# FAT PORN: Heather Goes to College !!PICS!!



## LillyBBBW

Woopa!! That's one high kick move for the fat girls. As many of you have probably heard by now, Heather was a smash hit as the guest lecturer at NYU's Department of Sexuality and Gender. The room was packed to the gills with people sitting on the floor even. There were a small number of people representative of the Fat Acceptance community but it was mostly made up of students and alumni of the school. The whole time that Heather spoke no one made a sound. No creaking chairs, no rustling papers, coughs, yawns, etc. You could hear a pin drop as her presentation was interesting, informative and engaging. People who already knew about it were even glued to what she had to say. 

I took a few pictures but not many. I didn't want to be a nuisance with my camera since I knew how nervous Heather was and I didn't want to go nuts with the flash to distract from what was happening so some of my photos are a little blurred. But here they come anyway.






Okay, I know nobody cares about my travel route to get to NY but it started out with me going off to meet AnnMarie in Newton so that I could bum a ride with her in her silver beetle. I went to meet her via the Green Line at Park Street Station in Boston and here's a random photo of the platform, the passengers and the wall set aside for the corporate whores who constantly try to sell us stuff during the commute. 





Here's Heather and Professor Don Kulick, the guy who runs the department for gender and sexuality studies at NYU. Kudos go to him for making this possible.





This is a photo of Heather and AnnMarie fighting with the computer. It seems there was some media issue before the start of the program and it was tough trying to get the system to cooperate. Things eventually got straightened out and we started somewhat on schedule but it was a bit tense for a while. The next few photos you will see in this line are just random shots taken of Heather, AnnMarie and some of the folks/staff at NYU introducing themselves and trying to solve the media problems.















One last glance in the mirror before we start. You can't give a good lecture without lipgloss.





This is just into the beginning of Heather's presentation. It was very thorough though Heather kvetched a little about not getting in all the things she wanted. EVERYONE thinks that after they do something but in my opinion it was just fine. She really did us proud dispelling a lot of stigma and wives tales about fatness and sexuality. She made some interesting points in the beginning and supplied some picture demonstrations of the different aspects of FA desire. The pictures featured Cheesecake, AnnMarie, BigCutieCaroline, BigCutieSkye, BigCutieSable and many others. She talked through the points of visual desire and even gave the weights of each of the models to gasps of awe and wonder. 





And this is the end of her presentation. I'm sorry folks, I didn't want to be a distraction for Heather and the people there to listen to the lecture so I kept my movements and activities to a minimum. So this is all I really have to show for the presentation itself.





This is the mob scene that engulfed Heather after the lecture's conclusion. There was a line of people waiting to shake her hand, ask questions and just meet her in person. I spoke with several of the attendees during this time. The mood was almost giddy as some of the chubby women I spoke with felt this great sense of relief, liberation and joy at finally feeling acknowledged as a vital, beautiful and sexual being. They were finding it difficult to leave. At the end invitations were handed out to let people know we were gathering later for drinks and snacks. 





This guy is a professional photographer who gave Heather his card. During the question and answer portion of the lecture he raised some questions about the format of the photos from the site and the presentation. He was feeling that the photos were not exploitive of artistry and such as he could not see it clearly in what he had viewed. Heather asked him if he was an FA. After a brief nervous pause the man said no and then Heather said, "Well, that's why you can't see it," and the crowd erupted into cheers and applause. This guy seems nice enough and sincere. He has some concepts in his mind of things he would like to explore as a photographer so this may not be the last we hear of him whoever he is.​
*to be continued...........*


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## LillyBBBW

*Gathering Afterward*





The gathering after. This lovely lady you see in the forefront is our own dear toni, and that dashing young devil beside her is JudgeDre. Did you folks know that JudgeDre is a journalist? I didn't know that. He was there to hang but he was also there in a professional capacity to interview Heather. You folks might want to chase him down to get a gander at his interview once he's put it all together and it's published. But yeah, back to toni. Isn't she cute? Very outgoing and nice. She came up to me, tapped me on the shoulder and introduced herself right before the lecture. I'm so glad she came. 





toni again. this time I took the photo without flash. I asked her to remain *super* still so the picture would not be so blurry. So she remained still and I steadied my hand and this is what came out. Yeah, we got da skeelz.





And this is Placebo, the one post bandit. He decloaked on here just to tell us he was coming and here he is! We luv 'im. He was a real prince.





And here's some of the rest of the crew that hung at the Hyatt. Heather had changed her clothes already and was relaxing after a job very well done.





And here's FAJohnny, Heather's better half posing for the cam.





But Heather's the star of the day. Here she is posing at the Restaurant. Where the hell where we? I can't remember the name. We all cabbed it over there and sat at the far end.










And that's all I've got. I'm sure you folks will see others as the days go by and people can figure out the time to upload everything. As for me, as soon as I walked in the front door I fell face down in the bed and slept until well after midnight. So nw I'm up and wired so I figured I would try to be the *FIRST* to post the exploits. I gotta get my thrills from someplace. Hope you all enjoyed it and please take the time to give Heather your congrats. She deserves it! 

Ciao!​


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## RedHead

Awesome...but there are no pictures of you!


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## LillyBBBW

RedHead said:


> Awesome...but there are no pictures of you!



I know. One of the hazards of being the one with the camera. There were others there with their cameras though so I'm sure there will be enough unflattering photos of me around to look at later.


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## bigsexy920

Wow, Looks like I missed out. I should have left work early while no one was looking. Looks and sounds like it was a great success. Congratulations to you and to all those involved.


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## MissToodles

cool pics, thanks for sharing.


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## Santaclear

Great work, Heather and crew!  And thanks for the snaps and well-written narrative of the day, Lilly!


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## BBW Betty

It is so great that Heather was given the chance, and took advantage of it, to dispell some myths for the college age crowd. I also just read the article linked on the home page, and am really impressed. Go Heather!!

Lily, Thanks for the pics. This would have been a great lecture to attend.


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## Webmaster

LillyBBBW said:


> ...As many of you have probably heard by now, Heather was a smash hit as the guest lecturer at NYU's Department of Sexuality and Gender. The room was packed to the gills with people sitting on the floor even....​




Thanks so much for the report, Lilly!! And a hearty congratulations to Heather + thanks to all who helped. That was very courageous of Heather and a good thing all around.​


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## Tina

Lilly, I've enjoyed the pictures and your descriptions very much. I would have loved to go; it looks and sounds like a wonderful experience.

Thank you so much for sharing!


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## Jes

I would've loved to have gone. Anyhoo, I adore these little photoessays we do of different events. I must've been a scrapbooker in another life or something!


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## The Weatherman

Wow... that seems like it was a great event and a great evening... too bad I'm 1000 miles from New York... Heather, any chance you'll be coming to Chicago? University of Chicago is always hosting lectures about anything under the sun...


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## Tooz

LillyBBBW said:


>


Yay, Boston! I used to live there and man, I miss it. Weird as it may be, I did love the T so very much.  

Also, hi. New here.


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## Aliena

Lilly, thank you for the pictures and a summation of the events that took place. I enjoyed reading and looking at your report and was envious of you all. I wish that I could've been there--fabulous!!


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## rainyday

Damn those corporate whores. What rancid folk they must be.  

Wish I could have gone to the presentation. Wouldn't it be cool if one could listen in on what audience members went home and told their friends/loved ones and hear whether or not their minds were expanded just a little? Hopefully there was a good bit of that going on. Thanks for sharing the pics.


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## Boteroesque Babe

Ohhhh... I'm sorry I missed this. Awfully glad to hear it went well.


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## EtobicokeFA

Too bad I couldn't make it, it sounds like it a great presentation and a great success. Of course, Heather and them should be applauded for they're great work. I just hope this is not the last one. 

And thanks Lilly for the report.


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## Tiger's_Lily

*Thanks Lily, that was really interesting!! 

Do you know if Heather is going to post her lecture, somewhere on this site, so we can all read it? *


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## LillyBBBW

The lecture was an hour and a half long and covered a lot of territory. I'm not sure there's a transcript available. I heard a rumor that someone attempted to videotape it but I hear they only got an hour's worth of the presentation and that's it. They may try to post that someplace for people to see.


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## Zoom

Let us step back for a moment and consider what has just occured.

Heather has now quite possibly done more for the size acceptance movement than any other SSBBW operating independently. (Remember she's been on TV a few times, and made quite a stir as I recall.) If this lecture became a series, imagine the repercussions in collegiate society (and therefore future society as well)!

Kudos.

On the other hand, it could all easily be forgotten next week...


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## Thrifty McGriff

Great job Heather and everyone who helped her.  I'm really glad some people were able to have their minds exposed to our side of the world, and hopefully opened up. I just wish I could have been there, but I'm a frugal student who would have gotten lost along the way and somehow ended up on the Mexican side of the border as a deportee. 

Plus, Heather you look fantastic in the photos.


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## EtobicokeFA

Zoom said:


> Let us step back for a moment and consider what has just occured.
> 
> Heather has now quite possibly done more for the size acceptance movement than any other SSBBW operating independently. (Remember she's been on TV a few times, and made quite a stir as I recall.) If this lecture became a series, imagine the repercussions in collegiate society (and therefore future society as well)!
> 
> Kudos.
> 
> On the other hand, it could all easily be forgotten next week...



Let's hope it's not forgotten! If it became a series that would be a major step forward in the size acceptance movement.


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## Jon Blaze

Awesome!!! Glad to hear it turned out ok. You took some great photos too!!


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## Littleghost

LillyBBBW said:


> This guy is a professional photographer who gave Heather his card. During the question and answer portion of the lecture he raised some questions about the format of the photos from the site and the presentation. He was feeling that the photos were not exploitive of artistry and such as he could not see it clearly in what he had viewed. Heather asked him if he was an FA. After a brief nervous pause the man said no and then Heather said, "Well, that's why you can't see it," and the crowd erupted into cheers and applause. This guy seems nice enough and sincere. He has some concepts in his mind of things he would like to explore as a photographer so this may not be the last we hear of him whoever he is.​



I'm more or less an art major, and I still don't know what he means by 'exploitive of artistry'. Sounds like a b.s. buzzword to me. Did anyone happen to tape the speech? I would've loved to be there, and not just for support, either. All the more reason for me to hurry up and get out of this rinky-dink town.

Woopah! Indeed,
--Littleghost


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## LillyBBBW

The more I think about it the more I think a tour of colleges might be a great idea! I'm not sure Heather would be up to it though. It would take some getting used to for her. Seriously, I would consider quitting my job and following the tour to become roadie. Who wants to be a 'Fat Head' with me?


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## LillyBBBW

Littleghost said:


> I'm more or less an art major, and I still don't know what he means by 'exploitive of artistry'. Sounds like a b.s. buzzword to me..... <snipped>
> --Littleghost



That's not the exact word he used, Littleghost. I can't recall exactly how he put it but he seemed to put across that the photos weren't interesting in an artistic way to his eye. Maybe he was looking for noir, Monet, Bouguereau or some such thing - he wasn't specific. But from what he said it's what I imagined. It led to what appeared to be a plug for his professional services. He may have merely been advertising himself. Once he began tooting his own horn and naming his business, audible groans went up from the audience.


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## Placebo

LillyBBBW said:


> I know. One of the hazards of being the one with the camera. There were others there with their cameras though so I'm sure there will be enough unflattering photos of me around to look at later.


hey what about our picture together? or was that on toni's camera..... you kow, the one where i look a little retarded with my eyes closed?


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## LillyBBBW

Yes, that was on toni's camera. She'll post them at some point I guess. Maybe in a brand new thread.


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## toni

I cant do it!!! I tried and tried and it just doesnt work. I am sorry guys, Lilly do you want to give it a try? :doh: 

I suck


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## Theatrmuse/Kara

Congratulations to Heather on tackling the NYU college circuit......wouldn't it be great if she did a college tour for this ...a side of fat acceptance many do not know exists!

And thanks to Anne Marie, Toni and Lily and all others who were able to attend and support our Heather!
AWESOME JOB,
Kara


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## Totmacher

Congrats! I'm glad to hear it went so well and soooo mad I missed it.


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## Jes

Theatrmuse/Kara said:


> Congratulations to Heather on tackling the NYU college circuit......wouldn't it be great if she did a college tour for this ...a side of fat acceptance many do not know exists!
> 
> And thanks to Anne Marie, Toni and Lily and all others who were able to attend and support our Heather!
> AWESOME JOB,
> Kara



I know a transcript or a whatever is too much to ask. Can we get the talk's bullet points? the power point? Something? I'd be curious as to Heather's frame of reference, etc. Sassy!


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## LillyBBBW

First, Professor Kulick spoke to the audience and set her up, explaining how he came to meet Heather. It appears he was fascinated with the phenom of fat porn when it was touched upon by a previous speaker. His research led him to send out emails to about 50 web hosts and Heather was the only person who wrote back. Eventually he invited her there.

Kulick was especially struck by the fact that fat hate is the final acceptable prejudice and had personal contact with it himself when he tried to get the staff of the building to bring up one of the couches for Heather to sit in. He badgered and badgered and finally his own people had to band together to bring it up themselves. Had heather been handicapped the building staff would have chopped to it but because she was fat they didn't even bother and treated it like a joke. Turns out Heather couldn't use it anyway but the experience was an eye opener for him. He'd never had this kind of issue with the building people before, ever.
1. First she covered fat speak. i.e. 
FA = Fat Admirer
BBW = Big Beautiful Woman (150 - 280+)
SSBBW = Super Sized Big Beautiful woman (350+)
BHM = big Handsome Male

and so on...

2. Heather spoke of removing the stigma from the word fat. Fat is not a dirty word. The word should be used in our society without fear and loathing.

3. Fat people aren't lazy, stupid, filthy, etc. Fat people work, pay taxes, lead productive lives. Over 60% of Americans are overweight, yet we are still not accommodated in theaters, buses, restaurants, etc.

Basically she started out with fat activism points of discrimination, etc.

She talked about how fat people can have sex, the idea that fat people are not supposed to have sex unless it's with other fat people is ridiculous. Also fat people have no difficulty having sex at all contrary to rumor.

FA's are not freaks. Preference like blondes or redheads. The stigma and difficulty of being an FA in a thin obsessed world where BBW's hate their bodies, bla bla bla... lack of quality sexual material for visual stimuli. Old fat porn with ugly fat woman, no make-up with some guy calling her pig, etc. Not a turn on for most.

I could go on and on and I'm sure I'm not saying it exactly as it happened but it was the gist of the first part of her talk.

She then moved on to show slide views of some of the material on her site. she showed the various styles of dress on the site. Pointed out that the same dress on a thin person is considered cute and normal but because model is fat, it's porn which she doesn't agree with or think is fair. As she showed each model she talked on the points of the visual that men would find visually stimulating and why, also she gave the weights of the models and the audience seemed interested and gasped out loud when they heard the numbers. Heather even forgot to name one of the model's weights and as she changed the slide a woman stopped her and asked out loud how much the woman weighed. People were definitely interested. she explained that the photos shows were considered soft porn.

Then she apologized for not having any hard core stuff to show because none of the folks that run that kind of thing would give permission for her to show their work. But she explained that it was exactly the same as any other hard core porn: sex, facesitting, dildos, fetish - just like the regular porn you see, *insert fat girl here*. (this brought out a laugh from the audience)

Then came question and answer time. Some guy gave her a hard time because he's an admitted fetishist and felt that her handling of the fetish issue was the same prejudice that she is against towards fat and implied fetish behavior should be celebrated and embraced by all mankind, yada yada. There's one in every crowd.

Then came the photographer plugging for his talents and ideas. 

Someone asked about race. What are the racial dynamics, why are there no black women on the site, etc. She said she can't find any.

How much do the women make. They get 50% of whatever comes in and Heather reinvests the other half into the site to keep it alive and well. Fat porn is a profitable industry. BigCuties.Com does no advertising. They have no pop ups or anything like that. Their main form of advertising has been here and with only (12?) girls on the site they grossed a quarter of a million dollars last year. And to join it only costs $5.95. Fat admiration is by no means an obscure little phenom but a vital and very real preference. 

Then came Aris asking about Apples.  We love you Aris!  A young lady compared the fat sex industry to that of the gay industry because at one time there was so little erotic gay material out there that people were snatching and grabbing and soaking up whatever they could find. But now there seems to be an abundance of it. She wanted to know if Heather thought that the same would happen for the fat porn industry possible going a bit more main stream. Heather said she hopes for the day a celebrity could proudly display a fat trophy wife on his arm.

I know I missed a lot of stuff and probably got some of it a little off by a word or two, but it's a rundown.


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## Jes

Fantastic Lilly, thanks a lot. I very much appreciate that. And I'm sorry, I missed the Aris/Apple reference. What did he ask? This apple's gotta know! 

I think Heather's point about the sheer $ grossed must've been a very compelling one. Money talks when nothing else does. ANd personally, the idea that a scantily clad fat woman is somehow more naked than a thin one (someone posted a story along these lines that happened to her in real life some years bck on a usenet group) has always resonated with me, and I'm glad that Heather brought up that point.


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## LillyBBBW

We have two Arises now. We've got UberAris and we've got lipmixgirl, who is new to our forum after meeting us at the lecture at NYU. Aris (lipmixgirl) brought up a subject in regards to the different types of body shapes of women and what men mostly go for. She felt that most FA's are interested in pears as opposed to apples or hourglass. Heather strongly disagreed. She said that men who like pears are often more aggressive and outspoken about it due to its rarity, so they make a lot of noise. But plenty of men like apples, no question.

Since then Aris has been a woman with a mission.


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## Jes

a-ha. 

okelee dokelee.


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## Tina

This is fabulous, Lilly, thank you for taking the time and trouble to post it. 

I think the reason why some people perceive the scantilly clad fat/thin issue as they do is because in the same outfit, fat women DO show SO much more skin than thin do -- think Belly tops. It's like with our cute little Buffalicious -- the woman shows no more boobage than anyone else, and stays within the rules, but it *looks* like she's showing much more because of the sheer amount of boobie acreage.  That, of course, doesn't address how perceptions might be colored by those who are bigoted against fat people and to them it is offensive and "obscene" no matter how small amount of fat is showing.

I would have loved to have been there; it sounds like Heather gave a fascinating, positive presentation. Not thrilled about the "trophy wife" thing, as I think that no woman should be a trophy, fat or thin, as it's dehumanizing, but if one is looking for such a thing, Pierce Brosnan's wife Keely, is at the very least plus-size, and more like a smallish-to-midsize BBW.

Good going, Heather! And thanks again, Lilly -- I tried to rep you for this, but it hasn't been long enough since the last time -- *Lilly and Heather both deserve some rep-love, peoples!*


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## LillyBBBW

Tina said:


> This is fabulous, Lilly, thank you for taking the time and trouble to post it.
> 
> I think the reason why some people perceive the scantilly clad fat/thin issue as they do is because in the same outfit, fat women DO show SO much more skin than thin do -- think Belly tops. It's like with our cute little Buffalicious -- the woman shows no more boobage than anyone else, and stays within the rules, but it *looks* like she's showing much more because of the sheer amount of boobie acreage.  That, of course, doesn't address how perceptions might be colored by those who are bigoted against fat people and to them it is offensive and "obscene" no matter how small amount of fat is showing.
> 
> I would have loved to have been there; it sounds like Heather gave a fascinating, positive presentation. Not thrilled about the "trophy wife" thing, as I think that no woman should be a trophy, fat or thin, as it's dehumanizing, but if one is looking for such a thing, Pierce Brosnan's wife Keely, is at the very least plus-size, and more like a smallish-to-midsize BBW.
> 
> Good going, Heather! And thanks again, Lilly -- I tried to rep you for this, but it hasn't been long enough since the last time -- *Lilly and Heather both deserve some rep-love, peoples!*



Yes it was really a wonderfully uplifting experience, not tawdry or disrespectful at all. I would love to see what the aftermath of this lecture was. Did it open some eyes? Did it change the way many of the women see themselves and each other? Did it encourage closet FA's to be a little bolder in their preferences? 

At one point a very thin Asian girl was speaking with Heather. She was very sweet and very respectful but had this idea that fatness is self inflicted. She didn't say it like that. It was truly an innocent and sincere inquiry, why wouldn't she think that? Some were trying to explain that for most fat people it's just the way they are. Then I asked her, "What would you have to do to get to any of our sizes? How would you have to eat? What would it take?" She seemed to nod recognition at that point. I pointed out to her that she could not possibly eat like that, not for long. She would make herself sick, and so would we. We can't eat like that either.

So maybe I changed a mind.


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## Tina

Thank goodness and good going. There is so much ignorance on the issue.

Growing up, ALL of my friends were skinny -- both male and female. Not just thin, but skinny. They were always trying to gain and I was always trying to lose. Thing is, people easily believed that my friends were naturally thin, but me? Just a pig who couldn't stop eating. It's like there is this cognitive disconnect that prevents some from making the connection that life, and the universe, is all about balance; the yin and the yang. Some are naturally skinny and some are naturally fat. Seems like it should be a "duh!" moment, but for too many it just is not.


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## rainyday

Thanks for posting all that, Lilly. Very interesting to read, and kudos to Heather. It took a lot of confidence to stand up and present to a crowd like that.

If she does repeat the lecture on another campus, maybe there could be some sort of short survey before and after gauging whether or not attitudes were changed.


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## Littleghost

Maybe it was "expletive of artist tree" he said? ::slaps face before anyone else can::

King of Post-modern Neo-classical avant guarde subjectivism,
--Littleghost


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## Tooz

I would love to see a university tour. I found out about this presentation the day it was scheduled, so I couldn't go. I would have loved to, though.


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## Vince

Thanks to Lilly for bringing the event to the forum. Lots of interesting photos and identities. Your reports took some time preparing so I am sure we are all grateful to you for your contributions.

I am interested in the presentation from an academic point of view. I suppose the audience there might not have been as informed of the vocabulary and issues that we all take for granted. Did Heather present any research to back up her statements or was hers mostly an anecdotal account of the fat on line scene and pay sites? I didn't detect anything that was original although I concede that much of her presentation was merely describing the present scene from her point of view. 

She does give various answers to questions that are highly conjectural but I suppose no one was there to contradict her. The plain truth is almost nothing is known of the men who fancy large women. I have read of no research done on this small population of men. Until we have something like that then it is all a matter of opinion and we might not see the diversity that is common on discussion boards. What do we know about the admirers who prefer Pears to Apples? I would say almost nothing. 

It is a pity that she used the terms that we see on line. I do not use the term FA but Heather's guy is FAJohnny. So that is a pity that she is reinforcing and defining those terms to a wider audience. Yes, of course what she said is common knowledge here but there is still some controversy about the labels used in our subculture. Did she go into the history of how the term BBW came to be define fat women? 

I congratulate Heather for having the courage to get up and speak to such an intelligent audience. I bet she was scared stiff beforehand! Her presentation is big step for fat women and we hope that someone else will follow her footsteps and be invited to speak at another gathering.


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## Tina

I don't see why anyone would need statistics when it's plain to see wherever you go that fat women are all over the place and they're often walking around with men who we can assume with some accuracy are their partners.

Also, men who like women of all sizes can have preferences for pears, hourglasses, apples, etc. When it comes to SA it's just a more exaggerated form.

While it would be interesting to see the numbers that you speak of, it's what happens in real life that counts. Though it's obvious that men have been socialized to prize thin women, an attraction to fat women has never disappeared and never will.


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## Vince

Well, Tina, knowledge advances mainly by proper scientific research. Otherwise all you have is anecdotal observations and reports. They are valuable, too, but are just one person's opinion.

In her reply to the person who asked about Pears and Apples did she give a breakdown of the models on her site regarding Pears and Apples and who got the most hits? That would be useful information. Then her comments carry more weight because she has evidence to back up her statements.

When we use the term 'BBW' we know it means Big Beautiful Woman. However, we also know it means all fat women. The public will wonder how it is possible for all fat women to be beautiful. Therefore, some account of the history of those terms would be valuable. A presenter could use those words but also say if he/she agreed with what they meant. 

We have to put the presentation into the perspective it was advertised. It was about fat porn. That would have attracted a certain population and would have given a slant to the proceedings. I take it part of what Heather tried to achieve was to validate fat porn and also equate it with mainstream porn and not as a freak show done with bizarre people.


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## AnnMarie

Vince, I understand why you're asking about much of this, but some of it just strikes me as Tuesday morning quarterbacking. Keep in mind that Heather was invited to do this, and it was not something for which she volunteered. The director of the program felt she was uniquely qualified to share her experience with the group. 

To answer you briefly... yes, her information was based on opinion, her extensive life experience with the subject matter and FAs (and being one herself), and anecdotal material. This was made abundantly clear to the audience prior to giving them any information. 

She also covered BBW and her opinion of the term for those in attendance, since that's something you brought up as well. As for what was said, I'm not going to cover it - those who were there know, and for those who weren't, until/if/when there is a transcript for reference, I don't think it's far to essentially put words in her/anyone's mouth.


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## Santaclear

Vince said:


> In her reply to the person who asked about Pears and Apples did she give a breakdown of the models on her site regarding Pears and Apples and who got the most hits? That would be useful information. Then her comments carry more weight because she has evidence to back up her statements.



I've never cared much about this pear vs. apple stuff...it seems like someone who's obsessed with it should be the one to research it and do what you're talking about, Vince. Also these categories are often bogus when you're faced with all the true varieties of bodyshapes out there.


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## Tina

Vince said:


> Well, Tina, knowledge advances mainly by proper scientific research. Otherwise all you have is anecdotal observations and reports. They are valuable, too, but are just one person's opinion.



I do understand that, and think it would be valuable for some purposes to see such academic papers not only submitted to academic journals but mainstream magazines and newspapers. Thing is, I understood that this presentation wasn't to be that kind of a gathering and responded to that.

Actually, I think pretty much everyone has some experience seeing fat people with partners, fat and thin, which doesn't give it academic creedence, but does make it somewhat more than anecdotal evidence. At some point, when it's society-wide enough, numbers aren't needed to validate a point (unless it is for one of the aforementioned academic or scientific journals) and are only necessary for those who like to collect numbers.


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## LillyBBBW

Vince, I deliberately avoided getting into the nitty gritty details of every minute point made in Heather's presentation and merely posted a rough synopsis of what was said. But since you feel you must know more.....



Vince said:


> Well, Tina, knowledge advances mainly by proper scientific research. Otherwise all you have is anecdotal observations and reports. They are valuable, too, but are just one person's opinion.




I disagree. Heather is uniquely qualified to speak on this particular subject given her background. She runs a very successful site that grossed round about $200,000 last year. The reason her site and her pictures are so successful is because Heather knows exactly what is going to appeal to her audience. She knows this through full immersion into her subject, direct contact and candid feedback from the community. Through over ten years of research and trial and error she knows what will sell and what won't, hence her booming success. I have complete confidence in her expertise on this subject. An opinion is merely an educated guesstimate based on personal experience. What Heather delivers is over ten years of immersion in the subjective research of fat desire and proven results to back up what she says. In this you would be hard pressed to find a stronger authority.



Vince said:


> In her reply to the person who asked about Pears and Apples did she give a breakdown of the models on her site regarding Pears and Apples and who got the most hits? That would be useful information. Then her comments carry more weight because she has evidence to back up her statements.



Actually she did. She stated that Karoline, Sable, Cindy and Cheesecake are the highest grossing models on the site and only Cheesecake qualifies as a pear.



Vince said:


> When we use the term 'BBW' we know it means Big Beautiful Woman. However, we also know it means all fat women. The public will wonder how it is possible for all fat women to be beautiful. Therefore, some account of the history of those terms would be valuable. A presenter could use those words but also say if he/she agreed with what they meant.



Heather also stated that she is not fond of the term BBW being used as a universal description for fat women simply because all fat women are not beautiful. The idea that being fat automatically makes one beautiful is as silly as saying being thin automatically makes one beautiful.



Vince said:


> We have to put the presentation into the perspective it was advertised. It was about fat porn. That would have attracted a certain population and would have given a slant to the proceedings. I take it part of what Heather tried to achieve was to validate fat porn and also equate it with mainstream porn and not as a freak show done with bizarre people.



The lecture was touted as one that would dispell myths about fat porn and give a true perspective on what it is and what it isn't directly from someone well acquainted with the subject. Heather has nothing to lose or gain by speaking at that venue. Hers is already a profitable business and is in no need of validation. Her purpose was merely to educate and share her knowledge, something that Professor Kulick felt enough confidence in to invite her to speak. A wise move on his part.


----------



## missaf

Forgive me for not being able to attend, but I think many of us would like to see an outline of what was posted! Heather, did you use powerpoint? Could you save it as a web presentation on the BigCuties site so people could peruse what you said on the behalf of the community?


----------



## AnnMarie

missaf said:


> Forgive me for not being able to attend, but I think many of us would like to see an outline of what was posted! Heather, did you use powerpoint? Could you save it as a web presentation on the BigCuties site so people could peruse what you said on the behalf of the community?



Heather is away still, and super busy with a new home and working on the NAAFA arrangements for this year. 

A few people have asked for a transcript, the PPT presentation (which would be essentially* useless since it was merely large/medium scale bullet points, not the text of the presentation), video, etc. I'll just say this - if anything from the evening becomes available, someone will let you all know here on the boards - definitely.

*edit, forgot the LY


----------



## kitimer

I am very happy to see that people are really interested in FAt beauty and acceptance and all that go with it.
Thanks for the good work to everyone !!!!


----------



## Vince

Thanks, Lilly, for that information. That is what I wanted to hear. I accept that a concept like 'pearshaped' is not easy to define but admirers instantly recognize one when they see one! 

It is interesting that Heather's site grosses about $200,000. Are there any statistics comparing her performance with other sites in the porn domain? Being in business may or may not make one an expert in that business. There are heaps of factors that contribute to success or failure and most of the time those involved have little idea about what works and what they should be trying. If she survived and expanded in an on line business for 10 years we would have to congratulate her because she must be doing something right.

I am just discussing that presentation and trying to find out more about it. There is no need for anyone to be defensive about it. I am not attacking anyone. In a very real sense Heather did represent all of us there. I think we should be interested in what was said and what arguments were used to explain, support and justify what she is doing. I thought about her showing those slides and thought how effective if would have been had she had a few of her models with her. I am sure live models parading there in lingerie would have made a big impression. :eat2: 

It is probably true that most fat women seldom expose themselves in bathing suits on the beach or in magazines, etc. I have heard of some fat wives never revealing themselves to husbands or boyfriends because they are ashamed of their bodies. That Heather enlightened the audience about soft fat porn is a good thing and those people will think differently about fat women in the future. 

Maybe one day they might invite an admirer to present that point of view? That surely qualifies as a deviant desire.


----------



## Tina

In your opinion. I do not consider a person enjoying the way a fat woman, or man, looks to be a "deviant desire."


----------



## Vince

My opinion? Heck, if it were only my opinion that fancying really fat women is bizarre. That is the opinion of just about everyone I have ever met. This includes the women I have known. I have taken crap for 8 years on this site because hardly anyone really, truly believes that a gym owner, PE teacher and bodybuilder can like huge women. Yeah, that's right, most here suspect that I don't fancy large women. Just a couple of weeks ago someone PM me asking if I were a FA. Yep, a complete F...ing A.s.o.e! No doubt about that in many minds here. Fat admirer? What's to like about fat? That is crazy. I like large female bodies that contain fat. Most people I know consider me absolutely nuts. I can't explain it to any of them and they aren't listening anyway. The reaction I get from men is mirth to outright incredulity. That's right, they laugh their asses off. My ex girlfriend and her new guy say, "There's Vince's wife!" when they see a huge woman anywhere in their travels. It is all a big joke. 

So don't go telling me this preference is normal. Oh, maybe it should be. To the vast majority out there is it bizarre and crazy. It is deviant for sure.


----------



## LillyBBBW

No problem Vince. I know many people were eager to know exactly what was said, what was covered, how the subject was characteristically portrayed, etc. I'm not one for details. Professor Kulick's talk alone lasted from four to five minutes. The things said in his portion alone would take up a full page. 

The entire presentation took an hour and a half, including the question and answer period. My brain hurts with the mere thought of trying to recreate the whole thing here. To satisfy at least a bit of the curiosity I wanted to give just a flavor for how the presentation went as I am certain many were itching to know. I did not want to speak in Heather's place however. I didn't write anything down or take notes so the information I provide is merely a flavor and nothing more. If my post came off as irritable it was merely because I loath having to go into detail and was hoping to avoid it.

As for porn site statistics, it's clear that the industry is a big money maker. Sites like those garner immense amounts of cash flow. What is so remarkable about Heather's and the other's here like hers is that they are at relatively low cost. Most other sites are $19.95, $29.95 and even more per month. At $5.95 a month, Heather has some rather impressive numbers. One need not be an expert in porn marketing statistics and profits to see that. The profits made at BigCuties demonstrate to the audience that fat porn does sell and quite well, indicating that fat admiration is not the obscure fringe fetish that it's commonly believed to be. If that doesn't dispell a myth I don't know what does. 

I agree. It would be interesting to know what mainstream sites bring in. I'm not sure if any of these sites are required to publicize their profits so it's difficult to say. I'm sure that given what they charge and the frenzied porn addiction that rules our society as a whole the numbers would be staggering and Heather's profits would dwarf theirs by a considerable margin. Still, her statistics standing on their own hold a strong relevance to the subject of fat porn and its popularity. 




Vince said:


> Thanks, Lilly, for that information. That is what I wanted to hear. I accept that a concept like 'pearshaped' is not easy to define but admirers instantly recognize one when they see one!
> 
> It is interesting that Heather's site grosses about $200,000. Are there any statistics comparing her performance with other sites in the porn domain? Being in business may or may not make one an expert in that business. There are heaps of factors that contribute to success or failure and most of the time those involved have little idea about what works and what they should be trying. If she survived and expanded in an on line business for 10 years we would have to congratulate her because she must be doing something right.
> 
> I am just discussing that presentation and trying to find out more about it. There is no need for anyone to be defensive about it. I am not attacking anyone. In a very real sense Heather did represent all of us there. I think we should be interested in what was said and what arguments were used to explain, support and justify what she is doing. I thought about her showing those slides and thought how effective if would have been had she had a few of her models with her. I am sure live models parading there in lingerie would have made a big impression. :eat2:
> 
> It is probably true that most fat women seldom expose themselves in bathing suits on the beach or in magazines, etc. I have heard of some fat wives never revealing themselves to husbands or boyfriends because they are ashamed of their bodies. That Heather enlightened the audience about soft fat porn is a good thing and those people will think differently about fat women in the future.
> 
> Maybe one day they might invite an admirer to present that point of view? That surely qualifies as a deviant desire.


----------



## LillyBBBW

I have spent many moments having a gas laugh at the expense of other fat women I see in the street sporting Disney inspired clothing and accessories. Many of us here on the boards have entertained ourselves heartily at their expense. Do I think that women who fancy Disney and cartoon characters to the point of draping them all over their bodies are deviant?  Yes. Are they deviant? No. In looking at things like this one has to have the ability to separate opinion from fact. I think people who put mayonnaise on french fries are a bunch of sickos. Some people think I'm a heartless beast because I continue to eat meat and fraternize with others who do the same. My mom thinks I'm a maniac. Just because many people think something doesn't mean that it's true.




Vince said:


> My opinion? Heck, if it were only my opinion that fancying really fat women is bizarre. That is the opinion of just about everyone I have ever met. This includes the women I have known. I have taken crap for 8 years on this site because hardly anyone really, truly believes that a gym owner, PE teacher and bodybuilder can like huge women. Yeah, that's right, most here suspect that I don't fancy large women. Just a couple of weeks ago someone PM me asking if I were a FA. Yep, a complete F...ing A.s.o.e! No doubt about that in many minds here. Fat admirer? What's to like about fat? That is crazy. I like large female bodies that contain fat. Most people I know consider me absolutely nuts. I can't explain it to any of them and they aren't listening anyway. The reaction I get from men is mirth to outright incredulity. That's right, they laugh their asses off. My ex girlfriend and her new guy say, "There's Vince's wife!" when they see a huge woman anywhere in their travels. It is all a big joke.
> 
> So don't go telling me this preference is normal. Oh, maybe it should be. To the vast majority out there is it bizarre and crazy. It is deviant for sure.


----------



## autopaint-1

"So don't go telling me this preference is normal. Oh, maybe it should be. To the vast majority out there is it bizarre and crazy. It is deviant for sure."

Unfortunately the words you use while technically correct are misunderstood because in common usage they denote a warped mind or sensibility. The confusion comes when we use the word bizarre when what we mean to say is misunderstood. In other words, while our society as a whole currently see thin as the ideal, and this hasnt always been the case, there are people whole prefer a woman with a larger body. Is this Bizarre, or is this a preference? Crazy? Another word which brings strong emotions with it. Is the appeal of say a woman over 6 foot crazy or is it a preference? If anything other than the norm is to be considered crazy or bizarre then the entire American ideal is such. Many countries of the world live in homogeneous societies, where the vast majority of citizens come from the same cultural, ethnic and racial background. Thats what separates America (and Canada) from the rest of the world. Are we to consider the fact that Americans are a Bizarre and Crazy people because of this? Just because something isnt understood doesnt automatically make it crazy or bizarre. In all honesty, according to your word usage my life is bizarre and crazy and yet if being attracted to only thin woman means Im not crazy or bizarre, Ill make use of the old adage, whats in a word.


----------



## AnnMarie

LillyBBBW said:


> At $5.95 a month, Heather has some rather impressive numbers.



That's only for a trial... just to be clear.

And also - for everyone, if this conversation is going to be about sites, and using names of such sites, etc... then anything remaining on the topic should be moved to a new thread on the paysite board. This thread was really only to discuss the actual presentation, and the pictures of the event - not the porn industry and specific site names, etc.

Those don't belong in this forum.


----------



## Littleghost

LillyBBBW said:


> She runs a very successful site that grossed round about $200,000 last year. The reason her site and her pictures are so successful is because Heather knows exactly what is going to appeal to her audience.


Holy Crap! And here I thought that that line of stuff could only really work as a side business in the FA/BBW community. But maybe that's because there's really not as much competition as 'mainstream'. Heck, maybe I oughta ditch my last semesters of school and get into this. Now all I need is some better tech skills, graphic and photography skills, photo equipment, tech equipment, extensive wardrobe, some nice background sets and let's not forget, a girl or two. *sigh*:doh:

Oh to be a Conrad Blickenstorfer,
--Littleghost


----------



## Littleghost

LillyBBBW said:


> Seriously, I would consider quitting my job and following the tour to become roadie. Who wants to be a 'Fat Head' with me?


Hey, maybe I could be a equipment/chauffur (sp?) and carry the 'heavy stuff' around? :wubu: 'course, I'd need help as I look like Jack Skellington. But there's more than enough to share. Have I dug a deep enough hole for me yet?

Practices by carrying pillows,
--Littleghost


----------



## Tina

Vince said:


> My opinion? Heck, if it were only my opinion that fancying really fat women is bizarre. That is the opinion of just about everyone I have ever met. This includes the women I have known. I have taken crap for 8 years on this site because hardly anyone really, truly believes that a gym owner, PE teacher and bodybuilder can like huge women.



Considering that you, yourself, used to post and ask if fat women could be attractive, I'm not sure why you're surprised. Enough years of that and people are going to question your sincerity, so maybe that's it. Or maybe it's the way you've treated some people here. 

But if you're talking real life, in addition to the boards, I know that while people see men with fat women every day when they're out and about, some may think the guy is settling, or something. There is a disconnect for some when it comes to the concept that the guy may prefer his fat girlfriend or wife's body over that of, say, a Playboy model's body. It's been so ingrained that thin bodies -- or at the very most, thick (in the 'right' areas) -- are the only acceptable bodies, there certainly are people out there who cannot accept it. I think it's a society-wide, brainwashing-induced sickness of the mind, frankly. And in my world I don't let that mindset define an attraction to me or my fat brothers or sisters be categorized as "deviant." 

If you choose to take the opinions of some in society and brand yourself with them, that is your choice, but it doesn't define my own reality, Vince.


----------



## Vince

> If you choose to take the opinions of some in society and brand yourself with them, that is your choice, but it doesn't define my own reality, Vince.



There is no choice when it comes to what other people think and believe. It would be foolish to ignor what the majority think. I have always believed what I want to believe but I have always been aware of opinions and the damage they can do. I have made a few posts in the past about whether men can love fat women. Those were written from the point of view of the majority of men I have known. Somehow just about everyone attributed those ideas to me personally. That was a case of misunderstanding that persists in the minds of many today. It surely is a lesson for anyone trying to present ideas on open forums.

Tina, I don't want to talk about me here. 

Getting back to Heather and her presentation I can only imagine what anyone would feel like who was going to do that in front of university staff and students. Those audiences can be quite critical so it would be a brave person who didn't feel apprehensive about appearing before them. That Heather accepted the challenge and survived her lecture is wonderful. I am glad some of her friends such as Ann Marie and Lilly were there to help her. I can just imagine all those gals together supporting each other. I know that Heather has taken on some of the responsibility of running the NAAFA convention and did a good job of keeping that going. From what I have read I know she is an intelligent woman and a leader when it comes to organizing things and getting them done. I certainly don't want to be seen as criticizing her in any way for what she did or didn't do at her presentation. Now that she and others know what to expect it will be easier for her or others to follow her pioneering effort. I salute her courage and am glad she did a good job.


----------



## Michelle

Vince said:


> It would be foolish to ignor what the majority think. I have always believed what I want to believe but I have always been aware of opinions and the damage they can do.


 
Hi, Vince. If the majority of people think fat women are unattractive and men who admire them bizarre, tell me why it would be foolish to ignore what the majority thinks? Repeatedly pointing out how negatively society views us isn't doing anyone any good.


----------



## Vince

All we need is to have Mindy jump in here and it will be 1998 again!


----------



## Tina

Yes, heaven forbid anyone disagree with you, or even answer a post where you talk about yourself so that you can then say you don't want to talk about yourself. 

I agree, Michelle, why dwell on the negative?


----------



## HectorFA

THank you to the reporter Lilly, I enjoy your pics and comments, thank you.

And thank you to Heather, I would have liked so much to be therem and heard you. Maybe I am too daring to ask you this, but I would like if you could share your presentation with us. Of course a presentation use to be accompany with coments and descriptions from the person who show it, you in thei case, but as it is so difficult to find documentations about it, and I am sure you did great, I would kindly ask you to share it, f it is possible.

Greetings from Spain,

Héctor López ( HectorFA)
Webmaster and spokesman of www.likefatwomen.com ( www.gordos.org and www.gordos.es )

:wubu:


----------



## AnnMarie

HectorFA said:


> THank you to the reporter Lilly, I enjoy your pics and comments, thank you.
> 
> And thank you to Heather, I would have liked so much to be therem and heard you. Maybe I am too daring to ask you this, but I would like if you could share your presentation with us. Of course a presentation use to be accompany with coments and descriptions from the person who show it, you in thei case, but as it is so difficult to find documentations about it, and I am sure you did great, I would kindly ask you to share it, f it is possible.
> 
> Greetings from Spain,
> 
> Héctor López ( HectorFA)
> Webmaster and spokesman of www.likefatwomen.com ( www.gordos.org and www.gordos.es )
> 
> :wubu:



If/when something relating to the presenation becomes available to the public it will be posted here, so you'll know. Until then, there are no immediate plans to try to get this done...everyone is just too busy with other things.


----------



## Isa

Thanks for the report and pics Lilly. Looks like a great time was had by all at the lecture and gathering afterwards.


----------



## bigcutiekaroline

Hey...I am glad all went so well! It was great to see the pics of you all hanging out and relaxing afterwards too!!!


----------



## LJ Rock

Lilly, thanks for taking those pics and sharing them all with us. From reading your comments, it truly looks as thought this was a very positive and enlightening event. Big-ups to you and to Heather and AnnMarie and all else who were there and making this happen.

I soooooo should have been there! I am not far from NY now... I have only lived down in PA for about a month and haven't made the journey up to NY yet, but I will soon.  I also wanted to say to Heather.... that was a great write-up/interview in The New York Press that was posted on the home page of Dimensions. Seriously... it's reading stuff like that that makes me truly proud to be a part of this community!


----------



## HectorFA

LillyBBBW said:


> First, Professor Kulick spoke to the audience and set her up, explaining how he came to meet Heather. It appears he was fascinated with the phenom of fat porn when it was touched upon by a previous speaker. His research led him to send out emails to about 50 web hosts and Heather was the only person who wrote back. Eventually he invited her there.
> 
> Kulick was ........
> .............
> .............
> ............. a fat trophy wife on his arm.
> 
> I know I missed a lot of stuff and probably got some of it a little off by a word or two, but it's a rundown.



I keep on giving thank to Heather to be kind as to expose the FA World and around. :bow:


----------



## HectorFA

AnnMarie said:


> If/when something relating to the presenation becomes available to the public it will be posted here, so you'll know. Until then, there are no immediate plans to try to get this done...everyone is just too busy with other things.



THank you to repply me AnnMarie, hope that day come soon a,d I and many other people I will translate it into spanish, and learn more about fatness and sexuality, a reality who people insist to see us as freakies. 

I get advance of this message to thank you too AnnMarie to help that world to difusse Fat admiration to thousand people who admire you too as a gorgeous SSBBW :smitten: :wubu: :shocked: .


----------



## HappyFatChick

First of all, congrats and thanks to the ladies for the great work. Second, why does this thing have be analyzed into oblivion? They did a great job. They enlightened people. I'm confused by someone trying to analyze/dissect/critique the whole thing.
Third, while most men have a shape preference, I wonder what would happen if you had a beautiful face on a body NOT their preference. I would guess they would be attracted as long as she was a bbw.
This whole topic is fascinating and I really enjoy all your opinions.


----------



## bellylover

I am so happy to read in this thread that someone actually started discussing this to a mainstream audience at a university. Having this at as many universities as possible is would make the size acceptance mover so much forward and I am sure it has been an eye opener and confidence boost for all the big girls in the audience, but also for any (closet) FAs.



Tina said:


> I do understand that, and think it would be valuable for some purposes to see such academic papers not only submitted to academic journals but mainstream magazines and newspapers.



Maybe I should start those sociology studies and make that thesis that I spoke about in another thread.


----------



## HectorFA

HappyFatChick said:


> First of all, congrats and thanks to the ladies for the great work. Second, why does this thing have be analyzed into oblivion? They did a great job. They enlightened people. I'm confused by someone trying to analyze/dissect/critique the whole thing.
> Third, while most men have a shape preference, I wonder what would happen if you had a beautiful face on a body NOT their preference. I would guess they would be attracted as long as she was a bbw.
> This whole topic is fascinating and I really enjoy all your opinions.



HappyFatChick, all first steps in any field give rire to a controversy, more even if a SSBBW speak about Fat porn, so I am sure Heather knew she was going to be analyze the whole thing, that is not bad to my own opinion.

Regarding your thrird remark, I think one can find all possibilities, a slender woman with a round pretty face, a large woman with a thin face, and so on, each FA would appreciate the attraction according their taste. To me , despite a body shape is not most important feature from a wooman, but important , just taking into account the body shape , the woman have to be fat all over her body, not only the face or the rest, I appreciate fatness from the tip ( love very fatty feet without ankles ) to top ( round chubby cheeks) , with big bellies, thunder fatty things , inmense wide .... , well , as i say, a woman well-fatty-shaped so to say it. I have been a Fat Admirer since I was born, and always attracted by the most fat women.

Greetings from Spain

HectorFA
www.likefatwomen.com 
:wubu:


----------



## HappyFatChick

Hector- I'm sure Heather knew exactly what she was doing. She's wonderful and my comment was not about her. It was referring to a certain someone on here who tends to analyze/dissect things when it's not really necessary. I didn't want to start anything or point any fingers, so I used a generalization.

Your website is nice. Keep up the good work in Spain.


----------



## HectorFA

HappyFatChick said:


> Hector- I'm sure Heather knew exactly what she was doing. She's wonderful and my comment was not about her. It was referring to a certain someone on here who tends to analyze/dissect things when it's not really necessary. I didn't want to start anything or point any fingers, so I used a generalization.
> 
> Your website is nice. Keep up the good work in Spain.



Thank you for your comment HappyFatChick, we do our best, and I try to show people that fat is chick.


----------



## AnnMarie

HappyFatChick said:


> Third, while most men have a shape preference, I wonder what would happen if you had a beautiful face on a body NOT their preference. I would guess they would be attracted as long as she was a bbw.
> This whole topic is fascinating and I really enjoy all your opinions.


 
It's an interesting question, to be sure. I'd say overall, within a certain similar weight/overall shape, they'd be fine. 

I know FAs who, while attracted to large women, aren't attracted to ALL large women of all shapes. If you show them one woman who is large-huge hips, legs, arms, etc... then you show them a very large apple-soft and hanging belly, thinner legs and arms, etc - there will, for some of them, be attraction to one, and maybe not so much to the other. I'm not saying either shape is better, I'm saying I KNOW men who will be more drawn to one of the two (different men, different shapes). 

Would they consider dating a beautiful woman in the "other" shape? I'm sure they would-they're all good guys, but just as we women have things that we dig or don't dig, I know some guys who wouldn't date one of those women based PURELY on something about her shape. It doesn't click with them sexually, it's not what their eyes seek, for whatever reason. It doesn't mean they can't appreciate her or like her as a person, etc. It could be akin to them being around a skinny girl... nice girl, but doesn't float his boat for some reason. 

So, I guess my answer is that a pretty face, while nice, isn't the great equalizer for everyone - some need that whole damn package.


----------



## Blackjack_Jeeves

For me, personally, my attraction to ladies is rarely based on physical features... The two most important things to me (as far as I have gathered) is that she has a good sense of humor (her smile is very important, both how often she uses it and its sincerity) and she has a good head on her shoulders. I'm stimulated more by intelligence than "a hot bod." A woman could look dazzling, but if she doesn't smile (I mean just not smiling at all, not frowning) or we can't have an intellectual conversation, I'm likely to not be as attracted to her.

Mind you, I'm not saying I don't notice physical features at all. I watch people more often than I realize sometimes, either because they have long wavy hair or they're enjoying a hearty meal... but I don't really think much about it unless we actually converse.

That doesn't seem too off, does it?


----------



## Jay West Coast

AnnMarie said:


> some need that whole damn package.




That's me! Um, can *I *have the whole damn package? What if I use the word "please"? 


<leaves before the women start to discuss men and "packages">


----------



## AnnMarie

Jay West Coast said:


> That's me! Um, can *I *have the whole damn package? What if I use the word "please"?
> 
> 
> <leaves before the women start to discuss men and "packages">



No please necessary, muffin. (see, twice now!) :wubu:


----------



## LillyBBBW

Sweet!  Do you realize that THIS thread has the highest number of views of any thread ever posted on the main dimensions board? And *I* started it all! FINALLY! An achievement that will make my papa proud. 

On the other hand, it's followed close behind by a thread titled 'Big Black Women' posted by Conrad. What does this say about us??


----------



## Vince

Well, Lilly, your thread is referred to on the home page. I guess a lot of people who visit there click onto it and that is why it has had so many hits. You did a good job there as a Dim reporter. Maybe one day they might make you a moderator here!


----------



## toni

LillyBBBW said:


> Sweet!  Do you realize that THIS thread has the highest number of views of any thread ever posted on the main dimensions board? And *I* started it all! FINALLY! An achievement that will make my papa proud.



GO LILLY GO LILLY GO LILLY


----------



## Jay West Coast

toni said:


> GO LILLY GO LILLY GO LILLY



Yeah, I didn't say it yet, but thanks a lot, Lilly. I figured that if I didn't go to the lecture, I'd never know how it went. You really made my day with the report 





.


----------



## SpacemanSpiff1700

AnnMarie said:


> It's an interesting question, to be sure. I'd say overall, within a certain similar weight/overall shape, they'd be fine.
> 
> I know FAs who, while attracted to large women, aren't attracted to ALL large women of all shapes. If you show them one woman who is large-huge hips, legs, arms, etc... then you show them a very large apple-soft and hanging belly, thinner legs and arms, etc - there will, for some of them, be attraction to one, and maybe not so much to the other. I'm not saying either shape is better, I'm saying I KNOW men who will be more drawn to one of the two (different men, different shapes).
> 
> Would they consider dating a beautiful woman in the "other" shape? I'm sure they would-they're all good guys, but just as we women have things that we dig or don't dig, I know some guys who wouldn't date one of those women based PURELY on something about her shape. It doesn't click with them sexually, it's not what their eyes seek, for whatever reason. It doesn't mean they can't appreciate her or like her as a person, etc. It could be akin to them being around a skinny girl... nice girl, but doesn't float his boat for some reason.
> 
> So, I guess my answer is that a pretty face, while nice, isn't the great equalizer for everyone - some need that whole damn package.



Speaking for myself (And for the first time on this board, where I've been lurking for roughly a week now), the type of body is certainly quite significant. I can only speak for my own levers, but in my case I think I'm attracted to the proportions rather than the size itself (I'd say that an hourglass figure is my "type"). So while there's definitely something about the weight itself, for me the figure is the most important part. I'd be willing to bet that there are plenty for whom that one is reversed.

Alas, I'm in easy distance of NYU and never knew about this. Would have been very interesting.


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## Raider X

In an ideal world, it would be nice if you can be judge by your actions and behavior than by outward appearances. Every man, woman, and child has the right to be loved and to love.


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## HotBBWnKC

Vince said:


> When we use the term 'BBW' we know it means Big Beautiful Woman. However, we also know it means all fat women. The public will wonder how it is possible for all fat women to be beautiful.



I was under the impression that all living things were beautiful? Not what the media pushes down societies throats.....


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