# When Fatherhood Is Not an Option



## CynPart2 (Apr 5, 2008)

Hi, all. Ive been popping in and out of Dimensions since the mid-90s, so this is a "not-quite-newbie" post. (My old screen name had posts with lots of ancient, forgettable history.)

Here's the problem, and I hope you can help... Im 43, diabetic (with HTN and mild neuropathy), working FT, and going to school, so Ive determined that pregnancy is not a wise option for me. Consequently, Ive decided to undergo sterilization. My husband, who also has a long family history of health problems, understands the reasons on an intellectual level and fully supports my decision. But, emotionally, hes having a hard time coping with the notion of never experiencing fatherhood. (We met in midlife, and this is a first marriage for both of us.) He regards fatherhood as the chance to leave behind a legacy and "bring life full circle." 

I love him with all my heart and wish that I knew how to help him through this painful period. Although I believe that life is filled with many other opportunities to leave behind a legacy, I dont know how to help him view his lifes purpose in terms that dont necessarily include being a parent. Have other people here experienced this dilemma? What helped you make peace with the decision to not have children?

Cynthia


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## LoveBHMS (Apr 5, 2008)

> What helped you make peace with the decision to not have children?



I don't enjoy being around them so there was no decision.

I think to some degree it's easier for women to know if they want kids because they see parenthood in far more concrete terms, such as "I don't like screeching brats around me" versus more ethereal terms like "I want to leave a lasting legacy to the world."

I don't know why, but it *always* makes me laugh when men say they want to carry on the family name. I mean, chances are there are tons of other people in the world with your name, it's not dying out anytime soon. And if it did, who cares? It's a last name not your good silver.

But seriously, is fatherhood something he honestly cares about? Does he even like kids or ever want to be around them? Does he make an effort to spend time around the children already in your lives such as friends' kids or nieces/nephews? I don't mean to insult your husband, but "wanting life to come full circle" is kind of vague.


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## BBW Betty (Apr 5, 2008)

I'm 39, have PCOS with a particularly unpredictable cycle, and in fact have a history of hyperplasia. Every 3-4 months I do an EPT, just to confirm that I'm not pregnant (Docs have told me it's not likely I'm ovulating anyway,) and do a round of a hormone so I menstruate and avoid further endometrial build-up. 

About 3 years ago, Frank and I decided to try to have kids. We talked with several doctors, none of whom were willing to diagnose fertility drugs for me--unless I would lose about 150 pounds. I'd still be around 40 BMI if I did lose that much, but I've had no luck with that one. I'm not diabletic or even borderline (Thank God), but that also meant that Metformin was not an option either.

It's been more difficult for me than for Frank to accept that we will likely never be parents. I love kids; he's getting a little more comfortable around our nieces and nephews. However, we have learned to appreciate the freedom we have that our siblings do not have. We can pack fairly light when we travel. If we decide to do something, we can usually just do it. Not needing to find a babysitter when we want to go out is nice. We can spend some time spoiling the nieces and nephews, then send them home. And we don't have to spend our money on diapers and other baby things.

I'll admit to being wistful every so often, but I also realize that I have more time to share my talents with others in meaningful ways, and that can be my "legacy." I am in our church choir and a cantor for Mass on a regular basis. I am in a homemakers club that helps with projects for local causes and charities. 

Sometimes it just takes time to appreciate the pluses that balance the minuses of a situation like this. Wishing you both happiness in however your life unfolds. You just might find an even better adventure than parenting--at least for you.


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## Keb (Apr 5, 2008)

Just to throw it out there--consider adoption or foster parenting, if there is a strong desire to be a father. There's plenty of kids who need one. It's not the same as passing on your genes, true enough, but the rest of the experience could be had under the right conditions.


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## Butterbelly (Apr 5, 2008)

Back in 2006, I underwent surgery for cervical and uterine cancer. After the surgery, I was left with one ovary and half of my cervix. My oncologist told me that if I was really into the idea of having children, that I needed to have my eggs harvested and frozen. I thought about this for a long time, and determined that having children isn't a necessity in my life. Having said that, my soon-to-be hubby would love to have at least one more child (he has a daughter from a previous marriage), and I feel bad that I may not be able to give him at least one more. But at the same time, he understands.

The older I get, the more I want a child and the harder it is for me to accept that this may not be a possiblity, and I do regret not having my eggs harvested. Adoption is an option for us, but I'm going to take one day at a time right now.


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## Ned Sonntag (Apr 6, 2008)

Just think of the material world as a Soul-Trap wherein God's thoughts have taken on a weight and solidity never originally intended. Our very individuality and free will is the strange result of God's experiments in universe-creation... I mean, there are passages in Genesis which have God talking to other beings like himself about how weirdly this universe is developing. He's left his Igor-like assistant The Demiurge in charge and gone on to make MUCH spiffier universes than this one. We may get to see them some day if we manage to break the chain/cycle of incarnation. Didn't mean to bum you guys out but really fatherhoodlessness on a cosmic level is actually not that bad an idea...:batting:


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## FaxMachine1234 (Apr 6, 2008)

LoveBHMS said:


> I don't know why, but it *always* makes me laugh when men say they want to carry on the family name. I mean, chances are there are tons of other people in the world with your name, it's not dying out anytime soon. And if it did, who cares? It's a last name not your good silver.
> 
> But seriously, is fatherhood something he honestly cares about? Does he even like kids or ever want to be around them? Does he make an effort to spend time around the children already in your lives such as friends' kids or nieces/nephews? I don't mean to insult your husband, but "wanting life to come full circle" is kind of vague.



Wow, this is kinda dismissive. What's wrong with someone wanting children so they know their family will continue on down the line? It's not being selfish; it's part of human nature.

And yeah, I second the adoption suggestion. Is there a reason you're not considering this?


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## CynPart2 (Apr 6, 2008)

Thanks, everyone. BBW Betty and Butterbelly, you brought up a good point about the nature of life -- that there may always be circumstances that bring sadness, regret, or wistfulness, even in the midst of a wonderful life. It's just a part of being human. And Keb and Ekim, adoption is something that we (or at least, I) have considered, but I honestly don't think that we'd make it through the typical approval process. Foster parenting, however, is something that we should learn more about, I agree. LoveBHMs, yes, he does enjoy being around kids, and I'm going to suggest tutoring or mentorship as a good volunteer idea. And, Ned, we'll have to ponder your interesting ideas on the cycle of incarnation. Thank you, all. 

Cynthia


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## EtobicokeFA (Apr 6, 2008)

Well there is a difference between not being able to have children, and not having children. 

The decision to have children is up to you. However, if you still want some, there is always adoption or foster parenting, but depending on your situation there is also the surrogate option as well.


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## MsGreenLantern (Apr 6, 2008)

He should understand on all levels why kids are not in the cards here. If you're both too busy, and with health problems, what kind of life would the kid have anyway, even if you did "fold" persay. I'm sure you're both amazing people, but working with childcare daily I see way too many parents who are half-in when it comes to their kids due to super time consuming careers, having too many, health issues, or just plain out age. The kids aren't happy, and yearn for outside attention, often with behavioral problems. 

Just tell him that kids are not a family biography, they need tons of time, tons of attention, tons of care, and tons of energy. If that's not what you two have, then he should understand why it's a bad idea on every level.


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## TraciJo67 (Apr 6, 2008)

Infertile couples who want to have children know all about their adoption/surrogacy options. Trust me, they do. They don't need to have people suggesting it, as if this possibility were a CNN bannerhead newsflash. 

In my own situation, I first had to come to terms with the fact that I would never have my own child. My husband and I couldn't consider the possibility of adoption until we'd had a chance to grieve the loss of our own personal dreams. We had so many well-meaning friends and family members "sagely" telling us to just go adopt a baby. Like it's as easy as choosing a puppy at the mill. There are two separate issues at play for most infertile couples: the first is that biological imperative to create their own offspring. The second is an equally powerful need to nurture and care for a child. 

Many people are just not interested in adoption. I really hate the underlying premise that they must be selfish if they don't consider this option. 

To the OP: In my own way, I can empathize with what you and your husband are going through. From what you've shared, the desire to be a parent seems stronger in him. The only practical thing that I can suggest is that you talk about your respective feelings, openly and honestly. My husband and I made the mistake of retreating into our own private worlds, and we needlessly lost a lot of opportunities to be a source of comfort for each other. This is a difficult issue that can't be resolved with a few discussions here and there. It's going to crop up again and again, as your husband tries to work through his sadness about time slipping away, and losing that opportunity to become a father. He'll get through it. You both will. Be kind to each other


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## CynPart2 (Apr 7, 2008)

TraciJo67 said:


> ... This is a difficult issue that can't be resolved with a few discussions here and there. It's going to crop up again and again, as your husband tries to work through his sadness about time slipping away, and losing that opportunity to become a father. He'll get through it. You both will. Be kind to each other



TracyJo, thanks for clarifying the intent of my post. In my case, I honestly do not feel that my husband and I are in a good position right now to rear any child, whether biological or adopted. (If I felt that we were, I would definitely want to explore adoption.) What he is experiencing is the drive to create a human being who biologically symbolizes our union and that of our families. Every Sunday, I see his wistful expressions when a child smiles at us, and I can sense what's going through his head. Your post is immeasurably helpful on many levels. Thank you.


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## CynPart2 (Apr 7, 2008)

MsGreenLantern said:


> ... but working with childcare daily I see way too many parents who are half-in when it comes to their kids due to super time consuming careers, having too many, health issues, or just plain out age. The kids aren't happy, and yearn for outside attention, often with behavioral problems.



MsGreenLantern, my husband isn't opposing my decision to opt for sterilization. He's extremely supportive, but he's struggling with his feelings of loss. I will agree, though, that your dose of reality makes a lot of sense. (We have two fur kids who are the _dog_ equivalent of children who run through restaurants, throwing mashed potatoes at the walls. )


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## Observer (Apr 7, 2008)

Not knowing the economic, health and emotional particulars of another's situation makes it impossible for an outsider to give specific advice. It is obvious that the OP's spouse has an emotional desire that the OP does not find practical or attractive (perhaps both). Frankly, if both spouses must work or if longevity of either is a real question her reaction could be well based. Certainly the details of child rearing traditionally fall more upon the woman.

That said, rearing children is a unique experience that many men look forward to and enjoy. I did - and am now into grandkids. IMHO from observation the foster care/big brother/mentoring alternative is nowhere near the same thing. Relationships there are by definition transitory and focused on a limited scope - and with foster care especially subject to abrupt disruption by uncontrollable outside events. True parenting demands unconditional total long-term loving involvement that doesn't stop even after emancipation.

I can't, as stated, judge another's situation but I can say that I wanted to do for children what adults had done for me. I ran the course by taking on a ready made family with some problems and made it through - and have never been sorry for it. And because it was my desire and reality I can understand the desire of a man who yearns to do the same thing.

I would suggest to the OP and her spouse some deep soul-searching. What are the real emotional and practical issues at work here? Is there a way of accommodating both the concerns and fulfilling the dreams? I understand what this man is being asked to give up - and maybe he has to. But I'd like it to be a joint decision, not a forced one.


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## Zandoz (Apr 7, 2008)

For us it was the other way around...my wife wanting a baby...and convinced that I needed to father a child "to be whole". But with my health issues, many of them being inherited, I'd decided long before we met that "These genes stop here"...and our financial situation was/is not conducive to adding another mouth to feed anyway. Other than health and financially, I had/have no problem with kids...but from my point of view, one of the most important factors in being a parent is putting the kid's well being before your own desires. In my case, not saddling a kid with my health issues out weighed my desire for a child. And for the record, the needing to father a child to be whole...or to continue the name...never really meant anything to me.


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## CynPart2 (Apr 7, 2008)

Observer said:


> ... I would suggest to the OP and her spouse some deep soul-searching. What are the real emotional and practical issues at work here? Is there a way of accommodating both the concerns and fulfilling the dreams? I understand what this man is being asked to give up - and maybe he has to. But I'd like it to be a joint decision, not a forced one.



Observer, thank you for your astute commentary. We have both done a tremendous amount of soul searching, and this is really not what I would call a "forced" decision. I deeply respect my husband's feelings, and he completely understands the practical issues that are at play.



Zandoz said:


> ... In my case, not saddling a kid with my health issues out weighed my desire for a child. And for the record, the needing to father a child to be whole...or to continue the name...never really meant anything to me.



Zandoz, this is a big motivating factor for us, too. With my age, poor to marginal history of glucose control, and both of our family medical histories, we would be taking a very big risk in terms of a child's health. Older diabetic mothers stand an increased risk of giving birth to babies with cardiac problems, Down Syndrome, and other medical difficulties.

--------------------------------------------------------------------
As a final note in this thread ... thanks, everyone, for your comments. We've appreciated having the opportunity to learn from your experiences.

Cynthia


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## Tooz (Apr 7, 2008)

LoveBHMS said:


> I don't know why, but it *always* makes me laugh when men say they want to carry on the family name. I mean, chances are there are tons of other people in the world with your name, it's not dying out anytime soon. And if it did, who cares? It's a last name not your good silver.



DAMN, girl. Make that number five.


When we agree, I kind of think I love you. :batting:


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## mossystate (Apr 7, 2008)

Yeah, I also chuckle and do a few other things when men say that..about The Name. Gee, what about women who want their name Carried On. Funny how that juuust does not matter. I say whoever drops it from their body..gets to name it..hehe. 2008 and one of my brother-in-laws gets guff about his son having his wife's ( my sister ) last name...the horror!!


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## rita.jones56 (Apr 9, 2008)

LoveBHMS said:


> I don't enjoy being around them so there was no decision.
> 
> I think to some degree it's easier for women to know if they want kids because they see parenthood in far more concrete terms, such as "I don't like screeching brats around me" versus more ethereal terms like "I want to leave a lasting legacy to the world."
> 
> ...



My boyfriend is the same way. He says he wants kids but he never has shown me that he enjoys being around them or can ever tolerate them. I am willing to bet he has similar reasons for wanting kids. I will find out soon.


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## LoveBHMS (Apr 10, 2008)

mossystate said:


> Yeah, I also chuckle and do a few other things when men say that..about The Name. Gee, what about women who want their name Carried On. Funny how that juuust does not matter. I say whoever drops it from their body..gets to name it..hehe. 2008 and one of my brother-in-laws gets guff about his son having his wife's ( my sister ) last name...the horror!!



It's actually done in Japan, of all places. It's not typical, but oftentimes both husband and wife use her last name if she comes from a higher class.

I used to frequent a CFC (childfree by choice) message board which often addressed what comebacks to use when you were harassed about your choice or asked really stupid questions such as "Don't you want a son to carry on your family name?" One great suggestion was to ask, when somebody asked if not having kids was "selfish", "Can you name five reasons you have kids that don't start with the words 'I want....'"


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## ESPN Cutie (Apr 10, 2008)

Ekim said:


> Wow, this is kinda dismissive. What's wrong with someone wanting children so they know their family will continue on down the line? It's not being selfish; it's part of human nature.


*ICAM.*



mossystate said:


> Yeah, I also chuckle and do a few other things when men say that..about The Name. Gee, what about women who want their name Carried On. Funny how that juuust does not matter.


*I KNOW I can be old fashioned, but I would never expect my husband to be ok with our child having my last name - just like I would not be ok with it. People who do not know my family situation may assume that I am not married and a single mother, which would not be the case. 

I don't understand why women feel that their child should have their MAIDEN NAME instead of their married LAST NAME. I think legacy is important and it would be rude to ignore my husband's need to feel that he is leaving something important behind. JMO.*


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## mossystate (Apr 10, 2008)

ESPN Cutie said:


> *I KNOW I can be old fashioned, but I would never expect my husband to be ok with our child having my last name - just like I would not be ok with it. People who do not know my family situation may assume that I am not married and a single mother, which would not be the case.
> 
> I don't understand why women feel that their child should have their MAIDEN NAME instead of their married LAST NAME. I think legacy is important and it would be rude to ignore my husband's need to feel that he is leaving something important behind. JMO.*



Yeah, the great thing about any of this is that you can do what you want. My sister is not so insecure as to worry about what some busybody might think of ' her situation '. My brother in law was the one who put the idea on the table, years before they had my nephew.

Many people wonder the same...that they don't understand why so many men think that the kids should have HIS last name. My sister did not take my brother in law's last name. What each person decides is their business, but, many women are like " what the hell are you talking about..I have had this name since I was born..it matters as much to me as my hubby keeping his "

As for being ' rude ', I find it much more rude to _demand_ that women give up something, just because of a tradition. As the world has seen, and continues to see, not all traditions are all goodness and light. I guess a woman wanting to leave her legacy behind is a silly thing. I smile when I think about my nephew...he has my last name....that is so friggin cool!!!
Oh, and, Gavriel is cool with it as well. He won't have such a narrow view of things, I can tell that about him already.


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## ESPN Cutie (Apr 10, 2008)

mossystate said:


> As for being ' rude ', I find it much more rude to _demand_ that women give up something, just because of a tradition. As the world has seen, and continues to see, not all traditions are all goodness and light. I guess a woman wanting to leave her legacy behind is a silly thing.



*Women leave their legacy by giving birth to their children. I guess I just don't see it as a "demand" as much as an expectation due to long-held traditions. But as you have said, to each his own.*


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## LoveBHMS (Apr 10, 2008)

mossystate said:


> Yeah, the great thing about any of this is that you can do what you want. My sister is not so insecure as to worry about what some busybody might think of ' her situation '. My brother in law was the one who put the idea on the table, years before they had my nephew.
> 
> Many people wonder the same...that they don't understand why so many men think that the kids should have HIS last name. My sister did not take my brother in law's last name. What each person decides is their business, but, many women are like " what the hell are you talking about..I have had this name since I was born..it matters as much to me as my hubby keeping his "
> 
> ...



You know...raising a child to be all open minded and free thinking is only going to cause problems in the long run.


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## mossystate (Apr 10, 2008)

LoveBHMS said:


> You know...raising a child to be all open minded and free thinking is only going to cause problems in the long run.



Let's just hope the years go by and the appropriate people will come along and stop him..* crosses fingers *


kidding, my little Mr. G


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