# Paysite models-Shaping your experiences?



## mergirl (Sep 12, 2009)

I was wondering about how many people think that paysite models have shaped their expectations/experiences of fat women in real life (or non models online)??
I know that for many Fas, Paysite models are the first port of call in internet experiences with bbws.

I have noticed a few first time posters making a few gaffs in regards to how they talk about and talk to women. For instance, Pming women they dont know asking " how much do you weigh" or saying "I want to rub your fat belly"..etc (you know the gaffs). I'm wondering if these mistakes are co-related to watching porn and thinking that this kind of talk turns on every fat woman in the world. 

Also, there seems to be a sort of unrealistic assumption from many that fat women should be nothing but super confident, and when women discuss anything which deviates from this they are met with dissmissal. 

I want to make it clear i have nothing against paysite models (and know people who 'do porn' lol), i just think it is possible that some Fa's confuse fantasy with reality sometimes, to their detriment. 
What do you think?
mer


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## Dr. Feelgood (Sep 12, 2009)

mergirl said:


> I have noticed a few first time posters making a few gaffs in regards to how they talk about and talk to women. For instance, Pming women they dont know asking " how much do you weigh" or saying "I want to rub your fat belly"..etc (you know the gaffs). I'm wondering if these mistakes are co-related to watching porn and thinking that this kind of talk turns on every fat woman in the world.



Long before Al Gore invented the Internet, there were assholes. Before they could pm women they insulted them verbally -- and not just fat women, either. At one time there was a C&W song entitled, "If I Said You Had A Beautiful Body, Would You Hold It Against Me?" In some quarters* this is considered the equivalent of Oscar Wilde at his wittiest. I suspect this happens more online, less because of paysite goddesses and more because the jerks know they're out of slapping range.


*bars, mostly


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## mergirl (Sep 12, 2009)

yessum. Arseholes are arseholes. I'm talking specifically in the fat/fa 'scene'. Maby, its the same all over though..mixing up fantasy with reality. 
I have the distinct impression that there will be a few people with their expectations crumbling when they get their first bbw girlfriend and she doesn't giggle, popping out of her clothes while eating cream cakes and rubbing her belly orgasmically. 
Even if the fantasy v's reality divide is not so extreme, i still think the confidence of many bbws can be over estimated. I see it here and i have seen it in real life. Its like Fas are anoyed when women do not utterly revel in their fat. (Not all Fas of course)
I just see such a big divide between what seems to be expected of big women by fas somehow and the emotions, feelings and reality of the big women themselves. 
I think seperating the fantasy from the reality would really help newer Fa's not to get bashed and would help the women on this site to feel less objectified. Though, maby that is an impossibility here anyway...
It was just something i was thinking about.


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## Cors (Sep 12, 2009)

Great thread! I think Wrestlingguy and SuperO made relevant, well-thought out comments on the Porn thread (link). 

I have always found it easy enough to separate fantasy from reality. The paysite I first suscribed to (Her First Fat Girl, before the suscription came with her more typical Playhouse site) isn't that different from regular porn. Made up girls, hot sex, with little focus on the fat. If anything, having grown up in a horribly fat-phobic place, having a distorted body image myself and knowing some awfully depressed fat people with health and mobility issues, I was skeptical of what I saw on the typical paysites - girls going on and on about how they loooove absolutely everything about being fat, wanting to gain loooots more and how they are so turned on by it all. I didn't doubt that it is possible for BBWs to feel that way, but it just seems so exaggerated. Then again, why broadcast your bad days to admirers who might still struggle with guilt about getting turned on by something many perceive as unhealthy? 

Something unique to BBW paysites is that most of the time, you can actually interact with the models so you see them as a real person and not just a fantasy. That might further cloud a guy's judgement - OMG, she is real and always turned on by her rolls and wants more food all the time! If the same guy has never had the courage to ask a fat girl out in real life but spends all his time chatting to models who are well, keeping up with their bubbly paysite persona, then it is not surprising that he develops such distorted views. 

We all know that there are many girls who pretend to be into certain sexual acts made normal by porn because they want to impress guys. How many BBWs have actually tried to or felt pressured to emulate what they see on paysites because they think that this is what FAs want?


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## Inhibited (Sep 12, 2009)

Dr. Feelgood said:


> Long before Al Gore invented the Internet, there were assholes. Before they could pm women they insulted them verbally -- and not just fat women, either. At one time there was a C&W song entitled, "If I Said You Had A Beautiful Body, Would You Hold It Against Me?" In some quarters* this is considered the equivalent of Oscar Wilde at his wittiest. I suspect this happens more online, less because of paysite goddesses and more because the jerks know they're out of slapping range.
> 
> 
> *bars, mostly



I think you make a good point. I don't don't mind getting messages asking how much i weigh, but i notice alot go girls seem to have an issue with it, maybe it is because I'm new, but it is better then guys messaging a sentence that has a 4 letter word starting with "f" in it.

Cors made a good point too, guys get to interact with models, which brings up the question are the models being themselves or are they being a character when they interact? But in saying that surely guys on Dims are smart enough to separate reality from fantasy? or am i giving them to much credit?

I do agree though that there is an unrealistic expectation to be super confident, everyone has certain areas of the body that they wish they could change, i think as long as those areas don't make you hide away from the world then it is ok.


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## Shosh (Sep 12, 2009)

I have always wondered also, how the models cope living out in the real world, where day to day people would be abusing them about their weight etc, and not adoring them like they are adored here.
Given that you have to live in the real world most of them time, I think it must be hard and crushing in terms of one's self esteem.

Dims is a special place, a safe space.


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## Observer (Sep 12, 2009)

mergirl said:


> I still think the confidence of many bbws can be over estimated. I see it here and i have seen it in real life. Its like Fas are annoyed when women do not utterly revel in their fat.



If a FA's total expectation of BBW reaction is based on the Dimension's Paysite board models before he gets serious about them he has indeed over-estimated confidence levels and will be disillusioned. 

Forty years ago I was in the dating market and faced a much more realistic situation as I'd acquired a car and could date whom I wished. The bigger girls were the most surprised that anyone would ask them out and in many cases initially the most suspicious. The idea that my inviting then to this or that was not a "second choice" after being turned down by others but an actual preference for them was something they'd seldom if ever encountered. 

Fortunately I think most hard-wired FA's have tested the waters long before finding the Paysite Board. They would likely not have found Dimensions if they hadn't already tried getting involved with larger girls and experienced reality. So they know that the confidence exuded by the Paysite Board girls is not the standard and that those running their businesses there are a special breed.

The good news for FA’s is that there is increasing confidence and assertiveness on the part of BBWs today than in my era. There is also increased awareness of of FA’s who are not fetish driven creeps (yes, we have our stereotype issues to overcome as well). .But there is a lot still to be done. 

An excellent topic, btw.


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## tonynyc (Sep 13, 2009)

Susannah said:


> I have always wondered also, how the models cope living out in the real world, where day to day people would be abusing them about their weight etc, and not adoring them like they are adored here.
> Given that you have to live in the real world most of them time, I think it must be hard and crushing in terms of one's self esteem.
> 
> Dims is a special place, a safe space.



Probably depends at what mental state a person is at. You have to deal with the Good folks and the Assholes... 

Now by abuse- do you mean assinine comments?...
You just develop a thick skin. At the end you just tell yourself that... "Your Self Worth will not be affected by the comments of some _'stranger'_ ".

I think there was a thread about the experiences of large folks based on geography (small town vs. city) and that can also have an effect. In most big cities folks may be too wrapped up in their own stuff.


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## marlowegarp (Sep 13, 2009)

Dr. Feelgood said:


> At one time there was a C&W song entitled, "If I Said You Had A Beautiful Body, Would You Hold It Against Me?" In some quarters* this is considered the equivalent of Oscar Wilde at his wittiest.
> *bars, mostly



I think that people forget that many of Oscar Wilde's witticisms, like Shakespeare's, are not far beyond that level. Both wrote many truly amazing things, but they also wrote a LOT of dick jokes. 

ANYWAY, I think that it's like the TV violence argument. Fictional violence affects people, but those that it drives to violence were headed there anyway. Same with porn depicting every BBW as a gluttonous wanton. If people don't get that that is a fantasy, there is some socialization static affecting normal reception.


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## Shosh (Sep 13, 2009)

I think there are plenty of models that are happy and confident within themselves and hence they are confident in modelling.
There is some element of fantasy involved in modelling however, in that there are models who suffer health problems and really are not happy within their skin, and even talk about WLS. So in a way they are selling a fantasy.
I think they are even aware of that, in that they know what particular fantasies sell with their intended audience, such as weight gain, and fetish type talk like " Im a little piggy" etc.
It is all part of the fantasy. I cannot imagine any woman knowingly wanting to refer to herself in those terms.


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## StarWitness (Sep 13, 2009)

marlowegarp said:


> I think that people forget that many of Oscar Wilde's witticisms, like Shakespeare's, are not far beyond that level. Both wrote many truly amazing things, but they also wrote a LOT of dick jokes.



"Your Majesty is like a big jam doughnut with cream on the top!"


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## marlowegarp (Sep 13, 2009)

"If snow is white, why then her breasts are dun!"

Oh, SNAP!


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## AnnMarie (Sep 13, 2009)

Susannah said:


> I cannot imagine any woman knowingly wanting to refer to herself in those terms.




There are some for sure - I know them. It's their thing, their choice, but any guy who's going to assume that would apply across the board is just a clueless individual - porn or not, model or not, he's a moron to not bother to find out another person's limitations and likes/dislikes. 


Most models are just girls who happen to take pictures, nothing more, nothing less. Anyone who spends more than an hour with them will quickly forget that they're models and start realizing who they really ARE, as people. But there's the rub - often no one wants to know more than the image, and that is an issue of the beholder, not the model or their job.


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## Shosh (Sep 13, 2009)

AnnMarie said:


> There are some for sure - I know them. It's their thing, their choice, but any guy who's going to assume that would apply across the board is just a clueless individual - porn or not, model or not, he's a moron to not bother to find out another person's limitations and likes/dislikes.
> 
> 
> Most models are just girls who happen to take pictures, nothing more, nothing less. Anyone who spends more than an hour with them will quickly forget that they're models and start realizing who they really ARE, as people. But there's the rub - often no one wants to know more than the image, and that is an issue of the beholder, not the model or their job.



True.

I am friends with a few girls here who model, through our Facebook pages.
Knowing them in that way, I can say that they are highly intelligent and engaging women. 
Buffie comes to mind straight away. She is amazing.


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## mergirl (Sep 13, 2009)

Susannah said:


> There is some element of fantasy involved in modelling however, in that there are models who suffer health problems and really are not happy within their skin, and even talk about WLS. So in a way they are selling a fantasy.


I wonder if perhaps the 'selling of the fantasy'; by which i mean that the model has no health problems, has no problems pertaining to size related issues (except for when it is offered as part of the tittilation) in some ways 'reasures' fas falsely that fat women are not faced with these issues in real life?


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## mergirl (Sep 13, 2009)

Cors said:


> Great thread! I think Wrestlingguy and SuperO made relevant, well-thought out comments on the Porn thread (link).



Oh cool, cheers Cors, i will have a wee read of that now. x


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## wrestlingguy (Sep 13, 2009)

Funny little observation here.........not too many guys weighing in on this subject thus far, except for a few brave souls.

Perhaps this may be a bit too personal and/or sensitive for us boys?


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## Keb (Sep 13, 2009)

wrestlingguy said:


> Funny little observation here.........not too many guys weighing in on this subject thus far, except for a few brave souls.
> 
> Perhaps this may be a bit too personal and/or sensitive for us boys?



Maybe--or maybe it's addressing a fear that we women have rather than something that most of the male FAs are afraid of. I know I worry about being overlooked because I don't fit the fantasy of either side (those who like thinner women and those who like fat) as portrayed in porn and paysites.


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## mergirl (Sep 14, 2009)

wrestlingguy said:


> Funny little observation here.........not too many guys weighing in on this subject thus far, except for a few brave souls.
> 
> Perhaps this may be a bit too personal and/or sensitive for us boys?


hmm.. perhaps. Why do you think it IS such a personal/sensitive subject for men? See, i was thinking the same. Porn seems to be a coming of age thing, when guys are realising their sexuality they get to look at women from afar before they have to actually interact with them. I think the fat/fa scene is different. Where else is it as common to be able to interact with your favorite porn star, actually talk to them, see what they think about george bush and bio fuels?. I think people are perhaps reticent on this issue because pay site models here are such an integral part of the community. I certainly don't think it is somehow the paysite model's responsibility to release a disclaimer at the end of every set/vid saying- "Please note-Not all women will want to whoop with joy as they step on the scales after eating lots of cakes". These women are fantasy makers and in many cases erotica 'artists', with as much talent in the art of Fa turn on than any burlesque artist does for the 'regular' punter. See, people can also talk about the positive effect that paysite models have had on them. Perhaps, most Fas know the difference between the fantasy and the reality. Having pmed/msgd a lot of fas in the past 8/9 years i think differently. Though, i'm wondering if my online experiences mirror fa ideals in real life.


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## mergirl (Sep 14, 2009)

Keb said:


> Maybe--or maybe it's addressing a fear that we women have rather than something that most of the male FAs are afraid of. I know I worry about being overlooked because I don't fit the fantasy of either side (those who like thinner women and those who like fat) as portrayed in porn and paysites.


In what way would you be afraid you dont match up to other fat women who have paysites? (I think this could help define the borders in some ways between fantasy v's reality).


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## roddles (Sep 14, 2009)

Susannah said:


> I think there are plenty of models that are happy and confident within themselves and hence they are confident in modelling.
> There is some element of fantasy involved in modelling however, in that there are models who suffer health problems and really are not happy within their skin, and even talk about WLS. So in a way they are selling a fantasy.
> I think they are even aware of that, in that they know what particular fantasies sell with their intended audience, such as weight gain, and fetish type talk like " Im a little piggy" etc.
> It is all part of the fantasy. I cannot imagine any woman knowingly wanting to refer to herself in those terms.



Great post. When I date big girls, I always tread carefully because the last thing I want to do is disrespect her. I respect women 100 percent and even though I have a tendency to be attracted to all the padding she is carrying, I always see the person carrying it AS a person, as a woman, who is definatly beautiful. I will call her beautiful and most of the time she will shake her head. I see the dims world as a completly different world, where I feel safe, and where big girls feel safe. I never speak in "dimensions language" to a woman unless she says it is ok, and I would never ask that of a woman. I have only ever met girls from dimensions who actually want you to talk like that.

There are also some elements of dimensions that should remain purely fantasy, as one could argue that applying those to real life could be disrepectful both to himself/herself and his/her partner, and even perhaps foolish.


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## mergirl (Sep 14, 2009)

roddles said:


> Great post. When I date big girls, I always tread carefully because the last thing I want to do is disrespect her. I respect women 100 percent and even though I have a tendency to be attracted to all the padding she is carrying, I always see the person carrying it AS a person, as a woman, who is definatly beautiful. I will call her beautiful and most of the time she will shake her head. I see the dims world as a completly different world, where I feel safe, and where big girls feel safe. I never speak in "dimensions language" to a woman unless she says it is ok, and I would never ask that of a woman. I have only ever met girls from dimensions who actually want you to talk like that.
> 
> There are also some elements of dimensions that should remain purely fantasy, as one could argue that applying those to real life could be disrepectful both to himself/herself and his/her partner, and even perhaps foolish.


Thanks for your post Roddles. What do you mean by 'dimensions language'? Do you mean the kind of stuff i was talking about before? I am wondering if applying the fantasy side to real life could be disrespectful, because many of the fantasies are only ones shared by some of the people here. In what other ways do you think they would be disrespectful? I know that some women might engage and enjoy play that is explored in much of the pornography here though i am guessing many dont. I would guess, actually i know that there would be more fas interested in that kind of fantasy play than fat women would be. I do think paysite models play up to Fa fantasy more often than they do explore and express their own, but then that would make sense, seeing that it is Fas that are paying to watch them.


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## Keb (Sep 14, 2009)

mergirl said:


> In what way would you be afraid you dont match up to other fat women who have paysites? (I think this could help define the borders in some ways between fantasy v's reality).



It isn't that I don't think I'm as good as them, and I feel like I could deliver pretty well on the fantasy for the right guy--but it's more that I fear (however irrationally) being overlooked in favor of women who feel more available, since that's part of the fantasy they're delivering. And that's the part that I can't deliver to every guy out there--only one.


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## Durin (Sep 14, 2009)

I think you have to have real life experiences with Fat Women.

My Wife for instance never goes on Dims even though she knows I am a frequent visitor, it is just something that doesn't interest her. I think if she could take the thin pill she would in an instant, not because she doesn't love herself or selfhatred but because sometimes being Big is hard Physically.

going up and down stairs ect. 

I think Paysite Models really perform an important function for folks to identify who they are and what attracts them. Paysite ladies helped me come to grips with what I like.


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## jakub (Sep 14, 2009)

mergirl said:


> I was wondering about how many people think that paysite models have shaped their expectations/experiences of fat women in real life (or non models online)??



If I see paysite model i just can say - she is hot(or not), thats all.



mergirl said:


> I know that for many Fas, Paysite models are the first port of call in internet experiences with bbws.



For young FA's - you are probably right (and for places where fat girls are very rare).



mergirl said:


> I have noticed a few first time posters making a few gaffs in regards to how they talk about and talk to women. For instance, Pming women they dont know asking " how much do you weigh" or saying "I want to rub your fat belly"..etc (you know the gaffs). I'm wondering if these mistakes are co-related to watching porn and thinking that this kind of talk turns on every fat woman in the world.



Mistakes are related to lack of experience.



mergirl said:


> Also, there seems to be a sort of unrealistic assumption from many that fat women should be nothing but super confident,



Lack of experience.



mergirl said:


> i just think it is possible that some Fa's confuse fantasy with reality sometimes



All people do that from time to time.


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## mergirl (Sep 14, 2009)

Durin said:


> Paysite ladies helped me come to grips with what I like.



I'll pretend i never noticed that wee inuendo there..
I know what you are saying.. though wouldn't big women in real life help you realise what you liked too? See i knew i liked big women before, then when i got online i realised that it was a 'thing'.. i didn't realise liking fat people had a name i guess.


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## Durin (Sep 14, 2009)

> I know what you are saying.. though wouldn't big women in real life help you realise what you liked too?



There were certainly real ladies that I appreciated from afar but I was really shy and really confused at that time in my life. Regular or thin women did not attract me sexually, I wondered if I was perhaps Gay but I didn't find men that interesting thin or fat.

This was a long time ago, pre-internet.


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## tonynyc (Sep 14, 2009)

Keb said:


> It isn't that I don't think *I'm as good as them*, and I feel like * I could deliver pretty well on the fantasy for the right guy*--but it's more that I fear (however irrationally) being overlooked in favor of women who feel more available, since that's part of the fantasy they're delivering. And that's the part that *I can't deliver to every guy out there--only one*.



Well Keb:
I think some of your fears are irrational - all that matters are the points of your post *(see highlighted remarks*)..


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## Jon Blaze (Sep 14, 2009)

Sorry I'm late to the party. 

In short: No.

A lot of it has to do with me though. I've never asked someone online how much they weigh, because numbers aren't my thing and I'm not really into eating in a sexual since. Even with the general pr0nz stuff, however, I don't let that determine how I judge someone.

I'm personal friends with a lot of women that model. I've met many of them in person and they all have a unique story, personality, aspiration, reason for modeling etc... I never act as if I know how they will be, because I don't. Some of the models really are just selling a fantasy, while others are actually into what they say they are. Some are outgoing, and some are somewhat shy (But somehow I seem nice enough to talk to, so I feel all lucky lol ). 

I accept them regardless.


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## joswitch (Sep 14, 2009)

Altho back in the day I was first drawn to BBW sites just for pics & stories, I always got the division between fantasy and reality.. Paysite models only influenced my attitudes insofar as I have RL met / Online chatted to any of them *waves* ... just like all the other women I have met in my life.. Cos paysite models are actual real people too.. With opinions and feelings and sense of fun and humour.. and stuff..


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## Ben from England (Sep 15, 2009)

(reading this through, it's kind of a jumble of thoughts, but hopefully some of it makes sense!)

Well, I when I found out what an FA was and started sniffing around online in about '97/98, paysites were still a dot on the horizon. I think in someways it's easier now than it was then to see the difference between what is real and what is not just by having images that cater to FA fantasies labeled as paysite content, the implication being that it's manufactured. 

However, these posts 



Cors said:


> We all know that there are many girls who pretend to be into certain sexual acts made normal by porn because they want to impress guys. How many BBWs have actually tried to or felt pressured to emulate what they see on paysites because they think that this is what FAs want?






Keb said:


> Maybe--or maybe it's addressing a fear that we women have rather than something that most of the male FAs are afraid of. I know I worry about being overlooked because I don't fit the fantasy of either side (those who like thinner women and those who like fat) as portrayed in porn and paysites.



speak to something that has very much come to colour my perception of fat men and women within the dims/online community specifically. In my opinion, there are a great many times that people not explicitly selling fantasy (for money at least) go looking for acceptance/attention/validation within 'the community', playing down the negatives and catering to FA's (for that matter, there are likely as many FA's catering to fat people). This is not at all suprising given this enviroment is one focusing on fat positivity, but all too often when I was younger I would confuse it with size acceptance and lose perspective. This could sometimes be alienating on two fronts. 

First, as a fat kid who couldn't relate or understand the sentiments expressed by my fellow fat people. 'Why don't I feel like this?' I would wonder whilst reading the millionth _I love everything about being fat_ post. Granted, some of this was due to that good old fashioned desire to hate myself that so often accompanies being fat/adolescence, but some of it was also that I didn't understand that alot of what was said was said for a specific audience (thankfully far less the case nowdays). It would also throw me off balance as an FA trying to figure out how I felt about my preference. Often times I would be angry and confused when I would find out a person who gave the impression that they were perfectly content with their size would suddenly do a 180. I like to feel that, in the last couple of years at least, I've been able to reconcile my understanding of this community (and my sexuality, I guess) with a larger understanding of the world and look at it all in the perspective I deem healthy.

I think the one two puch of my own relationship with my body and my experiences in this community make me overly suspiscious when it comes to trusting people (especially in the community. It took me ages to want to activly be a part of it.) that tell me they are OK with their size, so I'm certainly still a work in progress. 

It wasn't the relatively easy-to-spot facade of wish fulfillment on a sexual level that skewed my perspectives, it was more the culture that has developed within the community that I feel poses the greater threat. I love that dims (or at least pockets of it) have become a far less explicitly fat positive in recent years, though I also wonder about whether it's current more moderate form poses a greater risk of being mistaken as size acceptance. 

In my opinion, it's little wonder that FA's are traditionally seen as so immature when it comes to understanding and interacting with the people they are attracted to - the understanding of their sexuality (especially with so many be closeted through teenage years) can develope predominantly in these kinds of stunted enviroments, on forums such as Dims and Fantasy Feeder. 

I don't want this to come off as an attack on Dims or the community, I think it can be of great benefit when placed within a larger understanding of the world. God knows it's helped me.


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## roddles (Sep 15, 2009)

mergirl said:


> Thanks for your post Roddles. What do you mean by 'dimensions language'? Do you mean the kind of stuff i was talking about before? I am wondering if applying the fantasy side to real life could be disrespectful, because many of the fantasies are only ones shared by some of the people here. In what other ways do you think they would be disrespectful? I know that some women might engage and enjoy play that is explored in much of the pornography here though i am guessing many dont. I would guess, actually i know that there would be more fas interested in that kind of fantasy play than fat women would be. I do think paysite models play up to Fa fantasy more often than they do explore and express their own, but then that would make sense, seeing that it is Fas that are paying to watch them.



By "dimensions language" I was meaning that we perhaps use language and terms here that are not acceptable in the real world, because they ARE disrespectful if the recieving person is not into it. I think because there is more FAs interested in the fantasy, than women, it could possibly tempt one to try and force the fantasy upon someone else. 

I know plenty of bbw who are comfortable in their skin and even like being big. But I would never in a million years say "I wanna rub your fat belly" That is respectful, and demeaning to her, for she is a person, not a thing. And it would be selfish to ask. I also like to make sure that the woman also enjoys as much as I do. It would be like asking a woman to suck your cock, and insulting her at the same time.

However I think most FA folk get it. We are only talking about a small minority of nieve and perhaps nasty FA's? - I think It is quite easy to see since as someone said we are the only community who can actually talk to our favourite model, see what she did yesterday and what she (or he I should probably say) thinks about current affairs. Does that not indicate this model is a real person?


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## bdog (Sep 16, 2009)

wrestlingguy said:


> Funny little observation here.........not too many guys weighing in on this subject thus far, except for a few brave souls.
> 
> Perhaps this may be a bit too personal and/or sensitive for us boys?



I don't have much to weigh in. I make offensive comments all the time but coming on to a girl in a vulgar fashion? Never done that. I've dated girls for years and never knew their weight, even though that is a party of my fantasy.

As far as confidence goes? It's not even something I really pay much attention to when I'm looking at pictures of tits and ass. In real life I date women with high self esteem and when I find kinks in their armor I like them even more, FWIW.


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## Mies (Sep 16, 2009)

wrestlingguy said:


> Funny little observation here.........not too many guys weighing in on this subject thus far, except for a few brave souls.
> 
> Perhaps this may be a bit too personal and/or sensitive for us boys?



Naw, the women just post more in general. Even the "HER Pornage Usery- Your FEELINGS" thread has 31 female posts to 21 male, and that's in a thread whose premise is: "Wondering about the viewpoint of the menfolk...".


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## Merc Mike (Sep 20, 2009)

Uhhhh...If I heard some guy saying this to a random girl out in public, I'd say something to him.
To be that disrespective to a woman out in public (See...Chat/IM/Forum Etc is for PRIVATE means....yea)...that doesn't make it right at all. If It's at a "BBW CLUB" then...eh..I won't bother, I'll shrug it off unless the girl saying it too looks distraught...

I've never even encountered a moment where I would fully outrageously say that to a woman, let alone a big girl.

Only time I would ever say anything remotely "Sexy" or "Flirtacious/Disrespectful(I.E. "You have a nice butt" or something to that extent) to a woman is"
1. If I knew her and she was ok with it
2. We Joke
3. If I know she likes me/again fun flirting but between us not in public or if in public in the eyes of people who know we do this anyway, friends, family, but not complete strangers where she might be uncomfortable. @[email protected]


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## chocolate desire (Sep 21, 2009)

Amen AM I know for myself if men dont stimulate my mind he sure dont get anything but a thank you for liking my body.
To be honest one of the reasons I became a model was so other women who was not comfortable with themselves can say wow she is that big and dont mind showing herself. I know there are still women out in hthe world just like I was a short ten years ago that thibk they are fat and EVERY man only likes thin women I hope by beong a model they will see thats not true. I model for me not for men although it is very nice to be adored.



AnnMarie said:


> There are some for sure - I know them. It's their thing, their choice, but any guy who's going to assume that would apply across the board is just a clueless individual - porn or not, model or not, he's a moron to not bother to find out another person's limitations and likes/dislikes.
> 
> 
> Most models are just girls who happen to take pictures, nothing more, nothing less. Anyone who spends more than an hour with them will quickly forget that they're models and start realizing who they really ARE, as people. But there's the rub - often no one wants to know more than the image, and that is an issue of the beholder, not the model or their job.


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## chocolate desire (Sep 21, 2009)

Thats very true Sooshie and most with facebook has two one for the real them and one of their model persona.



Susannah said:


> True.
> 
> I am friends with a few girls here who model, through our Facebook pages.
> Knowing them in that way, I can say that they are highly intelligent and engaging women.
> Buffie comes to mind straight away. She is amazing.


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## MatthewB (Sep 21, 2009)

Ben from England said:


> When I found out what an FA was and started sniffing around online in about '97/98, paysites were still a dot on the horizon. I think in someways it's easier now than it was then to see the difference between what is real and what is not just by having images that cater to FA fantasies labeled as paysite content, the implication being that it's manufactured.
> 
> However, these posts speak to something that has very much come to colour my perception of fat men and women within the dims/online community specifically. In my opinion, there are a great many times that people not explicitly selling fantasy (for money at least) go looking for acceptance/attention/validation within 'the community', playing down the negatives and catering to FA's (for that matter, there are likely as many FA's catering to fat people). This is not at all suprising given this enviroment is one focusing on fat positivity, but all too often when I was younger I would confuse it with size acceptance and lose perspective. This could sometimes be alienating on two fronts.
> 
> ...


I've got to agree with everything you're saying, *Ben*; I'm actually worried that, by saying stuff like _"Oh, what a sight!"_ and the like to the ladies on the pay-site board, I'm ill-preparing myself for actually chatting with a woman (yes, even a fat woman) in the real world... and I've never actually been in a relationship with a woman before, so that's even scarier to me. :blush:


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## The Orange Mage (Sep 22, 2009)

My experiences?

Well the first thought on seeing the stuff at the age of 13 or so was that "Oh sweet, this exists! I'm not crazy!"

And then the thought went a step further and in a rare bout of testosterone-fueled optimism I thought, "Women who revel in their fat, sexy goddess-ness must exist as well!"

And then the diving off the cliff into the sea of paysite previews, erotic fiction, and so on for a long long long time.

Then it's on to surfacing and having to think about that thing called reality. Because let's be honest, only a select few crazy FAs ever reach the level of "FUCKYEAH, CATAPULT FORCEFEED!" or telling trick-or-treaters that your wife used to be the world's largest model at 800+ pounds, or just happening to be Ned.

The real trick is to consider all things FA when not horny. :doh: Only when you pull that off can the journey to normalcy begin.

---

On a related note, I am somewhat offended and saddened at paysite models who you can tell aren't into it all...not going to name names but you can just read their expressions that say, "You guys seriously think this is hot?", or the epic accusation of 'running the paysite to raise money for WLS' which is and always has been a rumour fueled by craziness and a few models dropping pounds for whatever reasons they want which I have no issues with. And not to mention the "Oh look how fat I've gotten!" thing every other update when if you look they're either the same size or smaller than before? Yeah. Maybe I'm missing the point and grown out of this sort of thing but whatever.


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## Ned Sonntag (Sep 22, 2009)

So... this thread's been going for 10 days and I don't spot it until just 2hrs after my name's been mentioned? It's the usual weirdness. You kids have to realize that the relative velocity of the weirdness is increasing exponentially~~ just keep that in mind and as always, I Blame Society For This.:bow:


The Orange Mage said:


> My experiences?
> 
> Well the first thought on seeing the stuff at the age of 13 or so was that "Oh sweet, this exists! I'm not crazy!"
> 
> ...


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## rollhandler (Sep 22, 2009)

The Orange Mage said:


> My experiences?
> 
> Well the first thought on seeing the stuff at the age of 13 or so was that "Oh sweet, this exists! I'm not crazy!"
> 
> ...



Dimensions is probably NOT the first place a burgeoning FA has his first interaction with the women he/she desires. This post tells the time line of a lot of FAs with a good proximity of accuracy. Adjust the frames of time to suit but it fits the sequence for quite a number of us.

I have always thought of myself as a student of the human condition and [in life] specifically as it relates to FAs and (SS)BBWs. I have been every type of FA from the creepy guy who begs for pics, to the student who seeks to only understand and correlate how this information can make my relationships longer lasting and more fulfilling by understanding the BBW perspective, integrating that information in how to be a better more understanding FA to my partner.

I found Dimensions in the middle of this journey.

My experiences with pay-site models are near non-existent (I have met some on the net but never in the context of their jobs) but my experience with BBW porn is not. As such my experiences aren't shaped much by them, however I have spent time in the Fat and Gaining chat fantasizing with other chatters the extremes of where my mind goes in its testosterone fueled moments, and those experiences have in some ways helped me to realize that I am not alone in what I find sexually erotic. This helps me understand my normalcy as an FA in the world at large.

I believe that in the absence of real life experiences with the objects of our desires most FAs have their first experiences with them from the perspective of porn as they try to come to terms with their differences with society norms and their peers. For some it is an epiphany to find that the fantasy women are real for some a realization of shame to understand that they ARE different and the reason why is on the screen turning them on in ways no other shape of woman can. As it has been pointed out in so many threads many FAs do not date until much later than their peers and are thus stunted in their social maturity in regards to male/female interaction. I myself didn't have my first date until I was 18 and my first sexual experience involving another person until almost 21. All pre-internet. So all I really had to draw from as far as what I desired in a relationship woman was a fantasy fueled Ideal, refined over years, totally based on how I wanted her to look and how my fantasy defined how she would act toward me as a partner and herself as a woman of size, both in an entirely sexual context.

If an FA first interactive experience with a BBW is through paysites it has the tendency to reinforce this ideal. I would venture that a lot of FAs found Dimensions while searching for porn stories. I was at this point in life where I had a bit of perspective of the real life of a BBW but still sought the ideal of the fantasy, I read the rules on the board for chat and went to each room as befit my mood for the day. I was able to divide my actions online and fantasize in the gainer rooms, and still be the gentleman in the main chat. There were many times however that my fantasy overrode judgement though and things were said that got me in trouble from time to time. 

It is only through being with BBWs and talking to them as women and people, that I really began to learn the similarities and differences between them and other woman in the world and be able to apply those lessons to my relationships. Dimensions has been the most valuable resource in these lessons because of the variety of personalities and ways of thinking that are here, from the supremely confident BBW to the beginner on her journey to discover her self worth and all the personalities that these women have. I have probably been less affected by pay-sites than my own imagination than the FAs of the computer generation since when I started seeking the fantasy material online there was more hours of frustration than actual satisfaction in my searches. Now it seems that "the net" is the fantasy seekers Ideal not only in being able to find what they seek but to interact with their fantasy women as well. This will have the tendency to place them at another section of the relationship learning curve when they finally seek and start relationships in real life and in chat as friends and start interacting with NON Models whose fantasy persona fits their ideal whereas in real life it is quite the wake up call. Some hang on to that fantasy Ideal and look for the one that matches it in real life quickly disregarding any who don't fit that ideal while others learn more quickly that the fantasy and the reality don't quite line up as often if ever and adjust their behaviour accordingly.
Rollhandler


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## Scorsese86 (Sep 24, 2009)

If I see something on the paysite board I like, I leave a comment for everyone to see. I try not to go perv or naughty or anything, just leaving a positive comment, that I liked what I saw.
I don't think people should send messages to random unknowns, asking how much they weigh, things like that. That's not my thing at least. People are people, and plus size paysite models are people with feelings too. They do a job, they show off themselves, because they like it, nobody forces them, but we should respect them too.
I adore BBW's, everyone knows that, and I try my best to show the respect they deserve. I have very little interest in sending creepy messages to unknown people!

End of rant, and I hope what I wanted to say came out...


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## wrestlingguy (Sep 24, 2009)

I used to help my wife run her MySpace page, and answer the bulk of her fan mail.

Many of you know this is a sore spot for me, but the general ass hattery of the the guys who actually think that a webmodel, or any woman, for that matter, is going to respond favorably to the crap that they fling at the paysite girls is incredible.

As such, I often would log back in as myself, and contact said ass hat, and remind them that they didn't talk with their mothers that way, and shouldn't talk to anyone like that. Some apologized, others spoke that way to me. One actually made it to a bash a few years ago, and I spoke with him outside and sent him home to his mom to learn some manners (sorry I never told you that Berna).

I would have to assume that since not every webmodel responds the way I do, that guys have no motivation to be nicer, and may get more aggressive in their language if they aren't checked. FURTHERMORE, it makes it easier for some of the ass hats to talk even worse to the non paysite girls, since they aren't the "prized possessions" to the ass hats.

The rest will be in my book. Look for it, but not at your local bookstore.


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## mithrandirjn (Sep 29, 2009)

Crossing up fantasy and reality can happen to anybody with any kind of sexual preference, and sadly, it exists quite strongly in this particular community for reasons already stated, the biggest, I think, being that FA'dom is often stunted and not developed in a natural, healthy way. Let's face it, there are plenty of guys who may like or admire big women out there, but many of them aren't about to admit it in public, and thus have most of their experiences confined to things like paysites and whatnot, seeking the anonymity of the Internet.

That being said, on the topic of webmodels, I admit that my experiences are mostly limited, but I feel the women I have interacted with seem to mostly be of the more positive mindset. I think that kind of has to go with the territory for many women; the act of modeling (and other performance art) typically has to involve some level of love for your own image, whatever it may be, and an outgoing nature that tends to lend itself to a more positive mindset. This obviously doesn't apply to every model, and I'm not naive enough to believe a large number aren't just "selling a product", but that's just my take on it.

This doesn't mean a model will want to hear sexist/objectifying/etc. talk from random fanboys, even if they ARE 100% comfortable with their weights and images, but that's just because, well, they're human beings, too, the vast majority of people aren't into that crap.

I do find that, in my own life, part of what often stops me from being with a lot of bigger girls is how difficult it can be to make them feel good about themselves at times. I feel for these girls, especially when I'm being completely honest with them saying how attractive I find them, wishing they could see things the way I see them, but I can't force that on them.

It's sad, and unfortunately, it hurts chances at a relationship, since one feels like they have to remind their partner constantly "Yes, I DO think you're very attractive, no matter what some other people think". To this degree, I think paysite models may have shaped some of my experiences; I remember going to Mandy Blake's site, or Courtney's, and a few others, and seeing how positive they always seemed to be (with some doses of reality mixed in, but they'd generally come off as positive about their bodies) and hoping I could find a bigger woman with such a positive self-image, but it's a very difficult thing, for the obvious reasons. Being around somebody who really has a bad view of themselves is trying, no matter the person's size, and it just doesn't work for anybody involved.


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## zanza (Sep 30, 2009)

I can't really say they have shaped my views or anything, i suppose i have in the past and now tended to not be really focused on them. (outside of maybe using the images to reference form in learning to render the form of varying ranges of plus sized women)

I suppose they do not provided a interesting enough interaction to me, I guess I am looking for something more than physical attraction for something

I do think that they do change the culture of things, in a way I can't really say for sure.

If only because it makes the interaction a little more objectified, I suppose erotica does that any way depending on how detached you are from the source. You start to only think of the images or vids instead of the person who is subject of them and their feelings and viewpoints. This may lead to interactions with others being crippled as a result of ones fantasy often interfering with real life interactions.

But I guess that is just me


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## JohnWylde (Sep 30, 2009)

I think I can confirm that Renee looks for more than just looks.
And when it comes to stimulating her mind, I can also say that her mind is as sharp as a razor! 
She may not be a blonde and she sure isn't dumb either!
I'm sure those guys who think model and dumb go together have found that out already!

John W



chocolate desire said:


> Amen AM I know for myself if men dont stimulate my mind he sure dont get anything but a thank you for liking my body.
> To be honest one of the reasons I became a model was so other women who was not comfortable with themselves can say wow she is that big and dont mind showing herself. I know there are still women out in hthe world just like I was a short ten years ago that thibk they are fat and EVERY man only likes thin women I hope by beong a model they will see thats not true. I model for me not for men although it is very nice to be adored.


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## TraciJo67 (Sep 30, 2009)

The Orange Mage said:


> On a related note, I am somewhat offended and saddened at paysite models who you can tell aren't into it all...not going to name names but you can just read their expressions that say, "You guys seriously think this is hot?", or the epic accusation of 'running the paysite to raise money for WLS' which is and always has been a rumour fueled by craziness and a few models dropping pounds for whatever reasons they want which I have no issues with. And not to mention the "Oh look how fat I've gotten!" thing every other update when if you look they're either the same size or smaller than before? Yeah. Maybe I'm missing the point and grown out of this sort of thing but whatever.




Orange Mage ... the paysite models are running a business ... and this business of making money involves indulging subscriber's fantasies. When the camera is turned off, and the fappers are done fapping (or not), and the subscribers click out of their website(s) of choice, the models don't turn off the lights and quietly disappear into the utility closet, waiting anxiously for the next fapper to bluster in and make them REAL GIRLS again. Your choice of words -- that you get 'offended' at any whiff of your fantasy perhaps not being as real as you'd like for it to be -- strikes me as very odd. If you're subscribed to a paysite, you're paying money to have a fantasy indulged. The models are under no -- absolutely NO OBLIGATION -- to make an effort to convince you that they're wildly joyful about a lifestyle filled with pies and buckets of chicken and family feast pizzas that end with nekkid romps to the scale in hopes that they've gained another few pounds. If you aren't sold that the fantasy is convincing, use your credit card elsewhere. But ... offended? Suspicious? (As in, you need to SEE the number on the scale as evidenced by your last few sentences). What do you think these models owe you, Orange Mage?


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## Mini (Sep 30, 2009)

TraciJo67 said:


> Orange Mage ... the paysite models are running a business ... and this business of making money involves indulging subscriber's fantasies. When the camera is turned off, and the fappers are done fapping (or not), and the subscribers click out of their website(s) of choice, the models don't turn off the lights and quietly disappear into the utility closet, waiting anxiously for the next fapper to bluster in and make them REAL GIRLS again. Your choice of words -- that you get 'offended' at any whiff of your fantasy perhaps not being as real as you'd like for it to be -- strikes me as very odd. If you're subscribed to a paysite, you're paying money to have a fantasy indulged. The models are under no -- absolutely NO OBLIGATION -- to make an effort to convince you that they're wildly joyful about a lifestyle filled with pies and buckets of chicken and family feast pizzas that end with nekkid romps to the scale in hopes that they've gained another few pounds. If you aren't sold that the fantasy is convincing, use your credit card elsewhere. But ... offended? Suspicious? (As in, you need to SEE the number on the scale as evidenced by your last few sentences). What do you think these models owe you, Orange Mage?



One day I hope to make money off of men who can't differentiate between art and reality. I just wish my tits were bigger.


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## Dr. Feelgood (Sep 30, 2009)

Mini said:


> One day I hope to make money off of men who can't differentiate between art and reality. I just wish my tits were bigger.



If you make ten cents off everyone who can't differentiate between art and reality ... or, for that matter, between kitsch and reality ... you can corner the silicone market. :bow:


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## Mini (Sep 30, 2009)

Dr. Feelgood said:


> If you make ten cents off everyone who can't differentiate between art and reality ... or, for that matter, between kitsch and reality ... you can corner the silicone market. :bow:



Oh, silicone, you are to breasts what Vlad the Impaler is to Dracula.


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## tonynyc (Sep 30, 2009)

Mini said:


> Oh, silicone, you are to breasts what Vlad the Impaler is to Dracula.



*And Carrot Juice- Don't forget your daily dose*


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## Dr. P Marshall (Sep 30, 2009)

tonynyc said:


> *And Carrot Juice- Don't forget your daily dose*



Why would you do this to us?


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## tonynyc (Oct 1, 2009)

Shock value


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## Dr. P Marshall (Oct 1, 2009)

tonynyc said:


> Shock value



I will send you the bill for my therapy.


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## tonynyc (Oct 1, 2009)

Dr. P Marshall said:


> I will send you the bill for my therapy.



Now Dr. P Marshall - I hope you give me the discount rate


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## swamptoad (Oct 28, 2009)

wrestlingguy said:


> I used to help my wife run her MySpace page, and answer the bulk of her fan mail.
> 
> Many of you know this is a sore spot for me, but the general ass hattery of the the guys who actually think that a webmodel, or any woman, for that matter, is going to respond favorably to the crap that they fling at the paysite girls is incredible.
> 
> ...




I think its just sad that year after year it seems that there's more and more assholes building porn collections, sharing stolen content even, and/or sending disrespectful emails or private messages to paysite models or non-webmodels. That kind of behavior seems to becoming quickly a norm for a lot of people. Just makes me very sad.


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