# Young BHM's & The Preasure to be smaller



## escapist (Jun 23, 2010)

So I just saw this show on MTV tonight I didn't really catch the name of it (doesn't really matter) but the whole show was all about these retarded social pressures to be what your *friends* want you to be (specifically thinner).

Personally my friends never gave me no such pressure that I was aware of. I partly got upset watching this show because (warning escapist rant ahead) the guy in the show was totally made out by his friends to be undesirable because he was chunky (277 lbs). They tried to force him to ask girls out on dates (so he wouldn't be the 3rd wheel without a date). That of course blew up in his face because he was totally insecure about doing it and virtually zero connection with the girl who had been set up to be with him. Heck it was almost uncomfortable to watch, he was devastated to hear another girl say no yet again.

So the show of course was about this "chunky guy" doing what his friends and everybody told him and loose weight. He dropped 20 lbs in 6 weeks. Asked a girl out (in a much less threatening atmosphere that the previous girl), she of course said yes. The show went on to say how fine and dandy his life was not that he fit in with his friends and what girls want. 

I guess this is partly why I go on my rants about building self confidence and dating skills if you don't have them. I used to fall for the crap of "I'm to fat for someone to want me" only to learn it was utter BS. You can be the hottest guy on Earth, you might get some play, but nobody is really going to want to be with you if you have no social skills and your no fun. Conversely if your chubby and even just moderately attractive but have a great positive warm and invitingly fun personality that has just a hint of naughty you'll probably never need to worry about dates.

I worry that other chubby guys(even girls) watch this show and go oh yep I'm to fat to be loved. There is no problem with gaining a little fitness or doing it cause you know its right, but to me its a whole other issue when you do it just to fit in, or be liked by your "friends".

Whats your guys(and girls) take on shows like this or even just people around you who do this?


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## Sasquatch! (Jun 23, 2010)

Isn't MTV aimed at 12 year olds?

There's a massive maze of contradicting information in society at the moment--often peddled by the same people/networks.
eg. You're the only person that matters but you need to put others first, Yours is the only opinion about yourself that you should listen to but you need to take advice from others....etc etc...

This is only one of its manifestations.

I am trying to lose weight. One of those reasons is to increase my business time. But that's not the main reason. I'm not happy with the size I am, fact. 

SA is all well and good. The only problem is you end up polarizing people into two separate camps--those who feel crap and try to lose weight, those that accept their size and don't do a thing about it.

MTV is never going to be a positive influence. It's a load of bull. But I really think we should push people to be comfortable with themselves irrespective of size. THEN weight loss/weight maintenance will become a less emotionally charged and involving subject.


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## LoveBHMS (Jun 23, 2010)

This is kind of like the "should you just say fuck society" argument.

There is nothing wrong with wanting to fit in with a peer group; kids and adults do it all the time. Humans are social animals and naturally need a sense of connection with others.

Particularly with young people, a need to fit in is going to be very strong. Kids that are outcasts can wind up turning to such extreme measures as suicide simply because the pain is so intense.

So it's perfectly understandable if a teenager does something because a peer group demands it. Yes it's all well and good to be able to say 'fuck it, I am who I am' but not everybody has the internal strength, personality, and character to pull that off. It's especially lacking in 15 year olds.

By the same token that not all bodies are going to be able to be a size 0, it stands to reason that not all human minds/personalities/psyches are the same. Pointing out that all it takes for social success is a warm personality, positive attitude, sense of humor and "a hint of naughty" is not a whole lot different from saying that all it takes to be a size 0 is veggies and exercise. It will happen for some and others could starve forever and not attain the same body type. People are all different and that includes their mental selves. I have no doubt plenty of skinny men can flaunt their bodies around fatties and say "Well if you want to look like me you can" and it's no more true than somebody with an outsized personality or sense of humor or intelligence can flaunt those things and think everyone else is capable of having them.


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## escapist (Jun 23, 2010)

Sasquatch! said:


> Isn't MTV aimed at 12 year olds?
> 
> There's a massive maze of contradicting information in society at the moment--often peddled by the same people/networks.
> eg. You're the only person that matters but you need to put others first, Yours is the only opinion about yourself that you should listen to but you need to take advice from others....etc etc...
> ...



OK First off:

Report Sales Demographics: http://cablevisionadsales.com/network_mtv.html

*MTV Demographics*
Male 46.6%
Female 53.4%

Income:
Median Household Income: $74,307

Education:
Have College Degree or More: 24.3%

Occupation:
White collar, professional, managers 29.5%

Age:
18-49 Years Old: 88.2%
25-54 Years Old: 62.7%

Home Ownership:
Own Their Own Home: 46.2%
--------------------
As for this:



> SA is all well and good. The only problem is you end up polarizing people into two separate camps--those who feel crap and try to lose weight, those that accept their size and don't do a thing about it.



I think you missed part of my post:



escapist said:


> There is no problem with gaining a little fitness or doing it cause you know its right, but to me its a whole other issue when you do it just to fit in, or be liked by your "friends".



I think SA is all well and good but I wouldn't go and try to pigeonhole people into just 2 categories. I Dig being a big huge guy, I'm sure that's clear. However I can careless how much I weigh as long as I can do the activities I enjoy, hiking, walking, sex, heck even shopping. 

I should add I was at the Gym walking for an hour (2.5 miles) while I watched the show. Not because my friends think I need to be small I just know my body needs exercise to function like it should. So don't go thinking people who accept themselves sit around just being fat.

I think its great you have motivation to make your life the way you want it. I just hope your doing it cause its what you want. Not cause you think it will make people like you more or any BS like that.



> MTV is never going to be a positive influence. It's a load of bull. But I really think we should push people to be comfortable with themselves irrespective of size. THEN weight loss/weight maintenance will become a less emotionally charged and involving subject.



Yeah my question wasn't so much about MTV, I think your right though, finding acceptance with self then making a choice to change is probably the way to go.


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## escapist (Jun 23, 2010)

LoveBHMS - There is a difference between "Approval Seeking" and fitting in socially with like minded people. People who get on you for not being "Their ideal" are really just saying, "we don't want you in our club"...so who needs friends like that anyways?

I guess that's part of what made me mad, I can't ever imagine my friends acting like that. The guy's who said those kind of things were simply not my friends, nor were they people I would even consider socially considering my friends. 

The guy on the show pushing him was supposedly like his BEST FRIEND, and all he did was AMOG (Toss berating Alpha Male Teasing and jokes) at him. Stuff like, "Your Fat", "You embarrass me around girls cause your fat", and "Lazy ass".

PS. The "Fat Guy" was more like 17-18 driving around in an SUV.


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## chicken legs (Jun 23, 2010)

Here is some more info on the MTV show "I'm under peer pressure"..

here is Aj..


















"AJ, 18, is caught in a circle of jocks. As the overweight, artistic type surrounded by muscley-athletic minded guys, AJ finds himself on the receiving end of some hurtful remarks -- based entirely on his size. While the guys love to be around the ladies, AJ has found it a tough time making moves on the girls. He's the go-to friend, the lovable but not sexy guy. His friends are getting more and more frustrated by his third-wheel status.

AJ strives to forget the embarrassing experience of being dissed by a cute girl, but his friend uses it as a reason why AJ needs to get his physical appearance in order. Are AJ's looks really keeping him and his friends from being a hit with the women in their circle, or is the pressure on AJ just an excuse to bully him? AJ's sick of the teasing, but is that really enough to change his eating habits and get healthy? He decides to try and make a go of a diet and lose weight.

Meanwhile, AJ heads to the gym and with his buddy as his personal trainer, AJ is hit with free weights and harassment. They're not off to the best start, but at least AJ is making changes to his behavior

AJ has been working out hard on his physique and within six weeks he's dropped 22 pounds. Nate is proud of his friend's work and he apologizes, in a backhanded way, for all the comments he had made. Feeling fine after his weigh-in, AJ heads over to meet with his friend Valerie and asks her out; she accepts and he leaves feeling finer than fine.

AJ and Valerie are headed out on their date, and a nervous AJ is terrified at being pushed away by her. However, by the end of the evening they're having a fantastic time. While his friends pressured him to lose weight, AJ is so happy at the changes in himself that he wouldn't have done it any other way."


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## Sasquatch! (Jun 23, 2010)

escapist said:


> Report Sales Demographics



Have to say I *am* surprised at that. Another rung down in my opinion of the general population.
--------------------



> So don't go thinking people who accept themselves sit around just being fat.


Yes, we all know you live life to the full a la Hugh Hefner/Triathlon runner, but you've also made it quite clear time and again that you are special.



> I think its great you have motivation to make your life the way you want it. I just hope your doing it cause its what you want. Not cause you think it will make people like you more or any BS like that.


Damn right I'm not doing it so other people will like me more. If people liked me more than they do now, I'd have to get restraining orders. 
I don't have the opportunities or the ability to do certain things that I want--stuff that is purely selfish--and the only thing stopping me from being able to do these things is stamina and size. If those things weren't important to me on a personal level I probably wouldn't bother.



> Yeah my question wasn't so much about MTV, I think your right though, finding acceptance with self then making a choice to change is probably the way to go.


I think we need to focus more on self-acceptance and worth as a human being, irrespective of body size. Size acceptance (on a personal scale) involves a shift in terms of a larger body being ok, but it's still based on the physical.


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## freakyfred (Jun 23, 2010)

There's always pressure for me, but never from my friends. It's always from my family, and frankly, it's more about my health more than my appearance.

If I had friends teasing me cause I was fat, they don't sound like friends to me :/


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## escapist (Jun 23, 2010)

freakyfred said:


> There's always pressure for me, but never from my friends. It's always from my family, and frankly, it's more about my health more than my appearance.
> 
> If I had friends teasing me cause I was fat, they don't sound like friends to me :/



Yeah, the stuff I get from friends and loved ones is far more centered around health and their rather legitimate fears. I know my FFA girlfriend is probably the most torn of all. I know she loves me big and "juicy", but I know she wants me around in her life more than she wants me fat and dead.

I don't know if I'll ever get back to running, but the least I can do is improve my stamina so I can walk a few hours. That way I can survive when we all run out of Gas and the government releases its biological weapons on us to turn us into an army of undead zombies doomed to roam the earth in search of brains to feed on.


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## escapist (Jun 23, 2010)

escapist said:


> So don't go thinking people who accept themselves sit around just being fat.



This wasn't some kind of a brag it was an example and an explanation. I am hardly the only Big person on Dim's who exercises.



Sasquatch! said:


> Yes, we all know you live life to the full a la Hugh Hefner/Triathlon runner, but you've also made it quite clear time and again that you are special.



You stated that people do 1 or the other Accept Fat and be Fat, or they try to change themselves for others. You seemed to miss the 3rd category that I and many others fall under. We accept our size, we maintain regular fitness and believe in loving our body's. I'm not sure if you meant to come off like a 2 year old or that was some kind of actual complement. I personally think more of you than that so I'll just asume you were thinking I was making some kind of personal attack when I was only trying to illuminate the 3rd path: Fit & Fat.

There are guys far bigger than I, that do Far more than I do:


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## Sasquatch! (Jun 23, 2010)

escapist said:


> This wasn't some kind of a brag it was an example and an explanation. I am hardly the only Big person on Dim's who exercises.


I don't doubt it. But I doubt all of us on Dims do 30 mins of exercise a day though. Not to mention that while Dims is a large community, it hardly encompasses the entirity of largedom.





> You stated that people do 1 or the other Accept Fat and be Fat, or they try to change themselves for others.


I said Size Acceptance would seem to lead to that. Screw the Size Acceptance movement. Let's put our weight behind the Self-Acceptance movement. Once you've accepted yourself on a mental level, I'm pretty sure you can figure out what size you feel comfortable at.
You keep saying yourself that confidence etc is the key to "scoring". We should help people get to the size *they* feel comfortable at, not make people feel comfortable with the size they are. For some people that may be larger, for some people that will be smaller.

Of course it's better to be fit. At what point did I deny that? Nor did I say that overweight people couldn't take part in physical activities. We should be encouraging people to be fitter no matter what size they want to be. 
My point is, in the same way that you can't point at someone at say "You need to lose weight or I won't be friends with you", you can't say "You need to be happy with the size you are now".

PS: I wish I was as healthy as a sumo
PS2: Sorry if I came off like a 2 year old, this _is_ the internet--there's always going to be tone confusion.


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## Gyrene (Jun 23, 2010)

Sasquatch! said:


> PS2: Sorry if I came off like a 2 year old, this _is_ the internet--there's always going to be tone confusion.



Thats why I always keep a handy-dandy tuning fork next to me 'pewter.


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## rellis10 (Jun 23, 2010)

I'v met a bit of peer pressure to get smaller but on the whole i havent had enough to be worried by it.

My (admittedly small) circle of friends and acquaintences have seldom brought the issue up with me and seem to accept that i am who i am. My family has prompted me to diet a couple of times when i was younger but never forced the issue.

The only real negative attention i'v recieved has been from strangers who are just ignorant prats 

However, i have felt pressure from all kinds of sources around me before and have at times felt bad about being this size. Only comparatively recently have i begun to shake that off and accept who i am (with the help of this fine place ).


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## Wanderer (Jun 23, 2010)

(shrug) I never noticed peer pressure to be thin. Note that I'm not saying there wasn't any... just that I didn't notice it. Heck, when I was little (which should, when talking about a 200-pound ten-year-old, be in GladOS' "huge sarcasm quotes"), I _loved_ being fat. I enjoyed being able to pop open the snaps on my pants by sitting down and taking a deep breath, even... and yet I was still active. (Though our backyard fence never recovered from my climbing it.)

Nowadays? I can't manage as much physical actiivity (due to tiem constraints rather than physical ones), but I still love being fat... though, personally, I don't think I'm "properly fat" yet.


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## escapist (Jun 23, 2010)

I was pressured by my family to the point of them taking me to weight watchers at 12 years old. Looking back, I was not a fat kid, my mother was just freaking nuts wanting me to have washboard abs or something.


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## WillSpark (Jun 23, 2010)

freakyfred said:


> There's always pressure for me, but never from my friends. It's always from my family, and frankly, it's more about my health more than my appearance.
> 
> If I had friends teasing me cause I was fat, they don't sound like friends to me :/



This is the simplest truth for me.


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## extra_fat_guy (Jun 24, 2010)

I never felt any preasure from my friends because they needed me to be big for the football team. I didn't get many dates, and I think it was because of my size. Most of the preasure came from my parents, and it still does.


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## chicken legs (Jun 24, 2010)

In my area of the world..the job market is the pressure cooker to be smaller and have big boobs. Plus, I hear it all the time from my family and friends. However, in their defense, they are used to me being smaller and are tired of me complaining about my weight and being antisocial because of it. For a women, clothes are waaayyy cheaper the smaller you are and I really miss all those deals..lol.


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## stldpn (Jun 24, 2010)

I never felt "pressure" growing up. I know I felt it more when I entered the supposedly adult and mature world than I ever felt it as a teenager. 

I don't know that it's as simple as putting people in distinct little categories. Mostly because you get a lot of bleed through. And people's emotions can swing rapidly as they lose,gain or attempt to maintain. We say things like just a number on a scale but we all know it's a bit more than that. 

I myself am currently on a path to loss. My health has been less than spectacular in the last eight months or so, and for a 34 year old guy I've not been living up to my potential. Bottom line I can't afford to be sick or any less mobile. As it is, if I fell on the floor and was unable to assist in picking myself up for some reason? It would take at least three adults to lift me safely. Living alone, I've got to rethink the way I've been doing things.


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## RJI (Jun 24, 2010)

I felt the pressure when I was a kid and I wasn't even really fat, but big and athletic/muscular. When I was going into Junior High I was @ 5'10" and 250lbs of muscle. I was more manly then most of my teachers and constantly being told I am too big and need to lose weight even though I wasn't fat. People see large and instantly think fat and unhealthy but didn't stop to think I was one of the best athletes in the county and ran track in my spare time when not terrorizing QB's. When I went into High School things changed because my Football Coaches actually encouraged me to gain weight and size. Being a star Football Player makes people see you in a different way but I did see how some of my fat friends were treated that didn't play Football. 

I like to judge people on how they treat me. If you give me respect in the first 2 minutes we meet I will give you another 10 minutes and go on from there.


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## vardon_grip (Jun 24, 2010)

Sasquatch! said:


> Isn't MTV aimed at 12 year olds?





Sasquatch! said:


> Have to say I *am* surprised at that. Another rung down in my opinion of the general population.



I don't think you are far off your assumption. I found a couple of articles that described MTV as...

".... Consistent in its stronghold over those aged 13 to 24 &#8211; while touching the 12 to 17s most intimately &#8211; MTV is known worldwide as the leading youth broadcaster."

and

"MTV, its music-focused offshoot MTV2, and its online site target people 12-24 almost to the exclusion of other demographic groups. Still, MTV is a high-rated network in most other demos."

What 49 year old do you know watches "Cribs"? They don't. But their kids do and they buy for their children. Can you really count them as part of the demographic that MTV goes for?...hmmmm maybe. Probably not.


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## chicken legs (Jun 24, 2010)

vardon_grip said:


> I don't think you are far off your assumption. I found a couple of articles that described MTV as...
> 
> ".... Consistent in its stronghold over those aged 13 to 24  while touching the 12 to 17s most intimately  MTV is known worldwide as the leading youth broadcaster."
> 
> ...





We can always count on you to disagree with anything Escapist says..woot.

Care to share you source of info?


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## JenFromOC (Jun 24, 2010)

chicken legs said:


> We can always count on you to disagree with anything Escapist says..woot.
> 
> Care to share you source of info?



Escapist cut and paste the demographics from a cable website, and while interesting and informative, it isn't completely indicative of who is ACTUALLY, PHYSICALLY watching MTV. The twelve year old isn't the one who pays for the cable, therefore would not be reflected in the statistics. For instance, if my cable provider logged what channel I was watching, they would find that the majority of my usage is watching Nick Jr. Am I really watching it? Sometimes, but the truth is, I'm tuned to that station for a one year old. She doesn't pay the bill, didn't subscribe to the service, and no one from the cable company even knows she exists. My point is, I'm white, female, and have a median income of blah, blah, blah. And I'm supposedly watching Wonder Pets, Yo Gabba Gabba, and Little Bill all day long. (Ok, only on my days off lol)

My source of information is from my own common sense.


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## JenFromOC (Jun 24, 2010)

http://www.ehow.com/video_4872069_what-demographics-mtv-viewers.html

http://student.valpo.edu/kpage/comm/history.html

http://company.monster.com/mtv/

Sorry, I don't know how to make cool links and shit....these are just 3 articles I found. Also, let me clarify that this thread is now really off topic and that Escapist's original post made sense to me. I had just finished watching that episode of True Life before I logged on yesterday. And yes, it was terrible to watch. So, anyway, my point is...Escapist was right in being outraged(?) by that episode, but I wanted to say that Sasquatch and Vardon weren't too far off by stating that MTV is slated toward tweens. Which actually makes that show worse, because kids don't have the good sense to see that you shouldn't put your self worth into other people. *steps down from soap box*


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## chicken legs (Jun 25, 2010)

JenFromOC said:


> Escapist cut and paste the demographics from a cable website, and while interesting and informative, it isn't completely indicative of who is ACTUALLY, PHYSICALLY watching MTV. The twelve year old isn't the one who pays for the cable, therefore would not be reflected in the statistics. For instance, if my cable provider logged what channel I was watching, they would find that the majority of my usage is watching Nick Jr. Am I really watching it? Sometimes, but the truth is, I'm tuned to that station for a one year old. She doesn't pay the bill, didn't subscribe to the service, and no one from the cable company even knows she exists. My point is, I'm white, female, and have a median income of blah, blah, blah. And I'm supposedly watching Wonder Pets, Yo Gabba Gabba, and Little Bill all day long. (Ok, only on my days off lol)
> 
> My source of information is from my own common sense.



I'm the same age as you and I have watched MTV as well as CNN since I was a child..so the maturity level that a particular media group targets doesn't change the fact that: A. That the mini-documentary is relevant (especially on this board); B. I'm not fond of people who are constantly disagreeable; C. If you are going to disagree with the results of a study.. at least site your sources; and last but not least..D. Silky Johnson has some major competition.









What got Escapist and I peeved was that this guy's so-called "friend" was constantly being a negative dick, talking shit to other people, and even after the guy jumped threw a few hoops...his friend was still a dick. I just hope AJ doesn't consider this guy a true friend after the show. The fact is everyone on this board has had to deal with someone close to us that tries to shit on everything we do. The question is how do you deal with it? Personally, I'll hold a grudge till the afterlife..but Escapist is very forgiving.


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## JenFromOC (Jun 25, 2010)

chicken legs said:


> I'm the same age as you and I have watched MTV as well as CNN since I was a child..so the maturity level that a particular media group targets doesn't change the fact that: A. That the mini-documentary is relevant (especially on this board); B. I'm not fond of people who are constantly disagreeable; C. If you are going to disagree with the results of a study.. at least site your sources; and last but not least..D. Silky Johnson has some major competition.
> 
> 
> What got Escapist and I peeved was that this guy's so-called "friend" was constantly being a negative dick, talking shit to other people, and even after the guy jumped threw a few hoops...his friend was still a dick. I just hope AJ doesn't consider this guy a true friend after the show. The fact is everyone on this board has had to deal with someone close to us that tries to shit on everything we do. The question is how do you deal with it? Personally, I'll hold a grudge till the afterlife..but Escapist is very forgiving.



Hence, my second post....and, I don't think I'm being disagreeable. Just making small talk lol


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## chicken legs (Jun 25, 2010)

JenFromOC said:


> http://www.ehow.com/video_4872069_what-demographics-mtv-viewers.html
> 
> http://student.valpo.edu/kpage/comm/history.html
> 
> ...






Fact is ..we fall into their demographic. woot. Most people who post on this board and go to the gym will see it because it does cater to people within the 12-34 age group.


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## chicken legs (Jun 25, 2010)

JenFromOC said:


> Hence, my second post....and, I don't think I'm being disagreeable. Just making small talk lol



Okie dokie


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## JenFromOC (Jun 25, 2010)

My point is that there are actually opinions and facts floating around that you and/or Escapist didn't say/quote/post, etc. that actually matter and have some validity. 

Hard to believe, I know.


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## WillSpark (Jun 25, 2010)

JenFromOC said:


> My point is that there are actually opinions and facts floating around that you and/or Escapist didn't say/quote/post, etc. that actually matter and have some validity.
> 
> Hard to believe, I know.



And....dammit I can't rep you.


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## chicken legs (Jun 25, 2010)

JenFromOC said:


> My point is that there are actually opinions and facts floating around that you and/or Escapist didn't say/quote/post, etc. that actually matter and have some validity.
> 
> Hard to believe, I know.



Really...I did not know that people were talking mad shit...that is news to me. 
**insert sarcasm here**







If someone has personal beef.. pm me..then we can sort things out. If someone has info they feel they need to share on Escapist..once again I'm open to pm's. Following people around on a board is way more childish than anything MTV or the Disney channel will ever put out. Plus, if you think, for one second, I'm not going to stick up for a friend..you're dead wrong. So if folks want to put shit out on the open board...I'm all for it, if it will squash all this high school bullshit.


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## JenFromOC (Jun 25, 2010)

chicken legs said:


> Really...I did not know that people were talking mad shit...that is news to me.
> **insert sarcasm here**
> 
> 
> If someone has personal beef.. pm me..then we can sort things out. If someone has info they feel they need to share on Escapist..once again I'm open to pm's. Following people around on a board is way more childish than anything MTV or the Disney channel will ever put out. Plus, if you think, for one second, I'm not going to stick up for a friend..you're dead wrong. So if folks want to put shit out on the open board...I'm all for it, if it will squash all this high school bullshit.



So, disagreeing with Escapist is....what? Not allowed? Obviously you have some kind of problem with me so have at it.


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## chicken legs (Jun 25, 2010)

JenFromOC said:


> So, disagreeing with Escapist is....what? Not allowed? Obviously you have some kind of problem with me so have at it.



No I have a problem with folks being assholes to someone I'm close to...surprising isn't it.


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## chicken legs (Jun 25, 2010)

You jumped into something between Vardon Grip and I...so whats your beef?


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## JenFromOC (Jun 25, 2010)

chicken legs said:


> You jumped into something between Vardon Grip and I...so whats your beef?



I don't have a beef with anyone, so stop trying to be confrontational with me. I posted information that I thought was relevant to what Escapist posted and added my opinion on the TV show he was talking about. I still haven't received a satisfactory answer as to why I'm not allowed to post my opinion on any fucking thing I want to and any fucking time I want to.

Also, every time you respond to one of my posts....it's negative. It's all this about being disagreeable, following people on threads, not having correct information, etc. Are you talking about me or not? That would be a yes or no answer. And I will need facts and figures.


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## chicken legs (Jun 25, 2010)

JenFromOC said:


> I don't have a beef with anyone, so stop trying to be confrontational with me. I posted information that I thought was relevant to what Escapist posted and added my opinion on the TV show he was talking about. I still haven't received a satisfactory answer as to why I'm not allowed to post my opinion on any fucking thing I want to and any fucking time I want to.
> 
> Also, every time you respond to one of my posts....it's negative. It's all this about being disagreeable, following people on threads, not having correct information, etc. Are you talking about me or not? That would be a yes or no answer. And I will need facts and figures.



Holy Cow you have a short memory. Lets recap. I responded to Vardon Grip..then you quoted me and posted this...



JenFromOC said:


> Escapist cut and paste the demographics from a cable website, and while interesting and informative, it isn't completely indicative of who is ACTUALLY, PHYSICALLY watching MTV. The twelve year old isn't the one who pays for the cable, therefore would not be reflected in the statistics. For instance, if my cable provider logged what channel I was watching, they would find that the majority of my usage is watching Nick Jr. Am I really watching it? Sometimes, but the truth is, I'm tuned to that station for a one year old. She doesn't pay the bill, didn't subscribe to the service, and no one from the cable company even knows she exists. My point is, I'm white, female, and have a median income of blah, blah, blah. And I'm supposedly watching Wonder Pets, Yo Gabba Gabba, and Little Bill all day long. (Ok, only on my days off lol)
> 
> My source of information is from my own common sense.



I didn't engage you in conversation...just replying and adding my own commentary.



Now this part you could have pm'ed me..but whatever.



JenFromOC said:


> My point is that there are actually opinions and facts floating around that you and/or Escapist didn't say/quote/post, etc. that actually matter and have some validity.
> 
> Hard to believe, I know.



However, you brought it to my attention that its worst than I thought..so once again..I responded to you and whomever your gossiping with.

If you want to get in the middle of a shitfest don't complain.


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## vardon_grip (Jun 25, 2010)

chicken legs said:


> We can always count on you to disagree with anything Escapist says..woot.
> 
> Care to share you source of info?



1: I agreed with what Sasquatch posted. I quoted only Sasquatch. I found information that supported what Sasquatch said...wootever.

2: Do an extremely simple search like I did.

Does disagreeing make what I posted inaccurate? Does standing mute or agreeing make what escapist posted accurate? You can label me and others as "haters" if you need to. It relieves you from accountability. It's easier to label others as "haters"; you don't have to step back and look at yourself and the reaction that you get.


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## chicken legs (Jun 25, 2010)

vardon_grip said:


> 1: I agreed with what Sasquatch posted. I quoted only Sasquatch. I found information that supported what Sasquatch said...wootever.
> 
> 2: Do an extremely simple search like I did.
> 
> Does disagreeing make what I posted inaccurate? Does standing mute or agreeing make what escapist posted accurate? You can label me and others as "haters" if you need to. It relieves you from accountability. It's easier to label others as "haters"; you don't have to step back and look at yourself and the reaction that you get.



1. yeppers...I quoted you..only you.

2. I did a simple search and actually showed Escapist who then posted it and its link...to end the pissing contest in the first place.

3. I didn't disagree with what you posted. 

4. I didn't label anyone. However, I have heard many labels put on me..but still no pm's to clarify anything.

5. I'm free to call bullsh**t when I see it...just like you.


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## chicken legs (Jun 25, 2010)

LOL...I just got what you were talking about




vardon_grip said:


> You can label me and others as "haters" if you need to. It relieves you from accountability. It's easier to label others as "haters"; you don't have to step back and look at yourself and the reaction that you get.




Silky Johnson was a "lead in" to this paragraph....



chicken legs said:


> .
> What got Escapist and I peeved was that this guy's so-called "friend" was constantly being a negative dick, talking shit to other people, and even after the guy jumped threw a few hoops...his friend was still a dick. I just hope AJ doesn't consider this guy a true friend after the show. The fact is everyone on this board has had to deal with someone close to us that tries to shit on everything we do. The question is how do you deal with it? Personally, I'll hold a grudge till the afterlife..but Escapist is very forgiving.



I was trying to keep the thread on track, and I didn't realize you are 49.

hrmmmm


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## Vespertine (Jun 25, 2010)

Aw, this makes me so sad. He's a good looking kid! Almost all the BHM I knew in high school/college had a rough time with body image, though I don't remember anything like this kind of pressure anecdotally, though guy friends would occasionally throw a mean comment. They all did it to each other pretty equally. I'll say the friend with the parents who ridiculed his weight had a more difficult time coping with the commentary, while a bf and other friends with families who didn't do that took it more in stride and threw something back at them as I recall.

I think its horrible to feel forced to move because you're unattractive, one of the worst feelings in the world personally. Moving is joyful, activity should be celebration of life not a punishment.


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## fat hiker (Jun 25, 2010)

I think there's a nugget of good news in that storyline too - after all, he went from 277 to 255 in six weeks, then started going out, etc. Hey folks, unless he's a lot taller than he looks 255 is still pretty big - I'm sure the Surgeon General would figure he was still 'obese' or better! 

If losing a little weight gives you the confidence to start going out while remaining well into the BHM camp, I think that's good, eh what?


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## RJI (Jun 25, 2010)

vardon_grip said:


> I don't think you are far off your assumption. I found a couple of articles that described MTV as...
> 
> ".... Consistent in its stronghold over those aged 13 to 24  while touching the 12 to 17s most intimately  MTV is known worldwide as the leading youth broadcaster."
> 
> ...




When MTV was started in 1981 many of its viewers were teens and 20 somethings that are now 35-50 years old and probably still have a connection with the network. I'm 37 and remember the day it started and still watch a few things on the channel but most of it is garbage.


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## IszyStone (Jun 26, 2010)

I absolutely see the "if I lose weight I'll be more attractive to the opposite sex" thing all the time. 
One of my friends is always saying that if she'd just have some self control and lost weight guys would start liking her. In reality she's pretty average sized and I know that a lot of guys that find her attractive. They just don't approach her because she's really shy and doesn't get out much or do a lot of things. The thing is I think the image media is portraying is that if you don't look like "this" or "that" then your undesirable and it allows people to hide behind that excuse and ignore the real issues that go beyond appearance.


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## vardon_grip (Jun 26, 2010)

chicken legs said:


> 1. yeppers...I quoted you..only you.
> 
> 2. I did a simple search and actually showed Escapist who then posted it and its link...to end the pissing contest in the first place.
> 
> ...



If you don't disagree with what I posted and if the info I posted was accurate, where is the bullshit? (and for that matter, why post at all) Call bullshit whenever you want, but try to call it where it actually happens. As far as sources go, the info is out there and you can easily find it if you want. I did my homework and reported accurately. You make it seem that if I dont link the source, either I am wrong or the info is. At the very least, it gives you a completely unrelated point to argue. Go fish.

I don't PM people to clarify anything. You want clarification, melt some butter or post it in the thread like you did all your other stuff. I dont have a problem with threads taking tangents. I dont think, OMG! This will derail the thread! Relax, its just an internet forum. Another reason I dont PM is this: I got a PM from a member several months back. They sent an "apology" that was extremely insincere. (Sorry, I didnt know you were so sensitiveblah blah blah. Basically saying that they were sorry that I was the one with the problem.) If it was posted on the board, this insincere and worthless attempt at an "apology" would have been seen by others and that person would have to be accountable for it. As a follow up to the PM, the apologetic poster made a dig in the thread and proved what I knew to be true. No thanks. 

I dont know why you dont understand that you made a direct reference to haters and or hating. 



chicken legs said:


> A. That the mini-documentary is relevant (especially on this board); B. I'm not fond of people who are constantly disagreeable; C. If you are going to disagree with the results of a study.. at least site your sources; *and last but not least..D. Silky Johnson has some major competition.*



 A, B, C, and last but not least D-is all one thought. The paragraph that follows is a different thought. Just because you say it is a "lead in" doesn't make it so. It just says to me that you don't know what you are talking about. Lastly, you say that you were trying to keep the thread on track and then follow it with a comment about my age...? What does my age have to do with the thread? More proof that you don't know what you are talking about...I'm not 49.



chicken legs said:


> LOL...I just got what you were talking about
> Silky Johnson was a "lead in" to this paragraph....
> I was trying to keep the thread on track, and I didn't realize you are 49.
> hrmmmm


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## Wanderer (Jun 26, 2010)

Vardon:

In the first place, your source is a five-year-old article in Media Life Magazine. The article actually predates the split in Viacom, so it's a bit out of date. MTV's current target audience, according to the network, is 12-34 years of age. (That's a median of 23, a bit older than in 2005.)

In future, please link your own sources. Requiring your readers to investigate your sources for you is just sloppy, assuming that it is not (as some may argue) an attempt to conceal the age and quality of your research.

Secondly, if you want a public debate, support your own points. If you want to make proclamations without having to defend your statements before the "great unwashed", take it to your blog. There, you may say whatever you want, and proclaim yourself the One True Genius of the Modern Age. Here, I suggest you open the valve and let a few cubic feet of arrogance out of that ego.

Thirdly, Chicken Legs was tying the "playa hata" referenced into why she and Escapist didn't think much of the guy's "best friend", who kept up a litany of how embarassed he was to be seen with his "friend". Some "friend"; sounds more like he hangs around so he can feel superior by beating the poor guy into the ground.

Finally, CL's confusion on your position is understandable; your reference to "49-year-olds don't watch MTV" (which is factually insupportable, btw) seems to have been something of a non sequitur. As it is, your position on MTV seems as clear as the side of a battleship.

I do hope you're going to respond logically to this message. If, on the other hand, you're just going to start huffing and puffing about how I "clearly don't know what I'm talking about", and "how dare you", well, you might as well make it a blog post and spare everyone else the pain of listening to you.


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## chicken legs (Jun 26, 2010)

vardon_grip said:


> where is the bullshit?



VardonGrip was at home reading posts when he saw someone disagree with his bullshit tone. He had a simple choice to make of ignoring the post or to keep it real.

If you relate to Silky Johnson and are offended by that..then thats your problem. However, following Escapist around post, after post, after post, and then posting some lame info to make a point...that still remains unknown..made me wonder about your motive. Maybe I was wrong in sensing that douchebaggery was a foot. Probably not.


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## Paquito (Jun 26, 2010)

JenFromOC said:


> So, disagreeing with Escapist is....what? Not allowed? Obviously you have some kind of problem with me so have at it.



Now you've done it. Prepare to be called a hater and when Escapist posts about a "fan club" that always seems to follow him around, he'll be talking about you too.


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## chicken legs (Jun 26, 2010)

Paquito said:


> Now you've done it. Prepare to be called a hater and when Escapist posts about a "fan club" that always seems to follow him around, he'll be talking about you too.


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## seasuperchub84 (Jun 27, 2010)

I know this is gonna sound stupid, but the best way I deal with this is to try to put on my ignore button to it all. I also know what situations to stay out of. Examples are: Dont watch MTV, cause it sucks. Dont watch the biggest loser because its all anti fat rhetoric. Don't go to the gym because most of the people there think like that.

Youve gotta examine what situations to look at and when to stay out of them. If you need to exercise, get a home gym, put on some damn music and do your thing. Ignore the magazines....I actually laugh at them and think, omg if I was in Africa, trapped in a cave, your ass would be dead already. Its all about self positivity. Keep in mind that people do like you fat and they are out there, refuse to change to the mainstream. I know normally young people want to be with the in crowd, however for myself I find it much rewarding to be with people I am A: Attracted to sexually and mentally. B. Since fatter people tend to be older, the older crowd is more my thing, they are smarter and more insightful.

I guess what I am saying, dont just refuse to give into the pressure, laugh at it. The best way to insult someone is to totally block the things they are saying to you, and the best way to do this is with laughter or simply ignoring them. Also, if your a gainer/maintainer like me (which I realize most of you are not) translate the situation into food consumption. If they dont like me fat, they will really hate me now after this donut. It gives me great joy in knowing I can piss people off by simply just eating, existing and being overly positive about being obese.

Then again I have 25 years of experience with this, so Im not sure if its just me lol. Ive learned to translate these signals a LONG time ago. Just remember, the only true reason to lose weight is if you get a medical problem that requires it. As long as your healthy, or medically your okay taking medications, then it doesnt require it. Screw society, the only person listening to you is really you. Everyone else is too consumed in there own little worlds to care.

And for people that say big boys don't get it sexually, I have at least 10 people off the top of my head that want to be with me or I have been with (yes I use protection). I also have a wonderful partner of 3 years who I married last year. I have tons of people who message me admiring my pictures online and liking my bigness. Sometimes I don't know how to keep them all at bay LOL. Im not bragging Im just giving you examples.


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## chicken legs (Jun 27, 2010)

edit...............


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## Surlysomething (Jun 27, 2010)

Another thread that needs to be put out of it's misery.

:|


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## escapist (Jun 27, 2010)

*seasuperchub84 *- Thanks, the Ignore button is an option for sure. I just got back from camping and realized (again) how hard real life cardio is. I'm a fan of both methods of exercise (Gym/Home-Gym). The treadmill has been a great way to get a lower impact high cardio workout. I love the workout pools and the sauna/hot-tubs for recovery. Things I just can't get at home. I might have been a little self-conscious at first, but a lot of that went away when it was soon obvious I was hardly the only one working off a few extra lbs. I've even made a few new friends there and for the most part everybody is cool.

For those who are keeping the thread on-tack and posting their real life experiences, Thank you. I know it can be a touchy subject when those you care about and love can't accept you as you are. Now that I've had some time away around family and love ones I think I would have made my original post a bit more broad in scope. I know many FA/FFA's have a lot of thoughts on the subject of their friends and family's pressuring the ones they love so they can "Fit IN" too. I'd love to hear them speak up. How have you dealt with it? What has worked? What hasn't worked? How would you deal with it if it comes up in the future?


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## Wanderer (Jun 27, 2010)

I get off easy; my family is pretty sure I'm crazy for wanting to be fatter than I am, but they have no real problem with it.  Same applies to my RL friends; it just doesn't compute for them that I like being soft and heavy, and want more of it. But at least they don't have an actual problem with it.


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## seasuperchub84 (Jun 27, 2010)

chicken legs said:


> edit...............



lol me being paranoid...did i say something wrong?


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## escapist (Jun 27, 2010)

seasuperchub84 said:


> lol me being paranoid...did i say something wrong?



lol no I tried to reply to you but she was using my system.


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## Paquito (Jun 27, 2010)

So I saw a different True Life episode today, which basically involved the same story, just with a girl instead of a guy. And her friends were just as rude as his. 

We could easily change this title to "Young People & The Preasure to be smaller."


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## JenFromOC (Jun 28, 2010)

I don't even know if this belongs in this thread but I'm wondering how much of this pressure on young people to be smaller and whatever has to do with where they live, their attitude, the people they hang out with, etc. Sounds basic enough, but for example, I was pretty chubby in elementary school and junior high. Even in high school, I wasn't really overweight, but definitely not thin enough to be what most superficial high school boys would go after. Even then, I had lots of friends, boys gave me lots of attention, etc. I don't remember ever feeling self conscious and not one memory of anyone ever making fun of me. Maybe they did it behind my back LOL...but young kids aren't that smart or subtle. 

My brother and sister were very overweight, and when we discuss it, their experiences were much the same. The exception is that they didn't have the attention from the opposite sex (I just attribute this to my natural tendency to flirt with everyone lol), but were never ridiculed for their weight. My bro would die if he knew I ever posted this, but he weighed almost 300lbs his senior year of high school, was the ASB President and probably the most popular boy in school. 

We grew up in Orange County, CA (probably one of the most superficial places you could live) but my mom raised us to have confidence. Our weight wasn't a huge issue at home. This is way too much information, and definitely more than I ever share, but I guess my point is, I don't have terrible memories of being overweight and never felt pressure to be smaller. So my question is, how much of it is how you allow people to treat you?


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## escapist (Jun 28, 2010)

Paquito said:


> So I saw a different True Life episode today, which basically involved the same story, just with a girl instead of a guy. And her friends were just as rude as his.
> 
> We could easily change this title to "Young People & The Preasure to be smaller."



Yeah I agree the Title wasn't exactly correct even for my main topic



escapist said:


> I worry that other chubby guys(even girls) watch this show and go oh yep I'm to fat to be loved. There is no problem with gaining a little fitness or doing it cause you know its right, but to me its a whole other issue when you do it just to fit in, or be liked by your "friends".
> 
> Whats your guys(and girls) take on shows like this or even just people around you who do this?



The show with the BHM was still burning in my head when I posted it thats all.


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## escapist (Jun 28, 2010)

JenFromOC said:


> I don't even know if this belongs in this thread but I'm wondering how much of this pressure on young people to be smaller and whatever has to do with where they live, their attitude, the people they hang out with, etc. Sounds basic enough, but for example, I was pretty chubby in elementary school and junior high. Even in high school, I wasn't really overweight, but definitely not thin enough to be what most superficial high school boys would go after. Even then, I had lots of friends, boys gave me lots of attention, etc. I don't remember ever feeling self conscious and not one memory of anyone ever making fun of me. Maybe they did it behind my back LOL...but young kids aren't that smart or subtle.
> 
> My brother and sister were very overweight, and when we discuss it, their experiences were much the same. The exception is that they didn't have the attention from the opposite sex (I just attribute this to my natural tendency to flirt with everyone lol), but were never ridiculed for their weight. My bro would die if he knew I ever posted this, but he weighed almost 300lbs his senior year of high school, was the ASB President and probably the most popular boy in school.
> 
> We grew up in Orange County, CA (probably one of the most superficial places you could live) but my mom raised us to have confidence. Our weight wasn't a huge issue at home. This is way too much information, and definitely more than I ever share, but I guess my point is, I don't have terrible memories of being overweight and never felt pressure to be smaller. So my question is, how much of it is how you allow people to treat you?



All good points. I think the "allow" part is a big part of it. Even when you don't allow it, it still sucks to hear; even if you can't do anything about it.


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## seasuperchub84 (Jun 28, 2010)

Oh okay, thanks escapist. Im like crap who did i piss off now...lol....

Yeah you just gotta be yourself. If you feel like losing weight then go for it, if you feel like gaining go for it, if you feel like maintaining, go for it. Just dont let anyone else make your decisions for you. I guess im fortunate enough I dont understand social pressures, in high school I really just did my thing. No one interfered. Plus I was gay. This combo of fat and gay might seem like so horrible to everyone and like I had social suicide, but I kind of ignored everyone....

I think back in the day, life at school had a more powerful effect. However now that we have the internet, phones, mailing lists, magazines....we can connect in so many ways.


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## vardon_grip (Jun 29, 2010)

Wanderer said:


> Vardon:
> 
> In the first place, your source is a five-year-old article in Media Life Magazine. The article actually predates the split in Viacom, so it's a bit out of date. MTV's current target audience, according to the network, is 12-34 years of age. (That's a median of 23, a bit older than in 2005.)
> 
> ...


 
Here's what I feel is relevant: A poster (Sasquatch) mused that MTV aims their programming at 12 year olds. The OP felt he needed to take his own thread off-"tack" [sic] and cited a source to contradict Sasquatch. You and I found similar (and better-Wall Street Journalwoot!) sources that support the claim that MTV aims their programming at 12 year olds. (In the process, you also confirm that the source escapist used to contradict Sasquatch is inaccurate. Thanks for the assist!) 

_What does all of this have to do with the thread? Good question. I have no idea. I have no idea why the OP felt he needed to single out and incorrectly contradict an innocent comment by another poster. _

If I had seen the WSJ article that you found, I would have included it with my earlier post. Good find! You don't mention that the OP's source is also a little dated and from an ad sales company making it a dubious source at best. (I find it strange that the OP didnt find or cite the sources that you, I and others found) You also didn't compare the sizable difference in your WSJ numbers to the OP's numbers. Is that sloppiness or just bias? Its possible that it wasn't important for you or fit in making your point. I can completely understand that notion. 

You think that the article I quoted from is a little dated, (which is true) but the article you cite is right in line with what I confirmed about 12 year old MTV viewers. That says to me that the info is relevant before AND after the Viacom split (IF that means anything about anything is another debate titled: Do MTV viewers give a ratsass or even noticed that CBS split from Viacom and what the hell does that have to do with the demos?) and has been consistent for many years. More win for meI mean, us! Thanks for your help in keeping it tidy. 

My replies to Chicken took into account her combative posts to myself and others who have disagreed with her BF. Quite simply, when she asked for a link, I did not feel like cooperating with her. It doesn't bother me that you think not providing a link is sloppy. I dont mind linking information, but doing it to make the antagonistic (Bitch Please Rimjob.jpgs-e.g.) GF of the OP happy...isn't something that inspires me. 

You put yourself in parts of a conversation and you make references about what I wrote, but dont acknowledge that my comments were directed at a very specific audience. (FYI-You and 99.9% of Dims were not a part of that audience) So yes, as far as that goes, you dont know what you are talking about. I dont care if you respond to this post (Logically or not) and I'm sorry about your pain. Get well soon.


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## escapist (Jun 29, 2010)

seasuperchub84 said:


> Oh okay, thanks escapist. Im like crap who did i piss off now...lol....
> 
> Yeah you just gotta be yourself. If you feel like losing weight then go for it, if you feel like gaining go for it, if you feel like maintaining, go for it. Just dont let anyone else make your decisions for you. I guess im fortunate enough I dont understand social pressures, in high school I really just did my thing. No one interfered. Plus I was gay. This combo of fat and gay might seem like so horrible to everyone and like I had social suicide, but I kind of ignored everyone....
> 
> I think back in the day, life at school had a more powerful effect. However now that we have the internet, phones, mailing lists, magazines....we can connect in so many ways.



heheh not a problem. I agree but you and I are certainly older now. Its a lot easier to see and feel those things. I fit in cause I was huge and on the football team. I wasn't nearly as popular or "in" before I got into sports. I think for the young BHM's (some just getting out of high school) a lot of those pressures are still there. Before my "sports era" I just stuck with my friends who didn't judge me like that.


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## seasuperchub84 (Jun 29, 2010)

I think also it could be slightly different for me because I was gay, I just kinda assumed I wouldnt fit in anywhere, so I didnt really try. 

Im just glad theres all these resources available for youth. We really need to get more out about being big and being positive about it.


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## Wanderer (Jun 29, 2010)

vardon_grip said:


> You put yourself in parts of a conversation and you make references about what I wrote, but dont acknowledge that my comments were directed at a very specific audience. (FYI-You and 99.9% of Dims were not a part of that audience) So yes, as far as that goes, you dont know what you are talking about. I dont care if you respond to this post (Logically or not) and I'm sorry about your pain. Get well soon.



If your audience is that specific, use a PM. If you instead float your message around on a dirigible, pray do not act surprised when others fire their own salvos. Fora are for mass communications; they are as closely targeted as buckshot, with a spread out to missile range. But since you apparently feel that private messages would be an untenable restriction upon the exhibit of your creative prose...

In any event, when you so blatantly missed the explanation of the reference to that "playa hata", I figured you could use a bit more information. Likewise, while MTV's _bottom_ age is 12, most of their shows are skewed toward Mature audiences; from my listing alone, we have a show about a not-quite-suicide, a cartoon so racy it now airs in the death slot of half-past-midnight, and an attempted revamp of failed series "Greg the Bunny".

Finally, Escapist's information is substantially correct, as it is paid to be; when you sell ad space, you need to know which products go where. There's a reason most Viagra ads air so late, you know. (And if you like "Smiling Bob", you can have him.)


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## vardon_grip (Jun 29, 2010)

Wanderer said:


> If your audience is that specific, use a PM. If you instead float your message around on a dirigible, pray do not act surprised when others fire their own salvos. Fora are for mass communications; they are as closely targeted as buckshot, with a spread out to missile range. But since you apparently feel that private messages would be an untenable restriction upon the exhibit of your creative prose...
> 
> In any event, when you so blatantly missed the explanation of the reference to that "playa hata", I figured you could use a bit more information. Likewise, while MTV's _bottom_ age is 12, most of their shows are skewed toward Mature audiences; from my listing alone, we have a show about a not-quite-suicide, a cartoon so racy it now airs in the death slot of half-past-midnight, and an attempted revamp of failed series "Greg the Bunny".
> 
> Finally, Escapist's information is substantially correct, as it is paid to be; when you sell ad space, you need to know which products go where. There's a reason most Viagra ads air so late, you know. (And if you like "Smiling Bob", you can have him.)



If your/my response isn't specific...why would you ever use the quote function on the boards? It would be really weird to see read a board filled with topic headings with no responses to read because of your "PM rule". There are bunches of people PMing you and me about this right now? Sorry, I didn't get that memo. I better clear out some box space. I don't see you or any cohorts restraining yourselves from putting up any and all kinds of stupidity on the boards. Why put the onus on me to use PM's?  I don't care to communicate by PM with people I don't know. I can't stop anyone from doing what they preach and I don't block PM's. (I don't know if that is possible) Before I posted my feelings on PM's, your friend Chicken didn't PM me for her precious "clarification". Did you chastise her about it? Something tells me that you didn't. I also don't see you saying anything about the plethora of idiotic, cry-baby-bullshit pictures Chicken has spewed all over this thread and others. You guys don't care to put your own advice to use do you? I probably wouldn't respond to your PM, but it warms the heart to know that you didn't even try!

As for the other points of this lovely back and forth...I think you're wrong. Yes, yes, yes, I get that you feel the same. 

This is what it all boils down to:
Do you feel that Sasquatch's comment about 12 yr.olds and MTV was wrong? 
Was what Sasquatch commented on was so wrong or important to keeping the thread "on-tack" [sic] that the OP needed to single his post out and correct him?

(A follow up question could be: Did you PM escapist and/or chicken and tell them that they should PM Sasquatch and correct him in a PM and not in the thread?)

My opinion is: No. No. And Hell-to-the-NO.


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## escapist (Jun 29, 2010)

escapist said:


> Yeah my question wasn't so much about MTV, I think your right though, finding acceptance with self then making a choice to change is probably the way to go.



The banter about MTV is a bit unnecessary. _*Right or wrong I think we can agree that the show itself was targeted to younger people undergoing social pressures to conform physically with the wishes of their, "Friends"*_ :doh:. Perhaps some of it was also aimed at us older folks who grew up seemingly watching MTV all our lives and are now in our 30-40's (It was on about 30% of the TV's at the Gym where I saw it)....I just don't know I'm not an MTV exec who schedules it, all I have is what market research has been done on it by cable advertising companies.

....And Back to the Main topic:

Any way around it I certainly felt moved to voice my opinion on such to others. There are of course young BHM's in my family; the topic came up a few times this weekend while I was away. I hate to imagine people I love and care about feeling ashamed to enjoy themselves on a hot sumer day swimming about in the water because a friend or family member looked down on them for their weight. 

I could be wrong, TV shows are famous for "Slanting" what we see. Perhaps his friend really cared and didn't know how to approach the subject of his buddy being over weight from a standpoint of caring. In the past I know the only times I ever made any lasting changes are when I made them for myself not for others.


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## BLUEeyedBanshee (Jun 29, 2010)

While all the discussion of MTV's target audience is/can be interesting, please let's try to keep the thread on topic.

Thanks!

/mod


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## bigpulve (Jul 1, 2010)

As the biggest kid from 3rd grade till high school, then being one of the biggest, I guess I got a lot of flake from kids. Just as a lot of people do. One thing that I pride myself on, is my actual love, yes love, to exercise. Its an addiction almost. If I go more then a day without it I get irritable and cant wait to get back. Part of its probably the seretonin and dopamine I get, but Ive been doing it for a long time so im probably used to it. 

And Ive noticed in my own personal experience, being short and fat is harder. Ive known guys even as little as 3-4 inches taller then my 5'6 that dont have as many issues from people. Its the tall + fat always = football player, but short and fat just equals fat even though I am just as strong and do just as much as my foot taller counterparts. 

Plus my brother being a nutrition freak, mother who daily talks about what she needs to do to lose weight, then doesnt do anything doesnt help.


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## escapist (Jul 1, 2010)

*bigpulve* - Good point, I'm sure hight is a factor. It seems once I got over 6 foot the 'noise' and tauntings did die down. Nobody even said anything when 2 other Linemen had to Squat me so I could do pull-ups with the rest of the football team, and when I was the last man on the field still running laps, 2 of the other bigger guys came back out and finished the lap off with me. If anything I got a ton of support.

(like you I think this is where my addiction for working out started...it really can be a serious high)


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