# Sex, Sexuality and BBW



## shrikearghast (Jan 14, 2007)

Okay... where to begin...

About three months ago I decided I had been single for long enough, and that it was time to start dating again. My last serious relationship ended approximately two years ago, and while I have been intimate with other ladies since then, it was nothing that ever got past the 'we get along decently and you're nice to look at' stage. I was also busy ordering my life - graduating from college, finding a job as a newspaper reporter, and enjoying my time alone. 

However, after two years it had gotten stale, and I was ready for something serious - no game playing, no flings... something with the potential to lead to marriage. One of my few required criteria was that the woman that I eventually fall in love with be a BBW, since I am a 100% open, care-free FA, have been so since I was 13. I simply do not find thin girls attractive.

I live in Maine, and there aren't a lot of BBWs that I run into on a day-to-day basis, so I decided to utilize a BBW-focused personals website. 

When local searches yielded unpromising results, I eventually widened my field and met a young lady from Texas who, while very, very conservative (I'm a moderate/libertarian), definitely matched up with me with regards to all the important things (wants kids, doesn't smoke, is well educated, doesn't seem to suffer from depression, is witty and strong willed, and is strikingly beautiful). She also happened to be a virgin (I'm 24, she's 20 - it's not so remarkable as it seems in her case), but more on that in a second. 

We hit it off smashingly, and have been spending hours on the phone talking every night for about two and a half months. It's gotten to the point where we need to meet, and I'll be flying down to see her on Wednesday. However, the events of this past week have thrown my feelings (and I believe her's as well) into disarray.

My girlfriend suffers from an abnormal menstral cycle. While she is not diagnosed with polycystic ovary syndrome, the symptoms are similar, generally resulting in prolonged bouts of having no periods, followed by devastating, horrible 'mega' periods every 4 or 5 months. She didn't want to go on birth control as a treatment because she is concerned that doing so will serve as an excuse to have premarital sex, and so her doctor recently put her on Metformin, a medicine normally used in diabetes treament, which has also been used to some success to treat menstral disorders. It also happens to be a mildly-potent apetite suppressant, which appears to be causing her to not only get physically ill with a good degree of frequency, but has reduced her consumption of food from 3 meals down to 1.

Now, here's the meat of the issue: I don't want her to get thin. I'm not interested in dating thin girls, and no matter how you flip the concept around, I can't get excited over them. Call me shallow or self-centered, but I believe that love and sexual preference are relatively mutually exclusive, which is to say that I believe I can love someone and not find them sexually attractive, and vice versa. 

The one thing I know with certainty is that if my girlfriend begins to drop massive amounts of weight, there will be problems. I just can't deal with it - I'm a young, extremely sexual guy, and while I do believe I love this girl, and do care for her far beyond her looks, I know - deep down inside - that her being thin would cause big issues down the road.

Being a virgin, her reaction when I cautiously attempted to explain this to her was that I was being incredibly shallow. "Sex is not, nor should it be, that important," I was told. Of course, I know that statistically the most common cause of infidelity amongst couples is disatisfaction in the sack. So, while I acknowledge and respect her current choice of the virgin lifestyle, I am not so foolish to believe that - should we eventually get married - that her being thin wouldn't cause me to be _quite_ unhappy with regards to sex.

Her reaction also troubled me deeply, because it didn't seem to matter to her what I thought on the subject. I was wrong, I was being shallow, and I needed to get over it. I know, of course, that there's no such simple answer, but she is naive enought to believe that just such a coy sollution is what the doctor ordered.

My problem here boils down to a simple question - what am I supposed to do? Actually, I lied, it's not quite that simple...

*A)* Am I a bad person for being open with my partner about my feelings with regards to her physical appearance? She is not massively overweight (or close an area I'd deem unhealthy), and so I don't believe that her current size places her in any immediate danger, and thus I do not think I am being _that_ selfish.

*B)* If I am _not_ ruled to be a jackass for feeling this way, how do I go about convincing her that I'm not some kind of sex-crazed maniac? This girl has lived a very, very sheltered upbringing, and to say that I believe that her beliefs with regards to sex and relationships are just flat-out wrong would be the understatement of the decade. She's inexperienced and indoctrinated with religious righteousness, a nasty lense through which to attempt to view reality. This girl has been - for all intents and purposes - told by God that sex is an evil, unimportant act shared only by loving husbands and wives. How am I supposed to compete with this divine methodology?

*C)* For you medical types out there, how likely is Metformin to succeed in making her thin? Am I worrying about nothing?

*D)* And finally, I believe I'd like to find some text talking about the importance of sex in healthy relationships. My girlfriend seems to think that sex, on the whole, is not nearly as important as other aspects of a functional relationship. She also seems to believe that sexual satisfaction is derived from love, rather than physical fulfillment. While I don't believe that the two are always exclusive, I know for a fact I can have a damned fine time with someone without loving them, and thus her point of view is incorrect. Anyone have any helpful links with doctor-like advice that I might pass on or share with her?

Thank you for any and all help.


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## shrikearghast (Jan 14, 2007)

Oh, and P.S., I am not trying to convince her to have sex with me. Rather, I am trying to convince her as to the importance that sex is likely to hold in a successful serious, (possibly married) relationship, which in turn makes my having a preference for a certain body type not shallow or unimportant in the slightest.


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## AnnMarie (Jan 14, 2007)

Wow, that is a handful of information and it's very late, but I'm going to try to answer you as succinctly as possible, for both of our sakes. 

I personally do not feel you are wrong or sex crazed or anything. I think for a young man you're terribly aware of your feelings, wants, desires, and goals in life and relationships. 

I think that although this girl seems to be your match on many levels, there are some fundamental differences here that you may have set to the side for the highlight of other more positive things. 

Frankly, as a sexual person myself, and feeling as you do that sex is a necessary and important component of a "relationship" (not a friendship and there is a difference) I could not get involved with someone who feels so strongly about sex as a God-like/Love derived action. It can be an illuminating experience, it can be almost transcendent but it can also be down and dirty and fun and messy and indulgent. You should be comfortable getting close to the point where you see the devil in the room and he's applauding the performance, you know?

But this is me. And I know not everyone sees sex this way. Exactly my point. I could not, in good conscience, head into a relationship with a man who didn't value a healthy, open, communicative, fun, pleasurable sex life - but rather saw it as a background issue, one for procreation, a "duty" (which I realize you did not say, but I'm getting an overall impression). 

So, on that issue, I think you've got yourself into a bit of a sticky wicket. It would require a lot of discussion if I were you, and I KNOW I could never marry someone I had no had sexual contact with - compatibility is key, and what if we just don't click? I can't live like that, I don't want them to live like that, and I know it will just cause problems down the road as the resentment builds up. 

NO - sex is not all there is, clearly. It's a big thing though, and I'm not going to lie about it and pretend it's not. 

As for her size and the medicine.... well, unfortunately, it just goes back to the no sex attitude for me. If she's so fearful that going on the pill is an excuse for sex, then there are some BIG sex issues here. I read your post and I heard "me" talking in a lot of spots. The things you said about her just sent my red flags into overdrive. 

Her size doesn't sound like a huge issue right now, but I don't know anything about that medicine. But I will say again, as I've said here before.... if you're an FA, and you're happy about that, and fine with it, then you deserve - and the girl you meet deserves - to find someone who fits what you want. Body, mind, spirit, etc. You should be able to comfortably seek a girl who understands your attractions, and is a happy, confident big girl (whatever size she may be). I understand losing weight is a fear of many FAs, but lots of big girls are big enough that even some weight loss will still leave a fat girl... so it's rarely that much of an issue. 

If you feel she is borderline in size enough that you may be left with a thin girl that doesn't want to have sex... well, wait a minute - maybe we're on to something?  Kidding. 

I don't know, you're in a pickle. I hate to be cut and dry about it, but I think this is not going to work out - the sex, to me, seems a far bigger issue for a possible marriage. 

I think you should meet her, go with an open mind and heart, but don't ignore your internal alarm bells. They're there for a reason, and you don't want to get into a situation for all the wrong reasons, despite the right ones that may be present. 

Good luck, I hope you keep us updated on how it's going.


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## Tooz (Jan 14, 2007)

Okay, I read your whole post, right? Okay. I only have a few things to say:

-How can you say that about her views on sex? Let her have her views, don't try to "compete" with them. I have so many problems with what you said regarding that that I almost don't know where to start, as it's 2:35am. Anyway, if she wants to wait for marriage and has been raised to believe that is the right way, you trying to change that WILL mess her up. I speak from personal experience on this front.

-If her weight is so damn important to you and the possibility of her becoming thinner is a problem, then maybe you need to be looking elsewhere for a mate. You seem to care about it an awful lot.

Overall, you strike me as someone who has yet to mature fully and is not actually ready for a real relationship. Granted, this is just how you have put yourself out there in a single post, so I'd like to believe you are posessing more facets than this post shows. You may be tired of being single, but I think you've got a little growing up to do before you're ready to be anything else.

Sorry if I seem a little mean, but your post struck some kind of nerve for some reason.

Also, she's right. Sex is not actually the most important aspect of a relationship.

GAAAAAAAAAAASP


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## ripley (Jan 14, 2007)

While not discounting your concerns about her getting thin, I must say that, to me, the greater issue here is your compatibility regarding religion, and views as to sex in general. If you two are not going to have sex until after marriage (as seems to be her requirement, from what you've written) then to me it seems like you'd know if she was skinny or not when you asked her to marry you, and if so, if you could move beyond that preference and have a complete marriage without it (the fatness, and it's sexuality to you).

You seem to have a history that's a little more free of religious constraint than she does, and I would be concerned that, disregarding the sexual issues even, it may make problems for you down the road.


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## NancyGirl74 (Jan 14, 2007)

OK...let's set aside your feelings about her weight loss for a moment. How does she feel about losing weight? Is this something she wants? Have you talked about it? Will she want to lose weight in the future regardless of her menstrual issues? If she does then this girl is not for you. You've made it clear that a big woman is your choice of mate. If she doesn't want to remain big (for whatever her personal reasons are) then it is in both your best interests to not take the relationship further. If you love her your first though should be of her health. Your second thought should be of her feelings in this matter. Finally, you should think of yourself and whether or not you can be a fair and loving boyfriend throughout her medical issues. If you can't perhaps you should do yourself and her a big favor and kindly move on. You are not a jerk or shallow for wanting what you want...However, you would be a big jerk if you didn't take her health, her choices, and her opinions into consideration. It sounds to me like she needs a very patient and loving friend right now. If you can't be that I suggest being honest with her and yourself. There is no crime in realizing a relationship will not work even when you wish it would. In fact, if you think it will not work in the long run you may just be doing her a kindness by letting her go. I'm _not_ saying you should let her go. I _am_ saying that I personally think you should look very deep within and ask yourself if you can be the boyfriend she needs right now and not focus solely on your own needs and desires.

Good luck to you both.


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## Renaissance Woman (Jan 14, 2007)

You say she's not been diagnosed with PCOS, but the symptom and treatments you mentioned all point in that direction. I have it and took metformin for a while. The reason it works in menstrual disorders is because the underlying cause for PCOS appears to be insulin resistence. This results in screwy things happening in the rest of the endocrine system, like messed up hormonal levels and such. Metformin takes care of the underlying problem, but birth control pills don't. It sounds like her doc is on top of that, so that's a good thing.

As for losing weight just from taking metformin? I hadn't heard that. And if she's only eating one meal a day, it's entirely possible her metabolism will compensate by slowing down, so it won't really matter that she's eating less. And if she just started taking it, it takes a week or two for the body to adjust, so she won't necessarily be ill long-term. 

The overall differences in attitudes towards sex and religion seems more problematic to me, and I'll go along with what previous posters said. Those may be the more problematic aspects of any long-term relationship you may attempt to have. If she's been sheltered as you say, and not had too much opportunity to find her own way with her religious beliefs, she may relax her attitudes, but she may not. That's not something you can predict. Because her beliefs about sex and religion are intertwined, it's not going to be useful for you to try to separate the two. Try to find some Christian sex sites and see if they're useful for either of you. A quick google search found http://www.themarriagebed.com/. Glancing through the site it seemed it was more reasonable and realistic than "no touching before the wedding vows," and takes it for granted that sex is an important part of marriage. 

Good luck.


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## liz (di-va) (Jan 14, 2007)

My biggest reaction to this?

You haven't met her yet. YOU HAVEN'T MET HER YET. 

I think a good 90% of the true nature of your worries could probably properly go under that heading if you unpacked them.

I know you've been talking constantly, but you really never know what you need to know until you meet somebody. So you have a lot of genuine feelings and hopes and expectations bound up in this visit with a person you know well but still haven't met, and now you have this to worry about, because of course--part of why you engaged in all this in the first place is because she's fat.

I personally think you're borrowing trouble, a whole arc of it. One thing at a time. If you discover you really love this person when you meet her, and it's mutual, a lot of these won't be worries anymore. I don't mean that dealin with these things'll be problem-free, but just: See. 

And as far as losing a lot of weight dealing with menstrual flooding...don't count on it. Been there, done that. Also with the long-distance thing. 

Also: not every virgin thinks sex is unimportant--I wouldn't assume that had anything much to do with things, her sexual status. She's probably worried, too. Menstrual irregularities are guaranteed to screw with your sense of being attractive/sexual.

There is always the "threat" of a BBW losing weight for FAs...think it's just something you gotta deal with. When you read these boards you'll sometimes find what I think are the most evolved responses to it on the part of FA-partners, but it's a basic worry, one that can ring kind of shallow, but has its place.

One thing at a time.


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## waldo (Jan 14, 2007)

I think this relationship is doomed. It will be better for both of you to quit sooner than later. Meeting in person is not going to change the fundamental problem of an incompatible outlook on life regarding sex and religion and probably a bunch of other related things. Often it seems that opposites attract, but once the excitement of the new relationship wears off the incompatibilities will be front and center. I don't think it would be that difficult for you to find other women who possess the things you mentioned that you have in common with the girl in Texas (wants kids, doesn't smoke, is well educated, doesn't seem to suffer from depression, is witty and strong willed, and is strikingly beautiful). There is nothing too out of the ordinary on that list, and it should be someone who agrees with you on some of these important issues like sex, religion, etc.


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## Carrie (Jan 14, 2007)

liz (di-va) said:


> You haven't met her yet. YOU HAVEN'T MET HER YET.
> 
> I think a good 90% of the true nature of your worries could probably properly go under that heading if you unpacked them.
> 
> I know you've been talking constantly, but you really never know what you need to know until you meet somebody.



Agreed x 1,000. It sounds like you're new to the online dating thing, shrikearghast, so I can understand why you're putting the cart before the horse - we've all been there, as online dating "rookies". You meet someone, get to know them online and on the phone, you seem really compatible, you get really, really excited. Totally understandable. The thing is, though, no matter how much you adore communicating with someone online and on the phone, being with them in person is just a whole 'nother ball game. So normally I'd say you really need to meet her at this point before worrying about anything else, at least to establish that you two are compatible in person, but....



Renaissance Woman said:


> The overall differences in attitudes towards sex and religion seems more problematic to me, and I'll go along with what previous posters said. Those may be the more problematic aspects of any long-term relationship you may attempt to have.



Yes. I'm a little surprised that you seem to consider smoking/non-smoking, the desire to have children, etc. more important than views on religion, sexuality and physical intimacy, especially if you are indeed someone who values sex. We sexy beasts need to be with other sexy beasts who want and love to ahh... to get it on. A lot. Sex is more than just the pursuit of an orgasm; it's the very pleasurable physical expression of love and intimacy between two people - incredibly important in a healthy relationship, in my opinion. As such, I think completely incompatible views on sex in a relationship is a big, whopping, screaming red light. It would be for me, anyway. This would give me much pause. 

Last, she's twenty. Twenty. This is not meant to offend the wonderful youngsters we have around here, who generally seem to have a clue, but really, I didn't know my ass from my elbow when I was twenty (although, boy, did I think I did!). Chances are, she has a lot, lot, lot of growing up to do (as do you, at 24), before she really understands who she is, what she can offer, and what she needs in a relationship. In other words, she has some dating to do! Again, this really isn't meant to insult you, her, or young people in general, but really, the 20's tend to be all about figuring out who you are and what's important to you - and she's at the very beginning of that. So again, I think putting the cart before the horse is not such the best idea here - you're putting a great deal of unnecessary pressure on yourselves by talking about marriage at this point, I think. 

If you really like her, the next step is just to meet. Hang out, have some fun, see what you're like together in person. You don't know what the future will bring - she could decide in the next few years that she loves being fat, or wants to be thin, or that sex is great, or she wants to be Amish - there's no way of knowing right now. It's a crap shoot, like any relationship, but a twenty year old girl has a good chance of going through some pretty big personality and belief changes in the next several years. Dating is all about getting to know the other person, which is where you two are right now. If you like her, date her and see where things go. I know the distance is challenging, but see each other when you can, try to spend more than just two or three days together at some points, and see where dating takes you. 

However, if you decide that it isn't in the cards because of her views on sex and attitude about losing weight, that's okay, too. Only you can decide what's important to you, and I don't think there's a thing wrong with your stance on both topics. 

So I don't know. This probably isn't helpful, but I guess I just felt talkative. At any rate, best of luck to you, whatever you decide, and I hope you'll stay and participate here on the boards.


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## GWARrior (Jan 14, 2007)

What if shes really a dude?


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## Biglover (Jan 14, 2007)

From a mans point of view, 
(1) she is 20, your 24, you both have a lot of growing up to do. 
(2) Have you talked about where you're going to live? 1,700 miles apart or so is really far. If you move her to your home, expect trouble there, if you move, will you be happy? 
(3) Sex, While it is not the most important thing in a relationship, it still can cause many troubles. 
(4) Religion, got to be real careful here, I know, I've been there. 
(5) Body type, you seem to know what you want, and like, no problem, but how does she feel about this? 
(6) Do you listen to her? Is her wants and desires considered? 
(7) Most importantly, if you don't get along, and agree on things now, how do you expect to after marriage? It won't happen, this is why so many people end up separated.
(8) You have a lot on your plate, good luck!
(9) Yes, it has been said, you haven't even met her yet!


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## babyjeep21 (Jan 14, 2007)

liz (di-va) said:


> My biggest reaction to this?
> 
> You haven't met her yet. YOU HAVEN'T MET HER YET.



I'm right there with ya. While I understand the concerns... 

One Step at a Time!


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## BBWModel (Jan 14, 2007)

AM...you hit the nail right on the head!!! I could not have said it better myself. If she is so afraid of sex that she won't even go on birth control pills, there is definately a much bigger issue there. And in the end, it will not make for a healthy relationship. But go and meet her and see how things go...then you can have a more serious discussion about your feelings if you feel like this is someone you want to spend more time with.


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## Sweet Tooth (Jan 14, 2007)

If sex and your arousal are more important to you than the person, I'd say you need to let her go to find someone who loves her regardless. It's far better to do this early on in the relationship, so I give you credit for not glossing over this conflict you're feeling.

Sure, you should be allowed to have a great, fulfilling sex life. I'm all for that. But there are things that come up in life and if you're willing to bail on a relationship for things that haven't even happened, you're not ready for marriage [where, due to health reasons, you might experience a partner's weight loss or gain or where you might have dry spells].

Also, I don't think it's wrong for her to not want to have sex at this stage of her life. She obviously has religious convictions, and I give her credit for actually living what she believes. There's nothing wrong with wanting sex to be special and to be in control of one's own body [as much as one ever can be]. Many young women of faith in this generation know who they are and what they want. It's not that they don't want sex. It's just that they want it within the boundaries of a marriage. Their relationship with God is more important than their relationship with you. That may be hard for a non-believer to accept or understand, which is one big reason for not having a "mixed marriage". If you can't respect her convictions simply because they inconvenience you at this point in your life, then you aren't compatible overall.

Oh, and I take metformin. The body gets more accustomed to it over time and the nausea goes away, especially if she's also making sure she's not loading up on sugar and carbs high on the glycemic index. My doctor put me on it gradually to minimize the side effects. I've been on it for years and, while I feel much better, I did not lose weight. Every one is affected differently.


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## MisticalMisty (Jan 14, 2007)

tooz said:


> Okay, I read your whole post, right? Okay. I only have a few things to say:
> 
> -How can you say that about her views on sex? Let her have her views, don't try to "compete" with them. I have so many problems with what you said regarding that that I almost don't know where to start, as it's 2:35am. Anyway, if she wants to wait for marriage and has been raised to believe that is the right way, you trying to change that WILL mess her up. I speak from personal experience on this front.


 
I agree, you have to allow her to have her religion, her own morals and values. There's no need to try to compete with them.
If they are truly too different from your own, that should speak volumes about the outcome of the relationship. A person's value system is who they are and you should never try to change a person's beliefs just to fit your own. You should seek out someone with the same belief system. 



tooz said:


> -If her weight is so damn important to you and the possibility of her becoming thinner is a problem, then maybe you need to be looking elsewhere for a mate. You seem to care about it an awful lot.


I realize your anger with this statement. We all want to be more than just our appearance at times. However, a person can not help what they are attracted to and I think that his awareness of how he feels about her size is ok. I would rather him be open with her and himself than to marry someone who is not his ideal and he seek out a fat women when he is married to a thin one.




tooz said:


> Overall, you strike me as someone who has yet to mature fully and is not actually ready for a real relationship. Granted, this is just how you have put yourself out there in a single post, so I'd like to believe you are posessing more facets than this post shows. You may be tired of being single, but I think you've got a little growing up to do before you're ready to be anything else.



Everyone can benefit from life experiences. I think he's plenty mature. He knows what he wants out of life and who wants and he's looking for the type of person he wants to be with..so I don't think it has anything to be maturity. Wanting to be with a person you are attracted to and mesh with isn't a sign of immaturity.





tooz said:


> Also, she's right. Sex is not actually the most important aspect of a relationship.



That depends on the person. I realize that you probably relate to her on a level because you seem to be quite similar. However, physical intimacy is a very important element and vital to a healthy relationship.

Sex isn't just an animalistic act between 2 people. I mean it can be..and can be quite fun that way. However, it is also a very loving and intimate way of showing the person you're with how much you love and adore them. It doesn't have to be dirty and it doesn't have to be a wifes "duty" to please her husband. It can be whatever the couple makes of it. It can be dirty, sexy, loving, emotional, fast, slow..mind shattering..there are so many feelings and emotions that go along with it.

However, if the beliefs in what sex means to a relationship is too different, I'm not sure how the relationship can blossom and not have one or both of the participants resenting the other.

As for the OP, I think your head is in the right place but your heart may be misleading you. I realize you care for this girl and I really think you guys should meet and discuss the issues you both have. But realistically, I think maybe your belief systems are just too differing. You can't ask her to change who she is and she shouldn't ask you to change who you are either.

I think the balance in your life will come with finding a mate that you mesh with on all levels..not just the non-smoker, wants kids..etc. You have to have the same beliefs and values for those future kids..or it isn't going to work out.


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## shrikearghast (Jan 14, 2007)

I don't believe that maturation will ever make sex unimportant to me in the way that people urging me to 'grow up' expect. This is just the way I am wired... other people, obviously, are constructed to the contrary.

Rather than eat the tickets, I am going to see her on Wednesday, and if things don't go well... oh well, I guess. I was willing to go the extra mile, take the first step and visit her. I think that is, or was, worth something.


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## This1Yankee (Jan 14, 2007)

shrikearghast said:


> I'm a young, extremely sexual guy
> 
> This girl has lived a very, very sheltered upbringing, and to say that I believe that her beliefs with regards to sex and relationships are just flat-out wrong would be the understatement of the decade. She's inexperienced and indoctrinated with religious righteousness, a nasty lense through which to attempt to view reality. This girl has been - for all intents and purposes - told by God that sex is an evil, unimportant act shared only by loving husbands and wives. How am I supposed to compete with this divine methodology?
> 
> ...



Above are the statements that trouble me most.

Since when does "Young, extremely sexual guy" + "Religious Righteousness" = Success!!! ???? I mean, really...

And while you said that she isn't depressed, yada yada, that doesn't mean that she doesn't have issues. Which I promise you, she does. Possibly more so than the average "woman", because as you stated, she is working with an upbringing that has left her with a gross misunderstanding of reality (and by this, I mean the commonly accepted definition of reality as it stands today, by the majority of people). I'm inferring here that YOUR reality, and hers, do not mesh whatsoever. So that would be a deal breaker for me, regardless of ANY other issues that you have. The cake, if you will, are the differences of opinion that you share on this subject. Everything else is the icing. 

I totally support every response that said "YOU HAVEN'T EVEN MET!", and I think it's silly to have taken yourself off the market, for someone that you do NOT know. Honestly, when you referred to her as your girlfriend, I thought that you must have been speaking of a different person; I had to re-read the entire opening to clarify.

There is a great phrase that says "If your sex life is active and healthy, then it's 10% of the relationship. If it's not, then it's 90% of the relationship." I have found this to be entirely true. So in my opinion, I would look at this situation, and consider it doomed before it was even supposed to have started. 

Hope my two cents helped!


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## saucywench (Jan 14, 2007)

To (almost ) all of the respondents: Dang, y'all are good. Really good. This thread is a great example of one of the reasons I listed long ago as to why I don't post much--I read responses to a thread and you've all covered the topic so thoroughly and often say it better than I could that you spare me the time and finger strain  of offering my own response. Good going!  

There's just one thing I want to add, though, that was touched on briefly by one or more of you. This observation is something that can apply not only to the OP but to all of us, online or in real life.

Sadly, we don't live in an ideal world. One of the crappy things about that harsh reality is that, throughout the course of our lives, we rarely meet up with enough people who, taken collectively, add such richness to our lives that we are left completely fulfilled with regard to interpersonal relationships. In other words, to have friends, mentors, lovers, gurus--whoever we need--to satisfy all of those complex cravings for human connection. These relationships help us define ourselves and validate our existence. 

The reality is, once we complete our schooling, the opportunities to meet others of like mind, heart, or spirit are diminished drastically. As Thoreau said, "the mass of men lead lives of quiet desperation." We spend a lot of time at home alone, whether by design or circumstance. As a consequence, we have a tendency to ascribe or project certain qualities onto a potential friend or love interest (or whatever role that person may represent to you) that they may not possess. They may possess some of the qualities we seek, but they cannot reasonably fulfill all of them. It would be so convenient for us if we could fit all of our needs into a cohesive package that takes the form of a solitary human being--but we cannot. 

The point I want to make with this, as regards the OP's predicament, is that the young woman with whom he hopes to fulfill his longings will unlikely satisfy all of those needs. It's not wrong to have a long and detailed "wish list"--I think we all do, whether consciously or subconsciously--but consider how inappropriate it likely is to expect one person to fill the bill. 

I don't have any quick and painless solutions to a dilemma such as this; I struggle with them, myself. It just seems, from the information that he has provided us, that there are too many fundamental differences to overcome in order to make this work as either of them might like. Shrikearghast, if your desire is to approach this from a grown-up perspective, you might both want to separate your realistic expectations from your unrealistic expectations and see what is left. You can then reach a mutual conclusion as to whether you want to continue the relationship under new definitions or not.


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## shrikearghast (Jan 14, 2007)

MisticalMisty said:


> As for the OP, I think your head is in the right place but your heart may be misleading you. I realize you care for this girl and I really think you guys should meet and discuss the issues you both have. But realistically, I think maybe your belief systems are just too differing. You can't ask her to change who she is and she shouldn't ask you to change who you are either.




Misty thank you.

Let's say that things don't work out between myself and her... what exactly should I be looking for in a woman?

Lately, I have been meeting a lot of girls who seem more similar to me than my girlfriend... but are morally ambiguous. The _"Hi, I'm dating you, but I still have male friends that I go out to dinner with in a for-all-intents-and-purposes date-like setting, but who I am just 'friends' with"_ type. I'm not normally a jealous person, but if it looks like a date, and smells like a date, and feels like a date, it is a date. As soon as it's become apparent that a girl is going to act like that, I balk and back off - regardless of whether or not we match up on other issues.

I am more inclined to lean towards more conservative women, because therein lies a lady who is likely to hold me to equal standards. However, the problems that my first post brings up seem like a... well... somewhat obvious side effect in hindsight.

I guess what I am looking for is someone who has more traditional expectations of loyalty, but who has a 21st century acceptance of physical desires, and I am beginning to question whether or not the pairing is possible in anyone below age 30.

I also, might add, that I don't want to wait until I am over 30 to get married. I'm just not interested in it. My parents got married when they were 3 and 4 years younger than me, respectively, and they've been successfully married for nearly three decades. 

I feel like I am shredding the best years of my life 'playing pretend' in relationships that ultimately go nowhere. I'm tired of being so bloody introspective and lonely, I have had several serious, years'-long relationships in the past, and am - at this point - generally quite mindful of what I want and need. 

Bah, now I'm just going in circles.


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## This1Yankee (Jan 14, 2007)

shrikearghast said:


> Misty thank you.
> 
> Let's say that things don't work out between myself and her... what exactly should I be looking for in a woman?
> 
> ...



It doesn't seem to me that you have ANY problems knowing what to look for in a woman. You are pretty clear about what you want/need.

FINDING it is the hard part. A predicament that every single person on earth deals with or has dealt with. Welcome to the club.


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## AnnMarie (Jan 14, 2007)

shrikearghast said:


> I guess what I am looking for is someone who has more traditional expectations of loyalty, but who has a 21st century acceptance of physical desires.



I think it's possible to find those people, I am one of those people. 

When I meet someone I like very much, then that's it... I focus on them and see where it goes. It's not because I feel I have to, it's because I want to. My heart is fairly singularly focused, and often at my own detriment when things go south - but hey, that's me, it's how I work. 

However, your description of someone going out with male friends and your reaction to it is a bit troubling. I'm a person who, until the last 5 years or so, was always very friendly with lots of men. I had close male friends who I spent hours with at work, after work, etc. They were not boyfriends, and if I'd met a boyfriend who made issue of my friendship with them, we'd have had some HUGE problems. 

I'm not saying you've written something that paints you as controlling, but a bit overly concerned. 

I understand this is all difficult, but some of your "wants" are very contradictory in nature and may be very difficult to find in one girl, and I think you're going to need to make peace with some of it before you can figure out the values/characteristics of a great girl for you. 

The idea of finding a sexually aware, conservative values, strong-willed woman who's willing to ditch male friends (I realize that's not exactly what you said, just sort of following a path here) is a tall f-ing order. 

Nothing is impossible, but I think you need to concentrate more on the substance of your future, and if she's got male friends let that go... LOL, it's not important if you love and trust someone.


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## supersoup (Jan 14, 2007)

shrikearghast said:


> Misty thank you.
> 
> Let's say that things don't work out between myself and her... what exactly should I be looking for in a woman?
> 
> ...


just wait it out if things don't work out with your girl. in my own past, and i'm sure others here, when you go seeking something out, something specific especially, you tend to make things harder for yourself. people cross paths for reasons, and you will eventually meet someone if your girl isn't right for you!

i too am a person that knows, more or less, what they want out of a relationship thanks to having had some serious ones, so your comment about 'shredding the best years of your life' hits home with me. i know it's frustrating, TRUST ME. but there's no point in kicking yourself in the arse about it, just see where things go with this girl, and if they end, then you know that you need a girl without some of the qualities she possesses...and there's nothing wrong with that, you just need something different.

and i just want to say, i completely feel ya on 'someone who has more traditional expectations of loyalty, but who has a 21st century acceptance of physical desires, and I am beginning to question whether or not the pairing is possible in anyone below age 30'...when i'm really frustrated at my situation, i think the same thing. these people do exist though, i promise!

good luck with everything, i hope you find what you are looking for! keep us updated!


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## shrikearghast (Jan 14, 2007)

AnnMarie said:


> The idea of finding a sexually aware, conservative values, strong-willed woman who's willing to ditch male friends (I realize that's not exactly what you said, just sort of following a path here) is a tall f-ing order.



I don't think I have ever asked a girl I have dated to ditch her male friends. A woman I was with for a good two years had strong male friends. What I ask is that she doesn't see them alone, in situations such as dinner, which could be construed as a date-like environment. There's a difference between having male friends and seeing them in environments that most people would regard as a dating atmosphere.


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## AnnMarie (Jan 14, 2007)

shrikearghast said:


> What I ask is that she doesn't see them alone, in situations such as dinner, which could be construed as a date-like environment. There's a difference between having male friends and seeing them in environments that most people would regard as a dating atmosphere.



I have dinner with friends, alone, male and female. These are *not* dates. That was my point in my post. If you think having dinner with a male friend is a date (or may be construed as one, as you mentioned), and something you don't want, then an independent woman may definitely have a problem with that. Just a cautionary warning for why I think some of the things you seem to want are contradictory qualities in a single person. 

But again, good luck with all of it, you're young (I don't mean that as dismissive, it's a good thing) and you've got time to step back and see things for what they are - use it to your advantage.


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## liz (di-va) (Jan 14, 2007)

_Quote: shrikearghast 
I guess what I am looking for is someone who has more traditional expectations of loyalty, but who has a 21st century acceptance of physical desires._



AnnMarie said:


> I think it's possible to find those people, I am one of those people.



I'm not addressing the not-seeing-male-friends part of this post for now, but just wanted to reiterate that I agree w/ AM: that's what I and everyone I KNOW is looking for! At least among my single friends We are 21st century chicks well in touch with our own sexuality who still want boyfriends! In fact, I've been writing an essay about this recently, so it obviously twanged a nerve, but really--don't worry about it if that's the issue.

This is really at this point a tangent; can see the discussion goin to other places, but I had to pipe up. I mean, GOLLY.


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## Tina (Jan 14, 2007)

shrikearghast said:


> I don't think I have ever asked a girl I have dated to ditch her male friends. A woman I was with for a good two years had strong male friends. What I ask is that she doesn't see them alone, in situations such as dinner, which could be construed as a date-like environment. There's a difference between having male friends and seeing them in environments that most people would regard as a dating atmosphere.



A very good male friend of mine and I go out to dinner whenever he comes into town. Sometimes it's in a dimly-lit, romantic-type restaurant. The difference is that we do not gaze lovingly into each others's eyes, hold hands or kiss. So what if the ambiance is that of a place where couples might have dinner or dance? The important thing is how they behave when they are together.


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## Theresa48 (Jan 14, 2007)

shrikearghast said:


> Misty thank you.
> 
> Let's say that things don't work out between myself and her... what exactly should I be looking for in a woman?
> 
> ...


 
This is my first post on Dimensions in many, many years. I have been a lurker in recent years while long ago, in the late 1990's did post from time to time. I feel compelled to make these observations: 

While the twenties are good years...they aren't necessarily the "best years" of your life. I found some intriguing adventures and great times in my twenties, thirties, forties, and now my fifties. I married when I was twenty to someone I thought was ideal for me in every way possible. We divorced thirty years later. Now, I've met another man whom I think is ideal in every way possible for me...will it last another thirty years or even a year? Who knows? Right now, we are very happy. 

You are concerned about your current girlfriend's attitude towards sex. It is amazing how what she "thinks" she wants as far as sex is concerned can change once she experiences sex. I was brought up in a family where sex was never discussed. My religious upbringing was such that sex was for procreation only. However, once I dipped my toe into the waters...I dove in wholeheartedly without reserve. So, it can happen in your girlfriend's case. (Not saying it will...just saying it can.) 

Meet her. Talk about your concerns. (Great advice given by others on this board.) Get to know her. Then both of you can better make a decision about a possible life together. 

As far as the loyalty issue...either a person is loyal or not. Age and sexual drive have little to do with it while they both can be great "excuses" for straying. 

I know many non-conservatives who are very loyal to their friends and mates. I know many religious conservatives who commit adultery every chance they get. 

This is a long first post. Sorry. 

Take care and good luck. Also, take the time to find someone who will meet your needs. Don't be in a hurry because you are afraid you will be too old if much more time passes. You won't be.


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## Tooz (Jan 14, 2007)

MisticalMisty said:


> Wanting to be with a person you are attracted to and mesh with isn't a sign of immaturity.



Well, it just seemed to me like he was putting his attraction before her health.


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## Tina (Jan 14, 2007)

Welcome back, Theresa. Great post with wonderful points; do not apologize for it.


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## MisticalMisty (Jan 14, 2007)

shrikearghast said:


> Misty thank you.
> 
> Let's say that things don't work out between myself and her... what exactly should I be looking for in a woman?
> 
> ...


It's time to stop reflecting on the loneliness and start reflecting on the why you are lonely. The whys of the ending of each relationship you've had recently. Before you find what you're looking for, you kinda have to know what you want.

If you are serious about finding a wife..you've got to get serious about your life and what your goals and dreams are. You have to know how you want to raise the kids you plan on having. How religious are the two of you going to be? What about schools and finances and jobs and how often will you move since you are a reporter?

These are the things that you need to know for yourself before you even think about bringing another person into the mix.

Next, you need to pinpoint what it is EXACTLY that you want from a woman. Obviously, you said you wanted a conservative woman so she won't date other people. Well, find a liberal person that you'd rather be with and say 
"Hey, listen, I'd like for us to be exclusive if that's ok. Really give ourselves time to find out if we are going to work without other people and emotions in the mix" If she can't agree to that..well guess what..dump her ass to the curb and move on to the next girl.

I realize that you want to marry early. Trust me, I'm almost 30 and I thought I'd be married and have a few kids running around. But your 20's are about finding yourself and enjoying yourself before settling down. Do everything that you want to do while you're single. Save the things you've always envisioned doing with your wife until you meet her. 

So there you have it. My advice..lol..take it or leave it..but this is a great time for self reflection to see what you really want.


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## Green Eyed Fairy (Jan 15, 2007)

I have to go with Liz on this one: You haven't even met her in person and already have all these conundrums about her.

Relax, meet her and then see what the future holds. 

A few things bothered me most about your post is:
1. You want her to be your wife
2. She is having health problems 
3. You are mostly concerned that she never, never, ever, ever lose weight- and you don't even seem care if it's because of health reasons 
4. You are thinking about dumping her if she loses weight
5. What if you marry her and she loses weight from cancer/lukemia? Would you want a divorce then?
6. Is your physical attraction to her the most important thing? If that's true, then I wonder if you're even ready for marriage. I was married for 14 years- his appearance changed alot during that time. As did mine. 
7. I know someone with PCOS and she can't get pregnant because of it. I could see you being more concerned about this than her weight.

If I misread/misunderstood anything in your post, then my apology in advance

Oh, one more thing, this part of your post:

I know for a fact I can have a damned fine time with someone without loving them, and thus her point of view is incorrect.

I have read and experienced that it is much easier for men to separate themselves from their minds/emotions during sex- that's not always the case with women. Do not conclude/assume she will think/feel the same about sex as you do. If you can't understand/value your differences in sex, or anything else, you will make a lousy lover, imo.


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## shrikearghast (Jan 15, 2007)

Green Eyed Fairy said:


> 6. Is your physical attraction to her the most important thing? If that's true, then I wonder if you're even ready for marriage. I was married for 14 years- his appearance changed alot during that time. As did mine.



There is a difference between something having importance, and something being the _most_ important thing. 

I would be a fool were I to say that physical appearance is unimportant to me. I am an FA; I like BBW - by default that gives me a preference heading into any relationship... a carnal, basic, extremely blunt preference. To claim that such a preference - one that has existed since I entered puberty, and has governed my physical attraction to women since then - is unimportant, would be a lie.

The problem with responses to my original post like your own is that they - intentionally or not - take, or imply, an all or nothing standpoint. Either my love for this girl is so profound that physical appearance is completely irrelevant, or I am such a bastard that all I can think about is the next time I shove my manhood into someone; their health or mental stability be damned. It's apparently one or the other.

The sad fact of the matter is that life and love are never so cut and dry, and it is my firm belief that people who view their lives in that way are kidding themselves. 

The reality is that people cheat when they are unsatisfied. That's not an excuse, it's just a fact - a fact I am extremely mindful of should my relationship with this girl progress. My potential future dissatisfaction with her physical form does not, however, preclude whether or not I love the girl... In fact, I maintain it has very little to do with that at all. 

I love my pets, I love my siblings, I love my parents - I don't want to have sex with them. I am highly attracted to random, fat bottomed girls who pass me in the mall, or on the street - but that doesn't mean I love them. Physical attraction and love are ambiguous partners, and as far as I am concerned, and they only really need to hold hands and be friends while imbodied in a person I have great affection for. They are also both of similar importance.

So is physical appearance the most important thing? Doubtful. Is it very, very important? Absolutely. The suggestion I should completely ignore one in favor of the other is silly. It is true that good looks fade... and that's why I'd prefer she have some before they're gone.


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## waldo (Jan 15, 2007)

shrikearghast said:


> There is a difference between something having importance, and something being the _most_ important thing.
> 
> I would be a fool were I to say that physical appearance is unimportant to me. I am an FA; I like BBW - by default that gives me a preference heading into any relationship... a carnal, basic, extremely blunt preference. To claim that such a preference - one that has existed since I entered puberty, and has governed my physical attraction to women since then - is unimportant, would be a lie.
> 
> ...



You seem to have a realistic outlook on this all, which is very mature in my opinion. The idea of loving someone despite their looks is not a good basis to build a marriage on for most people. As you say, it is likely to lead to lack of fulfillment and infidelity.

On one hand, I do not agree with those who say you haven't even met the woman so it is too early to say if it will work out. Having communicated online and by phone for over two months has given plenty of time to figure out if the person will mesh with you, assuming you are both being forthright about your thoughts and feelings. On the other hand, the thing that is missing is whether you will have 'chemistry' which only a face to face meeting can answer. But the red flags that give you concern aren't going away just because you meet in person. If any of these red flags are deal-breakers, it could be enough to pull the plug. The question will be whether you see enough in this relationship to make you want to work past those perceived hurdles. And maybe meeting her in person will give a better feeling for how much you should invest further that no amount of long-distance communication can. Good luck!


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## Green Eyed Fairy (Jan 15, 2007)

shrikearghast said:


> There is a difference between something having importance, and something being the _most_ important thing.
> 
> I would be a fool were I to say that physical appearance is unimportant to me. I am an FA; I like BBW - by default that gives me a preference heading into any relationship... a carnal, basic, extremely blunt preference. To claim that such a preference - one that has existed since I entered puberty, and has governed my physical attraction to women since then - is unimportant, would be a lie.
> 
> ...




I'm glad you realize your preferences. Those ARE important. 
However, in the course of a love relationship, it goes wayyyyyyyyy beyond your physical being. The fact that you love her (when and if you ever meet her in person) will make her more attractive/desirable to you. 
I would ask the same questions to a man that said he NEEDS his wife to be thin to have sex with her. Yeah, he has his physical preferences but marriage isn't like dating and having a score of people to choose from. 
It's meant to be forever and you have no idea what the future with this, or any woman, holds. 
I'm going to ask you once again, what if she had an illness such as cancer and all her hair fell out and she became stick thin? Does that give you an "out"? Or do you buck up like a husband should and be there with her, NO MATTER WHAT SHE LOOKS LIKE?
What if the situation were reversed? Should any woman leave you just when you need her most because of how you look? 
I think the answer is easy....
Looks are definitely not the most important factor when comes to MARRIAGE. 
I just get the impression from your posts that you definitely need to spend more time on this relationship before taking any big leaps. Marriage is a hard road to walk so choose your path carefully.

**One more thing, I think what bothers me overall about all of this is that you haven't met her and seem to hold her looks more important than even her political/moral/ethical beliefs. I don't think you're seeing the woman she really is. She is more than just a body to please you. 
You are choosing a life partner- not a mail order bride or something meant to only please you. YOU have to in turn be pleasing to her. As a woman, I can say that not being fully accepted as I am mentally, emotionally and physically has been one of the most disturbing, unpleasing things in my whole life.


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## Ruby Ripples (Jan 15, 2007)

Green Eyed Fairy said:


> I'm glad you realize your preferences. Those ARE important.
> However, in the course of a love relationship, it goes wayyyyyyyyy beyond your physical being. The fact that you love her (when and if you ever meet her in person) will make her more attractive/desirable to you.
> I would ask the same questions to a man that said he NEEDS his wife to be thin to have sex with her. Yeah, he has his physical preferences but marriage isn't like dating and having a score of people to choose from.
> It's meant to be forever and you have no idea what the future with this, or any woman, holds.
> ...



Both of your posts here Green, have echoed entirely my sentiments. 



_"I guess what I am looking for is someone who has more traditional expectations of loyalty, but who has a 21st century acceptance of physical desires, and I am beginning to question whether or not the pairing is possible in anyone below age 30."_

wow, added to everything else you demand.... I think you need to go live in Stepford, as that is what you want. (BBW Stepford of course!)

_"Lately, I have been meeting a lot of girls who seem more similar to me than my girlfriend... but are morally ambiguous. The "Hi, I'm dating you, but I still have male friends that I go out to dinner with in a for-all-intents-and-purposes date-like setting, but who I am just 'friends' with" type."_

To me, that comment sums you up entirely. WHY do you think those women are "morally ambiguous", for having friends, even if you dont like them seeing male friends for dinner, how the hell does that affect their morality? It says MUCH more about you and your strange attitude toward women. Do you realise that in your entire post worrying about your gf getting thin, you didn't once talk about what SHE wants or likes. 

Lets hope this strikingly beautiful, moral, conservative virgin is perfectly delighted with what she gets with you, or she may let herself be whisked away by a sweet and charming man, before you can say Metformin.


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## shrikearghast (Jan 15, 2007)

> Lets hope this strikingly beautiful, moral, conservative virgin is perfectly delighted with what she gets with you, or she may let herself be whisked away by a sweet and charming man, before you can say Metformin.



It certainly is difficult to have an adult conversation when children get involved. 

Remind me, the next time I make a post seeking help on how to deal with a difficult and no-easy-answer situation, to instead type out a poorly-disguised, uncalled-for attack on a complete stranger. That will allow us to skip all good advice and debate and get right down to the flame war you so clearly desire.

At least then perhaps some of the hostility you're directing at me will be _warranted,_ as is certainly not currently the case. I apologize for apparently pinching a nerve, but let me remind you that you don't know me, nor do you have any right to judge me, and yet here you are pounding the pulpit as if I were running off to commit mass murder.

Romance, more than any other act, is governed by a pursuit of ideals. When those ideals cannot be met, we either deal with our disappointment and focus on the good that outweighs the bad, or we move on to the next person. You, instead, propose that I should zip myself up in a body bag and call it quits here and now - after all, no woman could be 'perfectly delighted' with the package I present.

It's wonderful that you, apparently, were able to settle for a partner who isn't an ideal. What a blessed union indeed.

Some of us, however, aren't content with table scraps.

You obviously wanted a nasty response, and you got it.


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## supersoup (Jan 15, 2007)

and self destruct mode has commenced!!


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## This1Yankee (Jan 15, 2007)

Yankee then removes herself from the entire conversation, and gets out the tub of ice cream. Then hands Soupy a spoon, for to sit and watch the Fireworks with her.


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## supersoup (Jan 15, 2007)

This1Yankee said:


> Yankee then removes herself from the entire conversation, and gets out the tub of ice cream. Then hands Soupy a spoon, for to sit and watch the Fireworks with her.



i think i love you.


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## Carrie (Jan 15, 2007)

Gah. I hate when bunches of people respond in all sincerity to a post, and practically the only ones that receive a reaction/response are those that the OP perceives as a personal affront. 

Pass the ice cream, ladies. And it'd better be Haagen-Dazs, or I will go completely Veruca Salt on your asses.


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## supersoup (Jan 15, 2007)

Carrie said:


> Gah. I hate when bunches of people respond in all sincerity to a post, and practically the only ones that receive a reaction/response are those that the OP perceives as a personal affront.
> 
> Pass the ice cream, ladies. And it'd better be Haagen-Dazs, or I will go completely Veruca Salt on your asses.



but of course it is!!


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## Carrie (Jan 15, 2007)

supersoup said:


> but of course it is!!



I can always count on you guys. :wubu:


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## This1Yankee (Jan 15, 2007)

I've got straight chocolate, some sort of chocolate and coffee mixture, and white chocolate raspberry. And a car to go get more should we run out, or y'all would like something different...

hands Carrie spoon...


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## Tooz (Jan 15, 2007)

This1Yankee said:


> I've got straight chocolate, some sort of chocolate and coffee mixture, and white chocolate raspberry. And a car to go get more should we run out, or y'all would like something different...
> 
> hands Carrie spoon...



Want some cookies to go along with the ice cream?


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## supersoup (Jan 15, 2007)

tooz said:


> Want some cookies to go along with the ice cream?



she's in.


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## SocialbFly (Jan 16, 2007)

ok, i have several things i want to talk about, hopefully this will come across as i want it to...

first i think judging someone strictly on their religious backgrounds is a dangerous way to tread...some of the freakiest people that i know come from very religious background. I know what some might say, they are just fighting against what they have been taught. we all know that is not always true either, some of the most religious people have some of the strongest urges to control...ask Tammy Faye etc....i think when we made a judgement on her sexuality based on the religious back ground, you cant always make that leap of faith (so to speak). Didnt you all see Footloose?

as to the birth control issue making a case for her frigidity...maybe it speaks more to her horniness....i wouldnt go on the pill for fear of hormones in my fat body...but i could have used other things, but chose condoms...does that mean i am afraid of sex, or am a less sexual person? hell no, i chose that way to put a stop sign in front of my horny self (so to think before i act kinda thing)..I promise you that isnt it that i am afraid of sex...it could be her way of a stop gap for herself, fear of pregnancy is a good way to control some peoples hormonal and bodily urges..and yes, it does work for some people, and other people, of course, we just call them moms and dads...

i always worry more when physical attributes are a huge part of our relationship...it worries me from women who want certain attributes, just as it does when men want women that are in their definitions of beauty. i know we all want what we want...but i worry what happens when the physical attributes change...the boobs no longer perky, the waist no longer the size it was....yada yada yada, but i give you points for your honest post, but i challenge you to look closely at how you feel about the physical side only...life changes and throws us curves (some of us more curves than others) how would you feel 10 years down the road, when she has had your kids and now looks different...is this a reason to think about leaving?

my biggest problem is with someone saying they are in love when you havent even met....let me assure you, i believe you can love someone you have never met, but being in love is to me, a whole different thing...you may ask what is the difference....to me, being in love gives you the strength to live through those hurdles life places at your path, be it arguements, differences in money, or differences in physicality...(for example, your lovely fat partner getting thinner from chemo treatments) or being loved which relays your feelings to another person but doesnt hold the longevity that being in love renders....being in love takes time and physical intimacy, even if it is just kissing and holding hands, you cant beat chemistry to help complete the love cycle.

i think you have given it much thought, but i think this requires more introspection on your part to just how ready are you for this kind of committment....

and btw...you are in your sexual prime, so of course, sex is important to you...cant fight the hormones, but you can use your brain....look at this again, think about where and why you are headed where you are, look at your jealousy issues...then step forward again, i think you will make a better choice in the long run...


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## SilkyAngela (Jan 16, 2007)

I have to agree with AM that your wishlist in a mate is a tall order to fill, but lucky for you, no one is going to choose a mate for you, its up to you to find her and you do seem to have a clear idea of what you want. 

The best advice I could give to you comes from someone who is 3 times married and twice divorced. Compatability or lack thereof has proven to be the single biggest factor in my relationships lasting or failing. If you come upon issues with this girl (as you continue to get to know her) or any other that you can already see head-butting being a large part of your future together, most likely you will both be dissatisfied trying to fit each other when your core values are so different. 

my 2 pennies


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## Ruby Ripples (Jan 16, 2007)

shrikearghast said:


> It certainly is difficult to have an adult conversation when children get involved.
> 
> Remind me, the next time I make a post seeking help on how to deal with a difficult and no-easy-answer situation, to instead type out a poorly-disguised, uncalled-for attack on a complete stranger. That will allow us to skip all good advice and debate and get right down to the flame war you so clearly desire.
> 
> ...



I AM the adult here, That is why I wouldn't lay my potential husband open to scrutiny and dissect his characteristics on a forum. Why not show your girlfriend this thread and see who she thinks is the adult. 

This was not about attack. But you post with such strong opinions TO complete strangers, you have to expect to get opinions back. I believe I made valid points. Oh and you never replied to the "morally ambiguous" question I asked. I take it THAT is what pinched the nerve in you.


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## moonvine (Jan 16, 2007)

MisticalMisty said:


> Trust me, I'm almost 30 and I thought I'd be married and have a few kids running around.



Yes, I'm 40 and thought the same thing. Life is what happens when you're making other plans


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## Wagimawr (Jan 16, 2007)

moonvine said:


> Life is what happens when you're making other plans


Damn, and I just changed my avatar, too


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## LillyBBBW (Jan 16, 2007)

From the bits of information I can gather from what you've described it is pretty clear from a logical standpoint that this girl is not the one for you. You are not compatible, bottom line - however I will not go so far as to say that your feelings for this girl are not real just because you haven't met and you're on the internet. It's apparent that they are. Whatever impressions you have made with each other online and/or over the phone have been strong enough to cause both of you to ignore some very serious conflicts of interest among you, regardless of opinions on wether those interests are right or wrong. Interests that you can't even openly discuss with her to the point where you have to come here. It's a textbook red flag man.

If you ask me, which you did , I'd say save yourself now while it's still early. A woman at my church, similarly mismatched, is going through a painful divorce right now. It was her husband's choice, I think he met someone else more fitting. Because of her staunch religious beliefs, much more rigid than mine or his, she will never marry again as she believes that this man as the father of her child is and always shall be her husband even though he is not and never was a believer. She's praying that the Lord will turn his heart and he'll come back to her. It's a messed up world my friend. Buyer beware.


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## TheSadeianLinguist (Jan 16, 2007)

shrikearghast said:


> However, after two years it had gotten stale, and I was ready for something serious - no game playing, no flings... something with the potential to lead to marriage. One of my few required criteria was that the woman that I eventually fall in love with be a BBW, since I am a 100% open, care-free FA, have been so since I was 13. I simply do not find thin girls attractive.



Fair enough.



> I live in Maine, and there aren't a lot of BBWs that I run into on a day-to-day basis, so I decided to utilize a BBW-focused personals website.



Makes sense.



> When local searches yielded unpromising results, I eventually widened my field and met a young lady from Texas who, while very, very conservative (I'm a moderate/libertarian), definitely matched up with me with regards to all the important things (wants kids, doesn't smoke, is well educated, doesn't seem to suffer from depression, is witty and strong willed, and is strikingly beautiful). She also happened to be a virgin (I'm 24, she's 20 - it's not so remarkable as it seems in her case), but more on that in a second.



Warning bells going off in my brain. Conservatives, especially neocons, tend not to be the best matches for Mr. or Ms. Live and Let Live as Long as No One's Individual Rights Are Violated. 



> We hit it off smashingly, and have been spending hours on the phone talking every night for about two and a half months. It's gotten to the point where we need to meet, and I'll be flying down to see her on Wednesday.



Have fun on your trip.



> My girlfriend suffers from an abnormal menstral cycle. While she is not diagnosed with polycystic ovary syndrome, the symptoms are similar, generally resulting in prolonged bouts of having no periods, followed by devastating, horrible 'mega' periods every 4 or 5 months. She didn't want to go on birth control as a treatment because she is concerned that doing so will serve as an excuse to have premarital sex, and so her doctor recently put her on Metformin, a medicine normally used in diabetes treament, which has also been used to some success to treat menstral disorders. It also happens to be a mildly-potent apetite suppressant, which appears to be causing her to not only get physically ill with a good degree of frequency, but has reduced her consumption of food from 3 meals down to 1.



I'd worry about dating someone who thinks she'll become a sex-crazed vixen just because she's on the pill. That would make me rethink that "strong-willed" part, for sure. 



> Now, here's the meat of the issue: I don't want her to get thin. I'm not interested in dating thin girls, and no matter how you flip the concept around, I can't get excited over them.



Fine.



> The one thing I know with certainty is that if my girlfriend begins to drop massive amounts of weight, there will be problems. I just can't deal with it - I'm a young, extremely sexual guy, and while I do believe I love this girl, and do care for her far beyond her looks, I know - deep down inside - that her being thin would cause big issues down the road.



Most people who are fat remain fat their whole lives, and vice versa. There's always a chance someone will "become thin." I'm also guessing you don't like having sex with old people, but if you're married for fifty years, guess what? 

The thing here is, that if this was a thin woman you were freaking out over potentially becoming fat, society would be calling you a jerk right now. Bodies change, and there's always potential for huge change. Someone is not going to look like a firm, young 275 lb. chestnut haired beauty FOREVER. People are more than their very good pictures posted on a dating site. Keep that in mind, or as my boyfriend how I dress after work.



> Being a virgin, her reaction when I cautiously attempted to explain this to her was that I was being incredibly shallow. "Sex is not, nor should it be, that important," I was told. Of course, I know that statistically the most common cause of infidelity amongst couples is disatisfaction in the sack. So, while I acknowledge and respect her current choice of the virgin lifestyle, I am not so foolish to believe that - should we eventually get married - that her being thin wouldn't cause me to be _quite_ unhappy with regards to sex.



Date someone with a similar libido and attitude about sex. That tip's free.



> Her reaction also troubled me deeply, because it didn't seem to matter to her what I thought on the subject. I was wrong, I was being shallow, and I needed to get over it. I know, of course, that there's no such simple answer, but she is naive enough to believe that just such a coy sollution is what the doctor ordered.



Generally speaking, women get pretty pissed when you say things similar to, "If 'X' happens to your body, I'll quit being sexually attracted to you." And stay away from naive people; they tend to believe your attitude will change. If you don't want this, she won't end it.



> My problem here boils down to a simple question - what am I supposed to do? Actually, I lied, it's not quite that simple...
> 
> *A)* Am I a bad person for being open with my partner about my feelings with regards to her physical appearance? She is not massively overweight (or close an area I'd deem unhealthy), and so I don't believe that her current size places her in any immediate danger, and thus I do not think I am being _that_ selfish.



Meet her and then see if you could tolerate her if she dropped twenty lbs. or lost an arm or something.



> *B)* If I am _not_ ruled to be a jackass for feeling this way, how do I go about convincing her that I'm not some kind of sex-crazed maniac? This girl has lived a very, very sheltered upbringing, and to say that I believe that her beliefs with regards to sex and relationships are just flat-out wrong would be the understatement of the decade. She's inexperienced and indoctrinated with religious righteousness, a nasty lense through which to attempt to view reality. This girl has been - for all intents and purposes - told by God that sex is an evil, unimportant act shared only by loving husbands and wives. How am I supposed to compete with this divine methodology?



She is never going to think your behavior in the past or that your current attitude about sex is okay unless she changes her value system. And I don't really think you have a right to do that.



> *D)* And finally, I believe I'd like to find some text talking about the importance of sex in healthy relationships. My girlfriend seems to think that sex, on the whole, is not nearly as important as other aspects of a functional relationship. She also seems to believe that sexual satisfaction is derived from love, rather than physical fulfillment. While I don't believe that the two are always exclusive, I know for a fact I can have a damned fine time with someone without loving them, and thus her point of view is incorrect. Anyone have any helpful links with doctor-like advice that I might pass on or share with her?



Anything by Sue Johanson is good, but if you're so unwilling to change your perspective, why should she change hers?


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