# Mid sized bbws, marginalized by FAs



## rollhandler (Apr 12, 2009)

Ive been tossing the idea around about a gripe I have in relation to how I see women getting treated around this site and not only whether or not to say something about it, but HOW to get my point across concisely and in the spirit that it is meant. I am hurt, I am pissed, I am ashamed at times here in Dimensions. 

I chat with a number of fat women. A few have been concerned and one in particular has come straight out and asked if she even belonged here because she simply felt as if she was "in between both worlds" and expressed concern that she just didn't fit in here because she didn't feel as if she was fat enough.

As a newbie here she was flattered by all the attention and appalled by how rude the chatters were by their personal questions in 30 seconds of chat.
The thing that got her attention most of all though was that at her weight and size (230-270) range, it seemed that everyone she encountered pressed her to gain. She honestly felt out of step with size acceptance because she felt that she was too fat to be found attractive by those who liked thin women and NOT FAT ENOUGH to be admired by those who found fat girls sexy.

All in all SHE DID NOT FEEL ACCEPTED HERE as a fully fledged fat girl. She is also not the only one I've heard this from just the most recent and therefore the freshest conversation on my mind at the moment.

She asked me "I feel so marginalized, aren't I fat enough to be sexy to an FA, why cant they just be satisfied with ME without the pressure to gain?"

I understand that a large part of the online communities is about fantasy. I understand that men especially will say things to a woman online that they wouldnt dare say if the woman were within slapping distance of them. 

Why would any FA treat women, that they admire, in this manner is what I don't get. It is no mystery to me that we men are perceived in return by women as nasty pigs and pervs, looked at with suspicion for any attention we offer, no matter now platonic, if this is any representation of what is being presented to them anywhere but most especially in a community where acceptance at any size is supposed to be the norm. 

This chatter has been around for only a couple of weeks and has made mention to me that she is considering never coming back since this has been a consistant and constant thing without anyone treating her as anything more than a piece of meat that just isnt good enough as she is. Beautiful yes, but never good enough, never big enough.

I have told her that the troll community is out there and is almost a rite of passage for women to control them on her own terms. My gripe is that she shouldnt have to battle her way through the dregs HERE at dims to make it to a place where she can feel accepted and admired. 

She is an incredibly beautiful and passionate woman. She is also a fully realized Foodee that I have had the exhillirating experience to have met and talked with. I am the only representitive of an FA that has treated her with the respect she so richly deserves as both a woman and a woman of size. This is from her own mouth paraphrased by me here. As the First FA she has met that she knows of. I am the reason she comes here.

The women we admire have a hard enough time with an outside world telling them they simply aren't good enough, without being told that from those who claim to accept and admire them.


Rollhandler


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## Mini (Apr 12, 2009)

I'll just come right out and say it: Some of the men here are clueless, feckless assholes. They know who they are, and they can fucking take it up with me if they wish to.

I do not know to whom you refer, but let me say that EVERYONE is welcome here, and I hope you don't let these twats scare you off from what is otherwise a wonderful, supportive community.


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## Carrie (Apr 12, 2009)

Mini said:


> I'll just come right out and say it: Some of the men here are clueless, feckless assholes. They know who they are, and they can fucking take it up with me if they wish to.
> 
> I do not know to whom you refer, but let me say that EVERYONE is welcome here, and I hope you don't let these twats scare you off from what is otherwise a wonderful, supportive community.


Word. And if she's relatively new to this world, she will learn pretty quickly how to separate the metaphorical wheat from the chaff, in terms of people worth her time and energy. There are plenty of quality, open-minded, accepting people here - people who are interested in her as a person, not just as a set of numbers. She just needs to refine her screening skills, that's all. It'll come. 

If it helps at all, I also think every size range here feels marginalized at one point or another, for various reasons. She's not alone. 

Welcome, whomever she is.


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## Green Eyed Fairy (Apr 12, 2009)

rollhandler said:


> Ive been tossing the idea around about a gripe I have in relation to how I see women getting treated around this site and not only whether or not to say something about it, but HOW to get my point across concisely and in the spirit that it is meant. I am hurt, I am pissed, I am ashamed at times here in Dimensions.
> 
> I chat with a number of fat women. A few have been concerned and one in particular has come straight out and asked if she even belonged here because she simply felt as if she was "in between both worlds" and expressed concern that she just didn't fit in here because she didn't feel as if she was fat enough.
> 
> ...



First, I want to thank you. What you say...it is true. I have felt this way many times...not just by the chat (that I seldom go to anymore) but by some of the posts. Even a couple that made it to my YIM list overstepped the boundary, growing angry when I wouldn't say that I "PURPOSELY GAINED AND OMG I AM SO GLAD THAT I DID!!!- YAY! SUPERSIZE ME!"
I have an eating disorder/food addiction that I have spent years recovering from, very low self esteem issues that haunted a lot of my past life choices and just generally hated how I looked and being fat. 

Coming to Fatopia- the other side of the coin. Wow......fat people can actually be sexy here. Who knew? Just......that bigger is better for some.
Nothing wrong with a person having a preference. If a man prefers a woman larger...or smaller, than myself, I can live with that part. Just don't invade my personal zone with your shit about how I need to gain weight and be happy about it. IT'S EXACTLY THE SAME AS THE ASSHOLES THAT TELL ME I AM TOO FUCKING FAT AND HOW MY LIFE WOULD MAGICALLY TRANSPIRE INTO UTOPIA IF I LOST 150 POUNDS!

Sometimes, "time away" does help. But what about the noobs? This is why I want a BBW forum....free from those people telling a BBW that a man wanting to pork her "should be enough" to transport her to instant happiness with herself and her life. Or free from feeling as you described.....she should be able to mold HERSELF here.....not be molded by what others want her to be.

My time here has been an aid to help me work through some of my past issues.....that and much "self help". I finally feel like I am able to start calling myself "recovered". 
I think the community of Dimensions can sometimes "help people" with similar issues. Some things you take from it....other things you leave. 

A woman does have to learn how to tread water here, at times. The other women here....they have helped me in some ways. I have always been impressed by many of them. 

The guys? I have met some good guys here, too. Not all guys here act like you described...though many do. 

P.S. I have something that I automatically do from now on. Whenever a man on the net feels like it's his right to ask me, as a woman he just met aka does not know, for my weight, sizes, bra size, etc......I feel like I have the same right to ask for his penis size accompanied by pictures. I don't just do this at Dims....I ran some asshole off on a dating site with this tactic....after he first tried to laugh it off and ask for my bra size again.......:doh:

Chip on my shoulder now? Yeah, I got one. Care to be the fool that knocks it off?  


Edit: Oh and Carrie is correct about all groups can feel marginalized here. I have seen some of the SSBBW feeling offended in threads where men callously say things about them. Yeah, some people are just insensitive assholes who think they can say whatever they want on the internet without consequence.


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## Melian (Apr 12, 2009)

Some of the "medium" BHMs seem to feel the same way. I have sympathy for them (although, I personally am attracted to all sizes of BHM).


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## Green Eyed Fairy (Apr 12, 2009)

Melian said:


> Some of the "medium" BHMs seem to feel the same way. I have sympathy for them (although, I personally am attracted to all sizes of BHM).



Correct....I have seen that on the BHM board, as well.


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## Sugar (Apr 12, 2009)

As a mid-sized bbw I've never been pressured to gain nor do I feel marginalized. 

Clearly I don't have first hand knowledge of the conversations she has shared with other people, but if you set the tempo with someone they rarely deviate in a way that would be disrespectful. The ones that do are a part of life...there are jerks in all walks of life. 

All that being said I hope that she's chosen to have conversations with women around here as well. A lot of us are pretty awesome.


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## Violet_Beauregard (Apr 12, 2009)

I tend to agree with GEF. It's happened to me as well. As a BBW in the 240 lb. range, I have definitely been made to feel that I'm too small and couldn't possibly understand the issues faced by "real" BBWs. A year or so ago I inquired about a spot on a couple of multi-girl paysites, and was told by both that I was not big enough.  Needless to say, I was shocked.

I've met a couple of FA's from the boards in person, and while they're great guys, they are constantly encouraging me to eat and gain. I've told them time and again that I have NO desire to gain or get bigger, but it falls on deaf ears. As I say, they're great guys and I'll forever be friends with them, but it's frustrating when that is a topic of conversation every single time I talk to them. I'm happy to be dating a guy now who thinks I'm terrific exactly how I am. It's not about too big or too small... it's not about my size... it's about ME... he loves me for ME.


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## kittencat (Apr 12, 2009)

yeah i have been on Dims since around January not very long,and i had been wondering the same thing.It turns out that i got messages from men and Pm's in chat even.Saying that i was small and that i needed to be fattened up.That i didnt really even look large.ect.It can be a bit off setting.Especially when your new to the forumn.I thought for a while that i simply wansnt big enough to be here or something.But anywho im a mid sized BBW and it is rad i tell you..Just RAD!

please do nto Pm me anymore asking if you can fatten me up but feeding my cheescake ect. im perfectly content ty.

whew yay for venting!


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## elle camino (Apr 12, 2009)

yep, occupying the fatty hinterland sucks. well, correction: it sucks in certain ways. 
i have a few other (way more incisive) observations on the subject but they're bound to piss SOMEone off, so i'll leave it at that.

edit: i will add that i've never been nagged to gain or anything, but i think that's pretty much because i don't chat.


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## Mini (Apr 12, 2009)

elle camino said:


> yep, occupying the fatty hinterland sucks. well, correction: it sucks in certain ways.
> i have a few other (way more incisive) observations on the subject but they're bound to piss SOMEone off, so i'll leave it at that.



Hey elle, I'm not a moderator, but I do believe that you're allowed to express unpopular opinions here. Please elaborate if you feel it might provide some insight.


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## elle camino (Apr 12, 2009)

if i thought it would, i would. 
i think anyone to whom the topic personally applies doesn't need it all spelled out, really. people are going to like what they like, can't change that and wouldn't want to. and i'm happy that the rad SS ladytypes i've met around here have a place like this to come and be unequivocally celebrated. but dims is just not really a place for a midsize (whatever) fat girl, unless you do like some of us have and just shoehorn yourself in out of boredom.


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## Carrie (Apr 12, 2009)

elle camino said:


> if i thought it would, i would.
> i think anyone to whom the topic personally applies doesn't need it all spelled out, really. people are going to like what they like, can't change that and wouldn't want to. and i'm happy that the rad SS ladytypes i've met around here have a place like this to come and be unequivocally celebrated. but dims is just not really a place for a midsize (whatever) fat girl, unless you do like some of us have and just shoehorn yourself in out of boredom.


See, I think it's all a matter of perspective, as are most things. If the goal is to amass as many idiotic, drooling pm's asking for body stats from anonymous mostly lurkers, then yep, super-sized is the way to go here. But if we're talking about feedback on posts, on photos, etc., I can honestly say that I see no difference in regards to a person's size. Like I said, I think everyone can feel marginalized here. It _really_ sucks that the mid-sized fatties get the jackass comments about how they'd look better fatter, and I cringe when I read them. For the super-sized fatties, we may get fewer of that kind of junk, but as GEF correctly pointed out, we have the innate pleasure of reading the "how fat is too fat" kinds of threads where people express their concerns about and even revulsion for actually *gasp* dating someone as large as we are. Not fun. So like I said, I think there probably exist equal opportunities for feeling marginalized here - and in the world in general, for that matter.

(and Mini's right, don't you dare censor yourself, missy. Your insight and candor are invaluable to me, even when I happen to disagree!).


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## olwen (Apr 12, 2009)

I don't chat much, but from chatting on dating sites in the past, the behavior is often the same. They want to reduce you to a set of numbers and then tell you how hot you'd be if you gained weight and I weigh more than 300lbs. I don't think that is specific to Dims, but Carrie is right, on any internet forum or dating site you have to learn to separate the jerks from the sincere guys.

I think to anyone who does feel marginalized, they should just make a place for themselves and fuck the haters. It's what I would do. I realize that might be difficult for some, but that's the best advice I can offer on the subject. Just being fat in the wider world amounts to the same thing - making a place for yourself despite the obstacles. 

In any event, I hope she sticks around. Adding her voice to the chorus just makes for a richer tone.


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## Violet_Beauregard (Apr 12, 2009)

I agree Olwen.... when it's happened to me... I try to just go with the flow and not make a big deal out of it. It can be frustrating though, but this is just one place in my world, it's not my whole world. 



olwen said:


> I think to anyone who does feel marginalized, they should just make a place for themselves and fuck the haters. It's what I would do.


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## rollhandler (Apr 12, 2009)

Melian said:


> Some of the "medium" BHMs seem to feel the same way. I have sympathy for them (although, I personally am attracted to all sizes of BHM).



To correct myself, I had no intent of leaving the BHMs out in my example. I only used the BBWs as my example simply because I rarely have instance to correspond to BHMs. Not my choice just the way it ends up being. That and the fact that I made probably a wrongminded assumption that the guys here were better treated as BHMs than the women were as BBWs simply by the nature that women are usually more sensitive than men in dealing with the opposite genders. I also didnt mention the glbtq sector due to no basis of understanding but they probably have similar issues as well.
I however addressed the point of reference that I have which is the men treating women poorly because it is probably the largest instance that I come into contact with.

Thank you all for your input on this issue, if nothing else those marginalized will read the post and responses and find out a few names that they can chat with that would be more indicative of the reason I love this place so much.
Rollhandler


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## rollhandler (Apr 12, 2009)

elle camino said:


> yep, occupying the fatty hinterland sucks. well, correction: it sucks in certain ways.
> i have a few other (way more incisive) observations on the subject but they're bound to piss SOMEone off, so i'll leave it at that.
> 
> edit: i will add that i've never been nagged to gain or anything, but i think that's pretty much because i don't chat.



Please feel free to post your opinions on the subject and be proud to have one. They don't have to be popular, nor do you need to apologize for them. They are yours and are valid for YOUR reasons.

The only thing I ask is that they be ON topic please. If you cant rant and vent here what good are your gripes? If you do vent and rant here, someone else MAY possibly learn from them.
Rollhandler


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## elle camino (Apr 12, 2009)

Violet_Beauregard said:


> this is just one place in my world, it's not my whole world.


at the end of the day: this. exactly.


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## Dism4l (Apr 12, 2009)

Great observations, everyone.

Personally I have asked someone to gain, but I only do this in a relationship where I have already encouraged the other person to tell me what things they would like me to do for them. Therefore I believe gain or loss of weight in a relationship is acceptable if it is duly reciprocated.

Outside of a relationship, this kind of encouragement could be accepted as long as it was given in response to a weight-related health problem or complication involving performance in a physical activity.

However in my opinion, encouraging someone else to gain (or lose) otherwise is absolutely unacceptable.

Unfortunately issues analogous to this one exist elsewhere in the broader scope of society, and I'm not sure to what extent it can be suppressed or eliminated.


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## exile in thighville (Apr 12, 2009)

all i can say is that watch your word choice. there's a huge difference between expressing a personal preference and telling someone they're "too small." or too big for that matter. you're certainly not obligated to like someone's size that you don't, but be sure to make it as PERSONAL as possible and not use all-inclusive terms. they're not _too_ anything. you're too stupid.


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## Dism4l (Apr 13, 2009)

exile in thighville said:


> there's a huge difference between expressing a personal preference and telling someone they're "too small." or too big for that matter.



This brings up another important consideration: what about the perspective of these individuals making the comments? Surely, the commenters' remarks seem pejorative to the BBW, but are they necessarily malevolent in their intent?

Personally, when I make a request involving a change in someone else, I usually offer reciprocation of equivalent magnitude. It is a statement of preference meant to improve my relationship with the other person by allowing the other person to understand more about me and change in a way that suits me, while I do likewise for them.

Perhaps these commenters are operating on a similar system? I know that sounds like I'm pinning the label on myself, and to some extent that is true. However, as I see it, in this scenario the relationship between the mid sized BBW and the commenters is manifest as the offering of increased status (praise, acceptance, etc.) in exchange for weight gain. This is different from my system, where both parties receive increased status as a result of the primary exchange.

Therefore I believe that it is a matter of the commenters not offering due equivalent reciprocation that is offensive. This situation is exactly the same in nature as how BBWs in larger society are expected to slim down in order to improve their sexual attractiveness.

Nothing too original here, but I just wanted to run through the logic from my perspective.


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## Fascinita (Apr 13, 2009)

Dism4l said:


> This brings up another important consideration: what about the perspective of these individuals making the comments? Surely, the commenters' remarks seem pejorative to the BBW, but are they necessarily malevolent in their intent?
> 
> Personally, when I make a request involving a change in someone else, I usually offer reciprocation of equivalent magnitude.* It is a statement of preference meant to improve my relationship with the other person by allowing the other person to understand more about me and change in a way that suits me, while I do likewise for them.
> *



We're talking about comments made by strangers or near-strangers. There's no way it's appropriate to suggest that someone gain or lose weight in those circumstances--not in chat, not via PM, not while you're standing in line at the deli. It only adds to the pressure to look one way or another. Having fantasies and preferences is fine. But please wait to express those until there is, in fact, a more personal relationship; and then be prepared to respect the other person's boundaries. In the end, weight gain and weight loss are purely personal choices.

The fact that fat people hang out at Dimensions doesn't mean we're looking to entertain every last T, D & H's fantasy. If you wouldn't approach a BBW or BHM IRL and blurt out your fantasies to them while you wait in line at the grocery store, don't do it online. It's not a free for all just because you may never have to meet the person you're talking to face-to-face.


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## succubus_dxb (Apr 13, 2009)

As a 'mid-size BBW' or 'plumper' or whatever the hell else I've been called.... YES I can certainly relate to this post. 

Not only with men though, but with some of the women on the boards too. The occasional "oh honey, you don't even have a fat ass" sort of comment hurts - maybe I WANT to acknowledge that I have a fat ass.... 

I have no desire to gain weight, neither am I particularly interested in losing any, which seems to confuse people- as if I'm floating in some sort of Fatty Purgatory- I've got to chose which 'side' to cross over to. 

Too fat to be thin
Too thin to be fat


I like my big butt, and I cannot lie. :bow:


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## Ample Pie (Apr 13, 2009)

Saying that SS people get "unequivocal celebration" is 1: incorrect and 2: another way to encourage the whole us v. them attitude.

I totally can see that Mid-Sized BBWs would get the "you should be fatter" bs thrown at them. I get it and I'm SS, so of course they get it and it's tacky and I'm sorry.

But Dims isn't a "you're perfect just the way you are" parade for the SS people either.

I guess because the world and the people in it aren't perfect and there are assholes everywhere.

At the end of the day, I try to walk away from Dims with the positives and leave the negatives.


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## JMNYC (Apr 13, 2009)

Anyone who tells anyone they should or shouldn't do something isn't someone I want to know, unless it's "Don't hit that tree!" while we're driving, or "Ya know, that milk expired 3 weeks ago---maybe you shouldn't use it." I hereby throw a blanket of apology on behalf of louts urging women to gain or lose.


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## JMNYC (Apr 13, 2009)

Funny thing, too...I was at a business gathering on Wed. and met a PR guy I'd only talked to on the phone over the last year.

"I thought you'd be bigger!" he said. Second time I've heard that.

What am I supposed to do with that?

Say, "I thought you'd have more hair!"

I told him, "God gave me talent, then said, 'Ok, that's enough for you." It was the best I could think of in a split second.

I think if ya want a supersized person and you meet someone who's midsize, go on the net and look at a SSBBW, and leave the real, live girls alone why don'tcha.


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## William (Apr 13, 2009)

Hi 

At times in the past (even before the server crash) Mid-sized BBWs have be more vocal of their issues.

William




Mini said:


> Hey elle, I'm not a moderator, but I do believe that you're allowed to express unpopular opinions here. Please elaborate if you feel it might provide some insight.


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## NancyGirl74 (Apr 13, 2009)

Subscribing...

Roll, I feel as if I know what your new friend is talking about. For me, I consider myself to be an SSBBW. Many FAs and even BBWs here do not. It doesn't help that most people feel the need to categorize everyone. 350 lbs and up is the definition of SSBBW to most here at Dims. Some would even say 400 lbs and up. However, this doesn't take into account that anything outside of Dims is usually (at least in my experience) 300 lbs and up. I've always been too big "out there" and too small "in here". There are so many definitions and terms it's baffling to know where one fits. 

When an FA suggests I would be hotter/sexier/whatever-er bigger I tell them that I have been and I wasn't. To them I may have looked nicer bigger but I felt like shit and I'm sorry but feeling like shit isn't sexy. Just like people who think I need to lose weight need to back off, people who want me to gain can do the same. It's my body. I live in it. 

Good luck to your new friend, Roll. I hope she sticks it out. All in all, despite it's ups and downs, Dims is a pretty cool place to hang your hat and stay a while.


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## Ample Pie (Apr 13, 2009)

ps: don't confuse my earlier comments with the notion that I could possibly not support Mid-Sized BBW or, indeed, any sized human, period.

That whole "real women have...." is bullshit. Real women are real women--end of story. I support a person's right/desire/whatever to be whatever size they are or want to be.


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## Suze (Apr 13, 2009)

succubus_dxb said:


> I have no desire to gain weight, neither am I particularly interested in losing any, which seems to confuse people- as if I'm floating in some sort of Fatty Purgatory- I've got to chose which 'side' to cross over to.


ahaha! well said


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## mergirl (Apr 13, 2009)

From listening to the stories of bbw's of all sizes it seems to be that they feel marginalised more by other bbws than they are the Fa's. Then i guess if no-one fits in then everyone fits into not fitting in. I think for most bbws of most sizes, if they have been here for some time can block out some stupid or insensitive comments that some of the Fa's might make, like 'you would be hotter if you were x amount fatter' or ' I only think women of x size are hot anyone else is not'. I think its easier to seperate your emotions from this kind of talk because its steeped in a horny desperation and actually is pretty superficial. I think the bbw division is more instituationalised and for a community that is all making others feel better about their bodies on an emotional level it could hurt pretty deep to feel excluded from the very place you thought you would feel this support from. On the whole, i think most of the women here seem really supportive of each other, no matter what size. A few insensitive Fa's might mean mild irritation, while a few insensitive bbws could mean that walls are put up between groups. It seems this is the way it works anyway.


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## elle camino (Apr 13, 2009)

Rebecca said:


> Saying that SS people get "unequivocal celebration" is 1: incorrect and 2: another way to encourage the whole us v. them attitude.


 if you want to take it that way, go ahead. 
or consider that i actually am friends with a good number of SS ladies around here, have talked to them here and there about this subject, i see where they're coming from and was trying to integrate that into my own outlook. 
whiiiichevs.


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## LisaInNC (Apr 13, 2009)

Ok I am a bbw and yes I have been told I need to gain weight by men in chat, but you know what? I am not here to meet the man of my dreams. This is not a dating site to me. The women and men on this site rock (the non-trolls), so maybe your friend should stop looking at the hooking up aspect of it and just try to make lifelong friends. If she wants a date tell her to try bbwfinder...if she wants size acceptance from PEERS...then tell her to stick around. 

p.s. 
There are disgusting men EVERYWHERE. She wont ever escape them.


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## Ample Pie (Apr 13, 2009)

Was just adding a bit of clarity. Of course, I'm not shocked you took it that way. 


elle camino said:


> if you want to take it that way, go ahead.
> or consider that i actually am friends with a good number of SS ladies around here, have talked to them here and there about this subject, i see where they're coming from and was trying to integrate that into my own outlook.
> whiiiichevs.


hey, congrats on having SS friends tho. have I mentioned I have black friends!


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## mergirl (Apr 13, 2009)

Now, is this going to be an intellectual debate or a bitchfight? Just so i know whether to put on my reading glasses or to sharpen my claws!


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## elle camino (Apr 13, 2009)

Rebecca said:


> hey, congrats on having SS friends tho. have I mentioned I have black friends!


ahahahaha wow. 



just wow.


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## Uriel (Apr 13, 2009)

kittencat said:


> yeah i have been on Dims since around January not very long,and i had been wondering the same thing.It turns out that i got messages from men and Pm's in chat even.Saying that i was small and that i needed to be fattened up.That i didnt really even look large.ect.It can be a bit off setting.Especially when your new to the forumn.I thought for a while that i simply wansnt big enough to be here or something.But anywho im a mid sized BBW and it is rad i tell you..Just RAD!
> 
> please do nto Pm me anymore asking if you can fatten me up but feeding my cheescake ect. im perfectly content ty.
> 
> whew yay for venting!



But I like PMing you and telling you to fatten up...Hahaha. Sorry, can I mention which guy said that to you, huh, huh???


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## OneWickedAngel (Apr 13, 2009)

Roll, I know exactly how your friend feels. I'm under three hundred pounds and considered "small" in the Dims world. When I first signed on to Dimensions last year , I thought I was finding a home at last. I was completely thrown off when it didn't exactly turn out to be the exactly the open arms fatopia I was dreaming of. Which is incredibly disconcerting for someone like me when I have always been the largest and often the tallest of my friends (well female friends anyway). I never did the chat here, but had my fair share of the "not big enough" PMs. I initially chalked it up to the I'm new and it would be different as I get to know people; then I went to a couple of bashes. Last year at the Memorial Weekend Bash in MA I dared to show off in a leather bustier at the dance. I must have struck someone's nerve, because three different people asked if I really thought I belonged. So yes, I left Dims and taking a step back was exactly what I needed. 

Violet had it right. As with anything else in life, Dims should only be a piece of one's world, not the whole of it. Being a newbie not wanting to ruffle feathers I admit I internalized some people's crap I would not have IRL. Eventually, I came to realize it wasn't Dims as a whole, but just a few people whom I made the mistake of letting rent space in my head. Since my return, I've only heard from one and a nice worded FU private message took care of that. I've had to let the real nasty Wicked part of me come out to play a couple of times, but obviously I've been fine ever since. 

Keep encouraging your friend to hang in there and learn how to separate the treasure from the trash. If by chance you're actually reading this honey, do not let the bad ones take up so much space in your head that you can't feel the love of us good ones.


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## TallFatSue (Apr 13, 2009)

Yup, the world is full of jerks, whether you are thin, mid-sized or supersized. I used to hate my fat for seemingly attracting jerks. Eventually I realized that my fat is a very effective filter. My fat merely makes the jerks more readily apparent. It's the next best thing to them carrying a sign that says "Warning! Warning! I'm a jerk!" 

Methinx also that certain men have 3 very basic issues: *control, control* and *control*. Years ago when I visited chat rooms, I noticed some men zeroed in on mid-sized BBW with the express purpose of finding women they could fatten up. Those same men ignored us SSBBW who, one would think, had all the fat they could ever desire, ready-made. The issue wasn't that mid-size BBW were too small or SSBBW were too large. Those manipulative men wanted someone in their clutches to fatten up and thereby control. I also heard from some of their victims (and that's the right word), that after those women had become so fat they could no longer gain or were immobilized, those men abandoned them. The funerals of those men do not occur often enough.


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## Suze (Apr 13, 2009)

Guess I can add my 2c:

I've been told I'm to 'skinny' for this community a couple of times, which have felt rather hurtful to be honest. If I was a gainer, I guess I'd be alright....
It's ridonkolous AND frustrating. Where the heck do i belong?? It's a comfort knowing I'm not the only one feeling this way, though. 

PS
I've never been asked to gain weight, but then again... I don't 'tease'. (Not saying _everyone _'asks for it'.)

PPS
Everyone feel left out from time to time, but I think some classify more as an outcast than others in this particular environment.


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## Carrie (Apr 13, 2009)

For anyone here or at a bash or event or whatever who has been told they don't belong due to small(er) size, please, please, _please_ know that that is one dumb jackass's idiotic opinion and in NO way represents the opinion of the majority. Unfortunately, dumbassses tend to make up for in volume what they lack in numbers, so I understand the initial reaction of feeling hurt. Just please, always consider the source. Most of us welcome you with open arms, particularly if you have cupcakes.

Ugh! Reading about those kinds of experiences make me really angry. Grrrrr.


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## snuggletiger (Apr 13, 2009)

what kind of cupcakes and what kind of frosting? lets go to the real issues at hand.


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## steely (Apr 13, 2009)

This thread is disturbing to me.I'm losing weight,in another 20 pounds I'll be be what's considered a "mid size bbw".Will it matter,considering no one knows what I look like except for my face.It's round anyway and makes me look fat.

I'm not losing out of choice,it's beyond my control.I never gained due to anyone else's choice.Perhap's I have found my answer.I was fat for me in the first place.I am thinner for me because of my health.It all has to do with me and nobody else.

Smaller,larger or in between,it's all me.If I can handle that,everyone else will have to as well.If not,C'est la vie:happy:


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## OneHauteMama (Apr 13, 2009)

I experienced this myself my first few times in chat. It's annoying, to say the least. I ended up with the feeling that I didn't really "fit" anywhere. Not thin enough to be sexy to the guys who like skinny girls, not fat enough to be sexy to an FA...sheesh. It sucks when all you want to do is talk to people and connect and make friends, but just like has always been, you get bogged down in the details of "what size are you? How much do you weigh? How tall are you?". Funny thing is, I consider myself to be a pretty big girl because of what the scale says and because of my height to weight ratio. But my weight is lots of times considered too small and I've been asked if I'd be willing to gain. Um, no lol. The worst is when I have confessed my largest weight and I end up getting comments like "Wow, you must have been hot! Why don't you try to get back up to that?". Honestly, I think I'm pretty hot stuff now and so does my hunny. He'd love me if I was a size 2 or a size 32. And I feel the same about him. If he were any smaller, it wouldn't matter to me. I love him the way he is, but his goals for himself are his business and if he wanted to lose, I'd support him 1000%. I'd miss the man boobs, though lol. But it wouldn't diminish my attraction to him one iota. Nor would it increase it. I love him for his heart, for himself as a person. 

After spending my whole life being judged by my outer appearance, I've learned not to do the same to others. I apply this in my love life and in my social life with friends. A good person is worth my time, no matter their outward appearance.


I realize everyone has their fantasies and what they find attractive, but I honestly hate how much I see people being judged by their size and written off if they are "too small". Okay, so she's not 500lbs, but she could be the love of your life and your soul mate, but you won't give her the time of day because she doesn't fit your physical ideal. I think a lot of people are missing out on great friendships and relationships because of this. It's inverted from being judged for not being thin enough. And it's just as bad.


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## ashmamma84 (Apr 13, 2009)

I've experienced this, especially early on when I was a newbie. I think its easier to brush off misguided/ignorance from the guys, but when the hateration comes from a fat sister it stings a tad more. It's kinda like, how are you gonna trip? We are BOTH fat, chick. Let's stop it with the whole who has it worse trip. It gets us nowhere. 

Now, I just don't take it too seriously. I can't. Being fat and fat admirers aren't my whole world and pretty much anyone that has a problem with my un-supersized body can kick rocks, bitch!


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## Jack Skellington (Apr 13, 2009)

Mini said:


> I'll just come right out and say it: Some of the men here are clueless, feckless assholes.



Basically, what he said. 

Some men, when dealing with women, lack any kind of social tact what so ever and some are just arseholes. I think in some cases it also boils down to dominance and control issues. No matter what the size the woman is making her feel she is never okay the way she is. The "You'd be prettier if you gain/lose." type of mind games.


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## fffff (Apr 13, 2009)

I'm a lot smaller than I used to be and sometimes I do read things here that make me feel uncomfortable. 
But largely, it doesn't bother me. I'm not gaining weight and if some random 'dude form the net asked me to I wouldn't spend two-seconds thinking about it. 

But I've lived in congested cities my entire life and ignoring creepy men and bitchy women is as natural as breathing.


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## kittencat (Apr 13, 2009)

LOL yeha go ahead if you feel it is necassary! your my bestie!


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## rollhandler (Apr 13, 2009)

Dism4l said:


> This brings up another important consideration: what about the perspective of these individuals making the comments? Surely, the commenters' remarks seem pejorative to the BBW, but are they necessarily malevolent in their intent?
> 
> Personally, when I make a request involving a change in someone else, I usually offer reciprocation of equivalent magnitude. It is a statement of preference meant to improve my relationship with the other person by allowing the other person to understand more about me and change in a way that suits me, while I do likewise for them.
> 
> ...




What I am talking about is something that usually happens within the first few lines of the first conversation or very shortly thereafter. There is no basis of getting to know the person by the initiator of the conversation.
Rollhandler


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## rollhandler (Apr 13, 2009)

Fascinita said:


> We're talking about comments made by strangers or near-strangers. There's no way it's appropriate to suggest that someone gain or lose weight in those circumstances--not in chat, not via PM, not while you're standing in line at the deli. It only adds to the pressure to look one way or another. Having fantasies and preferences is fine. But please wait to express those until there is, in fact, a more personal relationship; and then be prepared to respect the other person's boundaries. In the end, weight gain and weight loss are purely personal choices.
> 
> The fact that fat people hang out at Dimensions doesn't mean we're looking to entertain every last T, D & H's fantasy. If you wouldn't approach a BBW or BHM IRL and blurt out your fantasies to them while you wait in line at the grocery store, don't do it online. It's not a free for all just because you may never have to meet the person you're talking to face-to-face.



Exactly on the money there. With e-mail the rule has always been that if you wouldn't sign your name to it and publish it in the paper, dont send it. In chat my hard and fast rule has always been that if you wouldnt say it in public to their face, dont say it in chat. 

Private chat seems to be the exception because you can have a more off color and intimate conversation with the person about more personal things however, if my name is biggerbelly the first thing I want to hear in pm is NOT how much bigger do you want it to be? Why not the question Interesting nickname, how did you come about it instead. Why not get to know the person and see if they bring it up on their own or even wait a few conversations of discussing other things when you can decide from the tone of the discussion whether or not it would be well recieved or tolerated. 

Boundries are a measure of respect for both parties in a conversation but I dont meet someone and ask them in the first sentence "what are your boundries?" By the same token, do I want anyone asking my penis size in the first line of a IM, or even how much money i make in my chosen trade or noticing how skinny i am by my pic and letting me know how they would love to fatten me up? NO, there are just boundries of respect that should be observed in a most basic sense even in chat. I may tell you the answers to those questions after we've had a chance to get to know one another or after a few chats but red flags fly if it becomes the basis of the first chat I have with a person of any gender.
Rollhandler


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## olwen (Apr 13, 2009)

OneWickedAngel said:


> Roll, I know exactly how your friend feels. I'm under three hundred pounds and considered "small" in the Dims world. When I first signed on to Dimensions last year , I thought I was finding a home at last. I was completely thrown off when it didn't exactly turn out to be the exactly the open arms fatopia I was dreaming of. Which is incredibly disconcerting for someone like me when I have always been the largest and often the tallest of my friends (well female friends anyway). I never did the chat here, but had my fair share of the "not big enough" PMs. I initially chalked it up to the I'm new and it would be different as I get to know people; then I went to a couple of bashes. Last year at the Memorial Weekend Bash in MA I dared to show off in a leather bustier at the dance. I must have struck someone's nerve, because three different people asked if I really thought I belonged. So yes, I left Dims and taking a step back was exactly what I needed.
> 
> Violet had it right. As with anything else in life, Dims should only be a piece of one's world, not the whole of it. Being a newbie not wanting to ruffle feathers I admit I internalized some people's crap I would not have IRL. Eventually, I came to realize it wasn't Dims as a whole, but just a few people whom I made the mistake of letting rent space in my head. Since my return, I've only heard from one and a nice worded FU private message took care of that. I've had to let the real nasty Wicked part of me come out to play a couple of times, but obviously I've been fine ever since.
> 
> Keep encouraging your friend to hang in there and learn how to separate the treasure from the trash. If by chance you're actually reading this honey, do not let the bad ones take up so much space in your head that you can't feel the love of us good ones.



Good on ya babe. I must admit I have a hard time imagining you taking shit from anybody.  I pity the fool who tries.


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## katherine22 (Apr 16, 2009)

rollhandler said:


> Ive been tossing the idea around about a gripe I have in relation to how I see women getting treated around this site and not only whether or not to say something about it, but HOW to get my point across concisely and in the spirit that it is meant. I am hurt, I am pissed, I am ashamed at times here in Dimensions.
> 
> I chat with a number of fat women. A few have been concerned and one in particular has come straight out and asked if she even belonged here because she simply felt as if she was "in between both worlds" and expressed concern that she just didn't fit in here because she didn't feel as if she was fat enough.
> 
> ...





Beneath the surface of this issue is that some men want to control women. In the fat world they want to tell women that they are not fat enough, and in the thin world they want to tell women that they are not thin enough, fit enough, buffed enough, young enough........something about men telling women that they are not enough. The day you allow a man to define who you are is the day you have been thrown under the bus.


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## OneWickedAngel (Apr 16, 2009)

katherine22 said:


> Beneath the surface of this issue is that some men want to control women. In the fat world they want to tell women that they are not fat enough, and in the thin world they want to tell women that they are not thin enough, fit enough, buffed enough, young enough........something about men telling women that they are not enough. The day you allow a man to define who you are is the day you have been thrown under the bus.



It's not only men who do it Katherine. Control cuts no matter which sex is wielding the blade. I think a lot newbies with either no idea as to what to expect from Dims or hold Dims to so high of an ideal, that the reality check that this world (be it ever so wonderful as a whole) still has its share of callous mean-spirits just like the real world. It can catch some newbies very much off guard. 

As a new BBW Dimmer I will admit I was completely taken aback by my first "_WTF do you know you're SMALL so STFU!_" private message and yes, that was an exact quote. In some ways Venus Envy (what I call it when one woman hates on another) cuts deeper here at Dims because there is an automatic assumption for many that _hey they're fat like me - they'll understand me!_ that does not necessarily happen.


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## CurvaceousBBWLover (Apr 16, 2009)

rollhandler said:


> Ive been tossing the idea around about a gripe I have in relation to how I see women getting treated around this site and not only whether or not to say something about it, but HOW to get my point across concisely and in the spirit that it is meant. I am hurt, I am pissed, I am ashamed at times here in Dimensions.
> 
> I chat with a number of fat women. A few have been concerned and one in particular has come straight out and asked if she even belonged here because she simply felt as if she was "in between both worlds" and expressed concern that she just didn't fit in here because she didn't feel as if she was fat enough.
> 
> ...





It's a shame that your friend feels that way. No one should feel unwelcome on this board. 

One of the things I have learned about the web is that I can't take everything seriously. Sometimes it is good to take a break from the boards because it's not worth it to let the boards get you down. 

I like mid-size and supersize women. I have no interest in trying to pressure someone to gain weight so I can get off. I know the guys with weight gain fantasies are quite vocal but I suspect that there are other guys on here who feel the same way I do. 

Dimensions is a great place because all kinds of people are welcome here.


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## katherine22 (Apr 17, 2009)

OneWickedAngel said:


> It's not only men who do it Katherine. Control cuts no matter which sex is wielding the blade. I think a lot newbies with either no idea as to what to expect from Dims or hold Dims to so high of an ideal, that the reality check that this world (be it ever so wonderful as a whole) still has its share of callous mean-spirits just like the real world. It can catch some newbies very much off guard.
> 
> As a new BBW Dimmer I will admit I was completely taken aback by my first "_WTF do you know you're SMALL so STFU!_" private message and yes, that was an exact quote. In some ways Venus Envy (what I call it when one woman hates on another) cuts deeper here at Dims because there is an automatic assumption for many that _hey they're fat like me - they'll understand me!_ that does not necessarily happen.



Thank you for your thoughful response to my post. You have given me a lot to think about. I am on a Dims honeymoon, as there are so few places that I feel comfortable socially.


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## mergirl (Apr 17, 2009)

OneWickedAngel said:


> As a new BBW Dimmer I will admit I was completely taken aback by my first "_WTF do you know you're SMALL so STFU!_" private message and yes, that was an exact quote. In some ways Venus Envy (what I call it when one woman hates on another) cuts deeper here at Dims because there is an automatic assumption for many that _hey they're fat like me - they'll understand me!_ that does not necessarily happen.



What??!! Thats SO pathetic!! To the septic labia who wrote that to you, i say this "muwahaha,,You KNOW your just jealous cause she's hotter than you!!!". I hate venus envy (oh i see what you did..kinna freudian but greek! fab!) ..I'm all about the venus loving!:wubu:


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## William (Apr 17, 2009)

Hi GEF

This it probably the wisest think you have ever said here, too bad your actions speak differently.

I am just glad that there are women of all sizes and with all types of size and body preferences on Dimensions now.

William





Green Eyed Fairy said:


> .........Edit: Oh and Carrie is correct about all groups can feel marginalized here......


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## mergirl (Apr 17, 2009)

William said:


> Hi GEF
> 
> This it probably the wisest think you have ever said here, too bad your actions speak differently.
> 
> ...


Got Bitch?


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## William (Apr 17, 2009)

Not really

What I mean is that if I said "....all groups can feel marginalized here......" then I would mean all groups can feel marginalized here and would not caught arguing on another thread that one group does not 

William




mergirl said:


> Got Bitch?


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## Green Eyed Fairy (Apr 17, 2009)

Hi Mergirl

This is probably the wisest thing you have said here.  

:wubu:



mergirl said:


> Got Bitch?


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## William (Apr 17, 2009)

Hi GEF

It would be more positive to explain how you can put so much effort against one thread that said a group was marginalized and now you say "....that all groups have the right to feel marginalized here....." There is a lot of dishonesty in your statements.

William





Green Eyed Fairy said:


> Hi Mergirl
> 
> This is probably the wisest thing you have said here.
> 
> :wubu:


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## Ample Pie (Apr 17, 2009)

Carrie said:


> For anyone here or at a bash or event or whatever who has been told they don't belong due to small(er) size, please, please, _please_ know that that is one dumb jackass's idiotic opinion and in NO way represents the opinion of the majority. Unfortunately, dumbassses tend to make up for in volume what they lack in numbers, so I understand the initial reaction of feeling hurt. Just please, always consider the source. Most of us welcome you with open arms, particularly if you have cupcakes.
> 
> Ugh! Reading about those kinds of experiences make me really angry. Grrrrr.


Wise words, indeed.


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## CurvaceousBBWLover (Apr 17, 2009)

William said:


> Hi GEF
> 
> It would be more positive to explain how you can put so much effort against one thread that said a group was marginalized and now you say "....that all groups have the right to feel marginalized here....." There is a lot of dishonesty in your statements.
> 
> William




You don't know what you are talking about. Green Eyed Fairy is quite honest.


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## katherine22 (Apr 18, 2009)

Carrie said:


> For anyone here or at a bash or event or whatever who has been told they don't belong due to small(er) size, please, please, _please_ know that that is one dumb jackass's idiotic opinion and in NO way represents the opinion of the majority. Unfortunately, dumbassses tend to make up for in volume what they lack in numbers, so I understand the initial reaction of feeling hurt. Just please, always consider the source. Most of us welcome you with open arms, particularly if you have cupcakes.
> 
> Ugh! Reading about those kinds of experiences make me really angry. Grrrrr.



If there is anyone who is going to define me as a fat woman it is going to be me. My standard of self-evalutation is as valid as any stranger's at a bash who does not consider me fat enough. Being a fat goddess is a state of mind as well as a number on a scale.


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## Rosi (Apr 18, 2009)

I havent been on chat much in the last few years, but when I was single I would get the same questions, how much you weight, what did you eat today, how big do you want to get, you need to gain 100lbs, blah blah blah and As a SSBBW at 420lbs I am still asked to gain. From what I understand wanting a woman to gain is not a BBW vs SSBBW thing. They like to see the growth and enjoy the thought of watching a woman eat regardless of your size, skinny, BBW, or SSBBW

Its the same old same old, no matter what you do , what you look like or where you go someone is going to have a problem with something.

Personally, I believe women of all shapes and sizes are beautiful each in their own unique way. The most beautiful thing about a woman is her confidence! I learned that many years ago from a very smart woman, thanks HB


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## Rosi (Apr 18, 2009)

OneWickedAngel said:


> Last year at the Memorial Weekend Bash in MA I dared to show off in a leather bustier at the dance. I must have struck someone's nerve, because three different people asked if I really thought I belonged.




I am so sorry you had to experience that. I know the girls that run those dances would not appreciate any of their guests being treated in such a way. When I use to attend their dances I remember them welcome woman/men of all shapes and sizes. Many times BBWs would bring the thin friends because they didnt want to attend alone. And they were always welcome with open arms.

Unfortunately, there are going to jerks everywhere you go. Ive been places where smaller BBWs shun me because they thought I was too big for their liken.

I dont look at it as BBW vs SSBBW, more like catty women being catty women. Lol I am sure there are some of the same issues in the thin world. 

I know the HB group works hard and pride themselves in making everyone feel comfortable at their event regardless of shape, size or gender. 

Please dont let the actions of few jerks keep you from attending another BBW event. 

I think you are absolutely beautiful just the way you are!!!!


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## Scorsese86 (Apr 18, 2009)

This thread really makes me sad actually. I guess I am what people brand as an FA, but then again mid-sized bbws, as this thread suggest, are usually the kind of gals I have been dated, or have been attracted to for most. I think it's rather stupid that people yells out at someone here for being "too skinny, by dimensions standards", because being a FA or something else, just prefering larger partners, does not mean you _only_ like 400lbs, there are plenty who like everything from 150lbs to...beyond. Ah, I hate numbers. All chicks look good here, no matter if they are small sized bbw, or ssbbws.

In the words of Rodney King (not everyday you hear that, especially from a conservative right-wing nut like me)
Can't we all just get along?


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## mergirl (Apr 18, 2009)

In the words of King kong-GRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR!!!! *bangs fists on chest*


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## Dism4l (Apr 18, 2009)

Rosi said:


> From what I understand wanting a woman to gain is not a BBW vs SSBBW thing. They like to see the growth and enjoy the thought of watching a woman eat regardless of your size, skinny, BBW, or SSBBW



Exactly. That probably accounts for 50% or more of the cases where BBW/BHM are asked to gain. In all likelihood, the FAs that are asking women/men to gain are not malevolent in their intent.

Indeed there are plenty of FAs such as myself who enjoy weight gain in a woman/man just because of the fact that they are getting bigger, and I would think that especially in a risque, sexually-themed conversation between such an FA and a BBW/BHM there could be a strong chance of weight gain being brought up.


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## tonynyc (Apr 18, 2009)

Scorsese86 said:


> In the words of Rodney King (not everyday you hear that, especially from a conservative right-wing nut like me)
> Can't we all just get along?




*
It would be nice if this was possible.In a perfect world perhaps;but, unfortunately Dims like "real life" is imperfect. Maybe at the end of the day - we can just try to make things better for all one step at a time*


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## Green Eyed Fairy (Apr 18, 2009)

Dism4l said:


> Exactly. That probably accounts for 50% or more of the cases where BBW/BHM are asked to gain. In all likelihood, the FAs that are asking women/men to gain are not malevolent in their intent.
> 
> Indeed there are plenty of FAs such as myself who enjoy weight gain in a woman/man just because of the fact that they are getting bigger, and I would think that especially in a risque, sexually-themed conversation between such an FA and a BBW/BHM there could be a strong chance of weight gain being brought up.



Just curious...how much weight are you willing to gain for a partner? Your weight and measurements please?


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## Dism4l (Apr 18, 2009)

Green Eyed Fairy said:


> Just curious...how much weight are you willing to gain for a partner? Your weight and measurements please?



I'm not sure how relevant this is, but I'll play along.

Personally I'm not a gainer, and I prefer my body size on the basis of aesthetics and practicality.

I am currently 170 lbs and 6'0"

Under regular circumstances I wouldn't gain, but I would for a partner as long as she was doing so for me. As I previously posted, my ethics pertaining to relationships revolve around reciprocation.

I would probably limit my weight so that I'm still healthy. I don't know what that particular weight is.


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## Green Eyed Fairy (Apr 18, 2009)

Dism4l said:


> I'm not sure how relevant this is, but I'll play along.
> 
> Personally I'm not a gainer, and I prefer my body size on the basis of aesthetics and practicality.
> 
> ...




Just wanted you to see how it is for a stranger to invade your personal zone. Now what if ten other women did this to you this week...with no invitation or provocation from you? You might eventually start rolling your eyes and getting aggravated....especially as someone that is " personally not a gainer". Not all FAs are into gaining. Some BBWs prefer conversations with them instead. It is possible.

Thanks for your response.


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## NoWayOut (Apr 18, 2009)

Yeah, it amazes me that some people can do this to anyone else and think it's okay. I had one BBW friend who I'd only met online who said I was the nicest guy she'd met, partially because I'd never tried to hit on her. Honestly, I think that's really sad, partially because I'd hope there are nicer guys than me and partially because not hitting on a girl that you only know online should be the norm, not the exception. 

Yes, some might consider what I say on the paysite board to be hitting on a girl I only know online, but I think that's different because those girls are asking for positive comments about their bodies or their lifestyles. I would never tell a girl that I'd just met that she should gain weight, because she's the one living with it, not me. Even with good friends, I wouldn't say that. One example, a girl who is not a BBW wanted to know my preferences for women and asked what she would need to do if she wanted to be my ideal girl. I only told her she'd have to gain about 75 pounds when ducking the question 4 times didn't work. Even then, the only reason I told her was because I knew she had no interest in me and would not binge because of what I said.

I have my opinions, and if asked, I will tell a girl that I think she'd look better with more weight, if that's what I think. But I'm not going to be the one to make the first move there. It's not my place to do that. If a girl is happy with her weight, does any other opinion matter?


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## Dism4l (Apr 19, 2009)

Green Eyed Fairy said:


> Just wanted you to see how it is for a stranger to invade your personal zone. Now what if ten other women did this to you this week...with no invitation or provocation from you? You might eventually start rolling your eyes and getting aggravated....especially as someone that is " personally not a gainer". Not all FAs are into gaining. Some BBWs prefer conversations with them instead. It is possible.
> 
> Thanks for your response.



Ok, I had a hunch that it would come to that. And no problem! I'm always happy to answer a question. 

Please don't think that I do not understand the nuisance of repeatedly being asked to do something against my will. The resulting peer pressure is powerful and disconcerting indeed. GEF also note that in an earlier post I said "plenty" of FAs like weight gain, which is not an absolute statement saying "all" FAs like it. It doesn't even suggest a majority.

I agree that the multitude of FAs on chat pressuring BBW/BHM to gain is a problem, but I just wanted to point out perhaps a these FAs don't know the extent that these BBW/BHM are being asked to gain and by this ignorance are assuming that the question is innocent. I'd like to assert that the majority of these people do not bear bad intentions and thus divert the attitude on this thread that these FAs are somehow evil or perverted. Ironically, it seems like I've exacerbated this...

Over all I just wanted to add a little perspective to this thread because it seemed like there is a lot of venting going on. I'm sorry if I offended anyone!:doh:

And thank you for contributing, NoWayOut.


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## Jack Skellington (Apr 19, 2009)

Dism4l said:


> Please don't think that I do not understand the nuisance of repeatedly being asked to do something against my will. The resulting peer pressure is powerful and disconcerting indeed.



Well, then, guys that do bring unsolicited weight gain comments should then be able to emphasize how frustrating and even insulting those kind of comments can be. Plus, from what I understand, there are enough open feedees on bbw forums and chatrooms that pestering the women that don't identify as such is unneccessary, futile as well potentially rude. 

I'm not saying anyone is good or bad and I'm not trying to be mean. This is actually me being fairly nice, by my standards anyways. 

Anyhoo...men, into that, just need to "get" why those types of comments are frustrating or even hurtful to women not into what they are. Just think about going into a chat room because you just want to hang out and shoot the breeze with people and you end up getting constantly bombarded with stuff like "You'd look prettier fatter" and "Hey, honey, wanna gain?" You know, that would really suck.


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## Dism4l (Apr 19, 2009)

Jack Skellington said:


> Well, then, guys that do bring unsolicited weight gain comments should then be able to emphasize how frustrating and even insulting those kind of comments can be.



True, but only if the person who's encouraging knows how frequently unsolicited weight gain comments are made. I'm not sure how many chat rooms allow their users to get this data and the knowledge of the BBW's/ BHM's reaction to the comment.



Jack Skellington said:


> Anyhoo...men, into that, just need to "get" why those types of comments are frustrating or even hurtful to women not into what they are.



Exactly. In my opinion, this is the heart of the problem.


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## Chode McBlob (Apr 21, 2009)

I prefer the smaller to mid-sized BBW's myself over the SSBBW's. Not that I dislike SSBBW's either.


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## Carrie (Apr 21, 2009)

Chode McBlob said:


> I prefer the smaller to mid-sized BBW's myself over the SSBBW's. Not that I dislike SSBBW's either.


There simply aren't enough :doh:s in the world.

But thanks for playing, you've won a lovely parting gift!


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## mossystate (Apr 21, 2009)

Dism4l said:


> True, but only if the person who's encouraging knows how frequently unsolicited weight gain comments are made. I'm not sure how many chat rooms allow their users to get this data and the knowledge of the BBW's/ BHM's reaction to the comment.



How about you stop making excuses for the behavior. How about such a thing be like any other question you just don't blurt out. You know, get to know a person a lil. You yourself used the word unsolicited. 

Unsolicited...Not looked for or requested; unsought.

Is basic common sense and being clued in, THAT difficult?

I am a chat veteran. " Monique...you a gainer? "..." how much do you weigh...wanna get bigger? "..." you look small in your picture ( when I am posting a head shot )...you here to look into gaining? "..." lookin for a girl who wants to gain ".

Now, some men of this ilk will chug an energy drink before they PM me and actually add a '" hello ". That just makes my heart skip a beat.:blush:


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## Fenrisulfr (Apr 21, 2009)

I could be way off base here, but as a guy, I've always found the "gaining" requests to be pretty damn cruel. It's not your body, it's not your decision. End of story. Asking a girl to gain weight or that she's not fat enough is just as shallow as telling a girl that she needs to lose weight or that she isn't skinny enough. Sure, everyone has their personal preferences when it comes to physical beauty, but nobody has the right to force those preferences upon others. 

I'm a relatively new member here, and I hope that I haven't pissed off too much of the community here. I just find people who force their opinions onto others (whether those are opinions of aesthetics, religion, politics, what have you) to be extremely irritating.

[/rant]


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## CurvaceousBBWLover (Apr 21, 2009)

If i had a penny for every time I have heard or read a woman's horror story about being asked her weight or other measurements at the beginning of a conversation, I would be a very rich man. It really is impolite to ask women this kind of thing. What about the word rude don't these male fetishists understand? Do I need to take them to school and give them some new social skills? Do I need to change the lives of FAs, one imbecile at a time?


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## OneWickedAngel (Apr 21, 2009)

*CurvaceousBBWLover: Changing the lives of FAs, one imbecile at a time!*

FA 101: A BBW/SSBBW etc should never be reduced (nor plumped) to a number. (especially on first chat!)


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## Green Eyed Fairy (Apr 21, 2009)

Fenrisulfr said:


> I could be way off base here, but as a guy, I've always found the "gaining" requests to be pretty damn cruel. It's not your body, it's not your decision. End of story. Asking a girl to gain weight or that she's not fat enough is just as shallow as telling a girl that she needs to lose weight or that she isn't skinny enough. Sure, everyone has their personal preferences when it comes to physical beauty, but nobody has the right to force those preferences upon others.
> 
> I'm a relatively new member here, and I hope that I haven't pissed off too much of the community here. I just find people who force their opinions onto others (whether those are opinions of aesthetics, religion, politics, what have you) to be extremely irritating.
> 
> [/rant]



It's more than rude....it is a statement saying "you are not good enough how you are....i want to change you". That is shitty enough to hear from a acquaintance or friend....now make it from a stranger.


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## Dism4l (Apr 22, 2009)

mossystate said:


> How about you stop making excuses for the behavior. How about such a thing be like any other question you just don't blurt out. You know, get to know a person a lil. You yourself used the word unsolicited.
> 
> Unsolicited...Not looked for or requested; unsought.
> 
> Is basic common sense and being clued in, THAT difficult?




I hope you realize that I'm playing the devil's advocate. Note that previously I said, "please don't think that I do not understand the nuisance of repeatedly being asked to do something against my will. The resulting peer pressure is powerful and disconcerting indeed."

Neither do I partake of this activity myself. I know well enough how to have a conversation with another human being.
I DO love having the finger pointed at me...






I'm simply trying to provide a balancing argument for the purpose of preventing this thread from becoming a vent-fest. I'm a staunch believer in the benefits of balanced, thoughtful discussion.

And for the record, FAs are notorious for their lack of skill with the gender that they desire due to suppressed sexuality during adolescence. Note also that the "kid in a candy shop" effect may also apply. Both of these, when paired with ignorance about the prevalence of weight gain comments, could significantly increase the likelihood of a newbie making these kinds of remarks. Perhaps not so much for an older, wiser FA, but there are also people who are relentless in their search for a gainer that may use a remark like that to weed out those who aren't. And then there are the creepers...


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## mossystate (Apr 22, 2009)

Dism4l said:


> And for the record, FAs are notorious for their lack of skill with the gender that they desire due to suppressed sexuality during adolescence. Note also that the "kid in a candy shop" effect may also apply. Both of these, when paired with ignorance about the prevalence of weight gain comments, could significantly increase the likelihood of a newbie making these kinds of remarks. Perhaps not so much for an older, wiser FA, but there are also people who are relentless in their search for a gainer that may use a remark like that to weed out those who aren't. And then there are the creepers...



No...No...and...NO.

This is not about FA's. This is not about gaining/feeding/tapdancing/newbieeeees/old/young/male/female. 

This is a very simple lack of very basic common sense and respect. Stop making every bad move a person makes out here about any of the things I listed. It is about tunnel vision, which can pop up...everywhere.


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## stan_der_man (Apr 22, 2009)

..........


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## Dism4l (Apr 22, 2009)

mossystate said:


> No...No...and...NO.
> 
> This is not about FA's. This is not about gaining/feeding/tapdancing/newbieeeees/old/young/male/female.
> 
> This is a very simple lack of very basic common sense and respect.



Be my guest if you would like to simplify the matter, but there are several reasons why someone may self-justify a weight gain comment, and while some of them are malevolent there are still plenty of others that are relatively innocent in nature.

Take good care to observe that while ethics and morals are relative to society, they are also relative to the individual. The latter seems to take precedence over the former on the internet, and so with that "common sense" and "respect" have a greater tendency to fly spontaneously out the window. When your creeper is sitting alone at his computer on the other side of the planet, what does he possibly have to lose by making such a trivial remark? Surely, it's probably nothing he cares about.


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## fatgirlflyin (Apr 22, 2009)

Dism4l said:


> And for the record, FAs are notorious for their lack of skill with the gender that they desire due to suppressed sexuality during adolescence. Note also that the "kid in a candy shop" effect may also apply. Both of these, when paired with ignorance about the prevalence of weight gain comments, could significantly increase the likelihood of a newbie making these kinds of remarks. Perhaps not so much for an older, wiser FA, but there are also people who are relentless in their search for a gainer that may use a remark like that to weed out those who aren't. And then there are the creepers...



So how long are we supposed to make these mental excuses for men who just have no manners? I have never, not one single time, had a man come up to me in person and ask how much I weigh or if I wanted to gain weight. On the rare occasions now that I go into chat I get at least half a dozen within a half an hours time. 

Its just plain lack of manners, and the anonimity of the internet that causes this to happen.


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## Victim (Apr 22, 2009)

Well, there is a bright side to the clueless FA problem. They are much less likely to be able to breed.


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## Green Eyed Fairy (Apr 22, 2009)

Victim said:


> Well, there is a bright side to the clueless FA problem. They are much less likely to be able to breed.




No one gets pregnant from cyber talk anyway.....


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## fatgirlflyin (Apr 22, 2009)

Green Eyed Fairy said:


> No one gets pregnant from cyber talk anyway.....



No? 

Well, that's my story and I'm stickin to it! 



No I'm not pregnant (for my cyberstalker)


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## Jack Skellington (Apr 22, 2009)

Dism4l said:


> And for the record, FAs are notorious for their lack of skill with the gender that they desire due to suppressed sexuality during adolescence.



Personally, I think some men (I'm speaking about men in general) no matter what they are into (fat, thin, busty, whatever) have some type of persecution complex as well as distinct lack of social graces around women. I feel our society, in general, is still deeply rooted in this "boys will be boys" mentality and is constantly trying to justify and excuse the negative behaviour of those men. When we should be teaching them and telling them that, that type of behaviour is not acceptable.


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## Victim (Apr 22, 2009)

If I ever get out of line with a woman, my mother's ghost will come back and slap me upside the head, so I gotta behave.


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## Dism4l (Apr 23, 2009)

Ella Bella said:


> So how long are we supposed to make these mental excuses for men who just have no manners?
> Its just plain lack of manners, and the anonimity of the internet that causes this to happen.



I am not asking anyone to accept this as a reason to accept their behavior. I am simply providing rationale and explanation for why this behavior happens.



Jack Skellington said:


> Personally, I think some men (I'm speaking about men in general) no matter what they are into (fat, thin, busty, whatever) have some type of persecution complex as well as distinct lack of social graces around women. I feel our society, in general, is still deeply rooted in this "boys will be boys" mentality and is constantly trying to justify and excuse the negative behaviour of those men. When we should be teaching them and telling them that, that type of behaviour is not acceptable.



I do believe it is, but i hope you're not trying to label me as one of those "boys will be boys" types. Whether I am or not, it is simply a subtler version of name calling that undermines the productivity of the discussion.

Personally, I'm arguing largely under the assumption that some FFA's are guilty as well, and so I am therefore taking a gender-neutral or a gender-balanced approach. Specifying a certain gender in a scenario in which the other gender is likely involved narrows the scope of the conversation and leaves out elements of the problem itself.


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## Jack Skellington (Apr 23, 2009)

Dism4l said:


> I do believe it is, but PLEASE don't tell me you're trying to label me as one of those "boys will be boys" types. Whether I am or not, it is simply a subtler version of name calling that undermines the productivity of the discussion.



I am not calling anyone names. You are reading into what I am saying. Trust me, _this is_ me being nice. 

I was *very clear *that I was speaking about some men in general, regardless of whatever their preference is or is not. I was also *very clear *about speaking about our culture as a whole tending to excuse negative male behavior. It is a deeply rooted cultural problem, in my opinion.

I get that you are saying why you think some men behave in such a fashion. What I am saying is, a fetish/preference (no matter what it is) does not excuse or justify that bad behavior. I don't feel we "the size acceptance community" would tolerate a guy saying something like "Hey, baby, why don't you get some breast implants." just because he has a breast fetish and poor social skills. Nor do I feel we should we brush off rudeness from a guy because he may identify as an FA.

Having a fetish/preference/whatever is not a get out of jail free card for rudeness.


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## mossystate (Apr 23, 2009)

Dism4l said:


> > Be my guest if you would like to simplify the matter..
> 
> 
> 
> ...


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## Famouslastwords (Apr 23, 2009)

I don't think it's exclusive to the medium girls about the gaining thing, hell I'm almost 400 pounds and I've been told I should gain.


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## samestar (Apr 23, 2009)

My wife is a "midsize" girl around 240 or so. She used to weigh over 350. she lost for health reasons and I tell her every day she is just as sexy now as the day we married (when she was 300+). I would never ask her to gain or lose for my pleasure.


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## fatgirlflyin (Apr 23, 2009)

Dism4l said:


> I am not asking anyone to accept this as a reason to accept their behavior. I am simply providing rationale and explanation for why this behavior happens.



OH, so you're not saying we should accept the behavior but your making excuses for it? Color me stupid, but as a mom when my kids make excuses its usually because they expect me to accept whatever bad behavior they are making excuses for.


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## NoWayOut (Apr 23, 2009)

Ella Bella said:


> OH, so you're not saying we should accept the behavior but your making excuses for it? Color me stupid, but as a mom when my kids make excuses its usually because they expect me to accept whatever bad behavior they are making excuses for.



And I'm probably going to get jumped on for this, but this is not the same thing. Countless times, I've explained to friends why something they disagree with is taking place because I'm usually perceptive enough to see multiple sides of an issue. Usually, this ends with something along the lines of "It doesn't matter that you're right. You can't change this action, and you have nothing to gain by attempting to try it." I would likely not engage in the behavior myself, but I can understand it.

It's the same thing here. No matter what, there will always be immoral pricks who get off on telling women to gain weight, without caring who they offend, who they hurt, etc. They will not change, no matter what. He seems to understand the mentality of this kind of person despite not engaging in the practice himself, and he's trying to give you a view into the reasons behind it. He's said that he doesn't do this himself.

Essentially, he's on the same side you are, but you're trying to make him the enemy.


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## fatgirlflyin (Apr 23, 2009)

I'm not trying to make him an anything. I'm saying that I refuse to make excuses for other people's bad behavior, and that it saddens me that other people do it. 






NoWayOut said:


> And I'm probably going to get jumped on for this, but this is not the same thing. Countless times, I've explained to friends why something they disagree with is taking place because I'm usually perceptive enough to see multiple sides of an issue. Usually, this ends with something along the lines of "It doesn't matter that you're right. You can't change this action, and you have nothing to gain by attempting to try it." I would likely not engage in the behavior myself, but I can understand it.
> 
> It's the same thing here. No matter what, there will always be immoral pricks who get off on telling women to gain weight, without caring who they offend, who they hurt, etc. They will not change, no matter what. He seems to understand the mentality of this kind of person despite not engaging in the practice himself, and he's trying to give you a view into the reasons behind it. He's said that he doesn't do this himself.
> 
> Essentially, he's on the same side you are, but you're trying to make him the enemy.


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## Les Toil (Apr 23, 2009)

Dism4l said:


> And for the record, FAs are notorious for their lack of skill with the gender that they desire due to suppressed sexuality during adolescence.




Wow, I guess I missed that memo when it came across my desk.


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## Les Toil (Apr 23, 2009)

CurvaceousBBWLover said:


> If i had a penny for every time I have heard or read a woman's horror story about being asked her weight or other measurements at the beginning of a conversation, I would be a very rich man.




I remember the very first couple months of discovering the Dim Board over a decade ago, I used to talk to a certain popular BBW over the phone. The first time she told me about guys wanting to rub her belly, I assumed she would follow their request with a slap to their faces. But she didn't. She told me that such a request was a tremendous compliment to a BBW (at least the ones she was friends with). 

I also remember how utterly shocked I was to see women on the Weight Board post their weight anywhere and everywhere they had the chance. For my entire life I was told women don't reveal such things--not even to their own husbands! So I learned early there was a sense of pride that went along with a large weight number on Dimensions--at least with the more ostentatious women. I still find it fascinating you couldn't get smaller women to reveal their weight under _any_ circumstance, but there's an ample amount of big women that will tell you their weight without having to ask them for it! 

Point being, I think a lot (not all!) of FAs within this community have learned a different set of chivalry standards about women. In all honesty, I'd say a lot of that comes from hanging around the Paysite Board way too much. On that board the guys are surrounded by women that ONLY talk about gaining weight and how much they weigh. It's like the dude here that recently posted about being surprised to hear some woman in his office was married to a man heavier than her. You lose touch with life beyond this place.


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## undrcovrbrothr (May 12, 2009)

My .02:

1. BBWs are beautiful, period, end of story, no matter what letters you add to them.

2. Don't make your weight gain fetish out to be extremely popular by making women feel small or devalued.

3. Sheer numbers anywhere does not make it right or valid automatically. History proves this.

4. Manipulative people are some of the worst sort, and get kicks out of human suffering... where they congregate, we gentlemen and ladies will be there to say "Ohh HELL no." 

Ahh, I feel better


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## gobettiepurple (Apr 28, 2010)

*I just wanted to thank everyone for writing in this thread! I was online talking to some of the lurkers that found my IM in Dims and its true, not everyone is like those men that objectify women whether for the fat or the skinny of it!

I myself am an average sized bbw looking to downsize just a bit and I am shocked that some guys have the audacity to ask how much I way, as if it would be a deal breaker if I was too fat or too thin. I have always been attracted to the person, not what they look like - beauty is in the eye of the beholder. Surely we should never have "fat on fat" negativity, especially if some guy claims he is an FA and would pressure a girl to gain weight. I struggle with binge eating everyday, so for some guy to come out and ask me if I am willing to gain is kind of like a slap in the face - its something very personal for me to talk about, which sometimes isn't enough of an explanation for people - but I digress.

I was at first apprehensive to join Dims because I thought it would be a lot of those guys - they FA's who only want a girl because of a subjective predetermined weight class that they found attractive. I want to be like and eventually loved for who I am, not for what I look like. Dims turned out to be different - people here really seem to care about getting to know me and helping me with my newbie-ness!

Thank you everyone for being open and supportive of other people and their bodies. It's tough being a bbw out there in the real world sometimes, its comforting to come to Dims where you can just be who you are. *


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## UMBROBOYUM (Apr 28, 2010)

Would you please stop lumping FAs in with this lot of douchebags. I hate being thrown in with the rotten apples. 

Any REAL FA wouldn't do that to a woman. Real FAs... No real MEN don't feel the need to talk to women like that. 

So lets replace the FA in the thread title to something else please.


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## gobettiepurple (Apr 28, 2010)

*[COLOR="Purple]You don;t have to get mad, some of us are new to all this terminology and lingo . . . jeeze, next time we won't vent and say the things we are thinking. Considering I didn't know that all FA's arent like that, perhaps you should be a little more understanding. Honestly didn't mean to offend anyone by expressing my opinion.*


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## UMBROBOYUM (Apr 28, 2010)

gobettiepurple said:


> *[COLOR="Purple]You don;t have to get mad, some of us are new to all this terminology and lingo . . . jeeze, next time we won't vent and say the things we are thinking. Considering I didn't know that all FA's arent like that, perhaps you should be a little more understanding. Honestly didn't mean to offend anyone by expressing my opinion.*



Its not you that it was directed at. the Op. 

You're fine.


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## CurvaceousBBWLover (Apr 28, 2010)

:doh: Too many of these guys seriously lack social skills. Big women get picked on and discriminated against enough because of their weight.

All I can say is that a lot of them just did not get good home training.


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## UMBROBOYUM (Apr 28, 2010)

CurvaceousBBWLover said:


> :doh: Too many of these guys seriously lack social skills. Big women get picked on and discriminated against enough because of their weight.
> 
> All I can say is that a lot of them just did not get good home training.




These guys aren't too bright, and they also mess things up not only for the women, but for the men who aren't like them at all.


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## fiddypence (Apr 28, 2010)

I think there a couple of take home points here:

1. Mid-size BBWs: you are lovely just as you are.

2. In fact, everyone in general: It's most important that you feel good in your body: f*ck everyone else (not literally).

3. Alot of FAs like to see women gain weight, but that's not a license to go around telling women that they should.

I don't want to be all high and mighty here, in past relationships I've pushed people to gain weight until I realized that such behavior was totally unnacceptable.

Telling a woman that she should gain weight because she would "look better" is not cool. If I think a woman would look good with more weight, chances are I ALREADY think she looks good. I'm just honest now and say "I would get off on you gaining weight because I have this fetish, you are hot already" and obviously you only say this to someone you are in a relationship with.

Also, as I've said before, its most important that my partner is happy with their size, even if it means they lose weight.


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## joswitch (Apr 29, 2010)

rollhandler said:


> Ive been tossing the idea around about a gripe I have in relation to how I see women getting treated around this site and not only whether or not to say something about it, but HOW to get my point across concisely and in the spirit that it is meant. I am hurt, I am pissed, I am ashamed at times here in Dimensions.
> 
> I chat with a number of fat women. A few have been concerned and one in particular has come straight out and asked if she even belonged here because she simply felt as if she was "in between both worlds" and expressed concern that she just didn't fit in here because she didn't feel as if she was fat enough.
> 
> ...



Mid sized BBWs are not marginalized by *this* FA, for one.

And a girl who's 230 - 270lbs is definitely a BBW!


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## joswitch (Apr 29, 2010)

gobettiepurple said:


> I just wanted to thank everyone for writing in this thread! I was online talking to some of the lurkers that found my IM in Dims and its true, not everyone is like those men that objectify women whether for the fat or the skinny of it!
> 
> *I myself am an average sized bbw looking to downsize just a bit* and I am shocked that some guys have the audacity to ask how much I way, as if it would be a deal breaker if I was too fat or too thin. I have always been attracted to the person, not what they look like - beauty is in the eye of the beholder. Surely we should never have "fat on fat" negativity, especially if some guy claims he is an FA and would pressure a girl to gain weight. I struggle with binge eating everyday, so *for some guy to come out and ask me if I am willing to gain is kind of like a slap in the face* - its something very personal for me to talk about, which sometimes isn't enough of an explanation for people - but I digress.



Just a suggestion - 
if you find questions about your weight / attitude to gaining to be upsetting - why not put words to the effect of that bolded above ^ in your forum sig / a sentence on your profile?


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## gobettiepurple (Apr 29, 2010)

joswitch said:


> Just a suggestion -
> if you find questions about your weight / attitude to gaining to be upsetting - why not put words to the effect of that bolded above ^ in your forum sig / a sentence on your profile?



*Because I don't think its that important. I just expect people to have manners; However it is true that at Dims most people's expectations are a bit different. I was just taken aback, thats all, and since I have been doing a lot of soul searching, I am trying to figure stuff out. That's why I joined dims. For the perspective, which to me is a little foreign and thus why my reaction wasn't what people expected.*


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## CurvaceousBBWLover (Apr 29, 2010)

I definitely will not be marginalizing mid-size BBWs. I like mid-size BBWs and smaller supersize BBWs who are attractive, mobile and compatible.

So come my way, ladies!


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## hal84 (Apr 29, 2010)

Who cares if someone is skinny, alittle bigger, a BBW or larger? Yes, I confess I like a BBW to alittle smaller, however that isn't to say tha I wouldn't date a skinny woman (I have) and it's not to say I wouldn't date a SSBBW (I have), in the end it's about the personalit that they possess. If a woman had the body of Baywatch Carmen Electra and the personality of a piece of rotted tree bark I think my attraction for her would fall quickly away based on my peceptin of her and her personality. So perhaps we should remove some of these silly titles and just gowith a standard test. Is this woman a nice person and have a few things that you can work with physically? If the answer is yes, then she's hot in my book. Ofcourse if they are a Buffalo Bills fan they get an extra hottness point from me!!


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## Lovelyone (Apr 29, 2010)

Carrie said:


> snip...I think everyone can feel marginalized here. It _really_ sucks that the mid-sized fatties get the jackass comments about how they'd look better fatter, and I cringe when I read them. For the super-sized fatties, we may get fewer of that kind of junk, but as GEF correctly pointed out, we have the innate pleasure of reading the "how fat is too fat" kinds of threads where people express their concerns about and even revulsion for actually *gasp* dating someone as large as we are. Not fun. So like I said, I think there probably exist equal opportunities for feeling marginalized here - and in the world in general, for that matter.



I happen to be one of the Larger ssbbw's in the community and even at +500 lbs I still receive the, "Do you want to gain" and "how fat will you get for me" comments. The smaller bbw's are definitely not the only ones here who are bombarded with the gaining comments. I think Carrie says it best that EVERYONE can at some time feel that way here- and in the world in general. I am sure that the men who visit the threads can also give examples of how we women have made them feel marginalized about their preferences.

I met my best man-friend here at Dims. He has his wishes. He likes bigger ladies and wants them to be about 600 lbs. That's what he likes. I don't condemn him for liking what he likes, but I also make clear to him I don't wish to be that 600 lb woman. He's okay with that and so am I. To me, its all a matter of realizing that each and every person on these forums has an idea of what they like and/or why they are here. That doesn't make it wrong nor right...it just is. Personally I think that the ones who ask the gaining questions are just looking for what they like. They are looking for a connection to someone who enjoys the same things that they do. If that's not what you are into--you are perfectly within your right to say that its not what turns you on and perhaps they should look elsewhere. (I chose to become great friends with my friend who likes gaining and its turned out to be one of the best friendships I have ever had).


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## CastingPearls (Apr 29, 2010)

SSBBW here as well and I get the same exact comments. Everyday.

Assholes come in every size, stripe and gender. Just because someone is an FA doesn't mean he/she's going to be better mannered, educated, sensitive or have more class than those who like only thin people.


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## indy500tchr (Apr 29, 2010)

CastingPearls said:


> SSBBW here as well and I get the same exact comments. Everyday.
> 
> Assholes come in every size, stripe and gender. *Just because someone is an FA doesn't mean he/she's going to be better mannered, educated, sensitive or have more class than those who like only thin people.*



*In my experience* it is the exact opposite. A majority of FA's *I've *come in contact with have been ill mannered, uneducated, insensitive and classless.

*the bold and red is to emphasize that this is MY opinion and experience and that I am not making a blanket statement about ALL FA's or putting words into the mouths of other ladies.


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## msbard90 (Apr 29, 2010)

Honestly, people just need to be more polite. FA's and everyone in general. Size is obviously a big issue here, and no one wants to be offended by someone complaining whether they are too small or too big. Imagine if the guys here had a "display your _junk_" thread and us ladies criticized and made fun of the small ones, wishing they were bigger? That would be offensive. Kinda like how its offensive for men to blatantly and **key word** OFFENSIVELY state how much hotter a woman would be if her ass and tits were bigger. If you like the way a girl looks, compliment her. If you don't like the way a girl looks, then shut your mouth. 

ps. Sorry for being so blunt about it- but I had to.


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## sowhat (Apr 29, 2010)

indy500tchr said:


> *In my experience* it is the exact opposite. A majority of FA's *I've *come in contact with have been ill mannered, uneducated, insensitive and classless.
> 
> *the bold and red is to emphasize that this is MY opinion and experience and that I am not making a blanket statement about ALL FA's or putting words into the mouths of other ladies.



As a gay FFA, I hope eventually you meet someone that helps to turn the tide on that statistic.

I have had and still do have a ton of issues with my body and self image. I sure as hell don't want someone trying to screw it up any more, and I would never do that to someone else. It seems that there is no shortage of FAs that don't give a sh1t about a woman's self esteem and body image; and I am pissed about that.

The aforementioned was probably pretty random sounding, but I still am trying to form the words to express these thoughts more eloquently.


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## sowhat (Apr 29, 2010)

msbard90 said:


> Honestly, people just need to be more polite. FA's and everyone in general. Size is obviously a big issue here, and no one wants to be offended by someone complaining whether they are too small or too big. Imagine if the guys here had a "display your _junk_" thread and us ladies criticized and made fun of the small ones, wishing they were bigger? That would be offensive. Kinda like how its offensive for men to blatantly and **key word** OFFENSIVELY state how much hotter a woman would be if her ass and tits were bigger. If you like the way a girl looks, compliment her. If you don't like the way a girl looks, then shut your mouth.
> 
> ps. Sorry for being so blunt about it- but I had to.



Just like if her ass and tits and hair and face and legs and personality and... were different: SHE'D BE A DIFFERENT PERSON. Just like if you (assdouche extraordinaire guy from your quote) were as kind and caring as your ego is overinflated you might have a shot in hell at a decent relationship.

I fucking hate objectification.


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## msbard90 (Apr 29, 2010)

sowhat said:


> Just like if her ass and tits and hair and face and legs and personality and... were different: SHE'D BE A DIFFERENT PERSON. Just like if you (assdouche extraordinaire guy from your quote) were as kind and caring as your ego is overinflated you might have a shot in hell at a decent relationship.
> 
> I fucking hate objectification.



Clarification, please? Lol may be the way you are saying something, but I'm not quite getting this.


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## SuperSizedAngie (Apr 29, 2010)

Even as an SSBBW, I still get told all the time by FAs that I'm just not fat enough. It's very frustrating, because I'm beautiful just the way I am, and if I gain, I'll be doing it for myself, thank you, and not because some man thinks I need to.


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## thatgirl08 (Apr 29, 2010)

joswitch said:


> Just a suggestion -
> if you find questions about your weight / attitude to gaining to be upsetting - why not put words to the effect of that bolded above ^ in your forum sig / a sentence on your profile?



The thing is, this forum claims to not be all about wg.. if that's the case, why is a disclaimer necessary? Not to mention the fact it's pretty fucking rude in any situation to tell someone they need to change something about their body without any prompt from the person. I shouldn't have to have a disclaimer saying DON'T BE A SOCIALLY INAPPROPRIATE ASSHOLE TO ME. Like honestly, do people here leave their houses ever? Because I cannot imagine walking up to someone in person and being like, sup you need boob implants cause your tits are too small.. or whatever. Like, clearly the internet allows people to say shit they wouldn't in public, but how is that the receivers fault? It ain't.


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## Victim (Apr 30, 2010)

SuperSizedAngie said:


> Even as an SSBBW, I still get told all the time by FAs that I'm just not fat enough. It's very frustrating, because I'm beautiful just the way I am, and if I gain, I'll be doing it for myself, thank you, and not because some man thinks I need to.



Looks like you're gaining wisdom, which will get you a lot further in life.


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## sowhat (Apr 30, 2010)

msbard90 said:


> Clarification, please? Lol may be the way you are saying something, but I'm not quite getting this.



I was agreeing with your hatred of objectification, but I don't quite realize what I was going for because I was posting under the influence of Drambuie. I also tend to agree that people need to be more polite in general.

Basically, chalk that up to PUI. 

What I can say now is that I have been called and told horrible things that anyone that was raised to be polite wouldn't have said. Society and the FA community specifically(in this case), have these thoughts. But by all rights they should have the decency and tact to know what is appropriate to say, and when to say it. I've known some very sexist people, that you wouldn't know for quite a while because despite that character flaw, they STFU because of that decency and tact.


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## Weeze (Apr 30, 2010)

UMBROBOYUM said:


> Its not you that it was directed at. the Op.
> 
> You're fine.



lol oh, sorry, i directed my anger at the OP... who created this thread over a year ago. that's right, not the person responsible for bumping the shit storm.


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## LovelyLiz (Apr 30, 2010)

thatgirl08 said:


> The thing is, this forum claims to not be all about wg.. if that's the case, why is a disclaimer necessary? Not to mention the fact it's pretty fucking rude in any situation to tell someone they need to change something about their body without any prompt from the person. *I shouldn't have to have a disclaimer saying DON'T BE A SOCIALLY INAPPROPRIATE ASSHOLE TO ME.* Like honestly, do people here leave their houses ever? Because I cannot imagine walking up to someone in person and being like, sup you need boob implants cause your tits are too small.. or whatever. Like, clearly the internet allows people to say shit they wouldn't in public, but how is that the receivers fault? It ain't.



Bolded for truth. 

I was laughing as I was carrying out that line of argument to the farthest extreme and thinking, what next, each person I meet I have to say to them "Please don't punch me in the face" because if I don't, they might think it's okay?


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## t3h_n00b (Apr 30, 2010)

I had no exposure to the while "pleasure gaining" thing before I got here, and to be perfectly honest, I still think it's weird as hell.

I like plus sized women, but how plus sized they are is up to them. If they don't want to be plus sized at all, that's fine too. It might not be my thing sexually but w/e. There's a lot more to life than that. It grinds my gears to hear about guys being jackasses though. I guess there's no real escaping it. I just try to do my best to not be like that. And fwiw, my gf is a midsized bbw and people still look at us half-crazy when we go out.


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## mossystate (Apr 30, 2010)

thatgirl08 said:


> The thing is, this forum claims to not be all about wg.. if that's the case, why is a disclaimer necessary? Not to mention the fact it's pretty fucking rude in any situation to tell someone they need to change something about their body without any prompt from the person. I shouldn't have to have a disclaimer saying DON'T BE A SOCIALLY INAPPROPRIATE ASSHOLE TO ME. Like honestly, do people here leave their houses ever? Because I cannot imagine walking up to someone in person and being like, sup you need boob implants cause your tits are too small.. or whatever. Like, clearly the internet allows people to say shit they wouldn't in public, but how is that the receivers fault? It ain't.



^^^^

At some point, the fat woman has to be viewed as more than bait.


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## joswitch (Apr 30, 2010)

@thatgirl08 and mcbeth... I never suggested it was the complainee's "fault", in anyway at all... It was just a suggestion (not a life-guidance principle!) to maybe, very maybe, help cut down her annoyance / disappointment levels, given what was upsetting her... 
= "it's raining, try an umbrella"... 
The complainee (betty?) would rather choose to continue expecting that people will be a) polite and b) not make unsolicited queries to her re. gaining... She chooses to hold that expectation on the WorldWideWank that is the interweb in general and on Dims in particular which attracts curious/noob/obsessive feeder/encouragers in legions... = "it's been raining for years, i hope the sun comes out soon" 
Well, best of luck to her with that... :shrugs:


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## isamarie69 (Apr 30, 2010)

I honestly have never been approarched lol i guess i should be grateful. Im not asking to be either, I honestly have no interest in gaining or feeding, I actually have negative feelings towards it that i will keep to my self. I came to dims as a bbw site which i am. 

But my question is i don't know where i fit in as a bbw, Im a 24-26 for the most part sometimes a 22. I had always thought im just at the ssbbw side. We seem to be the ones that are left out in the cold. It seems most men that are into bbws want either the super sized or the cute chubby or thick ones. The men that do hit on me want to take me to bed but not to dinner or even a movie where its dark lol. I've been on dating sites and had several as i call them free dinners. I explain and explain my size have plenty of photos and still they act in shock when they meet me. After going on and on about how they like big girls. 

I guess what my question is (after my ranting) Is there really men out there that are honestly attracted to big girls. Or is it just men looking for easy sex? or is it they are ashamed of what they like so they want to keep it hidden. Im not talking about the feeders or people that like the extremes. I mean just your everyday run of the mill attraction.


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## indy500tchr (Apr 30, 2010)

isamarie69 said:


> I guess what my question is (after my ranting) Is there really men out there that are honestly attracted to big girls. Or is it just men looking for easy sex? or is it they are ashamed of what they like so they want to keep it hidden. Im not talking about the feeders or people that like the extremes. I mean just your everyday run of the mill attraction.



I've been told there are guys out there like that but I have yet to meet one.


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## KittyKitten (Apr 30, 2010)

That is true because the ones that get the most cheers on this board are the super sized bbws 350lbs +. The mid sized bbw have it the hardest because they are too big for the regular world yet not big enough for the average FA. The small bbws/plumpers have few problems in the regular world because they are in the uppermost end (boundary) of what so many regular guys/non FAs would date yet most FAs look past them and head for the SSBBWs.


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## Carrie (Apr 30, 2010)

happyface83 said:


> That is true because the ones that get the most cheers on this board are the super sized bbws 350lbs +. The mid sized bbw have it the hardest because they are too big for the regular world yet not big enough for the average FA.* The small bbws/plumpers have few problems in the regular world because they are in the uppermost end (boundary) of what so many regular guys/non FAs would date yet most FAs look past them and head for the SSBBWs.*


Are you talking about here at Dims, like in reference to weight cheering posts and threads, or in the real world? Because if it's the latter, I'm going to need your coordinates, please.


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## KittyKitten (Apr 30, 2010)

Carrie said:


> Are you talking about here at Dims, like in reference to weight cheering posts and threads, or in the real world? Because if it's the latter, I'm going to need your coordinates, please.



Then again, I live in the South. And that has been my experience.


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## SuperSizedAngie (Apr 30, 2010)

What I think is very funny is that my mother and I wear the same size clothes.... But I'm 5'9" and over 400lbs, and my mom is at 4'8" and weighs just over 235. We have very similar figures, except that she's just a lot shorter..... I'm not sure how she'd fit in with the FA community, because even though she's not an SSBBW weight-wise, figure-wise her circumference is similar to mind... 

Hmmm.....


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## CastingPearls (Apr 30, 2010)

SuperSizedAngie said:


> What I think is very funny is that my mother and I wear the same size clothes.... But I'm 5'9" and over 400lbs, and my mom is at 4'8" and weighs just over 235. We have very similar figures, except that she's just a lot shorter..... I'm not sure how she'd fit in with the FA community, because even though she's not an SSBBW weight-wise, figure-wise her circumference is similar to mind...
> 
> Hmmm.....


I don't think there's an actual FA scale but I think she falls in somewhere as a small SSBBW.


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## SuperSizedAngie (May 1, 2010)

CastingPearls said:


> I don't think there's an actual FA scale but I think she falls in somewhere as a small SSBBW.



Oh, I know that there's no FA scale. What's attractive to one may not be to another... It's just that I always hear people claiming that the "line of demarcation," as it were, lay at 350lbs. But that's just a bit nonsensical since everyone carries weight differently. There have been times when I have weighed less than I do now but looked bigger because more of it was fit and now I have quite a bit of muscle.


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## KittyKitten (May 1, 2010)

SuperSizedAngie said:


> Oh, I know that there's no FA scale. What's attractive to one may not be to another... It's just that I always hear people claiming that the "line of demarcation," as it were, lay at 350lbs. But that's just a bit nonsensical since everyone carries weight differently. There have been times when I have weighed less than I do now but looked bigger because more of it was fit and now I have quite a bit of muscle.



You're right, the scale doesn't mean anything. Muscle mass should be taken into account. When I worked out using strength training, I was around the same weight but I looked more compact.


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## joswitch (May 1, 2010)

@isamari / sir paulys girl - most of my long term relationships so far were with girls who were in the size 22-26 range... And yes we went out in public to bars/gigs and they met my friends... One gf even met my Mum and my brother - and *I* only get to see them once a year if I'm lucky... Oh and yeah I'm a bit of a feeder, but I worked out long ago how to play with/at it, just like folks play at BDSM or other fun stuff... So, no I never asked any of my BBW gfs to gain... And if I exist, am sure I'm not unique.. Actually I can think of two FA friends of mine who married their BBW gfs who again are in the size range we're talking of... And come to think of it most of the big girls I meet at parties come attached to a bf.. So hey don't give up!


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## isamarie69 (May 1, 2010)

joswitch said:


> @isamari / sir paulys girl - most of my long term relationships so far were with girls who were in the size 22-26 range... And yes we went out in public to bars/gigs and they met my friends... One gf even met my Mum and my brother - and *I* only get to see them once a year if I'm lucky... Oh and yeah I'm a bit of a feeder, but I worked out long ago how to play with/at it, just like folks play at BDSM or other fun stuff... So, no I never asked any of my BBW gfs to gain... And if I exist, am sure I'm not unique.. Actually I can think of two FA friends of mine who married their BBW gfs who again are in the size range we're talking of... And come to think of it most of the big girls I meet at parties come attached to a bf.. So hey don't give up!



LOL Thanks, I think theres a big difference between getting turn on by a girl eating, and full fledged gaining. Heck even The Cure sing about it. I'm just nosey if thats what you played with? I do not want to comment to much on the gaining feeder thing because i do not want to offend anyone or talk about something i do not understand. But thank you for your comments lol can you move those friends to cali?


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## isamarie69 (May 1, 2010)

And thank you Indy and Happy I was worried i was going to get alot of flack, but felt the need to say it.


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## Lamia (May 1, 2010)

I understand where your friend is coming from RollHandler. I think when I first came to Dims chat back in 1998 I expected to find that I was loved for being me. I was shocked as well to find out that yet again I wasn't good enough AS IS. Some people, men and women tend to lose touch with reality while chatting. They use you for masturbation material and don't care if you're offended they'll just move to the next chatter. Anonymity is the worst thing about the internet. Imagine how much nicer it would be if you could be held accountable for your actions online. 

I make a point to conduct myself the same online as in person. Once upon a time when the internet was new for me back 1996 I dabbled in a wilder side and learned some harsh truths about myself and grew as a person. I regret some of my actions, but as I don't plan to repeat them I feel free to forgive myself.


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## gobettiepurple (May 1, 2010)

joswitch said:


> @thatgirl08 and mcbeth... I never suggested it was the complainee's "fault", in anyway at all... It was just a suggestion (not a life-guidance principle!) to maybe, very maybe, help cut down her annoyance / disappointment levels, given what was upsetting her...
> = "it's raining, try an umbrella"...
> The complainee (betty?) would rather choose to continue expecting that people will be a) polite and b) not make unsolicited queries to her re. gaining... She chooses to hold that expectation on the WorldWideWank that is the interweb in general and on Dims in particular which attracts curious/noob/obsessive feeder/encouragers in legions... = "it's been raining for years, i hope the sun comes out soon"
> Well, best of luck to her with that... :shrugs:



*Perhaps you didn't understand my post . . . I was just making a general observation of my time on Dims, which by the way has been a whole whopping 3 DAYS! Jeeze, maybe my expectations are too high for people being human beings to one another . . . 

I was raised to be polite, so I guess I have to take some of the other people's advice that posted after you and make a general disclaimer of "PLEASE DONT BE AN ASSHOLE TO ME" . . . Just because people choose to be a different, sex obsessed alter-ego while online doesn't mean that we all have to put up with it. Just like women starve themselves to conform to society's concept of beauty, so to do we allow people to objectify us. 

I was just stating that its not okay, for me personally. Aren't we all entitled to our own opinion?

Thanks fellow BBW's, no matter your size, for standing up and not letting anyone push you around!
*


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## joswitch (May 1, 2010)

@betty - er.. You seem to think I was attacking you in some way.. No. 
I offered what I thought might be a helpful suggestion.. I understand the counter arguments you and others have put foward and I respect your position.. 
all I'm saying is that:
after years of reading complaints on here, just like yours, I don't hold out much hope for those random feedee-hunters to suddenly stop spamming and acquire manners/Netiquette... That is all. Please don't shoot the messenger. Thanks.


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## msbard90 (May 1, 2010)

joswitch said:


> @betty - er.. You seem to think I was attacking you in some way.. No.
> I offered what I thought might be a helpful suggestion.. I understand the counter arguments you and others have put foward and I respect your position..
> all I'm saying is that:
> after years of reading complaints on here, just like yours, I don't hold out much hope for those random feedee-hunters to suddenly stop spamming and acquire manners/Netiquette... That is all. Please don't shoot the messenger. Thanks.



Thumbs up


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## Lovelyone (May 17, 2010)

happyface83 said:


> That is true because the ones that get the most cheers on this board are the super sized bbws 350lbs +. The mid sized bbw have it the hardest because they are too big for the regular world yet not big enough for the average FA. The small bbws/plumpers have few problems in the regular world because they are in the uppermost end (boundary) of what so many regular guys/non FAs would date *yet most FAs look past them and head for the SSBBWs**.*




Well, speaking as one of the bigger ssbbw's I can tell you that the bolded portion of your comment is not exactly true. I've been a member of this site for more than 8 years and I can tell you that I get my fair share of snubbery, not only from the men but also from the women on this site.

On a regular basis I read posts here about how "more than a 250-300 lb. woman is too much" for certain men. They comment about how they couldn't "handle" that much, which in essence designates me as a weight rather than a person. I've chatted with numerous men on this site who tell me that an SSBBW is their fantasy but a smaller bbw is their reality. They "settled" for the smaller bbw not because they wanted her, but because accepting a smaller bbw in his life is easier than dealing with public response to their REAL desires. Its easier and far more socially acceptable for them to be seen with the smaller bbw's. They can go out with their non-FA friends and feel comfortable in the fact that they don't have to explain why there is a 500 lb woman on their arm, simply because they are dating the woman that is (how did you put it?) "in the uppermost end (boundary) of what so many regular guys/non FAs would date." Having a smaller bbw for a gf is TOTALLY more acceptable by societies standards than dating the women at the higher end of the bbw scale (pardon the pun). Please don't get me wrong. I feel that EVERY bbw--no matter what size she is--should be able to leave these forums with a feeling of empowerment and confidence, but that's just not the case for some. In some cases the apathy we feel comes directly from the people who should be the most supportive of us. 

I've had men from the chat room (and a couple from these forums) talk, flirt, want to talk about how sex is with a ssbbw, and finally ask me out--only to find out that behind my back they are tearing me down to other smaller women, commenting to them about how I must be dirty and unclean cos I am bigger than most people here, how I must be desperate for someone cos I am so fat, etc. Their reality is not the same as their fantasy. Neither is MINE. What I've come to realize is that MOST (not all) men who SAY they would date an SSBBW--only TALK the talk and don't walk the walk. Its kinda like going to someone's house for dinner and then telling them that you loved their cooking even though you spit it out into your napkin...they are just being polite. 

I can point out to you comments which are made--in a site designed for plus sized people and their admirers, no less--which are blatant fat bigotry at best. Personally I think that if you asked every woman who posts here... they could each find a reason on these forums that makes them feel marginalized, no matter what size they are.


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## Jes (May 17, 2010)

Lovelyone said:


> . Their reality is not the same as their fantasy. Neither is MINE. What I've come to realize is that MOST (not all) men who SAY they would date an SSBBW--only TALK the talk and don't walk the walk.



I am so sorry that this has been your experience! I think what you wrote above is really insightful and true. 

I think it's probably a grass-is-greener kind of thing, only...for some people, there's no green grass, just mud. There are as many men who would not date a 500 lbs woman as there are men who wouldn't date a 250 lbs woman, I'll bet. One of the problems with the internet is that it's talktalktalk, and very little action. Many people meet through the internet, so I assumed most people were open to that. But after I was a member here for awhile, I remember someone telling me that for many (and we were discussing men specifically though perhaps it's not limited to that), the current level of interaction (behind a computer screen) IS what the guys want. If they wanted to meet, they'd turn off the computer and come outside. That, for me, was a revelation. I'd been thinking that they wanted to meet and act on all of their words, because *I* did, but I think many of them are enjoying exactly the level of interaction that they want, just be being online. It explains a lot. So, maybe it's more that than the SS/BBW divide, Lovely...?


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## Lovelyone (May 17, 2010)

Jes said:


> There are as many men who would not date a 500 lbs woman as there are men who wouldn't date a 250 lbs woman, I'll bet. One of the problems with the internet is that it's talktalktalk, and very little action. Many people meet through the internet, so I assumed most people were open to that. But after I was a member here for awhile, I remember someone telling me that for many (and we were discussing men specifically though perhaps it's not limited to that), the current level of interaction (behind a computer screen) IS what the guys want. If they wanted to meet, they'd turn off the computer and come outside. That, for me, was a revelation. I'd been thinking that they wanted to meet and act on all of their words, because *I* did, but I think many of them are enjoying exactly the level of interaction that they want, just be being online. It explains a lot. So, maybe it's more that than the SS/BBW divide, Lovely...?



Yes, I think that is one of the points that I was trying to make. Thank you for being such a great wordsmith and making my point clearer, but I have to add that it's not just about actual meeting or dating someone, persay. I think its more of a matter the women here being used in a way, to fulfill a fantasy that they will NEVER act on.


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## superodalisque (May 17, 2010)

i don't think mid sized BBWs should worry very much about what they hear here, or anywhere else on the net for that matter re: BBWs. its not real. even if the guy may think its real at the time. most of them have never even dated an ssbbw seriously. a lot aren't able to handle the reality of that and all that means anyway. a midrange girl is more able to fit in with the rest of society in general. she is much more likely to be mobile. she can travel. doing things with her is not such a big deal. she can fit most places. she can even wear more fashionable clothes. a lot of ssbbws get dumped because after the sex and all of the role play guys still need a real partner in life. real life trumps everything. the slow waddling is cute until you miss a very important train or flight somewhere because of it. her not being able to fit in a seat somewhere is cute until he has to miss his fav concert because of it. a lot of guys online are not cut out to be with an ssbbw anyway. many aren't responsible enough. if they were they wouldn't have all of this free time to be here. its the guys who don't have the time who are capable. online peeps are fun but some don't even have the drive they need to make an income where they could even afford to be with an ssbbw. a number of them are not emotionally in tune enough to not make it all about them--hence the ease with which they can tell a woman that she needs to gain weight. its great to find someone physically desirable but if they really believe a distinct size is the real and only connection between a man and a woman?... some also just say that stuff because it makes them feel powerful to make someone else feel not good enough. so a mid sized girl shouldn't worry. you aren't missing out on much anyway. feel lucky. thats a not so good package you just avoided.


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## superodalisque (May 17, 2010)

isamarie69 said:


> I guess what my question is (after my ranting) Is there really men out there that are honestly attracted to big girls. Or is it just men looking for easy sex? or is it they are ashamed of what they like so they want to keep it hidden. Im not talking about the feeders or people that like the extremes. I mean just your everyday run of the mill attraction.



yes they are out there, but they don't come online trying to convince you that you are a freak--because they don't think you are one. they won't participate in that because they know its disrespectful and don't want to associate with it. you need to make sure you are out there IRL and give them a chance to meet you. and when they ask you out or tell you that they find you attractive believe them. give them the chance to ask you out and then say yes when they do.


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## missy_blue_eyez (May 17, 2010)

I havent read every single post in this thread, but I have to say the below quote rings so true for me too......



NancyGirl74 said:


> I've always been too big "out there" and too small "in here".




Id say Im a mid-large sized BBW around the 280-300lb area, and the amount of times Ive heard off guys 'Wow you'd be so hot if you had bigger thighs/an extra 100lb's/bigger arms/a larger ass' etc etc.....and all I could think was 'Man you'd be so hot if you had some social fuckin' awareness!' Needless to say, Ive learnt my lesson from dating 'those' kinds of guys, been there, done that, never going back! If you dont find me attractive so be it, I dont expect you too...jog on sunshine and harass the next girl...but this bbw aint changin'! But then those are the guys who are constantly going to be looking for 'the next bigger and better thing' (no pun intended) regardless of which girl they manage to be with at that time......and nobody really wants 'that' type of guy, so you know, its all relative!


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## Lovelyone (May 17, 2010)

superodalisque said:


> i don't think mid sized BBWs should worry very much about what they hear here, or anywhere else on the net for that matter re: BBWs. its not real. even if the guy may think its real at the time. most of them have never even dated an ssbbw seriously. a lot aren't able to handle the reality of that and all that means anyway. a midrange girl is more able to fit in with the rest of society in general. she is much more likely to be mobile. she can travel. doing things with her is not such a big deal. she can fit most places. she can even wear more fashionable clothes. a lot of ssbbws get dumped because after the sex and all of the role play guys still need a real partner in life. real life trumps everything. the slow waddling is cute until you miss a very important train or flight somewhere because of it. her not being able to fit in a seat somewhere is cute until he has to miss his fav concert because of it. a lot of guys online are not cut out to be that with an ssbbw anyway. they generally aren't responsible enough. if they were they wouldn't have all of this free time to be here. its the guys who don't have the time who are capable. online peeps are fun but some don't even have the drive they need to make an income where they could even afford to be with an ssbbw. a number of them are not emotionally in tune enough to not make it all about them--hence the ease with which they can tell a woman that she needs to gain weight. some just say that stuff because it makes them feel powerful to make someone else feel not good enough. so a mid sized girl shouldn't worry. you aren't missing out on much anyway. feel lucky. thats a not so good package you just avoided.



Hi Felecia, I agree with some of what you have to say in your post, especially the blue highlighted part. However I don't fully agree with the red highlighted part of what you say. I think to some degree you are right about that, but I also think that there are men who do walk the walk, too. There are plenty of examples on the forums of men who are with SSBBW's for the long haul and they are true fa's. 

We both know that in real life there are some men who use women (no matter what size they are) to get what they want, whether it be sex, money, a place to live, whatever. Speaking as an ssbbw, I can tell you that more often than not I am approached just for a sexual aspect than I am for a real relationship. I've found that some men are pretty upfront about wanting to sleep with, but not be in a relationship with an SSBBW. I think that their fantasies play out and they disappear, having gotten what they wanted in the first place--bragging rights.


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## Lovelyone (May 17, 2010)

missy_blue_eyez said:


> snip...But then those are the guys who are constantly going to be looking for 'the next bigger and better thing' (no pun intended) regardless of which girl they manage to be with at that time......and nobody really wants 'that' type of guy, so you know, its all relative!



THIS! I am a 500 lb woman and even *I* feel this way, too. sadly they keep looking for the bigger and better (or in some cases the smaller and more agile) instead of getting to know the fantastically amazing and wonderful woman who is in front of them here and now.


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## superodalisque (May 17, 2010)

Lovelyone said:


> Hi Felecia, I agree with some of what you have to say in your post, especially the blue highlighted part. However I don't fully agree with the red highlighted part of what you say. I think to some degree you are right about that, but I also think that there are men who do walk the walk, too. There are plenty of examples on the forums of men who are with SSBBW's for the long haul and they are true fa's.
> 
> We both know that in real life there are some men who use women (no matter what size they are) to get what they want, whether it be sex, money, a place to live, whatever. Speaking as an ssbbw, I can tell you that more often than not I am approached just for a sexual aspect than I am for a real relationship. I've found that some men are pretty upfront about wanting to sleep with, but not be in a relationship with an SSBBW. I think that their fantasies play out and they disappear, having gotten what they wanted in the first place--bragging rights.




i agree that there are a lot of great guys here. but they sure aren't the ones going around telling women that they are too small. they aren't the type to be telling a woman that something is wrong with her just the way that she is. if they have a fantasy of a woman being even bigger thats one thing. but i don't think they'd ever put it in those terms especially the first time they ever had something to do with them. they aren't on the net all of the time because they are busy with their careers getting their education together and other passions as well as loving their woman at home. when they were single, they generally went after what they liked and were polite to everyone else. i don't think those are the guys that make the mid sized BBWs feel marginalized here at all. i was talking about the ones who do.

sometimes i think ssbbws get unrealistic about what constitutes a decent guy. we make a lot of excuses for people, especially our friends. sometimes the harsh truth is that they aren't capable of being with an ssbbw. they should know what it takes. its romantic to say that stability doesn't matter but it does. an ssbbw takes a bigger chance with a guy than other women might have to just because of the physical realities that can come into play. so she really can't afford to let guys go with things that other women might. its a part of it. so being with a guy who thinks you are the big version of a skinny girl and gets angry when times are hard because you can't take a job where you might need to stand all day is not an option. saying you want an ssbbw and then not being able to, or not wanting to take care of her if she has temporary or permanent health issues is a problem.

besides the guys who are just there for sex or to take advantage in other ways, there are also a lot of relationship oriented guys who find they just can't handle it. they might be good guys but its not what they thought it was. places like dims romanticizes things for them. they read the fantasy stories. they read all of the cleaned up threads. lets face it, even ssbbws keep a whole lot of secrets and admonish people from talking about them publicly. so, it can be a rude awakening for guys with absolutely no experience to be with an ssbbw IRL after only talking to her online. when you push to have everything out in the open folks don't want it to be said because they get too embarrassed. but we can't have it both ways. if we're asking FAs and FFAs to step up to the plate we need to tell them what that plate is composed of. right now there isn't too much of that. plus our expectations aren't sufficiently meeting our needs. we have to raise the expectations for them so that they can really know if they can do it or not.


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## Jes (May 17, 2010)

Lovelyone said:


> to fulfill a fantasy that they will NEVER act on.



oh yes. A wise dimmer once said that there are fat wankers, who will never be fat fuckers or fat daters, and fat fuckers who will never be fat daters. But thank god, there are some fat wankers and fat fuckers who are also fat daters! yay!


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## Lovelyone (May 17, 2010)

superodalisque said:


> i agree that there are a lot of great guys here. but they sure aren't the ones going around telling women that they are too small. they aren't the type to be telling a woman that something is wrong with her just the way that she is. if they have a fantasy of a woman being even bigger thats one thing. but i don't think they'd ever put it in those terms especially the first time they ever had something to do with them.  they aren't on the net all of the time because they are busy with their careers getting their education together and other passions as well as loving their woman at home. when they were single, they generally went after what they liked and were polite to everyone else. i don't think those are the guys that make the mid sized BBWs feel marginalized here at all. i was talking about the ones who do.




I get what you are trying to portray here by saying that "these" types of men wouldn't be spending so much time on the internet, but I don't think that is necessarily true, either. There are a lot of responsible men who use the internet often. I have a good friend who is in college full-time, working full-time, plays soccer on the weekend, and helps to take care of his grandma. He is online everyday and in no way shape or form is he a kind of man who would marginalize women in this way. Personally I don't think its is good to paint men on the internet with such a broad brush. 

I can understand that the midsized bbw's might feel marginalized by someone telling them that they are not big enough for them and/or they should gain weight to look better...just as *I* might feel marginalized when someone tells me that I am TOO big for them. I think that the point I was trying to make is that ALL women in these forums can feel marginalized no matter what size they are. I AGREED with you on the fact that this can happen. 
Honestly, we've probably talked to a lot of the same guys, and I am sure that YOUR experience with them and MINE differ in many ways because even compared to me, you can be considered a smaller bbw (not that this is a bad thing cos EVERYONE standing next to me is a smaller person). I chat with feeders, FA's and regular guys--they all have their own ideas of what's acceptable. Some ASK up front what is acceptable to chat with me about, others do not--but what I've found to be true on here is that EACH man that I've talked to has an affinity for a plus sized woman in one way or another. Some want bigger women, some do not. DO I condemn them for wanting what they want? no. Do I think that they can handle things in a better fashion when chatting with the women on sites such as these? that's a resounding YES.


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## Lovelyone (May 17, 2010)

superodalisque said:


> snip
> 
> sometimes i think ssbbws get unrealistic about what constitutes a decent guy. we make a lot of excuses for people, especially our friends. sometimes the harsh truth is that they aren't capable of being with an ssbbw. they should know what it takes. its romantic to say that stability doesn't matter but it does. an ssbbw takes a bigger chance with a guy than other women might have to just because of the physical realities that can come into play. so she really can't afford to let guys go with things that other women might. its a part of it. so being with a guy who thinks you are the big version of a skinny girl and gets angry when times are hard because you can't take a job where you might need to stand all day is not an option. saying you want an ssbbw and then not being able to, or not wanting to take care of her if she has temporary or permanent health issues is a problem.
> 
> besides the guys who are just there for sex or to take advantage in other ways, there are also a lot of relationship oriented guys who find they just can't handle it. they might be good guys but its not what they thought it was. places like dims romanticizes things for them. they read the fantasy stories. they read all of the cleaned up threads. lets face it, even ssbbws keep a whole lot of secrets and admonish people from talking about them publicly. so, it can be a rude awakening for guys with absolutely no experience to be with an ssbbw IRL after only talking to her online. when you push to have everything out in the open folks don't want it to be said because they get too embarrassed. but we can't have it both ways. if we're asking FAs and FFAs to step up to the plate we need to tell them what that plate is composed of. right now there isn't too much of that. plus our expectations aren't sufficiently meeting our needs. we have to raise the expectations for them so that they can really know if they can do it or not.


 
Agreed, for the most part.


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## superodalisque (May 17, 2010)

yes, Lovelyone we can agree to agree 

but i still say any grown up man who'd say something like that on purpose knows exactly what he is doing. if he doesn't he has a learning disability or has been living in a hole. either way he is probably wrong for a mid sized or an ssbbw because she isn't a person for him. like you said basically, its ok to have a preference but not ok to be a jerk. we give people like that too much room here sometimes.


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## Angel (May 17, 2010)

superodalisque said:


> a lot of ssbbws get dumped because after the sex and all of the role play *guys still need a real partner in life*. real life trumps everything.



"*guys still need a real partner in life*"


SSBBW _can't_ be real partners?!?!?!?!*???* 


I know that you were just comparing the fantasies and expectations of the FA who don't have a clue as to what the realities are in the life of some SSBBW. However, the insinuation or hint that a SSBBW with physical limitations wouldn't qualify as someone _worthy enough_ to be considered as "a real partner" - or that she wouldn't be _good enough_ to be considered "a real partner in life" is absurd. Especially coming from a SSBBW. That sentence is akin to siding with every excuse ever made or voiced.

The one thing I have said over and over is that as long as excuses are made for those FA who either don't act maturely or who don't treat women with respect is that those FA will continue to act immaturely and will continue to treat women disrespectfully. As long as excuses are made for their negative attitudes and behavior, and as long as they are babied and coddled, they will never grow up and become confidant FA capable of having a real relationship with or capable of being a "real *partner*" in a relationship with a SSBBW (or BBW).


Maybe my expectations are just unrealistic. Maybe it's just unrealistic to expect that most FA would be like most other men. Maybe it's unrealistic to think that FA could possibly see a woman for more than her being fat. Maybe it's unrealistic to hope that FA would stop seeing the women they profess to admire as somehow _less than_ or as _not worthy enough_. Maybe it's unrealistic to hope that someday SSBBW and SSBBW with physical limitations will not be thought of - or treated as - second class citizens by some FA and by some BBW/SSBBW. 


Not directing the following at you, SuperO. I keep reading these digs aimed at those larger among us, and they are almost always ignored. Like it's ok to make those types of posts and comments. It's ok to be fat, but only up to a certain point, but beyond that size, feel free to backhandedly insult. Haven't we learned anything????? or are we just as ignorant and judgemental and uncompassionate as other jackasses in society????? For a site that is supposed to be about size acceptance and fat acceptance and the glorification and eroticism of fat bodies, why is there so much hypocrisy and disgust and hatred towards those whom inhabit fat bodies that are so much not unlike our own?


As far as being a "real partner", there is so much more to being a *real partner* than what a physical body is capable of. It isn't the physical capabilities or abilities that makes someone a *partner* in a relationship. Then again maybe I come from another world. Where I come from it's the emotional investment in each other and the commitment to each other that makes a *real* partnership or relationship. When a relationship is based upon what is in the heart and upon genuine feelings rather than upon only fantasy, infatuation, lust, and/or personal sexual gratification partners tend to be much more understanding when it comes to physical limitations. When someone really cares about another they don't base the successfulness of a relationship upon what another is physically capable of, at least not in my world. That could be said for both friendships and intimate relationships. 


In summation, SSBBW with physical limitations need (and that is only if they so desire) a *real* MAN who is mature and who is willing to be a real *partner* in life rather than some judgemental guy who is living in a fantasy world and just looking to explore his fantasies or to play with emotions. 


Sounds a little different that way. Doesn't it? (edited to add) I mean if we continue to validate the point that it is OK to discount someone as _not good enough_ because of the degree of fatness or because of their physical limitations because of such, then we are more or less saying it is fine to continue to do so.


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## joswitch (May 17, 2010)

superodalisque said:


> *snip* a lot of guys online are not cut out to be with an ssbbw anyway. many aren't responsible enough. * if they were they wouldn't have all of this free time to be here*. its the guys who don't have the time who are capable. online peeps are fun but some don't even have the drive *they need to make an income where they could even afford to be with an ssbbw*. *snip*



i.e. you're saying FAs who are on the web are worthless losers.
I've been reading words to this^ effect all over DIMS lately:

1) Time on the Internet thing vs. meeting people in RL thing: 
I know this is hard to credit for peeps in the USA/CAN where BBWs and SSBBWs are so numerous - but there's plenty of parts of the world (and I live in one) where BBWs are few and far between.... and unattached BBWs who are out in public in a social setting, appropriate to chat them up, are fewer still... sometimes to the extent that meeting one another online might be the ONLY way we might meet... 

2) Yeah it's been made crystal clear that only wealthy blokes need apply... I can see the why and wherefore too... 

I've always earned what I've needed to get by and to pursue my dreams, but money was never something I really cared about for itself... creating music & odd adventures were my priorities... So rather than sell more of my time, for more money, to buy more luxury, instead I cut back to the bone on luxury to minimise my needs... 

That cutting back has meant I've not lived in places or situations that are compatible/comfy with/for a gf above a certain size (e.g. a caravan from '98 - 2000, a narrowboat since autumn '07, my studio at other times) ok, that size is currently about UK 26/28, so not titchy... but still, I don't like having a "situational" upper limit... I've been lucky that over the years I've had LTRs with open minded BBWs who were up for being with weirdo-me in the odd places I've lived in... Needing someone *that* open-minded narrows my "dating-field" way down...

It's become clear to me that prerequisites to my seriously re-entering the dating "scene" are: selling my boat (the harshest winter in 50 years! made that decision soooo much easier for me!), earning more, travelling further afield to socialise, and living somewhere else more BBW friendly / comfortable - at least a place that has an indoor loo, mains water, heating, electric and requires less than ninja skills to maneuver in... I'm about ready for some of those things myself too... I dream of having a bath tub again for a start!

So yeah, message received and understood by one FA at least: 
BBWs need a certain level of material comfort/luxury and they want a guy who can afford to provide that... *working on it*


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## disconnectedsmile (May 17, 2010)

superodalisque said:


> a lot of guys online are not cut out to be with an ssbbw anyway. many aren't responsible enough. if they were they wouldn't have all of this free time to be here. its the guys who don't have the time who are capable. online peeps are fun but some don't even have the drive they need to make an income where they could even afford to be with an ssbbw. a number of them are not emotionally in tune enough to not make it all about them--hence the ease with which they can tell a woman that she needs to gain weight.



it sounds like you've had some bad romantic experiences, and i'm sorry for that.
but no thanks for generalizing and pigeon-holing FAs into one category.


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## superodalisque (May 17, 2010)

for the record, whats answers all of the above is that i was talking about the types of FAs who'd even tell a mid sized BBW she was too small in the 1st place. it says something about the type of guy we are talking about. i never once said all FAs were anything in my opinions.


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## superodalisque (May 17, 2010)

disconnectedsmile said:


> it sounds like you've had some bad romantic experiences, and i'm sorry for that.
> but no thanks for generalizing and pigeon-holing FAs into one category.



nope i've had marvelous ones in general. i guess thats why i'm very outspoken about bs when see it because i know for a fact that it can be different and it should be. thats particularly true when you realize that the treatment some women here get over the years can contribute to the wearing away of every inch of self acceptance they've managed to cultivate in themselves over the years.


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## superodalisque (May 17, 2010)

Angel said:


> "*guys still need a real partner in life*"
> 
> 
> SSBBW _can't_ be real partners?!?!?!?!*???*
> ...



i agree with you specially about the real partner thing. i was referring to guys who are stuck in a particular mindset that you find sometimes here. i think exposure to too many like that is what makes mid sized BBWs feel marginalized. they are the ones who love the looks of big but are happy to behave as if they are disgusted if it turns it something they hadn't bargained for or can't personally handle. things like shame about fat women going public, causing a financial strain or a societal strain of some kind by not being like everyone else. suddenly the Goddess is a pariah. and thats why a fantasy site anywhere is really not a good place to take people that seriously. its not necessarily about who a person really is or what they are really going to do. there are guys out there who are totally loyal to their SOs under all kinds of conditions. they actually love them and believe there is such a thing as love and affection. but someone who'll say things that would make any woman feel bad about her body on purpose is probably not the kind of guy who really cares about women and how they feel anyway. especially when they wouldn't like similar criticisms aimed at them.

those guys tend to feel a real partner in life is an SSBBW who floats around as though she is weightless. she never gets sick. she's never angry. she just happily eats and never has any physical problems. she can travel everywhere and do everything that he does and a guy like that gets impatient with her if she can't. she's cool girl who acts exactly like think ones no matter what, even if its not her nature or hurts her. as long as she keeps up the facade that she can and will always fit in and make thin people like her somehow. a lot of women here have stories about those particular guys and how they made them feel fatter in the negative sense more than they ever did before. i'm not saying there aren't any fantastic FAs because there are some. but a lot of them you won't find online a lot unless as Joswitch pointed out they are from somewhere where there really aren't any. that doesn't give every foreign FA a pass either. some of them can have even more of a problem than the ones born and bred right in the US simply because they MUST live in a fantasy world nearly all of the time. but people in the US have access to plenty. not having a clue probably means that either they are very young and inexperienced, which is understandable or they haven't been exploring what right in front of them and refuse to acknowledge that just maybe they might be possibly be doing something wrong.


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## superodalisque (May 17, 2010)

joswitch said:


> i.e. you're saying FAs who are on the web are worthless losers.
> I've been reading words to this^ effect all over DIMS lately:
> 
> 
> *



nope not saying that at all. i'm saying that the type of FA who'd tell a mid sized BBW that she is too small more than likely is, and she hasn't missed much. i mean, would you talk to a woman and make a point of telling her how you aren't attracted to her body and how she should change it to your specifications upon first contact? sometimes i think you are a tiny bit off the wall but i don't feel that you are entirely crazy 

as for the financial stuff at least you grasp the reality of it. you aren't making any empty promises and reneging on anybody when things get tight. but there are a lot of impractical and unrealistic people who do that and then blame it all on her being fat even when that was what they insisted on in the first place. ssbbws even get attacked for somehow finding ways to provide for themselves to the levels that they must for their health etc.... a lot are supposed to nibble around the margins of things like a website but not go too far with that. meaning not far enough to make any real money where they can be secure enough to actually consider being with a guy with absolutely no money at all. that is somehow frowned upon. but she can say and do the same things as long as she doesn't do it to the level where she actually has some kind of a choice in her life.

like you pretty much said its not about gold digging. its about being serious about the pressure that can easily ruin things for people who aren't clued in. pretending its otherwise would really be unfair to an FA. trying to act as though money is not an issue especially if a BBW doesn't have plenty of her own is irresponsible too. better to be honest about whats needed and whats important so that everyone can make an informed decision. one big problem is how much of a surprise a lot of this might be to some FAs particularly when the ssbbw he is dealing with looks so healthy judged on outside appearances. thats why sweeping things under the rug needs to stop.


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## superodalisque (May 17, 2010)

superodalisque said:


> nope i've had marvelous ones in general. i guess thats why i'm very outspoken about bs when see it because i know for a fact that it can be different and it should be. thats particularly true when you realize that the treatment some women here get over the years can contribute to the wearing away of every inch of self acceptance they've managed to cultivate in themselves over the years.



adding to the above:

the way i feel about a lot of things has to do directly with spending time with my heart in my throat after hearing people talk about how they had all of the newly won faith in themselves beaten out by people who really didn't care a lick about what happened to them after they'd had what they wanted. that includes people who were said to be popular,well admired and loved who ended up dying alone because none of the people who said they cared were there for them even just to talk. thats whats really upsetting to see people you care about getting their spirits broken for no good reason.


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## bigsexy920 (May 17, 2010)

This is so accurate. 



Lovelyone said:


> Well, speaking as one of the bigger ssbbw's I can tell you that the bolded portion of your comment is not exactly true. I've been a member of this site for more than 8 years and I can tell you that I get my fair share of snubbery, not only from the men but also from the women on this site.
> 
> On a regular basis I read posts here about how "more than a 250-300 lb. woman is too much" for certain men. They comment about how they couldn't "handle" that much, which in essence designates me as a weight rather than a person. I've chatted with numerous men on this site who tell me that an SSBBW is their fantasy but a smaller bbw is their reality. They "settled" for the smaller bbw not because they wanted her, but because accepting a smaller bbw in his life is easier than dealing with public response to their REAL desires. Its easier and far more socially acceptable for them to be seen with the smaller bbw's. They can go out with their non-FA friends and feel comfortable in the fact that they don't have to explain why there is a 500 lb woman on their arm, simply because they are dating the woman that is (how did you put it?) "in the uppermost end (boundary) of what so many regular guys/non FAs would date." Having a smaller bbw for a gf is TOTALLY more acceptable by societies standards than dating the women at the higher end of the bbw scale (pardon the pun). Please don't get me wrong. I feel that EVERY bbw--no matter what size she is--should be able to leave these forums with a feeling of empowerment and confidence, but that's just not the case for some. In some cases the apathy we feel comes directly from the people who should be the most supportive of us.
> 
> ...


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## superodalisque (May 17, 2010)

Jes said:


> I am so sorry that this has been your experience! I think what you wrote above is really insightful and true.
> 
> I think it's probably a grass-is-greener kind of thing, only...for some people, there's no green grass, just mud. There are as many men who would not date a 500 lbs woman as there are men who wouldn't date a 250 lbs woman, I'll bet. One of the problems with the internet is that it's talktalktalk, and very little action. Many people meet through the internet, so I assumed most people were open to that. But after I was a member here for awhile, I remember someone telling me that for many (and we were discussing men specifically though perhaps it's not limited to that), the current level of interaction (behind a computer screen) IS what the guys want. If they wanted to meet, they'd turn off the computer and come outside. That, for me, was a revelation. I'd been thinking that they wanted to meet and act on all of their words, because *I* did, but I think many of them are enjoying exactly the level of interaction that they want, just be being online. It explains a lot. So, maybe it's more that than the SS/BBW divide, Lovely...?



exactly a guy IRL is a guy about action. if a net guy is serious he'll soon convert to IRL anyway.


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## superodalisque (May 18, 2010)

Les Toil said:


> I remember the very first couple months of discovering the Dim Board over a decade ago, I used to talk to a certain popular BBW over the phone. The first time she told me about guys wanting to rub her belly, I assumed she would follow their request with a slap to their faces. But she didn't. She told me that such a request was a tremendous compliment to a BBW (at least the ones she was friends with).
> 
> I also remember how utterly shocked I was to see women on the Weight Board post their weight anywhere and everywhere they had the chance. For my entire life I was told women don't reveal such things--not even to their own husbands! So I learned early there was a sense of pride that went along with a large weight number on Dimensions--at least with the more ostentatious women. I still find it fascinating you couldn't get smaller women to reveal their weight under _any_ circumstance, but there's an ample amount of big women that will tell you their weight without having to ask them for it!
> 
> Point being, I think a lot (not all!) of FAs within this community have learned a different set of chivalry standards about women. In all honesty, I'd say a lot of that comes from hanging around the Paysite Board way too much. On that board the guys are surrounded by women that ONLY talk about gaining weight and how much they weigh. It's like the dude here that recently posted about being surprised to hear some woman in his office was married to a man heavier than her. You lose touch with life beyond this place.



exactly. a lot of guys have been misled and don't know how to treat fat women IRL anymore. most would have a really hard time ever making a connection out in public with the kinds of attitudes i often see here. the dismissiveness and the condescension would never make it. what really saddens me is that there are attempts to actually mirror this fantasy lala land out in the real world. and unfortunately its easier to pass it by a lot of ssbbws in particular who've never dated outside of the community and never go out to see how the other half lives. sometimes expectations can be very low. and i think that some people would like to keep it that way even if they know better.

re: weight. some of the heavier women reveal their weight as a part of the lifting of the shame. i know that i do. i've always felt that to get rid of the shame women feel around age and weight etc.. is freeing. i tell both to anyone who asks both inside and outside of the community. but i think the guys here experience it in a different way and i'm definitely sure that a lot (not all) of women here use it specifically to titillate and would never say the same in other venues. its not necessarily about body pride for everybody. its a way to get attention and also a way to make a buck as well. 

i think it would serve FAs well to think about the kinds of reactions they get when they say the things they do here to a BBW in the wild. its not the same is it? thats not how most BBWs really react. thats not how most BBWs really think --even a lot of web models who say differently. remember that its their job-to try to project something that they think pleases you enough to spend your money. but a real BBW isn't exactly the same. and, also a lot of BBWs here are afraid to step outside the program or they get lamb basted. or they are made to feel they have to compete with a webmodel ideal that gets thrown at them. 

anything negative a woman says about a portion of FA behavior all of a sudden gets characterized as a hatred of all FAs. BBWs who depend on this place for their romantic lives are made to fear that they will drive potential FAs away and that there is absolutely no chance for them outside of the community. it doesn't matter what those of us say who are in or have been in long termed committed relationships with men outside of this. its discounted as somehow untrue and negatively motivated. so generally lot of things have to go unsaid by BBWs except in private--until lately. and when they are said in public they are intentionally misread because people just want you to shut up and keep playing, afraid that FAs will take their balls and go home. i've seen that threat made many times in the open. so basically if fat women don't lie to FAs and tell them what they'd like to hear then maybe they won't even get play online anymore. its a pitiful threat but its there. and thats the saddest thing of all. women shouldn't have to operate that way. they shouldn't just have to shut up and cooperate with the status quo. and men should have sense enough to know whats real and whats not at some point--unless they'd really rather not know or keep the pretense going.


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## bigmac (May 18, 2010)

Lovelyone said:


> On a regular basis I read posts here about how "more than a 250-300 lb. woman is too much" for certain men. They comment about how they couldn't "handle" that much, which in essence designates me as a weight rather than a person. I've chatted with numerous men on this site who tell me that an SSBBW is their fantasy but a smaller bbw is their reality. They "settled" for the smaller bbw not because they wanted her, but because accepting a smaller bbw in his life is easier than dealing with public response to their REAL desires. Its easier and far more socially acceptable for them to be seen with the smaller bbw's. They can go out with their non-FA friends and feel comfortable in the fact that they don't have to explain why there is a 500 lb woman on their arm, simply because they are dating the woman that is (how did you put it?) [/COLOR]"in the uppermost end (boundary) of what so many regular guys/non FAs would date." Having a smaller bbw for a gf is TOTALLY more acceptable by societies standards than dating the women at the higher end of the bbw scale (pardon the pun).




I think that this is more or less true. Although I wouldn't describe it as "settling" for a smaller BBW. When it comes to sex guys tend to go to extremes (if you need proof go at a video store on the seedy side of town). However, when it comes to actually dating (i.e. companionship as was as sex) we tend to be more pragmatic. You're right in that guys will only date girls that are "acceptable" -- of course this means different things to different people. In my circles it would be totally unacceptable to date a dull uneducated woman. My wife is smart and definitely not dull, therefore, no one in my family or circle of friends has ever said anything about the fact that she weighs over 350lbs. The five women I previously had serious relationships with were all small to mid-size BBWs who were also bright, educated, successful, and had strong personalities. These women were "acceptable" to date//marry because of who they were -- the fact they were fat was secondary.

That said there are significant barriers SSBBWs face when attempting to procure the education and success that would make them "acceptable". The barriers are not nearly as high for small to mid-sized BBWs. 





superodalisque said:


> i don't think mid sized BBWs should worry very much about what they hear here, or anywhere else on the net for that matter re: BBWs. its not real. even if the guy may think its real at the time. most of them have never even dated an ssbbw seriously. a lot aren't able to handle the reality of that and all that means anyway. a midrange girl is more able to fit in with the rest of society in general. she is much more likely to be mobile. she can travel. doing things with her is not such a big deal. she can fit most places. she can even wear more fashionable clothes. a lot of ssbbws get dumped because after the sex and all of the role play *guys still need a real partner in life*. real life trumps everything. the slow waddling is cute until you miss a very important train or flight somewhere because of it. her not being able to fit in a seat somewhere is cute until he has to miss his fav concert because of it.



This is very true -- guys do need a real partner in life. And its true in the thin world as well (the successful executive may casually date a cute waitress but he's not going to marry her). To live a middle-class life these days a families generally need two decent incomes -- thus the unfortunate truth that SSBBWs who are too fat to work are at a grave disadvantage. While physical accommodations such as seating can usually be dealt with (planning and creativity), its been my experience that a substantial number of SSBBWs just don't have the energy to actually get out and enjoy life on a daily basis. So yes smaller BBWs do have advantages.


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## isamarie69 (May 18, 2010)

superodalisque said:


> yes they are out there, but they don't come online trying to convince you that you are a freak--because they don't think you are one. they won't participate in that because they know its disrespectful and don't want to associate with it. you need to make sure you are out there IRL and give them a chance to meet you. and when they ask you out or tell you that they find you attractive believe them. give them the chance to ask you out and then say yes when they do.




Boy you have been a busy bee, But thank you for your encouragement. I know i just have to keep an open mind and I will find something that excites me


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## Lovelyone (May 18, 2010)

bigmac said:


> I think that this is more or less true. Although I wouldn't describe it as "settling" for a smaller BBW. When it comes to sex guys tend to go to extremes (if you need proof go at a video store on the seedy side of town). However, when it comes to actually dating (i.e. companionship as was as sex) we tend to be more pragmatic. You're right in that guys will only date girls that are "acceptable" -- of course this means different things to different people. In my circles it would be totally unacceptable to date a dull uneducated woman. My wife is smart and definitely not dull, therefore, no one in my family or circle of friends has ever said anything about the fact that she weighs over 350lbs. The five women I previously had serious relationships with were all small to mid-size BBWs who were also bright, educated, successful, and had strong personalities. These women were "acceptable" to date//marry because of who they were -- the fact they were fat was secondary.
> 
> That said there are significant barriers SSBBWs face when attempting to procure the education and success that would make them "acceptable". The barriers are not nearly as high for small to mid-sized BBWs.
> 
> ...



BigMac--In using the term "settled" in my post, I used the EXACT words that those men used to explain to me why they are miserable in their marriages. I was not using my own words, hence the quotes. IN THEIR eyes they settled for something acceptable, instead of going after what they really wanted....simply because they did not want to be persecuted for their preferences. 
As for dating women...its not all about physical attraction, you are correct in that aspect, however you look at it--physical attraction IS usually the FIRST thing that draws most people to someone. I think its wonderful that you have a wife who is not dull and uneducated but had you fallen in love with someone who was dull and uneducated (and by your definition unacceptable in your circle of friends and family) would your proclivity have been to marry her? doubtful.

And finally, I will address what you said here...

"The five women I previously had serious relationships with were all small to mid-size BBWs who were also bright, educated, successful, and had strong personalities. These women were "acceptable" to date//marry because of who they were -- the fact they were fat was secondary.

That said there are significant barriers SSBBWs face when attempting to procure the education and success that would make them "acceptable". The barriers are not nearly as high for small to mid-sized BBWs ."

The fact that you had to insinuate that a formal education and being successful would make ssbbw's more acceptable, simply proves my point. Basically what that says to me is that by being fat, we have to work HARDER at getting and having what thin to "acceptable fat-sized" people 
have. I think that mind-set is disgraceful. 

And for your information...speaking as an ssbbw I can tell you that to THEM their fat was not secondary. It is the main part of whom they are, and part of their whole being. (and this is the exact reason why so many people who've lost hundreds of pounds of weight and can be considered "normal-sized" STILL feel fat person angst inside themselves.) Their personalities were developed as part of being a fat girl. For our whole lives we've had to either laugh WITH people when they were making fun of us --to fit into the group..or fight against it and stand out of the group. For me, it was a matter of trying to maintain my dignity and develop my self worth, all-the-while trying to convince people that I was not a disgusting, gross, dirty, slovenly, unkempt person, with no morals or self-control. As an ssbbw, I carry with me all the the insecurities of the many years of doubt and frustration that society heaped upon me. Every time someone called me a derogatory name or made me feel less acceptable because of my size...it left one more dent or hole in my psyche. That's not something that we easily forget. I think that some people just aren't aware of that, or just don't care (especially people who've never had the experience of being overweight at any point in their lives.) 
Sure, communities like this one can help--although sometimes I wonder if they do not also hinder us in a way, because we feel a false sense of security from them. I do not believe for one minute that every confident, successful, educated overweight woman has never felt those slight undertones of being unaccepted. Its a daily struggle for some of us. Sometimes, even looking in the mirror can have a devastating affect on the rest of our day because when WE look in the mirror all we can hear in our heads is those words that people threw so effortlessly in our faces. "You are fat, fat is ugly, fat is disgusting, fat is gross, fat is unacceptable." What we should be hearing is "You are beautiful just the way that you are, you are amazing and talented, funny, intelligent, and kind to others. You have a good heart, and people love you just because they can."


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## CastingPearls (May 18, 2010)

Lovelyone--You deserved rep for that but apparently the rep gods are not being generous but you summed it up perfectly. As a SSBBW I too walk the fine line between loving myself unconditionally while being pressured to conform and being condemned by those in this very community for being not exactly like them, which to even the most confident person can be very discouraging. Keep up the good fight. You aren't at all alone.


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## Lovelyone (May 18, 2010)

apparently I have also been frozen out by the rep Gods today (I think I repped you yesterday and I need to spread the rep-loving around, which kinda sounds like a rep STD...but I digress). Consider yourself informally repped.


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## joswitch (May 18, 2010)

Lovelyone said:


> *snip* I think its wonderful that you have a wife who is not dull and uneducated but had you fallen in love with someone who was dull and uneducated (and by your definition unacceptable in your circle of friends and family) would your proclivity have been to marry her? doubtful.
> 
> And finally, I will address what you said here...
> 
> ...




When bigMac said...
"bright, educated, successful, and had strong personalities"
he meant that's what makes WOMEN acceptable as his date/mate in his social circle/family - *regardless* of their size.

and when he said:
"there are significant barriers SSBBWs face when attempting to procure the education and success"
he wasn't attacking SSBBWs or putting them down -
I understood he was referring to / acknowledging the very real situation of lack of physical provision in Uni campuses and suchlike for big folks and/or people with limited mobility.... I've read at least one thread on here talking about that very issue...


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## Lovelyone (May 18, 2010)

joswitch said:


> When bigMac said...
> "bright, educated, successful, and had strong personalities"
> he meant that's what makes WOMEN acceptable as his date/mate in his social circle/family - *regardless* of their size.
> 
> ...



I think its great that you read into it what you read into it. So did I. These forums are for posting ideas, thoughts, comments about how you feel about a post that has been written. I did just that.


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## superodalisque (May 18, 2010)

Lovelyone said:


> BigMac--In using the term "settled" in my post, I used the EXACT words that those men used to explain to me why they are miserable in their marriages. I was not using my own words, hence the quotes. IN THEIR eyes they settled for something acceptable, instead of going after what they really wanted....simply because they did not want to be persecuted for their preferences.
> As for dating women...its not all about physical attraction, you are correct in that aspect, however you look at it--physical attraction IS usually the FIRST thing that draws most people to someone. I think its wonderful that you have a wife who is not dull and uneducated but had you fallen in love with someone who was dull and uneducated (and by your definition unacceptable in your circle of friends and family) would your proclivity have been to marry her? doubtful.
> 
> And finally, I will address what you said here...
> ...




i'm sorry but i have to disagree with this. there are barriers but an education is possible especially if an SSBBW is aware and ready to take the risks. i was an SSBBW most of the way through college career--a true SSBBW. i haven't been midsized since highschool. i may seem smaller but i definitely fit the size and weight requirements. i was able to make it. i even teach now with all of the walking etc... even though i'm still recovering. there are other SSBBWs here who do physically demanding things as well. a lot more people who teach , lots of nurses managers etc... and there are a lot who've been able to shape their career based on the level of their physical abilities too. 

probably a key is getting as much under their belts as young as possible as well but i know SSBBWs who are my age and are going back to school. and there are tons of young ones here who are going as we speak. not to say there is anything wrong with anyone without a degree. i know a lot of women who haven't touched a campus and can think circles around anyone i know but the truth is we live in a classist society. i think Bigmac was being totally honest about whats really going on out there. it may not sound nice but its the truth. i don't think he was referring to anyone's character or personal worth just stating a fact about what really comes into play when people are talking about preference. preference isn't just physical and just being fat might not be enough. as an SSBBW i am more likely to be initially interested in someone educated. not because i'm a snob or i need someone to take care of me but because thats my stereotype of the kind of guy i'd like to talk to everyday. it would be a preference for me and i can fully understand it if that were one for a guy as well.

i'm not so sure that some SSBBWS don't go to school mainly because of their size. i think they don't go mostly because of the lack of emotional support. you need family friends and institutions that believe in you and don't treat you as though you can't achieve.


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## Lovelyone (May 18, 2010)

superodalisque said:


> i'm sorry but i have to disagree with this. there are barriers but an education is possible especially if an SSBBW is aware and ready to take the risks. i was an SSBBW most of the way through college career--a true SSBBW. i haven't been midsized since high school. i may seem smaller but i definitely fit the size and weight requirements. i was able to make it. i even teach now with all of the walking etc... even though i'm still recovering. there are other SSBBWs here who do physically demanding things as well. a lot more people who teach , lots of nurses managers etc... and there are a lot who've been able to shape their career based on the level of their physical abilities too.
> 
> probably a key is getting as much under their belts as young as possible as well but i know SSBBWs who are my age and are going back to school. and there are tons of young ones here who are going as we speak. not to say there is anything wrong with anyone without a degree. i know a lot of women who haven't touched a campus and can think circles around anyone i know but the truth is we live in a classist society. i think Bigmac was being totally honest about whats really going on out there. it may not sound nice but its the truth. i don't think he was referring to anyone's character or personal worth just stating a fact about what really comes into play when people are talking about preference. preference isn't just physical and just being fat might not be enough. as an SSBBW i am more likely to be initially interested in someone educated. not because i'm a snob or i need someone to take care of me but because thats my stereotype of the kind of guy i'd like to talk to everyday. it would be a preference for me and i can fully understand it if that were one for a guy as well.
> 
> i'm not so sure that some SSBBWS don't go to school mainly because of their size. i think they don't go mostly because of the lack of emotional support. you need family friends and institutions that believe in you and don't treat you as though you can't achieve.




Pardon me for asking Felecia, but are you disagreeing with me or the highlighted quote that I had in my posting about how "...That said there are significant barriers SSBBWs face when attempting to procure the education and success that would make them "acceptable". The barriers are not nearly as high for small to mid-sized BBWs"? 

Just for the record, I agree with you that an education is very, very important and is achievable for anyone and everyone who has the inclination to go to college. As far as I am concerned, you and I are on the same page regarding ssbbw's. I think it's important to get an education, but i don't think that its a necessity to being "accepted". That's a slap in the face to every housewife, single mom, care-giver, etc who is overweight and does not have a college education. 
My comment is in response to what was said about ssbbw's being MORE acceptable as long as they are educated and successful. I don't think that is true at all. I know many women who aren't college educated and are perfectly acceptable the way they are. I know women who struggle with finances, who don't fit the 'successful by societal standard' ideal...but they feel completely successful as mothers, workers, laborers, entrepreneurs, etc. I just think that whole...'its possible that you will be more acceptable if you are college educated and successful' is bullshit. Just my honest opinion.


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## LovelyLiz (May 18, 2010)

Lovelyone said:


> SNIPPED
> My comment is in response to what was said about ssbbw's being MORE acceptable as long as they are educated and successful. I don't think that is true at all. I know many women who aren't college educated and are perfectly acceptable the way they are. I know women who struggle with finances, who don't fit the 'successful by societal standard' ideal...but they feel completely successful as mothers, workers, laborers, entrepreneurs, etc. I just think that whole...'its possible that you will be more acceptable if you are college educated and successful' is bullshit. Just my honest opinion.
> [/COLOR]



I totally agree with you that people of all levels of education are acceptable and worthwhile as they are. But I think Bigmac's point was that in his particular friend group, where the majority of the people in the group do have a lot of formal education, that is something that they look at more in a partner than whether she is fat or not. Certainly a woman who doesn't have a college education is still acceptable in her own right and can make meaningful and important contributions to the world, I don't think that's part of the debate here, but the issue was more whether she fit the spoken/unspoken standards of that particular friend group.

There are lots of friend groups where a fat woman, by virtue of her being fat, would not be "acceptable" to the standards of that particular group of friends. I think most of us fat women have experienced that first-hand, or have at least seen it. Bigmac was just drawing a contrast to say that in his case, it's not the fat, it's the education that is the "dealbreaker" standard - and if someone has the education, the fatness isn't really that big of a deal. (And that this acceptability was specific to his particular group, and not about whether the woman is acceptable in general.)


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## Lovelyone (May 18, 2010)

mcbeth said:


> I totally agree with you that people of all levels of education are acceptable and worthwhile as they are. But I think Bigmac's point was that in his particular friend group, where the majority of the people in the group do have a lot of formal education, that is something that they look at more in a partner than whether she is fat or not. Certainly a woman who doesn't have a college education is still acceptable in her own right and can make meaningful and important contributions to the world, I don't think that's part of the debate here, but the issue was more whether she fit the spoken/unspoken standards of that particular friend group.
> 
> There are lots of friend groups where a fat woman, by virtue of her being fat, would not be "acceptable" to the standards of that particular group of friends. I think most of us fat women have experienced that first-hand, or have at least seen it. Bigmac was just drawing a contrast to say that in his case, it's not the fat, it's the education that is the "dealbreaker" standard - and if someone has the education, the fatness isn't really that big of a deal. (And that this acceptability was specific to his particular group, and not about whether the woman is acceptable in general.)



This is exactly what I am addressing. I AM educated(and now have explained for the second time in this thread)that I UNDERSTAND what he was TRYING to point out. All I am saying is that I, personally get offended when someone uses the crap line that being educated and successful means that you might more acceptable to society--or rather that not having an education and a ton of money from a successful job makes you less acceptable to society if you are fat. Its pretty clear cut and has a rather condescending tone to me.

We are sorry your thread got sidetracked, we now resume you yo your regularly scheduled programming and continue on with how mid-sized bbw's feel marginalized. Thank you for your participation.


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## LovelyLiz (May 18, 2010)

Lovelyone said:


> This is exactly what I am addressing. I AM educated(and now have explained for the second time in this thread)that I UNDERSTAND what he was TRYING to point out. All I am saying is that I, personally get offended when someone uses the crap line that being educated and successful means that you might *more acceptable to society*--or rather that not having an education and a ton of money from a successful job makes you *less acceptable to society *if you are fat. Its pretty clear cut and has a rather condescending tone to me.



I guess I feel like there's a difference between "acceptable to society" and "acceptable within a specific group of friends." Saying that someone who doesn't have an education is not acceptable to society, I agree, is crap. But saying that most of your friends are really educated, etc., and that people that tend to fit in with and be accepted by the group also tend to be really educated; well, that may not be ideal, but I think it's reality. There are other friend groups where someone who IS very educated is not going to be acceptable or fit in, because the group is made up of people who haven't put an emphasis on formal education in their lives, but on other things. 

Whether for good or ill, it does seem that people of a similar social/educational/economic status do tend to congregate together. I personally like to mix it up, and I'm sure others do too, but it can also be easier to be around people who have tended to value similar goals in their lives.

What it comes down to is the stereotype included in bigmac's post that ssbbw's tend to be less educated because of the obstacles in the way to gain that education. That might be worth debating. (And also possibly more relevant to the thread?  I promise to stop side-tracking now too...)


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## Lovelyone (May 18, 2010)

mcbeth said:


> I guess I feel like there's a difference between "acceptable to society" and "acceptable within a specific group of friends." Saying that someone who doesn't have an education is not acceptable to society, I agree, is crap. But saying that most of your friends are really educated, etc., and that people that tend to fit in with and be accepted by the group also tend to be really educated; well, that may not be ideal, but I think it's reality. There are other friend groups where someone who IS very educated is not going to be acceptable or fit in, because the group is made up of people who haven't put an emphasis on formal education in their lives, but on other things.
> 
> Whether for good or ill, it does seem that people of a similar social/educational/economic status do tend to congregate together. I personally like to mix it up, and I'm sure others do too, but it can also be easier to be around people who have tended to value similar goals in their lives.
> 
> What it comes down to is the stereotype included in bigmac's post that ssbbw's tend to be less educated because of the obstacles in the way to gain that education. That might be worth debating. (And also possibly more relevant to the thread?  I promise to stop side-tracking now too...)



Terri loves your post.  
lol I adore these forums because I can have a discussion with intellectual people who can make a point and show me a different side to things. Isnt that what its all about? Now I take my leave and let the mid-sized lovelies have their thread.


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## superodalisque (May 18, 2010)

Lovelyone said:


> Pardon me for asking Felecia, but are you disagreeing with me or the highlighted quote that I had in my posting about how "...That said there are significant barriers SSBBWs face when attempting to procure the education and success that would make them "acceptable". The barriers are not nearly as high for small to mid-sized BBWs"?
> 
> Just for the record, I agree with you that an education is very, very important and is achievable for anyone and everyone who has the inclination to go to college. As far as I am concerned, you and I are on the same page regarding ssbbw's. I think it's important to get an education, but i don't think that its a necessity to being "accepted". That's a slap in the face to every housewife, single mom, care-giver, etc who is overweight and does not have a college education.
> My comment is in response to what was said about ssbbw's being MORE acceptable as long as they are educated and successful. I don't think that is true at all. I know many women who aren't college educated and are perfectly acceptable the way they are. I know women who struggle with finances, who don't fit the 'successful by societal standard' ideal...but they feel completely successful as mothers, workers, laborers, entrepreneurs, etc. I just think that whole...'its possible that you will be more acceptable if you are college educated and successful' is bullshit. Just my honest opinion.




yes i disagree. i don't think its anymore difficult for an SSBBW than anything else she has to do in life. so whether an education is challenging to get or not it doesn't matter. not getting one is very hard too. its not a slap in anyone's face. an education makes an SSBBW more acceptable to many people. it gives her more choices and flexibility. as one with an education i can say i face a lot less abuse because people back up quite a bit when they find out what my credentials are. it might not be fair. it might not recognize all of the real contributions of women who don't have a degree but thats the unfortunate reality right now. thats one thing thast pretty much the same for fat and thin women. education is just as much of a protection for fat as it is for being black as well. it mitigates at least some of the prejudice you have to face. *and as i said before i don't devalue women who don't have an education and i know they are, many times, much brighter than women who have one. i find all people acceptable. but if you're asking for the acceptability of society thats another thing altogether. society is not just me and what i think. * i won't insult another SSBBWs intelligence by pretending that it doesn't make a difference in society. but what i feel and think has nothing to do with how people are actually viewed. any person in this country or even abroad who has an education is given certain credits for that. i empathize with what you're saying but thats not how society is working for the most part. i wish it would.


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## bigmac (May 18, 2010)

Lovelyone said:


> BigMac--In using the term "settled" in my post, I used the EXACT words that those men used to explain to me why they are miserable in their marriages. I was not using my own words, hence the quotes. IN THEIR eyes they settled for something acceptable, instead of going after what they really wanted....simply because they did not want to be persecuted for their preferences.



Guys will always tell their mistresses (or mistress prospects) that their wife doesn't meet their needs in some way. 



Lovelyone said:


> As for dating women...its not all about physical attraction, you are correct in that aspect, however you look at it--physical attraction IS usually the FIRST thing that draws most people to someone.



Very true -- but good looks only gets you so far. As Felicia said guys are looking for a life partners. Men and Women both tend to hook up with people with similar interests and aspirations when they choose long-term partners (of course both sexes are less choosy regarding short-term flings). One of my points was that midsized BBWs don't have nearly as many barriers when it comes to education and careers -- in effect disagreeing with the proposition that midsized BBWs are marginalized. 




Lovelyone said:


> I think its wonderful that you have a wife who is not dull and uneducated but had you fallen in love with someone who was dull and uneducated (and by your definition unacceptable in your circle of friends and family) would your proclivity have been to marry her? doubtful.



An irrational question -- I wouldn't have fallen in love with a dull uneducated woman -- both deal breakers.



Lovelyone said:


> The fact that you had to insinuate that a formal education and being successful would make ssbbw's more acceptable, simply proves my point. Basically what that says to me is that by being fat, we have to work HARDER at getting and having what thin to "acceptable fat-sized" people
> have. I think that mind-set is disgraceful.



Yes fat people do have to work harder at being educated and successful (of course thin people have to work too). And yes being educated and professionally employed is a prerequisite for consideration as a long-term mate for many guys (and women too). Harsh as this may seem its the truth -- if I'd been an unemployed high school drop out I would never have gotten a second date with my wife (hell I'd never have gotten a first date).



Lovelyone said:


> And for your information...speaking as an ssbbw I can tell you that to THEM their fat was not secondary. It is the main part of whom they are, and part of their whole being. (and this is the exact reason why so many people who've lost hundreds of pounds of weight and can be considered "normal-sized" STILL feel fat person angst inside themselves.) Their personalities were developed as part of being a fat girl.



When I said their fat was secondary I was talking about how other people saw them. My wife and I socialize mostly with thin people -- her friends don't see her as a fat person -- she's just their friend.

I think what I'm trying to say is that its possible to live a full life as a fat person. Again -- it'll be harder for a SSBBW than a midsized BBW -- but that doesn't mean its impossible for SSBBWs.


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## indy500tchr (May 18, 2010)

bigmac said:


> 1. Yes fat people do have to work harder at being educated and successful (of course thin people have to work too).
> 
> 2. And yes being educated and professionally employed is a prerequisite for consideration as a long-term mate for many guys (and women too). Harsh as this may seem its the truth -- if I'd been an unemployed high school drop out I would never have gotten a second date with my wife (hell I'd never have gotten a first date).



1. Can I ask why you think that fat people have to work harder to become educated and successful? Does the fat affect our intelligence? 

Apparently I was lucky b/c I seemed to do just fine in college, got my degree, and a job which I have been in since I've graduated. All the while being fat.

2. And I do love those guys who don't have a job or car who think they are doing me a favor for wanting to date me. I too have standards such as yourself.


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## Nutty (May 18, 2010)

I have and will help support poor people conflicted with their weight, either deemed too fat by non-FAs or not too fat FAs. Personally I like any sized bbw or ssbbw, as long as they are nice and have a good personality (like all the ones I have met in Dimensions). So we need to show full appreciation for middle sized bbws or bhms because they could be doing something else with their time instead of participating in Dimensions ( We need to show appreciation to all bhms, bbws, ssbbws, and FAs, but in this circumstance show middle sized bbws and bhms that they have a special place here).


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## bigmac (May 18, 2010)

indy500tchr said:


> 1. Can I ask why you think that fat people have to work harder to become educated and successful? Does the fat affect our intelligence?
> 
> Apparently I was lucky b/c I seemed to do just fine in college, got my degree, and a job which I have been in since I've graduated. All the while being fat.



I've noticed and been told about many logistical problems fat people experience when they go to college. Most can be overcome but it takes some effort. Some examples: 1) there was a 600lb woman in several of my undergrad sociology classes -- she could only take a half load because it took her extra time to do many things; 2) my wife was about 500lbs when she started college -- she had to arrange for special seating in all her classes, get a disabled student parking pass (this required a doctors certification), and had to take adaptive physical education (PE was a graduation requirement). *fat people don't need to study any harder* -- but they may need to plan better and be more patient.

Regarding employment -- I think its indisputable that many fat people have a hard time getting hired. Using my wife for an example again -- she's a social worker. She started as a welfare to work intern and almost didn't get hired a regular county employee because a supervisor thought she was too fat to do the job (she went to the director when she didn't make the list -- a gusty move many fat people would not have the balls to do). Also, she didn't get promoted until she lost 100lbs.


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## Lovelyone (May 19, 2010)

bigmac said:


> Guys will always tell their mistresses (or mistress prospects) that their wife doesn't meet their needs in some way.
> 
> In no way shape or form did I say that these men I chatted with were interested in making me or anyone else their mistress. Men and women can have chats without it being sexual. I have plenty of male friends whom I chat with and our conversation have nothing to do with sex.
> 
> ...




Sorry I haven't figured out how to use the multi-quote button yet, I guess that makes me technologically unintelligent. heh. I highlighted my response to you in purple. I already typed that I was going stop posting on this thread so this is the last response I will give about how I feel about this subject. Take advantage, write what you want cos I will not respond again. 
*Exits thread*


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## Russell Williams (May 22, 2010)

About 20 years ago (and no I do not know where she is now) I had a coversation with Carolyn Owens. In the conversation she was lamenting that mid-size women at NAAFA conventions got all the attention and the supersized women were largely ingnored. That was her opinion.

When I asked other women at that gathering I could find none that agreed with Carolyn, but then again most of them were not supersized.


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## BigBeautifulMe (May 31, 2010)

bigmac said:


> I've noticed and been told about many logistical problems fat people experience when they go to college. Most can be overcome but it takes some effort. Some examples: 1) there was a 600lb woman in several of my undergrad sociology classes -- she could only take a half load because it took her extra time to do many things; 2) my wife was about 500lbs when she started college -- she had to arrange for special seating in all her classes, get a disabled student parking pass (this required a doctors certification), and had to take adaptive physical education (PE was a graduation requirement). *fat people don't need to study any harder* -- but they may need to plan better and be more patient.
> 
> Regarding employment -- I think its indisputable that many fat people have a hard time getting hired. Using my wife for an example again -- she's a social worker. She started as a welfare to work intern and almost didn't get hired a regular county employee because a supervisor thought she was too fat to do the job (she went to the director when she didn't make the list -- a gusty move many fat people would not have the balls to do). Also, she didn't get promoted until she lost 100lbs.


Sorry, Terri, but I'm absolutely going to have to agree with him here. 

It IS harder to get an education as a supersized woman. First of all, we face educational discrimination just like we face job discrimination. This means we are less likely to be accepted to more selective universities. I fully believe that had I had a face-to-face interview instead of a phone interview I never would have gotten into the college I attended. I was one of only two or possibly three supersized women on campus. 

Secondly, once we are accepted, we face challenges like getting ourselves around campus (many are made with primarily pedestrian modes of transportation in mind and don't have convenient, close parking spots to every class. I was able to do the walking around campus, fortunately, but had I been 20 years older and this size I might not have had the physical capacity to do that) and incredibly small desks in classrooms. My college classrooms had those tiny, attached desk/chair combos that not even half my body fit into. I dreaded the classes I had to sit through with my leg and butt going numb and painful, and had I been embarrassed of my fatness I might not have had the cojones to go to the Disabilities office and demand accommodating seating. And don't get me started on the tiny beds in college housing...

There are definitely many barriers to a formal education for supersized women that there are not for smaller women. I'm not saying it's not possible (It is! I did it), I'm just saying there are obstacles. 

And all this doesn't even take into account the fact that fat women are paid less than their thin counterparts, so are less likely to be able to afford to attend college, or to pay their student loans back afterwards...


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## FatAndProud (May 31, 2010)

This thread is totally going to make me write a weight paper for my social inequality class. I think thin people need to hear the truth.


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## bigmac (May 31, 2010)

BigBeautifulMe said:


> Sorry, Terri, but I'm absolutely going to have to agree with him here.
> 
> It IS harder to get an education as a supersized woman. First of all, we face educational discrimination just like we face job discrimination. This means we are less likely to be accepted to more selective universities. I fully believe that had I had a face-to-face interview instead of a phone interview I never would have gotten into the college I attended. I was one of only two or possibly three supersized women on campus.
> 
> ...



Excellent points.

My oldest daughter will be going to UC San Diego this fall -- she's either a large BBW or small SSBBW. I'm hoping she'll be able navigate the obstacles -- I'm pretty sure she'll be OK though -- she's learned a lot from her step mom about being a fat girl at college.

I've got to say I hadn't thought about the dorm bed issue. Luckily my daughter did -- its the main reason she's going to be living off campus with a roommate from high school.

Those desk//chair combos need to be outlawed (luckily there does seem to be a trend away from them). I could never get my legs under them with any comfort (I'm 6'4").

And yes, all the large campus's I've ever visited are definitely pedestrian oriented (which is great for students using public transport). This leads to a good example. At the 35,000 student University of Alberta I never gave a second thought to the distance between classrooms when registering for classes (as a 19-23 year old running between classes along icy paths and over snow banks was not a problem). In contrast super-sized students would either have to schedule classes near each other or not schedule back to back classes. Just an example of something super-sized student have to deal with -- traditional campuses were designed for young athletic students. Those who don't fit that category must work a little harder.

That said I think its very important for non-traditional students to enroll in college and to make there needs know. Its the only way school administrators will know not to order inflexible seating when planning new classrooms and to plan better for people with mobility issues when laying out new campuses.


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## indy500tchr (May 31, 2010)

BigBeautifulMe said:


> *snip*
> 
> And all this doesn't even take into account the *fact* that fat women are paid less than their thin counterparts, so are less likely to be able to afford to attend college, or to pay their student loans back afterwards...



Can I ask where you get your facts from? Because I know for a fact that I get paid more than a lot of my fellow teachers with the same or more years of experience than me. The school I work for doesn't have a set pay scale based on years of experience. We are given raises based on our merit. 

Your experience might be different but you are also in a different, and more public, carrier than I am. Heck you probably get paid more than I do but I chose a career that is known to be severely underpaid.

Just be mindful not to lump ALL of us into the category of not getting paid what we deserve b/c of our size.


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## bigmac (May 31, 2010)

indy500tchr said:


> Can I ask where you get your facts from? Because I know for a fact that I get paid more than a lot of my fellow teachers with the same or more years of experience than me. The school I work for doesn't have a set pay scale based on years of experience. We are given raises based on our merit.
> 
> Your experience might be different but you are also in a different, and more public, carrier than I am. Heck you probably get paid more than I do but I chose a career that is known to be severely underpaid.
> 
> Just be mindful not to lump ALL of us into the category of not getting paid what we deserve b/c of our size.



There have been many studies finding that the obese earn less -- here's a link to one news story.

http://abcnews.go.com/Health/story?id=117168&page=1

Of course there are always exceptions. My wife makes more money than most people with her level of education too -- this does not undermine the fact that as a group the obese earn less.


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## BigBeautifulMe (Jun 1, 2010)

Believe me, girlie, I wish it weren't true. But as bigmac says, multiple studies have proved it's true. Fat people make less than their thin counterparts, just like women still make less than men.

A 2007 study by the U.S. Department of Labor finds "a statistically significant continual increase in the wage penalty for overweight and obese white women followed throughout two decades." 

Here's the paper from the study: http://www.bls.gov/ore/pdf/ec070130.pdf

Here's a study showing that being fat can actually help men's chances for being promoted, but hinders women's significantly:

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,513549,00.html

(I know, I know, I'm not a Fox News fan either but it's quoting a study by UMich - you can google to find news coverage of the same study elsewhere. It's just late and I need to get to bed.)

Also, In their paper “Bias, Discrimination, and Obesity,” Rebecca Puhl and Kelly Brownell found that, “Overweight and obese job applicants and workers may be subjected to weight-based discrimination in employment. Numerous studies have documented discrimination in hiring practices, especially when the positions sought involved public contact, such as sales or direct customer service. Obese workers face inequities in wages, benefits, and promotions, and several studies have confirmed that the economic penalties are greater for women than for men. *Overweight women earn less doing the same work as their normal-weight counterparts and have dimmer prospects for promotion*.”

I really, really wish it weren't true, turtle, but I'm afraid it is.


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## toni (Jun 1, 2010)

bigmac said:


> I've noticed and been told about many logistical problems fat people experience when they go to college. Most can be overcome but it takes some effort. Some examples: 1) there was a 600lb woman in several of my undergrad sociology classes -- she could only take a half load because it took her extra time to do many things; 2) my wife was about 500lbs when she started college -- she had to arrange for special seating in all her classes, get a disabled student parking pass (this required a doctors certification), and had to take adaptive physical education (PE was a graduation requirement). *fat people don't need to study any harder* -- but they may need to plan better and be more patient.



I was in the mid 300's when I was in college. I hated it! That was the main reason I dropped out. I was the only one of that size in any of my classes and I didn't fit in most of the desks. I finished the semister and ran to a tech school (better seating). That was almost 10 years ago and I still regret it. 

I admire any bbw/ssbbw who toughed it out and earned their education. It is a rough road.


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## KittyKitten (Jun 2, 2010)

This is a very interesting thread with great discussions.


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## Dr. Feelgood (Jun 2, 2010)

happyface83 said:


> This is a very interesting thread with great discussions.



I agree; nevertheless, I have a bone to pick.  Many posters have been talking as though education = schooling. It doesn't. Schooling has to do with courses, exams, grades, transcripts, and diplomas: it is a kind of certification, something that someone else gives you. Education is what you give yourself. A diploma isn't an education, though it may be evidence of one. But a diploma may equally be evidence of taking easy courses, cheating on tests, or having a father who made a large donation to the college. No one would accuse Socrates, Queen Elizabeth I, or Abraham Lincoln of being uneducated, but none of them went to college. I agree with BigMac that a dull, uneducated woman would not appeal to me (even if she had a Ph.D). OTOH, I appreciate and admire anyone who is intellectually curious and interested in many different things, because -- to me, at least -- that is what education is.

P.S.
Toni, no regrets. You are an educated person. Your posts show it.


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## bigmac (Jun 3, 2010)

Dr. Feelgood said:


> I agree; nevertheless, I have a bone to pick.  Many posters have been talking as though education = schooling. It doesn't. Schooling has to do with courses, exams, grades, transcripts, and diplomas: it is a kind of certification, something that someone else gives you. Education is what you give yourself. A diploma isn't an education, though it may be evidence of one. But a diploma may equally be evidence of taking easy courses, cheating on tests, or having a father who made a large donation to the college. No one would accuse Socrates, Queen Elizabeth I, or Abraham Lincoln of being uneducated, but none of them went to college. I agree with BigMac that a dull, uneducated woman would not appeal to me (even if she had a Ph.D). OTOH, I appreciate and admire anyone who is intellectually curious and interested in many different things, because -- to me, at least -- that is what education is.
> 
> P.S.
> Toni, no regrets. You are an educated person. Your posts show it.



I agree with most of what you say. I've met people who claim to have graduate degrees who are dumb as posts. That said I do think that formal education at institutions _with real standards_ is a great benefit to most people. There's a natural tendency for even the intellectually curious to limit the depth of ones self study -- reading articles in Scientific American just isn't the same as taking a year long organic chemistry class. Intensity is also an issue -- the curricula at good institutions push students to their limits -- which I think is a good thing -- the classes everyone bitches about -- the ones where most of the people who start end up dropping the course -- these are the classes where people really learn.

FYI: I have no use for some of the feel good stuff that passes for scholarship in many institutions and departments today -- and have been accused of being an elitist. As the parent with two kids in university I want my kids to have to work their butts off.


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## Adrian (Jun 3, 2010)

There is no substitute for common sense! Unfortunately, to many people 'don't' have it.


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## joswitch (Jun 3, 2010)

Adrian said:


> There is no substitute for common sense! Unfortunately, to many people 'don't' have it.



Sense is not, in fact, common....


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## Never2fat4me (Jun 5, 2010)

Couple of things I would like to address.

First, I agree that doing well in school does not necessarily correlate with being smart. I consider myself pretty intelligent, but I know people just as smart, if not smarter, than me who didn't finish (or even start) college. That said, college degrees open doors. Just look at how many good jobs require a college degree; without one, you are at a severe disadvantage. (I am not suggesting you actually need a degree to do these jobs - frequently you don't - but you still need one to be considered.)

Second, there was an interesting little discussion about whether being obese actually makes you earn less. Since the focus was on studies, another set of studies suggests that if you are poor with little education, you are more likely to be obese. I'm not saying this is necessarily the case - really just putting this out there for discussion - but if being poor/ill-educated means you are more likely to be fat, then could this be a contributing factor as to why other studies find fat people are underpaid? I.e., is the correlation that being fat people means you are likley to be stuck in a lower paying job or is it that lower paying jobs attract people more likely to be fat? I am not sure there is a clear answer out there; I always have problems with studies looking at people with the "same" job - unless you can point to a company where there are two people doing the same work and one is paid less than the other, then there are too many other variables to do a good comparison. (For example, fat people are more likely to have image problems and may not be as self-confident as "average" size/thin people to ask for a raise, so does their being fat make them paid less or their lack of self confidence make them paid less?) I certainly recognize that there is discrimination in hiring/promotion practices, but I am not as convinced by the correlation between being fat and getting paid less.

Chris


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## BigBeautifulMe (Jun 5, 2010)

Chris, this sentence:



> fat people are more likely to have image problems and may not be as self-confident as "average" size/thin people to ask for a raise, so does their being fat make them paid less or their lack of self confidence make them paid less?



is exactly one of the arguments sexist employers try to use to justify wage disparities between men and women doing exactly the same job for them. Don't you think the authors of such studies would have thought of "other variables?" I do. Read the studies, and/or studies showing wage disparities between men and women. You'll see exactly what is and is not taken into account.

In my opinion, (and this is only my opinion), it's a vicious cycle. 

For example, let's say I get paid less for doing the same job. I can't eat as healthy, because when my grocery budget is only $125 a month, or sometimes less (this is actually true) I have to buy pre-packaged, less healthy stuff, and very little fresh produce, because the healthy stuff is more expensive. As a result I get fatter. I'm lucky that I personally can afford a car and to get out to other safer areas to go walking (and I only can because I don't pay rent). But say I couldn't afford a car because I had to pay rent. I live in an area where it's absolutely not safe to go walking by myself at any time of day. So, no way to get exercise. As a result, I would get fatter. As a result of both of those things making me fatter, I get paid even less. I absolutely believe being fat is a class issue.


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## Never2fat4me (Jun 8, 2010)

BigBeautifulMe said:


> Don't you think the authors of such studies would have thought of "other variables?" I do. Read the studies, and/or studies showing wage disparities between men and women. You'll see exactly what is and is not taken into account.
> 
> In my opinion, (and this is only my opinion), it's a vicious cycle.



While I agree with your conclusions, BBMe - that this is a class issue and a vicious cycle - the studies you cited (in your post above) looking at the influence of weight on salary (which is a different issue than wage disparities between men and women) really only compare people with people of similar background/at a similar stage in life, not people doing the same job. They look at variables like the number of years in the workforce, education (both what you obtained and your parents' education level), marriage status, and how many kids you have. And then they come to the conclusion that you are likely to earn less if you are fat (though one only came to that conclusion for white women - I find that hard to believe), which is different than saying you will make less for doing the same work. This tends to support the hypothesis that you get discriminated against in hiring for being fat and end up in a lower-paying job, but not that you will necessarily be paid less for being fat.

Chris


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## BigBeautifulMe (Jun 8, 2010)

Even if the conclusion *you've* come to is entirely true (and I don't agree - read *more* than just those two studies [as I said before, including those that look solely at disparity in pay for genders] and you'll see)...

Discrimination in hiring still ends up with the exact same result - fat people earning less money solely because they're fat. Why does it even matter if it comes in the form of us getting paid less for the same job, or us not getting hired for better jobs in the first place? Either way it leads to the same place. Both avenues disprove your theory that fat people only get paid less because they "don't have enough self-esteem to ask for a raise."


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## Tooz (Jun 8, 2010)

i like how mid-size "bbw" continue to be marginalized here because the conversation has taken a turn towards "ssbbw" problems.


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## BigBeautifulMe (Jun 8, 2010)

Not sure what you mean. Employment discrimination and accommodation issues in education are not exclusive to SSBBWs.


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## Blackhawk2293 (Jun 8, 2010)

rollhandler said:


> Ive been tossing the idea around about a gripe I have in relation to how I see women getting treated around this site and not only whether or not to say something about it, but HOW to get my point across concisely and in the spirit that it is meant. I am hurt, I am pissed, I am ashamed at times here in Dimensions.
> 
> I chat with a number of fat women. A few have been concerned and one in particular has come straight out and asked if she even belonged here because she simply felt as if she was "in between both worlds" and expressed concern that she just didn't fit in here because she didn't feel as if she was fat enough.
> 
> ...



Firstly I would like to apologise on behalf of men... we are not all like those f#%king morons that act that way.

Personally I prefer a woman that feels comfortable in her own skin and size no matter whether they're BBW, SSBBW or other acronyms. The confidence combined with the physical traits is what I find attractive.


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## Dr. Feelgood (Jun 8, 2010)

BigBeautifulMe said:


> Not sure what you mean. Employment discrimination and accommodation issues in education are not exclusive to SSBBWs.



I'm not even sure that fatphobes "see" mid-sized people as being different from supersized ones: I've certainly heard people use words like "huge" to describe what I would call mid-sized people.


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## Never2fat4me (Jun 8, 2010)

Dr. Feelgood said:


> I'm not even sure that fatphobes "see" mid-sized people as being different from supersized ones: I've certainly heard people use words like "huge" to describe what I would call mid-sized people.



That is an interesting question. I think you are probably right if you are referring to someone who is very fat-phobic; I think there may be a more nuanced view of fat people (i.e., they view "mid-size" BBWs less negatively than supersize BBWs) among the majority who are more mildly fat-phobic.

Literature would also seem to suggest that discrimination against the "mildly obese" is less than that against the "very obese," at least when it comes to income.

Chris


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## Never2fat4me (Jun 8, 2010)

BigBeautifulMe said:


> Either way it leads to the same place. Both avenues disprove your theory that fat people only get paid less because they "don't have enough self-esteem to ask for a raise."



We'll have to agree to disagree on the issue of wage discrimination for doing the same work, but you need to be fair now in your critique, Ginny, and not put words in my mouth that are not there. You are a good student of the English language, so I know you must appreciate the difference between something being raised as an example of why fat people might be paid less for doing the same work vs. your suggestion that I have said this is the only reason they get paid less. There is a big difference between the two.

Chris


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## disconnectedsmile (Jun 11, 2010)

BigBeautifulMe said:


> Discrimination in hiring still ends up with the exact same result - fat people earning less money solely because they're fat. Why does it even matter if it comes in the form of us getting paid less for the same job, or us not getting hired for better jobs in the first place? Either way it leads to the same place. Both avenues disprove your theory that fat people only get paid less because they "don't have enough self-esteem to ask for a raise."


the "don't have enough self-esteem to ask for a raise" theory is fundamentally broken, as it presumes all fat people have low or no self-esteem.
that's just my view, though.


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## lucidbliss (Jun 11, 2010)

rollhandler said:


> Ive been tossing the idea around about a gripe I have in relation to how I see women getting treated around this site and not only whether or not to say something about it, but HOW to get my point across concisely and in the spirit that it is meant. I am hurt, I am pissed, I am ashamed at times here in Dimensions.
> 
> I chat with a number of fat women. A few have been concerned and one in particular has come straight out and asked if she even belonged here because she simply felt as if she was "in between both worlds" and expressed concern that she just didn't fit in here because she didn't feel as if she was fat enough.
> 
> ...



i understand the thoughts on pressure to gain also ...... AND some of the SSBBW women find there to be pressure not to lose.....in some ways a lot of men that find SSBBW's attractive do so because of fetish.... i just want to be me ... big or small ..large or HUGE .... i don't care.... as a person i have a lot to offer and I found the perfect man that loves me in any form .... so i say that women should not categorize themselves .... and just be a woman ....I Know i have caught myself saying sometimes that a person isn't really a BBW and wonder why they are on here..... only because i don't stop and think about exactly what the standard of acceptance in society is today ..... i see them and i think they are just really pretty normal size girls to me ..i also realize that a lot of men find one shape more appealing "the pear"..i was always so jealous because i felt like if i had to be bigger why didn't I the big hips and small waist!!.. so its all a lot of marginalizing in all physicality i guess........... but I guess if you don't feel like you fit in anywhere... make your own category ..or you could be really brave and realize there is no mold to put yourself in ... everyone is beautiful...


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## RJI (Jun 11, 2010)

disconnectedsmile said:


> the "don't have enough self-esteem to ask for a raise" theory is fundamentally broken, as it presumes all fat people have low or no self-esteem.
> that's just my view, though.



I agree, I am fat and without a doubt one of the most confident people you will ever meet. I also work in an office with dozens of large men and women and I don't believe any of them lack an ounce of confidence or have low self esteem. 

The only large people I ever see who lack confidence are the ones who suffer from depression etc and have become shut ins/reclusive and would be the same way if they were thin. 

Maybe it is just my region but most of the large people I encounter truly embrace the motto " Large and In Charge".


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## bigmac (Jun 21, 2010)

Just found this article about workplace discrimination based on looks (including obesity):

http://www.alternet.org/books/14722...ur_looks_could_cost_you_your_job/?page=entire

The article advocates both anti-discrimination legislation and union membership as antidotes. The Nevada casino cases were interesting -- unionized waitresses successfully fought arbitrary weight requirements while a nonunion bartender lost when she fought requirements that she wear makeup and tease her hair. Union membership is one of the few ways workers can stand up and fight arbitrary management decisions.


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## jenboo (Jun 22, 2010)

Mini said:


> I'll just come right out and say it: Some of the men here are clueless, feckless assholes. They know who they are, and they can fucking take it up with me if they wish to.
> 
> I do not know to whom you refer, but let me say that EVERYONE is welcome here, and I hope you don't let these twats scare you off from what is otherwise a wonderful, supportive community.



haahaa, awesome!!


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## FrankBell (Nov 11, 2015)

Cool thread


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## Dromond (Nov 12, 2015)

Holy necromancy, Batman!


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## RabbitScorpion (Nov 12, 2015)

Dromond said:


> Holy necromancy, Batman!



Indeed, but it is a worthwhile thread that I only now discovered as its last previous posts got buried before I found Dims.

What happened back then was awful

This place is about acceptance and respect.

FWIW, I'm attracted to "moderate BBW" (BMI 35-50, women most men say they would not date, but that somehow are seen in most of the wedding announcements in the local newspaper), personally, I see no desire to be involved in "feederism".


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## Deannie (Jan 10, 2016)

Dr. Feelgood said:


> I'm not even sure that fatphobes "see" mid-sized people as being different from supersized ones: I've certainly heard people use words like "huge" to describe what I would call mid-sized people.




Thanks Dr. Feelgood. Here I am mid-size, but in the word I am just fat. I am okay with being fat, but let us be realistic about how society sees us ladies. I wear plus sizes, I have the dreaded "morbidly obese" on my medical chart, and I deal with the same stigma. Although I grant that SSBBWs can face more obstacles than I do, we are all in the same boat.


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## PrincessAmanda (Jan 13, 2016)

Great Thread,

I've also felt like I'm too big for mainstream and too small for most men who love fat girls  

I think everyone just wants someone to love them for who they are. Not just because they are fat, tall or thin etc. 

A girl can dream *sigh*


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## BBW MeganLynn44DD (Jan 18, 2016)

Very interesting post,my husband never pressured me,but never discouraged me to lose.I know he likes me large,we've had so many talks about it.If I wanted to lose,I could.He married me for me.Just a large me comes with the territory.I've gotten some really rude comments and just brush them off.Amazing for years I was told to lose weight,now I'm not big enough!!!I'm happy with me,and that's all that matters.


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## fuelingfire (Jan 19, 2016)

I have been/am in the situation where my partner wants to lose weight but then states they can’t because I wont be attracted to them anymore. This is extremely frustrating to me. I don’t choose my partner solely for looks. I do profile by size, but then personality is a huge factor afterwords. I do not choose to start relationships with thin women, but would embrace someone I love losing weight. I like being in long term relationships, and want my partner to be healthy. I fully encourage them to get healthy. (I exercise a lot and eat a vegan diet) I don’t live in a fantasy world.
 It makes me feel creepy when I have to start explaining that they are not a piece of meat or an object. “ I will be happy as long as you are not boney.” My attraction to larger women it a spectrum not an exact size. It’s not just the bigger the better. I really don’t have an ideal size, other than not boney. It’s a depressing conversation to keep having. And it’s not a realistic thing to worry about, it very rare for someone to go from 300ish pounds down to 140ish and maintain that weight.
My ex-wife blamed me many times for “letting” her get fat, despite me fully supporting her with dieting and exercise. I never once encouraged her to gain weight. In the year that we have been divorced, it doesn’t look like she lost a pound.


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## Deannie (Jan 19, 2016)

Fuelingfire: I am sorry you have had this experience. People should not be blamed by other people regarding weight. I have a medical condition for which "obesity" is essentially a symptom/side effect. This makes it easier for me to understand and accept. Perhaps these women do not understand why they are fat so they blame it on you. Unfair! No one can "make" someone fat or thin. We are who we are. That is okay. It is okay to be fat. There are all types of bodies. Unfortunately this reality is not accepted by many people.


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## bigmac (Jan 19, 2016)

fuelingfire said:


> ... And its not a realistic thing to worry about, it very rare for someone to go from 300ish pounds down to 140ish and maintain that weight. ...



With WLS this is no longer true. My wife used to weigh 522 lbs -- today she's 155.


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## bigmac (Jan 19, 2016)

PrincessAmanda said:


> Great Thread,
> 
> I've also felt like I'm too big for mainstream and *too small for most men who love fat girl*s
> 
> ...




Guys who like fat girls tend to be easily distracted by the biggest body in the room. However, after a while many guys start noticing the mid-sized BBWs.


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## Green Eyed Fairy (Jan 19, 2016)

bigmac said:


> Guys who like fat girls tend to be easily distracted by the biggest body in the room. However, after a while many guys start noticing the mid-sized BBWs.



And not all necessarily like "biggest" but some seem to have a body type preference.


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## loopytheone (Jan 20, 2016)

fuelingfire said:


> I have been/am in the situation where my partner wants to lose weight but then states they cant because I wont be attracted to them anymore. This is extremely frustrating to me. I dont choose my partner solely for looks. I do profile by size, but then personality is a huge factor afterwords. I do not choose to start relationships with thin women, but would embrace someone I love losing weight. I like being in long term relationships, and want my partner to be healthy. I fully encourage them to get healthy. (I exercise a lot and eat a vegan diet) I dont live in a fantasy world.
> It makes me feel creepy when I have to start explaining that they are not a piece of meat or an object.  I will be happy as long as you are not boney. My attraction to larger women it a spectrum not an exact size. Its not just the bigger the better. I really dont have an ideal size, other than not boney. Its a depressing conversation to keep having. And its not a realistic thing to worry about, it very rare for someone to go from 300ish pounds down to 140ish and maintain that weight.
> My ex-wife blamed me many times for letting her get fat, despite me fully supporting her with dieting and exercise. I never once encouraged her to gain weight. In the year that we have been divorced, it doesnt look like she lost a pound.



This reminds me a lot of me and my ex. When we broke up he accused me of 'pressuring' him to gain weight and 'not being supportive' of him trying to lose weight. This is despite him telling me on several occassions that he wanted to gain weight and me repeatedly asking him if he was absolutely sure about that. The only way in which I 'wasn't supportive' when he did talk about losing weight was to say that I find diet talk really triggering for my own eating disorder so I would support him but didn't want to hear about calorie counting, weight targets etc etc. I even gave him advice on healthy eating and exercise, which he then didn't follow.

Like your ex, pretty sure he hasn't lost any weight since we split up, and I've seen him around feederism websites as well. I think for a lot of people it is easy to blame your FA partner for your weight one way or another, even if it was nothing to do with them.


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## fuelingfire (Jan 20, 2016)

bigmac said:


> With WLS this is no longer true. My wife used to weigh 522 lbs -- today she's 155.


 
That is a major accomplishment! I work in the medical field. The 5-year prognosis for someone with bariatric surgery, is about half of the clients gain most of the weight back. This statistic is not normally mentioned to people. People dont like to change. To maintain that weight loss they have to continue on the diet that got them there and exercise.  Though different doctors will accept different parameters, I dont know any that have had weightloss surgery on someone only weighing 300. The lowest I have heard of is 350.


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## bigmac (Jan 20, 2016)

fuelingfire said:


> ... Though different doctors will accept different parameters, I dont know any that have had weightloss surgery on someone only weighing 300.[/SIZE] The lowest I have heard of is 350.[/FONT]




There are doctors who will perform WLS on 200 pound women.


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## fuelingfire (Jan 20, 2016)

bigmac said:


> There are doctors who will perform WLS on 200 pound women.


 
Those are not doctors, they are greedy butchers. Bariatric is a very invasive procedure, with a relatively *high mortality rate*. Its a surgery that is seen as a last option for someone who is life threateningly obese. Though I will not violate HIPAA, my second sentence here is very important.


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## bigmac (Jan 20, 2016)

fuelingfire said:


> Those are not doctors, they are greedy butchers. Bariatric is a very invasive procedure, with a relatively *high mortality rate*. Its a surgery that is seen as a last option for someone who is life threateningly obese. Though I will not violate HIPAA, my second sentence here is very important.




Lets acknowledge reality. Only a tiny fraction of people how have had WLS did so because of life threatening conditions. The majority do it for social and economic reasons.

Please note that I don't necessarily consider this a bad thing. One of my cousins had WLS because he was told he'd loose his job as a peace officer if he didn't loose weight. I can't say that his was a poor decision.


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## bigmac (Jan 20, 2016)

Green Eyed Fairy said:


> And not all necessarily like "biggest" but some seem to have a body type preference.



Yes we do. But for most of us we're willing to deviate from our preference for the right inducement.


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## Green Eyed Fairy (Jan 20, 2016)

bigmac said:


> Yes we do. But for most of us we're willing to deviate from our preference for the right inducement.


That may be so for you...but not for the guys that prefer to date me


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## bigmac (Jan 21, 2016)

Green Eyed Fairy said:


> That may be so for you...but not for the guys that prefer to date me



I don't understand guys who are unreasonably rigid. This rigid nature does appear to be more common among FAs than guys in general.


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## wrestlingguy (Jan 21, 2016)

bigmac said:


> I don't understand guys who are unreasonably rigid. This rigid nature does appear to be more common among FAs than guys in general.



My bet is that you don't understand them because you don't think like they do. However, there seems to be an overwhelming amount of dudes who more fit the profile that GEF is talking about, than guys who think more like you do, having spoken with many of them over the years at my events, and seeing so many of the posts in the FA Forum.

Interesting thing is, they lose out on many great potential opportunities for relationships and/or great sex because of their inability to see beauty in all sizes.


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## bigmac (Jan 21, 2016)

wrestlingguy said:


> My bet is that you don't understand them because you don't think like they do. However, there seems to be an overwhelming amount of dudes who more fit the profile that GEF is talking about, ...



You're probably right. I never found I had much in common with the other guys at BBW events.


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## Green Eyed Fairy (Jan 21, 2016)

bigmac said:


> I don't understand guys who are unreasonably rigid. This rigid nature does appear to be more common among FAs than guys in general.


I don't think sharing my own personal sexual experience with men (which I assume I have more of than you) is "rigid". 

I understand that there ARE men like you....but what you see in the world should let you know that it's different strokes for different folks. I'm by no means considered "tiny" or even "mid size" out in reality. I'm full fledged fat girl outside the walls of Dims and I've had my share of relationships, dates, boyfriends and even husbands. 

They don't all go for the "biggest" (or NEED small) otherwise I probably would have never gotten laid.

Whatever "rigidity" you perceived was simple disagreement. You may be an FA but you cannot speak for them all. I've spoken to some of the guys on here that actually prefer women more in the realm of my size. They don't always post their preferences....but I KNOW they are real. Just as real as you.


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## Imp (Jan 21, 2016)

In six years this has probably been said, but my first thought was, "Well, you know, there's an easy solution for that."


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## wrestlingguy (Jan 21, 2016)

Imp said:


> In six years this has probably been said, but my first thought was, "Well, you know, there's an easy solution for that."



Yes, because every woman needs to gain weight to get approval from FAs.







By the way, it's not just men who engage in that marginalization. 

View attachment NO.jpg


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## PrincessAmanda (Jan 22, 2016)

bigmac said:


> Guys who like fat girls tend to be easily distracted by the biggest body in the room. *However, after a while many guys start noticing the mid-sized BBWs.*



It's not as if I never get noticed... I just get noticed places like here for the potentially larger woman I could be. When I explain I love my body and *if* it gets bigger I'm fine with it but I'm not actively looking to change my body to either extreme (to lose or gain a significant amount of weight) I become somehow less interesting. 

You can imagine how frustrating it is to be too fat for mainstream men in my everyday life and then to be too small for men who love fat women. Its a lonely place to be


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## Tad (Jan 22, 2016)

Ive probably said something similar earlier in this thread  if not Ive certainly said it elsewhere.

Im pretty sure that there are more men out there who lust after mid-size BBW than there are ones who are looking for SSBBW or who are all about weight gain. I just think that less of them are going to spend much time on sites like this. 

First of all, there are apt to be women in the size range they prefer all around them. So meeting such women is not so hard that a site like this might seem like your best shot. 

Second, somewhat related to the first point: while they may be relatively more common than are guys who like SSBBW, they may be less common than women of that size range (at least in current North America). Which may make them somewhat less apt to be single.

Third, they have more ability to somewhat hide their preference if the low end of their range is down into the curvy/thick/just a bit chubby sort of range (some may hope that their partner who starts off that size will grow larger over time, others may be entirely happy with that). This means they may be less apt to even think of themselves as being much different from other guys, and so all the less apt to come to sites like this. 

Fourth, because their interests are less far off the norm, they may be less likely to feel a need for support of a community that shares their preferences.

Now, Im not saying that you cant meet someone here  it has happened in the past and can happen in the future. But the same general dynamics are apt to be at play on these sites as they are with who is on such sites. The more specific and unusual someones tastes are, the more apt they are to still be looking for someone to meet those specific tastes. So those people with the hard-to-satisfy tastes are more apt to be hitting up every woman on here, essentially asking are you willing to change yourself to be my fantasy? (and to be honest, some of those guys probably dont really want a relationship, they just want fantasy fodder).

Now, that doesn't help in terms of finding those guys. I'm not saying that this makes your life easy, just that I don't think that there is actually less guys into women your size than guys into women who are larger.


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## landshark (Jan 22, 2016)

Green Eyed Fairy said:


> And not all necessarily like "biggest" but some seem to have a body type preference.



Definitely. For me shape is more important than size. It's a good thing, too because my wife has lost weight and gained weight and will likely try to lose again. Through it all she maintains a shape that I just can't get enough of!


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## CleverBomb (Jan 22, 2016)

Tad said:


> I’ve probably said something similar earlier in this thread &#8211; if not I’ve certainly said it elsewhere.
> 
> I’m pretty sure that there are more men out there who lust after mid-size BBW than there are ones who are looking for SSBBW or who are all about weight gain. I just think that less of them are going to spend much time on sites like this.


...and the rest of the post as well. 

That's an excellent analysis of the self-sorting process here and on similar sites. 
I'd rep if I could.


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## Green Eyed Fairy (Jan 22, 2016)

happily_married said:


> Definitely. For me shape is more important than size. It's a good thing, too because my wife has lost weight and gained weight and will likely try to lose again. Through it all she maintains a shape that I just can't get enough of!



That seems to be the case with my fiance. My weight has seen a fifty pound up and down difference in the six years I've been with him but he seems to still be more fond of my shape rather than my "thickness". 



CleverBomb said:


> ...and the rest of the post as well.
> 
> That's an excellent analysis of the self-sorting process here and on similar sites.
> I'd rep if I could.



I got him Rusty


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## landshark (Jan 22, 2016)

Green Eyed Fairy said:


> That seems to be the case with my fiance. My weight has seen a fifty pound up and down difference in the six years I've been with him but he seems to still be more fond of my shape rather than my "thickness".



He sounds like a smart man! The weight is just a number on a scale. The shape and appearance is a bigger motivator to me. Besides, my wife is pretty curvy. Make no mistake about it: I like the way she looks at her heaviest, but when she loses weigh it has a way of...uh...enhancing those curves. Goodness, gracious I am a lucky man.


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## Rojodi (Jan 22, 2016)

Green Eyed Fairy said:


> That seems to be the case with my fiance. My weight has seen a fifty pound up and down difference in the six years I've been with him but he seems to still be more fond of my shape rather than my "thickness".



I met my wife in 1983. She was a curvy woman with damn great eyes! She's now 50 lbs over that initial weight, but has been 100 lbs heavier than now.

I guess I like her shape and her eyes.


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## Forgotten_Futures (Jan 22, 2016)

PrincessAmanda said:


> It's not as if I never get noticed... I just get noticed places like here for the potentially larger woman I could be. When I explain I love my body and *if* it gets bigger I'm fine with it but I'm not actively looking to change my body to either extreme (to lose or gain a significant amount of weight) I become somehow less interesting.
> 
> You can imagine how frustrating it is to be too fat for mainstream men in my everyday life and then to be too small for men who love fat women. Its a lonely place to be



You're fine. If you weren't Canadian, I'd be interested = P (This has less to do with nationality and more to do with physical distance... okay it has nothing to do with nationality.)

I've wondered, for years, if I truly belong on this site for the mirror opposite of that indicated by this thread's theme: I tend to prefer the smaller BBWs. Women who might reasonably be described as "Chunky" to "Plump" by a more normal-yet-open-minded crowd. So I generally am interested in the so-called "mid-sized" BBWs. I just... don't use the chat system.


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## PrincessAmanda (Jan 23, 2016)

Forgotten_Futures said:


> You're fine. If you weren't Canadian, I'd be interested = P (This has less to do with nationality and more to do with physical distance... okay it has nothing to do with nationality.)
> 
> I've wondered, for years, if I truly belong on this site for the mirror opposite of that indicated by this thread's theme: I tend to prefer the smaller BBWs. Women who might reasonably be described as "Chunky" to "Plump" by a more normal-yet-open-minded crowd. So I generally am interested in the so-called "mid-sized" BBWs. I just... don't use the chat system.



Aw.... Damn borders lol 

Sounds like its as difficult for you as it is for me. We're a niche inside a niche community.


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## bigmac (Jan 24, 2016)

PrincessAmanda said:


> It's not as if I never get noticed... I just get noticed places like here for the potentially larger woman I could be. When I explain I love my body and *if* it gets bigger I'm fine with it but I'm not actively looking to change my body to either extreme (to lose or gain a significant amount of weight) I become somehow less interesting.
> 
> You can imagine how frustrating it is to be too fat for mainstream men in my everyday life and then to be too small for men who love fat women. Its a lonely place to be




Over the years I noticed that the FA/BBW world is not a really good place to meet suitable mates. I meet all but one of the women I've had long term relationships with outside of the FA/BBW world. 

Outside the FA/BBW world midsized BBWs actually have it a lot easier than SSBBBWs. While even small BBWs may be marginalized in some places its been my experience that small and mid-sized BBWs are welcomed in many others. When it comes to socializing I always found it important to choose the right venue. Many night spots cater to traditionally beautiful young people (or at least try to). It pays to scope out local venues -- I'm betting some will be much more fat friendly than others.

When I was young I lived in Edmonton Alberta. I found the popular dance clubs were not at all fat friendly. However many alternative venues were fat friendly (i.e. Heavy Metal and Punk venues and the Blues bar near the University of Alberta). Most cities of any size are going to have a choice of night spots. Its easier for people with conventional looks to find places to socialize. The rest of us have to put in a little more effort. Hang in there and happy socializing.


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## squeezablysoft (Apr 20, 2016)

*This is how I feel, everyone in the non-FA world thinks I should lose weight, but as a 145# woman (I'm only 5'1" though, putting my BMI right smack in the middle of the overweight category), I feel like a fraud if I try to think of myself as a BBW. I think I'm thin enough to "pass" as normal weight to the casual observer when fully clothed (especially since I carry most of my weight between my boobs and my knees, with just a hint of plushness starting in my face, but have thin lower legs, arms and hands), but fat enough that the sight of my naked body would turn most ppl off. Sometimes I feel like the short person who is 5' one AND A QUARTER", my BMI is 27 POINT 4 and don't you dare forget the point 4! *


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## HereticFA (Apr 21, 2016)

squeezablysoft said:


> *I feel like a fraud **if I try to think of myself as a BBW. *


Don't diss yourself like that. Actually, you're in the BMI range of most of the models that used to appear in the magazine _BBW_ when in its original incarnation. (I never read it after it was sold and published only online.)


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## RabbitScorpion (Apr 21, 2016)

squeezablysoft said:


> *This is how I feel, everyone in the non-FA world thinks I should lose weight, but as a 145# woman (I'm only 5'1" though, putting my BMI right smack in the middle of the overweight category), I feel like a fraud if I try to think of myself as a BBW. I think I'm thin enough to "pass" as normal weight to the casual observer when fully clothed (especially since I carry most of my weight between my boobs and my knees, with just a hint of plushness starting in my face, but have thin lower legs, arms and hands), but fat enough that the sight of my naked body would turn most ppl off. Sometimes I feel like the short person who is 5' one AND A QUARTER", my BMI is 27 POINT 4 and don't you dare forget the point 4! *



Who said you _had _to be a BBW? Your dimensions sound great to me (just the right height to rest your head on my shoulder).

Sadly, I'm way too old :-(


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## seavixen (Apr 25, 2016)

I'm still far away from being mid-sized at a size 24ish, but there's definitely a sense of not belonging anywhere, now. When I was a very, very big ssbbw over 200lbs ago, I felt like I had a niche, and there was a sense of belonging to it. Now I'm somewhere in that grey area where I'm just sort of gross to everyone. Fun times!


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## landshark (Apr 25, 2016)

seavixen said:


> I'm still far away from being mid-sized at a size 24ish, but there's definitely a sense of not belonging anywhere, now. When I was a very, very big ssbbw over 200lbs ago, I felt like I had a niche, and there was a sense of belonging to it. Now I'm somewhere in that grey area where I'm just sort of gross to everyone. Fun times!



Yeah, but you're doing something that YOU want to do for yourself, so anyone who thinks you're gross can just deal with it. You don't need validation from anyone* and grey area to them doesn't have to be grey area to you. Keep doing good things for yourself and don't worry about anyone else!

* You probably already know this and don't need a pep talk from me, but other readers in your situation may stumble upon it later and find it helpful. At least that's my hope.


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## Green Eyed Fairy (Apr 25, 2016)

seavixen said:


> I'm still far away from being mid-sized at a size 24ish, but there's definitely a sense of not belonging anywhere, now. When I was a very, very big ssbbw over 200lbs ago, I felt like I had a niche, and there was a sense of belonging to it. Now I'm somewhere in that grey area where I'm just sort of gross to everyone. Fun times!



I have been somewhere in the size 24ish realm my whole time here- through many up and down weight fluctuations. I still frequently feel "unaccepted" but that's okay because many other times I have found "understanding" and "freedom" here that I can't seem to find out in the world. 
I have seen your photos in the picture threads- you are gorgeous- and there are actually men who will be able to see that at your size. You're just more than likely not going to find them on Dims.


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## bigmac (Apr 25, 2016)

seavixen said:


> I'm still far away from being mid-sized at a size 24ish, but there's definitely a sense of not belonging anywhere, now. When I was a very, very big ssbbw over 200lbs ago, *I felt like I had a niche*, and there was a sense of belonging to it. Now I'm somewhere in that grey area where I'm just sort of gross to everyone. Fun times!



Its been my experience that FAs who prefer really big women tend to go to extremes in other ways too. All my SSBBW friends have lots of weird boyfriend stories. Guys who like "regular" fat girls tend to be more normal. At your new size you may be less likely to catch the eye of a rabid FA -- but there is a far larger pool of guys out there who are open to dating a mid-size BBW.


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## RabbitScorpion (Apr 26, 2016)

As I mentioned in a another thread on Dims, the local newspaper here is full of wedding announcements where the bride has a BMI in the thirties.


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## Rojodi (Apr 26, 2016)

RabbitScorpion said:


> As I mentioned in a another thread on Dims, the local newspaper here is full of wedding announcements where the bride has a BMI in the thirties.



I can remember our paper printing any and all engagement announcements with pictures. Size of the bride or groom were never any problem. Why? Because the people in charge of that section were sentimental fools: They loved love.


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## RabbitScorpion (Apr 26, 2016)

Well, I would hope any newspaper that does print wedding announcements would print _any _local announcements from couples-to-be.

My point was that men consider "mid-sized BBW"s to be marriage material.


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## choudhury (Apr 29, 2016)

The "bigger is better" mindset - carried to extremes - would certainly irritate me if I were a BBW. There's something crazily reductive about obsessing purely over the number on the scale. 

Just speaking for myself, my "sweet spot" is probably in the SSBW region, and I rarely find a thin woman "sexy" (they might be visually appealing, but not really _erotic_ to me). However, over the years I have met many "plump" women - say, 40-50 lbs overweight - very desirable, and many SSBBW to be not particularly so. A lot depends, as others have said, on shape, how the woman carries her fat, as well as self-presentation, etc.. 

(Honestly, what arouses me as much as anything else is whether the woman in question likes to eat and to eat a lot. I'm not talking about feeder "stuffing" sessions here, just a healthy appetite. When I met my wife she was about a size 16, maybe 175 lbs, with great hair and a notable belly bulge. I thought she was quite hot, and what added to it was that she was a foodee who loved to eat and didn't seem self-conscious at all about eating. She'd happily get dessert at work while the thin girls refrained; she'd eat portions as big as mine or bigger despite my being a foot taller than her; by our third or fourth date she'd openly comment on being stuffed from dinner; etc.. 20 years later she is 290 lbs and unbelievably sexy, but the point is that she was ALWAYS attractive without being a SSBBW).


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## landshark (Apr 30, 2016)

choudhury said:


> *The "bigger is better" mindset - carried to extremes - would certainly irritate me if I were a BBW. There's something crazily reductive about obsessing purely over the number on the scale. *
> 
> Just speaking for myself, my "sweet spot" is probably in the SSBW region, and I rarely find a thin woman "sexy" (they might be visually appealing, but not really _erotic_ to me). However, over the years I have met many "plump" women - say, 40-50 lbs overweight - very desirable, and many SSBBW to be not particularly so. A lot depends, as others have said, on shape, how the woman carries her fat, as well as self-presentation, etc..
> 
> (Honestly, what arouses me as much as anything else is whether the woman in question likes to eat and to eat a lot. I'm not talking about feeder "stuffing" sessions here, just a healthy appetite. When I met my wife she was about a size 16, maybe 175 lbs, with great hair and a notable belly bulge. I thought she was quite hot, and what added to it was that she was a foodee who loved to eat and didn't seem self-conscious at all about eating. She'd happily get dessert at work while the thin girls refrained; she'd eat portions as big as mine or bigger despite my being a foot taller than her; by our third or fourth date she'd openly comment on being stuffed from dinner; etc.. 20 years later she is 290 lbs and unbelievably sexy, but the point is that she was ALWAYS attractive without being a SSBBW).



You speak truth! 

No woman wants to be pressured to lose weight by her partner. Why would a woman feel any different about having to gain weight in order to be "perfect?" Now of course a lot of women of their own free will want to lose or gain weight. But it's THEIR preference, not something they are doing to make their partner happy. 

My wife has always wanted to lose weight, but just isn't very successful. She knows my preferences and was worried once she lost weight that I'd no longer be attractive. She briefly had some success, dropping about 120 pounds down to the low 200s. I think she got under 210. I was wild about her as ever because she's my wife and is so much more than a number on a scale. She's since gained it all back and then some, reaching weight levels higher than ever. She's upset with herself but in the back of her mind is comfortable knowing she is married to a guy who isn't going to complain about her weight.


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