privlaged to enjoy the attention of ChristianFA and urvaceousBBWLover.


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## CurvaceousBBWLover (May 29, 2006)

HAHAHAHA! Self-worth is a great thing, isn't it, NFA? Misty, hold your head up high and be proud to be who you are!


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## Buffie (May 29, 2006)

ChristianFA said:


> Consider yourself _*gently*_ corrected.
> 
> It's actually been my experience going way back to Carolyn Owens' old board, The Big Picture, in the pre-web days (yes, Buffie, I am probably old enough to be your father), that some BBWs have taken their self-esteem classes way too seriously.
> 
> ...



Sorry to hear that's been your experience so much. Bummer. I hope things get better for you. The girlies here are super great, IMO. 

Lots of people have moments where they get a little high on themselves. Give em a chance to get over it (the world has a way of knocking us off our pedestals when we least expect it, LOL) and see what happens next time. 

Hugs,
~Buf


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## mossystate (May 29, 2006)

Ummmmm....his temper tantrum was not a very good one..*L*...quite dramatic, though....."I shall not return"..I imagine the back of his hand sees his forehead...QUITE often.

The thing about a man like this is that I am willing to bet he does not 'see' the same thing if a man ignores the polite hello from another man.This IS about him demanding that women..in this case, fat women...be as jolly and accomodating as he wishes....well...too fucking bad...


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## Emma (May 29, 2006)

I must say 90% of the time I don't respond to people in the chat. Sometimes I'm away, sometimes I've seen one of my friends in the chat and I've popped in just to say a quick hello, sometimes I've had 8 or 9 PM's at once but most of all I just don't like PMs. In the room, if someone talks to me in the room I answer, that is unless I miss it.


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## fatgirl33 (May 29, 2006)

I can't believe this thread is even here...

In my experience the BBW on the Web (ie: these boards, or chat) that handle themselves like divas are few and far between. Personally I cannot remember a single one.

However, the men/FAs who handle themselves like complete, arrogant, sleazy a**holes have been numerous. As a result, like CurvyEm, I don't generally respond to PMs in chat unless it's someone I already know.

Sorry to all the nice folks out there, but like so many other things in life, the idiots ruined it for everyone.

My 2 cents,
Brenda


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## MoonGoddess (May 29, 2006)

fatgirl33 said:


> I can't believe this thread is even here...
> 
> In my experience the BBW on the Web (ie: these boards, or chat) that handle themselves like divas are few and far between. Personally I cannot remember a single one.
> 
> ...



*
It goes back to that old addage about one rotten apple. Like FatGirl, I have not yet met a diva BBW. I know at least two in "real life" that are bitches, not divas, but they are not the standard.

I tend to think that perhaps, when a fat woman carries herself with grace and style, some may think her a snob. But if it came down to walking along with my head down, refusing to look people in the face, and being labeled a diva because I refuse to NOT meet someone's eyes, then go right ahead and label me a diva, bitch, what ever you want.

MoonGoddess*


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## fatlane (May 29, 2006)

It's not uppity if someone hasn't figured out how to use the PM system yet.


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## TheSadeianLinguist (May 29, 2006)

ChristianFA said:


> Yeah, I guess you're right. We men have no right to simple courtesy from women, do we? I mean, I am sure that it's a terrible imposition for someone to respond to a kind hello that has nothing sexual at all in it. Or maybe "good afternoon" does have a sexual connotation to it... I guess I should stop saying that.
> 
> :doh: I feel so stupid for not having realized that 40 years ago.



Okay, a large portion of my job is making nice and peace and happiness and sunshine. Guess what? Once I clock out, I don't owe anyone a hello, good afternoon, or even a "fuck you." Why would I want to waste a second of speech on an asshole who thinks he's entitled to every fat woman's attention by virtue of saying hi?

You want attention? Be worthy of attention. Be smart, funny, kind, polite. By polite, I don't mean say hello, thank you, and wash your hands after you piss. Being kind and polite is a lot more than mumbling a few words. Ask a friend to watch you dealing with women and give you feedback. If most women don't like you, it's probably not a problem with the women. I'm one of the *few* true blue, heartless, certified snotty bitches here.


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## Rosie (May 29, 2006)

I have no problem talking to FA's but I will not date one. Reason for that is that I don't want anyone fawning over my fat. I HATE being fat, and see NOTHING good in it, so I do not want anyone praising it. Another reason is that if I were to lose weight he would either disappear or even if he didn't, he'd be turned off by me.


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## JMNYC (May 29, 2006)

I drop in to Dim chat from time to time, and say hi via PM if there's someone I feel like saying hi to. If I don't get a response, I just figure they're busy, or not interested in talking. But I don't take it personally---gotta give people a lonnnnnnnnnnnnnnng leeway on line. The ones I do get a response from, it's a delight to say hi and go back and forth, sometimes from thousands of miles away.

Sounds like you're at the end of some kind of rope. You're fed up. 

It's helpful to look at that than to post a complaint about stuck up women. It's possible your "I'm going to get really mad if you don't say hi back" stance is palpable.

Maybe?


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## TheSadeianLinguist (May 29, 2006)

CurvaceousBBWLover said:


> I don't know what to say. NFA's posts are excessively negative.



Truth be told, the boy's probably suffering from a short temper when it comes to listening to whining. I suffer from the same affliction.


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## Webmaster (May 29, 2006)

ChristianFA said:


> ...It's actually been my experience going way back to Carolyn Owens' old board, The Big Picture, in the pre-web days (yes, Buffie, I am probably old enough to be your father), that some BBWs have taken their self-esteem classes way too seriously...


 
Hehe.. I, too, remember Carolyn's old board where you had to wait til a modem was available. I even donated a few parts one time when the board was in danger of going down. However, 39 doesn't exactly make you Methusaleh and I can't quite see you as the delectable Ms. Buffie's dad. Me, that's another story.  

As for some fat women reveling in their diva status, I say more power to them. No degree of admiration by our community can make up for the pain and hurt some fat women have gone through as children, young girls and young women. So whatever adoration now comes their way, they'll know what to take, what to enjoy, and when enough is enough. As a red-blooded FA I find fatness inherently wonderful and powerful. It just is. So I admire something that to me is wondrous and magical, and if it puts a smile onto the face of a fat woman, that is fine with me.


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## JMNYC (May 29, 2006)

Rosie said:


> I have no problem talking to FA's but I will not date one. Reason for that is that I don't want anyone fawning over my fat. I HATE being fat, and see NOTHING good in it, so I do not want anyone praising it. Another reason is that if I were to lose weight he would either disappear or even if he didn't, he'd be turned off by me.



Hi, Rosie--

Nothing wrong with feeling as you do about your fat. But I'm curious---is it always this extreme? Is it always "I HATE my fat!!"

Is it never "I hate my fat sometimes" or "I hate my fat 90% of the time"?

Just wondering how much wiggle room there is in there...

Not trying to fix or change you---just curious.


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## CurvaceousBBWLover (May 29, 2006)

BBW divas are like diamonds in the desert. They are rare finds, but they are great to have around.




fatgirl33 said:


> I can't believe this thread is even here...
> 
> In my experience the BBW on the Web (ie: these boards, or chat) that handle themselves like divas are few and far between. Personally I cannot remember a single one.
> 
> ...


----------



## CurvaceousBBWLover (May 29, 2006)

I love it when a fat woman carries herself with grace and style. There is nothing sexier than a woman with a positive self-image.



MoonGoddess said:


> *
> I tend to think that perhaps, when a fat woman carries herself with grace and style, some may think her a snob. But if it came down to walking along with my head down, refusing to look people in the face, and being labeled a diva because I refuse to NOT meet someone's eyes, then go right ahead and label me a diva, bitch, what ever you want.
> 
> MoonGoddess*


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## CurvaceousBBWLover (May 29, 2006)

That's an interesting point. The hardest thing to do is to find someone who will love you as you are, regardless of what you look like. 



Rosie said:


> I have no problem talking to FA's but I will not date one. Reason for that is that I don't want anyone fawning over my fat. I HATE being fat, and see NOTHING good in it, so I do not want anyone praising it. Another reason is that if I were to lose weight he would either disappear or even if he didn't, he'd be turned off by me.


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## MoonGoddess (May 29, 2006)

CurvaceousBBWLover said:


> I love it when a fat woman carries herself with grace and style. There is nothing sexier than a woman with a positive self-image.



*
I second that.

MoonGoddess*


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## NFA (May 29, 2006)

Rosie said:


> I have no problem talking to FA's but I will not date one. Reason for that is that I don't want anyone fawning over my fat. I HATE being fat, and see NOTHING good in it, so I do not want anyone praising it. Another reason is that if I were to lose weight he would either disappear or even if he didn't, he'd be turned off by me.



Well, for this FA, I would want absolutely nothing to do with anyone who harbored such thoughts anyway. Living your life waiting to be thin is no way to live and its not something I could ever stand to be around. You'd rather date someone who'd be turned off to you NOW than risk someone who'd be turned off to you if you were among the extraordinarily small number of people who successfully lose weight? That's a mindset I'd find just sad and I could never want to share my life with someone who felt that way. If a woman would never date an FA, the feeling is always mutual from me.

Though I have to ask, if you have such hatred for your body and for FA's, why come here?


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## moonvine (May 29, 2006)

CurvaceousBBWLover said:


> No one should have to behave desparately to obtain attention from the opposite sex. But at the same time, some of these BBWs and SSBBWs are excessively arrogant and picky when members of the opposite sex try to approach them. It doesn't make sense!



Why doesn't it make sense? Maybe they have all the male attention they need and don't want more. Maybe they have had a bad day and just want to vent to friends and don't want strangers bothering them. Maybe they don't like your approach.


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## moonvine (May 29, 2006)

CurvaceousBBWLover said:


> I don't know what to say. NFA's posts are excessively negative. But what I will say is that some women have no concept of simple courtesy. I don't understand rude behavior by women, but I do not tolerate it.



I don't think NFA's posts are negative at all. I love his posts. I'd definitely welcome any approaches by anyone like NFA


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## moonvine (May 29, 2006)

TheSadeianLinguist said:


> Okay, a large portion of my job is making nice and peace and happiness and sunshine. Guess what? Once I clock out, I don't owe anyone a hello, good afternoon, or even a "fuck you." Why would I want to waste a second of speech on an asshole who thinks he's entitled to every fat woman's attention by virtue of saying hi?
> 
> You want attention? Be worthy of attention. Be smart, funny, kind, polite. By polite, I don't mean say hello, thank you, and wash your hands after you piss. Being kind and polite is a lot more than mumbling a few words. Ask a friend to watch you dealing with women and give you feedback. If most women don't like you, it's probably not a problem with the women. I'm one of the *few* true blue, heartless, certified snotty bitches here.




Damn, I can't rep you again. So I just have to say "word" to this entire post.


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## CurvaceousBBWLover (May 29, 2006)

Rude behavior never makes sense, unless one is dealing with a brutish lout who does not know who to talk to women. 




moonvine said:


> Why doesn't it make sense? Maybe they have all the male attention they need and don't want more. Maybe they have had a bad day and just want to vent to friends and don't want strangers bothering them. Maybe they don't like your approach.


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## moonvine (May 29, 2006)

CurvaceousBBWLover said:


> Rude behavior never makes sense, unless one is dealing with a brutish lout who does not know who to talk to women.



You said they were "excessively arrogant and picky." I have no idea what this even means. Now you say they are rude. What specifically is happening that you deem excessively arrogant, picky, and rude?


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## Emma (May 29, 2006)

moonvine said:


> I don't think NFA's posts are negative at all. I love his posts. I'd definitely welcome any approaches by anyone like NFA



Seconded

more text


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## saucywench (May 29, 2006)

ChristianFA said:


> ....It's rather those women who not only accept being placed on a pedestal, but who appear to demand being placed there, that really bother me.


On what factual basis do you form such an assumption?

You've been offered some very valuable advice in this thread. Stop with the broad-based projecting, already, and perhaps you will find yourself a little less "bothered"; sometimes it's not all about you.


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## saucywench (May 29, 2006)

ripley said:


> ....Maybe the women you are referring to are stuck up....


Or maybe (standard rebuffed male conclusion) they're all LESBIANS.:shocked:


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## saucywench (May 29, 2006)

ripley said:


> When I first started coming online about two years ago I was very naive. I still am, to some extent....


Oh, but look how far you've come--you, with your six cans at your side. 

Great post, btw.


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## CurvaceousBBWLover (May 29, 2006)

I don't get this very often. But in many cases women can be defensive and rude even if I just want to give them a compliment. I am sure other guys deal with the same thing. I just write the woman off as just another frog as I continue looking for my princess.



moonvine said:


> You said they were "excessively arrogant and picky." I have no idea what this even means. Now you say they are rude. What specifically is happening that you deem excessively arrogant, picky, and rude?


----------



## moonvine (May 29, 2006)

CurvaceousBBWLover said:


> I don't get this very often. But in many cases women can be defensive and rude even if I just want to give them a compliment. I am sure other guys deal with the same thing. I just write the woman off as just another frog as I continue looking for my princess.



And in what way are they defensive and rude?


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## NFA (May 29, 2006)

moonvine said:


> You said they were "excessively arrogant and picky." I have no idea what this even means. Now you say they are rude. What specifically is happening that you deem excessively arrogant, picky, and rude?



Picky behavior means not being interested in CBBWL. Rude means being picky. But they are just frogs what with the having of self-esteem and what not. Surely, some BBW will be appropriate grateful for him changing them from a frog into a princess and that one will be a keeper. Have to make sure them women folk know who's boss, after all.

Oh, I'm being excessively negative again. Sorry! Carry on men with your protestations of how difficult FA's have it compared to fat women and how those fat women have it easy and don't even need us for self-esteem anymore. Darn floozies. Forgot I said anything. Obviously, I haven't studied the male handbook closely enough.


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## moonvine (May 29, 2006)

Some people think I am excessively picky because I expect a guy to have something interesting to say when he approaches me other than "A/S/L?," because I expect him to be legally unmarried and otherwise uninvolved if he expects to date me, because I expect him to have some sort of way of earning an income (not to live off me) and because I expect him to like animals and have some sort of interests in common with me other than liking fat women. So I was wanting to get clarification on what the poster thought "excessively picky" meant.

It seems some men expect us to jump all over them because we are, after all, fat women, and can't expect much male attention.

Just trying to determine if the OP is one of those people or not.


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## CurvaceousBBWLover (May 29, 2006)

LMAO Your sarcasm is extremely amusing.

Rude means a lack of proper home training regardless of whom one wants to be with. 

I don't expect anyone to be grateful to be with me. That kind of condesension has no place in my life.

I think it's difficult for everybody to find a partner. It's difficult for BBWs and FAs and its difficult for people in the mainstream world. 



NFA said:


> Picky behavior means not being interested in CBBWL. Rude means being picky. But they are just frogs what with the having of self-esteem and what not. Surely, some BBW will be appropriate grateful for him changing them from a frog into a princess and that one will be a keeper. Have to make sure them women folk know who's boss, after all.
> 
> Oh, I'm being excessively negative again. Sorry! Carry on men with your protestations of how difficult FA's have it compared to fat women and how those fat women have it easy and don't even need us for self-esteem anymore. Darn floozies. Forgot I said anything. Obviously, I haven't studied the male handbook closely enough.


----------



## moonvine (May 29, 2006)

CurvaceousBBWLover said:


> LMAO Your sarcasm is extremely amusing.
> 
> Rude means a lack of proper home training regardless of whom one wants to be with.



I really wish you could be more specific. What exactly is "proper home training?" That could mean many things, most of which aren't applicable on a message board or chat line, such as not eating with your elbows on the table.


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## CurvaceousBBWLover (May 29, 2006)

Your expectations are reasonable. Pickiness is subjective.

I consider women who have a laundry list of requirements to be picky. I read a lot of personal ads. For example, some women ask for a guy who is 6 feet tall, wealthy, able to do 5-star wining and dining on a regular basis, must drive a luxury car and of course must have a lot in common with the woman. There are a lot of men who are of good character, but they may not be wealthy and there are only so many wealthy men to go around.

This is only an example. Not all women are like that. 

I do not expect women to jump all over me because I pay them some attention. A woman has a right to choose whom she wants. I can do the same thing.

All that I expect is respect and I am more than willing to give it.






moonvine said:


> Some people think I am excessively picky because I expect a guy to have something interesting to say when he approaches me other than "A/S/L?," because I expect him to be legally unmarried and otherwise uninvolved if he expects to date me, because I expect him to have some sort of way of earning an income (not to live off me) and because I expect him to like animals and have some sort of interests in common with me other than liking fat women. So I was wanting to get clarification on what the poster thought "excessively picky" meant.
> 
> It seems some men expect us to jump all over them because we are, after all, fat women, and can't expect much male attention.
> 
> Just trying to determine if the OP is one of those people or not.


----------



## CurvaceousBBWLover (May 29, 2006)

Proper home training: Being taught at an early age by one's parents to treat people with respect and decorum.



moonvine said:


> I really wish you could be more specific. What exactly is "proper home training?" That could mean many things, most of which aren't applicable on a message board or chat line, such as not eating with your elbows on the table.


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## Miss Vickie (May 29, 2006)

I'd be interested in knowing what rude or stuck up behavior is as well. I mean, I suppose people think I'm that way if some guy messages me with "A/S/L?" or "got pics?" I usually tell them to get lost. I mean, give a girl a little verbal foreplay before jumping in. A little "Hi, my name is so and so. I'm from such and such. Do you have time to chat?" is nice. Is that really so much to ask? (Of course I'll still probably keep it short since I'm married and most guys who approach me in chat rooms want a cyber bootie call, but I'll be a heck of a lot nicer to the guy who makes an effort to, you know, speak the language). 

Sometimes people see those who reject them as arrogant or rude, which is unfair, because none of us is guaranteed a positive response to a come on, and there's always some risk of rejection involved. But it's hard to know if that's what's going on unless we get some details. It could be the approach, it could be the woman. It's just so hard to know when we talk in such vagaries.


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## moonvine (May 29, 2006)

CurvaceousBBWLover said:


> Proper home training: Being taught at an early age by one's parents to treat people with respect and decorum.



Thank you for that definition. How, specifically, would one exhibit (or not exhibit) such in a chat room?


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## moonvine (May 29, 2006)

Miss Vickie said:


> I'd be interested in knowing what rude or stuck up behavior is as well. I mean, I suppose people think I'm that way if some guy messages me with "A/S/L?" or "got pics?" I usually tell them to get lost. I mean, give a girl a little verbal foreplay before jumping in. A little "Hi, my name is so and so. I'm from such and such. Do you have time to chat?" is nice. Is that really so much to ask? (Of course I'll still probably keep it short since I'm married and most guys who approach me in chat rooms want a cyber bootie call, but I'll be a heck of a lot nicer to the guy who makes an effort to, you know, speak the language).



I actually take a lot of delight in being rude to people who approach me for a cyber bootie call, just as I would in real life, except online I can't dump a drink in their lap or slap them.


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## CurvaceousBBWLover (May 29, 2006)

Easily. Don't let your first comment to a stranger be "Hey baby. How big are your tits? or Hey, handsome, how long is your dick?




moonvine said:


> Thank you for that definition. How, specifically, would one exhibit (or not exhibit) such in a chat room?


----------



## CurvaceousBBWLover (May 29, 2006)

And you should be. The best way to curb base behavior is to set boundaries and speak your mind.




moonvine said:


> I actually take a lot of delight in being rude to people who approach me for a cyber bootie call, just as I would in real life, except online I can't dump a drink in their lap or slap them.


----------



## Miss Vickie (May 29, 2006)

moonvine said:


> I actually take a lot of delight in being rude to people who approach me for a cyber bootie call, just as I would in real life, except online I can't dump a drink in their lap or slap them.



I wish there were a cyber equivalent to dumping a drink in their lap, tho'. Wouldn't that be fun?


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## moonvine (May 29, 2006)

CurvaceousBBWLover said:


> Easily. Don't let your first comment to a stranger be "Hey baby. How big are your tits? or Hey, handsome, how long is your dick?



Well, I guess I'm good then.


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## kyla (May 29, 2006)

Miss Vickie said:


> I wish there were a cyber equivalent to dumping a drink in their lap, tho'. Wouldn't that be fun?


hmm I really like this idea!


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## rainyday (May 29, 2006)

TheSadeianLinguist said:


> You want attention? Be worthy of attention. Be smart, funny, kind, polite.



This really is something more men who are looking should take to heart if they want to succeed in chat. Back when I used to PM I remember dreading the entrance to chat of a certain few guys because inevitably two minutes after arriving, up would come the same dull PM they always sent "Hi. How are you." Or even just "Hi." Never anything original. Nothing to set them apart.

If you want a lady's attention in there, realize you are asking her to turn away from the room conversation, and maybe from other PM conversations she has going, and listen just to you. So make it worth her while or don't be surprised if the response is perfunctory (or there's no response at all). You don't have to be a comic (though it helps), just be somehow different in a way that's interesting and makes her want to find out more. Same goes for women PMing men trying to start up a conversation.

And the kiss of death? Whine that nobody's paying attention to you. If they weren't before they certainly won't after that, I'm sorry to say.


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## AnnMarie (May 30, 2006)

Well, I'm late in on this after a weekend away, but I need to chime in on just two points from my own personal experience. 

First, posting this and then accusing mods of ridding the boards of your thread (as if it's community threatening or something? LOL) and you is just absurd. We have far bigger fish to fry here, and there is nothing wrong with this post. It's opened a lot of very interesting dicussion, and we're not afraid of some observations - right or wrong. I'm echoing what Observer said, but I just had to drive it home. 

Second, as a veteran chatter and board user who has some "web presence" (does that make me arrogant, for saying that? I'm not trying that, just trying to set up where I'm coming from) I have a mixed issue with PMs in chat. 

When I chat frequently, I get almost NO PMs, it's GREAT. I don't go into chat to PM with people, I go in to chat in an open room with guy and girls that I know and enjoy. I generally will respond to a simple hi and if it continues I will usually just mention that I prefer to chat in the room, but thanks. No biggie. 

Here's the problem.... when I DON'T chat frequently. For about the past year, I've been in chat rarely. When I do go in, the guys who are there may not realize that I'm generally around all the time, and they starting PMing like crazy. I don't care if people say hi, but I cannot possibly be in there and trying to chat in streaming and answer all those PMs... it's not possible. 

More often than not (and chatters here can attest to it happening) I'll just throw my hands up and leave because I can't get a moment's peace. If anyone says hi to me in the room, I'm careful to give a greeting back... if I miss it, it's usually just a mistake. 

So, while I'm rather certain none of your post was about me (I don't recall your name, etc) I just wanted to give a quick glimpse into things that may be going on on the other side. 

Frustration and confusion will often take the front seat to polite courtesies that you may think you're entitled to. I'm sorry you feel this is an increasing problem among the big girls online, but you just never know the whole story (not to mention ringing phones, if they have kids running around, timers going off, cats knocking things over...) I can't tell you the number of times I have to leave a computer to put out fires of any nature... and I come back to "Hello?" and two minutes later "Fine, I see how you are - thanks for nothing." 

The difference between the message I describe above and the overall accusation in your post is only the time and manner the feeling was expressed.


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## eightyseven (May 30, 2006)

I feel like my biggest issue with the original post is that the poster pidgeon-holes BBWs... that they're all supposed to be down to earth because they're BBW and not revered by mainstream society like we in our community revere them. That's a load of crap. BBWs, like anyone, are prone to all sorts of personalities and attitudes. How one looks or how society responds to how one looks usually has little or no bearing on one's personality.

Secondly, I've observed (and this is not always the case, just a mere observation) that many BBW models seem to enjoy what they're doing- they don't do what they do because they want to be revered by FAs in the way that many of us revere them. Therefore, it's unfair of the original poster to hold BBWs which our community spotlights to a higher standards than their admirers. To be quite frank, some of the ways in which FAs go about "admiring" BBW (and men "admire" women in general) DISGUST me, as a man, to no end. Maybe you feel like BBW have attitudes and superiority complexes because they have to deal with so much crap from FAs who don't know what TACT is.


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## LillyBBBW (May 30, 2006)

CurvaceousBBWLover said:


> Proper home training: Being taught at an early age by one's parents to treat people with respect and decorum.



*Proper Home Training:* Look both ways before you cross the street, wear clean underwear, No means no and NEVER talk to or go off with strangers. 

Proper home training means different things to different people. You need to learn to respect boundaries and comfort levels for people and not take it personally if someone is simply not interested. Do they owe you an explanation as a courtesy? No, they don't. There are no laws requiring anyone to respond to you but there are many laws governing just what you can demand from a stranger. There is no rule saying that everybody has to be your friend or that everyone has to like you. It's just not possible.

It's best not to take it personally so don't go away mad, just go away.


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## OriginalCyn (May 30, 2006)

Just for the record: I don't IM with anyone whom I don't already know, and it has nothing to do with assuming that I'm "too good for" the unknown IMer, either. 

Do I ignore these fellows (and they are always fellows--I'm not being sexist)? No. I just tell them, politely, that I'm not into communicating with random strangers online, that I reserve IMing for people whom I already know.

So, you're probably wondering, how does a fellow get to meet me if I won't even talk to him? Well, that's the point: I'm not into meeting men online. Period. Actually, at this point in my life, I'm not into meeting new men at all, online or otherwise. 

Whether it's online or IRL, just because a woman is "there," it doesn't mean that she's anxiously waiting for random men to chat her up. SOME women are, in fact, waiting for men to chat them up. Some women need constant affirmations from men in order to feel--I dunno?--worthwhile, wanted, valuable, beautiful, whatever... And some women don't view themselves in the reflections of men's eyes whatsoever, and they resent any implication that they, perhaps, SHOULD.

I know that men hate rejection. And men are in the unenviable position of having to put themselves "out there" to make the first move and risk rejection. But just because that aspect of being a man is difficult and unpleasant, that doesn't somehow obligate all women everywhere to gladly receive every man's attentions. After all, there are men who blanket-reply to every woman who's got a personal ad online, figuring, I suppose, that they'll play the odds. Should their letters be received with the same respect as a man who's actually LOOKED at a woman's profile and sent her a thoughtful and appropriate reply? Of course not! The former is like the guys who ask for nekkid pictures or cybersex from strangers--they can be ignored or swatted like flies, depending on the recipient's mood. The latter deserves at least a polite and respectful rebuff. But he doesn't automatically deserve attention.


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## Elfcat (May 30, 2006)

ChristianFA said:


> Have we gone too far with the whole idea of celebrating the beauty of BBWs and SSBBWs, and turned some of those we adore into people who believe they are truly above those of us doing the adoring? Have websites like ratingbbw.com turned our beloved ladies into (pardon me, but it's the only word that fits) arrogant women.



My only comment on this is that I worry that these rating and beauty contest voting sites lead fat women down the path that will ultimately lead to another "Myth America" protest. Which is why I choose not to bother with them. I don't really see the point of numbering women; to me it takes time away from enjoying their company.

But hey, if that's the path some want to tread, I'm arrogant enough not to think it matters that much to me.


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## Rosie (May 30, 2006)

I hate being fat 100% of the time. I see nothing positive about it.


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## Rosie (May 30, 2006)

I find your attitdue not only disgusting, but dangerous. You would probably dissuade someone from losing weight even if their life depended on it.

And it don't live "my life waiting to be thin". Just because I don't like being fat doesn't mean I don't enjoy living, or feel that I deserve respect.


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## OriginalCyn (May 30, 2006)

I think that I was, perhaps, a little bit too nice, a little bit too empathetic, in my initial reaction to this thread.

If I take what the original poster has written and coolly analyze it, what it comes down to is this: If we allow people to have a sense of self-esteem, they're likely to get all swollen-headed and feel that they're "too good" for us. So we shouldn't encourage them to feel good about themselves, since this is ultimately not to our benefit.

When phrased in that way, it doesn't sound like a position that deserves any sympathy--nevermind any sort of communication...and certainly not a date or a relationship.


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## Miss Vickie (May 30, 2006)

OriginalCyn said:


> If I take what the original poster has written and coolly analyze it, what it comes down to is this: If we allow people to have a sense of self-esteem, they're likely to get all swollen-headed and feel that they're "too good" for us. So we shouldn't encourage them to feel good about themselves, since this is ultimately not to our benefit.
> 
> When phrased in that way, it doesn't sound like a position that deserves any sympathy--nevermind any sort of communication...and certainly not a date or a relationship.



Not only that, but I think the most arrogant, swollen headed people are the most insecure. That's been my experience -- when you crack that big headed exterior and get past the ego, you find a gooey center of insecurity bubbling away inside. People that are truly confident have no need to throw their weight around -- intellectual, physical or otherwise -- but go through life confidently doing what's right and speaking their truth without apology.

Too bad there's so few of them out there. It seems to me that most of us suffer from insecurities of one kind or another.  So it seems to me that genuine compliments to each other -- regardless of size or gender -- are a good thing. I think maybe they make us all better people.


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## NFA (May 30, 2006)

Rosie said:


> I find your attitdue not only disgusting, but dangerous.



So, just so I'm clear, its okay for you to not want to date me because I would find you attractive. But its "disgusting and dangerous" for me to not want to date someone who wouldn't want to date me?


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## NFA (May 30, 2006)

OriginalCyn said:


> When phrased in that way, it doesn't sound like a position that deserves any sympathy--nevermind any sort of communication...and certainly not a date or a relationship.



And that's really just how the OP phrased it. I think few rants about "stuck-up" and "overly picky" women every are remotely justified, but they are their own beast. Taking the step to suggest women aren't beholden enough to men for affection is pure misogyny and I don't think there is another way to look at this.


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## Buffie (May 31, 2006)

Rosie said:


> I hate being fat 100% of the time. I see nothing positive about it.



Sorry you feel that way. Please don't be surprised at people's reactions, this site was founded by a pro-size person and it's frequented by all different types including a LOT of pro-size people. Therefore some of us are kind of taken aback when we see someone express a 100% negative opinion of fat. It doesn't happen here (not that I've seen) very much. You have every right to your own thoughts, I just wanted to make sure you knew what Dimensions was primarily about so you don't feel attacked or badly if people strongly disagree with your opinion. You should feel welcome to express yourself and discuss it with anyone here, but some opposition should probably be expected. Just an FYI, sincerely. No sarcasm or snottiness is implied at all and I hope the 'tone' of this post (if there is such a thing online) comes across in the spirit in which it is meant.


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## fatlane (May 31, 2006)

Amen, Buffie.

How do I feel about fat womens' rights?

Let me just say that I have _always_ felt right about the fat womens.


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## Buffie (May 31, 2006)

You! Tsk tsk tsk! In the corner you go, time out. 15 minutes.


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## AnnMarie (May 31, 2006)

Carrie said:


> ...but you'd be hard pressed to find a sweeter, more genuine, approachable woman here at Dim...



Thank you very much, that's very sweet of you, and right back atcha bombshell. (we still don't have a blushy icon, so imagine that one here)


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## LillyBBBW (May 31, 2006)

Rosie said:


> I find your attitdue not only disgusting, but dangerous. You would probably dissuade someone from losing weight even if their life depended on it.
> 
> And it don't live "my life waiting to be thin". Just because I don't like being fat doesn't mean I don't enjoy living, or feel that I deserve respect.



So clarify for us Rosie. You hate being fat 100% of the time, but you also claim that you do not spend 100% of the time wishing you were thin. So if you don't want to be fat, what is it that you want?


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## TraciJo67 (May 31, 2006)

Santaclear said:


> We have definitely gone too far. Some of these dames get too uppity and end up giving swell head. Then they disappear. Others are just too big for their britches.
> 
> I say we storm the Paysite Board. Who's with me?



Damn uppity fat broads


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## FitChick (May 31, 2006)

Buffie said:


> Sorry you feel that way. Please don't be surprised at people's reactions, this site was founded by a pro-size person and it's frequented by all different types including a LOT of pro-size people. Therefore some of us are kind of taken aback when we see someone express a 100% negative opinion of fat. It doesn't happen here (not that I've seen) very much. You have every right to your own thoughts, I just wanted to make sure you knew what Dimensions was primarily about so you don't feel attacked or badly if people strongly disagree with your opinion. You should feel welcome to express yourself and discuss it with anyone here, but some opposition should probably be expected. Just an FYI, sincerely. No sarcasm or snottiness is implied at all and I hope the 'tone' of this post (if there is such a thing online) comes across in the spirit in which it is meant.



Exactly. One reason I hang out on fat acceptance sites is to AVOID the diet/thin obsession I see in the other 99% of the world, be it on or offline. This is the ONE venue where I don't have to worry that someone will judge me for not being happy about weight loss.

If I didn't have places like this, I'd go crazy from all the bombardment of diet ads, weight loss commercials, infomercials, billboards for gyms, etc.


BTW Buffie, is that your pic under your name? If so, you are incredibly beautiful...wow!


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## Buffie (May 31, 2006)

FitChick said:


> Exactly. One reason I hang out on fat acceptance sites is to AVOID the diet/thin obsession I see in the other 99% of the world, be it on or offline. This is the ONE venue where I don't have to worry that someone will judge me for not being happy about weight loss.
> 
> If I didn't have places like this, I'd go crazy from all the bombardment of diet ads, weight loss commercials, infomercials, billboards for gyms, etc.
> 
> ...



I come to Dim for the same reason you do, to avoid all the anti-fat junk. It wears me out. It's nice to be with my own kind, so to speak.  

Yep, my pic. Thank you for the props.  I appreciate that.


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## Rosie (Jun 2, 2006)

Buffie said:


> Sorry you feel that way. Please don't be surprised at people's reactions, this site was founded by a pro-size person and it's frequented by all different types including a LOT of pro-size people. Therefore some of us are kind of taken aback when we see someone express a 100% negative opinion of fat. It doesn't happen here (not that I've seen) very much. You have every right to your own thoughts, I just wanted to make sure you knew what Dimensions was primarily about so you don't feel attacked or badly if people strongly disagree with your opinion. You should feel welcome to express yourself and discuss it with anyone here, but some opposition should probably be expected. Just an FYI, sincerely. No sarcasm or snottiness is implied at all and I hope the 'tone' of this post (if there is such a thing online) comes across in the spirit in which it is meant.




Hi Buffie, everyone has a right to their feelings. I don't try to tell others how to feel about their fat, and I would hope they would give me the same respect. I come here because it's a place to be where I don't have to worry about being judged about being fat (tho I've felt judged at times for not being fat enough!) and I do believe that all fat people deserve to be treated with courtesy and respect. 

Rosie


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## Buffie (Jun 2, 2006)

It sounds like you come here for the same reasons the rest of us do, too. I'm glad you've found a place like this where fat isn't judged so harshly. 
Amen to courtesy and respect! The world definitely needs more of that.


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## Ladyrose1952 (Jun 4, 2006)

CurvaceousBBWLover said:


> Very good advice. A sure way to turn a strange woman off is to attempt to engage her in sexual banter before she even knows you. But some of these guys have never learned how to approach a woman. They need to be schooled. LOL


 
Maybe someone with the knowledge to do so, should create a Group where the Art of Communication is taught to these men/gals that seem not to have a clue as to how to communicate to a Lady/Gentleman? When there is BHM/BBWs involved, there should be better communication skills if they have any hope of actually maintaining a decent corrispondance with the focus of their admiration.

I have often gotten and heard of the way many men/gals start a new communication with sexual innuendos and such, do they actually think that this sort of contact will be welcomed? I DON'T THINK SO!! A real LADY/GENTLEMAN will have absolutely nothing to do with these missinformed men/gals. After all, there are so many more interesting things to chat or communicate about including great SEX.

Just a suggestion, but I am wondering if an Internet Contact Group might be an idea so these people would get their minds and words out of the gutter..... just a suggestion......


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## CurvaceousBBWLover (Jun 4, 2006)

I like that idea. Now all we need is someone who is willing to lead the group.



Ladyrose1952 said:


> Maybe someone with the knowledge to do so, should create a Group where the Art of Communication is taught to these men/gals that seem not to have a clue as to how to communicate to a Lady/Gentleman? When there is BHM/BBWs involved, there should be better communication skills if they have any hope of actually maintaining a decent corrispondance with the focus of their admiration.
> 
> I have often gotten and heard of the way many men/gals start a new communication with sexual innuendos and such, do they actually think that this sort of contact will be welcomed? I DON'T THINK SO!! A real LADY/GENTLEMAN will have absolutely nothing to do with these missinformed men/gals. After all, there are so many more interesting things to chat or communicate about including great SEX.
> 
> Just a suggestion, but I am wondering if an Internet Contact Group might be an idea so these people would get their minds and words out of the gutter..... just a suggestion......


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## MisticalMisty (Jun 4, 2006)

Ladyrose1952 said:


> I have often gotten and heard of the way many men/gals start a new communication with sexual innuendos and such, do they actually think that this sort of contact will be welcomed? I DON'T THINK SO!! A real LADY/GENTLEMAN will have absolutely nothing to do with these missinformed men/gals. After all, there are so many more interesting things to chat or communicate about including great SEX.
> 
> :


Wait..don't talk to you about sex...but communicate about more interesting things including sex...kinda contradicting yourself don't you think?


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## Ladyrose1952 (Jun 5, 2006)

CurvaceousBBWLover said:


> I like that idea. Now all we need is someone who is willing to lead the group.


 
Gee, I wonder if there would be any takers.... hmmmmm, might be an interesting concept indeed.

And chatting about sex is healthy, but there are other things in chatting that you can discuss too. Sex can get boring it that is the only thing that one person wants to chat about. It can be just as boring as watching re-run's on TV.. *"Get some new material people*!" LOL


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## Sumguy (Jun 5, 2006)

Santaclear said:


> We have definitely gone too far. Some of these dames get too uppity and end up giving swell head. Then they disappear. Others are just too big for their britches.
> 
> I say we storm the Paysite Board. Who's with me?



"end up giving swell head"??  

Is that really what you meant to say?


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## Les Toil (Jun 5, 2006)

Sumguy said:


> "end up giving swell head"??
> 
> Is that really what you meant to say?



Hands down THEE greatest typo I've seen this year.


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## Santaclear (Jun 5, 2006)

Sumguy said:


> "end up giving swell head"??
> 
> Is that really what you meant to say?



Yeah, I said what I meant. Not a typo.

I was praising them uppity dames.


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## candygodiva (Jun 5, 2006)

Santaclear said:


> Yeah, I said what I meant. Not a typo.
> 
> I was praising them uppity dames.



*giggles*
Santa baby! You always tickle me! :wubu:


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## gypsy (Jun 6, 2006)

ChristianFA said:


> Kinda hard when they don't even respond to a polite "good afternoon."



I don't even think I've seen you utter a word in the chatroom. We must scare you to death


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## Placebo (Jun 6, 2006)

Rosie said:


> Hi Buffie, everyone has a right to their feelings. I don't try to tell others how to feel about their fat, and I would hope they would give me the same respect. I come here because it's a place to be where I don't have to worry about being judged about being fat (tho I've felt judged at times for not being fat enough!) and I do believe that all fat people deserve to be treated with courtesy and respect.
> 
> Rosie


i'm still very confused.....

you come here because this is a forum where people can escape the harsh judgements of the outside world, yet your own internal judgements which you have made well known by now as well as live with everyday, completely negate your last message.

please, enlighten me..... (i'm being serious, not a smart ass)

~placebo


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## SamanthaNY (Jun 7, 2006)

gypsy said:


> I don't even think I've seen you utter a word in the chatroom. We must scare you to death



If not, we can always try harder! 

(kidding! I kid ) 

Christian: sometimes it takes some foot-stamping to break into the chatroom convos, so consider giving it another try. It might be worth the trouble.


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## FitChick (Jun 7, 2006)

LillyBBBW said:


> So clarify for us Rosie. You hate being fat 100% of the time, but you also claim that you do not spend 100% of the time wishing you were thin. So if you don't want to be fat, what is it that you want?




Maybe she means she would like to be thinNER but not THIN? Or maybe "average" (which these days seems to be size 14 or so.)


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