# Size and Coupling...



## eightyseven (Jul 22, 2007)

This week was my town's annual art fair... it draws a large regional crowd and the streets are absolutely packed all day. Walking around, I was both happy to see plenty of stunning BBW out and about, many of whom were paired with some lucky gentlemen. Now, what struck me as interesting was the percentage of those guys that happen to be bigger themselves. Has anyone else noticed that people of size tend to gravitate toward each other - romantically speaking? Clearly this is not the rule (as I know there are plenty of FAs who fall elsewhere on the size spectrum and there are a great deal of BBW who are not fat admirers), but it is something that I've found intriguing. Anyone have thoughts on this phenomenon? Does anyone disagree with my observation? I'm curious to hear feedback... would you believe me if I told you I studied sociology?


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## Lady at Large (Jul 22, 2007)

Sometimes (as with my sister and her hubbie) they got married, got comfortable with each other, and eventually gained weight with each other. Now, two previously thin people, ten years later are both living large.


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## gameguy (Jul 22, 2007)

Lady at Large said:


> Sometimes (as with my sister and her hubbie) they got married, got comfortable with each other, and eventually gained weight with each other. Now, two previously thin people, ten years later are both living large.


I would agree. Once you live together as a couple, you share a lifestyle that could in some cases lead to weight-gain. It always gives me a warm fuzzy to see two people that have been together so long that they have grown similar, even if it's just that they dress in a similar fashion.


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## Lady at Large (Jul 22, 2007)

Yes my cats and I are getting to look more and more like each other...OH :blush: you said PEOPLE...sorry.  

It is nice to see that comfort though isn't it...it's heartening when a relationship works.


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## butch (Jul 22, 2007)

Can't back this up with science ( ) but I've noticed more pairings like this, and since it is in all age groups, I don't think it is just people growing fat together. When I see lots of people younger than me (mid 30's) in this pairing, I wonder how much of it is due to the possibility that there are more fat people in the generations behind me? Or something else?

Good question, eightyseven, I'll be interested to see all the responses.


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## gameguy (Jul 22, 2007)

Lady at Large said:


> Yes my cats and I are getting to look more and more like each other...OH :blush: you said PEOPLE...sorry.



:doh: Oh, I meant to include pets in that as well. Sometimes they even wear the same kind of sweaters...


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## pudgy (Jul 22, 2007)

Well, we have to remember that not everyone thinks that fat is beautiful. To think that every fat couple has at least one FA or BHM would be crazy (though fun!). I wonder if these people - since they both are "overweight" - simply settled for less (in their mind). Or they both couldn't manage to find a skinny person who would date them, so they went for someone who would, who ALSO couldn't find a skinny person that would date them.

Now, when I see one large girl with one skinny guy or vice versa, then you have to wonder...


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## Santaclear (Jul 22, 2007)

pudgy said:


> Well, we have to remember that not everyone thinks that fat is beautiful. To think that every fat couple has at least one FA or BHM would be crazy (though fun!). I wonder if these people - since they both are "overweight" - simply settled for less (in their mind). Or they both couldn't manage to find a skinny person who would date them, so they went for someone who would, who ALSO couldn't find a skinny person that would date them.
> Now, when I see one large girl with one skinny guy or vice versa, then you have to wonder...



You can think anything you like. I see no reason to assume the negative tho. I would never assume anyone's "settling for less" because it clearly ISN'T less!


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## William (Jul 22, 2007)

Hi 

I like women a little heavier and shorter than me. It is not like I am just getting what I can get as a Fat Guy.

William



Santaclear said:


> You can think anything you like. I see no reason to assume the negative tho. I would never assume anyone's "settling for less" because it clearly ISN'T less!


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## Kareda (Jul 23, 2007)

pudgy said:


> Now, when I see one large girl with one skinny guy or vice versa, then you have to wonder...



Im the larger one in my relationship. I am 240 and 5 feet tall where as my hubby currently just bought a size 29 pant... I have always been big- 206 when we met 9 years ago and he has always been skinny/average. He loves the cushion and softness of my body, always has. Actually all of my boyfriends have been of average weight, even on the slightly skinny size. I never set out for that, but that is who found me. What makes you wonder in this circumstance?


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## fatgirlflyin (Jul 23, 2007)

pudgy said:


> Well, we have to remember that not everyone thinks that fat is beautiful. To think that every fat couple has at least one FA or BHM would be crazy (though fun!). I wonder if these people - since they both are "overweight" - simply settled for less (in their mind). Or they both couldn't manage to find a skinny person who would date them, so they went for someone who would, who ALSO couldn't find a skinny person that would date them.
> 
> Now, when I see one large girl with one skinny guy or vice versa, then you have to wonder...




Why on earth would you wonder anything if you saw a large girl with a skinny guy? I know plenty of fat chicks that can land a skinny guy, my ex husband happened to be a navy seal, you can't get much more macho/workout/physically fit than that. 

My fiance happens to be a bigger guy. Do I feel like I'm settling for less? Nope! He's awesome, I love him, and I'd love him if he were thin. 

For you to suggest that fat people settle for less when they partner with another fat person, or to suggest that there's something to wonder about when a fat person partners with a thin person is pretty ignorant.


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## eightyseven (Jul 23, 2007)

Ella Bella said:


> For you to suggest that fat people settle for less when they partner with another fat person, or to suggest that there's something to wonder about when a fat person partners with a thin person is pretty ignorant.



I wholeheartedly agree... the idea of two fat people being together because they're "settling" seems like what our thin and "health" obsessed society would like everyone to believe. It assumes that fat people are inferior and have less social value. This is, of course, complete bullsh*t.


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## saucywench (Jul 23, 2007)

eightyseven said:


> This week was my town's annual art fair... it draws a large regional crowd and the streets are absolutely packed all day. Walking around, I was both happy to see plenty of stunning BBW out and about, many of whom were paired with some lucky gentlemen. Now, what struck me as interesting was the percentage of those guys that happen to be bigger themselves. Has anyone else noticed that people of size tend to gravitate toward each other - romantically speaking? Clearly this is not the rule (as I know there are plenty of FAs who fall elsewhere on the size spectrum and there are a great deal of BBW who are not fat admirers), but it is something that I've found intriguing. Anyone have thoughts on this phenomenon? Does anyone disagree with my observation? I'm curious to hear feedback... would you believe me if I told you I studied sociology?


The only thing that comes to my mind at this hour, 87, is that maybe some of us fat folk are simply drawn to each other when there is visual evidence that conforming to a societal body ideal is not high on our list of priorities. To me, that would indicate, roughly, a more laid-back, type-B approach, not only to life in general, but inviting people into our world. I'm not a fat admirer _per se_, but if I encounter another fat person (stranger) while navigating through life, I would more likely assume that they would be more accepting and open to me than an average-sized stranger--maybe simply from the shared experience of being fat. And for some, that might make for an attractive dating shortcut through having that assumption, in the sense of having one less thing to feel angsty about. With that not being a factor, they could then get on with the things that really matter.

Then again, it's late, and I might be making no sense at all.


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## Leonard (Jul 23, 2007)

I think pudgy's catchin' a little more flak here than he deserves here. Many a time I have found myself a-people watchin', looked upon a couple and thought, "I wonder what their relationship is like?" That's basically all pudgy's saying here. I've certainly dated people in the past that weren't my physical ideal. The sort of scenarios pudgy is dreaming up in his fat-lovin' mind happen all the time. 



pudgy said:


> Well, we have to remember that not everyone thinks that fat is beautiful. To think that every fat couple has at least one FA or BHM would be crazy (though fun!). I wonder if these people - since they both are "overweight" - simply settled for less (in their mind). Or they both couldn't manage to find a skinny person who would date them, so they went for someone who would, who ALSO couldn't find a skinny person that would date them.
> 
> Now, when I see one large girl with one skinny guy or vice versa, then you have to wonder...


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## Jes (Jul 23, 2007)

yeah, i agree. I don't know if what Pudge is talking about happens in huge numbers, but the point that not everyone thinks fat is a good deal is a valid point. It's a shame, but it's certainly true. And if you think being fat is bad, then you're going to make interpersonal relationship issues based on that. I won't go further than that, because I don't know all the ins and outs of what would happen, but I certainly think it can be a factor. Just like a fat person not liking being fat, and wanting never to be involved with a fat person. It happens.


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## fatgirlflyin (Jul 23, 2007)

Leonard LePage said:


> I think pudgy's catchin' a little more flak here than he deserves here. Many a time I have found myself a-people watchin', looked upon a couple and thought, "I wonder what their relationship is like?" That's basically all pudgy's saying here. I've certainly dated people in the past that weren't my physical ideal. The sort of scenarios pudgy is dreaming up in his fat-lovin' mind happen all the time.



That's not what he said. He implied that 2 fat people together must be settling for less and that there was something to wonder about with a fat person with a thin one.


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## Leonard (Jul 23, 2007)

Ella Bella said:


> That's not what he said. He implied that 2 fat people together must be settling for less and that there was something to wonder about with a fat person with a thin one.



I disagree. I can see how you might have misunderstood his post, but when I read it I got the distinct impression that, when he sees a fat couple, he sometimes wonders if the couple is comprised of a FA&BBW/FFA&BHM, or if its comprised of two people who are not dating their physical ideal and have instead "settled". He didn't say anything akin to, "2 fat people together *must* be settling". 

Furthermore, when I see a fat person and thin one I often do wonder if the thin counterpart is an FA or FFA. "Is he/she one of us?", I wonder aloud. Usually too loudly, in fact, because the couple in question usually asks mall security to remove me from the food court. But what they don't understand is that I have just as much a right to eat at Orange Julius as they do. You see? You see?


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## fatgirlflyin (Jul 23, 2007)

Leonard LePage said:


> I disagree. I can see how you might have misunderstood his post, but when I read it I got the distinct impression that, when he sees a fat couple, he sometimes wonders if the couple is comprised of a FA&BBW/FFA&BHM, or if its comprised of two people who are not dating their physical ideal and have instead "settled". He didn't say anything akin to, "2 fat people together *must* be settling".
> 
> Furthermore, when I see a fat person and thin one I often do wonder if the thin counterpart is an FA or FFA. "Is he/she one of us?", I wonder aloud. Usually too loudly, in fact, because the couple in question usually asks mall security to remove me from the food court. But what they don't understand is that I have just as much a right to eat at Orange Julius as they do. You see? You see?




nope I dont see, but that's what's so great about this place. I dont have to, and can still respect that you see what you see.


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## Leonard (Jul 23, 2007)

Ella Bella said:


> nope I dont see, but that's what's so great about this place. I dont have to, and can still respect that you see what you see.



Oh, okay. Well I tried. I got a little silly towards the end there, but that was just my lame way of trying to lighten the mood. I don't think pudgy's saying what you think he's saying, but if he is then your displeasure is entirely warranted. 

To be honest, this entire conversation was actually my quirky way of asking if you wanted to go grab a smoothie at an Orange Julius with me, but now I guess I'll never know.


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## Jay West Coast (Jul 23, 2007)

Perhaps this thread has moved on, but I've thought about this too. There are enough "fat couples" around that I've asked myself the same question. My feeling is that in general people of similar experiences and tastes attract, and often fat people are no different. Exempli gratia, a guy with a bowl in his earlobe sees a girl with seventeen piercings. He may not bring it up right away, but he intuitively recognizes that they might be on the same page. 

So, a fat guy who knows how to enjoy food, isn't a gym-freak, and deals with the crap that goes along with being fat sees a girl who is fat. He just might subconsciously be adding up the evidence: on some level, she just might get me. 

I suppose that's one idea. Plus, I think a lot of bigger women feel a bit validated by having a big guy. I remember dating a BBW who said many times that she wouldn't feel so self-conscious about her weight if only I were heavy too. 

I ate myself into a stupor to no avail.


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## pudgy (Jul 23, 2007)

Wow, I'm sorry for the confusion. Let me clarify.

I whole-heartedly DISAGREE that marrying a fat person is indeed settling for less. It's the SHAME of our culture, however, that people do think this. But they do, and I'm certain it happens. People, sadly, "settle" for things all the time, or at least they think they do. How sad.

As for me wondering, I was indeed wondering, as Leonard put it, if they are "one of us."

Sorry for the confusion.


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## liz (di-va) (Jul 23, 2007)

1. This thread title is very naughty, thank you, 87.

2. I've pretty much completely uncoupled (hah) any assumptions about couples based on size...you just never know anything based on that. I mean...there's nothing really *to* know (about what it means that one's bigger/smaller/not), even if you could assume everyone were happy with their size out here in the world. ( I mean this differently from the sense in which you're askin, 87, just thinkin about how people usually talk.)

What is really amazing is, yes, how people seem to think couples should "match" in their own unevolved POV, by both being either big or small, since clearly size tells you so much about somebody (not). Personally I just love (hopeless sap here) seeing people who like/love/lust for each other, whoever they are. Makes me happy. And I feel the same about men I'm with...if I like em, that's good enough for me, whether they are twiggy and lean or thick footballers.

Sorry...feeling a lil idealistic or something at the mo. But seriously.

I like to think maybe there are BBWs with bigger dudes in part because they've learned to be open to their preferences, whatever they may be, but that's probably kinda idealistic. I dunno!

Did I say this right? It's late.


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## CeCe the Porky Princess! (Jul 23, 2007)

ALL my past fellas have been slim/muscular. I met my partner and THE lurve of my life thru' his ex partner and didn't physically see him for over 6 months..by that point I was more than on my way to smittenhood!

Pip is a big fella 6ft plus and alot of lbs (we do stones here in the UK!) .. what attracted me to him was HIM not his fat, not because I thought 'he's fat he will have me!' (as bloody if!), not because he is fat he will put up with my weight...but purely and simply because I LIKED the arse of him and when we met the attraction was immediate:wubu: !

FAT does not necessarily attract FAT infact I would say as a rule bigger fellas do nothing for me - Phil goes to show that rules are to be brooken and I am VERY thankful they are too!

CeCe xx


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## eightyseven (Jul 23, 2007)

Jay West Coast said:


> Perhaps this thread has moved on, but I've thought about this too. There are enough "fat couples" around that I've asked myself the same question. My feeling is that in general people of similar experiences and tastes attract, and often fat people are no different. Exempli gratia, a guy with a bowl in his earlobe sees a girl with seventeen piercings. He may not bring it up right away, but he intuitively recognizes that they might be on the same page.
> 
> So, a fat guy who knows how to enjoy food, isn't a gym-freak, and deals with the crap that goes along with being fat sees a girl who is fat. He just might subconsciously be adding up the evidence: on some level, she just might get me.
> 
> ...



This makes a great deal of sense to me, actually. I wish I didn't believe the second theory, but the truth is that I know too many lovely gals whose lack of confidence would drive them to be that self-conscious... even if they won't explicitly admit it.



liz (di-va) said:


> 1. This thread title is very naughty, thank you, 87.



Naughty? I don't see it at all... maybe I'm just slow. Please explain!


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## supersoup (Jul 23, 2007)

eightyseven said:


> This makes a great deal of sense to me, actually. I wish I didn't believe the second theory, but the truth is that I know too many lovely gals whose lack of confidence would drive them to be that self-conscious... even if they won't explicitly admit it.
> 
> 
> 
> Naughty? I don't see it at all... maybe I'm just slow. Please explain!



oh yeah, i thought this was gonna be a whole different thread, heh.

coupling...making the loooooove.

i can only speak for myself, but i've dated guys thin and bigger. i guess my eye IS drawn to bigger guys more often, but i'm an equal opportunity lech. i ogle the skinny ones as well.  

now, the guy i was with the longest, he was a big boy. 6'2" i think, and at his skinniest was 190, and his biggest around 300 lbs. my memory is foggy on his stats, but he had a lovely belly that i often fell asleep on while listening to it growl.


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## liz (di-va) (Jul 23, 2007)

eightyseven said:


> Naughty? I don't see it at all... maybe I'm just slow. Please explain!





supersoup said:


> oh yeah, i thought this was gonna be a whole different thread, heh.
> coupling...making the loooooove.



Yes! see first definition


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## RedVelvet (Jul 23, 2007)

supersoup said:


> oh yeah, i thought this was gonna be a whole different thread, heh.
> 
> coupling...making the loooooove.
> 
> ...




You are so damn cute its alarming. You know that?


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## supersoup (Jul 23, 2007)

RedVelvet said:


> You are so damn cute its alarming. You know that?


!!!!!!

 

<3


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## Aliena (Jul 23, 2007)

My husband and I were both over 400lbs. when we met. He had seen a picture of me, I had never laid eyes on him. The night we met was magical and we've haven't been apart since. 

Neither one of us feel as though we compromised or settled. In fact, weight was not an issue for us, only more important we connected and had like interests. 

He has been the best thing to ever happen in my life. I'm venture to say he'd say the same about me. 

Interestingly enough, we've lost weight together not gained. We're still WubbyTubbys but we like it that way. At night, when laying in his arms, I love squeezing his round belly in my hands. It's so very soft and VERY comforting to me. 

As for the sex, we never had a problem having it at any size. We could bump uglies with the best of them and we've always enjoyed it very much! :batting:

Size to me is like age; it's a state of mind. Wherever the mind is, the heart will follow.


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## loren_a_e (Jul 24, 2007)

I'm sure there are lots of couples who settle for a less than physical ideal. Sheer numbers would suggest that either fat people are settling for each other or thin people are settling for fat people. I can see fat being drawn towards fat because there's a shared history of rejection and insecurity and and in the same vein, I can see fat being drawn towards fat because there's a shared love of food. 

At this point, there are far too many of us (In the UK and America, at least) for every fat person to find the FA of their dreams. Some of us simply have to settle. I suppose it could be argued that with increasing exposure to fat, people are learning to appreciate it, but regardless of what's happening on the street, the media is still pushing thin, alarmingly thin in some cases. I just don't think there are enough FAs to go around.

Personally, I'm not attracted to fat men initially. I've never yet encountered a large man who's turned my head in the street. What does attract me is someone passionate about the slow food movement and New Zealand wines. As such men tend to be a little larger than most, I'm often found to be eyeing off the porker in the room. :bow:


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## butch (Jul 24, 2007)

loren_a_e said:


> I'm sure there are lots of couples who settle for a less than physical ideal. Sheer numbers would suggest that either fat people are settling for each other or thin people are settling for fat people. I can see fat being drawn towards fat because there's a shared history of rejection and insecurity and and in the same vein, I can see fat being drawn towards fat because there's a shared love of food.
> 
> At this point, there are far too many of us (In the UK and America, at least) for every fat person to find the FA of their dreams. Some of us simply have to settle. I suppose it could be argued that with increasing exposure to fat, people are learning to appreciate it, but regardless of what's happening on the street, the media is still pushing thin, alarmingly thin in some cases. I just don't think there are enough FAs to go around.
> 
> Personally, I'm not attracted to fat men initially. I've never yet encountered a large man who's turned my head in the street. What does attract me is someone passionate about the slow food movement and New Zealand wines. As such men tend to be a little larger than most, I'm often found to be eyeing off the porker in the room. :bow:



Look, just because the media doesn't say it, doesn't mean that it can't be true that fat can be aesthetically pleasing and sexy to people. If this wasn't the case, then their would be NO FAs for fat women to attract. Your statement suggests that even FAs shouldn't exist, and if so, they're settling? And that no fat person could find another fat person attractive independent of their own experiences as a fat person? Come on, that's not true and demeans all fat people and FAs.

I'm fat, and would never date someone who felt they were settling (and have brushed off the folks who behave that way) and I find other fat people sexy because their bodies are sexy-round and soft and warm and beautiful. Don't insult me and most of the other people on this board by suggesting that anybody dating a fat person is settling. I'm worth more than that, and so are my friends here on the board. And if you would at least try to have an objective, open mind, you'd see the numerous points of beauty that a fat body possess.


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## CTAnonymousCT (Jul 24, 2007)

eightyseven said:


> This week was my town's annual art fair... it draws a large regional crowd and the streets are absolutely packed all day. Walking around, I was both happy to see plenty of stunning BBW out and about, many of whom were paired with some lucky gentlemen. Now, what struck me as interesting was the percentage of those guys that happen to be bigger themselves. Has anyone else noticed that people of size tend to gravitate toward each other - romantically speaking? Clearly this is not the rule (as I know there are plenty of FAs who fall elsewhere on the size spectrum and there are a great deal of BBW who are not fat admirers), but it is something that I've found intriguing. Anyone have thoughts on this phenomenon? Does anyone disagree with my observation? I'm curious to hear feedback... would you believe me if I told you I studied sociology?



I have to say that from hanging around the bbw bashes and such (at least in new england) That I havent found that many large couples. I think that alot of the couples I see out and about( Not in the bbw/bhm culture) got large together, just MO. Many of the bbw's I know arent really attracted to larger men. There are exceptions of course, however, I find them not to be the norm ......

Keep it Real!


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## loren_a_e (Jul 24, 2007)

butch said:


> Look, just because the media doesn't say it, doesn't mean that it can't be true that fat can be aesthetically pleasing and sexy to people. If this wasn't the case, then their would be NO FAs for fat women to attract. Your statement suggests that even FAs shouldn't exist, and if so, they're settling? And that no fat person could find another fat person attractive independent of their own experiences as a fat person? Come on, that's not true and demeans all fat people and FAs.
> 
> I'm fat, and would never date someone who felt they were settling (and have brushed off the folks who behave that way) and I find other fat people sexy because their bodies are sexy-round and soft and warm and beautiful. Don't insult me and most of the other people on this board by suggesting that anybody dating a fat person is settling. I'm worth more than that, and so are my friends here on the board. And if you would at least try to have an objective, open mind, you'd see the numerous points of beauty that a fat body possess.



I'm unsure how you read all that into my post, but let me clarify: -

I believe a small number of people are born FAs. I'm happy for these people.
I believe that as we grow and our experiences widen, we learn to appreciate that which was not palatable before. There are men and women out there who I'm sure are now drawn to fat because they've found over time that they appreciate being with fat people.

I just don't want to delude myself into thinking that the world is a beautiful, fluffy place where fat is desired and accepted by all. In some countries there is a larger collective waistline than ever, and it would be silly to assume that with this burgeoning waistline comes increased desire for fat. Some people are settling, and I'm glad that you feel so good about yourself that you would never settle for a person who wasn't 100% into your body shape. Other people, because they fear being alone, because they want children, for any number of reasons will settle. It happens for thin people, it happens for fat people but I daresay because of the negative way fat is perceived, it happens more often for fat people. 

Finally, being fat myself I think I'm very appreciative of the chub. Why just this morning I caught a glimpse of myself in the mirror on the way into the bathroom and thought "Dearie, that's a fine bottom you have there".


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## sunnie1653 (Jul 24, 2007)

Jay West Coast said:


> I suppose that's one idea. Plus, I think a lot of bigger women feel a bit validated by having a big guy. I remember dating a BBW who said many times that she wouldn't feel so self-conscious about her weight if only I were heavy too.
> 
> I ate myself into a stupor to no avail.




I don't necessarily think bbw's feel "validated" by having a bigger guy.. but speaking from experience (my hubby's about 6'1" and 330ish), I guess its nice to have someone there that appreciates what you go through during your daily life as a larger person, and when people make snarky remarks or are just jerk-head-ish, and irritate me, he knows just what to say to cheer me up, because hey.. he's been there.

That and I can steal his Cubbies t-shirts.


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## butch (Jul 24, 2007)

loren_a_e said:


> I'm unsure how you read all that into my post, but let me clarify: -
> 
> I believe a small number of people are born FAs. I'm happy for these people.
> I believe that as we grow and our experiences widen, we learn to appreciate that which was not palatable before. There are men and women out there who I'm sure are now drawn to fat because they've found over time that they appreciate being with fat people.
> ...



I read all that because you said all that. let me show you:

You wrote: "Sheer numbers would suggest that either fat people are settling for each other or thin people are settling for fat people. I can see fat being drawn towards fat because there's a shared history of rejection and insecurity and and in the same vein, I can see fat being drawn towards fat because there's a shared love of food." 

Nowhere in that did you offer even the possibility that fat people had dates for any other reason than that someone settled for them. When you included thin people in your statement, you sort of cancel out FAs, or are they not thin? Therefore, you say that all fat people with mates are less than ideal for the thin mate, and if it is an all fat couple, they could only be together because of a shared understanding of stigma or because they love food. Nice stereotype with that food bit, too.

Then you write, "At this point, there are far too many of us (In the UK and America, at least) for every fat person to find the FA of their dreams. Some of us simply have to settle. I suppose it could be argued that with increasing exposure to fat, people are learning to appreciate it, but regardless of what's happening on the street, the media is still pushing thin, alarmingly thin in some cases. I just don't think there are enough FAs to go around"

This suggests that everyone only wants to be with a thin person, that that is the only way someone doesn't settle, and that thin is the only approved aesthetic out there. Then you mention the media, as if the media is the only way humans can learn how to find other bodies desirable. Then you suggest that the media is more important than individual preferences when you say "regardless of what's happening on the street, the media is still pushing thin," and one knows all change comes from the street. "Black is beautiful" and "gay is good" are slogans from the street, not the BBC, ABC, CBS, or NBC.

I never said we should have a 'fluffy' world where everyone finds fat sexy and beautiful. I don't care what anyone else finds attractive, but I don't think FAs are all inborn, nor do I think they're a small number, nor do I discount the many people whose desires are informed by intangibles like personality or intelligence, and come to the conclusion that this rest of us fatties who don't have a dyed in the wool thin FA have settled. If I were to think this, then how the hell could I expect anyone, fat or thin, FA or not, to ever want to date me? 

And finally, how do you say "and it would be silly to assume that with this burgeoning waistline comes increased desire for fat" when throughout history and across cultures many different sizes have been considered desirable? Its not as if Size 0 has been the aesthetic ideal forever and ever in every spot on the globe, and my assumptions about the beauty of fat has nothing to do with the statistics about how many fat people there are. Aesthetics have nothing to do with statistics.

Fine, settle, and think the rest of us do. I don't see how anyone, thin or fat, can be happy if they feel 'less than' and that is what settling is. And if you have such a shallow view about humanity, that all humans care about in terms of one's self worth is the size of their ass, then I don't think anything I can say will change your opinion about the wonderfulness of all bodies, fat or thin, to someone. There goes my fluffiness again, actually believing, like Anne Frank, that all people are inherently good. When will I learn?


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## Jes (Jul 24, 2007)

loving it!


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## loren_a_e (Jul 24, 2007)

butch said:


> I read all that because you said all that. let me show you:
> 
> You wrote: "Sheer numbers would suggest that either fat people are settling for each other or thin people are settling for fat people. I can see fat being drawn towards fat because there's a shared history of rejection and insecurity and and in the same vein, I can see fat being drawn towards fat because there's a shared love of food."



You broke my brain. I was under the impression that given the board this is being posted on I needn't have prefaced my message with "Aside from those people who are drawn to fat because they genuinely enjoy and appreciate a fat partner, here are some other reasons why fat people might end up with the partners they do". The OP was also kind of a giveaway. 

I promise you, I like fat. I've even got a tshirt that says that. Okay, I don't but I'll get a marker and write on an old polo "I Like Fat". Maybe I'll replace the like with a love heart just so everyone knows that it's not just a fleeting affair I've got going with fat.


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## butch (Jul 24, 2007)

loren_a_e said:


> You broke my brain. I was under the impression that given the board this is being posted on I needn't have prefaced my message with "Aside from those people who are drawn to fat because they genuinely enjoy and appreciate a fat partner, here are some other reasons why fat people might end up with the partners they do". The OP was also kind of a giveaway.
> 
> I promise you, I like fat. I've even got a tshirt that says that. Okay, I don't but I'll get a marker and write on an old polo "I Like Fat". Maybe I'll replace the like with a love heart just so everyone knows that it's not just a fleeting affair I've got going with fat.



Well, then stick around a bit, lots of people come on these boards and say things about fat (and other things) that paint a rather large brush stoke about why things are, and often times its stuff that discounts a lot of real people's experiences, like yours did. And anytime those broad strokes imply that all fat people are 'less than,' then I'm going to say something, regardless of the OP. 

I'm glad you like fat, and really, I don't make it a prerequisite for anyone in my life or on the net, but yes, some of us don't like our experiences boiled down to such a narrow set of choices that you offered. Especially on a site that is pro-'fat is sexy and desirable.'


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## Waxwing (Jul 24, 2007)

Butch, you are so fucking awesome. Just had to say that because I can't rep you right now.


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## Jane (Jul 24, 2007)

Waxwing said:


> Butch, you are so fucking awesome. Just had to say that because I can't rep you right now.



Ditto!!!!!!


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## Tina (Jul 24, 2007)

loren_a_e and pudgy, I'll allow that maybe you didn't mean the things you said in the way you said them, but as I told another newer poster not long ago, if you're going to internalize society's views of fat people, please don't regurgitate them here, seemingly verbatim. We know all of the stereotypes and don't need to see them displayed here, so if you do so, you'll be called out on such things. I know this sounds rude, but I don't mean it that way. What I'm getting at is to read here, and question society's fat biases, don't repeat them. [/Mod]

Just posting as me and not a mod (in this paragraph...), I have to give kudos to the eloquent Julia. Lovely.


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## cammy (Jul 24, 2007)

My observation is that most people are with someone of similar weight.


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## Green Eyed Fairy (Jul 24, 2007)

I don't really choose the size of the guy I'm with... as in they usually ask me out because I'm not one to pursue. They all have been thin to outright "skinny". Two ex-husbands and all my ex-boyfriends were thin. 
I used to make a joke about if there is a skinny/thin guy wearing a hat in the room, he's going to hit on me - my last bf didn't wear a hat often.... but he was wearing one when he asked me out the first time 

*I'm not opposed to heavier guys, they just don't usually seem to be the ones interested in me *shrugs*


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## William (Jul 24, 2007)

Hi Tina 

I have found that quotation marks are a marvelous tool for emphasizing the statements of others.

William



Tina said:


> loren_a_e and pudgy, I'll allow that maybe you didn't mean the things you said in the way you said them, but as I told another newer poster not long ago, if you're going to internalize society's views of fat people, please don't regurgitate them here, seemingly verbatim. We know all of the stereotypes and don't need to see them displayed here, so if you do so, you'll be called out on such things. I know this sounds rude, but I don't mean it that way. What I'm getting at is to read here, and question society's fat biases, don't repeat them. [/Mod]
> 
> Just posting as me and not a mod (in this paragraph...), I have to give kudos to the eloquent Julia. Lovely.


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## RedVelvet (Jul 24, 2007)

William said:


> Hi Tina
> 
> I have found that quotation marks are a marvelous tool for emphasizing the statements of others.
> 
> William



nevermind....


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## William (Jul 24, 2007)

Maybe

But there has been a lot of confusion in Fat Acceptance because people do not differentiate their statements from those that they are commenting on.

William

PS I do not mean Tina  




RedVelvet said:


> er.....was that supposed to be sarcasm?


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## RedHotAva (Jul 24, 2007)

I don't have many other BBW friends in person so I can't really vouch for anyone other than myself- but when I don't know ahead of time that a "thinner" guy is an FA, I am more wary of his motive. When a bigger guy is into me, I am much more comfortable right off the bat because I don't feel like I'm any different physically (read: worse). While the big guys aren't my #1 "type," I am just so much more at ease that it makes all the difference in the world!


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## supersoup (Jul 24, 2007)

Waxwing said:


> Butch, you are so fucking awesome. Just had to say that because I can't rep you right now.





Jane said:


> Ditto!!!!!!



me three!!

<3


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## loren_a_e (Jul 25, 2007)

Tina said:


> loren_a_e and pudgy, I'll allow that maybe you didn't mean the things you said in the way you said them, but as I told another newer poster not long ago, if you're going to internalize society's views of fat people, please don't regurgitate them here, seemingly verbatim. We know all of the stereotypes and don't need to see them displayed here, so if you do so, you'll be called out on such things. I know this sounds rude, but I don't mean it that way. What I'm getting at is to read here, and question society's fat biases, don't repeat them. [/Mod]
> 
> Just posting as me and not a mod (in this paragraph...), I have to give kudos to the eloquent Julia. Lovely.



I'm sorry my post was taken the wrong way, and accept that perhaps this may be the wrong forum for such a view. I haven't a problem with that as I'm not the one paying the server bills. I don't think I in any way internalise the views the mainstream media has of me and my size, and to infer such a thing from a post made about the realities many of us face daily is, IMO, unfair. Marginalised people whose views diverge from popularly held belief are far too often accused of internalising opression regardless of how they've come to hold those beliefs.


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## cammy (Jul 25, 2007)

I'm an FFA coupled with a BHM. The fact that he's a BHM isn't the reason I was attracted to him when we met (I wasn't sure I was really interested for the first month), nor plays into the reason I'm with him now (years later). If he was the same man in a slimmer physique, I'd still be with him cause he's amazing, but the fact that he's a BHM and thus my preference, just makes me even luckier.


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## Midori (Jul 25, 2007)

Hmmm ... I THINK that I have a few thoughts to add here but am hesitant because I don't really want to add to or descend into the maelstrom that seems to be spinning with this post ... 

Nevertheless ... knowing when to hush isn't always my strong suit so I'll share with some trepidation and the hopes that there is grace available if I am misunderstood. 

When I was at University there were several men who were interested in me ... they did NOT appeal to me at all physically nor intellectually really. One was very determined in his pursuit of me and although I was not attracted to him ... I accepted some of his offers to get together simply because I thought in all honesty, "what if this is the only person who will ever want me?". He proposed to me numerous times and at that time I thought, "maybe I will never get what I am really attracted to because I'm fat and I should be grateful for this guy's interest and intentions." That's just as real as it gets. At the time that is how I thought. I don't think it's far fetched to admit or speculate that others have indeed entered relationships because they didn't think they could have what they really wanted.

I do think though it's a gross assumption by which to speculate on how certain couples get together ... even if it is a fact that it DOES happen. I think it's equally erroneous to assume that EVERYONE wants a slender mate ... and that is the overriding assumption that most people in western culture have. THEREFORE other assumptions about the lacking of the slender partner or the luck of the larger partner or the badluck of both large people come into play. We don't assume ever that smaller people desire larger people BECAUSE of our cultural/media conditioning SO we must find a way to rationalize it to make it make sense. In doing so we negate MOST possibilities that there is genuine attraction and instead generally formulate negative reasonings for couplings that don't seem to meet societal standards. 

Unfortunately ... we (as a culture, not as individuals) assume that fat people would prefer skinny mates and we assume that all skinny people prefer skinny. On all counts assumption ridiculously limits the rights of each individual regardless of their own size to have their own preferences. We don't think fat women have a right to say they don't prefer fat mates and likewise we are offended if skinny people don't prefer fat. It's pretty vicious when you think of it ... even in the postulations given in this thread ... we look for tendencies and trends ... palatable explanations for WHY people are together based on things we can understand rather than simply assuming that people are together because they wish to be together. 

Maybe this is all another example of our society's obsession with analysis and -fixing- things. ~laughs~ I dunno ... I know it's a valid statement to say that some people settle but I believe that unless it's verbalized by a person involved, it's insulting to make assumptions based on outward appearance. Just because I know that sometimes a certain thing does occur it's still incredibly judgemental of me to assume that it occurs everytime my own prejudices see room for it ... if that makes sense.

&#9834;midori


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## RedVelvet (Jul 25, 2007)

Good lord. 

Midori is a smartypants.

Excellent analysis....I really cant agree more.


wow..I'm dazzled.


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## Moonchild (Jul 25, 2007)

The observations described in the first post have actually been scientifically studied and replicated many times, except with general "attractiveness" rather than just size. There are, in my opinion, many problems with any of the studies I've seen, the biggest being that there is no way (that I can think of anyway) to get around the fact that these studies rely on a generalized perception of attractiveness and applies it to everyone (see studies in question to see how they attempted to normalize standards)... However, studies in the past acknowledge these serious flaws, and in spite of them calculate a correlation coefficient within an acceptible margin of error to say that there is significant observational evidence supporting the statement that people are likely to be coupled with people who look like them.

I conducted one of these studies for my social psychology class. I completely half-assed it to be honest, but I actually did get a statistically significant correlation coefficient (r = 0.2980, n=50).

See (both are PDFs):

Alvarez, L., & Jaffe, K. (2004). Narcissism guides mate selection: Humans mate assortatively, as revealed by facial resemblance, following an algorithm of self seeking like.: http://www.epjournal.net/filestore/ep02177194.pdf *PDF*

Miller, G., Todd, P. (1998). Mate choice turns cognitive: http://www.cogsci.rpi.edu/CSJarchive/proceedings/2006/docs/p1323.pdf *PDF*


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