# Living Green.



## biodieselman (Nov 2, 2006)

Tina suggested I start a living green thread. I have no illusions about myself & don't pretend to be the 'green' expert. Nor do I pretend to know the final word on being green. But I would love to hear what you guys do to be green, no matter how insignificant you think it is. Any small effort benefits all of us. I would love to encourage people to at least try to be a better steward of earth. 

My pet topic is biodiesel. I can give you pointers if you're considering ending your petroleum addiction. Future cars & trucks with new era diesel technology & Ultra Low Sulfur Diesel fuel will be cleaner than gasoline engines plus get up to 40% better fuel economy. New diesels are as clean as a Prius & in my case of burning 100% biodiesel much cleaner than a Prius. Wow, my 3/4 ton truck is cleaner than a Prius, can you believe it? M.I.T. says total life cycle diesel/electric hybrids are as clean as a hydrogen fuel cell powered car. Cleaner if fueled by 100% biodiesel. You can't afford a fuel cell car even if they made one but in two or three years Honda will be selling diesels & diesel/electric hybrids. Honda aims to be the environmental auto maker. 

Living green starts with conservation. Conservation doesn't get enough mention. It does not mean having to do without. If we use energy wisely we can still maintain our life style. One example is energy-wise florescent lighting. Only 11% of the energy incandescent bulbs consumes produces visible light, the rest is wasted as heat. 

Something I do know about is organic vegetable gardening. I will gladly answer questions on small container vegetable gardening or backyard gardening. You won't believe how good food you have grown tastes. Plus there is a great feeling of satisfaction. 

Recycling is another everyday commitment of mine. Of course, in Los Angeles county where we live recycling is easy- we just toss recyclables into a separate waste can for curb side pick-up. However, we do have to go out of our way to recycle all our used electronics. Did you know E-waste & batteries are considered hazardous toxic waste? The heavy metals in electronics leaches out of land fills & poisons our drinking water. E-waste is having a huge detrimental impact on the environment but not many people dispose of E-waste properly. 

The steps to being green is a huge topic & I've only mentioned a few examples. What are you doing to help?

_***Moderator's note: I have decided to move this thread to the lounge, with a shadow of it still in Hyde Park, because the environment is something of concern, I would thing, of every living being, and maybe because so many avoid HP, a lot of people were missing what I, and many others, have found to be a very valuable thread. Please feel free to contribute your ideas, also._


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## 1300 Class (Nov 2, 2006)

I use public transport (I can't drive for medical reasons for some time but would do it anyway), and always recycle (the recycling bin is collected every second week). Every little bit helps. And we rigdidly adhere to the water restrictions currently in place.


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## love dubh (Nov 2, 2006)

Bikes, people! OH HOW I LOVE THEE, BICYCLE! 

Freddy Mercury knew what was going on! He sang her praises!

Bicycles are fantastic. ZERO DOLLARS AND ZERO GALLONS PER MILE. Does NOT contribute to environmental pollution (with the exception of the rubber tires and minimal amounts of grease). 

You can take them on most public transport; they're fun to ride! You can ride with friends! You can all sorts of tricks with them, and compete too. They inject some sort of enjoyment into exercise. 

Oh, and not to mention the HARD-ON (figuratively) that I get when I *saaaaaaail* passed cars stuck in traffic. Ha ha, suckahs. 

And a good bike will only set you back 200 bucks. A tool kit? 20-30 bucks. You don't need insurance, but you'll want to consider a helmet and reflective materials if you ride at night.

And, when you're done with it, you can donate it, or upgrade! YAY!


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## 1300 Class (Nov 3, 2006)

You ain't seen how hilly iy is round these parts.


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## Tina (Nov 3, 2006)

*Thank you very much, biodieselman!

I made this thread sticky, because whether one agrees whether there is such a thing as global warming or not, it cannot hurt to do what we can to be good to our wonderful planet.

I request that only helpful, not argumentative, posts be posted, or they will be removed, as this is meant to be an informational thread. Thanks! *

- Tina


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## missaf (Nov 3, 2006)

I do have questions about how to start container gardening. I live in an apartment with a patio, and have shade just about 50% of the day. I can't invest a whole heap of money into container vegetable gardening, but it would be nice to know what containers can be home made, if I can grow in the winter, and what best would grow in the conditions I have.


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## activistfatgirl (Nov 3, 2006)

I'm a horrible environmentalist/conservationist. I've surrounded by people who garden...even in the city...I know kids who use vegetable oil to run their cars or bike everywhere...I've got a far way to go. 

I'm very interested in alternative fuel. I wish I would have stopped and thought about getting a diesel when I bought my car. Meh.

Next summer, gardening it is. If we all grew as much of our food as possible, the effects would be tremendous.

(I've got to get used to getting dirty!)


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## GWARrior (Nov 3, 2006)

Unfortunately, I live out in the middle of the woods, and it takes a 20 minute car ride to get anywhere. We're so far out in the middle of nowhere, we dont get public transportation. We also dont get garbage pick up. We bring it to a dump (actually, the correct term is "transfer station") So we depend a lot on our automobiles.

My family is big on recycling. Cans, bottles, paper... We used to have a good composte heap going, but I dont know why that stopped. Ive been thinking about starting it again next spring.


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## biodieselman (Nov 3, 2006)

Container gardening is ideal for someone with limited space. Containers don't have to be expensive- I used Rubbermaid storage containers to grow tomatoes a few years ago. My supersize wife has lots of different herbs in pots that she grows year-round here in So.California. They don't take a whole lot of work to thrive and they get by on a few hours of sun during the day, even less during winter. She has a bad back, so I do any heavy lifting needed, but, by and large, she maintains them by herself. Tomatoes, summer squash and cucumbers would be easy to grow in containers during the summer.

If you live the ocean or in extreme southern areas where you get few mild frosts, no frost is better, you can still plant cool season crops but hurry. Nurseries will soon be throwing away all their vegetable six-packs to make room for poinsettias. It would be best if you got at least 8 hours of full sun. Reflected heat from a wall will help offset cool night temperatures. It's recommended that you start small so gardening doesn't become a chore, it's supposed to be rewarding, not work. To save money on containers, I've seen people use the potting soil bags by themselves. Cut several small holes in the bottom for drainage & lay them flat. Shallow root plants like leaf lettuce will do just fine with one bag. Larger plants like broccoli & peas would benefit from two bags. Lay the first bag with drainage holes in the bottom flat where you want it & cut a large rectangular hole in the top but leave enough of the bag for structural support so the soil doesn't wash out. Lay the second bag right next to the first, cut several holes through out the top so roots will find a path down into the second bag. Use your best judgement on the hole sizes depending on how fast you think you can flip the bag over onto the top of the first, but not to where the bag won't hold in the soil. There's your containers. It would be preferable to find a cheap plastic shallow tray the size of the bag for a water catch basin & ease of watering, but isn't necessary. There will be some stains from water leakage but should wash up with a hose when watering. 

I've already started my winter garden. I secession plant meaning I plant a few plants every month to spread out the harvest over time. Here is a list of cool weather tolerant crops you can probable find in nursery six-packs: Brussel sprouts, cabbage, cauliflower, chard & sugar snap peas (yum, sugar snap peas:eat1. My favorites are broccoli, sugar snap peas & carrots because they don't require much care or insecticide. The crevices between the leaves in stuff like sprouts & cabbage are perfect hiding places for aphids, worms & slugs. When you grow your own food you soon realize how much insecticide Mr. Farmer has to use to produce blemish free crops. 

I like broccoli because you can find 'branching' varieties that produce small side shoots after cutting the central head, prolonging harvest. Broccoli probably will have a few pests. Look closely underneath the head for tiny aphids. A strong spray of water will wash them off, but insecticidal soap is better. Safer's Insecticidal Soap is nontoxic to animals, that means me, but the oil & soap smother the little sapsuckers. If you see greyish/white butterflies, then look for cabbage loopers. Look carefully under the leaves for worms, they'll be the exact same color as the plant. Missing edges of leaves or holes are also a sign. There is a completely nontoxic, organic insecticide that kills worms called BT, bacillis thuringiensis, which can be sprayed on plants right up to harvest.

When you buy six-packs, you're buying the time it takes to get to planting size. Choose the plants with the thickest stem; it is normal for the stem right next to the soil to be thinner. Cabbage, brussel sprouts & broccoli, or cole crops, are some of the few plants that benefit from planting deeper than existing soil level. Plant them deep so the thick stem will support the plant. Cut holes in your bag & plant 18" apart. 

Sugar snap peas are so sweet & delicious. You should still be able to find six-packs. Choose the 'bush' varieties so you don't have to get a trellis. They can be planted pretty close to each other & will sprawl all over the bags. Peas are relatively pest free, but try not to get the foliage wet. Peas are susceptible to a disease called powdery mildew, a type of fungus that looks like powdered dust. 

Leaf lettuce six-packs should also be available & should do well with one bag. Seeds sprout quickly & there are many varieties. You can extend the harvest by only picking the larger outer leaves & leaving the rest to grow. Just be sure you thoroughly inspect & wash each leaf because you don't want to be showing off your home grown salad greens & have your guest find a slug. 

Fertilize half strength each month with a vegetable fertilizer or get a time released fertilizer such as Osmocote. Osmocote is relatively expensive but you only do it once at planting time & forget about it. If you get a 'heat spell', we get dry windy 80 degree Santa Annas here in L.A. winters, you can water while at work by filling a one liter plastic soda bottle with water & turning it upside down into a hole in the bag. Stick your finger into the soil & it feels dry then water slowly by laying the hose in a hole & just barely turn the water on until saturated. You can over water. 

Winter gardening is a pleasure in mild weather zones. Most bugs hibernate, the plants grow slower so there is no great rush, plus some crops fare better in cool weather. If you have an old table then you could put your bags on top of it so you don't have to bend over so much.


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## missaf (Nov 4, 2006)

OH, wow. Thank you so much! I learned more from your post than I did in 8 houts of web surfing for ideas.


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## biodieselman (Nov 4, 2006)

We took this photo this morning showing one of the rows of broccoli with the Twentieth Century Asian pear tree to the left and San Diego red bouganvillea behind me. The broccoli consists of three different varieties ripening at various intervals and are grown from seed by my wife. Super easy to germinate. I sprayed them today with the BT mentioned in my previous post, which is completely organic; no pesticides or chemical fertilizers are used. This row of broccoli is about 10 feet long by 3 feet wide; I have 10 rows of staggered lengths with the smallest being about 6-1/2 feet long. This all fits in just one part of my backyard on an average sized lot here in So.California.

P.S. The white fuzzy Frowney Face I'm holding is Bubbles the Shih Tzu. My wife's dog. And, reluctantly, for he is not a man's man's dog, mine. 

View attachment broccoli resized.jpg


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## Tina (Nov 4, 2006)

Oh, great pic, bio.  How did you end up with a breed of dog you are not thrilled with?  

Missa, you might try picking up a copy of Sunset's Western Garden book. It is, IMO, the best, because you get lots of info from it, plus it shows the western U.S. broken down into zones and what grows best, and does not grow well, or at all, in each zone. Mine is packed away, dang it, or I'd quote from it for you, but it is kind of like the gardener's bible, if you're interested in going in that direction.


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## activistfatgirl (Nov 4, 2006)

Someone give me guidance: are there ANY vegetables that would grow totally inside in containers..michigan winter...no sunlight..grumble grumble.


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## biodieselman (Nov 4, 2006)

activistfatgirl said:


> Someone give me guidance: are there ANY vegetables that would grow totally inside in containers..michigan winter...no sunlight..grumble grumble.


 
Not without spending a lot of money & energy. Consult your local indoor hydroponic cultivating weed purveyor for technical support & lists of local hydroponic supplies vendors. Just look for the brilliant glints of light peeking through the holes in the aluminum foil covered windows. 

You should be able to grow mushrooms indoors during the winter. Google 'mushroom growing kits'. There are many gourmet varieties available & vendors willing to help answer your fungi growing questions. I know, you weren't expecting a serious answer.


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## biodieselman (Nov 5, 2006)

Tina said:


> How did you end up with a breed of dog you are not thrilled with?
> 
> Missa, you might try picking up a copy of Sunset's Western Garden book.


 
I asked Dee to post the Nov 4th garden picture with a brief explanation while I went to the store. I guess the dog explanation was her way of trying to sound 'biodieselmanly'. She doesn't work & the two Shih Tzu are her beloved companions. I don't require a rottweiler to feel manly. Don't tell anyone, but he is a cute little puppy. 

Another excellent, more in depth reference manual is titled 'California Master Gardner Handbook'. It can be ordered from the University of California Agriculture and National Resources Communication Services at http://anrcatalog.ucdavis.edu..


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## Tina (Nov 5, 2006)

That's so funny, bio, because in reading the P.S. part it didn't really sound like something you would say, but hey, you never know. I see that Dee is michevious. 

Hi Dee!


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## Miss Vickie (Nov 5, 2006)

What a great thread! Thanks for starting it.

For me, living where I do, it's tough. We're not set up for public transportation and since we've been having single digit temperatures, biking isn't really a viable safe option. But I do recycle, try to do all my errands at once, plug in our vehicles, etc. Also, since Burtimus and I are "cold" sleepers, the heat's turned way down at night.

I was at my conservationist best when I lived in Seattle. We had curbside recycling so we recycled a LOT. I had an organic garden, composted my own veggie and bunny waste, purchased from food co-ops and washed my kids' cloth diapers. I was in greenie heaven.  We're not nearly so well set up here, and I miss it.


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## biodieselman (Nov 5, 2006)

Miss Vickie said:


> I had an organic garden, composted my own veggie and bunny waste.



I worked with a guy who was Alaskan native & he had married a San Diego woman. She hated Alaska & made him move to San Diego. He hated San Diego & wanted to move back to Anchorage. Mark was also a gardner. He said the top soil is so deep & rich, he didn't need to amend the soil very much. The growing season is short but the really long sunlight hours allowed him to grow cabbages approaching the size of beach balls. I would guess timing planting is critical but cool weather crops should grow like weeds with that many hours of sun. The only real problem he had was critters.


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## Elfcat (Nov 6, 2006)

Not enough I'm sure. I have taken on the role of company recycler, and I take gobs of paper down to the drop off periodically.

I donate a little money to the Green Party. And I shop at the farmer's market as often as I can.


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## Tina (Nov 6, 2006)

We really do not have a good system in the apartment where I live to recycle much. We recycle aluminum and plastic, and I try to make scrap paper out of pages I've printed and don't use, or envelopes from mail and such. I also end up using the grocery plastic bags for trash bags for little trash cans. I'm not sure if that's good or not. There is so much more I could do, and know that I will in Montreal, where everyone recycles, even businesses.


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## biodieselman (Nov 6, 2006)

It is difficult for small communities to fund comprehensive recycling programs. For recycling to be effective it has to be relatively easy for the individual & businesses. We live in Los Angeles county; recycling is mandatory. You can still toss recyclables in with regular waste, but it's just as easy to keep the recyclables separate and toss them in their own receptacle. Living in a city that makes it easy is no guaranty of cooperation. Just this morning I saw that some lowlife had dumped a mattress (not a recyclable, but rather an example of how lazy people can get when it comes to properly disposing of waste, let alone having a concern for the environment) in the cul-de-sac next to my house. P.O.S. The city-contracted waste removal company that we use provides a large item pick-up service but it requires a phone call. Some people!


Recycled materials need to be further separated at the landfill/dump/plant & there needs to be infrastructure to re-process recycled materials. The total recycling process is still in the infancy stage but we're getting there. 

Did you know that in reality you're not recycling plastic. You are recycling the crude oil used to make plastics. Researchers are working on making plastics from corn oil & the indicators are positive. 

You're not actually recycling aluminum either. Aluminum is the fifth most common element on earth. Aluminum, like hydrogen doesn't exist in elemental form. Both are tightly locked up in molecules that require great amounts of energy to break very strong chemical bonds in order produce the elemental form. That's why aluminum smelters are next to power plants. You're actually recycling the immense amount of energy required to make aluminum.

Another reason to recycle is that landfills are, well, filling up. Who wants a landfill to open up in their neighborhood? NIMBY! Recycle now and stretch the life of your local landfill.


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## sammitch (Nov 7, 2006)

From reading this thread, I think it's clear that there are a *lot* of little things we can all do to help clean up the world around us. I care a lot about the real, concrete things in front of me, like clean air, clean water, landfills that aren't EXPLODING onto the street, and reusing stuff. Unlike some of the theoretical stuff, much of which is based on rather dubious information (we _still_ can't reliably nail down a _non_-natural cause for periodic climatic fluctuations), we _can_ see the little things, and we _can_ do something about them. It's certainly better than pounding nails into tree trunks in the twisted hope of taking out a few unlucky loggers, or burning lots full of those awful, awful SUVs (thereby releasing _vast_ amounts of toxic pollutants), or the other ridiculous things that give environmentalism of any variety a bad name.


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## Miss Vickie (Nov 7, 2006)

Oh and one more bit of a greenie idea. There are groups everywhere called "freecycle". We even have one here in Anchorage. People list the stuff they want to get rid of and arrange with others to pick them up. No money, no trading, just getting rid of stuff (some amazingly weird and cool stuff) that would otherwise end up in a landfill.

Our local group is a Yahoo group. Not sure if they all are, but you can use The Google  to find them. Awesome way of re-using and keeping those landfills manageable.


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## biodieselman (Nov 11, 2006)

Whoa is me, it cost me $16.50 to fuel up my truck . Here's a picture of me pumping 30 gal of home-made moonshine into my fuel tank. 

This is a photo of my biodiesel extractor. My own personal fuel refinery.:smitten: 

I used to laugh at people that plastered the back of their cars with bumper stickers & now I'm one of them. Don't laugh at me now, laugh at me as I drive by gas stations. 

It's hard being green. 

View attachment biodiesel1.jpg


View attachment biodiesel2.jpg


View attachment biodiesel3.jpg


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## Tina (Nov 12, 2006)

Cool still, man.  Bio, how big of a pain in the neck is it to do it this way? It seems like one would have to spend a lot on equiptment, and then what, run around to fast food places, asking for oil? As you can see, I simply have no clue when it comes to this.


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## biodieselman (Nov 12, 2006)

Making biodiesel isn't for everyone. It takes commitment. When I brag that my fuel costs 55 cents per gal to make, I'm deliberately not mentioning that I'm approaching the $6,000 mark in equipment. I have too many hobbies & too little time. My vegetable garden, landscaping & pool maintenance takes too much of my time so I spent the money & bought a turn key system. A handy person could assemble a processor relatively cheaply.http://journeytoforever.org/biodiesel_make.html 

I have a written contract with a Indian restaurant (their cuisine fries very little meat which is best for the home brewer) . He is required by law to dispose of his cooking to a licensed renderer. I had to get a million dollar umbrella insurance policy plus $175 for a California issued sticker that serves as my renderer's license. He has to pay to have the oil removed from his property & he was happy when I told him I would take it, no charge. He produces enough waste vegetable cooking oil to keep me in fuel. I have a dedicated 12v pump that uses the truck battery to pump the oil out of his barrel & into eight 5 gal motorcycle fuel dump cans. Collecting is no big deal other than it can be a bit disgusting sometimes. I never mention that part when bragging about biodiesel. 

The actual process is very simple & doesn't require much hands on time. I valve the system & turn on a pump to recirculate the oil for a good representative oil sample. The titration test is similar to simple pool chemistry tests. There is a chart that tells me how many grams of lye & gallons of methanol is required to make sodium methoxide to strip the glycerine molecule off the three carbon chains (biodiesel). Mixing lye & methanol is a dangerous process & requires a little common sense. This is no place to be in a hurry or careless. One reason for buying this turn key system was that this important step was very well designed for safety. After the lye is dissolved I adjust the valves & inject the sodium methoxide into the oil. After all catalyst is injected, I turn the valves to recirculate & agitate the oil, I set the timer for one hour & walk away. About three hours later the glycerine has settled to the bottom like oil & water. I drain off the glycerine. I wash & dry the biodiesel to try & make the cleanest fuel I can. I pump the finished product into a barrel on wheeled casters. Fueling the truck uses another dedicated 12v pump which pumps the oil through a water block filter & a second 10 micron filter. Next thing you know my exhaust smells like french fries. 

Sounds like a lot work but it really goes fast once you get comfortable with the process. But like I said, it isn't for everyone. I became a total biodiesel kook when I realized we don't need foreign oil, it's good for the environment & 55 cents per gallon doesn't hurt. The savings in fuel will eventually pay for the processor. It feels really good not contributing CO2 to the atmosphere when I drive. It feels even better not funding terrorists .


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## Ted (Nov 12, 2006)

... less CO2 and CO and NxOy's. Certainly you can't mean ZERO CO2. Can you? (I admit ignorance).

Regards,
Ted


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## Tina (Nov 12, 2006)

Thank you for your honestly in your reply, bio. I think it would be too much for me at this point, but I really hope that alternative engines and fuels take off like rockets -- both for the environment, and to get out from under the thumb of foreign oil. 



biodieselman said:


> Sounds like a lot work but it really goes fast once you get comfortable with the process. But like I said, it isn't for everyone. I became a total biodiesel kook when I realized we don't need foreign oil, it's good for the environment & 55 cents per gallon doesn't hurt. The savings in fuel will eventually pay for the processor. It feels really good not contributing CO2 to the atmosphere when I drive. It feels even better not funding terrorists.



I feel the same as you, bio, and applaud you for doing what you are doing. I would feel very good about it, too.


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## biodieselman (Nov 12, 2006)

When I say zero CO2 emissions from burning 100% biodiesel I'm refering to the total carbon cycle to boost my arguments. Plants use sun light energy to fuel the photosynthesis process which consumes CO2 from the atmosphere & soil nutrients to make various molecules including tri-glycerides (vegetable oil). According to the National Biodiesel Board, considering the total carbon footprint, burning corn oil is considered carbon neutral because corn is in the grass family which requires lots of fertilizer, a crude oil product. My exhaust emits no more CO2 that the amount corn consumed making the corn oil including the total carbon used in farm production & processing. Soy beans are a legume, a plant family that has a symbiotic relationship with a certain bacteria that fixes nitrogen from the atmosphere, thus soy doesn't require much fertilizer. When I burn soy oil, I'm slightly reducing atmospheric CO2. 

There is ZERO sulfur in vegetable oil or else your food would taste like toxic waste. There are no Volatile Organic Compounds in vegetable oil, benzene, toluene, ect. Total unburned hydrocarbons are reduced 67%. Carbon Monoxide is reduced 48%. Particulate matter is reduced 47%. New 2007 diesel engines are required to have soot collectors, making them even cleaner. All emissions are halved or zero with the exception of NOX which is increased 10%. Our atmosphere is 79% nitrogen & every time we heat air we make NOX. Honda says their new super clean diesels will use a catalatic converter to convert NOX into ammonia & the ammonia is then used to eliminate soot particles. Hard to believe that future diesel technology will be damn near as clean as a hydrogen fuel cell. 

Biodiesel is the cleanest, safest transportation fuel we have today. Hydrogen doesn't even come close when factoring in the total emissions from the extremely dirty processes required to produce elemental hydrogen. There is hopeful research using bacteria to produce clean hydrogen but the technology hasn't been proven viable yet. I'm not saying biodiesel is the only technology to consider but it's the best available viable option today.


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## Ho Ho Tai (Nov 13, 2006)

biodieselman said:


> Tina suggested I start a living green thread. . . . What are you doing to help?


Great thread, and appropriately tagged 'sticky'. However, I can't help injecting this story from Alternet about a certain humorous complication . . .

It Ain't Easy Peeing Green
http://www.alternet.org/story/44202

A woman realizes that while going to the bathroom ecologically meant peeing on 
trees and lawns, and working with a poo-only toilet, all she wanted was 
something that flushed and that she could sit down on.


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## Miss Vickie (Nov 13, 2006)

That is a GREAT story, Ho Ho Tai. It reminds me that we all have different levels of eco-ness, and we should do what we're comfortable doing. Even doing something is better than nothing, right?


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## biodieselman (Nov 13, 2006)

L.A. Times Nov 13, 2006, pgB1, front page 'Business' section. 
"Wal-Mart goes 'green''" 
Wal-mart has been using a store in Aurora, Colo. for the last year as a trial to test & evaluate green technologies & is ready to release a progress report for this week's international conference here in L.A. on 'green' building. Wal-Mart says "_the goal has never been to build demonstration stores_." Wal-Mart announced they intend to retrofit 6,600 stores around the globe with green technologies. "_By their size, they're forcing manufacturers to come up with more earth-friendly, energy-efficient products, which then become the industry norm." "...Wal-Mart figures it has 130 million opportunities every week - each time a shopper walks through its doors - to encourage people to make money-saving, earth-friendly choices in their own homes and lives._" 

Wal-Mart's sales haven't been growing recently & hopes to attract urban and wealthier shoppers. "_...Wal-Mart may have found a way to kill several birds with one environmentally friendly store. But Wal-Mart says that's not why it's going green. Above all, the retailer says, its earth-friendly initiatives will save the company and its customers money._" 

They're recycling used motor & cooking oil (there goes my oil for biodiesel), for heating. They're saving 85% of water usage by planting native drought tolerant plants. The parking lot is made from special permeable concrete to allow rain to percolate into the soil, not run off into sewers. They're using LED lighting in closed door refrigeration cases, not the typical open display units, that dim when a customer isn't standing in front & brighten when the door is opened. They have had limited success with their solar & wind turbine generators to reduce energy usage; they keep shorting out (damn non-union cheap labor). They are trying skylights, evaporative cooling instead of mechanical cooling & many other strategies. Wal-Mart says "_the company would spend $500 million annually to reach specific environmental goals_." 

"_Wal-Mart has given presentations and tours of its experiments to competitors such as Target Corp., Costco Wholesale Corp. and Food Lion in hopes of winning converts and driving prices down on the new technology._" 

I have serious personal political problems with Wal-Mart being anti-union and using child labor overseas. I resent having my union medical insurance rates skyhigh to offset Wal-Mart not paying medical benefits for their employees. I need help; I'm having a hard time saying 'Yay Wal-Mart.' "_But you can't deny real change and progress and goals, and how much can be accomplished by a company the size of Wal-Mart._" 

I want to believe I'm on a big green wave ready to crash across America, coast to coast.


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## biodieselman (Nov 18, 2006)

Nov. 18, 2006 

Recently it's been high 80's, dipping down to bone chilling lows of high 50's at night in LA. These are left over Better Boy tomatos from the summer garden. I choose tomato varieties from the 'indeterminate' category because they will keep growing until a hard frost kills them. We rarely get a killing frost where I live. While technically a perennial, vines lose vigor after a long growing season. I've trained portions of the stem to bury under a layer of soil. Tomato stems have tiny 'hairs' that when buried will grow into roots to increase growing vigor. I recently removed long pine needles that I swept up off the sidewalks from neighbors trees. The 'free' pine straw doesn't go to the land fill, helps me conserve water & shades soil during hot, dry LA summers. This time of year I artificially warm the soil 10 degrees with black plastic mulch to help stimulate growth during cool night temps. The tomatos won't be as tasty as sun warmed, vine ripe, summer tomatoes but they're 10 times better than anything the store sells. 

I didn't show an experiment that is doing very well so far. I have two smaller beds planted with five different varieties of what's called 'Siberian' tomatos & they also are setting fruit. Tomatos don't set fruit above 95 degrees. The LA Times recommended planting 'Siberian' tomatos late summer for winter harvest in this growing zone. These special varieties were ordered from the Heirloom Seed Trust, a conservancy that works to save genetic diversity. 

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## biodieselman (Nov 18, 2006)

Nov. 18, 2006

This broccoli was started late August from mail order seeds by Dee using 'seed starter kits', tiny little greenhouses. There are five varieties, all selected for genetic traits that produce many side shoots for a prolonged harvest. I planted them into the ground early September & expect to start harvesting early December. These varieties will produce over a long period. About six weeks later a second planting into the ground. Dee & I expect to enjoy homegrown, completely organic broccoli till late winter, early spring.:eat1: 

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## Tina (Nov 18, 2006)

Cute little broccoli. I am not a fan, as when I was younger I worked in a broccoli packing shed, and it grows all over the place here. Too much broccoli is.. too much. I do love it dipped in tempura, fried and dipped in a nice asian sauce, though.



biodieselman said:


> These special varieties were ordered from the Heirloom Seed Trust, a conservancy that works to save genetic diversity.



You answered my question right there. Somehow I knew you would be using Heirloom seeds. I SO miss having a garden. Bio, kudos to you for your garden, and knowledge of gardening. There's nothing more satisfying than eating food grown by one's own efforts. 

Thank you for sharing! I see you have the pic thing down now (Dee, did you post those?  )


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## stan_der_man (Nov 19, 2006)

biodieselman said:


> It's hard being green.



I think Kermit the Frog also said that: It aint easy being green.

Dumb as this may sound, I think there is a lot we can learn by looking back at old technology to be more environmentally conscious. Just using hand tools instead of electric powered ones for example. Ive found that my little Fiskars hand drill drills about as good as a cordless drill, even in aluminum and isnt physically demanding to use. It requires no electricity or batteries (even rechargeable batteries eventually poop out and have to be disposed). The average person has about as much torque in their hand that most power screwdrivers have (the consumer models anyway), and doing it by hand is less likely to strip screws. A well designed hand can opener isnt that difficult to use.

My big pet peeve is how many things now-a-days are battery powered that dont need to be. I think AAA batteries are the biggest scam! They last a fraction of the time that AA batteries do and are only slightly smaller! The physics department at the college where I work goes through so many of them.

A while back, my wife and I went to Amish country in Ohio. I didnt so much look at what the stores were selling but what sort of appliances they had (fans to keep the rooms cool, the lighting, the old mechanical cash registers etc). I think most of these stores that I saw were run by Mennonites (telling by how they were dressed). Most of the stores were predominately lit by sunlight, there were a couple of stores that had hydraulic fans and from what I was told they used diesel power for generators, wind power and hydraulic for other things. From what Ive read the Amish (and Mennonites) arent living in the stone age. I saw a website (that unfortunately I couldnt readily find) that had all sorts of hand tools and appliances. There are some simple ways to greenify ones life, Im trying to myself. 

I like what one of the physics instructors once said: Any cutting device with a power cord is inherently flawed by design.

Ill try to find that website and post it.

fa_man_stan


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## biodieselman (Nov 19, 2006)

I had planned to keep this thread alive by periodically posting about small stuff Dee & I do, trying to be green. Thanks for contributing. You hit upon a post I was preparing for December, hazardous waste & E-waste. We save all E-Waste & hazardous waste to dispose of it properly at the annual round-up. L.A. has rolling hazardous Waste & E-Waste round-ups throughout the county. They hit Diamond Bar about once a year.

It has been illegal in Calif. since 2003 to knowingly dump E-Waste into landfills. Laws have been recently tightened. The EPA estimates more than 4 million tons of E-Waste are dumped per year into landfills. Many people seem to think the electronics industry is a clean industry. HA! Kyocera was an account of mine when I lived in San Diego. It really opened my eyes to see firsthand all the toxic chemicals & processes used to manufacture printed circuit boards & memory chips. 

The main problem with E-Waste,circuit boards, monitors, ect., is that they contain heavy metals. One example of toxic E-Waste is fluorescent light bulbs, which have gases which produces invisible ultraviolet light, stimulating the mercury coating on the inside of the tube & causing the mercury coating to glow. When improperly disposed of the metals leach into our ground water just to return in our drinking water.

You hit upon a sore subject. I see many AAA & AA batteries flattened by cars in the parking lots of accounts I serve. Makes me angry that people just throw them out their car's window after buying replacements at Target. The problem is that many people aren't aware of the growing E-Waste problem or, in the case of my parking lot rant, just don't care. 

I service heavy commercial air conditioning equipment which uses many toxic materials. I also save all the printed circuit control boards & old outlawed mercury bulb thermostats for the E-Waste round-up. 

Another pet subject in your post are the high tech gadgets just for the gadgetry, which don't make sense. High tech devices aren't necessarily best. It is more appropriate to use the right technology when possible. 

fa_man_stan, if you're interested in a seminar on processing biodiesel, PM me (or, if you're down the hill, come by), I would gladly bore you to tears . The invitation is open to all.


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## Tina (Nov 20, 2006)

Stan, I would love that link if you ever find it.

Bio, I don't recall my city having one of those days where one can recycle batteries and such.


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## stan_der_man (Nov 21, 2006)

biodieselman said:


> ...fa_man_stan, if you're interested in a seminar on processing biodiesel, PM me (or, if you're down the hill, come by), I would gladly bore you to tears . The invitation is open to all.



Biodieselman, I'll definately take you up on that! That sounds very interesting as my (gasoline powered) car is giving out and I'm planning to get a diesel sooner or later! I'll PM you tomorrow or after Thanksgiving (loading up the family for the weekend at the moment...)

Tina, one thing I just recently discovered is that you can take your old batteries to most Radio Shacks (I also believe Best Buy is doing it...) and they will properly dispose of the batteries. Sort of like gas stations doing oil recycling. I'll take a look tomorrow (it should be a slow work day...) and see if I can find that website with the hand tools.

fa_man_stan


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## stan_der_man (Nov 21, 2006)

I seem to remember that it was Lehman's catalog that I found, but I thought that they had more hand tools. It was a few years ago... Here are a couple of other sites with interesting things that I found

non-electric and solar and crank appliances:

Lehman's Non-electric catalog:
http://www.lehmans.com/
The biggest all encompassing catalog that I could find.

Solar powered gizmos:
http://www.global-merchants.com/home/solars.htm

Hand powered flashlights:
http://theepicenter.com/hand_powered_items.html

Hand cranked cellphone charger:
http://www.corporatetravelsafety.com/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=53&products_id=144

Hand powered paper shredder:
http://www.engadget.com/2005/01/26/hand-cranked-cd-paper-and-credit-card-shredder/

Solar cooking devices:
http://solarcooking.org/

Somewhat funny, don't know how practical:
http://www.scottevest.com/v3_store/access_solar.shtml

More solar chargers:
http://www.voltaicsystems.com/

Other websites with appliances and misc:
I thought the heat fan was a good idea, circulates heat non-elect.
http://www.backwoodssolar.com/Catalogpages2/non-elec2.htm

Simple power generation:
http://www.windstreampower.com/humanpower/hpginfo.html

fa_man_stan


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## Tina (Nov 21, 2006)

Thank you, Stan, these look like great links!


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## missaf (Nov 21, 2006)

My dad recenly wanted to buy me a battery powered drill. I used a speed handle instead. It took some muscle, but we did it! Of course, I went out and bought a corded Dremel later for something else, but it's the only power tool I own. Not even THOSE are power tools 

Thanks for the info on heirloom seeds. I would love to preserve the pure genetics of plants, and that's a great way to do it.


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## stan_der_man (Nov 29, 2006)

biodieselman said:


> I had planned to keep this thread alive by periodically posting about small stuff Dee & I do, trying to be green.



I was thinking about the idea of "right tech" that biodieselman mentioned. The hardest thing about being environmentally conscious is finding out what is in fact good for the environment. There seem to be a lot of disingenuous products out there, not necessarily intentionally deceptive; things that appear to make sense, but actually affect the environment in adverse ways that aren't so obvious. The example that always sticks out in my mind is the company that I used to work for. For the sake of not being sued for libel, I won't name the company. (I've had a lot of strange jobs, but that's another story...) I was a R&D technician for a label / paper company. They marketed labels that were made out of recycled paper; a good thing. To hold the recycled paper to the backing, they had to use an unusually toxic adhesive. The benefit of recycling paper is obviously lost with such a product.

The whole concept of labels is not particularly sound for the environment either. For every label you see on packages, there is a backing that has been thrown away (most consumer type of labels). Remember the stamps that you used to lick? Why did we get rid of them? They had no backing that was thrown away. Just simple little things like that, that aren't so obvious really add up to degrade the environment and add unnecessarily to our landfills.

Lawns are another thing that is going to require some good thought. I was amazed; grass (of the lawn variety...) is the single most grown crop (if you consider it as such) in the United States. The combined lawns of the entire U.S. could cover the whole state of Mississippi. Most of the grass varieties aren't native to where they are grown (especially in the west). Non-native grasses spreading out into our deserts are the cause of range fires in places that never had fires before (at least not as large) because there didn't used to be grass to lead fire from plant to plant. We use an incredible amount of resources to grow and maintain lawns; fertilizer, large amounts of water, gasoline powered lawnmowers etc. So let's get rid of our lawns and plant drought resistant plants! (This is probably most relevant here in the Southwest and West...) Do you want your kids playing in scrub brush or some other prickly drought resistant plant? With the sprawling suburbs that we have built, we really can't have raked dirt yards like most places in the world have without having increased particulate in our neighborhoods (dust flying when the wind blows). Introduced non-native drought resistant plants may have unforseen consequences on native species (especially planted on a large scale). Native vegetation may not grow so easily in a landscape of roads and fences dividing up the space, and unnatural water drainage. Suburban yards in the Midwest and back East would probably do OK with minimal maintenance if people really wanted to conserve resources. Maybe you noticed that high end housing developments (in the West) tend to look like a snapshot taken out of the Midwest or East, with rolling grassy hills, a creek meandering through, nice green leafy trees etc. The names are even things like "Stone Brook", "Aspen Ranch"; places that just a few years earlier were nothing but scrub brush and oak trees at best. We are creating high maintenance, unnatural environments (The lake communities around Las Vegas NV, another example).

Local biologists just recently discovered that a certain type of non-native flower that people have been planting (I can't remember what) has apparently been having some sort of bacterial reaction with native oak trees in our area, causing them to die.

So what's the point of this? (Actually I'm not sure myself...) Truly doing what may be right is going to require a bit of thinking, but it might be utterly simple in some ways.

If anybody's interested, I'll rant about light bulbs and how they can make a difference in conservation next...

fa_man_stan


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## biodieselman (Nov 29, 2006)

fa_man_stan said:


> So let's get rid of our lawns and plant drought resistant plants!...Native vegetation may not grow so easily in a landscape of roads and fences dividing up the space, and unnatural water drainage. fa_man_stan



The photo below is the cul-de-sac area that the city we live in used to 'maintain'. It's not landscaped & all the city did each spring was spray a heavy layer of herbacide to prevent weeds from becoming fuel for fire. I live next to a large open field & fire breaks are required. The city allows me to use this small patch of otherwise unusable land since I took over the 'maintenance' responsibilities. I originally used this area for my vegetable garden vines. I planted winter squash & pumpkins next to the wrought iron fence & allowed the vines to cover the whole area. Each year I grow enough winter squash to store in the garage for use until spring.

Our neighbors from up the street, an elderly couple from India, stop on their evening walks & we talk. I share summer vegetable excess with them & Manda brings us Indian food that she makes from my vegetables. They mentioned that their back yard was overgrown with jade & agave. I offered to trim it all up & haul it away. What I did was stab a hole in the ground along the asphalt & shoved a stem into the hole. I had to water occasionally the first year until they rooted. Once established, I might on rare occasion water after a long hot dry spell if I feel guilty. The jade is just now starting to flower & continues flowering until late winter. Free plants!

Last winter I spread native California poppy seed. This cul-de-sac was one continuous carpet of irridescent orange poppies. The spent plants are left in place to allow the seed pods to naturally 'ripen', notice the brown stubble. The pods literally pop apart to scatter their seeds. Very few Calif. poppies survive & live throught the summer, you might see a few patches in the middle. We had our first winter rain & soon it will be a carpet of iradescent orange again. Poppies late winter to warm weather, squash vine summer till late fall. Free poppy seeds!

Last late winter I transplanted several plants that are spreading from our pool side Calif. native garden into the cul-de-sac. I transplanted 3 hummingbird sage & five fried egg poppies. These also need watering the first year until established. The native plants are short lived if watered so starting with this winter's rains they require no water or fertilizer. The fried egg poppies are as spectacular as Calif. poppies. There is a profusion of 4" to 5" flowers that look just like sunny side up fried eggs. I will post a second post with a close up of fried egg poppies. Free plants, no water no fertalizer!

The Theodore Payne Foundation has many California natives for all California climate zones. http://www.theodorepayne.org/ 

View attachment resize5.jpg


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## biodieselman (Nov 29, 2006)

Here's the fried egg poppy, also known as matillija. 

View attachment resize7.jpg


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## stan_der_man (Nov 30, 2006)

bio-d,
Thanks for the info. I must admit, I'm basically a hack when it comes to gardening. Native plants that don't need maintenance usually work best for me. Also water is expensive here so plants that require water aren't practical. What I'm looking for here in the mountains are good plants to hold the soil together (anti-erosion plants) for our hillside (basically our whole lot is on a hillside).

The plants that you photographed look great and they appear be good hillside plants. I'm looking for something that is (preferably native) does well in direct sunlight but can handle freezing temps. Periwinkles are common here for that purpose, but they don't do well in direct sunlight (without regular watering), and they are considered invasives by the Forest Service.

When we first moved up here, I was amazed how bad the soil is. (We live in a semi-arid pinion pine forest). Despite having trees over 100 ft tall, and a decent amount of vegetation, the soil is humus (ranging from 4" to 1' thick) with grainy mineral below (like grainy sand). The humus is incredibly fiberous (it obsorbs water, but isn't easily torn apart). Once the humus layer is gone, the mineral erodes like crazy and is offers plants practically nothing. The humus is also a bit acidic because of the pine needles.

I'll check out that website and see what I find.

fa_man_stan


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## missaf (Nov 30, 2006)

Stan, you should look into ice plants -- there are so many different varieties, and since they're succulents, they can do with very little water, like once a week in some places.


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## Thrifty McGriff (Nov 30, 2006)

My own little efforts currently include biking to school every day (I'm sick of biking up that god damned @$#^ing hill on the way home) and most other places. I also use the bus about once a month, basically to go to one of them damn fangled malls. Come winter I plan on walking to school for as long as I can until the Ottawa cold starts freezing my extremities. Mind you with global warming that may become less of a problem. Whether it is real or not, the temperatures in both Niagara Falls and Ottawa have been steadily rising over the last few years, which upsets me. 

I just now started trying to figure out how I can recycle in this apartment building I moved into a few months ago. Back at my parents house we recycle everything we can. Up here I guess I just got caught up in adjusting to living on my own and the university life, and I didn't pay attention to the lack of recycling until recently. 

It would be hard, being a student on a limited fund, but perhaps in time when I have more financial security or am living as a hermit in the Canadian north, I will try to grow some food for myself/scrounge what I can from the forest. I'm slowly starting to eat a wider variety of vegetables but I still don't buy them very often. My diet tends to consist mostly of cheap food like pasta, instant noodles, macaroni and cheese, canned beans, and booze, with a bit of all the healthier stuff thrown in. 

Ideally I'd like to get as many products, food and otherwise, from as close to home as possible. At the same time I'm at a point where I have to save every penny I can since I'll probably be going to the government for a loan before I graduate (3+ years from now). What's a girl to do except go cheap for now.


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## Risible (Nov 30, 2006)

fa_man_stan said:


> bio-d,
> Thanks for the info. I must admit, I'm basically a hack when it comes to gardening. Native plants that don't need maintenance usually work best for me. Also water is expensive here so plants that require water aren't practical. What I'm looking for here in the mountains are good plants to hold the soil together (anti-erosion plants) for our hillside (basically our whole lot is on a hillside).
> 
> The plants that you photographed look great and they appear be good hillside plants. I'm looking for something that is (preferably native) does well in direct sunlight but can handle freezing temps. Periwinkles are common here for that purpose, but they don't do well in direct sunlight (without regular watering), and they are considered invasives by the Forest Service.
> ...




Stan,

I'm biodieselman's wife. I've got a website for you to check out for California natives: http://www.laspilitas.com/. They sell live plants by mailorder, as opposed to Theodore Payne, which only sells seeds by mail. Click on plant communities to determine what zone you're in and then you can have some assurance that the plant will probably work for you. In addition to community, they have the needs listed for each plant such as full sun, how much water/year, what type of soil, etc. I've ordered many plants from them. Unfortunately the area for our native garden is so small, and I tried to cram too many plants in there, that many of the plants were shaded/overcrowded/overgrown by another plant, and didn't make it. I really like this website though. I'm focusing on a hummingbird/butterfly garden (am working towards becoming a Monarch waystation) and this website is very helpful with tips on that as well.


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## Risible (Nov 30, 2006)

missaf said:


> Stan, you should look into ice plants -- there are so many different varieties, and since they're succulents, they can do with very little water, like once a week in some places.



Actually, Missaf, my husband made me write this (he's working on a household project right now, a little matter of a clogged drain  )... I didn't want to shoot down your suggestion. Anyway, he hates the ice plant, calls it a nuisance. See, when he came into my life I was living in a house I'd bought as a single woman and I had everything just _so_. One of the first things he did was eyeball the patch of iceplant I had in the "pool yard," which has a small slope contained by a block wall, and then one day he's out there tearing it all out. I was like, "The bees, where are the bees gonna go?" because they're very much attracted to this plant. I kinda liked it too. But eventually we planted it in California natives and I'm very happy with it now; the native garden is much more interesting, smells wonderful and is more colorful.

He looked the iceplant up for use in Stan's area, San Bernardino mountains, steep slope, fire area, and found that it is, in fact, contraindicated on the County of Los Angeles' Fire Department webpage under Vegetation Management, paragraph Plant Selection. In addition, it is shallow rooted and would require regular watering, especially the first year or until it is established.

What I can personally recommend for Stan's area (the chapparal community of plants) are two of my favorite California natives, ceanothus "Joyce Coulter," and salvia clevlandii, the leaves of which are wonderfully fragrant, especially on a hot day. It is a treat of which I avail myself frequently, to go in the pool on a hot day and breathe in that wild, soothing sage scent. I have both of these in my native garden and they are maintenance free. He probably has lots of room (wish I had more room, I'd plant an acre of milkweed for the Monarchs if I could  ), and could get the ceanothus (California lilac) going; they are large, small-leaved plants with striking blue spires of flowers in the spring. Both of these plants, BTW, are fire resistant, as per the info on laspilitas.com.


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## stan_der_man (Dec 1, 2006)

Risible said:


> Actually, Missaf, my husband made me write this (he's working on a household project right now, a little matter of a clogged drain  )...
> 
> What I can personally recommend for Stan's area (the chapparal community of plants) are two of my favorite California natives, ceanothus "Joyce Coulter," and salvia clevlandii, the leaves of which are wonderfully fragrant, especially on a hot day.



Thanks for the info Missaf and Risible! I haven't had a chance to look at the info about good plants for my area, I've found it to be tricky to find plants that are drought resistant, and can withstand freezing temps and snow. Also our air can we wickedly dry when it's cold and clear, more so than the desert just north of us.

I thought about iceplants, I've always admired how they seem to be the only things that can cling to sandy hills at the beach. Actually my mom (In eastern L.A. county) had some in her yard, but I remember her having to water them often to keep them healthy looking.

The native plants in our yard generally (excluding the larger trees) are manzanitas and grasses in the sunny areas (where the oak trees are), but almost no ground cover (other than humus) in the shade (under the pines or cedars). I'll take a look at the websites, it really interests me what kind of plants will work up here.

Stan


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## stan_der_man (Dec 3, 2006)

Here is my earlier mentioned light bulb rant...

If anybody is wondering how to save energy, but doesnt have the time or money to make a major overhaul in their lives, the single easiest way to do that is to have energy efficient lighting in their homes. I think its something like 10  25% of electricity is used on lighting. Believe it or not, you really dont need bulbs greater than 13watts. You can light large areas (and create decent visibility) for as little as .6 watt! (In theory)

<rant> The big pisser of all of this is that the light bulbs in our stores are purposefully inefficient!</rant> Well, only partially true I dont fully blame stores (and manufacturers) for selling the more inefficient bulbs. There is a demand issue it seems (or lack of). I spoke to a hardware store guy who said that they are only able to sell the smaller efficient bulbs when there is an energy crunch. As rates go down again, people go back to purchasing the more convenient higher wattage bulbs, and forgo the inconvenience of lower wattage incandescents and fluorescents. (Ill get to the disadvantages in a minute)

<rant> This is what errks me, the bulbs that we see in the stores purposefully have short lives! Sometimes you can find long life bulbs for a higher price. It is cheaper or at least equal in price to manufacture long life bulbs than it is to make the shorter life bulbs! There is no counter argument to that! Case in point; Thomas Edisons original light bulb still works, as do a lot of his original design production bulbs that are still around. It took an extra effort for companies marketing light bulbs to create a shorter life bulb (they burn hotter and have smaller elements). They knew that they would sell more bulbs if they didnt last as long. There are some neon signs around that are 70 years old and have their original tubes! Some neon tube benders purposely create less than clean tubes so they have to be replaced every 10 years or so. </rant>


Here is an Edison Bulb for sale:
http://cgi.ebay.com/Antique-Edison-...egoryZ12QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

Ill explain the types of light bulbs, the advantages disadvantages, and my recommendations:

Incandescent:
Its the classic light bulb. Its a glass bulb with a wire element inside. The element heats up and gives off light in a vacuum. The white ones are coated with phosphorus to produce color (frequency) of light that is easier on the eyes. Clear glass bulbs with the element exposed are used for decorative lighting. Classic Edison style bulbs with loop-de-loop elements make candle-like looking light at about 30 watts. The light doesnt oscillate (flicker like the cycling of a TV picture tube), thats one feature that makes them easier on the eyes. Efficient incandescents are dim (many people are annoyed by this) but you can produce perfectly usable light at 15 watts. Example: 3 watts = night-light, 15 watts = bedside lamp, 25 watts = adequately lights up a bedroom (candle like quality), 40 -100 watts = typical house hold lighting. In my opinion anything over 40 to 60 watts is overkill. Incandescents can be dimmed to lessen (control) the light, although thats an inefficient thing to do.

Fluorescent:
Fluorescent lights generally give you more illumination at a lower wattage. These are hollow tubes filled with inert gas (typically argon) most often with mercury vapor in them (literally it can be a drop of mercury in them, thats why breaking them is hazardous). High voltage Neon lights are basically the same as fluorescent lights, except that fluorescent lights are always phosphorus coated (again, easier on the eyes). They usually use argon / mercury gas, and are more efficient (they use ballasts which are basically tightly controlled high voltage transformers that have an initial kick of electricity to power up the efficient tubes and then power down a bit to maintain illumination at an efficient level). One disadvantage with fluorescents is that they need to warm up a bit to reach their full light (maybe 3 to 5 minutes), so they may not be desirable as a pantry light, that you turn on for 15 seconds, grab a can of soup, turn off and close the door. (A 15 watt or less incandescent would suffice). Fluorescent lights cannot be dimmed, they are either on or off. In extreme cold they may actually burn out prematurely or not work at all. For us old folks here remember the old fluorescents that you had to hold the button for about 3 seconds to start and they always buzzed a bit? Modern ballasts are much more efficient. Another disadvantage, being a tube with ballast attached, they are awkwardly shaped. But the new compact fluorescents try to reproduce the shape of a classic light bulb, and come pretty close, unless you have a lampshade that clamps onto the bulb. Fluorescents are generally more expensive because they need ballast. The most annoying thing about fluorescents (they bug the bejeebers out of my eyes) is that the light oscillates (flickers very quickly). This is why computer monitors (CRT picture tube types) really bother your eyes in the work place. Its not the flickering of the picture tubes, or the flickering of the florescent lights individually that really bother your eyes, its what is called the beat frequency that bothers your eyes (it really reeks havoc with my eyes). The beat frequency is the difference in frequency that the CRT computer monitor flickers and the florescent lights flicker. Its basically the light interference that mostly bothers your eyes. That is why LCD (flat screen) monitors are better for your eyes. They are cells of light and dont cycle, therefore not creating a beat frequency with the fluorescents. So if you use a CRT (Cathode Ray Tube  picture tube) monitor (or CRT television in your home) its easier on your eyes if you have incandescent light, because once again, there is no beat frequency bugging your eyes.

---------------Warning  Unnecessary trivia ---------------

Here is some inert gas trivia. Clear glass tubes pumped with different gases (neon tubes or fluorescent tubes, same thing basically)

Fluorescent tubes without the phosphorus coating would be blue, you can see that at the uncoated ends by the electrodes The reason argon / mercury is used is because combined it is the brightest and most efficient.

Helium: Bright peach in color, practically as bright as neon, burns hot, tubes dont last as long. (Anything that burns hot, breaks down the electrodes that contaminate the tubes)

Neon: The classic bright red you see in clear glass neon signs. In cold climates neon may be used with mercury (mercury tends to make things illuminate blue) as a substitute for argon.

Argon: The most efficient of the inert gases. Burns a weak light blue color without mercury, efficient and cool burning.

Krypton: Dim purple in color, but a bit more noticeable than argon by itself, very jewel like color.

Xenon: Dim silver in color, like Krypton, very jewel like.

Radon: Green in color, radioactive, so its generally avoided.

(Last trivia I promise) Some old neon tubes were made with a combination of colored gas and GLASS that was of color (not phosphorus coated). They were very beautiful and jewel like in look. The gaudy colors that you see in typical neon signs are because they are argon / mercury gas filled and have phosphorus coatings.

---------------End  Unnecessary trivia ---------------


LED (Light Emitting Diode):
The newest old technology in lighting. Yup, they are the classic LED lights that are on many electronic devices. Theyre basically little diodes that create light and very little heat. They are even more efficient than fluorescent lights! They dont oscillate (or at least their frequency is so high that it doesnt bother the eyes). They are really good for flashlights and lights powered by batteries because they use so little energy. The downside is that you need lots of these little buggers to create the light you need, and some electronics to manage the power to them (that ups the price of them a bit). Since you need lots of them, they cant easily be focused like an incandescent flashlight that has one focal point of light and a concave mirror around it. They are mediocre flashlights at present, they dont make a very good beam of light. More disadvantages, LEDs cannot be dimmed, they are either on or off. They create a somewhat harsh blue light, not natural to our eyes. As a side note, yellow light is what our eyes see best in. The sun is a bit yellowish. Ever see those yellow vision enhancing sunglass ads? There is truth to it, supposedly while wearing them you see better in the fog Yellow fog lights on your car? Same thing Ironically, insects dont see yellow light as well, they are drawn to infrared and ultraviolet. Yellow bulbs are anti-insect bulbs for your porch or outdoor lighting. Making LEDs more eye friendly and focusable is what they are working on now, because LEDs cant be coated as easily to create a better light. Many cities are converting traffic signals to LED because of their efficiency.

Halogen & Mercury Vapor: (carbon vapor, etc)
BLAAAZIN BRIGHT! BURNIN HOT! SCORCH THE EARTH (or your driveway) WITH THE NEXT BEST THING TO SUNLIGHT! These pups are the turbocharged Hemi of lighting! They are hot-fudge sundaes for the eyes, luminous gut bombs, but man-did-that-feel-good kind of lighting! They are a fuel (mercury) injected incandescent light bulb on overdrive! Woo-hoo, man-made sunlight (with all of the disadvantages of the others combines), except they arent self-powered like the sun. <oops Im ranting> These babies are also the slick looking desk lamps from Ikea that will light your curtains on fire! You can retrofit the bulbs now I believe

Anyway, Ill end my bulb rant with this. I think bio-d-man is right! It always comes back to right technology. You have to be informed and figure out what you want and need. Our science community and we as a society have to figure out what is the best technology with the fewest disadvantages.

---------------------------------------------------

Here are some links that I think are interesting:

The local bulbsperts (bulb experts), weak website, but some good info.

Inland Lighting Supplies
3393 Durahart St.
Riverside, CA
(951) 748-3455
http://www.inlandlightingsupplies.com/lamps.htm


Online stores:
http://www.bulbs.com/

http://www.lightbulbwarehouse.com/

LED bulbs:
http://www.goldengadgets.com/index.php?cName=led-bulbs
Check out the LED floodlight that only uses .6 watts

LED bulbs and conversions:
http://www.ledsupply.com/
Flashlight bulb replacements:
http://www.ledsupply.com/evflbu.php

Antique light collectors:
http://bulbcollector.com/
Check out the "tube gallery"

Museum of Neon Art - Los Angeles
http://www.neonmona.org/
I took their neon introduction class, and learned luminous tube bending and crafting in Van Nuys, CA by the way

--------------------------------------
Misc. ramblings...

30w Edison bulb
15w night-light
25w light lights the room
13w fluorescent = 60 watts of light. Get multipacks at Cosco. Don't buy the fluorescent bulbs with removable tubes, the little ballasts crap out just as quickly as all-in-one compact bulbs...

--------------------------------------

P.S. If you guys want to see my "hillside from hell" that I'm seeking plants for, that will be forth coming...

fa_man_stan


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## Risible (Dec 3, 2006)

fa_man_stan said:


> Here is my earlier mentioned light bulb rant...
> 
> <rant> The big pisser of all of this is that the light bulbs in our stores are purposefully inefficient!</rant> Well, only partially true… I don’t fully blame stores (and manufacturers) for selling the more inefficient bulbs. There is a demand issue it seems (or lack of…). I spoke to a hardware store guy who said that they are only able to sell the smaller efficient bulbs when there is an energy crunch. As rates go down again, people go back to purchasing the more convenient higher wattage bulbs, and forgo the inconvenience of lower wattage incandescents and fluorescents. (I’ll get to the disadvantages in a minute…)
> 
> ...


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## stan_der_man (Dec 4, 2006)

> Risible: ... And this is where I feel our government should step in- not by regulating this- and other energy- industry(s), but in encouraging businesses to provide energy efficient options at reasonable rates. ....



Technically, the government already regulates appliances. I'm not one for lots of regulations per se either, but I don't think it would be much of a stretch legally, or overburdensom if government regulated the effeciency of appliances like they do with fuel effeciency in cars. (Which in cars we could be doing a lot better...) I saw Al Gores presentation at our university, some of our domestically made cars don't meet China's fuel effeciency standards and can't be sold there! Can you believe that?

Even our national standards for safety have been slipping lately. Have you ever noticed the "UL" organization's approval emblems on appliances? (Underwriters Laboratory) The European Union has an equivalent "CE" (I don't know what it stands for off hand...). I have been seeing lots of electronic items here that have the "CE" emblem on them and not the "UL" emblem. I read that Europe's CE standards are equivalent if not higher in some areas and that some companies aren't bothering to get UL approval.

fa_man_stan


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## biodieselman (Dec 9, 2006)

Dec. 9, '06, Los Angeles 

First harvest of this years winter garden! .:eat1: We will be eating broccoli until early spring. There are five different varieties, all selected for side branching characteristics. After the main head is cut, smaller side heads form, prolonging harvest. Also shown is the second planting of broccoli starting to size up. Risible has a third & last planting of this year's fall garden already sprouted. Succession planting eliminates having more food ready to harvest than a couple can eat. Succession planting is a strategy to prolong harvest over longer periods. Garden fresh broccoli is so tender even the stalks are delicious. :eat2: Notice in the background a second planting of Sugar Snap Peas. :eat2: 

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## biodieselman (Dec 9, 2006)

Dec. 9,'06. 

Organic winter tomatoes in L.A. This is a Better Boy variety which is an indeterminant, meaning they have no genetic size limitation. They will keep growing until frost kills them or when they just run out of vigor & growth slows. We have an experiment with a class of tomatoes called 'Siberian tomatoes' & they're looking pretty good so far. Winter tomatoes don't come close to summer, vine ripe fruit but beggars can't be choosers. We have had an unseasonably warm fall to date & the tomatoes have benefited. Winter gardening is a gamble on the weather. Who else has tomatoes in the winter? 

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## biodieselman (Dec 9, 2006)

Dec. 9, '06 

The first fall planting of Sugar Snap Peas is finally blossoming! Shown are the first sign of delicious peas to come. :eat1: The Sugar Snap Pea variety is a old 'All American Selection Winner'. AAS Winner means that seed companies give new varieties to home gardners across the county for trials & ratings. The AAS Winners are chosen from the results of small home gardners in the U.S. Snap peas are like sweet corn in the sense their sugars very quickly start to convert to starches immediately upon harvesting. The taste transformation is extremely quick & dramatic. The old gardener adage is 'get the water to a boil, run outside to pick your corn, dash back inside & throw it into the water just until heated'. Same thing with Sugar Snap Peas. They are so sweet it's almost like eating candy. I know, I know, you're saying 'whatever'. As a child listening to my parents saying 'food just doesn't taste the same' I didn't appreciate what they were saying until I grew food myself in the garden. Freshly picked Sugar Snap Peas heated just until tender with a little butter is light years better than anything a gourmet cook can prepare. 

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## biodieselman (Dec 9, 2006)

Here's a photo of the baby broccoli. My wife, Risible, places the little tiny seeds (the size of the tip of a pencil) in the starter cells. These are held in place by a styrofoam tray which is placed in a tray to keep them well watered. Germination for the broccoli takes just a few days, depending on the ambient warmth. We do have a heat mat inside on which we germinate seeds during the months of January and February using this same starter cell method. After the baby plants have sprouted, they are set outside to acclimate to outdoor temperatures, then transferred into the ground.

A starter tray holds 60 of the starter cells. We usually start about 48 broccoli at a time. Of these, perhaps 20-30 plants survive into adults bearing fruit. The starter trays will last years; the soil-based cells are used one time only, and are usually transferred into the ground. This is an economical and energy efficient way to start seeds. 

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## biodieselman (Dec 9, 2006)

I can't remember the last time I didn't have carrots coming out my, well I won't say. Look at my pitiful carrot crop. Carrots have tiny seeds that require very shallow planting depths to successfully sprout. The repeated cycle of sprinkling the soil to keep seedlings moist & drying causes the surface to crack apart. I mix the tiny seeds with a larger volume of sand to aid in even seed dispersal; sand also helps me see what areas need more seed coverage. A thin layer of nursery potting mix sprinkled to barely cover the carrot seeds prevents the surface from cracking & helps retain moisture. This year's carrot crop failure was caused by two strong 'Santa Ana' weather patterns. The first planting coincided with hot 100 degree Santa Ana winds with humidity levels in the teens. Even though Dee kept the planting beds watered, the tiny shallow rooted carrot seedlings were desiccated & died. I attempted a second planting but as luck would have it, same thing happened, extremely hot, dry winds. Normally this whole raised bed would be a miniature fern forest of carrots, yielding more carrots than Dee & I can eat until early spring. It's too late to plant more because they won't grow well in weather that is too cold. They would languish until warm spring weather & then the plant hormones would signal them to begin flower production. The flowers are beautiful, looking like queen ann's lace, but the carrots are like wood & bitter. Again the varieties are selected for taste & sweetness, not machine harvestable, processing & shipping characteristics. The small carrots are picked for eating, leaving 'shoulder room' for the remaining carrots. Fall planting time is critical. They need to grow to a fair size before cold weather slows their growth, which means they have to be started when there is a chance of extremely hot, dry weather. Carrots can be grown in many cold areas of the country where the summers aren't so hot & dry. They are started earlier to allow full growth before winter. In locations where the ground freezes, gardeners cover the mature carrots with a thick layer of weed seed-free straw for freeze protection. Even in the depth of winter they can go outside, part the straw & pull fresh carrots from the soil. In L.A. I wouldn't have to cover them. Carrots left in the soil will keep perfectly & they are as fresh & sweet as if they were grown in the spring. 

Sure glad I don't make my living farming. One spell of bad weather could wipe you out. I have the utmost respect for our nation's unappreciated farmers. My departed uncle in western Tennessee, who was a dry farmer, had a bumper sticker on the back of his truck "Don't complain about the high cost of food with your mouth full". 

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## stan_der_man (Dec 15, 2006)

I finally had a chance to look at the Las pilitas Nursery website. I really like the feature that you can look up the vegetation for your area by the Zip Code! Next time I head south to San Diego, I want to stop by there.

http://www.laspilitas.com/comhabit/zipcode.htm

Where I live, it seems that the most practical thing to plant will be some sort of chaparral type plant to get some roots onto our steep hillside and keep the squirrels from tearing things up. I've been sprinkling seeds from our cedar trees there (that have been falling like crazy since we had our bark beetle pines removed) on the hillside area. The cedar seeds are little "helicopter" like buds that spin when they fall, it looks cool when I sweep a whole bunch of them off of our porch. Nothing much has sprouted from the cedars in the dry areas though.

We may be high enough in elevation to look at the "yellow pine forest" vegetation, so I'll look into that some more. I would imagine it's too late in the season to expect anything to grow though...

P.S. Biodieselman, what do you do with your surplus veggies? Do you can them, or do they go into the biodiesel makings?

fa_man_stan


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## Tina (Dec 18, 2006)

Bio, what do you think about this? I think it's still problematic, but I don't really know much about it.

I think a cleaner jet fuel would be better, but no matter what, the flyboys are polluting our oceans with that crap, as when they go out to play their war games, they have to fly until the tanks are empty, and often dump them in the ocean when they want to go back. Found this out from the ex when he was in the Navy and we were living on the base. I found that horriffic, especially when thinking about all the jets that go out every day, and knowing that a number of them are dumping JP5 into our precious ocean.
*
Liquid coal: A cheaper, cleaner 21st century fuel?*

By Steve James Sun Dec 17, 1:18 PM ET

NEW YORK (Reuters) - When railroads ruled, it was the sweating firemen shoveling coal into the furnace who kept the engines running.

Now, nearly two centuries after Stephenson's "Rocket" steam locomotive helped usher in the Industrial Revolution, that same coal could be the fuel that keeps the jet age aloft.

But with a twist: The planes of the future could be flown with liquid fuel made from coal or natural gas.

Already the United States Air Force has carried out tests flying a B-52 Stratofortress with a coal-based fuel.

And JetBlue Airways Corp. (Nasdaq:JBLU - news) supports a bill in Congress that would extend tax credits for alternative fuels, pushing technology to produce jet fuel for the equivalent of $40 a barrel -- way below current oil prices.

Major coal mining companies in the United States, which has more coal reserves than Saudi Arabia has oil, are investing in ways to develop fuels derived from carbon.

The technology of producing a liquid fuel from coal or natural gas is hardly new. The Fischer-Tropsch process was developed by German researchers Franz Fischer and Hans Tropsch in 1923 and used by Germany and Japan during World War II to produce alternative fuels. Indeed, in 1944, Germany produced 6.5 million tons, or 124,000 barrels a day.

And coal-to-liquid (CTL) fuel is already in use elsewhere, like South Africa, where it meets 30 percent of transportation fuel needs.

In addition to being cheaper than oil, advocates point out that the fuel is environmentally friendlier and would also help America wean itself of foreign oil imports.

"America must reduce its dependence on foreign oil via environmentally sound and proven coal-to-liquid technologies," said JetBlue's founder and chief executive, David Neeleman. "Utilizing our domestic coal reserves is the right way to achieve energy independence."

In a recent briefing to power and energy executives, Luke Popovich, a spokesman for the National Mining Association, said bio-diesel fuels offer little in the way of reduced carbon dioxide emissions, have enormous production costs and present "serious transmission and infrastructure" problems.

In contrast, CTL transportation fuels are substantially cleaner-burning than conventional fuels.

Popovich warned that the United States risks falling behind economic competitors such as China, which plans to spend $25 billion on CTL plants.

America is "already behind the curve" when it comes to tapping the vast liquid fuel potential that coal offers, said John Ward, of natural resources company Headwaters Inc. (NYSE:HW - news), which builds CTL plants.

He said plants in America would likely each produce 40,000 barrels of CTL fuel per day, with a typical plant using 8.5 million tons of coal per year. In contrast, China is focused on building plants capable of producing 60,000 barrels of CTL fuel per day, he said.

"There is significant investor interest in what could be a major growth opportunity," said Paul Clegg, an alternative energy analyst with Natexis Bleichroeder.

"It is a viable technology, but the question is where do hydrocarbon prices go now? Will we continue to see oil above $40 a barrel forever?"

In October, Montana Gov. Brian Schweitzer and a consortium of energy and technology companies announced the state will be home to one of America's first CTL energy plants.

The $1 billion Bull Mountain plant is slated to produce 22,000 barrels per day of diesel fuel and 300 megawatts of electricity -- enough to power 240,000 homes -- in six years.

Schweitzer and the companies behind the plant, including Arch Coal (NYSE:ACI - news) and DKRW Advanced Fuels LLC, say the production of fuel and electricity will not release the greenhouse gases associated with coal-generated electricity.

Arch has a 25-percent stake in DKRW and the companies are also developing a CTL plant in Medicine Bow, Wyoming. More...


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## missaf (Dec 18, 2006)

I'm slowly buying supplies for my first container garden. Actually, I've been looking around my house for containers that aren't being used, and modifying them as needed. With my new Dremel, I've aerated an old Rubbermaid filing container, two of those huge plastic bins, some old plastic containers that I was using to organize my pantry, and two 5 gallon buckets. Home Depot is having a sale on their orange 5 gallon buckets right now, so I'll be picking up two more of those for potatoes!

The current plan is a salsa garden: tomatoes, cilantro, garlic, green onions, yellow onions and jalepenos. We haven't decided on varieties, but we wanted to plan what to put in what barrels.

And a salad garden: romaine lettuce, radishes, green peppers, cucumber, grape tomatoes.

And I think Biodiesel's snap peas look divine! That's so tempting, too.


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## biodieselman (Dec 18, 2006)

Tina said:


> I think a cleaner jet fuel would be better, but no matter what, the flyboys are polluting our oceans with that crap, as when they go out to play their war games, they have to fly until the tanks are empty, and often dump them in the ocean when they want to go back.


 
Commercial flights also dump excess fuel at high enough altitudes over U.S. soil so that the fuel evaporates before hitting the ground & they dump excess fuel over the ocean before landing as a safety precaution to reduce fire risk in the event of a crash. BTW, I've read that one flight from New York to L.A. produces one ton of CO2, greenhouse gas, per passenger. Speed has a high polution cost. 

L.A. Times, Dec. 16, '06 page C1 

_'A B-52 bomber took off...with all eight of its engines running on synthetic fuel, the first time that a U.S. military aircraft has flown without the kerosene formula... Jet fuel went from 75 cents a gallon in 2001 to $2.01 last year...The U.S. military is the world's largest buyer of fuel, consuming 8 billion gallons a year. The Air Force alone spent $5 billion on fuel last year... U.S. airlines spent more than $33 billion on fuel last year and passed the cost on to passengers.'_ 

The military has been testing synthetic fuel for almost a year now & the commercial airlines are keeping a close watch. The tests have been successful. The fuel used is a 50-50 blend of traditional jet fuel & synthetic. The fuel for the trials was made from natural gas but future fuel will be made from coal using a variation of the Fischer/Tropcsh process. 

On a couple of side notes. The military has been using biodiesel blends in some of their diesel engines already. Coal To Liquid fuel is nowhere as clean burning as biodiesel made from plants or algae nor is CTL a renewable energy source.

Isn't it ironic that the military needs Middle East fuel to fight for stable Middle East fuel sources?


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## biodieselman (Dec 18, 2006)

fa_man_stan said:


> P.S. Biodieselman, what do you do with your surplus veggies? Do you can them, or do they go into the biodiesel makings?
> 
> fa_man_stan


 
I wish I could grow enough soybeans for biodiesel. You would never hear the end of my bragging!  

When I lived in San Diego my house had a much bigger lot than I have now in L.A.. I was a member of the California Rare Fruit Growers Society. The back yard had a small area of grass for the kids to play on & the rest was vegetable garden & rare fruit trees. The front yard was an English cottage garden style mix of drought tolerant perennial flowers & of course, more rare fruit trees tolerant of drought, no water thirsty grass. 

I carefully selected various types of fruit tree varieties that produced at different times over a prolonged season to prevent having too much at any one time. Over the years I've learned to plant multiple small plantings of vegetables every 4 to 6 weeks to prevent having too much at once. I've heard old timers say that if you didn't lose some of your first planting & last planting, you weren't planting soon enough or late enough. It's hard work to can food, I know, my Mother made me help! I don't expect a SSBBW to sweat all day in a hot kitchen, canning food. 

No matter how well I plan, there are times when there is just too much to eat. I share my excess vegetables with several of the neighbors. I hate to see it go to waste. An older couple from India that walks for exercise will return with exotic dishes cooked with my vegetables.:eat2: 

All I have now for trees are two Asian pears, one peach, one navel orange, one tangerine, one lemon & one lime. I'm looking for more room for more trees!


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## Tina (Dec 19, 2006)

VERY frustrating and disheartening.



biodieselman said:


> Isn't it ironic that the military needs Middle East fuel to fight for stable Middle East fuel sources?



Yeah, no lie. We should have had alternative means of energy, for homes, businesses and transportation decades ago, and would have were it not for special interest groups and lobbyists.

And I wouldn't blame you for bragging if you could grow enough soy beans for your fuel! How cool would that be. 

The rare fruit trees sound _fabulous!_ And you're right, canning is a real pain in the rear; some love it, but not I. It sounds like you treat your Dee so well. As I get to know her better I'm finding that she deserves every bit of it.


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## Risible (Dec 19, 2006)

missaf said:


> I'm slowly buying supplies for my first container garden. Actually, I've been looking around my house for containers that aren't being used, and modifying them as needed. With my new Dremel, I've aerated an old Rubbermaid filing container, two of those huge plastic bins, some old plastic containers that I was using to organize my pantry, and two 5 gallon buckets. Home Depot is having a sale on their orange 5 gallon buckets right now, so I'll be picking up two more of those for potatoes!
> 
> The current plan is a salsa garden: tomatoes, cilantro, garlic, green onions, yellow onions and jalepenos. We haven't decided on varieties, but we wanted to plan what to put in what barrels.
> 
> ...




Missa,

I had PM'd you yesterday about your container garden, but Bio pointed out that I should warn you about growing potatoes. I thought that was probably a good idea and that I could give you the example of our potato-growing experiment.

We ordered seed potatoes from Johnny's Seeds, Russian fingerlings I believe they were, and they were kinda expensive, like $16 for a 2-pound bag of these shriveled potatoes. So we cut them up, because its the eye of the potato that you sprout, and planted them accordingly. They germinated just fine and the potato bushes grew beautifully. Many of our garden vegetables mature and then decline between 2-3 months, so you gotta pick the crop at the right time or else they'll begin to wither on the vine or stalk or whatever. They'll be off-peak. So we dug the potatoes up at the suggested interval and they didn't seem to have ripened, and we let them grow for another month or so. We dug them up after that and several of the bushes hadn't produced at all. The ones that did produce yielded just a few of these tiny little potatoes. I thinked we satueed them with garlic and they were delicious. But only about a half-serving each. In fact, the yield didn't even match the number of potatoes we had begun with!

Turns out, potatoes need a specific climate and conditions in order to grow and yield decently. We're not going to try potatoes again. Another disappointing crop was peanuts. Same thing- expensive to begin with, sprouted and grew fine, but little yield.

Tomatos and peppers are best bought at Home Depot or Armstrong's in order to gain time. Most other vegetables are easy to grow from seed. I've found the plants I'm able to germinate from seeds are stronger and better acclimated than store-bought plants.

Here are links to those catalogs I was telling you about:

http://www.parkseed.com/
http://www.johnnyseeds.com/
http://www.burpee.com/

Have fun! We're anxious to hear about the progress! With pictures  !


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## OfftoOtherPlaces (Jan 1, 2007)

What a great thread. I'm going to keep watching this one.

I am a little OCD about conservation in a very basic, low-scale way. Things that I usually do:

--Half of my lightbulbs are the energy saving kind. All of them would be, except I don't light flourescent light as much as incandescent. So I mix them, and then I don't notice the difference as much. And of course I turn off the lights when I leave a room-- it's cheaper.

--I have filled up some empty beer bottles and placed them in the corner of the tank of my toilet. The space they take up means that I use less water per flush.

--I shower every other day, using less water. This is not for everyone, but I don't find a daily shower all that necessary unless I've been to the gym or it's in the summertime and I'm spending a lot of time outside sweating.

--I'm not vegetarian, but I try to avoid purchasing meat. Cattle runoff really pollutes water tables; chicken and pigs do to a lesser degree as well! Fish, I have heard, are not so bad for the environment, so I will often buy that-- it is much healthier than other meats, besides. Soy products are supposes to be healthier for the environment, _but only if they are farmed properly._ If farmers do not rotate their crops, soy beans suck all the nutrients out of the soil and then fertilizers must be used, again poisoning groundwater. Can anyone confirm what I am saying on these things? I learn about conservation mostly by word of mouth, which is not always a reliable source.

--I don't compost because I don't have a garden, but I do throw most of biodegradable refuse out in the woods behind my apartment. It's not much, but I figure every little bit helps, and I already said that I was a bit of the OCD.


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## missaf (Jan 1, 2007)

I'm treating my kid to some fun outside the hotels of Vegas for a change on Wednesday. I found this Living Machine and Cactus Garden at the Ethel M chocolate factory and figured his interest in conservation will be interested in this!


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## biodieselman (Jan 1, 2007)

Say Hello to the Angels said:


> What a great thread. I'm going to keep watching this one...I am a little OCD about conservation in a very basic, low-scale way...It's not much, but I figure every little bit helps...


 
Great ideas. No need to feel that your efforts aren't enough, no one is perfect in all aspects of being green. You do what you can. Awareness itself is a major step. Congratulations for your efforts. Another suggestion I read on being green is 'Spread the word, tell five friends'. 

Jan. 1, '07 

New Year's eve, I finished planting the last of my winter garden. I have ten raised beds, one of which Risible took over from me for her flowers. I stagger plantings about six weeks apart to avoid having too much to harvest at one time. The photo shows the last bed being planted with the third crop of broccoli. 

The first broccoli crop is in full production & I've had only one head with a very minor aphid infestation. Being organic, bugs happen. Risible insists that I wear my glasses so that I can see the tiny little sap suckers. They wash off with cold water. 

My carrots were a disappointment this year. The late hot fall weather took a heavy toll on their sprouting. We have only a few that made it. See Risible's post for pics in the 'Foodee Board' in 'Every day food pics' thread here, #417. 

We have two plantings of the Sugar Snap Peas variety. The seeds for the first planting were eaten by birds. I created a 'Backyard Wildlife Habitat' so that critters would help my with insect control & well, because I love critters. http://www.nwf.org/backyard/. My back yard isn't officially registered because I'm cheap. I don't use insecticide because the birds will eat the chemicals & the American song bird population is already terribly stressed enough from cat predation. I don't mind sharing my food with critters that help me with harmful insects. The second crop looks really good. The first only gave us a taste of what's to come.:eat2: 

I'm still getting tomatoes from the Better Boy variety planted early spring. You can see why I select varieties that are indeterminate. They have no genetically determined size & will keep growing until a killing frost nukes them. The 'Siberian' varieties are looking good with some having fruit with shoulders starting to 'blush'. 

I planted more flowers in bed #1 that Risible had pre-sprouted in her little greenhouse seed starter kits. I guess I like the flowers too. 

We have citrus one each, Washington navel orange, Satsuma tangerines & Bearss lime that ripen during the winter. The Eureka lemon bears year round. 

Well I'm done planting for the year of '06 but we expect to have produce until late winter/early spring.:eat1: The seed catalogs are already arriving in the mail & we're already dreaming of what to plant this spring.:eat2: 

View attachment resize22.jpg


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## fa_foo (Jan 2, 2007)

Thank you for starting this thread and all of the great information.

What drives me nuts, and I try my hardest to avoid, is having lights and appliances on that don't need to be on.

If you're not in the room, turn the lights off. If you're not using your computer for a few hours, turn it off (a standard desktop can use between 250-400 Watts, more than several lightbulbs). Mind the temperatures of your refrigerator and freezer, and try to keep them full, for greater efficiency.

Plan your trips with your car, and when possible, just say no to automobile travel. That may mean adding "moving to a place with mass transit" to the ten-year plan.

Talk with friends, family, and acquaintances about your greenness, or at least your attempts at it. Without being overly confrontational, ask questions to get people to consider adopting new habits.

Oh, and save money on heat at night by turning the thermostat down and snuggling. If you have no current snuggling partner, go get a good one and do your part for the environment.

foo


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## OfftoOtherPlaces (Jan 2, 2007)

fa_foo said:


> Oh, and save money on heat at night by turning the thermostat down and snuggling. If you have no current snuggling partner, go get a good one and do your part for the environment.



Agreed. And on the nights when I don't have one, I just shut my bedroom door and it keeps heat from escaping to the colder half of my apartment (my bedroom is underground and retains heat better). It's also a good idea to seal up your windows in the winter using kits you can find pretty easily at hardware stores or wal-mart.


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## missaf (Jan 2, 2007)

I don't even turn my heater on. I let the heat from cooking be the only thermal induction in the house. I also boil water for moisture in the winter, so the warm hudmidity makes it a little more comfortable.

In the desert summer at 120 degrees, I open the windows at night to let in the 80 degree night time weather, then close up the windows at noon when it's unberable, and run the AC until midnight again.


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## biodieselman (Jan 3, 2007)

A few suggestions to Reduce energy usage. Many you've heard before, and several in this thread, but they bear repeating. 

1. Change the 5 or so most used light bulbs to fluorescent. 

2. Put your electronic battery chargers on an old computer plug strip. Cell phone, portable phone, camera battery, ect. have voltage transformers that consume energy even though they aren't being used. Have a charging station where they can all be turned off by the plug strip when not in use. These are called 'ghost' energy users. Time LED displays, DVD players, home entertainment equipment & all the electronic stuff we have these days use power 7/24 365 days/yr. 

3. Put your computer on stand-by if leaving for a while. 

4. Look for the 'Energy Star' labels when replacing appliances. 

5. Buy fresh not frozen food. Frozen food consumes 10 times the energy of fresh due to refrigeration costs. 

6. Buy locally grown food if possible. Eliminate transportation fuel usage. 

7. Take advantage of local utility company 'energy audits' if available. 

8. Change your furnace filter. I'm serious! 

9. Consider joining 'Stop Global Warming Virtual March'. http://www.stopglobalwarming.org/default.asp 

10. Spread the word, tell 5 friends. 

Does anyone else have examples on how you *Reduce-Reuse-Recycle*?:bow:


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## Ruby Ripples (Jan 4, 2007)

I use low energy lightbulbs in every light in my house, ceiling pendants and table lamps. I use 20 watt bulbs in the pendants (equiv to 100 watt) and 11 watt bulbs in my lamps (equiv to 60 watts).

I have double glazed windows but they were quite draughty so I had draughtproofing felt strips put round them all, and also draught proofing strips put at the bottom of each door in the house. I also have had extra loft insulation put in. Blackout blinds and good curtain liners stop lots of heat escaping in the winter and heat building up in the summer. All of this has made the house much more energy efficient and warmer in the cold weather, meaning the heating doesn't cost so much. 

I know some people don't like microwave ovens, but i make good use of mine. It takes 90% less energy to cook food in it, and veg come out beautifully, keeping most of the flavour and goodness.

If you use an electric kettle for boiling water, always only put the amount of water you need in. Boiling a litre when you only need 300ml for a cup of tea is so wasteful, and takes longer too. 

I dont have a garden, but I buy StayFresh Longer bags to store veg in the fridge, and it keeps them fresh for several weeks so I am not wasting food.
http://www.lakelandlimited.co.uk/product.aspx/!1932_1094_1092

I have tried to give up bleach but I found it too hard when cleaning the toilet (my bad i know!) so I put one fifth bleach and four fifths water into a spray bottle and use that to clean the toilet, spray then scrub. Still better than pouring gobs of straight bleach down the pan.

Some toilet cisterns use a lot of water. A house brick placed carefully into the cistern reduces the amount of water used each flush. 

I dry lots of laundry over heaters or on clothes horses then just use the dryer to fluff them up for a few minutes at the end. 

I never leave appliances on standby, always turn them off properly when not in use.

Very frustratingly I cannot recycle as i would love to, as my local City Council keep refusing to put recycling bins in our bin shelters. There is no recycling station within walking distance of my house and I have no car. I do save all glass and bag it and give it to a friend when she visits to drop at the bottle bank, but with a small apartment and no storage spaces, I cant recycle any more. However i am keeping on at my local Council and contacting my local Councillor and will not give up til we get recycling bins for each building. 

I do believe that one of the biggest things we can all do to help effect a more environmentally responsible attitude all round, is to keep on the backs of our local City Councils to provide recycling stations, bins, information on energy efficiency for householders, etc etc. Pester power is a great thing.


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## Wayne_Zitkus (Jan 7, 2007)

Something like this may make sense for me. I have a relatively short commute (7 1/2 miles each way), so the gas engine would probably never be used.



> *GM shows Chevy plug-in concept*
> 
> _Volt runs on elecricity, uses gas engine as back-up generator._
> 
> ...


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## Zandoz (Jan 7, 2007)

It's a step in the right direction...but it's just too bad they could not apply similar innovations in more practical styling to their choice of show vehicles...sporty is well and good, but it's not the meat of the market, were innovation is the most direly needed.


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## biodieselman (Jan 7, 2007)

Wayne_Zitkus said:


> Something like this may make sense for me. I have a relatively short commute...


 
L.A. Times, 1/7/07, pg C1 

_"...Production of the cars for the retail market depends on advances in battery technology to increase the amount of energy they can store...On Thursday GM announced a battery development deal with Johnson Controls Inc. and Chevron Corp. The companies hope to produce advanced batteries capable of storing enough energy to allow a gasoline-electric hybrid to be recharged from a residential power outlet and run at highway speeds in all-electric mode for 30 miles or more... 

GM executives said they expected the first of their electric cars to be brought to market as early as 2010... 

Although still a prototype, the Volt 'is in serious engineering development...' It would be the first of a family of electric-powered cars and trucks that would use onboard generators fueled with diesel, pure ethanol or biodiesel produced from vegetable matter. 

Despite proponents' claims that that the world was ready for EVs, automakers complained that short ranges and long recharging times made the vehicles impractical... 

In the meantime, Japan's Toyota and Honda developed hybrids that used electric motors with relatively small battery systems to augment gasoline engines..."_ 


Once again, American auto manufacturers are missing the mark and relegating themselves to a small niche market. Japan is ready to kick our ass by emulating the most efficient transportation system designed, an American design, the diesel-electric locomotive. There is no silver bullet, not even biodiesel. We must diversify. There is a small niche for battery-powered vehicles in high-density cities and short commutes, but the majority of cars will require a longer driving range. 

Notice GM makes no mention that 80% of the electrical power for their plug-in cars comes from coal fired power plants. Do you hear any of these guys mention that every 4 to 6 years the batteries have to be replaced? Where will the hundreds of pounds of toxic hazardous waste batteries be disposed?


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## stan_der_man (Jan 7, 2007)

I'm soooo envious of my wifes brother! We just visited him up in the Bay Area (Calif.) last December. He got himself solar panels on his house; they were pricey, about $20,000 (he as an average sized single story suburban type house...). He is able to generate a slight surplus of electricity on average for the year. For the bay area, being somewhat foggy that's pretty good. Just imagine the surplus (or slightly less solar panels) on a house in So. Calif where the sun shines most of the time!

The interesting thing is that he is still connected to the electrical grid, they installed a digital electrical meter on his house that goes backwards when a surplus is generated. In California, the power companies are required to reimburse you for power that you add to the grid, which he does. But unfortunately, it sounds like it isn't required that the power companies actually pay you (cut you a check for your surplus...) they just always keep a running tab. Conceiveably, he is refunded if he sell his house, he is going to check on that...


fa_man_stan


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## Risible (Jan 8, 2007)

fa_man_stan said:


> I'm soooo envious of my wifes brother! We just visited him up in the Bay Area (Calif.) last December. He got himself solar panels on his house; they were pricey, about $20,000 (he as an average sized single story suburban type house...). He is able to generate a slight surplus of electricity on average for the year. For the bay area, being somewhat foggy that's pretty good. Just imagine the surplus (or slightly less solar panels) on a house in So. Calif where the sun shines most of the time!
> 
> The interesting thing is that he is still connected to the electrical grid, they installed a digital electrical meter on his house that goes backwards when a surplus is generated. In California, the power companies are required to reimburse you for power that you add to the grid, which he does. But unfortunately, it sounds like it isn't required that the power companies actually pay you (cut you a check for your surplus...) they just always keep a running tab. Conceiveably, he is refunded if he sell his house, he is going to check on that...
> 
> ...




I'm a big fan of solar power. I understand prices have come down somewhat, even as solar power technology has miniaturized and become more efficient. I'm hoping that California (the state I live in), the local power company and the federal government will make it affordable through rebates/incentives very soon. I understand that there are rebate/incentive programs available right now, but those are drawing to a close. I would like to seriously consider the next crop of r/i, assuming that they'll be available in the not too distant future.

Bio-d wants to get a diesel generator to heat the pool and to run the meter backwards, using biodiesel for fuel, so we're looking to budget that.

I'd heard about running the meter backwards, but I guess I just assumed that payment for the power they purchase from you would be available immediately (kinda like when they bill me, I have to remit immediately?), proceeds of which would go towards pay-down of the solar panel install bill. Thanks for the reality check!


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## missaf (Jan 8, 2007)

Here in the desert of California, we have two solar plants that supply power to the Inland Empire Grid. It sure would be nice to grow some of that power on my own, especially in the summer, when we need it most!


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## XGuy (Jan 8, 2007)

biodieselman said:


> Where will the hundreds of pounds of toxic hazardous waste batteries be disposed?



Siberia.

Besides how long will it be until we have a process to "shoot our shit into the sun." Think about it, nuclear waste oh no's what do we do? Shoot it into the sun.


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## missaf (Jan 8, 2007)

Picked out our first seeds! We picked out things that do well in partial sun (as the sun doesn't hit my patio until the mid-afternoon), containers and the desert heat. 

Alot of things look doubtful for my situation, like lettuce and onions, but after my first real growing year, I'd like to try other things.

Thanks for all the tips, I will be asking more questions after the seeds arrive!


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## biodieselman (Jan 8, 2007)

missaf said:


> Picked out our first seeds!...after my first real growing year, I'd like to try other things.
> 
> Thanks for all the tips, I will be asking more questions after the seeds arrive!


 
Ahhh...the anticipation! Will spring time ever get here? 

I started vegetable gardening out of necessity in the 70's. Geez, I'm old. I had started a new job as a heavy equipment operator & was told I would have months off between construction projects. The ex stayed home to raise the kids & I needed a way to supplement the food budget. As they say the rest was history, I was hooked. Gardening is a very rewarding hobby if you love nature & the outdoors. 

My only suggestion is to start small. It should be fun & not become a chore. As time goes along you'll want to expand & may develope ideas for different methods. Give the kids a small corner of their own to plant. Something easy to sprout & extremely fast growing such a radishes. They won't eat them of course but they will enjoy seeing them grow & having something of their own to harvest.


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## Risible (Jan 8, 2007)

missaf said:


> Picked out our first seeds! We picked out things that do well in partial sun (as the sun doesn't hit my patio until the mid-afternoon), containers and the desert heat.
> 
> Alot of things look doubtful for my situation, like lettuce and onions, but after my first real growing year, I'd like to try other things.
> 
> Thanks for all the tips, I will be asking more questions after the seeds arrive!



Ooohhh! Exciting (to the likes of me, at least  )!

Which catalog did you go with? And, what'd you get?

BTW, you may be able to grow lettuce during the winter months when the weather is relatively cooler. Unless you get snow, then it'd probably not work.


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## missaf (Jan 8, 2007)

It is exciting! My son and I had a nice time browsing the Burpee catalog. 

We ordered:

Cucumber (salad variety) bush hybrid
Sweet Pepper California
Hot Pepper Jalapa (Miniature hots)
Tomato Tumbler Hybrid 
Radish Champion 
Beet Little Chicago Hybrid
Snapdragon Topper Hybrid
Basil Summerlong 
Cilantro

And I just found out my dad has a plot of land at the veteran's home to himself! He said we can plant there, as long as we til the land for him and leave room for his Cherokee tomatoes! We'll keep a container at home, but we'll be spending every day for an hour or so with my dad gardening, so it's a family activity now 

We don't get snow in Barstow, but we do get down into the 20s, and the wind is horrid...



Risible said:


> Ooohhh! Exciting (to the likes of me, at least  )!
> 
> Which catalog did you go with? And, what'd you get?
> 
> BTW, you may be able to grow lettuce during the winter months when the weather is relatively cooler. Unless you get snow, then it'd probably not work.


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## Miss Vickie (Jan 9, 2007)

I'm so jealous. We still have three feet of snow on the ground *whine*.

But I do plan to put in some raised beds this year, as soon as I can see the ground again.


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## missaf (Jan 9, 2007)

You may still have snow, but you can order seeds and start seedlings for before the thaw!


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## Miss Vickie (Jan 9, 2007)

missaf said:


> You may still have snow, but you can order seeds and start seedlings for before the thaw!



Yep, I should do that. Maybe if I had seeds (which I can start indoors) that would inspire to make them little beds to live in once they're sproutlings.


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## andreamoxie (Jan 9, 2007)

i know most have been talking about growing their own food and such 


as for me green design and such i relate to my career

im an interior design student and we just finshed another class on green design which is changing the way we all live our lifes. Using recycled products and reusable products like bamboo are making our world a better place to live in. You can go to your local dump, gross maybe to hear, but you can find great furnitrue products and such, even at your local good will. 

 its all about making the world better for us all.  its actully a wonderful way to help our environment. We have some great exhibits in DC at the national building museum if your ever in the area check them out


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## Risible (Jan 10, 2007)

Miss Vickie said:


> Yep, I should do that. Maybe if I had seeds (which I can start indoors) that would inspire to make them little beds to live in once they're sproutlings.



Miss Vickie,

Bio-d and I love the gardening shows, and I've seen several that featured short-summer areas like Canada and Alaska where they grow spectacular crops. In fact, there is a giant pumpkin named after a Canadian in Nova Scotia (Dill's Atlantic Giant), and I've seen other giant varieties of different crops in Canada/Alaska, so a fabulous Alaskan garden is very doable.

As far as seed starters, I love my BioDomes from Park Seed (see above post for link to Park's website). I buy and use between 240-480 of the cells each year. This method works very well. I also have a seed mat heater, though I don't necessarily have to use it during warm winters. I set the BioDomes with the lid on and vents closed in a south-facing window where they get good, though weak, winter sun. I have my original four BioDomes for five years now and they are still in good shape, even though they regularly get exposed to our scorching summer temperatures. A good investment.


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## biodieselman (Jan 20, 2007)

Go to a round-up!

Diamond Bar City News, Jan 2007
_
"A new law was passed in February 2006 which makes it illegal for California residents and businesses to throw away batteries and flourescent bulbs in the trash. The law includes common batteries, AA, AAA, C and D cells and button batteries, and flourescent tubes and bulbs. The purpose of the law is to keep toxic mercuryand heavy metals from entering our air and water...

Did you know that 70% of heavy metals and 40% of lead contents found in today's landfills are from e-waste? In order to create a cleaner environment for our community, the City of Diamond Bar is hosting an electronic waste collection event on Saturday, January 20...This event is a free service..."_

Improper disposal of e-waste has been illegal since 2003, but not many people are aware of the problem, much less the laws. For a definition of e-waste see here.

I save old mercury thermostats & bad circuit boards from my job to dispose of properly. We got rid of old CTR's, VCR's & other dead electronic devices. I use a lot of flashlight batteries in my job & I dispose of them properly, not in the weekly trash pick-up. You may have to look for businesses in your area that specialize in e-waste collection. Try your city hall or contact your waste management company.

Don't go to jail! Dispose of your e-waste properly. Remember, you've been warned!

A photo from our e-waste roundup visit today: 

View attachment resize25.jpg


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## Tina (Jan 21, 2007)

Good for you, Bio!! I wish our city had such a thing.


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## biodieselman (Jan 27, 2007)

More commercial businesses are demanding green buildings because of economics. My brother-in-law is an architect & says he is being asked more frequently to design energy-efficient green buildings. California requires a special endorsement on their license & if he can't find a certified 'green architect' he will have to go back to school to get certified himself. 

Businesses aren't just demanding green buildings to save energy costs, they are also demanding them to be built with green building materials. GreenSpec Directory is a directory that catalogues companies that manufacturer green building materials. Co-editor Alex Wilson says the number of green product manufacturers has really grown in the last few years to over 2,100 manufacturers. 

One example is a Canadian company called Triton Logging. Triton believes there might be more than 100 billion board feet of trees that were submerged under water decades ago when hydroelectric dams were created. They will use remote-controlled logging submarines to clamp onto a standing tree and attach inflatable floats. With electric chain saws, it cuts the tree & it floats to the surface to be loaded onto a barge. Because the trees are cut, the lake floor isn't disturbed and no sediment is created.

Due to energy & escalating building material costs, economics will drive an ever increasing green movement. As demand increases, the cost of being green will decrease. About time! Green is the new cool.


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## Tina (Jan 28, 2007)

This is a wonderful post, Chuck. I really look forward to seeing the costs come down so that more people will be willing to try buying and living green. For some of us, certain aspects aren't even an option, but I wish it were. 

I'm loving what Triton Logging is going to do. And hey, the wood is already seasoned then, no?


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## XGuy (Jan 29, 2007)

Hmmm I haven't seen any local trends towards building green, only on a residential level. Though I've seen a lot go into advanced water conservation/retention.


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## biodieselman (Jan 29, 2007)

XGuy said:


> Hmmm I haven't seen any local trends towards building green, only on a residential level. Though I've seen a lot go into advanced water conservation/retention.



A 'green' store isn't obvious. Many communities have zoning regulations requiring screening on building mechanical systems. Target is a very large customer of ours & I see a lot of Targets in Orange, L.A., Riverside & San Bernadino. All have Energy Management Systems. EMS systems for Target are controlled from coporate headquarters in Minneapolis. No one in the store has control over the thermostat settings for Heating, Ventilation & Air Conditioning. All HVAC systems use economizers that will use outside air if enthalpy is low enough, instead of using mechanical systems. I spend a lot of time tracing communication problems used to control lighting & HVAC equipment. You won't see them recycle cardboard, shrink-wrap, metal fixtures & garment hangers, but I see the recyling efforts as I walk through their stockrooms. Except for the sales floor, all lighting is on motion detectors that turn lights off when the room is empty. Three stores that I know of have photo-voltaic panels on the roof. 

Target uses low Volatile Organic Compounds for carpet, adhesives, sealants & paint to eliminate outgassing of VOCS such as formaldehyde to improve indoor air quality. They have cut their waste by 70% & have a Zero Waste goal. New buildings are designed to be energy efficient using Leadership in Energy & Environmental Design. LEEDs is something you won't see unless you are working on the building site & see the materials used or understand mechanical systems. The mechanical systems I work on consume the bulk of the building's energy. Target spends a lot of money keeping them in working order & energy efficient, which is good for me or I wouldn't have a job.

I read more & more articles in the paper about commercial buildings converting to being 'green'. It isn't because they are environmental extremists; they are wising up to the fact that they can save money on energy & recycling. Profits are the driving force. Being green only makes common sense.

I posted an article about Wal-Mart in post #32. I've read articles about Home Depot, UPS & others. New construction, replacement of old buildings & tenant improvements are using more energy saving stratigies.

If it's done right, you won't hardly know it's a green building you're in. Get ready, our world is on the verge of big changes. I'm tellin' ya, green is the new cool.


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## Tina (Jan 30, 2007)

I'm glad to hear this about Target, because I won't shop at WalMart unless I am balls to the walls desperate.

Went and read your #32 post, because it's been a while and I had forgotten what you said in it. You mention they are recycling their cooking oil, and then commented "there goes my oil for biodiesel". That made me wonder: if places start recycling their own used cooking oil, what will you. and others who use biodiesel, do?


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## XGuy (Jan 30, 2007)

Bio: I actually work in construction so I think it is probably partially a location thing. The demand for green we know is more popular in California than in a lot of the country. I definitely see it becoming more popular than it used to be though.


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## biodieselman (Jan 30, 2007)

Enjoy a short video explanation of how I can say I don't add any greenhouse gas to the air you breath when I burn 100% biodiesel in my truck.


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## biodieselman (Jan 31, 2007)

Tina said:


> ...You mention they are recycling their cooking oil, and then commented "there goes my oil for biodiesel". That made me wonder: if places start recycling their own used cooking oil, what will you. and others who use biodiesel, do?



I can't find where I read the number, but there are billions of gallons of waste vegetable oil dumped into landfills every year. I'm not sure about most communities in other states, but in large California cities it is against the law for restaurants to pour their used cooking oil down the drain. It doesn't just clog sewer drains, it damages septic systems & public water disposal systems. The best waste oil is the oil with the least animal fat. When I went door to door, if you will, I found many small restaurants without waste cooking oil collection systems. Shame on them. I offered to supply the service for free but they were suspicious. Perhaps the language barrier was an issue.

Responsible restaurant owners pay a disposal company to pick up their used oil for disposal. While some used cooking oil is recycled into several different uses, most is dumped in landfills. I read there are many biodiesel processing plants being built right now across the country to take advantage of this valuable resource. Ha, I said waste cooking oil is a valuable resource. 

Most 'home brewers' don't have an 'inedible kitchen grease transporter's' permit & soon they will be affected as more waste cooking oil is recycled into biodiesel. I wanted to be legal if by some chance I had an accident or was caught by some local goverrnment inspector. I had to get a one million dollar umbrella insurance policy & pay $175 to the state (under the California Dept. of Agriculture) for the license. I have an Indian restaurant under written contract & I'm obligated to collect his used cooking oil. He is currently producing more oil than I normally burn in my truck so Risible's little Honda sits in the garage. Because Cummins is the fuel economy king of all heavy duty trucks & with biodiesel costing me 55 cents per gallon to make, it's cheaper to drive a heavy duty truck than her 'economy' car & the truck doesn't pollute nearly as much. That is still hard to believe.

There is no perfect transportation fuel, not even hydrogen. Biodiesel is the closest thing there is to a perfect fuel.

On a side note, I've got a bad case of the 'want me-s'. I'm hoping to buy a new truck towards the end of the year. Just read in the L.A. Times that DiamlerChrysler will be the first to market a diesel heavy duty truck capable of meeting 2010 emissions standards in all 50 states. A one-ton heavy duty truck with the new clean diesel technology will be eligble for the low emissions tax credits just like a Prius. New diesels will be that clean. Volkswagen will be selling a diesel Jetta as early as April 2008. If new technology clean diesels burned 100% biodiesel they would be nearly as clean burning as a hydrogen fuel cell but won't cost several hundred thousand dollars to buy. What do I keep saying about common sense?


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## biodieselman (Feb 1, 2007)

Tina, I found a 12-minute video of making biodiesel very similar to the process I use, except the system I use virtually eliminates the sodium-methoxide fumes from mixing lye and methanol to make the catalyst. When you get to the end of the video you will see me, just like the guy in the video, driving past the gas stations  .

The restaurant I contract with is producing more used vegetable oil than I can burn while driving my truck. I've been having this brain-fart to make my own co-gen plant in the pool pump yard. I'm wanting to get a diesel-powered generator that is water cooled. I would run the generator 3-4 hours a day to spin my electrical meter backwards while the pool pump is running, because it takes a lot of energy to pump water. I would reclaim the heat from the generator by using the pool water to cool the generator and co-generating heat to heat the pool. Dee would love to go swimming in the wintertime if the pool were heated (especially if we can heat it practically free!).

We're also tinkering with the idea of making a little hothouse to guarantee tomatos and cucumbers in the wintertime by using a little $300 diesel-fired furnace to heat the hothouse.


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## biodieselman (Feb 3, 2007)

*Feb, 2nd L.A. garden update.:eat1:*​
First photo shows the 1st planting of broccoli on the left. Smaller side shoots form after the central head is picked, extending harvest. The 2nd broccoli planting on the right is starting to produce its first central heads. Soon there will too much broccoli for Risible & me to eat. I'll have to share with the neighbors. We have had cold weather recently & the growth of the 3rd planting has dramatically slowed. The top growth will remain relatively small while developing root structure. There will be a warm spell come early spring, and there will a rapid growth surge from all those roots. Broccoli will seem to form overnight.:eat2: 

The second photo shows the 2nd planting of sugar snap peas on the left, which is starting to flower. Well I can see the flowers; you might see two white spots by the support pole. The peas are at least 5 feet high & soon will be bearing the sweetest peas you've ever had.:eat1: On the right are Better Boy tomatoes from last spring. They had a heavy top cover of foliage which was damaged by light frost but protected the tomatoes lower on the vines. You might notice a couple of ripe tomatoes on this side of the trellis with several more on the other side. Yes, I've still got vine ripe tomatoes in winter. 

The last photo shows the 1st planting of sugar snap peas that suffered a severe setback from a late fall heat wave. They are producing a few peas, just enough to tease the taste buds, causing eager anticipation waiting for the 2nd planting to produce.:eat2: Siberian tomatoes on the right, planted late fall, were too small when the frost really nuked them. They had set a lot of fruit, which you might see to the far right, but had no excess top foliage to protect them. I photographed them before pruning the dead growth. If weather cooperates with no more killing frost, with their developed root system, we will have the earliest tomatoes just as others are thinking of setting out spring garden plantings. 

View attachment resize2.jpg


View attachment resize3.jpg


View attachment resize4.jpg


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## biodieselman (Feb 26, 2007)

Ho Ho Tai suggested a tongue-in-cheek post on extreme recycling, burning dried manure for our homes. While most of us go  , this is really a serious topic as Ho Ho Tai said in a PM to Risible. For centuries, & to this day, humans burn dried manure for heating & cooking. Burning dried manure has very little foul smell, if any. Native Americans taught early plains pioneers to burn dried buffalo chips for cooking & warmth. I have cattle in the open field behind our home, but I don't think Risible will allow me to hop over the fence to collect cow chips to burn in our fireplace on cold winter nights. 

There are a lot of cattle feed lots in Imperial Valley, California. When I went camping at Glamis I drove by a full scale experimental manure-fired power plant. It has been mothballed because of several problems, one of which is that the silica in straw doesn't burn. The silica collects in big deposits that break off the smoke stack & fall back into the furnace, causing damage. This technology doesn't appear practical. Manure digesters are another solution, marginally effective, but no one wants to live next to one.

New clean burning diesel powered cars, which will be appearing very soon in your showroom floors, use urea (ammonia) to control NOX emissions. Much like Mercedes Bluetek technology, promisingTexas A&M research uses cow manure as an ammonia source to remove 90% of NOX from coal fired power plants. America has plenty of coal energy, but coal emissions are very dirty. America has a serious pollution problem with feed-lot manure streams. This technology would solve three problems: American dependence on terrorist oil, manure pollution & cleaning up coal fired power plants.

I personally would like to see algae ponds fed with manure & coal power plant emissions to produce algae/biodiesel. I would be all for coal fired power plants if these two technologies can clean up dirty coal emissions & get us out of the Middle East all together.

Thanks Ho Ho Tai for your suggestion.


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## HottiMegan (Feb 26, 2007)

fa_man_stan said:


> I was thinking about the idea of "right tech" that biodieselman mentioned. The hardest thing about being environmentally conscious is finding out what is in fact good for the environment. There seem to be a lot of disingenuous products out there, not necessarily intentionally deceptive; things that appear to make sense, but actually affect the environment in adverse ways that aren't so obvious. The example that always sticks out in my mind is the company that I used to work for. For the sake of not being sued for libel, I won't name the company. (I've had a lot of strange jobs, but that's another story...) I was a R&D technician for a label / paper company. They marketed labels that were made out of recycled paper; a good thing. To hold the recycled paper to the backing, they had to use an unusually toxic adhesive. The benefit of recycling paper is obviously lost with such a product.
> 
> The whole concept of labels is not particularly sound for the environment either. For every label you see on packages, there is a backing that has been thrown away (most consumer type of labels). Remember the stamps that you used to lick? Why did we get rid of them? They had no backing that was thrown away. Just simple little things like that, that aren't so obvious really add up to degrade the environment and add unnecessarily to our landfills.
> 
> ...



This post reminds me of the complaint i had the other day when I bought a camera at Costco. I needed a new one because my old one was hurting my neck when we'd go on outings (big bulky professional camera). So my goal was a compact camera that took good video and pics. I buy this camera and it comes in this HUGE box (that i will reuse but still). Inside the huge box was a small box that was about the size of a baby's shoe box and it held my camera that isn't much bigger than a cell phone. I can understand using the big box for a display and they give you the small box at a security check point. The packaging has gotten insane with a lot of electronics these days.


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## HottiMegan (Feb 26, 2007)

This is a neat thread. I have been working on becoming more of a green household for the last two months...
It all started with me becoming a vegan. Stopping the consumption of animal products really lessen my environmental foot print. I keep 3-4 chico bags in my purse at all times in case i decide to go shopping while i'm out. (http://www.chicobag.com/) I try not to buy any proccessed foods so that reduces my trash output, and it's healthier. I reuse paper and buy recycled paper. I recycle every box and piece of paper as well as cans. I live in an apartment that is pretty good at recycling. I have noticed that my trash output is way less considering that most of the food i buy is veggies and fruit. I also hit the local farmers market to support local organic farmers.

I am soooo looking forward to owning my own home so i can have a garden. I was super jealous of my brothers HUGE organic garden.

Oh and all lights in my home are the energy saving bulbs. It's a dimmer light but my husband prefers mole like settings. I really noticed the savings in my energy bills.


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## magnoliagrows (Feb 26, 2007)

biodieselman said:


> . However, we do have to go out of our way to recycle all our used electronics. Did you know E-waste & batteries are considered hazardous toxic waste? The heavy metals in electronics leaches out of land fills & poisons our drinking water. E-waste is having a huge detrimental impact on the environment but not many people dispose of E-waste properly. ?



Do you know what to do with a broken TV?


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## XGuy (Feb 26, 2007)

magnoliagrows said:


> Do you know what to do with a broken TV?



Break it in to tiny peices and siphon it out your pant leg at work.


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## biodieselman (Feb 26, 2007)

magnoliagrows said:


> Do you know what to do with a broken TV?



I've been meaning to post on e-waste again to help keep the Living Green thread alive. Allow me to thank you for showing concern & helping to reduce pollution.

I hope these web sites & information are helpful to you. The Consumer Electronics Assn. will provide a calendar of recycling events sponsered by retailers and local governments at www.mygreenelectronics.org. There is a 'Find Recycling' search feature on the first page, to the left.

More & more city governments are operating programs or have information for proper hazardous waste disposal. If this web site doesn't help you could call your local city hall or electronics retailer for location near you. Best Buy is starting to accept discarded cell phones, batteries & inkjet cartridges.

In California people can search www.erecycle.org for e-waste information.

L. A. Times, 22 Feb, 2007, pg B1

_Enough with the dillydallying. it's time to get the lead out....

The experts are attending the Printed Circuits Expo at the LA Convention Center. The six-day conference, sponsered by the trade group IPC, ends today with seminars on intergrated circuits and manufacturers' demonstrations of a new breed of environmentally friendly computer innards...

At issue is the use of solder in the production of circuit boards._

_The silvery...tin-lead alloy has been used to securely connect wires since...the 1920s. Since the 1950s, solder also has routinely been used to cover circuit boards' minute strands of copper. But new European manufacturing standards ban the use of solder with lead in it. Three U.S. states, including California, are considering doing the same. And experts were predicting Wednesday that the United States might not be far behind._

Increasing focus is being brought to bear on environmentally unfriendly, hazardous industrial chemicals. Many products will soon change. Europe is leading the way on eliminating hazardous industrial chemicals used to produce manufactured goods & if America expects to sell their manufactured goods in Europe, we'll have to change also. The environment will be a winner & so will we.

I know I'm repeating myself, but I'll say it one more time, the greening of all industries across the board & the greening of our personal lives is picking up more & more speed each year. Big changes are coming & they are coming sooner than you think.

Green is the new cool.


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## stan_der_man (Feb 27, 2007)

HottiMegan said:


> ... I buy this camera and it comes in this HUGE box (that i will reuse but still). Inside the huge box was a small box that was about the size of a baby's shoe box and it held my camera that isn't much bigger than a cell phone. I can understand using the big box for a display and they give you the small box at a security check point. The packaging has gotten insane with a lot of electronics these days.



It's funny with all of the packaging. From what I've read, and learned from a place where I used to work, a lot of it is related to marketing. They've done research that people will pay more for something in a bigger package. Arguably, a digital camera needs some additional protection around it to keep it from getting damaged. But software (that's on a CD or DVD ROM) is packaged in larger containers for the above marketing consideration; research has shown that a larger package makes a person think they are getting more and they are willing to pay more. (Also, software is put into book sized containers so it sits on a shelf better...) There is also "legacy" packaging. DVDs, that are much smaller than the packaging that they come in, are in containers that are the same size as VHS tapes, so that people with large VHS collections can put DVDs in the same cabinets as VHS tapes. Audio CDs were put into smaller "jewel cases" because the size difference from an LP was so different that marketers considered it unnecessary to recreate a LP sized container.



HottiMegan said:


> ... I keep 3-4 chico bags in my purse at all times in case i decide to go shopping while i'm out. (http://www.chicobag.com/) I try not to buy any proccessed foods so that reduces my trash output, and it's healthier. I reuse paper and buy recycled paper. ...



In Germany when you go to the grocery stores, most people bring their own bags because you have to purchase a paper or plastic bag if you don't have your own container. I can see that happening in the U.S. sooner or later if we continue to use our resources in a wasteful manner.

Stan


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## XGuy (Feb 27, 2007)

It's all too complicated and confusing for me, I just never throw my electronics away, I have in various levels of completion probably 8 computers. I traded all my old monitors to some indians for fireworks  

Thats what I call recycling! :smitten:


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## HottiMegan (Feb 27, 2007)

fa_man_stan said:


> It's funny with all of the packaging. From what I've read, and learned from a place where I used to work, a lot of it is related to marketing. They've done research that people will pay more for something in a bigger package. Arguably, a digital camera needs some additional protection around it to keep it from getting damaged. But software (that's on a CD or DVD ROM) is packaged in larger containers for the above marketing consideration; research has shown that a larger package makes a person think they are getting more and they are willing to pay more. (Also, software is put into book sized containers so it sits on a shelf better...) There is also "legacy" packaging. DVDs, that are much smaller than the packaging that they come in, are in containers that are the same size as VHS tapes, so that people with large VHS collections can put DVDs in the same cabinets as VHS tapes. Audio CDs were put into smaller "jewel cases" because the size difference from an LP was so different that marketers considered it unnecessary to recreate a LP sized container.



I like how EA games are packaging in small packages these days. Many times there is no cardboard to the packaging. My husband and I are big time game players and i have always hated how much packaging is in software.





> In Germany when you go to the grocery stores, most people bring their own bags because you have to purchase a paper or plastic bag if you don't have your own container. I can see that happening in the U.S. sooner or later if we continue to use our resources in a wasteful manner.
> 
> Stan



I get 3 cents back on every bag i bring in on my own at most grocery stores here. I also like the fact that I don't have to find alternative uses for the plastic bags from grocery shopping. I think they should charge for bags.. and that money should go to maintaining recycling programs.


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## Tina (Feb 27, 2007)

I either use the plastic grocery bags for trash, or recycle them. I've been considering bringing them back to the store so I can re-use them, but keep forgetting to put them in my purse. :huh:


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## magnoliagrows (Feb 27, 2007)

biodieselman said:


> I hope these web sites & information are helpful to you. The Consumer Electronics Assn. will provide a calendar of recycling events sponsered by retailers and local governments at www.mygreenelectronics.org. There is a 'Find Recycling' search feature on the first page, to the left.
> 
> More & more city governments are operating programs or have information for proper hazardous waste disposal. If this web site doesn't help you could call your local city hall or electronics retailer for location near you. Best Buy is starting to accept discarded cell phones, batteries & inkjet cartridges.



Thanks. The website showed that the closest place to Chicago was in Wisconsin. I called the city. For anyone else in Chicago in a similar situation: You have to take it to the drop off facility for household hazardous waste at 1150 N. North Branch. The hours of operation are Tuesday 7-12, Thursday 2-7 and the 1st Saturday of every month from 8-3. 

Thanks for your help Biodieselman (sounds like a super hero name  )


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## biodieselman (Feb 27, 2007)

Spring is around the corner. The monarch buterflies that enjoyed our mild California costal winters are starting their migration towards the Rockies with spring weather following right behind their arrival in your neighborhood. Time to think about ordering your seeds. Johnny's, Park and Burpee are my favorite seed houses. I in particular like Johnny's because they offer growing information such as sowing time, seeding method, soil temperatures & plant spacing.


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## stan_der_man (Feb 28, 2007)

This spring as soon as the snow melts I'm planning to be the Johnny Appleseed of cedar trees on our denuded hillside. I have a whole bunch of little cedar sprouts growing in places where they aren't needed so I'm going to transplant them in hope that some will take root.

Any tips for transplanting?

fa_man_stan


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## biodieselman (Feb 28, 2007)

fa_man_stan said:


> This spring as soon as the snow melts I'm planning to be the Johnny Appleseed of cedar trees on our denuded hillside. I have a whole bunch of little cedar sprouts growing in places where they aren't needed so I'm going to transplant them in hope that some will take root.
> 
> Any tips for transplanting?
> 
> fa_man_stan



Stan, I looked up 'cedar' in in 'Sunset Western Garden Book' & it didn't list native species for the San Bernardino Mts. Generally it's better to move conifers when small, still dormant or semidormant. Cool weather is best after soil has warmed up in spring. The loss of some roots isn't a critical when the tree is dormant.

Several days before the move, thoroughly soak the soil around the tree so that the digging will be easy & the root ball will hold together.

Prepare the new planting hole before digging up the tree to be moved; that way you can move the tree as quickly as possible so the roots will not dry out. Dig the new planting hole twice as wide as the root ball & 6 inches deeper.

The bigger the tree the more soil you will have to dig up. Mark a circle around the tree that is 10 times bigger than the (or larger if practical) the diameter of the tree trunk at ground level. Use a sharp spade to cut the roots as you cut around the mark going as deep as the spade's depth. This will encourage a new set of feeder roots where you root pruned; and the shock of losing roots will be minimized. Here is where the work comes in. Dig all around outside the circle, leaving the majority of roots the tree will depend on intact forming a root ball.

If you're moving a larger tree & root ball is big, wire tie 1" or smaller chicken wire to wrap the root ball tight. Slice under the root ball with a spade or mattock. Really try not to use the trunk as a handle, instead lift the root ball. If you're moving a large root ball get help (call me if you need help, I've got tools & work doesn't scare me) or slide plywood under the root ball to slide on over to the new hole.

Plant at the same depth. Add one shovel full of well composted organic amendment to three shovel fulls of native soil. Form a encircling ridge to hold water in the basin formed. 

Particularly with evergreens it would be wise to first spray the foliage with an antidesiccant spray. The spry will cut down water loss during the first monts the new roots are forming. Don't over water, just keep the soil moist for the first year. After the first year, just let it grow.

Piece of cake, right?


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## biodieselman (Mar 5, 2007)

Heard an ad on the radio today. The Salvation Army is an official E-Waste recycler in southern California. I'm not sure if the Salvation Army in your city is doing the same.

When I still lived in San Diego, The Salvation Army main office headquarters in down town was one of our accounts. The parking lot didn't have a single Mercedes, BMW or Lexus. They were all Toyotas, Hondas and such. The executives didn't have expensive suits & they all were extremely nice people. The facility wasn't extravagant, instead it was clean & functional. The Salvation Army is about the only charity we give to. I was relieved to see this first hand.


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## Tina (Mar 6, 2007)

Thanks for sharing, Bio. I've still been looking for a place to turn in my batteries.


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## stan_der_man (Mar 8, 2007)

Tina said:


> Thanks for sharing, Bio. I've still been looking for a place to turn in my batteries.



Tina, I was under the impression that electronic stores (that sell batteries) were required to be disposal sites, such as Radio Shack, Best Buy, or other places. I believe all Radio Shacks in California accept old batteries, I know that the one in Highland CA does.

Bio-d, Just a quick revisit of my question... Our cedar trees are called "Incense-Cedar" or "Calocedrus decurrens". I went to the ranger station and purchased a book about native trees and bushes of the SanBerdoo NF. According to the book these trees aren't really cedars, thus the hyphenated name and probably why you didn't find them in your listing as cedars. I'm going to take your advice and try a replant this Sunday if you don't think it's too early (the snow is gone and the ground isn't so dry yet...)

fa_man_stan


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## biodieselman (Mar 8, 2007)

fa_man_stan said:


> ...Our cedar trees are called "Incense-Cedar" or "Calocedrus decurrens". I went to the ranger station and purchased a book about native trees and bushes of the SanBerdoo NF. According to the book these trees aren't really cedars, thus the hyphenated name and probably why you didn't find them in your listing as cedars...fa_man_stan



Hurry before warm weather arrives & trees are still in dormancy. They should do well but not too close to the house.

Incense cedar; Calocedrus decurrens; (Libocedrus decurrens)

Evergreen. Symmetrical tree 75' to 90' with dense, narrow, pyramidal crown; trunk with reddish brown bark. Rich green foliage in flat sprays. Tree gives pungent fragrance in warm weather. Small, yellowish brown to reddish brown cones which, when open, look like duck's bills.

Although slow growing at first, once established it may grow 2 ft./yr. Deep but infrequent watering in youth will make it unusually drought tolerant when mature. Takes blazing summer heat. Tolerates poor soils. Good tree to make green wall, high screen, windbreak. common on the Yosemite Valley floor, this tree has been seen by millions.


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## biodieselman (Mar 17, 2007)

Hooked up the old flatbed trailer to pick up 7,000 pounds of composted chicken manure for the spring garden. The old straight-six-Cummins burning 100% biodiesel had no problem pulling my loaded trailer up the hills from the sand & gravel yard. 

I don't use chemical fertilizer on the vegetable garden. Digging lots of composted manure into the soil each year has over time made the soil rich & black, full of organic material. Southern California has the sun & climate but not the water & soil. I can fix the water & soil. Having sun, climate, water & rich soil makes gardening all year round easy. 

I had better get busy & dig in the chicken manure because Risible doesn't like the smell. Some in Hyde Park might believe that I'm real good at spreading manure around. 

Before I forget, some of you guys were making jokes about my carrots in some other green thread in the Lounge. I can't keep up with you youngins so could you remind me what the joke is all about? 

View attachment resize3.jpg


View attachment resize6.jpg


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## Tina (Mar 17, 2007)

biodieselman said:


> I had better get busy & dig in the chicken manure because Risible doesn't like the smell. Some in Hyde Park might believe that I'm real good at spreading manure around.



Yikes. I don't blame her. That stuff smells beyond putrid. Was a chicken farm off the local interstate. It's been gone for years and it still stinks. Great fertilizer if you can stand the smell.



> Before I forget, some of you guys were making jokes about my carrots in some other green thread in the Lounge. I can't keep up with you youngins so could you remind me what the joke is all about?



As if you need the 'splainin'!


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## biodieselman (Mar 25, 2007)

_BERKELEY  Global energy firm BP announced today (Thursday, Feb. 1) that it has selected the University of California, Berkeley, in partnership with Lawrence Berkeley National Laboratory (LBNL) and the University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign, to lead an unprecedented $500 million research effort to develop new sources of energy and reduce the impact of energy consumption on the environment. 

The funding will create the Energy Biosciences Institute (EBI), which initially will focus its research on biotechnology to produce biofuels  that is, turning plants and plant materials, including corn, field waste, switchgrass and algae, into transportation fuels... 

"Our new institute will combine the best qualities of individual genius in our faculty and staff with the capability to form teams that can rapidly explore bold approaches that are well beyond the reach of a single investigator or a single discipline."...

The BP grant dovetails with new energy initiatives at LBNL and UC Berkeley that include the Helios Project and a proposed bioenergy research center, which is in the running for U.S. Department of Energy grants that nationwide would total $250 million. Both projects are devoted to developing sustainable, carbon-neutral sources of energy, such as biomass conversion, which is inherently carbon-neutral...

...California will lead in energy research on clean sustainable alternative energy sources."_

At last, research to mass produce my fuel of choice, biodiesel. I don't think the money I've invested in my 'personal refinery' will be wasted though. Somehow I don't think BP will produce & sell biodiesel for 55 cents per gallon. 

Who says you have to sacrifice anything to be green  .

On a side note, I am developing a bad case of the "want-me's". I bought a diesel truck in 1990 because a Cummins has a nominal life of 350,000 miles & has been known to run a million miles before needing rebuilding. I was trying to be green back then, knowing that diesels get 40% better fuel economy than gasoline. Plus the knowledge that it takes a tremendous toll on earth's resources to produce each new vehicle, with a long engine life expectancy I had hoped to keep this truck over twenty years. But unfortunately a car parked next to me at college caught fire & the ole truck hasn't been the same since. Plus Risible hates my truck. 

America finally changed to Ultra Low Sulfur Diesel last summer like Europe did years ago. This enabled the use of soot collectors & catalytic converters to make diesel exhaust as clean as a gasoline powered engine. I was sceptical about how clean burning new technology had made diesels. The new 2007 6.7l Cummins meets 2010 smog emission standards today. We went to look at a new truck last weekend but couldn't drive one yet because they had just arrived & weren't checked out for test drives yet.

Diesels have a poof of soot when they start, a little soot until thoroughly warmed up & some soot if you stomp on the throttle. I intentionally stood at the exhaust pipe when the salesman started the engine & let it idle for us to hear how quiet the new Cummins is. There was absolutely no soot at all! I not only couldn't believe how clean the exhaust is but it was also as quiet or quieter as a gasoline engine.

The salesman remarked that they were embarassed when they went to park the truck in the lot. It seems that 350hp & Cummins producing 650lbs of torque just above a idle will make a truck lay rubber for twenty feet no problem. Now I've really got the "want-me's"!


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## biodieselman (Apr 2, 2007)

If Uncle Sam won't act to reduce greenhouse gas vehicle emissions, then I guess the states will have to be the responsible ones to act as stewards of the environment.

_San Francisco Chronicle
Monday, April 2, 2007

WASHINGTON - The Supreme Court rejected the Bush administration's hands-off approach to global warming today in a ruling that pushes the federal government toward curbing greenhouse gas emissions from autos and strengthens the position of California and other states that want to regulate vehicles on their own. 

The 5-4 decision said carbon dioxide and other heat-trapping gases emitted from tailpipes are "air pollutants' covered by the Clean Air Act of 1970 -- rebuffing the Environmental Agency's view that it lacked authority to regulate those emissions. And though the court stopped short of ordering the EPA to set mandatory limits, the justices rejected the Bush administration's claim that voluntary programs were an effective substitute. 

"Under the clear terms of the Clean Air Act, EPA can avoid taking further action only if it determines that greenhouse gases do not contribute to climate change or if it provides some reasonable explanation as to why it cannot or will not exercise its discretion to determine whether they do,'' said Justice John Paul Stevens in the majority opinion. 

He said the EPA's justifications for inaction -- that voluntary measures were adequate, that mandatory regulation might hamper Bush's negotiations with nations like China and India on emissions reduction, and that vehicle emissions were only one piece of the puzzle -- did not add up to a "reasonable explanation for its refusal to decide whether greenhouse gases cause or contribute to climate change.'' _

Yet another example of the federal government being out of touch with most American citizens.


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## James (Apr 3, 2007)

biodieselman said:


> The steps to being green is a huge topic & I've only mentioned a few examples. What are you doing to help?



Its easier since i've got my own place as I can set the rules about this and my tenants must respect ma authoritay! 

All vegetable waste is composted and the compost is used to help grow stuff in the garden and greenhouse

All tins, bottles, plastic and card are re-cycled (our local authority provides the bins for this)

All lights are low energy bulbs. 

The attic is fully insulated and all doors are fitted with draft excluders.

I buy as much local produce as possible to minimise on food miles.

I volunteer for conservation work.

My job... I project manage a conservation project.

I carpool to work each day. 

I drive a go cart that does 50+ mpg (but I gotta admit that I'm thinking of getting a bigger car)


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## biodieselman (Apr 3, 2007)

James said:


> Its easier since i've got my own place as I can set the rules about this and my tenants must respect ma authoritay! ...QUOTE]
> 
> Wow! Impressive. The world could use a lot more people like you. We all thank you for your efforts.
> 
> ...


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## James (Apr 4, 2007)

biodieselman said:


> James said:
> 
> 
> > Three years ago I installed a whole house fan. Our utility company gives rebates for energy conservation upgrades & since I installed it myself, a $150 fan cost us $25 after the rebate.
> ...


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## Tina (Apr 5, 2007)

Now that's the life, Bio!! I really like the way you and Ris live. What with the bio-diesel truck, the gardens, the pool, and everything else you do to conserve and be as energy-independent as possible, it is how I would want to live had I the options to do so.

I admire what you're doing, too, James. Is conserving widespread where you live?


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## Rosie (Apr 5, 2007)

James said:


> biodieselman said:
> 
> 
> > This is the kind of initiative that I admire. A utilities company that gives you an incentive to make your own (good) choice. I bought my composter at a 75% reduction from my water company... I believe that they got a subsidy from the government for making that offer available to me...
> ...


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## GenericGeek (Apr 6, 2007)

Rosie said:


> James said:
> 
> 
> > I don't see what the problem is with putting veggie and fruit peelings etc in the landfill - it just breaks down anyway. No different than digging it into your garden. It's the stuff that doesn't break down that's the issue.
> ...


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## Rosie (Apr 8, 2007)

GenericGeek said:


> Rosie said:
> 
> 
> > My guess is that it has to do with how much it costs to transport the "compostables" to the nearest landfill that's still open. In many places (Seattle, for instance), all the local landfills have been shut down for many years, and garbage has to transported hundreds of miles for disposal. So even the stuff that DOES break down poses a problem, just because it's -- stuff!
> ...


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## James (Apr 11, 2007)

Tina said:


> I admire what you're doing, too, James. Is conserving widespread where you live?



Pretty much...

Well its definitely gaining momentum... most local authorities run door to door recycling collections and they give you 2 swing-bins for your trash. The non-recycling bin is purposely smaller, thus forcing people to think about what they throw away. The locals grumbled at that one to start with but its caught on with most people now and re-cycling has gone through the roof here...

the initiatives like free/cheap composters being subsidised have sprung out of some extremely punititative waste legislation that came as the "Landfill Directive" (a European directive) which was then transposed into UK law a few years ago. What this has effectively done is led to the strict streaming and separations of wastes... and... more importantly, raised the costs of landfill, especially for re-cycleable or toxic wastes... The effect of this is that its more economic for landfill users (local authorities/industry etc) to consider more environmentally friendly options.... that, along with the fact that we are running out of landfill space on our little island here and super-strict planning laws sorta prevent new landfills being created... not to mention the NIMBY efffect.

As for the other aspects of conservation, there is a widespread "belief" in the importance of environmental issues. For example climate change as a phenomenon is undisputed. We drive cars that run on unleaded gas and choose vehicles based on their mpg ratio (mainly because the gas costs SO much here)... Another initiative underway is congestion charging. This scheme uses CCTV technology to record who goes in and out of central london by car during peak times. People who do so are billed with the cost and as such this initiative has led to significant reductions in inner-city traffic.


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## Tina (Apr 11, 2007)

I'm not sure how I feel about that last one, but I think the rest is great. Since the industrial age, little thought has been given about how business affects the environment, until they are charged for their screw ups. Being proactive and forcing a change that is definitely doable, but just hasn't been made out of laziness, status quo, whatever, is a good thing. 

I'd also love to see more people have the desire, and the ability, to have some kind of a garden. More plants means more oxygen in the atmosphere; fresh fruit and veggies, if grown well, means more vitamins and minerals are absorbed by the body. They also taste better.


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## biodieselman (Apr 13, 2007)

L.A. Times, April 12, 2007, from the Associated Press

_"ConocoPhillips on Wednesday became the first major U.S. oil company to join a corporate/environmental coalition urging Congress to require limits on greenhouse gases tied to global warming.

The decision could give the Houston-based company an important voice in helping to guide legislation that might alter the way the industry produces fuel and almost certainly make that production more costly, analysts say...

Other companies that belong to the partnership include the American arm of London-based oil major BP and General Electric Co., the U.S. industrial products and media conglomerate.

"We recognize that human activity, including the burning of fossil fuels, is contributing to increased concentrations of greenhouse gases in the atmosphere that can lead to adverse changes in global climate," said Jim Mulva, ConocoPhillips' chief executive.

Mulva said the company was allocating "significantly more resources" to help develop alternative and renewable sources of energy and was committed to reducing emissions at its plants. ConocoPhillips has said it would spend $150 million this year to research and develop new energy sources and technologies  a 50% increase in spending from 2006.

Mulva's call for mandatory limits on greenhouse gases is an abrupt departure from his views on the issue as recently as January. Mulva acknowledged at the time that all types of efficient energy sources were needed but said market forces and consumer preferences, not federal requirements, should determine how they're used.

"We believe very strongly the best way of meeting those metrics is to determine what they are and then let the industry  come up with the resources and plans to meet those, [rather] than have mandates saying specifically, 'You have to do it this way and that,' " he said."_

I don't think ConocoPhillips is trying to 'green wash' their company image like BP attempted recently by opening a 'green gas station' here in L.A. which BTW doesn't sell any alternative fuels.:blink: IMHO these companies realize that federal government greenhouse limits are on the horizon & want a 'say' in the new regulations. I'm sure these CEO's have our best interest at heart. Why, Mulva only 'earned' $45.6 million last year alone.

At any rate, expect America to finally start to curb greenhouse emissions...somewhat.


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## biodieselman (Apr 15, 2007)

missaf said:


> Yesterday I was driving through the smallest little town I've ever seen, in Northern California. There was a gas station meant just for large trucks.
> 
> There parked in front, and pumping his fluffy goodness, was a bio-diesel rig
> 
> I immediately thought of this thread and to tell you all!


 
The switch to ULSD has caused problems for truckers. Dino-diesel has low lubricity properties to begin with & removing the sulfur from diesel is causing gaskets to swell & is damaging expensive injector pumps from lack of adequate lubrication. Biodiesel, unlike dino-diesel has very high lubricity which is the reason diesels run quieter & smoother on biodiesel. Blending as low as 2% of biodiesel, (B2), dramatically improves lubricity. 

Truckers want biodiesel but ASTM specifications for biodiesel aren't approved as of yet. The standards of American Society of Testing Materials are accepted world wide because they are so difficult to get. A single 'NO' vote from diverse entities on the committee shoots down approval. Biodiesel has passed all EPA requirements for use as a fuel but lacks ASTM specs. Lack of ASTM standards is holding up engine manufacturer's approval of higher ratios of blends or 100% biodiesel as a fuel. Most engine manufacturers currently approve B20, 20% biodiesel. 

The problem is that the chemical properties of biodiesel vary slightly depending on the root stock & growing conditions. Different plants make carbon chains between 12 to 14 carbons & vary further by the number of hydrogens on the chain. The reason biodiesel makes 50% less soot is because some of the carbon bonding spots are taken by oxygen, roughly 11%, again depending on the plant & growing conditions. 

Because of the switch to ULSD, there is a rush to produce specs. & the last thing I read is that ASTM specs are nearing approval.

And truckers probably prefer the sweet french fry smell or popcorn smell over the oily dino-diesel smell.


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## GeorgeNL (Apr 15, 2007)

Still a bit too expensive for most of us, but this fully electric car is certainly also promising:

http://www.teslamotors.com

If that would come at an affordable price, you can have the much higher efficiency of electric power plants and electric engines.


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## Tina (Apr 16, 2007)

Oh, I like that! Tesla motors, eh? Wonder if my hips would fit...


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## Zandoz (Apr 16, 2007)

GeorgeNL said:


> Still a bit too expensive for most of us, but this fully electric car is certainly also promising:
> 
> http://www.teslamotors.com
> 
> If that would come at an affordable price, you can have the much higher efficiency of electric power plants and electric engines.



A beautifully done vehicle....styling and engineering. Now hopefully they or someone will take the technology and translate it to a lower (and more efficient) power level, and build a practical commuter vehicle.

It's long been my opinion that the way of things a generation after the crunch hits will be predominantly total electric plug in commuter vehicles and far fewer non-petro fueled simple (not the current excessive-tech) hybrid vehicles for over-the-road long distance travels. The overwhelming majority of personal vehicle trips are perfectly suited to short range commuter vehicles. 

When I say commuter vehicle I do not necessarily mean rolling sardine cans with slot-car motors...just efficiently designed in interior ergonomics, overall footprint, power requirements and cost. It is possible to build spacious inside (space doesn't weigh a lot) and even luxurious in a small footprint and power requirement. Plug-in electric propulsion being the simplest and therefore most cost efficient.


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## Risible (Apr 16, 2007)

Tina said:


> Oh, I like that! Tesla motors, eh? Wonder if my hips would fit...



Ha! That's along the lines of what I said to Bio, "Well, it could fit one of us or the other, but not both at the same time. _*summons vision of wall-to-wall flesh* _ And maybe not even one of us, at that. :blink: ."

It is a nifty looking little car, though.


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## missaf (Apr 16, 2007)

Yeah, I was thinking I'd look like a sardine in that can 

That's not a very family friendly car yet, either. I'll stick with my Kia for now


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## Tina (Apr 16, 2007)

Risible said:


> Ha! That's along the lines of what I said to Bio, "Well, it could fit one of us or the other, but not both at the same time. _*summons vision of wall-to-wall flesh* _ And maybe not even one of us, at that. :blink: ."



Hey, Ris, why don't we BOTH try to fit! :blink: It would be like VW stuffing, only it would just take two of us before it would be full. 

It's funny, Missa. I have a PT Cruiser, and when my son and I are in it, we take up the entire front of it. Something like a Mini Cooper, which I adore, would be akin to the Shriners riding their little cars in parades.


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## Risible (Apr 16, 2007)

Tina said:


> Hey, Ris, why don't we BOTH try to fit! :blink: It would be like VW stuffing, only it would just take two of us before it would be full.
> 
> It's funny, Missa. I have a PT Cruiser, and when my son and I are in it, we take up the entire front of it. Something like a Mini Cooper, which I adore, would be akin to the Shriners riding their little cars in parades.[



Yeah, you with the hips, me with the boobs; that'd be worth the price of the FA's admission!  Can you say _"lotsa baby oil"_?!!!


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## Tina (Apr 16, 2007)

And a big shoe horn.


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## missaf (Apr 16, 2007)

Wow, we did an awesome job derailing this one


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## Tina (Apr 16, 2007)

Heh. Oops! Yeah, I guess we did, although, in the larger context, this whole place is about fat, so I suppose that we were still on-topic... Nah. I'm not even convincing myself.

I have to say that I do wonder just how long it will take before we truly have a number of more affordable 'green' cars to choose from when auto shopping.


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## biodieselman (Apr 16, 2007)

Come-on Missa..._Don't harsh my slow jam quiet storm_

I was just enjoying the visual of two flaming hot women crammed into a flaming red hot car. Oooh the body parts bulging out the windows & such...the ample body parts pressing up against the instruments in the cockpit:smitten:


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## Tina (Apr 16, 2007)

[cue Beavis voice]Hehehehe... he said "cockpit." Hehehehe.[/Beavis voice]


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## missaf (Apr 17, 2007)

rofl! 


Huh huh huh huhhuhuhuh.... He said cock--pit!


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## biodieselman (Apr 17, 2007)

L.A. Times
IN BRIEF / ENERGY
ConocoPhillips, Tyson in fuel deal
From Reuters
April 17, 2007


_Oil company ConocoPhillips and meat producer Tyson Foods Inc. plan to work together to produce biodiesel from animal fat, the companies said. Beef, pork and chicken fat from Tyson rendering plants will be processed at ConocoPhillips refineries to create transportation fuel. 

ConocoPhillips, the third-largest U.S. oil company, said it planned to spend about $100 million over a 3- to 5-year period to prepare several refineries to process the fuel. It said the diesel would first be produced at its Borger, Texas, refinery. 

Tyson said production was expected to start late this year. _

I wonder if the exhaust smell like chicken?


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## Tina (Apr 18, 2007)

I hear that yesterday. Weird, isn't it? All of the food smells in the air might cause people to get hungry, eat more and gain weight...


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## biodieselman (Apr 21, 2007)

Earth Day is Sunday, April 22, 2007. 

The EPA has a web site with locations of e-waste recyclers across the nation. _"Computer monitors and older TV picture tubes contain an average of four pounds of lead and require special handling at the end of their lives. In addition to lead, electronics can contain chromium, cadmium, mercury, beryllium, nickel, zinc, and brominated flame retardants. When electronics are not disposed of or recycled properly, these toxic materials can present problems."_ 

TreeHugger has a good web site on being green. Don't be put off by the name TreeHugger. It won't hurt you to try to be a little greener. The EPA web site also has many suggestions for being greener. 

Ris & I have been thinking about switching to bio household chemicals. Have any of you bought bio laundry detergents or other bio cleaning chemicals? I've seen a lot of web sites but we're not sure which products are good & what web sites are trustworthy. Would like to hear any recommendations. 

There was a thread on banning plastic bags & I remember Ned asking what would he pick up dog poop with if plastic bags were banned. Well, here's the answer, BioBag. 

View attachment earthday_NY.jpg


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## biodieselman (Apr 23, 2007)

L.A. Times, By Meg James, Times Staff Writer, April 23, 2007

_If "Wall Street" were made today, Gordon Gekko might be a television executive who would shrewdly say: "Green is good."

Green is now officially big business in Hollywood.

Beginning in the fall, programs on the youth-oriented CW network will include story lines that promote environmental themes. Some of the CW's hottest stars will tout energy-saving tips in public service announcements...

In Hollywood, of course, motivation comes in a different shade of green.

"There's definitely goodwill involved, but from a business perspective, there is a huge opportunity in the marketplace to support environmental initiatives," said Cary Rubinstein, who is in charge of buying advertising for Bank of America, the main sponsor of the Discovery Channel's "Planet Earth" series...

This month, cable programmer Discovery Communications Inc. said it would dedicate $50 million to produce original shows with Earth-friendly themes. After its success this year with "Planet Earth," the Silver Spring, Md., company decided to relaunch its Discovery Home digital channel next year as Discovery Planet Green, with shows that explore such topics as eco-design, organic food and green architecture...

"This is being driven both by consumer interest, people who want to live their lives in more environmentally friendly ways...

...Smith Barney sponsors "Robert Redford Presents: The Green," a show on the Sundance cable channel...

"Today many companies have separate green budgets in addition to their advertising budgets," Discovery's Zaslav said. "We think this whole concept of green living is not a fad. It's a real movement, and it fits with our brand and what viewers expect from us."...

...the Cassandra Report, which found that last summer, when "An Inconvenient Truth" was making news, global warming was the No. 1 concern of people under 40.

"This was a group that was raised with recycling in the schools, with Habitat for Humanity and Save the Rainforest campaigns. It's a group that cares about the environment," said Jane Buckingham, president of Intelligence Group...

"They love to be part of the group. The minute they see the momentum gaining, they want to jump on board. They want to be part of something big."...

"The entertainment industry...have a huge cultural impact," said Allen Hershkowitz,..."They are important players in reaching those who influence and define our cultural values."_

All well & good but Hollywood should be, quoting Miss Vickie, "Walking the walk..."

Ruby Ripples pestered her city council to start a recycling program & I think she would be great as a 'lobbyist' to pester our government.


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## Ho Ho Tai (May 3, 2007)

biodieselman said:


> Tina suggested I start a living green thread. I have no illusions about myself & don't pretend to be the 'green' expert. Nor do I pretend to know the final word on being green. But I would love to hear what you guys do to be green, no matter how insignificant you think it is. Any small effort benefits all of us. I would love to encourage people to at least try to be a better steward of earth.
> 
> My pet topic is biodiesel. I can give you pointers if you're considering ending your petroleum addiction. Future cars & trucks with new era diesel technology & Ultra Low Sulfur Diesel fuel will be cleaner than gasoline engines plus get up to 40% better fuel economy. New diesels are as clean as a Prius & in my case of burning 100% biodiesel much cleaner than a Prius. Wow, my 3/4 ton truck is cleaner than a Prius, can you believe it? M.I.T. says total life cycle diesel/electric hybrids are as clean as a hydrogen fuel cell powered car. Cleaner if fueled by 100% biodiesel. You can't afford a fuel cell car even if they made one but in two or three years Honda will be selling diesels & diesel/electric hybrids. Honda aims to be the environmental auto maker.
> 
> ...



. . . because so many of the issues you raise are also addressed in this article. The article is interesting; some of the comments even more so. I did fancy myself a part of this commune-ity in the '70s, hauling wet manure from the stockyards to community gardens, et c. Sold out for suburbia long ago, but still friendly to - even imbued with - many of the old ideas. Not so much the practical, hands-on stuff anymore, but the ideas of peace, brotherhood, community and, well, "Imagine".
http://www.commondreams.org/archive/2007/05/02/915/


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## Risible (May 3, 2007)

Ho Ho Tai said:


> I did fancy myself a part of this commune-ity in the '70s, hauling wet manure from the stockyards to community gardens, et c.



You wouldn't be quite so "ha ha", Ho Ho, if your house was downwind of the garden beds strewn with chicken manure fresh from the stockyards, or, in this case, from the soil and manure purveyors.  Whew city!


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## biodieselman (May 4, 2007)

The Aussies know how to be green! 

_Beer: the energy drink for bacteria
From Times Wire Reports
May 3, 2007

Scientists and an Australian beer maker are teaming up to generate energy from brewery wastewater and bacteria.

The University of Queensland was given a $115,000 grant to install the experimental microbial fuel cell at a Foster's Group brewery near Brisbane.

The fuel cell is a battery in which bacteria consume water-soluble brewing waste such as sugar, starch and alcohol. The battery produces electricity and clean water, said Jurg Keller, the university's wastewater expert.
_


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## missaf (May 4, 2007)

More beer!


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## Ryan (May 5, 2007)

Green Restaurant Association

The GRA web site allows you to search for environmentally friendly restaurants, find environmentally friendly products, etc.


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## biodieselman (Jun 7, 2007)

Rightfully so, the G8 summit is attempting to put pressure on Uncle Sam to get off the pot and start being green. Schwarzenegger and California legislators are just one example, along with many other states and municipalities across the U.S., passing legislation to curb greenhouse gas emissions and other environmental protections. Here is the most recent example in California, followed by examples of the real environmental impact of everyday products in our lifes. We need to get serious about conservation.



> Patt Morrison:
> Green guilt trip
> Too lazy to recycle? Here's how much you're wasting.​June 7, 2007
> 
> ...



Another interesting statistic is that it takes 50,000 pounds of raw material to make one 3,000 pound car. That's a heavy price for Mother Earth to pay.

Of course, nothing will be done until the year 1 A.D. (After Dubya). I hope the next administration can get off the pot.


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## Ho Ho Tai (Jun 9, 2007)

biodieselman said:


> Tina suggested I start a living green thread. I have no illusions about myself & don't pretend to be the 'green' expert. Nor do I pretend to know the final word on being green. But I would love to hear what you guys do to be green, no matter how insignificant you think it is. Any small effort benefits all of us. I would love to encourage people to at least try to be a better steward of earth.
> . . .
> 
> Something I do know about is organic vegetable gardening. I will gladly answer questions on small container vegetable gardening or backyard gardening. You won't believe how good food you have grown tastes. Plus there is a great feeling of satisfaction
> ...



BDMan - I have quoted your original post in it's entirety previously. This time, I focus only on food issues.

This program came to my attention through a newsletter from the Minnesota Landscape Arboretum. It may be of interest to some here. It may be heard via the internet (streaming audio) at www.mpr.org. You need to click on their news channel link.

"MPR to Rebroadcast Michael Pollan Lecture
Minnesota Public Radio (FM 91.1) will rebroadcast the Arboretum's Public Policy Program, "What's for Dinner? The Ethics and Aesthetics of Eating," featuring keynote speaker Michael Pollan, this Sunday, June 10, at 9 p.m."

If you miss it, it may be archived at that same site.

The MN Landscape Arboretum is an adjunct of the Univ. of Minnesota. We have spent many happy hours there. You may access it here http://www.arboretum.umn.edu/


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## chickadee (Jun 9, 2007)

I dumpster dive and donate the things I can't use to charity. 

I'm thinking about starting to dumpster dive for food, but I'm not sure where to start. I already hit some bakeries and bagel places that put out their wrapped leftovers at night, but it would be great to get involved with supermarket leftovers- that's where the good food is at.


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## stan_der_man (Jun 10, 2007)

I just thought I'd mention an interesting book that I've been reading... It's called "A Short History of Progress" by Ronald Wright (Canada). The things that I find interesting about it (without giving the whole book away...) is that archeologists are discovering more evidence that the declines (and complete fall) of most civilizations can (to date, reasonably) be attributed to environmental degradation caused by humans. (The demise of Easter Island being a textbook example of this.) What we may be facing is nothing new. Even the notion of "progress" may be a fallacy. For example, we have learned that humans "progressed" from being hunter/ gatherers to agriculture because we got smarter. As our hunting techniques became better we hunted the animals into extinction, our technology and skills were our downfall. We didn't "progress" to agriculture (in terms of it being an advancement), we were forced to find another means of lively hood because we hunted the animals down to numbers that wouldn't sustain our populations. An example of a technology progressing to the point of maximum destructiveness are nuclear weapons. The other interesting notion in this book is that individual modern humans may not be that much smarter than the cro-magnons or neanderthals. It's our culture (combined human ingenuity) that has brought us to the technological level which we have achieved (with an assorted few geniuses here and there...) The sum of our tools (skills) over time enable present day humans to exponentially invent more.

Anyway I thought this book was an interesting (but not too heavy of a) read for anybody interested in environmental issues...

Stan


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## biodieselman (Jun 11, 2007)

Thank you guys for your contributions. 

Thanks Chickadee. It would be great if the Second Harvest program was increased. Too much food is wasted & if supermarkets 'can't sell' food with expired dates that's still fit to eat, I wish more could be donated. 

Thanks Stan. Ris & I seen several documentaries on this topic. I've read many articles about this also. Mechanization & man-made chemical fertilizers have freed millions of us from agricultural labor. Why do we value honest, hard work at such low wages? It's not right. The problems with modern farming techniques are that we are depleting aquifers, losing top soil & excessive farming chemicals are polluting our ground water supplies. Farmers are seeing this first hand & there is a growing movement to switch to sustainable farming techniques. I won't bore you with details but there are many practices that are changing. Most importantly of all, farmers are decreasing mechanical soil tilling which accelerates top soil loss from wind erosion & other erosion causes. Once top soil is lost, it takes generations to rebuild. We can't afford to lose valuable top soil. 

As always, thanks Ho Ho Tai for your contributions. I couldn't listen to the program you linked, but allow me to speak of my own gardening experience. I wasn't very successful at first using the quick & easy chemical fertilizers. It took so many chemicals to produce a small yield, I almost gave up. It takes a lot of physical work once a year but the difference in results are dramatic. 

I use raised beds to improve drainage & the increased surface area raises soil temperatures for earlier & later seasonal plant growth. Once a year I bring a trailer load of composted poultry manure & manually spade the soil as deep as I can dig to incorporate the composted organic matter. I never walk on the soil because the weight of a normal sized person concentrated on the area of their foot print really compacts the soil. Friable soil high in organic matter will make anyone look like they have a green thumb. I'm not a Master Gardener, but with good soil it makes it look easy. 

More & more commercial farmers are adopting sustainable farming techniques. Getting off chemicals are hard at first but over a few short years their costs are down & their yields are increased. After all, isn't that what it's all about? 

Green is better.


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## biodieselman (Jun 12, 2007)

Several cities across the nation are considering baning styrofoam. Styrofoam used to be made using ozone depleting chlorofluorocarbons. Now most Styrofoam is produced using nitrogen, which does not harm the ozone, but the end product is still non-biodegradable. It's not recyclable & most ends up in landfills, litters our cities & poisons wildlife. 

Ris buys a lot of stuff on line & we get a lot of styrofoam shipping peanuts. I hate the large chunks of styrofoam because it all winds up in the landfill. What a waste. But I found a peanut solution.:happy: We save all the peanuts, placing the stinking little statically charged peanuts into plastic trash bags with the draw strings. When I need to go to the local private postal store, they are more than happy to take them & reuse them for their customers to ship stuff. 

I still hate styrofoam though.


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## stan_der_man (Jun 12, 2007)

At the university we often get "foamy beans" that are made out of some type of protein stuff. They are cool, because all you have to do is put them in water and they desolve. They are non-toxic and completely biodegradable. Actually I've eaten one, they sort of taste like little rice cakes...  

P.S. Bio, I'm looking forward to camping, all is reserved I'll email specifics to Ris! Rumor has it that you want to bring mountain bikes? I know a dirt road that is a one-way ticket down to Lake Silverwood!  

Stan


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## Ho Ho Tai (Jun 12, 2007)

biodieselman said:


> Recycling is another everyday commitment of mine. . .
> 
> What are you doing to help?



*It's not easy, being green,
While trying hard not to be seen.
And, while it may give the others a thrill,
Mostly, it just gives you a chill.​*
My Portland cousin forwarded this story to me. What could I do but share it?

Note: You may have to log in with a zip and birth year. I think you can be somewhat fanciful about that.

Riding cheek to cheek
Not for naught nor for naughtiness do 800 cyclists pedal naked, but rather to do the globe some good
Tuesday, June 12, 2007
STEVE WOODWARD
The Oregonian

Naked was the fashion Saturday night, and bikes were the luxury vehicle of choice.

About midnight, with only the glow of streetlights draping them, an estimated 800 men and women pedaled madly. . .in what has become an annual Portland tradition: the World Naked Bike Ride.
. . .

"All the good parts were showing," said the 27-year-old Southeast Portland resident.

Wiza also displayed a poetic message for anyone behind her: "LESS GAS MORE (rhymes with 'gas')." The hand-painted message included an arrow pointing readers to her (rhymes with "gas").

On the blocked-off street outside the Organics To You warehouse party after the ride, several men had added ties to their birthday suits. One woman wore nothing on her chest but a red Superman logo. "Green power," declared a man's back. One woman dressed provocatively in cheap black lingerie -- cheap because it was painted on.

. . .

"I started out not all the way," Miller said, "but I was feeling it." And, apparently, if one is feeling it, there's naught to do but shed the remains of one's modesty -- even in the middle of the Hawthorne Bridge.

"It's nice to let go," said Jackson . . .

Steve Woodward: 503-294-5134; [email protected] news.oregonian.com

©2007 The Oregonian

http://www.oregonlive.com/living/oregonian/index.ssf?/base/living/1181609706145690.xml&coll=7

And omit not to watch the sidebar video!

http://www.oregonlive.com/living/oregonian/video/index.ssf?LV_31NAKD012


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## Ho Ho Tai (Jun 15, 2007)

biodieselman said:


> Tina suggested I start a living green thread. I have no illusions about myself & don't pretend to be the 'green' expert. Nor do I pretend to know the final word on being green. But I would love to hear what you guys do to be green, no matter how insignificant you think it is. Any small effort benefits all of us. I would love to encourage people to at least try to be a better steward of earth. . . . What are you doing to help?



If you needed anything else to worry about, try this. Be as green and organic as you can - without bees, good luck.


"From the Los Angeles Times
Suddenly, the bees are simply vanishing
Scientists are at a loss to pinpoint the cause. The die-off in 35 states has crippled beekeepers and threatened many crops.
By Jia-Rui Chong and Thomas H. Maugh II
Times Staff Writers

June 10, 2007

The dead bees under Dennis vanEngelsdorp's microscope were like none he had ever seen.

He had expected to see mites or amoebas, perennial pests of bees. Instead, he found internal organs swollen with debris and strangely blackened. The bees' intestinal tracts were scarred, and their rectums were abnormally full of what appeared to be partly digested pollen. Dark marks on the sting glands were telltale signs of infection . . . "

http://www.latimes.com/news/science/la-sci-bees10jun10,0,1022355,print.story

Believe me - Ho Ho isn't laughing this time.


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## Risible (Jun 16, 2007)

Ho Ho Tai said:


> If you needed anything else to worry about, try this. Be as green and organic as you can - without bees, good luck.
> 
> 
> "From the Los Angeles Times
> ...



Ho Ho, yeah, no ha ha this time. 

In fact, Bio was reading me this very article (he subscribes to the LA Times) on June 10.

I've been searching fruitlessly, so to speak, for a colony of honeybees to set up in our garden, as we are seeing fewer and fewer bees each year here. We have two bumblebees that hang around, two different varieties, and there are some honeybees, though not nearly as many as six years ago, when we inaugurated our garden. They also used to be so prolific around our lavender patch that I used to be able to sit here at the computer and listen to the hum of bees; no more (the lavender is right outside the room the computer is in).

This is a very sad development indeed, and will have wide ranging repercussions for our agriculture industry.


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## Ho Ho Tai (Jun 16, 2007)

Risible said:


> Ho Ho, yeah, no ha ha this time.
> 
> In fact, Bio was reading me this very article (he subscribes to the LA Times) on June 10.
> 
> ...



I've felt the pull of Yeats' magic place for many decades, and never more than now. I think you already have your magic place, and actually, ours is too. Just got back from a morning bike ride. No biggie - just a few miles to a favorite coffee shop, winding through woods, around a lake, through the fields. Quite a few other morning bikers and runners, but the drop in both the bird and bee population is quite noticeable.

Years ago, I built a front deck on the house where we raised our kids. Unusual for that place and time. We could sit there and waive to the neighbors walking and biking by. I had the custom of Saturday breakfast on the deck - something simple, usually black coffee, toast, and pickled herring. The honeybees loved the pickled herring! I used to set an apple, or some honey on the opposite side of the deck. They would explore it, but soon be back to the herring. No problem. I ate the herring, and they sipped the juice, and all was well on Ryan Street. 

They liked that juice so well that I figured the bees must be sons of Norwegians - and vice versa.


This moment of peace and tranquility brought to you by:
http://www.esatclear.ie/~our_ireland/wb_yeats.htm

_
Lake Isle Of Inisfree (Circa.1890).
W.B. Yeats

I will arise and go now,and go to Inisfree,
and a small cabin build there,of clay and wattles made:
Nine bean rows will I have there, a hive for the honey bee,
and live alone in the bee-loud glade.

And I shall have some peace there,for peace comes dropping slow,
dropping from the veils of the morning to where the Cricket sings;
There midnight's all a glimmer, and noon a purple glow,
and evening full of the Linnit's wings.

I will arise and go now,for always night and day,
I hear lake waters lapping with low sounds by the shore;
While I stand on the roadway, or on the pavements grey,
I hear it in the deep heart's core. ​_


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## Risible (Jun 16, 2007)

Ho Ho Tai said:


> I've felt the pull of Yeats' magic place for many decades, and never more than now. I think you already have your magic place, and actually, ours is too. Just got back from a morning bike ride. No biggie - just a few miles to a favorite coffee shop, winding through woods, around a lake, through the fields. Quite a few other morning bikers and runners, but the drop in both the bird and bee population is quite noticeable.
> 
> Years ago, I built a front deck on the house where we raised our kids. Unusual for that place and time. We could sit there and waive to the neighbors walking and biking by. I had the custom of Saturday breakfast on the deck - something simple, usually black coffee, toast, and pickled herring. The honeybees loved the pickled herring! I used to set an apple, or some honey on the opposite side of the deck. They would explore it, but soon be back to the herring. No problem. I ate the herring, and they sipped the juice, and all was well on Ryan Street.
> 
> ...



What a lovely poem! I'm half Irish, ye know. In fact, a descendant of the Joyce family, though I don't know if I am, in fact, related to _that _Joyce. I suppose I am, at some far remove.

It is very disheartening to read that, at the present time, the scientists who are at the heart of the bee-death issue have no clue as to what is causing it, let alone how to reverse it.

The times, they are indeed a-changing.


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## Ho Ho Tai (Jun 16, 2007)

Risible said:


> What a lovely poem! I'm half Irish, ye know. In fact, a descendant of the Joyce family, though I don't know if I am, in fact, related to _that _Joyce. I suppose I am, at some far remove.
> 
> It is very disheartening to read that, at the present time, the scientists who are at the heart of the bee-death issue have no clue as to what is causing it, let alone how to reverse it.
> 
> The times, they are indeed a-changing.



Risible - I might, or might not, be familiar with that poem, had I not heard it sung by Judy Collins in the early '70s. Over the following decades, there were many times when I wanted to chuck it all and go off in search of Innisfree. I didn't, but somehow, it found me anyway. 

I think that the telling points in the bee article are the hints that it is related to an immune system failure, caused, perhaps, to too many chemicals and pesticides. The other scary thing was the controlled study of hives sanitized, or not, in various ways - and the observation that even the normal bee predators stayed away from the unsanitized hives.

We bought nine quarts of locally raised strawberries last weekend, and Mrs Ho Ho put must of them up as strawberry-rhubarb jam. Most of it will be gone by next year, but I think I'll save one jar. When it is clear that the earth, and humanity, are in their final throes, we will open that jar, share it, and hope we can manage one last, sweet, kiss.


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## Wagimawr (Jun 16, 2007)

Ho Ho Tai said:


> think I'll save one jar. When it is clear that the earth, and humanity, are in their final throes, we will open that jar, share it, and hope we can manage one last, sweet, kiss.


You might have the privilege of finding your way off this rock sometime before that happens, so by all means, pass the jar along.  :bow:


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## Ho Ho Tai (Jun 16, 2007)

Wagimawr said:


> You might have the privilege of finding your way off this rock sometime before that happens, so by all means, pass the jar along.  :bow:



I just checked your profile. Since I am almost exactly 50 years older than you are, you are probably right. For your sake, and the sake of my kids, grandkids, and - well, everybody, I sincerely hope so. I do expect to be around for a few (quite a few, actually) years yet, and I will continue to watch, with hope, or despair, or both, as humanity struggles to pull themselves out of this abyss.

Success will depend on a hell of a lot of hard work, especially on the part of you young 'uns. Mrs Ho Ho and I are past the times when we could do the heavy lifting. We're taking the easy way out by making arrangements for the bulk of our resources, whatever they may be at the end of our lives, to go into scholarship funds that will give people your age the tools to do the job.

But that jar of jam? Ferget it, buddy! Somebody may have to spoon feed it to me, but that jar, and that last kiss, is mine, all mine!

However, I'll have Mrs Ho Ho send you the recipe for the jam. The kiss? You're on your own for that!


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## Wagimawr (Jun 16, 2007)

Ho Ho Tai said:


> But that jar of jam? Ferget it, buddy! Somebody may have to spoon feed it to me, but that jar, and that last kiss, is mine, all mine!


So, humanity's last throes, or yours, whichever comes first, eh?  enjoy!


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## James (Jun 16, 2007)

Ho Ho Tai said:


> *It's not easy, being green,
> While trying hard not to be seen.
> And, while it may give the others a thrill,
> Mostly, it just gives you a chill.​*
> ...



thats awesome


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## biodieselman (Jun 16, 2007)

Ho Ho Tai said:


> ...My Portland cousin forwarded this story to me. What could I do but share it?...


 
Not quite sure what to think of that photo Ho Ho Tai. Where's the female posteriors? I don't even want to speculate what that man rode through to cause that yellow stripe up his spine. But it was all for a good cause.:happy: 

Thought I would post these links from the June 11th, Newsweek 'Environment' section. 

1. rateitgreen _"...helping consumers and businesses find ecofriendly building materials and services..."_ 

2. thegreenoffice _"...Ideas include buying ecofriendly office supplies...asking your company to buy carbon offsets for corporate travel and pushing for more opportunities to work from home..."_ 

3. treehugger Come on you guys , there's more here than just another biodiesel site. 

4. usgbc _"...a group of people in each field who are working to make their profession more green...which describes its certification course and lists other helpful resources..."_ 

5. ecotourism Self explanatory. 

6. idealist _"...lists jobs and volunteer opportunities with a wide variety of socially responsible organizations..."_ 

7. cerc.columbia _"...Columbia University's certificate program in conservation biology..."_ 

8. environment.yale _"...earn a master's in forestry from Yale..."_


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## Ho Ho Tai (Jun 16, 2007)

biodieselman said:


> Not quite sure what to think of that photo Ho Ho Tai. Where's the female posteriors? I don't even want to speculate what that man rode through to cause that yellow stripe up his spine. But it was all for a good cause.:happy:
> 
> Thought I would post these links from the June 11th, Newsweek 'Environment' section.
> 
> ...



Can't comment on the yellow stripe, nor on the absence of feminine derrieres. Actually, I did cheat a bit on that picture. I couldn't find a good one directly connected with the article. Most were taken at night, with low resolution and detail. I found this one to illustrate the point.

A good list of links, which I will forward to those on my list who have an interest in such things. I am familiar with some of them, but not many. 

I add this link, which I received unsolicited today. The lead article is on carbon ranching. I think that Mr. Hurowitz' ideas make sense. I have seen similar before. The title of the website does seem to be an oxymoron, though.

I may copy you on my reply to him, using the on-board e-mail channel.


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## Ho Ho Tai (Jun 16, 2007)

Wagimawr said:


> So, humanity's last throes, or yours, whichever comes first, eh?  enjoy!



You got it!


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## Lady at Large (Jun 17, 2007)

I saw those bike riders on the news the other night and I meant to be impressed with their determination to make a difference...but sadly all I thought of was the safety issues involved in riding nude...*sigh* 

It's always fun and games until someone falls off and gets road rash on their yo-woo! 

But yes, as was mentioned, it was for a good cause!


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## biodieselman (Jun 25, 2007)

Yet another example of our federal government's failure to do their damn job & address the concerns of the people who elected them to office. Cities, states & individuals are taking action to improve our environment, but congress is too busy representing their big money corporations to take care of the concerns of the majority of Americans, one of which is global warming & the environment. 

_Gov.'s climate change speech is a hit 
By Jia-Rui Chong, Times Staff Writer 
June 24, 2007 

Gov. Arnold ...encouraged local governments to take the lead in combating climate change. 

"I was so happy and so delighted when I found out that you've made climate change No. 1..." 

...praised Mayor Michael Bloomberg's initiative to replace New York's fleet of gasoline-powered taxicabs with hybrids and Mayor Antonio Villaraigosa's bid to reduce the Department of Water and Power's reliance on coal-burning power plants for energy. 

Hundreds of mayors also have signed a U.S. Mayors Climate Protection Agreement calling on cities to meet or beat targets set in the 1997 Kyoto Protocol, an international plan to reduce greenhouse gases. 

"Just like you mayors are doing, we are applying leverage so that at some point the whole environmental thing will tip," Schwarzenegger said. "We are not waiting for Washington." 

The governor touted the law passed last year mandating a 25% cut in California's greenhouse gas emissions by 2020 and his executive order requiring car and trucks to reduce carbon emissions in their exhaust 10% in the same time frame... 

The ballroom was filled with almost all of the approximately 1,000 mayors and other city officials attending the U.S. Conference of Mayors' annual meeting. 

"He is on target," said Larry Nelson, mayor of Yuma, Ariz. Like other cities that draw their water from the Colorado River, Yuma is worried that global warming could mean more droughts and could diminish its water supply, he said. 

He proudly described Yuma's project to remove water-hogging nonnative tamarisk trees from the riverbank as a way that cities could contribute. 

"I agree" with the governor," said Patricia Christensen, mayor of Port St. Lucie, Fla. "Washington is taking too long. It really is up to cities and towns to lower fuel emissions." 

Her city is building an environmentally friendly East Coast home for La Jolla's Torrey Pines Institute for Molecular Studies. The building will feature heating and air-conditioning systems with top efficiency ratings, furniture made from recycled materials and a roof covered in living grass to help with drainage by absorbing the water, she said. 

"I'd rather do something now than wait for the feds to give us unfunded mandates," she said. 
_ 

It's commendable that cities, states & responsible individual citizens are doing something about global warming, but to really be effective our own federal government & all other nations need to accept responsibility. We need to press our representatives to do the right thing.

Why am I telling you guys this? I'm preaching to the choir here.


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## Ho Ho Tai (Jun 25, 2007)

biodieselman said:


> Why am I telling you guys this? I'm preaching to the choir here.



*"Hallelujah! Hallelujah!
Hallelujah!Hallelujah!
Halllllll-leeeeeee-luuuuuuuuu-jaaaaaaaah!"​*
*The Choir​*


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## biodieselman (Jun 28, 2007)

Ho Ho Tai said:


> *"Hallelujah! Hallelujah!
> Hallelujah!Hallelujah!
> Halllllll-leeeeeee-luuuuuuuuu-jaaaaaaaah!"​*
> *The Choir​*



This video about global warming is for you Ho Ho.


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## QuasimodoQT (Jul 5, 2007)

I so rarely venture into Hyde Park, but this thread was worth it!

My husband wasn't raised in a "green state" like I was, so sometimes it's a bit like running up the down escalator around here, but he's really starting to try. Here's what the household policies are:

-we have the compact flourescents in about 75% of our lights, all of our often-used ones.
-we only have hand-crank flashlights and a hand-crank paper shredder, and we have a hand crank radio/cell charger anda solar shower, though those are for the emergency kit.
-we live in a big city, so we don't own a car, just mass transit, bicycles, and our trusty feet. Actually, we are planning to use zipcar if we really need to at any point to avoid a car purchase.
-we have cloth grocery bags, and when those aren't with us, we reuse all of our plastic bags for trash and bringing in again for fruit, etc.
-we do not dry clean.
-we cold water wash, and hang dry the easier items.
-we buy locally grown when possible.
-we don't ask for printed receipts at ATMs.
-we selected a green poer provider option through our utility.
-we recycle.
-we use biofriendly cleaning products whenever possible, most often Shaklee or Method.
-we mostly use an orange oil product as a pesticide
-we buy Energy Star. That doesn't mean that we're not still using appliances that aren't so efficient that were purchased before my advent, though.
-we set our TVs on more energy efficient settings. We don't really notice the difference enough to warrant the blinding brightness.
-we buy the less-packaged items whenever there is a choice. This includes soda (2-liter bottles only).
-we don't buy bottled water at all- we use tap + Brita.
-we use less water, turning off taps when brushing teeth, only using shower, not baths, I have a spray bottle I use to soak dishes with instead of running water, we have weights in our toilet tank, no dishwasher.
-we make epayments and ask for estatements whenever practical. I really only want my bank statements, as I need them anyway for taxes, and there's a fee for back statements.
-we keep the blinds closed when the sun is brightest in the rooms that have blinds. We need to have them on all windows, but we have really big ones, and sliding glass doors and whatnot, and as a renter, purchasing custom blinds has not been feasible yet.
-we use smart power strips on computer systems that can tell when you are active and power down peripherals when you aren't.
-when I did own a car, I tried to pick the least egregious of the multinational corporations/gas stations (Chevron at that time), didn't speed, and didn't keep heavy loads in my trunk longer than necessary.

That's all I can think of for now. 

I saw a program on alternate energy sources in development. Wow. The wind farm of the coast of Holland, the solar collector in the Outback, and there's a project in the UK that is saying it can supply the energy needs for 1 person for 30 years using a bathtub of water, with no toxic byproducts... of course it will take about 30 years to develop. 

And actually, there are tidal turbines going in several places, even right here in NYC! For the last two years, there has been one in the East River, supplying power to the Roosevelt Island Gristede's. That project is expanding. 

And a building going up by Bryant Park that isn't just energy efficient, it will actually filter the air around it as well! I need to see that one again, I think it was on D-Health. It was on at 4 or 5 am, and I was starting to be sleepy. Note current posting time.

Finally, if you need instant motivation, here is a link to an amazing article. I had no idea about many of the issues raised here. I think it's as important to know about these things as An Inconvenient Truth. 


http://www.bestlifeonline.com/cms/p..._oceans_are_turning_into_plastic_are_we.shtml 

Sorry for rambling a bit. Sleepy again, finally.


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## Risible (Jul 5, 2007)

Wow, QT! That's quite a list! Your post goes to show that living green within your own home is doable. Even if our government isn't make much of an effort to encourage green practices or go green themselves, I believe it's important for individuals to re-evaluate their lifestyles and incorporate green alternatives where practicable, as you obviously have.

We make an effort as well. One area that I'd like to take advantage of, and that would really make a difference is solar power. I guesstimate that, right now, it would cost around $20,000 to go solar in our So Cal home, and that's with current rebates. I'm hoping that there'll be more incentives at the federal and local levels to reduce that cost, and that the solar equipment manufacturers will reach the point where they're selling enough to bring the costs of manufacturing down. I also read about new, smaller, and better solar technology is in the works; hope it's not too expensive. I'd love to have a solar-powered home. It's something that every So Cal home should be taking advantage of, the energy of the sun.


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## Jane (Jul 5, 2007)

QuasimodoQT said:


> I so rarely venture into Hyde Park, but this thread was worth it!
> 
> My husband wasn't raised in a "green state" like I was, so sometimes it's a bit like running up the down escalator around here, but he's really starting to try. Here's what the household policies are:
> 
> ...



Save the 2-liter bottles for your friends who garden. I use them as early-spring hot houses for getting plants to grow while the air is still a little nippy. They work to extend the season both in Spring and Fall.


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## QuasimodoQT (Jul 5, 2007)

Jane said:


> Save the 2-liter bottles for your friends who garden. I use them as early-spring hot houses for getting plants to grow while the air is still a little nippy. They work to extend the season both in Spring and Fall.



I'm in a 28 story bldg in Manhattan, and I don't know any gardeners locally, but if I did, I would certainly do that, good idea! I save a few for "emergency purposes" ie: to fill with water immediately if anything horrible went down, a few more to use with plant spikes (they autowater from the 2-liter when you're gone), and the rest I recycle, they're a pain, but until we have the corn plastic, probably my best choice. I simply can't live without diet cola. I keep trying, but the siren song calls, calls, calls to me. 

Actually, I'm a bit on the fence about corn plastic/fuel. Corn prices have soared, and that's cattle feed, so meat and dairy have soared. And as more corn is needed, more fertilizer. Back to the petroeum loop. Of course, I can sit and be skeptical, but do I offer another idea? Nope.


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## Jane (Jul 5, 2007)

QuasimodoQT said:


> I'm in a 28 story bldg in Manhattan, and I don't know any gardeners locally, but if I did, I would certainly do that, good idea! I save a few for "emergency purposes" ie: to fill with water immediately if anything horrible went down, a few more to use with plant spikes (they autowater from the 2-liter when you're gone), and the rest I recycle, they're a pain, but until we have the corn plastic, probably my best choice. I simply can't live without diet cola. I keep trying, but the siren song calls, calls, calls to me.
> 
> Actually, I'm a bit on the fence about corn plastic/fuel. Corn prices have soared, and that's cattle feed, so meat and dairy have soared. And as more corn is needed, more fertilizer. Back to the petroeum loop. Of course, I can sit and be skeptical, but do I offer another idea? Nope.



It's all on speculation. Trust me, here in corn country, I don't hear the farmers crowing.


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## biodieselman (Jul 8, 2007)

QuasimodoQT said:


> ...Actually, I'm a bit on the fence about corn plastic/fuel.


 
I'm all for plastic from vegetable oil. There is a relatively new materials concept coined "Waste Equals Food". Following is a brief description. Michael Braungart is my hero! 


"_...Cradle to Cradle Design is a new strategy for business growth and prosperity that generates ecological, social, and economic value. It represents a fundamental conceptual shift away from the flawed system design of the Industrial Revolution, not just a damage management strategy. 

Background 

In response to widespread environmental degradation, many industries have adopted a strategy known as "eco-efficiency"-minimizing waste, pollution, and natural resource depletion. But eco-efficiency is not a strategy for long-term success. It seeks to make the current, destructive system sustainable. 

Minimizing toxic pollution and the waste of natural resources are not strategies for real change. Designing industrial processes so they do not generate toxic pollution and "waste" in the first place is true change. Long-term prosperity depends not on the efficiency of a fundamentally destructive system, but on the effectiveness of processes designed to be healthy and renewable in the first place. 

Cradle to Cradle Design's strategy of eco-effectiveness is rooted in the systems of the natural world, which are not efficient at all, but effective. Consider the cherry tree. Each spring it makes thousands of blossoms, which then fall in piles to the ground-not very efficient. But the fallen blossoms become food for other living things. The tree's abundance of blossoms is both safe and useful, contributing to the health of a thriving, interdependent system. And the tree spreads multiple positive effects-making oxygen, transpiring water, creating habitat, and more. And it is beautiful! 

Eco-effectiveness seeks to design industrial systems that emulate the healthy abundance of nature. The central design principle of eco-effectiveness is waste equals food..."_ 



QuasimodoQT said:


> Corn prices have soared, and that's cattle feed, so meat and dairy have soared. And as more corn is needed, more fertilizer. Back to the petroeum loop. Of course, I can sit and be skeptical, but do I offer another idea? Nope.


 
I'm all for any alternative energy sources that gets us off oil & completely out of the Middle East. IMO it is the height of ignorance to fund both sides of the war. First, throwing billions of dollars at governments that fund jihadists. Secondly, paying billions in taxes for military actions when trying to fight elusive terrorists that hide amongst women & children when confronted.:doh: 

However, ethanol has serious problems. You all know I believe algae/biodiesel makes the most practical sense. 

1. Ethanol evaporates readily, is itself a Volatile Organic Compound & is a greenhouse gas. Biodiesel has no VOCs, making no greenhouse gas. 

2. Ethanol production fouls 12 gal of good drinking water per gal of ethanol. Algae/biodiesel feeds off sewage fouled water, aiding water treatment efforts. 

3. Ethanol gets 30% less fuel economy than gasoline. Biodiesel gets 30% greater fuel economy than gasoline. 

4. Ethanol isn't greenhouse gas neutral. Corn needs fertilizer, requires lots of energy to produce & doesn't totally eliminate the use of gasoline. Biodiesel from soy beans is 100% carbon neutral. Biodiesel from algae actually removes CO2 from the atmosphere, reducing global warming. 

5. Automobiles must be modified to burn 85% ethanol/15% gasoline. 100% biodiesel can already be used with current diesel engines without any modifications. Eliminates the 'chicken or the egg' arguments. 

6. Ethanol is more expensive than gasoline. Algae/biodiesel is projected to cost less than what we pay for gasoline today.

Mark my words, diesel power is the future. Audi is beating everything with a diesel powered car & all the other engine manufacturers are scrambling to catch up. Check out the cool sound of the TDI future. Can you say Turbo Direct Injection?


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## Tina (Jul 8, 2007)

Was watching "Who Killed the Electric Car?" last night. Hope biodiesel doesn't go the way of the electric car. Damned oil and car manufacturing companies.


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## biodieselman (Jul 8, 2007)

Tina said:


> Was watching "Who Killed the Electric Car?" last night. Hope biodiesel doesn't go the way of the electric car. Damned oil and car manufacturing companies.


 
I wouldn't write off electric cars just yet. There are many new electric vehicles ready to hit the market. I have recently changed my opinion of electric cars. Electric cars have range problems but most of us only drive less than 80 miles a day. For short commutes they make practical sense only if they are charged during off peak energy demand times. 

I subscribe to 'Biodiesel Magazine', an industry publication for commercial biodiesel producers. Countries all around the world are throwing up new biodiesel plants. I don't support agri/biodiesel because I believe it's a mistake to divert acreage away from food production, increasing the cost of many products, not just the price of my corn tortillas. Several of these new biodiesel facilities utilize algae as feedstock with millions of dollars going into research to improve algae/biodiesel production techniques. 

Alternative energy is coming! 

Alternative energy is coming!


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## Tina (Jul 8, 2007)

biodieselman said:


> I don't support agri/biodiesel because I believe it's a mistake to divert acreage away from food production, increasing the cost of many products, not just the price of my corn tortillas.


I agree! We're losing enough agricultural land to development as it is. My concern isn't just price, but the need to import when we hand over production to other countries, as has happened with steel production, electronics production, automobile production, et al. We end up screwing ourselves over, in so many ways. 

Lately, just one of those ways has become very apparent in the manifestation of poison products coming out of China. Not even to mention the loss of jobs that pay actual living wages, and cities that have become ghost towns because of the loss of our manufacturing base.


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## Tina (Jul 8, 2007)

Exactly, Missa. So much land has been taken over by wind production -- it's crazy. Who the hell needs that much wine? There are so many labels that it's dizzying when trying to pick something out. Not only that, but more often than not, I end up seeing a lot of them in the bargain bin, simply _because_, IMO, there are too many out there. The whole supply and demand thing is way out of balance there.


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## Risible (Jul 8, 2007)

Tina said:


> I agree! We're losing enough agricultural land to development as it is. My concern isn't just price, but the need to import when we hand over production to other countries, as has happened with steel production, electronics production, automobile production, et al. We end up screwing ourselves over, in so many ways.
> 
> Lately, just one of those ways has become very apparent in the manifestation of poison products coming out of China. Not even to mention the loss of jobs that pay actual living wages, and cities that have become ghost towns because of the loss of our manufacturing base.



Excellent points, T, not to mention that we're virtually supporting the sub-human living conditions and criminally low wages of laborers in countries like China.


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## Tina (Jul 8, 2007)

Bingo. It has such far-reaching consequences. Another being the WalMart-ization of cities all over the world, where small business owners have been run out of town because they cannot afford to operate. It's all of a piece and all interrelated, and it all sucks.

We have been sold down the river by our various politicians ever since there have _been_ politicians.


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## biodieselman (Jul 8, 2007)

..................................Oh!...Sorry, were you ladies saying something? 

All I could hear was the first 12 seconds of this video on a continuous loop. 

Don't ask me to explain. It's a man thing. 

Oh......yeah...yeah...I completely agree with all you beautiful ladies.


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## Tina (Jul 8, 2007)

Yeah, yeah, I read all about it a month ago or so. Something about some study made of how men can't hear certain frequencies well, and womens' voices just happen to fall within that range, blahyakettyblah.   

(BTW, of course you do! Just because you can't hear us, that doesn't negate the fact that us women are usually correct! *pffffffffffft!*)


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## James (Jul 8, 2007)

biodieselman said:


> This video about global warming is for you Ho Ho.



hahaha... ahh... thats a classic.

that one's going to go round my office tomorrow.


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## Risible (Jul 8, 2007)

Tina said:


> Yeah, yeah, I read all about it a month ago or so. Something about some study made of how men can't hear certain frequencies well, and womens' voices just happen to fall within that range, blahyakettyblah.
> 
> (BTW, of course you do! Just because you can't hear us, that doesn't negate the fact that us women are usually correct! *pffffffffffft!*)



Off topic, but I've heard of this study also. My experience with men, i.e., working in a male-dominated industry supervising a group of men, and being married to a man, is that they *Just Don't Listen*. I don't know whether or not they can hear us, but I do know that they are very good at tuning women out!

Disclaimer to whosoever doesn't agree: *Of course* there are exceptions - besides, this is *my* experience, okay?


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## Ho Ho Tai (Jul 8, 2007)

biodieselman said:


> This video about global warming is for you Ho Ho.



BDMan - I didn't catch your response until someone else did, replied, and it showed up in my e-mail repeater. That's wonderful. Something else with which I can afflict the comfortable and comfort the afflicted.


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## biodieselman (Jul 8, 2007)

Ho Ho Tai said:


> ...That's wonderful. Something else with which I can afflict the comfortable and comfort the afflicted.


 
When I first saw this kid imitating Dubya I almost fell out of my chair laughing. This kid is really funny! Glad you guys enjoyed it.


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## stan_der_man (Jul 9, 2007)

biodieselman said:


> This video about global warming is for you Ho Ho.



That was a funny video, the kid can really do Dubya's voice!

I noticed your's and Risible's sayings below your avatars about the recent heat... We had an unusual situation last week, the high clouds seemed to trap the heat all the way up to our elevation. On Thurs. and Fri. it was hotter up here (by about 3 degrees F...) than it was in Redlands. That doesn't happen very often. I'm glad things are finally cooling down a bit now!

Stan


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## Shosh (Jul 9, 2007)

Hi Bio, I think I am a bit of a water waster, and may need to improve in that regard. Summer or winter I must have two long showers a day. I have to be squeaky clean at all times. In Australia there is a water crisis due to the drought etc. I know that I have to reform my ways, but where to start? Susannah


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## Ho Ho Tai (Jul 11, 2007)

. . . run like hell when the world explodes."

Buffie St. Marie penned and sang those words decades ago. I think this article meshes very well with that thought.

http://news.scotsman.com/index.cfm?id=1077582007


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## biodieselman (Jul 14, 2007)

_Ford to use soybean-based foam in 2008 Mustang seats 
From the Associated Press 
July 13, 2007 

DETROIT  Ford Motor Co. will put soybean-based foam cushions in the seats of the 2008 Mustang and may do the same with other models as well, eventually saving thousands of barrels of oil in the manufacturing process.... 

Most automakers use petroleum-based foam, with an average of 30 pounds going into each vehicle, Ford said.... 

But Debbie Mielewski, technical leader for Ford's materials research and advanced engineering department, said if all the foam was soy-based, Ford would use 11 million pounds of soy oil, and the petroleum savings would be a similar volume. 

The foam, which is 40% soy and 60% oil-based, now costs about the same as conventional foam that is fully oil-based... 

"....but you have to remember that is because we are implementing it on one program and lower volumes," she said, predicting that the cost would drop when used in more vehicles. 

The annual worldwide market for automotive foam is 9 billion pounds, so a switch to a renewable material could have a significant environmental effect, Mielewski said. 

Ford said the environmental advantages included reduced carbon dioxide emissions in manufacturing compared with petroleum-based foam, lower energy use to produce the soy foam and less dependence on foreign oil.... 

And no, the seats are not edible. That's because they still contain petroleum, Ford said._ 

Story condensed from 'Biodiesel Magazine', June 2007, pg 15. 

_"Polytechnic University in New York has been awarded $2.34 million over two years....to perfect a bibioplasticade from vegetable oils that can be converted back to fatty acids for the production of biodiesel.... 

The process involves taking fatty acids....and adding an alcohol (hydroxy) group to the final carbon in the chain.... This synthesis is done with an engineered strain of the yeast Canidida Antarctica. 

A commercially available enzyme.... can then be used to create long-chain polyesters that have similar properties to polyethylene.... By manipulating....conditions of the reaction.... has been able to create plastic films, thermoset plastics and structural plastics.... "Plus they have other properties that go above and beyond what a polyethylene can do. we have shown that material has really good properties." 

The polyesters are biodegradable but break down much more slowly than other bioplastics.... However, an enzyme called cutinase will break apart the polyester bonds and turn the plastic back into fatty acids. The fatty acids can then go through transesterification with methanol to create biodiesel. "At the end of use, we can treat the plastic with an enzyme that breaks it back down into the monomer," Gross said. "We simply shred the polyester and treat it with the cutinase. It's really quite simple.".... 

By the conclusion of the grant, Gross hopes to have a cost-effective, efficient process...."_ 

I really believe that biology will be the solution to many of our problems. Not the least of, ending our energy dependence on Middle-East oil.


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## wrestlingguy (Jul 14, 2007)

Here's a pretty cool one. I work in the ceramic tile & stone business as a sales rep. My company also distributes glass mosaic tiles.

We just signed a national distribution agreement with a glass tile manufacturer that has a true green product! Their glass mosaics are made of crushed bottles, broken windshields, and any other glass that can be broken down, crushed, and then re-heated back into the glass mosaics they become. Temperatures of over 2,000 degrees are used to melt the glass back down, and then hit with 6,000 pounds of pressure as the glass cools to create the glass tile. This process results in a very stable and aesthetically beautiful tile.

We have featured these products on selection boards that are also made from recycled paper.


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## biodieselman (Jul 14, 2007)

wrestlingguy said:


> ....We just signed a national distribution agreement with a glass tile manufacturer that has a true green product! Their glass mosaics are made of crushed bottles, broken windshields, and any other glass that can be broken down, crushed, and then re-heated back into the glass mosaics they become. Temperatures of over 2,000 degrees are used to melt the glass back down, and then hit with 6,000 pounds of pressure as the glass cools to create the glass tile. This process results in a very stable and aesthetically beautiful tile.
> 
> We have featured these products on selection boards that are also made from recycled paper.


 
There is an increasing number of building owners who want "green" buildings. Contractors are scrambling to find resources for recycled and green building materials. Is your company listed in the Rate It Green catalog or the GreenSpec Directory? 

Do I get any commission from future sales referred through these resources?


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## Paul Delacroix (Jul 15, 2007)

Tina said:


> *Thank you very much, biodieselman!
> 
> I made this thread sticky, because whether one agrees whether there is such a thing as global warming or not, it cannot hurt to do what we can to be good to our wonderful planet.
> 
> - Tina*


*

I agree; I do not have ANY interest or belief in global warming, and even if it was real, it would probably be just as beneficial as harmful to the human race. However, I believe it is patent nonsense. But I believe the civilized world is too polluted--my concerns are air pollution from fossil fuels, urban sprawl, destruction of offshore reefs, and sewage disposal. 

But the biggest ecological problem, IMHO, is dependency on fossil fuels. They are technologically obsolete, we don't need them, and we should get rid of them. 

The three inexhaustible energy sources we should use are Veggie Diesel, solar, and wind power. Those three can fill the void of fossil fuels. Wind farms and solar facilities can be placed in deserts by the thousands. More wind towers can also be placed on offshore rigs in the ocean, where spoiled urbanites do not have to look at them. There is limitless space for wind farms.

But the best solution, which we can implement right away, is vegetable oil diesel, often called "bio-diesel". This is the one that scares the hell out of Big Oil and their representatives in the media and government. With gentle market controls (changing subsidies, offering tax breaks, etc.), bio-diesel could be phased in rapidly. It could clean the air, end OPEC dependency, and greatly stimulate farming.*


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## Tina (Jul 15, 2007)

Paul, have you seen the photos of Bio's 'still'? That's what I call it, because that's kind of what it looks like to me -- albeit a high-tech one. He makes his own fuel and it costs him, what, I think he said 55 cents per gallon. I could go for that. Would make running a truck very economical.

I read not long ago that they're (whomever "they" are) looking into putting wind towers out at sea. I think that could be a great thing, as there's usually a good breeze out there, and no one can complain about how they look (though I think wind farms kind of look pretty). 

I do believe the death of the electric car was terrible; it had such promise, and even if you consider that the power for the electricity were to come from a coal plant, it would pollute less than a car running on petroleum. 

When the 'answer' comes, I don't think it will be any one thing, but a collection of alternatives to petroleum-based oil, which has more negative consequences than simply pollution.


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## Paul Delacroix (Jul 15, 2007)

Tina said:


> Paul, have you seen the photos of Bio's 'still'? That's what I call it, because that's kind of what it looks like to me -- albeit a high-tech one. He makes his own fuel and it costs him, what, I think he said 55 cents per gallon. I could go for that. Would make running a truck very economical.



Nope. I haven't seen the "still". Is it a tank system for mixing fuels? You can run most diesels on pure vegetable oil, too..for example many tractors can run on pure canola oil.


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## biodieselman (Jul 16, 2007)

Paul Delacroix said:


> ... I believe the civilized world is too polluted--my concerns are air pollution from fossil fuels, urban sprawl, destruction of offshore reefs, and sewage disposal.
> 
> But the biggest ecological problem, IMHO, is dependency on fossil fuels. They are technologically obsolete, we don't need them, and we should get rid of them.
> 
> ...


 
I'm in near complete agreement with much of of your post. However, IMO, conservation is the first & easiest thing all us can do each & every day. Using ocean wave energy has great potential also. 

With sulfur removed from dino-diesel, you will soon see in the next year or so, clean burning diesels being imported from Europe & Japan. We could reduce Middle East oil imports 30 to 40% right off the top by getting rid of our greenhouse gas spewing gasoline powered cars. 

We will soon see cars that can realistically get over 100 mpg using diesel/hybrid electric cars. MIT performed a 'total life cycle' study recently comparing hydrogen fuel cell cars with 100% biodiesel/hybrid electric cars. Using 100% renewable biodiesel in an electric/hybrid is damn near as clean as a hydrogen fuel cell. That's optimistically assuming a fuel cell will ever affordable & assuming a cheap method of producing hydrogen is ever possible. 

I don't believe we should divert farm land to virgin feedstock production for transportation fuels. I will keep repeating my agenda until most of you guys start believing Michael Briggs, University of New Hampshire, Physics Department. . Here is a brief, simplistic explanation of algae/biodiesel. 

I do however, *totally support* recycling used waste vegetable oil & animal fats into biodiesel instead of polluting our water & filling our land fills. Indeed, what once was disposed of as waste, is now being recycled into biodiesel. Tom Bryan, Editorial Director of 'Biodiesel Magazine' wrote in the June 2007 issue, "_...there is now at least 2.2 billion gallons of biodiesel production capacity represented by proposed project around the country. In addition, there's about 1 billion gallons of capacity already on line and another 1 billion under construction... This existing, under construction and proposed capacity represents twice the amount of crude oil refined into diesel imported from Iraq each year..._" 

"_A New Zealand company has successfully turned sewage into modern-day gold. Marlborough-based Aquaflow Bionomic yesterday announced it had produced its first sample of bio-diesel fuel from algae in sewage ponds._" PetroSun is planning a 20 million gallon/year algae/biodiesel plant in Australia. Cetane Energy is building a 3 million gallon/year algae/biodiesel plant in Carlsbad, New Mexico. About half of the 1.2 billion gal/yr biodiesel plants currently under construction in the U.S. uses waste veg. oil & animal fats as their feed stock. The rest uses virgin veg. oil as feed stock. Personally, I would rather see algae fed sewage as the first step in water treatment treatment. Sewage fed algae is 10 times more productive per acre than soy bean oil or corn oil. No farm land is required. Can be grown on barges in the ocean or in our vast western desert lands where there is lots of sunshine. After all, the 100% biodiesel I burn in my truck, ultimately is energy from the sun. 

Yes Paul, I'm obsessed with biodiesel. Just ask Tina. Transesterification is my friend. I've only been to a gas station once since December 2005. If people bitch about the war, I can tell them, our troops aren't dying for my fuel. If people bitch about obscene Big Oil profits, I can tell them I stopped giving Big Oil my money Dec. '05. If people bitch about global warming & pollution, I can tell them I've been 100% carbon neutral since Dec. '05. If people bitch about financing terrorist by buying gasoline, I can tell them I stopped giving terrorists money Dec. '05. If they brag how green their Prius is, I can honestly say my one ton, 4x4, 650lbs of torque, 100% biodiesel burning, fire breathing, 350hp, 6.7L 2007 Cummins, (I would never do this to my new truck), clean emissions diesel, is cleaner & greener than their wimpy Prius. I don't see a down side to biodiesel.

Think diesels are slow? The Turbocharged, Direct Injected AudiR10 is kicking all the Porsches, Lamborghinis, Aston Martins & all the hottest cars in the world's collective asses with an oil burning diesel. Peugeot is first, trying to play catch-up with the Audi diesel with their own diesel in this year's Le Mans.

Be patient Tina, electric cars are coming soon.


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## biodieselman (Jul 16, 2007)

Waste vegetable oil is not an EPA-approved fuel. The glycerin on the triglyceride molecule does not burn readily and will eventually leave carbon to "coke" an engine's injectors, whereas 100% biodiesel is completely certified and approved for use by the EPA as an alternative fuel.

I bought a ton of bumper stickers and had them plastered all over the back of my old truck; a couple of them I put on my "still," Praise the Lard, and Biodiesel - Moonshine for Your Diesel.

Tina, are you making fun of my moonshine-producin' Tennessee ancestors? 

See? No black carbon soot from new clean-burning diesel technology! 

View attachment resize11.jpg


View attachment resize12.jpg


View attachment resize8.jpg


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## Tina (Jul 16, 2007)

Missa! Get out of there, girl! Ris has food cooking -- you don't want to miss that!!


biodieselman said:


> Yes Paul, I'm obsessed with biodiesel. Just ask Tina.


Yes, and Tina admires you greatly for this (and more!). 


> Be patient Tina, electric cars are coming soon.


A hybrid of biodiesel and electricity would be fantastic. Then all it would take is $$$$ and I would SO be all over that!


biodieselman said:


> Tina, are you making fun of my moonshine-producin' Tennessee ancestors?


No way! They were a God-send to thirsty people during prohibition.  "Still" is my attempt at tech talk gone horribly awry.


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## biodieselman (Jul 16, 2007)

missaf said:


> (help, I'm trapped inside the spare bio-diesel storage tanks!)



I've been wondering why my exhaust has been smelling so sweet & nice lately instead of smelling of french fries.


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## Surlysomething (Jul 16, 2007)

Bring your own bag to haul your groceries home with.


That's my latest "I need to change my habits" action.


http://www.presidentschoice.ca/FoodAndRecipes/HealthyLiving/Editorial.aspx/id/653

These bags are affordable (in Canada).


2cents.

Tina


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## stan_der_man (Jul 16, 2007)

You know Bio, ya gotta say one thing about ozone, CO2 and atmospheric particulate... it is the elixir of beautiful sunsets.

Speaking of phenomenal atmospheric conditions... It was great having you and Risible up the mountain for a visit and dinner! Camping is going to be fun. I know Missaf will love the campground.

Stan

P.S. Nice new truck BTW! Don't worry Missaf being in the biofuel... if you stall, just look for the bulge in the fuel line. I saw that on a Bugs Bunny cartoon once... 

Stan


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## Risible (Jul 16, 2007)

missaf said:


> Hey, as long as no margaritas were consumed on the mountain without me



Not to worry, hon. That gallon jug of booze that you brought over is intact along with the mix; we'll be enjoying those frosty cold margaritas soon enough! Can't wait to face you off over a large cup of margarita and Candyland .


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## stan_der_man (Jul 16, 2007)

Next month's adventure...


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## stan_der_man (Jul 16, 2007)

missaf said:


> Haha!
> 
> See, that's not fair. Stan and mtnmaiden are used to the elevation. Add the lack of oxygen for Risible and I, and we won't be coherent for very long!



We'll have to get in the harmonica duet before that happens!  

Stan


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## biodieselman (Jul 21, 2007)

_Plug-in hybrids seen as vehicles for change 
A study projects lower emissions and sufficient power grid capacity. 
By Martin Zimmerman, Times Staff Writer 
July 20, 2007 

"The widespread use of plug-in hybrid vehicles  which could be driven up to 40 miles on electric power alone  would significantly reduce greenhouse gas emissions in the United States without overloading the nation's power grid, according to a new study. 

The upbeat news for plug-ins, seen by many as the next big step in environmentally friendly automotive technology, came with two caveats. Achieving the *maximum air quality improvements would require a significant cut in the pollution produced by electric utilities.* It's also dependent on large-scale adoption of plug-in hybrids, which may not be in new-car showrooms for several years. 

Even so, backers of plug-in technology were heartened by the latest findings, which could help defuse the claim that the vehicles simply would transfer the source of air pollution from vehicle tailpipes to power station smokestacks. 

... Barring a breakthrough in battery technology, however, most say it will be several years before the vehicles are available at dealers. 

...Cost is also an issue. Some experts estimate plug-in technology could add $10,000 to the sticker price. Even with gas selling for more than $3 a gallon and electricity costs for plug-ins pegged at the equivalent of less than $1 a gallon, that's a significant markup. 

...A raft of proposals has been introduced in Congress that would provide incentives to manufacturers and buyers of plug-ins, as well as provide additional funding for battery development and mandate the use of plug-ins in government vehicle fleets. 

...Priuses modified to run as plug-ins have achieved more than 100 mpg. 

...Under a "middle case" scenario, which assumes plug-ins make up 62% of U.S. passenger vehicles by 2050 and utilities adopt more stringent pollution-control measures, emissions would be cut by 468 million tons a year. 

That would be equal to removing 82.5 million vehicles, about a third of the light vehicles on the road today. 

...Although the study estimates that plug-ins would become available in 2010, the outlook for the vehicles is murky. That's mainly because of questions about lithium ion batteries, which have caused fires in laptop computers. _" 


I would prefer traditional battery technology because lithium ion batteries become toxic hazardous waste at the end of their life cycle. But then again, everything pollutes one way or another. Except maybe for algae/biodiesel. 


_Getting revved on diesels 
The percentage of motorists who would consider buying such a vehicle doubles in a year, a survey finds. 
By Martin Zimmerman, Times Staff Writer 
July 21, 2007 

...In a recent survey by J.D. Power & Associates, the percentage of new-car shoppers who said they would consider buying a diesel-powered vehicle rose to 23% from 12% a year ago, while the portion who said they would consider a gasoline-electric hybrid slipped from 57% to 50%. Surveys by Kelley Blue Book have shown a similar trend. 

Experts credit the allure of new, cleaner diesel engines  which are expected to meet even California's strict air quality standards  as well as the prospect of getting better fuel mileage without sacrificing performance. 

Also playing a role: disappointment with the real-world fuel economy of hybrids, which often fell well short of government mileage estimates. 

...Improvements in diesel engine technology and recent federal mandates requiring cleaner diesel fuel are leading to diesel-powered vehicles that can meet air-quality standards in all 50 states. 

...But a slew of other automakers, including Honda Motor Co., Nissan Motor Co., Volkswagen and Audi, are planning to introduce diesel models in the U.S. in the next few years. 

...Besides making strides environmentally, diesels are scoring pocketbook points. Diesels typically cost $1,000 to $2,000 more than a comparable gasoline-powered car but get 25% to 40% better gas mileage... 

...Diesel engines, which ignite fuel by compression rather than with spark plugs, are noted for delivering better mileage while still providing the kind of acceleration traditionally favored by American drivers. Hybrids, by contrast, are sometimes derided as being under-powered. 

..."Consumers are going to see a greater diversity of powertrain options going forward," Michels said, "but we still think the hybrid has the best balance of miles per gallon, greenhouse gas emissions and, particularly important for California, low smog emissions."_ 

The best all worlds would emulate existing technology American engineers developed for our railroad locomotives. Detroit says they 'can't build' cars that get good fuel economy, but G.E. has been making the most fuel efficient vehicles ever made, a diesel/electric hybrid locomotive. A high-torque, low-RPM, fuel-efficient, clean-burning diesel would be a marriage made in heaven, allowing cars to realistically get 100 mpg & not sacrifice performance. Throw in a few thousand acres of unusable, arid, unfertile desert in the American west to grow algae/biodiesel, & nuclear power that produces no greenhouse gas for plug-ins, we could get out of the Middle East for good.


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## biodieselman (Jul 27, 2007)

"_...But greener motorsports is something over which we can definitely sit down with our compatriots at sister site AutoblogGreen. In fact, we'd go as far to say that it's the one thing that could stand to keep automobile racing relevant in the modern era, and we'll applaud any series, team or supplier that moves the cause forward. 

Audi, then, is a particular favorite, for their milestone achievement of fielding the diesel-powered R10 in endurance racing series and events  and winning, sweeping the field, in fact, despite the self-imposed oil-burning handicap. But the boys at Ingolstadt aren't about the rest on their proverbial laurels, they're pushing forward, together with their sponsors over at Shell. They've announced that at next year's 24 Hours of Le Mans, they'll not only be racing on diesel, they'll be racing on biodiesel!..._" 

Audi swept the 2006 Le Mans & other races with their new diesel-powered car & placed 1st in the 2007 Le Mans. Audi would have had 2nd place also, but they had a turbo detonation & took too long to repair. A brand new Peugeot diesel took second. Other racing teams are crying foul, saying that diesels have an unfair racing advantage.:blink: 

The Audi diesel was handicapped this year with a 10% smaller fuel tank trying to offset the fuel efficiency advantage, but finished 11 laps ahead of the 3rd place gasser. The Germans are trying to diffuse the 'unfair diesel advantage' by using biodiesel, which has about 8 to 10% less energy per pound than dino-diesel. But the Germans aren't stupid. They know that biodiesel is a denser heavier molecule meaning more pounds per gallon. Biodiesel has a much higher cetane rating, similar to the octane rating for gasoline, which means they can use higher boost pressures & a bigger intercooler for more power. Those Germans are crafty. 

Green is coming to racing! I just love the sound of the first 15 seconds of this video.


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## Paul Delacroix (Jul 28, 2007)

biodieselman said:


> _
> 
> The best all worlds would emulate existing technology American engineers developed for our railroad locomotives. Detroit says they 'can't build' cars that get good fuel economy, but G.E. has been making the most fuel efficient vehicles ever made, a diesel/electric hybrid locomotive. A high-torque, low-RPM, fuel-efficient, clean-burning diesel would be a marriage made in heaven, allowing cars to realistically get 100 mpg & not sacrifice performance. Throw in a few thousand acres of unusable, arid, unfertile desert in the American west to grow algae/biodiesel, & nuclear power that produces no greenhouse gas for plug-ins, we could get out of the Middle East for good._


_

I actually doubt we need the nuclear. Wind power can take over our electrical needs--it'll take a few years to implement, but windmills are far more efficient and sustainable than hydrocarbons and nuclear. Your algae farms could use the same ground level acreage of West Texas or New Mexico or Arizona in the shadows of wind farm towers. 

We don't need geology based energy...we never did. Windmills and bio-diesel predated unleaded gasoline and nuclear power._


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## biodieselman (Jul 28, 2007)

missaf said:


> I'm not keen on wind-generated power, mostly because of its effects on the ecosystem. Entire flocks of birds have re-routed their passage through the Tehachapi mountains of California because of the wind machines. I can't imagine what migratory consequences there would be with wind machines located on every hill side.
> 
> To curb electrical usage in homes so it can be replaced for car power, I'd be happy to solar power my home. I realize not everyone can do this, but for those that can, running their meters backwards would help immensely, and they could power their cars at the same time.
> 
> Algae/biodiesel would definitely be easy to do here in the desert. The only problem would be that our water tables are so low, because it is a desert, there wouldn't be any left for the people.


 
There is no single energy silver bullet. Windmill blades can also kill birds. The wind doesn't always blow. Ris & I are this close to covering the southern roof exposure with solar panels but the costs are still too high. The problem with solar is that the sun doesn't always shine, especially at night. 

The only reason I'm in favor of nuclear is because they emit no greenhouse gas. There are problems with all energy sources, even with hydro/electric. 

I'm tellin' ya, algae/biodiesel is the closest thing there is to an energy silver bullet. Missa, algae doesn't grow well in clean water. We wouldn't need to pump out your water table unlike ethanol production. I would guess there's enough BS from Washington DC & sewage flowing out of L.A. to grow enough algae to supply the whole nation with transportation fuel. 

It's not just about being green for me. I seriously believe our energy dependence on Middle East is a huge national security issue. It's really stupid to fund terrorism with each & every gasoline fill-up. But I know that every one doesn't have a biodiesel 'still'. Speaking of which, I got to finish the 100 gallon batch of 'home brew' I made last weekend.


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## biodieselman (Jul 28, 2007)

U.S. offers way to atone for carbon guilt

By Claudia Lauer, Times Staff Writer
July 26, 2007
_
"WASHINGTON — You take public transportation to work, use energy-saving lightbulbs and turn off the air conditioner when you're not home — but still you feel somewhat guilty that your lifestyle isn't totally pollution-free.

The federal government may have an answer for you.

For years, companies have been allowed to compensate for greenhouse gas emissions by purchasing "carbon offsets" — vouchers for investment in alternative energy sources, tree-planting and other projects that can mitigate global warming.

Now the idea is spreading to individuals, with the Forest Service's announcement Wednesday that it will be the first federal agency to offer personal carbon offsets through an initiative called the Carbon Capital Fund.

"We came up with the idea because everyone is looking at what they can do in terms of climate change," said Bill Possiel, president of the National Forest Foundation, a nonprofit partner of the Forest Service. "The money goes to a restricted fund for projects on national forests."

Trees and forests are "carbon sinks," Possiel said, because they draw carbon dioxide — the main greenhouse gas blamed for global warming — out of the atmosphere and store it for long periods of time....

Under the program, individuals can use a "carbon calculator" at http://www.carboncapitalfund.org to figure out the size of their carbon footprint. Then, they can buy offsets at $6 per metric ton of carbon dioxide. An average family of four is responsible for 19 to 30 metric tons of carbon dioxide a year, so the offsets would cost $114 to $180....

There are other programs that allow individuals to purchase carbon offsets, but environmentalists have criticized them for insufficient regulation and lack of proof of the funds' use. That's not the case with the Forest Service program, Possiel said.

"We have third-party verification, a company that looks at our calculations but also does on-site verification," he said. "A lot of programs have verifications through computer models. The important component for us is the ground truth."

Possiel said that almost all of the money would go to a restricted fund for planting trees, improving native wildlife habitat, and restoring land damaged by wildfires and other natural disasters. A small portion would be spent on the third-party verification....

For almost eight years, the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service has had a similar program for companies and large groups.

That program was opened to individuals in April, an agency spokesman said.

However, unlike the Forest Service initiative, in which the government and the National Forest Foundation are directly responsible for the offset purchases, the Fish and Wildlife Service program funnels contributions to organizations, such as the World Wildlife Fund, that restore habitat and plant trees."_

Ris & my carbon footprint, using the 'carboncapitalfund' "carbon calculator", is 2.39 metric tons/yr of CO2. 

I have biodiesel carbon credits for sale if anyone is interested.


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## Ho Ho Tai (Jul 28, 2007)

biodieselman said:


> U.S. offers way to atone for carbon guilt
> 
> Ris & my carbon footprint, using the 'carboncapitalfund' "carbon calculator", is 2.39 metric tons/yr of CO2.
> 
> I have biodiesel carbon credits for sale if anyone is interested.



BDMan - I owe about a million green cans, but I'm canned out for the moment. This is the best I can do. You can store quite a bit of biodiesel in these.


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## biodieselman (Jul 28, 2007)

Ho Ho Tai said:


> BDMan - I owe about a million green cans, but I'm canned out for the moment. This is the best I can do. You can store quite a bit of biodiesel in these.


 
Ris is cringing in despair at the thought of more 55gal drums in the garage. I have two to hold collected waste veg. oil & two for finished biodiesel. The last two are one with methanol & a second for the return deposit when buying more methanol. 

One of the major advantages of biodiesel is that it's 10 time less toxic than table salt & biodegradable. One of the problems with biodiesel is that it's more biodegradable than table sugar. To avoid 'stuff' growing in my fuel tank, I only make a fresh batch as needed. So I really don't need the extra drums. Thanks anyway Ho Ho Tai.  

$1.00/gal Missa? That would only leave me with a 30 cent/gal profit after buying the new filtration system. Ah what the hell Missa, I don't want to be greedy like Exxon. $1.00 a gallon is OK. But you gotta help with collecting the waste cooking oil.


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## Ho Ho Tai (Jul 28, 2007)

biodieselman said:


> Ris & I are this close to covering the southern roof exposure with solar panels but the costs are still too high. The problem with solar is that the sun doesn't always shine, especially at night.



BDMan - I sent the following article to many, including Risible and several profs in my old physics department. Did you see them? Take a look. Do you think there is anything to it? I just checked. As of July 28, 2007, the article is still available.

NJIT Researchers Develop Inexpensive, Easy Process To Produce Solar Panels

http://www.njit.edu/publicinfo/press_releases/release_1040.php


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## biodieselman (Jul 28, 2007)

Ho Ho Tai said:


> BDMan - I sent the following article to many, including Risible and several profs in my old physics department. Did you see them? Take a look. Do you think there is anything to it? I just checked. As of July 28, 2007, the article is still available.
> 
> NJIT Researchers Develop Inexpensive, Easy Process To Produce Solar Panels
> 
> http://www.njit.edu/publicinfo/press_releases/release_1040.php


 
Thanks, I read the article you referenced. The problem is that there are so many new, promising technologies that are are near market ready, I'm afraid to fork out money, only to find something cheaper & better just hit the market. 

I keep reading about new materials being developed that show great promise but haven't reached the market yet. Here is a snipped article on thin film PhotoVoltaic materials. 

"_...The report examines key product sectors that will create revenue opportunities over the next several years. Integrated building and construction products such as PV enabled roofing and window materials are projected to be the largest market opportunity measuring $800 million ($US) in 2011 with large project and consumer electronic products the second and third largest market opportunities. 

On the materials front, amorphous silicon, the best established of the various thin-film PV materials, will represent an $800 million ($US) opportunity followed by organic and hybrid organic/inorganic materials and then CIS/CIGS. 

Thin film/organic PV is also generating buzz in the industry and several companies have received large VC rounds. Major multinationals are also supporting this technology as Honda has announced it will soon start full-scale production of thin film PV and Shell has just sold off its conventional PV business to focus on thin film. On the other hand, NanoMarkets points out that thin film and organic PV is also a technology space that has received its fair share of hype and controversy with competing claims by different manufacturers on where and how it can be applied and disputes over conversion efficiencies and costs per watt...._" 

The electronics to convert DC voltage from PV film, paint or panels into true sine wave, 60hz, 120v AC are also getting cheaper. 

I was reading in my "Biodiesel Magazine," published for worldwide commercial biodiesel producers, "Surveys show only about 5 percent of consumers are truly 'green' enough to pay more for alternative fuels...." I'm afraid I'm still in that category, the prices have to come down a little more per kilowatt before I can afford a PV system. 

But I'm optimistic that with a little increase in federal & state tax incentives, plus reduced materials & electronic costs, soon my roof will be covered with PV photovoltaics, here in sunny So Cal, where we have horrible sunstorms nearly every day  .


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## MrChipz (Jul 29, 2007)

There are some algae that grow well in seawater and contain up to 30% oil. Making biodiesel out of them makes sense, because that wouldn't compete with food crops for land and fresh water. Salvaging used fryer oil that would otherwise be dumped or incinerated is also a good idea. OTOH, burning food in cars will only drive up the prices of the crops you make the biodiesel from, which will exert pressure on food prices generally. That's good news for the agricorps, bad news for the rest of us.


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## biodieselman (Aug 28, 2007)

Abandoned copper smelters, old dumps, chemical refuse heaps, cesspools, contaminated heavy industrial sites, hazardous waste sites. How can the EPA's Superfund program clean up thousands of acres of polluted soils after years of heavy industry? ...No guesses?...Come on, you guys know me. BIODIESEL :doh: 

DaimlerChrysler is one of several large companies that polluted a five square-mile area in Rose Township in Oakland County, Mich. The soil & ground water will remain polluted for years. Can't build schools on it, can't make a park out of it, no one will eat anything grown on it.... Wait... we can use the contaminated ground water & contaminated soil to grow soybeans for biodiesel. 

DaimlerChrysler & other responsible parties formed a unique partnership to turn the Rose Township industrial area into crop land for biodiesel production. Michigan & Detroit are looking to position themselves as leaders in the development of alternative fuels. 

The Department of Crop and Soil Sciences at Michigan State University & NextEnergy Center (NEC) funded by the U.S. DOE National Biofuels Energy Laboratory, will monitor the site to determine if growing crops on contaminated soil will aid in cleaning up soil & ground water contamination. They will research how best to clean up pollution, reclaim the land & work towards energy independence.

The EPA Superfund also has work underway at an additional 422 contaminated sites across the nation. The EPA is using this as a "return to use" initiative, making what is now 'useless land', productive once again.


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## J34 (Aug 30, 2007)

If you live in New Jersey there are dozens of these superfund sites. Many of these places are heavily contaminated. In my town I remember there was a DuPont plant that was torn down. It took over 7yrs for them to finally build on it. I am a very strong advocate of alternative energy sources. Right now I study Architecture and Cardiology. There are ways we can build homes that waste little to no energy. The problem is that most homes in the US are terribly inefficient and very old. Even if we all fix the car situation there is the major problem w/ housing.


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## Risible (Aug 30, 2007)

J34 said:


> If you live in New Jersey there are dozens of these superfund sites. Many of these places are heavily contaminated. In my town I remember there was a DuPont plant that was torn down. It took over 7yrs for them to finally build on it. I am a very strong advocate of alternative energy sources. Right now I study Architecture and Cardiology. There are ways we can build homes that waste little to no energy. The problem is that most homes in the US are terribly inefficient and very old. Even if we all fix the car situation there is the major problem w/ housing.



Bio and I own a home in So Cal. We'd love to get off the grid by installing a solar energy system. Pretty pricey, this is.

I wish the Bush Administration had put the country in debt to the tune of trillions of dollars to make our country oil independent rather than wage a false war. I'd like to see the government get serious about subsidizing the modernization of the energy efficiency of these older homes that you mentioned. Yeah, it'd cost the taxpayers big bucks, but it would benefit you, me, and every other citizen here.


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## J34 (Aug 30, 2007)

^^^^ Very true. I don't want to look back in the past, but one of the reasons I wanted Al Gore to be president was because of his eco-concerns. He always fought to protect nature and advocate for many green intitiatives. Unfortanetely we got stuck with the oil barron from Texas controlling our energy policy.


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## biodieselman (Aug 31, 2007)

J34 said:


> ... There are ways we can build homes that waste little to no energy. The problem is that most homes in the US are terribly inefficient and very old. Even if we all fix the car situation there is the major problem w/ housing.


 
I've been reading *many* examples of states, cities & counties across the nation acting to reduce greenhouse gas emissions. Some one has to act, at the federal government level they are too busy passing laws to enrich huge multi-national corporations or passing themselves pay raises. 

Here is the latest example of a local California government doing what congress can't or more likely won't do. Acting with global responsibility. 

_"San Bernardino County to waive fees for solar, wind systems... 
By Sara Lin, Los Angeles Times Staff Writer 
August 28, 2007 

Environmentally friendly developers and homeowners in San Bernardino County could start seeing green -- and saving money -- thanks to initiatives announced Monday by county supervisors. 

Under a four-part plan unveiled by board Chairman Paul Biane that is expected to be approved by the Board of Supervisors today, the county will waive building permit fees for homeowners installing solar and wind-generated energy systems and expedite applications from developers whose projects meet certain green-building criteria. 

"Time is money," Biane said. "We're encouraging residents and businesses to make changes that will help us cut our greenhouse gas emissions." 

Homeowners currently pay $200 for a solar permit and $250 for a wind-energy permit, county planning officials said.... 

...also features a county website encouraging residents to "go green" and a pledge by supervisors that new county buildings and any renovations of existing facilities will comply with national green building standards. Several California counties, including Orange and Marin, have incorporated greenhouse gas measures in their planning.... 

...Under San Bernardino County's new plan, several other energy-efficient technologies for the home will be covered by the permit fee waiver, include tankless water heaters and energy-efficient heating, ventilation and air-conditioning systems. The priority processing for green builders will shave weeks off a review process that can last more than a year. 

The county is also trying to cut carbon emissions by expanding its fleet of hybrid cars..."_ 

*Alternative energy is coming, alternative energy is coming.* 

View attachment woot2.gif


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## biodieselman (Sep 11, 2007)

I found a good algae/biodiesel production process video (please be patient, it takes a couple of minutes to load up). This video only represents one of many processes currently being developed. Oilgae is still developing technology, but there are many nations & companies racing to develop a cost-effective replacement for Middle East oil.

Seems I was too quick to dismiss ethanol & hydrogen.

Pond scum algae for biodiesel is good at growing oil, allowing it to float on water. 

Other species of algae are good at growing carbohydrates which can be used to make ethanol or possibly hydrogen. Algae may finally make elemental hydrogen production cost effective instead of today's technology, requiring more energy to produce hydrogen than the energy the process yields. Now if only they can get the cost of a hydrogen fuel cell car under $200K. 

There is also tons of research in bio-plastics using soy, corn & of course algae. 

Oilgae loves to eat our nitrogen-polluted sewage, loves to eat our greenhouse gas pollution, doesn't take food off our tables & doesn't need good farm land to grow.

We really need to stop funding Middle East terrorism with our gasoline nozzles.


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## Ho Ho Tai (Sep 12, 2007)

biodieselman said:


> Pond scum algae for biodiesel is good at growing oil, allowing it to float on water.
> 
> Other species of algae are good at growing carbohydrates which can be used to make ethanol or possibly hydrogen. Algae may finally make elemental hydrogen production cost effective instead of today's technology, requiring more energy to produce hydrogen than the energy the process yields. Now if only they can get the cost of a hydrogen fuel cell car under $200K.
> 
> ...



Wouldn't it be a wonderful quirk of fate of pondscum pulled the rug out from under the 'Pondscum' who who run Big Government, Big Oil, Big et c., who feed off the rest of us and our bad habits?

I'd like your comments, BDMan, on another potential alternative which was discussed in a recent NYTimes article: Jatropha. This NYTimes article appears to have an open link. If it doesn't work, try Googling [Jatropha "Lydia Polgreen"]
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/09/09/w...ference/Times Topics/People/P/Polgreen, Lydia

I offer this brief excerpt:

"Malis Farmers Discover a Weeds Potential Power"
By LYDIA POLGREEN
Published: September 9, 2007

KOULIKORO, Mali  When Suleiman Diarra Bananis brother said that the poisonous black seeds dropping from the seemingly worthless weed that had grown around his family farm for decades could be used to run a generator, or even a car, Mr. Banani did not believe him. When he suggested that they intersperse the plant, until now used as a natural fence between rows of their regular crops  edible millet, peanuts, corn and beans  he thought his older brother, Dadjo, was crazy.


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## biodieselman (Sep 20, 2007)

I've been a lazy gardener this year, with the multiple home improvement projects taking up too much time. At least I've managed to completely stay away from gas stations for another year. Just wouldn't do to pull up into a station & stick a dino-diesel nozzle into a truck with bumper stickers reading "Biodiesel -Cleaner Than A Prius" & "Biodiesel - Helping To Reverse the Greenhouse Effect" now would it?:doh: 

I've started cleaning up spent spring/summer plants, getting ready for fall/winter planting. The mild L.A. winters are actually the best time for gardening. Can't grow heat loving crops such as corn & beans but the cool season veggies love the warm days & cool nights. There's no big burst of crops greater than you can eat & the insect pest problems are greatly reduced.

You can see in Ris's basket, she loves baskets, zucchini, okra, tomatoes & sweet corn. The tomato vines are two years old, yes you heard me - two years old, & the vines are losing vigor as the fruits are getting smaller & smaller. Time for them to go. The variety of sweet corn I grew this year is a Japanese favorite called Montauk that is truly superior. Super sweet genes usually make the kernels tough & the corn flavor is lost. Montauk kernels are too tender for commercial shipping, it has a very high sugar content yet retains corn flavor.:eat2: I'm probably going to grow Montauk again. Corn sugars immediately begin converting to starch & I waited just long enough to take a photo. I've already eaten this corn & I got butter all in my keyboard while typing this posting.:eat1: :eat2: 

We had too many carrots left from last fall's planting & I didn't get around to pulling them out to replant the bed with a summer crop. Carrot is a biennial, planted as an annual for eating, flowers & produces seed the second year. After two years of growing deep into a dark hole in the fertile soil of Mother Earth, they grew a 'little woody'. 

View attachment resize42.jpg


View attachment resize43.jpg


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## Ho Ho Tai (Sep 20, 2007)

biodieselman said:


> You can see in Ris's basket, she loves baskets, zucchini, okra, tomatoes & sweet corn.
> 
> We had too many carrots left from last fall's planting & I didn't get around to pulling them out to replant the bed with a summer crop. Carrot is a biennial, planted as an annual for eating, flowers & produces seed the second year. After two years of growing deep into a dark hole in the fertile soil of Mother Earth, they grew a 'little woody'.



OK - I gotta ask. Somebody will, and I may as well have the bad-taste albatross hung around my neck. In that first picture, is that a zucchini you're holding, or are you just glad to see Risible?

In the second - "Carrot Critter Attacks" Gad! What is that thing?


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## biodieselman (Sep 20, 2007)

Ho Ho Tai said:


> OK - I gotta ask. Somebody will, and I may as well have the bad-taste albatross hung around my neck. In that first picture, is that a zucchini you're holding, or are you just glad to see Risible?
> 
> In the second - "Carrot Critter Attacks" Gad! What is that thing?


 
That's a cucumber! What did you think it was? BTW, I'm always glad to see Ris, she's a beautiful woman!:wubu:  

Why... that's a carrot! What did you think it was?

And you sir, never have bad taste. I have nothing but respect for you. I'm being serious this time.:bow:


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## stan_der_man (Sep 22, 2007)

Carrots are nature's original phallic symbol... 



Here's an article that caught my eye in yesterday's L.A. Times:

"To go green, live closer to work"
"New study says planning compact, mixed-use communities instead of suburbs would help save the planet from effects of greenhouse gases."

Didn't the Europeans discover that 50 years ago!?

Stan


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## biodieselman (Sep 23, 2007)

fa_man_stan said:


> Carrots are nature's original phallic symbol... ...


 
Geez, Stan, you should have seen some of the other carrots I threw into the green waste recycle bin. Some of the ones that weren't forked were over 20" long & much thicker than a soda can. 

Yesterday I went to a local Hazardous Waste Round Up, this one in nearby Covina. I save all the defective circuit boards I replace at work because of the lead solder & other toxic chemicals in the circuit boards. I dropped off an old computer, spent AA batteries, four nearly empty cans of paint from the bathroom remodel, fluorescent bulbs & the NiCad battery from Ris's electric leg shaver. 

Feels good to dispose of stuff responsibly.


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## biodieselman (Oct 3, 2007)

"bioplastics Magazine", June, 2007, pg 5 



> *Metabolix and AMD announce brand name Mirel *tm
> 
> Metaboliz... and Archer Daniels Midland... announced they have named their Joint venture Telles tm, after the Roman goddess of the Earth. Telles is now building its first commercial scale plant for the production of PHA in Clinton, Iowa, USA. This plant is expected to start up in 2008 and will produce the cor-based PHA, (bioplastic) at an annual rate of about 50,000 tons.
> 
> ...


 
IMO, we are beginning to see more & more evidence of the change to a bio-based economy. Few of us appreciate just how many of the materials we consume everyday are made from crude oil. As the costs of petroleum increase & the costs of biofuels & bioplastics become cheaper, it won't make a difference whether you believe in global warming or not. Simple economic forces will bring about sustainability of natural resources & finally closing the carbon cycle.


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## Ho Ho Tai (Oct 4, 2007)

BDMan - we just must do something about these green cans! It's been ages since the board would let me issue more of them to you, and you said your garage is already full of those green oil drums. 

Hmmm! How about some gold stars instead?


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## newlylarge (Oct 6, 2007)

The thing about environmentalism that I find frustrating is how many people are not educated as to the realities of such matters. For example, how many times have we heard about "saving trees" by recycling paper? Well, the trees used for paper pulp are not high-quality "old growth" trees, but rather cheap, fast growing trees that are grown like crops. So when you use paper, you are consuming trees that have been grown for that purpose and which will be replanted. It is more like agriculture than logging.

Another matter I am familiar with because I work with the industry is wind power. I am not saying that wind power is not a good thing, but for many technical reasons, it cannot be a replacement for conventional generation. Wind generation is very expensive and would not even be economically viable if not for tax breaks. Moreover, wind energy can only be used in certain areas where the wind blows sufficiently. Additionally, wind power cannot be turned on or off as needed to meet demand, which is necessary for any primary power source. So wind energy is great and can supplement other forms of generation. But do not be fooled into thinking that it can replace our primary generation sources.

Finally, there are hybrids. Once again, hybrids are great. My Dad has one and it works very well. But if we are REALLY serious about reducing fuel consumption and emissions, there is a much more simple solution. Drive smaller vehicles.

I am not suggesting driving "tiny" little cars here. I merely point out that Americans have embraced SUVs and minivans that are really larger than necessary for most people. For most families, a standard sedan should be sufficient. But people seem to feel that, if they have a child or two, they need the extra room of an SUV or minivan. Well, when I was a kid and I had a younger brother, my mom somehow made due with a convertible coupe for both my brother and I as well as "cargo" such as groceries, diaper-bags, etc.

A standard sedan seats four (especially if two are children) and has an adequate trunk for storage. So unless you have a family of five or more, an SUV or minivan seems unnecessary. Put the kids in the back seat of a sedan and your "cargo" in the trunk. Believe it or not, it really works just as it has for decades before Detroit started pushing SUVs and minivans on us.

If everyone who does not really NEED an SUV or minivan, but drives one anyway, switches to a more fuel efficient sedan, we could save huge amounts of fuel and emissions. No fancy new tech needed.

Now I know that many here probably drive SUVs and minivans and may take issue with my assertions. But think about whether you REALLY need such vehicles. Think about what vehicles your parents used to drive you around in when you were a kid, at least, if you are over 25-years old.


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## James (Oct 9, 2007)

have something you dont want any more..? 

dont want to use up landfill space throwing it away? 

give it away to someone who wants it using freecycle!

http://www.freecycle.org/

_(freecycle mission statement - "Our mission is to build a worldwide gifting movement that reduces waste, saves precious resources & eases the burden on our landfills while enabling our members to benefit from the strength of a larger community." )_


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## mango (Oct 10, 2007)

*One Roo Burger please..... :eat2: 

 *




> *Greenpeace urges kangaroo consumption to fight global warming
> 
> Karen Collier
> October 10, 2007 02:35pm*
> ...


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## Ho Ho Tai (Oct 10, 2007)

Tried it. Made me jumpy.


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## biodieselman (Oct 11, 2007)

DuPont of the U.S. was one of the first companies to publicly establish environmental goals 16 years ago after being bashed for years due to their pollution. DuPont has spent millions on research & it is starting to pay off. Bioplastics is still a niche market in the U.S. but it's starting to catch on in Europe. Manufacturing plants are being thrown up all over Europe. 

Now China is getting into bioplastics. A Chinese company named Livan is building two, (19.6 million Euro), plants in Hungary. They will create 800 jobs & 50,000 tons of bioplastic per year using corn as feedstock. Livan will double the capacity after the first plants are operational. 

This month's issue arrived wrapped in a 100% biodegradable plastic cover. Notice the richness of the colors & yes the bag was tough to tear open. 

Sainsbury in the UK announced that they are going to replace the packaging material of 500 product lines. New Zealand's '_good_' brand bottled water will be bottled with bioplastic. 

Get out of the way petroleum-plastic! 

View attachment resize48.jpg


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## J34 (Oct 12, 2007)

Great news biodieselman. Living in Jersey is great to see companies take personal responsibility for their actions. We had a former DuPont plant that was replaced by a community college. However the site clean-up took years. But is nice to see something thriving there for once.

We must all do our fare share in saving the environment. thanks for all the updates biodieselman:bow:


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## jjx560 (Oct 12, 2007)

This is a great thread, the enthusiasm behind good environmental practice is really encouraging about the future. Currently I'm trying to find a good Mercedes diesel to do the biodiesel/waste veg oil conversion like biodiesel man (though if I had the money I'd love to have a brand new Dodge Cummins diesel). It's funny to me that a lot of people who drive new hybrid cars really tout them as the end all of environmental cleanliness. They never realize how much extra energy and parts (ergo pollution as a result of energy needed for the manufacturing process) and the disposal of the batteries once they bite the dust at 100k or so. Wheras I'd rather just get a car that was built 20 years ago, has a tough diesel engine and is still a luxury car (leather, A/C full power=luxury to me) and run it on cheap or free fuel that doesn't pollute much.


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## biodieselman (Oct 15, 2007)

jjx560 said:


> ... Currently I'm trying to find a good Mercedes diesel to do the biodiesel/waste veg oil conversion... It's funny to me that a lot of people who drive new hybrid cars really tout them as the end all of environmental cleanliness. They never realize how much extra energy and parts (ergo pollution as a result of energy needed for the manufacturing process) and the disposal of the batteries once they bite the dust at 100k or so. Wheras I'd rather just get a car that was built 20 years ago, has a tough diesel engine and is still a luxury car (leather, A/C full power=luxury to me) and run it on cheap or free fuel that doesn't pollute much.


 
My previous truck was a 1990 Cummins that ran on 100% biodiesel for almost two years with no hoses or fuel lines swelling & leaking. There are three problems with biodiesel.

First problem with biodiesel is that it attacks natural rubber. A car from the mid '90s & after shouldn't have natural rubber fuel lines or seals. Second, biodiesel will clean out any crud in an older car's fuel tank & could plug up a fuel filter. I changed my fuel filters three times but the third filter was still clean. Third, biodiesel has a higher gel point, meaning precautions will be required during cold weather. Mild L.A. winters are no problems. 

There are newer used diesel Volkswagon Jettas & a few Mercedes diesel cars available. Most diesels in America are in heavy duty trucks. I originally bought my first Cummins for the reason to keep the truck twenty years. The Cummins is a true commercial duty engine that can run for over a million miles. I heard the president of Ford say in the "Waste Equals Food" documentary say it took 64 tons of raw material to make one new car. That's why I tried to keep my truck 20 years, but unfortunately it was parked next to a car that caught fire and the truck was never the same afterwards. I hope to keep my new truck, purchased a few months ago, over twenty years. 

Since America finally switched to ultra-low sulfur diesel, starting in 2007 diesels have clean-burning technology, making them as clean as a gasoline engine, with 20% to 40% greater fuel economy. Last year was the first year diesels outsold gasoline cars in Europe. Europe is way ahead of the U.S. in being green.

Due to the high costs of hybrids & the fact that real life fuel economy is nowhere near what is advertised, starting 2008/2009 at least six auto manufacturers are betting that fuel efficient, cleaner burning & cheaper diesels will leave hybrids in the dust. 

Hey, feel free to PM me if you have any questions; same goes for anyone else!

I'm not a car guy, but here is a test drive of a BMW 335d that will be imported to the U.S. starting 2009. Clean diesels are coming. The comentator is a dork but watch the whole thing to the end where they look at the tail pipe. My 2007, 350 hp, 650 lbs of torque 6.7L diesel's tail pipe is cleaner than any Prius's. Think diesels are slow? Check out this turbo charged, direct injected, straight 6 Cummins. Of course, there's no soot collector on this drag truck.


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## biodieselman (Nov 4, 2007)

That's right, pond scum is coming to L.A. I was refilling home brewing supplies with my buddies at Extreme Biodiesel. I've know these guys from their beginnings & have been asked to consult with them on piping and plumbing problems; I was recently asked to design a methanol vacuum recovery system for them. When I arrived they were all excited about their good fortune. They've been bought by a large investment group that is primarily concerned with developing 'green' technologies. The investment group has contracted with AlgeaLink to build an algae photo-bioreactor processing plant & is currently looking for a building site. Extreme Biodiesel will process the algae oil feedstock into biodiesel.

This is a photo of AlgaeLink's, (a Netherlands company), Demo/Test photo-bioreactor at the Biodiesel Expo 2007 in Nottingham, England. The production capacity is easily scaled up by simply adding more piping loops.





I asked if they were looking for investors, because I'm seriously thinking of putting my money where my mouth is. Tod & Bob winked at me, telling me they hadn't announced yet, but they were ready to go public. I've watched these guys grow, from a tiny garage-sized dive in December 2005 into a much larger facility they have already outgrown since moving into last year. Now they are going to be on the NY Stock Exchange!

'Clean diesel' cars from Europe & Japan will be in the showrooms starting 2009. My 2007 Dodge 6.7L Cummins *exceeds* the even more stringent diesel emissions standards that will take effect 2010. People disappointed with gasoline/hybrid's overstated fuel economy will start to realize that 'clean diesels' are cheaper to purchase, cheaper to operate, get better fuel economy & have more power.

The 'green' movement is growing. Many American citizens desire to be greener & are wanting affordable alternative fuel, but aren't willing to sacrifice on size, performance & comfort in a automobile. Enter 'oilgae', algae/biodiesel. As petroleum dino-fuel gets more expensive and the public demands cheaper, cleaner fuels, I hope to be a participant in fulfilling that economic market. Wouldn't hurt to make some money for a change.

Greening the environment, reducing funding for terrorism & reducing Big Oil's profits... what's not to like!


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## Mack27 (Nov 4, 2007)

fa_man_stan said:


> Carrots are nature's original phallic symbol...
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Telecommuters are pretty green then I guess.


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## biodieselman (Nov 6, 2007)

I was sniveling about the high cost of my 'Bioplastics' magazine subscription but I didn't know the price also included 'Biomass' magazine.

Here are some highlights from the November 2007 issue. 


> 'Closing the Energy Circle'
> 
> Green Circle Bio energy Inc. is building the world's biggest wood pellet plant in the heart of the largest plantation-style pine forest in the world. Until U.S. legislation promoting biomass power catches up with directives in Europe, these pellets will be exported to a handful of European power companies.
> 
> ...



Who gets the carbon credits for being green, Europe or America? And why isn't America 'burning our forests' to generate power instead of Middle-East oil?



> 'The Fischer-Tropsch/Fat Connection'
> 
> ... The U.S. DOE helped fund a demonstration plant to scale up the Syntroleum process and produce 400,000 gallons of synfuels for testing in military jets and diesel applications. Syntroleum supplied JP8 jet fuel it produced from natural gas to the U.S. Air Force. It passed the tests and is now certified for use in a 50 percent blend with petroleum-based jet fuel in B52 bombers. The Air Force intends to certify all of its aircraft to fly on the blend by 2011....
> 
> ...



Tyson Foods produces chicken, beef and pork products. Sorta gives new meaning to the phrase, 'when pigs fly'.

I think it's wonderful that our landfills are spared all the animal fats & grease, which are now being used to reduce our dependency on Middle-East oil. But I'm not so sure it's a good idea to ship our replanted forests off to Europe.

I'm still 'rooting' for algae, or as I like to call it... pond scum.


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## Shosh (Nov 7, 2007)

Hi Bio,

I checked out the site that you directed me to, Treehugger.com 
It is an excellant site. I especially like the information regarding going green with women's personal products, namely cosmetics etc. It is very germaine to my health.
Still getting my head around which cleaning products to buy.


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## Risible (Nov 7, 2007)

Susannah said:


> Hi Bio,
> 
> I checked out the site that you directed me to, Treehugger.com
> It is an excellant site. I especially like the information regarding going green with women's personal products, namely cosmetics etc. It is very germaine to my health.
> Still getting my head around which cleaning products to buy.



Shosh, you're probably gonna have to try several cleaning products to see which does the best job in your opinion (no harsh chemicals to cut through the grease, see, so you're gonna need some elbow grease - the kind you supply ). Unfortunately, it's not cheap these days, going green. However, it is getting more affordable and accessible, at least.


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## Paul Delacroix (Nov 7, 2007)

biodieselman said:


> Tyson Foods produces chicken, beef and pork products. Sorta gives new meaning to the phrase, 'when pigs fly'.
> 
> I think it's wonderful that our landfills are spared all the animal fats & grease, which are now being used to reduce our dependency on Middle-East oil. But I'm not so sure it's a good idea to ship our replanted forests off to Europe.
> 
> I'm still 'rooting' for algae, or as I like to call it... pond scum.



What's funny, I have found, is that many enviro-Greenies seem to detest bio-fuels, claiming that such production "starves the poor". One would think eco-folk would support bio-fuels, but evidently it's too [pragmatic a solution to be attractive.


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## biodieselman (Nov 7, 2007)

Paul Delacroix said:


> What's funny, I have found, is that many enviro-Greenies seem to detest bio-fuels, claiming that such production "starves the poor"....



I'm opposed to all forms of extremism, even if I'm in partial agreement with some parts of it. Does that make *me* an extremist?

After reading newspaper articles, 'Biodiesel', 'Bioplastics' & 'Biomass' magazines, I'm of the opinion scientists all over the world are researching into converting every last bit of agriculture waste products into bioplastics, biofuels or biomass to burn for power generation. Just like the genetic engineering industry, serious money is being spent on research. That's why I firmly believe we are finally seeing an end to the world's petroleum-based economy and the beginnings of a bio-based economy. As the cost of a barrel of oil keeps setting new records, simple economic forces will make us greener whether we believe in global warming or not.




> In the beginning, there were algae, but there was no oil
> 
> Then, from algae came oil.
> 
> ...



I don't believe it's a good thing to divert productive acreage from food crops to fuel crops. We've recently seen near riots in Mexico City over corn tortillas nearly doubling in cost. We saw 'boycotts' in Italy over the increasing price of pasta. Fact is, there isn't enough arable land to even come close to fulfilling our fuel needs. Excluding ongoing EPA research using contaminated lands under the Super Fund, to return toxic sites to productivity by growing soy beans for biodiesel, growing crops for fuel benefits farmers but hurts all of us in the form of higher food prices.

However... I do love me some pond scum! Algae is up to 100 times more productive than any corn or soy crops at producing oils. Doesn't need farm land or clean water. Algae can be used as the first step in reclaiming water from sewage. 72% of our nations power plants have enough acreage for algae farms, which by the way, algae loves to eat power plant greenhouse gas. We already have diesel engines & pipeline infrastructure to transport biodiesel. Biodiesel is a 100% EPA approved clean-burning fuel. There is none of that 'which came first? chicken or the egg?' problem. No new technology required. Talk about pragmatic solutions!

In todays LA Times 'Highway 1' section, Jay Leno said _"My thing with the green situation is: Even if you don't believe in global warming, don't you want to screw the oil company or gas company or utility company?"_

My goal in life is to be self-sufficient. Can't help it, got it from my parents. Being green is great, but with me it comes down to 'waste-not-want-not' & self-sufficiency. Some make jokes, calling me a hillbilly, but I'm proud of never asking for a handout. I'm not ashamed of the true definition of a hillbilly, which is strong, independent & self reliant. I think America needs to cut our ties to Middle-East oil & become energy independent. How stupid is it that we finance terrorism with our oil addiction?:doh: IMO, being green will be the outcome of achieving energy independence.


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## Paul Delacroix (Nov 7, 2007)

biodieselman said:


> I don't believe it's a good thing to divert productive acreage from food crops to fuel crops. We've recently seen near riots in Mexico City over corn tortillas nearly doubling in cost. We saw 'boycotts' in Italy over the increasing price of pasta. Fact is, there isn't enough arable land to even come close to fulfilling our fuel needs.



I believe there is. All the anti-bio-fuel reports and studies out there are, in my opinion, propaganda pieces of cherry-picked data that arrive at false and misleading conclusions. 

There is a LOT of arable land in the US alone--the vast majority of it is being wasted on cattle grazing. It could easily support bio-diesel production on a vast scale, if ranchers had more economic incentive to stop using land to grow cow patties.

Now, ethanol itself, I believe, is wasteful and inefficient. But bio-diesel is not, and it does not have to be limited to pond scum. We have lots of land. If you combined windmills, solar collectors, and soybeans on the same acres, states like Oklahoma and Texas could once again become energy giants.


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## J34 (Nov 9, 2007)

Also what would be wise for people to know is to use less carcinogenic products or products that harm the environment. Products like vinyl siding are very unhelathy to the environment. Although it may look nice it can potentially stop your home from breathing resulting in moisture trapped underneath the vynil causing mold to grow in your walls. Also the siding is made from dioxins which are one of the most deadly if not dangerous chemicals on earth. They also have a low melting point, and give off deadly poisonous fumes in a fire.

We must remember that we should think with ethical values when making decisions even in things that make up our home. Since unfortunately american building standards haven't changed much. While Europeans are light-years ahead of us in eco-efficiency

You rock biodieselman!


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## Risible (Nov 9, 2007)

J34 said:


> Also what would be wise for people to know is to use less carcinogenic products or products that harm the environment. Products like vinyl siding are very unhelathy to the environment. Although it may look nice it can potentially stop your home from breathing resulting in moisture trapped underneath the vynil causing mold to grow in your walls. Also the siding is made from dioxins which are one of the most deadly if not dangerous chemicals on earth. They also have a low melting point, and give off deadly poisonous fumes in a fire.
> 
> We must remember that we should think with ethical values when making decisions even in things that make up our home. Since unfortunately american building standards haven't changed much. While Europeans are light-years ahead of us in eco-efficiency
> 
> You rock biodieselman!



You're so right about harming the environment. Last night, Bio and I watched a program on Nature about the plight of the honeybee. A plague has been infesting them over the past three years causing what is called "Colony Collapse Disorder," where the entire population of a hive deserts the hive and goes off to die. It's been estimated that 1/3 of the honeybee population has gone missing (presumably dead) very recently. Nations worldwide are reporting similar occurrences.

It's not known what causes CCD, however they determined that insecticides play a role in at least some of the deaths amongst the honeybee populations in France, where they've banned certain insecticides. In one U.S. study, honeybees were found with 41 different insecticides in their bodies. It's a wonder they're able to survive at all with much of their food supplied literally poisoned.


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## Ho Ho Tai (Nov 9, 2007)

Risible said:


> You're so right about harming the environment. Last night, Bio and I watched a program on Nature about the plight of the honeybee. A plague has been infesting them over the past three years causing what is called "Colony Collapse Disorder," where the entire population of a hive deserts the hive and goes off to die. It's been estimated that 1/3 of the honeybee population has gone missing (presumably dead) very recently. Nations worldwide are reporting similar occurrences.
> 
> It's not known what causes CCD, however they determined that insecticides play a role in at least some of the deaths amongst the honeybee populations in France, where they've banned certain insecticides. In one U.S. study, honeybees were found with 41 different insecticides in their bodies. It's a wonder they're able to survive at all with much of their food supplied literally poisoned.



Risible -
By coincidence, your post (relayed to my e-mail) was followed by a CSM story, bearing on the cause of CCD, and the effect on US agriculture. Note: you may think that it is odd for me to quote CSM, but they are, IMHO, a reliable news source on most topics.

Here's a link to the article.

Progress on 'collapsing' beehives
Some warned of crop disaster when honeybees started to disappear. Crops didn't fail, but farmers and beekeepers aren't out of danger yet.
By Moises Velasquez-Manoff | Staff writer of The Christian Science Monitor

from the November 8, 2007 edition

http://www.csmonitor.com/2007/1108/p13s01-sten.html?s=wklyenv


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## Paul Delacroix (Nov 10, 2007)

Ho Ho Tai said:


> Risible -
> By coincidence, your post (relayed to my e-mail) was followed by a CSM story, bearing on the cause of CCD, and the effect on US agriculture. Note: you may think that it is odd for me to quote CSM, but they are, IMHO, a reliable news source on most topics.
> 
> Here's a link to the article.
> ...



The human race actually needs to pitch together in a rational (and civilized and free) manner and clean up the oceans. The coral reefs near developing nations are dying. That's an indicator of how much human filth is going into the sea. 

Every day, the cities of the world pump millions of gallons of sewage and bio-matter into the ocean. Simultaneously, plastic by the ton washes into the ocean in the form of plastic bags, bottles, and containers. 

We treat the skies and the land much better than we do the ocean. The ocean is the lifeblood of the planet.


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## Risible (Nov 10, 2007)

Paul Delacroix said:


> The human race actually needs to pitch together in a rational (and civilized and free) manner and clean up the oceans. The coral reefs near developing nations are dying. That's an indicator of how much human filth is going into the sea.
> 
> Every day, the cities of the world pump millions of gallons of sewage and bio-matter into the ocean. Simultaneously, plastic by the ton washes into the ocean in the form of plastic bags, bottles, and containers.
> 
> We treat the skies and the land much better than we do the ocean. The ocean is the lifeblood of the planet.




Well, some nations, Japan in particular, are doing more than their fair share of "cleaning" the oceans. Cleaning them out, that is. 

You're right, Paul. The world's oceans are treated deplorably. I'm mindful of every single thing that I throw away or pour down the drain, of where it's likely to end up.


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## J34 (Nov 11, 2007)

Risible said:


> You're so right about harming the environment. Last night, Bio and I watched a program on Nature about the plight of the honeybee. A plague has been infesting them over the past three years causing what is called "Colony Collapse Disorder," where the entire population of a hive deserts the hive and goes off to die. It's been estimated that 1/3 of the honeybee population has gone missing (presumably dead) very recently. Nations worldwide are reporting similar occurrences.
> 
> It's not known what causes CCD, however they determined that insecticides play a role in at least some of the deaths amongst the honeybee populations in France, where they've banned certain insecticides. In one U.S. study, honeybees were found with 41 different insecticides in their bodies. It's a wonder they're able to survive at all with much of their food supplied literally poisoned.



Its sad that soo many species of animals die and are extinct because of our presence on the environment. Your story about the bees is disheartening, I still remember being 5yrs old and going to the local park every weekend. There would be a beehive, and my dad would scoop out the honeycomb and get some good natural honey, (let me tell you nothing is as delicious as natural honey :eat2. Unfortunately the bees were killed by an insecticide that was sprayed on them. It's sad that we can't even coexist with even the smallest of creatures.


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## ZainTheInsane (Nov 11, 2007)

love dubh said:


> Bikes, people! OH HOW I LOVE THEE, BICYCLE!
> 
> Freddy Mercury knew what was going on! He sang her praises!
> 
> ...




I have one problem with this...when it is below 40 degrees, and/or above 80 degrees...you sweat your ass off on a bicycle. And unfortunately, being a business major, eventually going into business...you can't come into the office everyday smelling like a gym.

SO, unfortunately, Bikes, though awesome...are not so amazing an option. I am all for exercise...but a bicycle has severe limitations in the real world applications.


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## ZainTheInsane (Nov 11, 2007)

I VOTE HYDROGEN!!!!

And until we get there, lets use water powered engines...cleaner, more efficient...uses about a gallon of gasoline per 100-150 miles, and is easily filled wherever water is found. 

Oh, AND, the end product...is water! How snazzy!


OH...AND!!!

VOTE FOR ZAIN 2020!!!!!


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## biodieselman (Nov 11, 2007)

ZainTheInsane said:


> I VOTE HYDROGEN!!!!
> 
> And until we get there, lets use water powered engines...cleaner, more efficient...uses about a gallon of gasoline per 100-150 miles, and is easily filled wherever water is found.
> 
> ...



I had written hydrogen off due to the many technological issues with H2. The most glaring problem is being upside down on the energy equation, consuming more energy to produce H2 than the H2 produces when consumed in fuel cells. I've modified that opinion with certain algae species' ability to produce H2 under certain conditions. Scientists are currently researching how to scale up this algae growth process for what appears to finally be an energy efficient method of producing H2. Some day, hopefully soon.

Now if they can only solve the H2 storage problems, transporting H2 problems, make fuel cells cost under $100,000 dollars and solve the problem of the water exhaust freezing inside the 'tail pipe', plugging up the 'tail pipe' in cold weather, then we will eventually convert to H2.




What?... the 'the chicken or the egg' problem? Who thinks that far ahead?

My vote? Well... pond scum of course!

Seriously... there is no single technology that will eliminate our petroleum addiction. *All* reasonably clean energy sources need to be developed. I know that biodiesel isn't the end all solution. But roughly 2/3s of the petroleum we consume is used for transportation. Biodiesel's high energy density, fuel efficiency, clean burning, relatively cheap production costs & no new technology required makes biodiesel the most pragmatic, cost efficient solution.


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## Ho Ho Tai (Nov 19, 2007)

biodieselman said:


> Tina suggested I start a living green thread.



Worth looking at just for the illustrations. Just think - what a concert you you could have in your garden. Concertos in the corn? Tuttis in the tomatoes? Symphonies in the squash patch? I always knew that a zucchini must be good for something.







From The Telegraph
Britain awaits the Vienna Vegetable Orchestra

By Laura Clout
Last Updated: 1:54am GMT 17/11/2007

They give the phrase 'playing with your food' a whole new meaning - and now the Vienna Vegetable Orchestra is coming to Britain.
# You tube: The Vienna Vegetable Orchestra
# More on the Austrian vegetable ensemble
# How about that: Tales of the bizarre from around the world

The unique ensemble, which performs on instruments made of fresh vegetables, will play at the Huddersfield Contemporary Music Festival next week.


http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2007/11/16/wveg116.xml


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## biodieselman (Nov 19, 2007)

Ho Ho Tai said:


> Worth looking at just for the illustrations. Just think - what a concert you you could have in your garden. Concertos in the corn? Tuttis in the tomatoes? Symphonies in the squash patch? I always knew that a zucchini must be good for something....



When I lived in San Diego, I had more room to grow stuff. Each year I made sure I grew at least one 'experimental' vegetable. I was a member of the California Rare Fruit Growers & from reading their magazine, I never knew the world had a *much greater* number of different types fruits.

In San Diego I had a Fuyu persimmon, jujube (or Chinese date), pomegranite, kiwi, two types of grapes, plum, peach, blackberries, strawberries, fig, lemon & orange trees. I tried to grow Surinam cherry, cherimoya, banana, avocado & starfruit but I had too much frost for these more tropical fruit trees.

Looking at your photo, I remembered the documentary on Colony Collapse Disorder. Try to think of all flowers you know & all of the vegetables you know. Almost all are dependent on honey bees for pollination. The world would lose much of its color if bees became extinct, which is predicted to happen around 2035. 

There are many, very concerned scientists all around the world working on CCD. They are also working on breeding a 'Super Bee'. Maybe Ho Ho will be surrounded in cacaphony of color if 'Super Bee' indeed becomes Super Pollinator.

If they don't get a handle on CCD, I hope all you guys like to eat gruel. Mmmmmm ... gruel!


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## CandySmooch (Nov 20, 2007)

I turn off the water when I brush my teeth.

I buy orgnanic/natural products as much as I can.

I do not leave radios/tvs/lights on if they are not being used. 

I try to fill up my gas tank after sundown. (I read somewhere about gas fumes/sun having effect on ozone & better fuel economy)

I also only run the dishwasher/washing machine/dryer at night. (again something I read thats supposed to be better at conserving energy)

I spend the extra money on energy saving appliances.

I buy energy saving light bulbs.

My husband burns most of our trash (we live in the country on some acreage).

We re-use glass containers instead of disposable plastics.

Thats about all I can do - I'd really love to have a house that ran self-suffienctly through solar & wind energy. There was some show I saw where their house was completely self-sufficient without electricity - it was awesome! The house re-used everything including water that went down the drain.


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## snuggletiger (Nov 20, 2007)

There was a thing on my local news today about Solar Energy and how they estimated that by changing a house over to solar energy, it would take 20 years to recover the cost of conversion. That's a long term investment which I don't mind but seeing how we live in a society of soundbites and day trading how many people would be that willing to make a 20 year investment.


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## Risible (Nov 20, 2007)

snuggletiger said:


> There was a thing on my local news today about Solar Energy and how they estimated that by changing a house over to solar energy, it would take 20 years to recover the cost of conversion. That's a long term investment which I don't mind but seeing how we live in a society of soundbites and day trading how many people would be that willing to make a 20 year investment.



I figure it would be about 20K to install enough solar equipment to drop our electric bill to $0 each month. With incentives, that 20K could be reduced to 10-15k. We'll wait for the right incentives to become available before we convert, which is something we'd really, really like to do. I'd love to be off the grid, using green energy.

We're on a level-pay plan for the electrical, and we're paying $136 per month, which includes pool pump (energy hog. We're getting a new one in a week). So that's $1632/year. I guess payoff would be closer to, what, 7-10 years at 10-15K. Not too bad.


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## goldendiamondeyes (Nov 21, 2007)

love dubh said:


> Bikes, people! OH HOW I LOVE THEE, BICYCLE!
> 
> 
> And a good bike will only set you back 200 bucks. A tool kit? 20-30 bucks. You don't need insurance, but you'll want to consider a helmet and reflective materials if you ride at night.
> ...


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## Paul Delacroix (Nov 21, 2007)

goldendiamondeyes said:


> love dubh said:
> 
> 
> > Bikes, people! OH HOW I LOVE THEE, BICYCLE!
> ...


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## CandySmooch (Nov 21, 2007)

My friend has a Mo-Ped that tops out 40 MPH for a small engine one.


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## goldendiamondeyes (Nov 21, 2007)

Paul Delacroix said:


> goldendiamondeyes said:
> 
> 
> > What top speeds do mopeds get up to now?
> ...


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## Paul Delacroix (Nov 22, 2007)

goldendiamondeyes said:


> Paul Delacroix said:
> 
> 
> > _*I am a SSBBW(425+) and I ride a Honda Ruckus and top speed I get on mine with my size is approx 30 miles a hour...beats hoffen it to town.....LOL*_
> ...


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## goldendiamondeyes (Nov 22, 2007)

Paul Delacroix said:


> goldendiamondeyes said:
> 
> 
> > Interesting..I'd like to get one.
> ...


----------



## Paul Delacroix (Nov 22, 2007)

goldendiamondeyes said:


> Paul Delacroix said:
> 
> 
> > *They (mopeds) are so fun. You never realize what you miss about nature when you are in a automobile....With a moped you go slow enough to see all kinds of cool nature....Not to mention the savings on gas....*
> ...


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## biodieselman (Nov 24, 2007)

Paul Delacroix said:


> ... Mopeds tend to get about--what? 60-90 MPG?...





Today's diesel cars already get almost the same MPG as a moped.


> Feast your eyes on this, car technology and high-mileage nuts. It's a Honda Accord that runs on diesel.
> 
> Honda expects to bring the clean-diesel car to the U.S. by 2010. It gets 62.8 miles a gallon on the highway, but otherwise looks and feels like a regular Accord. At that mileage level, the car is about as "clean" as a new Toyota Prius. But if you run it on biodiesel, a form of diesel made from vegetable oil or animal fat, it would be even cleaner than a Prius (Priuses get 60 in the city).
> 
> The advantage of diesel cars, however, is that they pack a lot of power....












> ... It's taking place in technical universities worldwide, where a new generation of inventors and engineers think it's possible to produce and market a safe and affordable car that gets 100 miles per gallon.
> 
> And it's reaching a flashpoint ... winning the $20 million Automotive X Prize that will go to the individual or group who beats everyone else to market with a 100-miles-per-gallon or energy-use-equivalent car....


It appears more & more every day that Michael Briggs's published paper in 1998 for the National Renewable Energy Laboratory had it right. First, cut our need for fuel in half by driving diesel/electric hybrids. Second, eliminate Middle East petroleum by burning algae/biodiesel. The X-Prize winner could be a diesel-electric hybrid.

Peugeot will be selling a diesel/electric hybrid next year in Europe.


> ... Peugeot announced its intention to deliver a diesel-electric hybrid to European drivers, and said that its diesel-electric hatchback would achieve over 70mpg....










When are you guys going to get rid of your Flintstone, gasoline powered greenhouse gas factories & buy your first *green* algae/biodiesel/electric hybrid car?


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## biodieselman (Dec 9, 2007)

Ris & I are taking up another 'hobby', vermiculture. Yeah Ha!... we're worm wranglers! (Ha ha ha, Ris is a worm wrangler.) 

On average, each person generates 600 pounds of solid waste per year & we're running out of places to dump it. In California, organic waste makes up 30-40% of the waste. About 10% of all food brought into the home becomes kitchen waste. Many municipalities are seeking to extend the life of rapidly filling landfills by diverting organic waste to composting. Makes practical common sense, save landfill space & gain a valuable soil amendment.

To be honest, the real reason for worm wrangling is that my garden has sucked for the last two or three years. I'm doing the same practices as when I lived in San Diego, buying trailer loads of composted chicken manure each year & deep digging it into the soil late winter between the end of fall planted crops & the start of spring plantings. Everything is the same except, living on a smaller lot, I don't have room for a compost pile. Our city supplies a separate container for landscaping green waste to be composted.

So in order to save space & speed up the process, we bought a 'Worm Factory'. A worm high rise condo if you will.

Ris has been saving kitchen waste to feed two pounds of red wigglers. She cut a section of permeable weed barrier to line the bottom of the bottom tray to keep worms from crawling out. A brick of bacteria inoculated coconut husks was spread out on top of the barrier & a layer of kitchen waste above that.





Ris tore black ink newspaper, without color, into 1" strips. We filled a pitcher of tap water & let it sit overnight, allowing the chlorine to evaporate so as not to poison the worms. The paper was soaked with water, excess water squeezed out for the third layer.





Top layer is the two pounds of red wigglers which quickly disappeared into their new home.





The 1st floor of worms or tray sits on a drain pan with a tap to drain off any worm tea. Worm tea anyone? The kit comes with a vented roof for aeration. Both help prevent the worm bedding from becoming water logged, smothering the worms. We want happy fat worms, right?

As the worms eat the food in the first tray, another tray is started for a total of five trays of worms & garden waste. It only occupies a 16" x 16" footprint. When the top tray has shrunken down into the 4th tray, needing another tray, the 1st tray is harvested for worm casting fertilizer & becomes the top tray. Ris cut a plastic milk jug for her kitchen & I have a little galvanized container with a lid for the yard.





We already are dreaming of our spring garden. Our first spring seed catalog has already arrived!


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## moore2me (Dec 9, 2007)

Bio-dieselman,

You wouldn't be one of those anti-God environmentalists would you?


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## biodieselman (Dec 9, 2007)

moore2me said:


> Bio-dieselman,
> 
> You wouldn't be one of those anti-God environmentalists would you?



Oh, m2m, you've discovered my well-hidden secret. I may as well come out of the closet and profess my belief in the Carrot-god "Philo," which means loving.


After years of offerings of well-rotted poultry manure, Philo finally blessed my garden with his presence last year.





Philo's commandment to me: "Thou shalt grow worm castings."


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## Tina (Dec 9, 2007)

Uh, interesting carrot, Bio. 

I would like to bring over an issue from the Foodee board (in the thread I started about the fabulous party held at their house, and my raving about the disposable plates, cups and forks that Ris and Bio used.

The items were bought from WorldCentric.org They were all very sturdy, and the forks were the strongest 'plastic' forks I've ever used. They can be found under the Biocompostables section of the site, here.. If Bio would like to bring over his post from there to here, I think it never hurts to expand the audience that receives this kind of information, in this world of disposable everything -- only they are usually things that do not biodegrade, and our great, great, great grandchildren, and beyond, will still be dealing with this waste.

Bio, will you bring your post over about these utensils. I was very impressed with them, and I'm also impressed with their price and how they are affordable. I've posted in the thread on the Foodee board about how when Eric and I have casual get-togethers, we will definitely be ordering these, as Eric is extremely environmentally-conscious and is a huge believer in recycling, etc.


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## Tina (Dec 11, 2007)

BTW, sent Eric the link and he loves the idea. Anyone who really cares about the state of our landfills and how plastic is For.Ever. might want to take the little bit of extra time in planning to buy these products ahead of a gathering. Great stuff! I know, I keep going on about it, but I am so impressed by the quality, the rate at which they biodegrade, and the pricing that I just can't get over it!


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## biodieselman (Dec 11, 2007)

Tina requested more information about bioplastics after Ris's party, honoring Missaf for her BA degree. I didn't make a fuss about the bioplastic plates, cups & cutlery because the party wasn't about me & I think Ris was too busy to tell many of her guests what they were eating with. I don't believe the guests that weren't told, could tell they were eating with bioplastics. There really is no noticeable difference between dino-plastic & bioplastic. 

Now stop for a second & take a good look around your room. Everything plastic or made from man-made materials is made from toxic petroleum. Here is a brief list of how it takes plastic to degrade into unrecognizable particles. BTW, those 'small' particles... scientists aren't sure how long they remain toxic.



> plastic bag-- 20 years
> 
> cigarette filter-- 15-25 years
> 
> ...




Ris wanted to be with her guests, not doing dishes. She insisted on disposable plates, cups & cutlery. We have mandatory recycling here & I didn't want to have to separate dirty plates & stuff. I didn't want to feel guilty throwing plastic into the trash that then goes into the landfill and stays there forever. I insisted on using bioplastic & biodegradable stuff.

The plates were made from unbleached bagasse. Bagasse is sugar cane fiber waste left after juice extraction & is totally biodegradable into *non-toxic* compost after 30 to 90 days. Clean sugar cane pulp is molded at high temperature & pressure to create plates, cups or bowls. There is no wax or plastic lining & is suitable for both hot or cold items. Bagasse is soak proof, but hot items lead to slight moisture condensing on any surface in contact with tableware. Heat passes through bagasse & then condenses on the cooler surface. Bagasse is microwave & freezer safe. It handles hot liquids up to 190 F. Bagasse is sterilized, sanitized, strong & sturdy.

The 'plastic' cups & forks were made from PLA bioplastic. PLA is 80% cornstarch & 20% other biodegradable fibers. Bioplastic can take longer to totally compost. Bio-degradable means 60% has degraded into indiscernible pieces within 180 days. Completely biodegrading into *non-toxic* compost can take up to two years depending on thickness.

Styrofoam & plastic made from petroleum never degrades & remains toxic for hundreds of years. Not only are bioplastics good for the planet, the cost was nearly the same as store-bought toxic petroleum-plastic stuff; with shipping it was only a tiny bit more expensive.

I've reposted some of this from other forums & parts of this may look familiar. AnnMarie had requested info on where we got the bioplastic tableware & the following is the link information.



> "World Centric is non-profit organization working to reduce economic injustice and environmental degradation through education, community networks & sustainable enterprises...."


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## CandySmooch (Dec 11, 2007)

Ok I need some help, my mom is buying a new house and wants to install a windmill to power her electricty & she's also interested in solar paneling the house. Can anyone point me in the right direction? She is not computer Savvy so she asked me to do the research and find out who she can contact to do this to her house. She lives in Missouri if that helps. Any help would be appreciated.


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## biodieselman (Dec 11, 2007)

CandySmooch said:


> Ok I need some help, my mom is buying a new house and wants to install a windmill to power her electricty & she's also interested in solar paneling the house. Can anyone point me in the right direction?...



Commercial windmills are set to make a major comeback. New technology has improved efficiency, the industry has recently seen a huge influx of investment capital & maintenance costs have dropped.

What is she trying to accomplish? Does your mother have a lot of money, mad at the power company & desperately wants to 'get of the grid'? I ask because the payback period for windmills can take up to 30 years. There are also annual maintenance costs. It is a machine & all machines can break, wear out & need maintenance. Check with her utility company for suggestions about incentives, recommendations for power generation & a list of qualified contractors.

You need to check building codes for height limitations. Her desires are commendable but there will always be a Ted Kennedy wherever you go & they will bitch, calling the windmill an eyesore. Do the building codes permit windmills? Is her home in the 'shadow' of tall buildings or trees blocking the wind? Is the home on top of a hill or in a location where the flow of air is laminar & not turbulent? You have a lot of research to do!

PVs are different. They shouldn't wear out & require minimal if any maintenance. Again need to check with the utility company & building codes. PVs should be installed by a licensed contractor. A current sensing relay needs to be installed on the municipal power coming into the home. This relay will isolate the power you generate from the grid if there is a power outage she won't kill linemen working on the power transmission grid. You also need to find what the utility company's policy is on power generation. Most utilities won't pay for excessive power she might put back into the grid. Where I live I would need to carefully size the photovoltaic system to produce power close to what we consume, trying to come close to zeroing out the bill.

The cost of PV is dropping but still too expensive for me. I'm waiting for Uncle Sam to cough up some big fat tax incentives.

The first thing I would spend money on is conservation. Insulating the walls & atic. Sealing air drafts & leaks. Upgrading heating/air conditioning systems if they're old for more energy efficient models, energy efficient refrigerators, washing machines, clothes driers, etc., etc. IMO, conservation should *always* be the first step, it's the easiest & most cost effective of any efforts to being green.


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## CandySmooch (Dec 11, 2007)

Wow biodiesalman. Thanks. Ok, my mom just bought a house in the country on 10 acres. She's more of "green" person than I am. There are no building restrictions, she's in the boonies of a hick county in Missouri with no one around her. Cost isn't an issue, so the "payoff" time isn't a matter its more of she's wanting to help the environment by conserving energy and utilizing her own power sources. She already does all the things you stated as energy saving appliances, proper insulation, recycles etc. etc. So I guess & gather I need to first start by contacting the power company? I was kinda looking for a reference to a company that might be able to get me started in the right direction. I'll try googling.......can anyone tell me what the proper term to search for would be?


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## biodieselman (Dec 11, 2007)

We are daily experiencing a recent cultural phenenom that just 30 years ago no one would have ever thought to do - pay 2 to 4 times the cost of gasoline to carry about a dino-plastic bottle full of water. In a world where one in six people have no safe, dependable source of drinking water, we *need* to have in hand at all times a prop... er... I mean water contained in a toxic, polluting, wasteful dino-plastic bottle. Every week, America moves one billion bottles of water around in ships, trains & trucks. We consume millions of barrels of petroleum each year to make dino-plastic water bottles, of which the EPA says only 3% of which is recycled.



> Heres the trouble with bottled water, broken down in a way that plastic water bottles may never be:
> 
> 1. The bottled water industry is under-regulated.
> 2. Private companies have marketed their way into public utilities and are selling public resources for up to 5,000% profit.
> ...


Recently on the Left Coast, these plastic bottles have gone out of chic. Californians are weird. A new 'fad' is gaining momentom, being _*green*_. Here are some alternatives.

People are starting to use reusable containers to carry their water. There are many places to buy them. Just for one example, _*Target Online*_ sells a variety of bottles, one of which has a built-in carbon filter to purify the water as you drink it.



If you must buy bottled water, think about buying bottles made from non-toxic bioplastic. No dinosaurs were harmed making these bottles.

*BIOTA *Brands of America.

*Belu *Mineral Water of UK.

*Naturally Iowa* milk in Iowa.

Finally, for those thinking of moving to The Great White North, (Canada), there is '*+1*', Plus One Water, Montreal, Canada.


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## Tina (Dec 11, 2007)

I think that last sentence might apply to me, but don't understand it. What is +1 water? Please, lead the senile, will ya? I googled it and it became no clearer. 

Candy, that's great that your mom wants to do that. It can be a bit costly at first, but is really worth it down the road.


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## stan_der_man (Dec 12, 2007)

Pardon the digression here...

Biodieselman does weird things with left over food, I rant about not using battery powered things! We all have our quirks I suppose.


Give the gift of hand tools this holiday season! Forgo the battery powered gadgets!






Although Bio, I'll admit your battery powered drill came in handy camping when I needed to raise the trailer jacks...:blush:

I just wanted to post a picture of me at work (my student assistant was kind enough to take this photo...) using a hand drill that is probably older than I am. It was more efficient time-wise, and wood is typically so soft that you don't need a hand powered drill anyway!


OK, I'm done ranting... carry on.


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## Tina (Dec 12, 2007)

Very cool, Stan. I really like old tools (please, those of you who know who you are, don't read anything into that, okay? ), and that one is a beauty.

The new one, a Fiskars? Good brand. I need a power tool because of my wrists and shoulders, but had my own hand drill years ago, as a young 'un. People forget about stuff like that, but they're great. I want one of those hand crank lamps, though.


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## biodieselman (Dec 12, 2007)

Tina said:


> ... What is +1 water? Please, lead the senile, will ya? I googled it and it became no clearer. ...



I hope this is more clear.



> Bienvenue à Eau +1
> 
> La bouteille d’eau qui offre une alternative responsable.
> Bouteille Naturelle
> ...



I linked the page where it asks "english / français".


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## Tina (Dec 13, 2007)

Thanks, Bio. I get a little wary of the whole "Spring water" thing, because I know that usually that's code words for "tap water," and that buying purified water gives one the best chance of ingesting less bacteria. It was good to read about their water, though, and it sounds like it isn't just tap water. I love the idea of the compostable/biodegradable bottle, and given that I keep a case of water in the trunk of my car at all times, it would be tempting to go look for that once I'm in Montreal.


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## biodieselman (Dec 17, 2007)

Not exactly a green issue but I told StantheMan fa_man_stan I would find this important info on.... socks for car tires.:blink:



> Weissenfels WeissSocks are really quick & easy to use. Unlike conventional snow chains, grip is provided by a strong textile surface with no metal parts. Assuming sufficient hand room exists to pull them over the top of the tyre, they are extremely simple to fit and automatically self centre as you drive. As there is nothing to chafe around the back of the tyre, they are ideal for cars with limited clearances between the wheel, wheel arch and suspension struts.
> With no metal chain in contact with the road, WeissSock is totally smooth running with absolutely no vibrations or noise. Removing WeissSock is simply a matter of pulling to the ground and driving off them. We highly recommend WeissSock as a cost effective, highly efficient and easy to use gripping aid that is ideal for use in most snow conditions. Whilst WeissSock gives amazing traction, efficiency & grip is greatly enhanced if fitted to all four tyres.
> Important: Tyre socks of any brand are not yet a legally acceptable form of "snow chain" with in European ski resorts....



I read an article about these tyre socks. They have better traction on ice than chains, they slip on & off as easy as socks & they don't tear up your car's suspension. Our new Fed Banking Chairman hasn't supported the dollar & they may cost more than normal right now. Considering the ease of putting them on, taking them off, the additional traction & safety having them on all four sounds like a good idea.


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## biodieselman (Dec 18, 2007)

As long as I'm talking tires



, how about tyres made from corn?





It takes a *lot* of petroleum to make tires, that's why they are getting so expensive.



Novamont, (bioplastics company) & Goodyear have teamed up to produce tyres made from corn starch.

"bioplastics magazine", vol 2, 2007, pg 19



> BioTRED, is a special patented formula derived from corn... the bio-tyres marketed in Europe... as GT3 or in Japan, (in Japan all tyres are BioTRED) as GT-HYBRID and EAGLE LS3000 feature physical properties that differ substantially from those of the traditional fillers and thus offer several environmental advantages. Not only does the tyre require less energy in its production, and not only does the cultivation of corn absorb CO2, but the tyre actually requires less energy to move the car thanks to a reduced roling resistance. In combination with lower tyre weight this is said to add up to a 5% saving in fuel consumption.
> 
> Further advantages... are a reduction in noise, and therefore in sound pollution, better road-holding in the wet, improved grip and steering ability, and therefore better safety...
> 
> And just recently, the European Commission has awarded Goodyear a major research and development grant to support the company's initiative in the further development of environmentally friendly tyres.... Research partner in this provect is, besides Novamont, the German car maker BMW.



My questions are, instead of black, can I get yellow corn, white corn, red corn or blue corn tires for my 100% biodiesel burning, high-performance, *350 hp diesel powered*, BMW535d?



If I have red, yellow & blue corn, can they make the whole color spectrum in tyres? Will they smell like popcorn if I burned them for a desert campfire?:eat1:


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## Admiral_Snackbar (Dec 20, 2007)

Just bought some of the springy fluorescent bulbs from Wal Mart, mainly due to the longer life and heat issues. Incandescents don't do it for me anymore, standard fluorescents are better in some cases.

The bad thing is the spring lights put out this yellow wavelength, so everything gets a jaundiced look about it.

A friend told me about an alternative wavelength bulb or LED lights which have an incredibly long life.

My issue is when I go to upgrade my home office (currently using a two-bulb fluorescent shoplight), how to determine coverage in terms of lumens/lux/etc..

Any info on this? I am a scathing retard when it comes to this sort of thing.


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## biodieselman (Dec 22, 2007)

Admiral_Snackbar said:


> Just bought some of the springy fluorescent bulbs from Wal Mart, mainly due to the longer life and heat issues. Incandescents don't do it for me anymore, standard fluorescents are better in some cases.
> 
> The bad thing is the spring lights put out this yellow wavelength, so everything gets a jaundiced look about it....
> 
> A friend told me about an alternative wavelength bulb or LED lights which have an incredibly long life....



There are 'natural light' fluorescent replacement bulbs that give off nearly the whole visible light spectrum. Here is just one web site. You might try looking for them on-line, at a Lamps Plus type lighting store, a full service gardening supply house or ask your local indoor pot grower.








We are getting ready to demo the entire kitchen & do it all over. Ris wants to save energy & asked me what I thought about different types of lighting fixtures. I told her that regular fluorescent light especially wouldn't work in a kitchen, the heavy green/yellow light spectrum makes food look awful.





I nagged her into researching LED lighting but unfortunately this lighting technology is just to be applied to residential & commercial lighting fixtures. What little there is available is still pretty expensive.

If any one finds a source of a good selection & reasonably priced LED light fixtures please post or PM Ris.


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## William (Dec 24, 2007)

Hey BD

Toyota is very green

They have developed plant that thrives around the heat sinks and dirt that production plants create.

http://web-japan.org/trends/science/sci051128.html

They have developed Bio-plastics that may make them more money that their Car Business!!!

http://www.toyota.co.jp/en/environmental_rep/03/special02.html

William




biodieselman said:


> There are 'natural light' fluorescent replacement bulbs that give off nearly the whole visible light spectrum.


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## Risible (Dec 24, 2007)

William said:


> Hey BD
> 
> Toyota is very green
> 
> ...


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## SocialbFly (Dec 31, 2007)

something i hate is that i have been buying bottled water here in the OC, cause man the water is awful, smells lik chlorine, and i figure if fish die in it, it cant be all good...so, yeah, but what i have done, is i reuse the bottles, putting my brita pitcher to work, and i put my family to work when they were here doing the same thing (ohhh the whining!!) but yeah, tastes tons better than the gross out water here...


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## biodieselman (Jan 3, 2008)

Now that Christmas is over, you probably have a lot of old electronic stuff to get rid of. Just about every gadget these days has an electronic circuit board made with toxic heavy metals. All batteries, especially cell phone batteries are toxic waste. You may have to call around to locate someone that handles it like the toxic waste it is. But please, dispose of all e-waste properly.




> EPA announced January 10th, at the annual International Consumer Electronics Show's (CES) Environmental Recognition Luncheon a new partnership with Staples and the Product Stewardship Institute to test a pilot "take-back program" as a new approach for recycling used electronics.
> 
> Under this partnership, electronics manufacturers Apple, Brother, Dell, Epson, Intel, Lexmark, Panasonic, Sharp, and Sony will pay for the recycling of their name brand products taken back to Staples. A recycling company called Envirocycle will ensure safe recycling of these products.
> pile of computers, monitors [CRTs], and keyboards
> ...



First call the business that sold the electronics to ask if they have or know of programs for proper e-waste disposal. None of us want lead or mercury in our drinking water.


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## biodieselman (Jan 5, 2008)

> California and 15 other states sued the Bush administration Wednesday, seeking to overturn a federal decision last month rejecting the state's bid to curb greenhouse gases from cars and trucks.
> 
> The lawsuit, filed in the U.S. 9th Circuit Court of Appeals in San Francisco, marks a new round in an epic five-year struggle between California and the federal government over whether states have the power to regulate carbon dioxide and other pollutants that cause global warming....



California also intends to sue the EPA, seeking to regulate airplane CO2 emissions. The Feb. '08 issue of "Consumer Reports" cites estimates of the CO2 pollution per passenger from several sources. TerraPass estimates that each passenger on a flight form New York to Los Angeles emits 1,924 lbs of CO2, BTW, that's 15,392 cubic feet. The Bonneville Environmental Foundation claims 6,732 lbs per passenger or 53,856 cubic feet of CO2. Either way, that's a *lot* of CO2 for just one flight! Scientists now suspect airliner CO2 emissions at high elevations are far more detrimental than automobile emissions at ground level.


Do we really require a Live Earth concert to bring awareness to Global Warming?




FYI, every gallon of gasoline we burn becomes roughly 20 lbs of greenhouse CO2. One pound of CO2 gas is roughly 8 cubic feet, (depending on temperature). Our cars convert each gal of gas burned into 160 cubic feet. Visualize every gal of gas becoming the volume of eight 20 cubic foot refrigerators.


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## Tina (Jan 14, 2008)

Bubbles!!!





Okay, I've calmed down now... Thanks for all the info, Bio. Living in a different place, we now have to find out how to dispose of certain things. While Eric is very dedicated to recycling, he never knew what to do with batteries, so he threw them away. We're now keeping them in a box until we can find out who takes them.

Saw this in the news today. What do you think about it?

*GM to make biofuel out of garbage*

DETROIT, Michigan (AFP) - General Motors Corp. is planning on making biofuel with garbage at a cost of less than a dollar a gallon, the company's chief has said.

The US automaker has entered into a partnership with Illinois-based Coskata Inc. which has developed a way to make ethanol from practically any renewable source, including old tires and plant waste.

The process is a significant improvement over corn-base ethanol because it uses far less water and energy and does not divert food into fuel.

"We are very excited about what this breakthrough will mean to the viability of biofuels and, more importantly, to our ability to reduce dependence on petroleum," said Rick Wagoner, GM's chief executive officer, on Sunday. More...


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## Ryan (Jan 16, 2008)

_"Oh, so Mother Nature needs a favor? Well, maybe she should have thought of that when she was besetting us with droughts and floods and poison monkeys. Nature started the fight for survival and now she wants to quit because she's losing? Well, I say 'hard cheese'!"_ - C. Montgomery Burns


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## David Bowie (Jan 19, 2008)

........................ 

View attachment 2.jpg


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## stan_der_man (Jan 21, 2008)

Here are some pics of the 110 volt LED light fixture I found at Lowes that I mentioned to you Bio... These little suckers draw a fraction of the power compared to fluorescents, their light doesn't oscillate the way fluorescents do, they basically last indefinitely, but they aren't as bright as a fluorescent of the same size. Also, the "white" LEDs have a bluish tint to them which is harsh on the eyes. I think they are good for basic illumination, but not in a situation where they directly illuminate something that is being read, or as a work bench light illuminating whatever you are working on. LEDs still need improvement in that regard, but they are well suited for flashlights or other battery powered applications, because they don't draw much and they aren't particularly fragile.

I mounted the light fixture (the white pod in the center...) on a piece of plastic for wall mounting. The white pod itself is what you mount under a cabinet or wherever. There is a little red LED in the center which is the on / off switch. The red LED stays illuminated when the light is off so you can see the switch.


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## stan_der_man (Jan 21, 2008)

Just to show you how long LEDs last. Here is a night light I've had since the 1970s. It literally was plugged in for years non-stop and it still works!


led_man_stan


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## biodieselman (Jan 22, 2008)

fa_man_stan said:


> Here are some pics of the 110 volt LED light fixture I found at Lowes that I mentioned to you Bio...



Thanks for the info Stan. We've been researching on line for energy efficient lighting for Ris's new kitchen. Since the kitchen is being totally redone, I really wanted the most energy efficient lighting possible. Florescent is too heavy on the yellow/green light spectrum to make food appear appetizing. Only a very limited number of LED products for household lighting are beginning to appear on the market. We did chose to use LEDs for task lighting underneath the kitchen cabinets.

The photos of the unfinished kitchen show two sets of five little adhesive pads that stick underneath the cabinets with four LEDs per pad. I'm old school & don't know how to control the exposure like my old 35mm camera, but *the lights are on*. The flash washed out the LED lighting. I'm sitting on the floor to look up at the bottom of the cabinets. Like you said, the light spectrum from LEDs is heavy on blue light. As of now we will use incandescent lighting so the prepared food doesn't appear to be off.:eat2:

I understand that LEDs with a more natural light will be available soon in a variety of household lighting fixtures. However, I finally needed to buy replacement light bulbs & I bought nine florescent bulbs. I replaced the burned bulbs & a few others where lighting is used the most. The 'soft white' florescent really doesn't look too bad at all.









The microwave/hood hasn't been installed yet between the two light strips in the bottom photo.

We also replaced the old pool filter pump with an energy efficient pump that qualified for a power company rebate.


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## biodieselman (Jan 23, 2008)

Tina said:


> ... *GM to make biofuel out of garbage*
> 
> DETROIT, Michigan (AFP) - General Motors Corp. is planning on making biofuel with garbage at a cost of less than a dollar a gallon, the company's chief has said....



I've been meaning to respond to your post, Tina, & I'm sorry I took so long. Hope you're staying warm during this recent frigid weather. The weatherman says it might get down to 38 here in LA. Damn that's cold! It has been so 'cold' that Ris has been making ol' man Bearie wear his hoodie sweatshirt. Oh, while it's on my mind, remind Eric for me that he's a lucky man, will ya?

The last two issues of "Biomass Magazine" & "Biodiesel Magazine" are *filled* with new plants being built across the nation utilizing every type of waste that once was bound for landfills. There has been recent developments dramatically reducing the costs of producing man-made enzymes. These enzymes allows new cellulosic ethanol plants to greatly reduce the amount water polluted in production, reduces the energy requirements, which greatly reduces the cost per gallon of ethanol.

Enzymes are being tailored to 'digest' practically any organic material, instead of using a slower, more expensive fermentation process. Garbage, paper, wood chips, saw dust, manure from feedlots, yard waste, left over stover from harvesting food crops, even weeds & straw. If it rots, we can use it. Utilizing waste biomass will hopefully reduce the economic strain on the rising costs of feedstock. Corn for tortillas & cornstalks & garbage for ethanol.

The 'digested' biomass produces syngas, which can be used as building blocks to make everything we currently make from petroleum. Bioplastic for one example.






Scientist can now spin straw, (waste byproducts) into gold (almost anything!).


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## biodieselman (Jan 28, 2008)

Highlights from "bioplastics magazine", January, 2008.

_"According to a new technical research report...the global market for biodegradable polymers reaches 246,000 tonnes in 2007. This is expected to increase to over 564,000 tonnes by 2012, a compound average annual growth rate of 17.3%....

... The North American biodegradable polymer market has not progressed as rapidly as in Europe, and Asia but is now beginning to show its potential. The major drivers for the U.S. market are mandated legislation and prospective increases in landfill pricing - none of which are foreseen within the next 5 years, although recent increases in petroleum based plastics have rekindled interest in biodegradable polymers..." (pg. 5)

"At Nokia World 2007,... introduced their Nokia 3110 Evolve Bio-Covers Environment - Friendly Phone. This phone is the environment-friendly version of the 3110 Classic. It uses "bio-covers" made from more than 50% renewable material, which replace the normal thermoplastic materials used on other phones. The 3110 Evolve will also come in a smaller package made of 60% recycled materials and with a new efficient charger that (according to Nokia) used 94% less energy than Energy Star requires." (pg. 6)

"Whilst the first examples of biodegradable and compostable packaging started to appear on UK supermarket shelves as far back as 2001, there has been a very marked increase over the past two years...

Traditionally the UK has been behind mush of the rest of Europe in many aspects of waste management, so how is it that the UK is now seen by many as a major driving force behind the introduction of compostable and renewable packaging?...

...Suddenly Climate Change is understood by many to be one of the principal challenges, perhaps even the greatest challenge that the human-race will face going forward.

Media focus on the environment, both written and audio-visual, has increased dramatically, and packaging in particular has a major 'image problem'....

... the UK is in the midst of a recycling revolution.

Household recycling stood at a pitiful 7% in 1997!

By 2006/07 however, it has reached 31%, and the leading local authorities are now recycling over 50%... (pg. 16, 17) _"

Let's hear it for the Brits!


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## stan_der_man (Jan 30, 2008)

biodieselman said:


> Thanks for the info Stan. We've been researching on line for energy efficient lighting for Ris's new kitchen. Since the kitchen is being totally redone, I really wanted the most energy efficient lighting possible. Florescent is too heavy on the yellow/green light spectrum to make food appear appetizing. Only a very limited number of LED products for household lighting are beginning to appear on the market. We did chose to use LEDs for task lighting underneath the kitchen cabinets.
> 
> The photos of the unfinished kitchen show two sets of five little adhesive pads that stick underneath the cabinets with four LEDs per pad. I'm old school & don't know how to control the exposure like my old 35mm camera, but *the lights are on*. The flash washed out the LED lighting. I'm sitting on the floor to look up at the bottom of the cabinets. Like you said, the light spectrum from LEDs is heavy on blue light. As of now we will use incandescent lighting so the prepared food doesn't appear to be off.:eat2:
> 
> ...


Very nice pics Bio! I got lucky with my LED pics, I didn't do anything fancy with the exposure.

It looks like your kitchen is coming along! I can't wait to see it when it's finished.


Stan


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## biodieselman (Feb 4, 2008)

Ris bought herself a new 'toy'. We've been wanting a small greenhouse to start seedlings but we just don't have the room. Damn vegetable garden & fruit trees take up too much space. So she bought a small cheap little cold frame to get a headstart on spring.

Ris starts most of the flowers & vegetables from seed; I'm just the laborer. The nights are still too cold for germinating most veggies, but she really wanted to get an early start this year. While putting this cold frame together for her I had a brain fart. I can make this better AND easier for her to tend!

OK, so I'm a bit of a pack rat. I hate throwing away materials & parts still in good condition that are leftover after a job is completed. I had made a very sturdy step for her to climb up into the truck camper shell (before we got the travel trailer). I mounted the cold frame on a piece of leftover plywood & sealed the bottom & top of the lid with foam weather stripping. Putting the cold frame on top of the high step makes it easier on her back as she bends over it.

I wired 120v power through a line voltage rated refrigeration thermostat, using the set of contacts that opens on a temperature rise. The thermostat controls power to the duplex outlets & the light fixture. I started with a 25 watt incandescent light bulb (left over after replacing them with fluorescent bulbs) & plugged her bottom-heating mat into the outlet. Using my Fluke temperature probes, (temporarily held with tape on the right side), I found out 25 watts isn't enough heat for nighttime temps in the 40s. I wound up using a second outdoor lighting fixture & two 75 watt incandescent bulbs for heat.






After sealing the cold frame top & bottom, I'm able to maintain 72 degrees at night. The thermostat turns off all power when the temperature reaches 72. She also bought a 'solar' vent to open the lid when it gets too hot inside the cold frame. If you look at the center of the photo you'll see a black cylinder. It open around 75 degrees. The black cylinder is temperature sensitive & operates on gas pressure to open & close the lid.






The only thing I had to buy was the weather stripping & a 4" metal gang box to mount the free recycled materials. ... oh yeah, and the cold frame.


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## William (Feb 4, 2008)

Hi 

Here is a great story about a lady farmer in the Amazon ocean flood plain that is using her knowledge of farming to beat Global Warming


NPR- Farming the Amazon with a Machete and Mulch

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=18656632


William





biodieselman said:


> Ris bought herself a new 'toy'. We've been wanting a small greenhouse to start seedlings but we just don't have the room.....


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## samsam81073 (Feb 5, 2008)

Don't drive a big car like me, lol.


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## Admiral_Snackbar (Feb 6, 2008)

This may be old news but an eco-friendly concept house has been designed and is seen on Cradle To Cradle's website. No word yet on the cost of such a structure, nor if any particular environments would be hostile to it's sustainability. It would feature:

- It has a photosynthetic, phototropic spinach skin surface and a vegetated roof system that filters storm water in.
- A vertical core with super-conductive photosynthetic plasma that generates 200% more voltage than ordinary solar cells. 
- The spinach protein shell of the house grows over time, generating enough electricity to power the neighbors' homes, too. 
- The vegetated roof collects storm water and filters it. Non-potable water goes to a septic tank below the home, and then feeds the garden. 
- Soy-foam wall panels keep heat in.
- Reconstituted concrete with striated polymer mesh reinforcement helps keep the open floor plan intact. 
- Walls can be moved around easily to accommodate growing families and renovations. 
- The unique contours of the building increase wind speed overhead, generating more power. 
- Hot air flows out of the house through the core stack ventilation tower. 
- Waste is collected and re-purposed as a fertilizer for the garden.


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## William (Feb 6, 2008)

This is why oil is King

House Members of the 110th (2007-2008) Congress
Showing contributions greater than $2,295, members receiving more than $18,500, and companies giving more than $15,000

http://oilmoney.priceofoil.org/federalRaceGraph.php?type=congress

For what is a man profited, if he shall gain the whole world, and lose his own soul? or what shall a man give in exchange for his soul?

Matthew, 16

William


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## Tina (Feb 12, 2008)

Chuck, that is marvelous! You're so darned handy. 

We went to Costco here weekend before this last one and I saw 'plastic' cups made from that corn stuff (I know, the technical talk is mind-boggling) -- corn oil? Corn something? I was really thrilled to see that. We will be using them when we have a gathering -- probably later next month. Was really happy to see some place like Costco supporting that.


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## biodieselman (Feb 12, 2008)

Tina said:


> ... We went to Costco here weekend before this last one and I saw 'plastic' cups made from that corn stuff... I was really thrilled to see that. We will be using them when we have a gathering -- probably later next month. Was really happy to see some place like Costco supporting that.



Hi Tina, hope the dramatic change in your life is becoming less wearing & less dramatic as time passes.

I'm a cheapskate & complain about the cost of industry magazines, but the publications have really opened my eyes. At the risk of becoming a total bore, I'll say it again: *Big changes are coming.* I won't bore you with details but I'll briefly summarize a few articles I've read recently.

The main reasons you're noticing bioplastic products in stores is because you're educated to the differences & benefits. You now know to look for alternatives to petroleum plastics. But the real reason Costco carries bioplastic products is they are becoming cheaper than dino-plastic. The article I read stated bioplastics is cheaper when petroleum reaches $76/barrel. Economics will drive the change.



Admiral_Snackbar said:


> This may be old news but an eco-friendly concept house has been designed and is seen on Cradle To Cradle's website...





> ... Minimizing toxic pollution and the waste of natural resources are not strategies for real change. Designing industrial processes so they do not generate toxic pollution and "waste" in the first place is true change. Long-term prosperity depends not on the efficiency of a fundamentally destructive system, but on the effectiveness of processes designed to be healthy and renewable in the first place.
> 
> Cradle to Cradle Design's strategy of eco-effectiveness is rooted in the systems of the natural world, which are not efficient at all, but effective. Consider the cherry tree. Each spring it makes thousands of blossoms, which then fall in piles to the ground-not very efficient. But the fallen blossoms become food for other living things. The tree's abundance of blossoms is both safe and useful, contributing to the health of a thriving, interdependent system. And the tree spreads multiple positive effects-making oxygen, transpiring water, creating habitat, and more. And it is beautiful!...



The brilliant German chemist, William McDonough, has spurred a revolution in industrial design. The "Waste Equals Food" & "Cradle to Cradle" engineering & design concepts are spreading worldwide. California legislature is currently considering banning thousands of toxic industrial chemicals. They will require industry to use safer, less polluting processes. These regulations will have a nationwide impact. Because California is such a huge segment of the nation's economy, it will not be cost effective to build two separate processing plants. The goal is to emulate nature's supreme efficiency of recycling, which will ultimately be more cost effective. Again with the economics.

California is also working on building codes that will require commercial buildings to use 50% less energy. Recent developments in photovoltaics allows a dramatic cost reduction, due to new production techniques requiring less silicon. We may soon see the entire exterior skin of buildings covered with wafer thin photovoltaics.

WalMart is experimenting with permeable paving so that rain doesn't run off into the sewers. There is a growing revival in sod roofs. Sod roofs not only reduce rain runoff, but they help keep buildings warm in the winter & cool in the summer, dramatically reducing energy usage.

California is facing future water shortages. The city I live in recently passed regulations requiring all new commercial buildings to have separate water systems installed. The second water system will allow reclaimed sewage water to be used for landscape irrigation. Southern Californians are starting to grade their building lots to capture rain runoff. Using gutters, drainage pipes & lot grading, rain will be stored in underground tanks for later landscape irrigation.

From what little I've read, there are a great many changes coming to our world. Including my personal agenda, alternative energy. Newspapers didn't invent radio. Radio didn't invent TV. TV didn't invent cable. Cable didn't invent the internet. Nor will Big Oil invent cheap alternative energy. Because of ever increasing energy costs with no end in sight, some man or woman, tinkering in their garage, will invent cheaper & cheaper alternative energy. I'll have Ris throw a big party when EXXON finally loses their petroleum monopoly.



William said:


> ...Here is a great story about a lady farmer in the Amazon ocean flood plain that is using her knowledge of farming to beat Global Warming...
> 
> William



Fine example of individuals taking personal responsibility, not to pollute. Pollution *is* a choice. Developing nations are not being left out of the equation. Negotiations are currently under way in Nusa Dua, Indonesia to create a successor to the Kyoto Protocol. The Bali summit seeks to pay poorer nations to be green.



samsam81073 said:


> Don't drive a big car like me, lol.



There is a little something we all can do to make a difference. I'm not an extremist on anything, not even biodiesel. IMO, we can maintain our lifestyle with conservation & wise choices. Being green doesn't necessarily mean sacrifice. Even owners of 'big cars' can make a difference.

Did you know the average driver can save one ton of greenhouse gas/year with good driving techniques? Drive your car like a truck driver. No jackrabbit starts, anticipate red lights to maintain a steady speed, don't race up to red lights just to slam on the brakes & most importantly, obey speed limits.

I watched "Energy Wars" on the History channel recently. Felt good to hear someone else saying what I've felt for a long time. Our federal government is 'brain dead, flat-line brain wave activity' regarding our :doh:stupid:doh: dependency on oil from unstable governments. (Recently, Hugo Chavez threatened to cut off oil exports to the US... *again!*) The documentary stated that he had a huge stack of letters from all over the nation from business & citizens taking action, taking personal responsibility & not waiting for Uncle (brain-dead) Sam to enact sensible energy policies. Energy Secretary Bill Richardson's token, BS, tax subsidies for giant agriculture conglomerates to make ethanol or millions for hydrogen research so that a dozen people can drive million dollar cars to photo ops are *not* sensible policies. The end to our polluting/petroleum addiction will not come from Uncle Sam or Big Oil. Energy independence will happen at the hands of some one tinkering around in their garage asking, "I wonder what will happen if I do this?"

Fewer & fewer people around the world are saying with their efforts...


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## Ho Ho Tai (Feb 13, 2008)

BDMan -

I wish I could bring this entire thread to the attention of every one of our congressional representatives, state governors, cabinet members, and on down - right on down to the guys I meet in the barbershop. But - such a jewel to be hosted in this rather tangled board of ours! I hesitate at times to forward the link to others for fear that their explorations elsewhere on the boards would lead them to take this thread less seriously.

Ah, well . . .

Where do you find the time and energy to construct posts like this, along with keeping your gardens and distillery humming? My hat is permanently off to you.

I will quote just one of the sections of your post:

"Did you know the average driver can save one ton of greenhouse gas/year with good driving techniques? Drive your car like a truck driver. No jackrabbit starts, anticipate red lights to maintain a steady speed, don't race up to red lights just to slam on the brakes & most importantly, obey speed limits."

As I thread my way through city traffic, I have wondered many times how much energy we could save, collectively, if we drove, not only using good driving techniques, but cooperatively, like a big machine with ten thousand moving parts. If every freeway merge was treated as a cooperative endeavor, with the person on the freeway either speeding up or slowing down to accommodate the car entering - and if that car's driver were astute enough to watch for, and take advantage of, these courtesies. . .

When I find myself stopped at a light with a freeway entrance on my right, I will pull to the left as far as possible to permit those behind me to enter the freeway, thus saving a bit of engine idle time.

There are probably thousands of similar acts that we could all perform routinely to expedite traffic flow, save engine idle time, and unnecessarily vigorous acceleration and braking.

The gears in a properly regulated clock all act in accord. If every gear was free to choose it's own speed and direction, chaos would result. Perhaps it's time to implement the smart freeway concept, if people can't manage it collectively.

I state what I consider to be the three most important rules governing collective driving.

3. Obey the law, except where it conflicts with rules #2 and #1
2. Use 'common' sense, and refine that sense with a knowledge of vehicle and road dynamics, weather conditions and the anticipated acts of other drivers.
1. Drive with courtesy. Those other cars contain mothers, fathers, offspring, et c. Treat them as you would your own.

I've often wished that cars had a bit more 'language' capability, beyond turn signals and brake lights. While most of us can read auto 'body language' and predict the intentions of the other drivers, I'd like to see brake lights mounted front, rear and sides. I'd like to have some way of signaling "you first", "thank you" and "sorry - my bad". Of course, this might be a bit much for those who have yet to fathom the function of the turn signal.

I think we already have sufficient means of signaling our displeasure!


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## stan_der_man (Feb 22, 2008)

*I love this graphic!* 


One thing I just noticed... eBay now has a feature to specifically search for alternative fuel vehicles! It's not perfect, for example "electric" occasionally brings up some vehicles that only have "electric windows".

http://hub.motors.ebay.com/alternative_fuel



alternative_man_stan


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## biodieselman (Feb 22, 2008)

fa_man_stan said:


> ...*I love this graphic!* ...
> 
> alternative_man_stan



*Stan, you know that you're buying an alternative fuel capable vehicle!*

A vehicle that has the ability to switch between conventional diesel or...





In fact, I predict that you will soon be spending more time hanging out behind restaurants than posting on Dims.





Just so you can cover your dock bumper with bumper stickers similar to...





Here's another favorite cartoon of mine for your enjoyment.


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## lipmixgirl (Feb 24, 2008)

i have been ranting about this for a few years now... and now i am just running around like chicken little screaming "we're killing ourselves! we're killing ourselves"... 

any *ignoramous*- and i mean _*ignoramous *_- who makes an arguement that global warming is some sort of conjured myth- that does not see what is happening with our increased and consistant UNNATURALLY WARMER weather patterns is the direct effect of releasing greenhouse gasses into the atmosphere should really watch the new special on the National Geographic channel entitled "Six Degrees Could Change The Earth"....

if seeing the evidence of melting and DISAPPEARING glaciers isn't enough...

ok, enough of my rant on the bad news - the good news is:

i proudly and emphatically CHOOSE to live in manhattan (my island paradise off the coast of the mainland) because of the quality of life it offers...

- i do not own a car, nor do i need a car or want one while living here 
 my monthly travel expenses are all of $76 a month for 24-7 access to NYC 
 busses and subways

- my city RECYCLES! NYC offers a comprehensive recycling program for paper, 
 metal, plastic, and glass - along with electronics recycling

- my city plans to ban the use of plastic bags in stores. it encourages people to 
 use cloth bags for shopping

- NYC currently has the "Small Steps, Big Strides" reduce, reuse, recycle
 campaign in effect to encourage NYC'ers to do such things as change to e- 
 billing, unplug electronics when not in use, etc...

- NYC promotes "Freecycle" fairs to encourage people to bring their good, yet 
 unwanted items to free good swaps in the city to reduce unnecessary waste

the big green apple has spoken...
::exeunt:: :bow:


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## David Bowie (Feb 25, 2008)

and polar bears are drowning!


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## David Bowie (Feb 25, 2008)

biodieselman said:


> We already are dreaming of our spring garden. Our first spring seed catalog has already arrived!



oh so what kinds of plants do you grow...


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## biodieselman (Feb 26, 2008)

lipmixgirl said:


> ... - my city RECYCLES! NYC offers a comprehensive recycling program for paper,
> metal, plastic, and glass - along with electronics recycling
> 
> - my city plans to ban the use of plastic bags in stores. it encourages people to use cloth bags for shopping
> ...



Good for you! I love it when people don't use the planet for a...



Not that many seem to know about E-waste. How does NY handle E-waste pickup? In LA, they have rotating Hazardous Waste Roundups in different areas around the city. One can usually find a Roundup near the home once or twice per year. Ris & I have a section in the garage to store old paints, household chemicals, etc. We have a box for old electronics & another smaller box for batteries.

I don't throw old circuit boards from work into customer's trash either. I bring replaced parts home & remove the circuit boards for proper disposal. Nearly all of the commercial a/c part stores take old mercury thermostats, which have been outlawed in LA. The free Roundups are only for homeowners. They see the biodiesel bumper stickers on my truck & ask if I'm a business. I also recycle copper, aluminum, brass & steel. I got $240 a couple weeks ago for salvage. It pays to be green.



David Bowie said:


> oh so what kinds of plants do you grow...



I cleaned up my Photobucket account & must have deleted the seed catalog photo. We have several varieties of fruit trees, blackberries (ollalie), a vegetable garden & flowers.

The birds got my first planting of broccoli last fall. The second planting has just finished producing & the last of the winter garden broccoli isn't quite ready yet. In the photo you can see broccoli in the front, mustard greens in the middle & bok choy in the rear of this bed. There is another whole bed of broccoli that's a little bit bigger. In the bottom photo you will see fistfuls of broccoli from the second fall planting.









Just last week we started picking Sugar Snap peas, with lots & lots of peas soon to enjoy. Yum... fresh picked peas!









Last Sunday, Ris made stir-fry using garden peas, bok choy & broccoli raab. Damn, that woman is a good cook!





We also grew something called broccoli raab; leaves, stalks and florets are edible.





Ris has sprouted seeds of several tomatoes for me & flowers for fresh bouquets in the house to plant this spring. I'm pouring worm tea from our worm ranch into the flats for gentle fertilizer.


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## stan_der_man (Mar 2, 2008)

You guys always have incredible fresh veggies!

We are one step closer to getting a diesel truck... We went to Riverside yesterday and looked at a '97 Ford F-350 (7.3L of course...) from a private individual which leads me to my question... What sort of fuel milage should I be expecting from a big diesel like this? The guy told me he got about 11 mpg city, 18 mpg highway. Is that typical?


Don't worry, I won't let you down Bio... I'm definitely getting a diesel!


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## biodieselman (Mar 2, 2008)

fa_man_stan said:


> You guys always have incredible fresh veggies!
> 
> We are one step closer to getting a diesel truck... We went to Riverside yesterday and looked at a '97 Ford F-350 (7.3L of course...) from a private individual which leads me to my question... What sort of fuel milage should I be expecting from a big diesel like this? The guy told me he got about 11 mpg city, 18 mpg highway. Is that typical?...



My kids were 13 & 14 when I brought that '90 Cummins home. They absolutely hated it. Now that they are grown, they both have diesels. My son has probably hit 500,000 with my old Cummins. My daughter, like me, isn't a Dodge fan & she bought a 7.3L Powerstroke. She drives a ...






for a living, my little tom-girl:wubu:. She drives it like her truck & transfer, obeying speed limits, anticipating street lights to avoid jackrabbit starts & unnecessary sudden stops & keeps the engine in the 'sweet spot' with the manual transmission. I assume you know diesels have 'sweet spots', much like a two-stroke engine. Her fuel economy isn't quite as good as this guy's.

So, yes, those are pretty typical MPGs for a 7.3L Powerstroke. Add about 4-5 MPG for a Cummins. 

I had assumed that you would want to go the biodiesel route. Biodiesel is costing me about 80 cents per gallon to brew since the price of methanol has increased. The cost of methanol isn't tied to the cost of petroleum since it's mostly made from natural gas. Problem is, more & more biodiesel plants are sprouting up in the mid-west & east coast & the cost reflects the increased demand for methanol.

I know I don't live that close to you, & I don't know how often you come down off the mountain to see your Mom, but I would be happy to process any oil you have into biodiesel if you don't want 'Junior' around potentially dangerous chemicals. I would gladly teach you how to brew biodiesel if you bought or made your own processor.

I've been looking for a 'bio-partner' to help pay off the initial cost of the processor equipment. What is the availability of Waste Vegetable Oil up in the mountains? What does the university's cafeteria do with their WVO & how much do they produce a month? I would be more than happy to work out an arrangement where we both can be 'carbon neutral'. How about forming a fa_man_stan/bio_man co-op?


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## stan_der_man (Mar 4, 2008)

biodieselman said:


> ...
> 
> I've been looking for a 'bio-partner' to help pay off the initial cost of the processor equipment. What is the availability of Waste Vegetable Oil up in the mountains? What does the university's cafeteria do with their WVO & how much do they produce a month? I would be more than happy to work out an arrangement where we both can be 'carbon neutral'. How about forming a fa_man_stan/bio_man co-op?



We are going to look at an '01 Ford F250 (7.3L 4x4, short bed). I'm hoping to get something as short as possible to fit into our driveway... You and I should definitely talk about it more. I was hoping to have a couple thou $ extra to possibly put together a bio-diesel setup like yours but last night our house furnace (literally) blew. My extra money is going to that at the moment. With my Wednesdays off I could dedicate some time to "hanging out behind restaurants..." I would be interested in some possible working together (especially if it brings down my fuel costs!  ) I know a lot of people in La Verne, that may have more potential than the mountains. You never know... We'll talk more, definitely!


Stan


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## Ho Ho Tai (Mar 8, 2008)

biodieselman said:


> My pet topic is biodiesel. I can give you pointers if you're considering ending your petroleum addiction. Future cars & trucks with new era diesel technology & Ultra Low Sulfur Diesel fuel will be cleaner than gasoline engines plus get up to 40% better fuel economy. New diesels are as clean as a Prius & in my case of burning 100% biodiesel much cleaner than a Prius.



BDMan -

I'm sending you both a link to our local paper and the text in clear (there are photos on the website.)

Augsburg College is a small, local, private Lutheran-based college of sterling reputation, given neither to hyperbole nor proselytizing. [ http://www.augsburg.edu/ ] I don't think that this is another cold fusion story. I will post this story on the board too (in the BD thread). I ask your considered opinion here and on the board.

Let's just hope that they don't succumb to Big Oil interests before this thing has a chance to escape into the wild.

Ho Ho Tai

Link: you may have to register to read it, but it's free. http://www.startribune.com/business/16404276.html

text:
StarTribune.com
Augsburg boasts discovery of biodiesel 'miracle'

By THOMAS LEE, Star Tribune

March 7, 2008

The setting was modest but the rhetoric was anything but.

Inside a drab third-floor chemistry lab at Augsburg College, a group of scientists on Friday unveiled a technology they claim could "revolutionize" energy production and free the United States from its dependence on foreign oil.

That's a tall order for a small liberal arts college in Minneapolis that, at least until now, was not particularly known for its energy acumen.

Nevertheless, Augsburg President Paul Pribbenow suggested the technology, which makes cleaner and cheaper biodiesel fuel, could be "one of modern day's greatest discoveries." ("Miracle," "history making" and "dream" were also liberally tossed about during the 30-minute news conference.)

more at link​


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## biodieselman (Mar 11, 2008)

Ho Ho Tai said:


> ... Inside a drab third-floor chemistry lab at Augsburg College, a group of scientists on Friday unveiled a technology they claim could "revolutionize" energy production and free the United States from its dependence on foreign oil.
> 
> That's a tall order for a small liberal arts college in Minneapolis that, at least until now, was not particularly known for its energy acumen.
> 
> Nevertheless, Augsburg President Paul Pribbenow suggested the technology, which makes cleaner and cheaper biodiesel fuel, could be "one of modern day's greatest discoveries." ("Miracle," "history making" and "dream" were also liberally tossed about during the 30-minute news conference.)...



There have been many recent promising developments in biofuels, bioplastics & bio-based materials. I've read several articles in "Biodiesel Magazine" of companies using different technologies, searching to lower the costs of biodiesel production but I can't find the magazines.:doh:

A company has developed a process using microwave technology for thermal depolymerization, another using a variation of Fisher-Tropsch gasification and catalysis, and yet another using proprietary solid catalysts which aren't consumed in the transesterfication process.

Recent advances in enzyme production for cellulostic ethanol also promises cheap affordable fuels from non-food biomass.

I believe petroleum prices will continue to climb well above $100/barrel oil. IMO, because many investors believe we are on the back side of Hubbert's Peak, we will soon see many new scientific developments from many diverse technologies.

I hope these guys are onto something. I tend towards optimism.


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## Crystal (Mar 18, 2008)

Since I began attending the University of Tennessee, I've found myself becoming more and more green. 

The University has done an excellent job promoting recycling and saving energy. There are nearly 1,000 recycling bins scattered around campus, as well as two on every floor of every dormitory. 

They also plan to change each current light bulb on campus to the LCD version during this week, while we are on Spring Break. 

It's my understanding that they even won an award at the beginning of the year for their promotion of green energy.

It's refreshing to see such a massive university like UT take steps to maintain a cleaner environment.


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## LarryTheShiveringChipmunk (Mar 24, 2008)

im pretty dern green except for my car...since i cant really afford a new one now, but it still gets 20+ mpg usually, and i still bike when i can to some places. 

i recycle everything that it's good to recycle (ie i dont recycle the things that cause more pollution to recycle than to get new material) and im one of the apt complex's trash picker uppers.

i think living in a chicago apt where they "force" certain things was good when i was just out of college. now its instinct.

mine you im one of those GW skeptics too, but my thought is, theres many other reasons to be green


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## Fire_in_AK (Apr 3, 2008)

Yo! What up CHippy!! Guess who lol. I am green as I can be. I use organic food and cleaning supplies from 7th generation. I recycle what the city offers and do what I can. Other then that I use my car, I consume fuel and keep on living.


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## swamptoad (Apr 4, 2008)

My first time posting in this sticky! :blush:

Yesterday, I spent an hour sorting through the apartments recycling bins and then placing appropriate items in the outside recycling bin, where the apartment care-taker said that they needed to go. Most of the stuff was recyclable, but there was still some trash mixed in. 

Lots of plastic, newspapers, crushed cans, glass ---- I had to sort through to make sure were clean and such.

Oh well, I really am not all that angry or bent out of shape. Glad that more and more people are recycling around the apartment. :bow: My wife actually got me more involved into recycling. :wubu:


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## biodieselman (Apr 5, 2008)

> April 3, 2008 -- Aircraft maker Boeing flew a plane earlier this year that was powered by a hydrogen battery in a first for the aviation industry...
> 
> "For the first time in the history of aviation, Boeing has flown a manned airplane that was powered by a hydrogen battery,"...
> 
> ...



The cost of fuel cells is dropping & hopefully will become affordable. Two other major stumbling blocks of hydrogen might possibly be solved: a cheap, efficient source & safe storage.



> The energy in biodiesel is typically released by combustion, or more simply, by burning it.... Diesel engines are more efficient than other internal combustion engines, but they still waste a lot of energy as heat... One alternative for converting biodiesel and other biofuels into useful energy is a technology once almost exclusively associated with the space program, but is rapidly finding more uses in everyday lifethe fuel cell....
> 
> The downside of fuel cells is that until recently, they were expensive.... However, with research and innovative manufacturing techniques the price of fuel cells has fallen to the point where they are competitive in many applications including replacing batteries in back-up power systems. Fuel cells are being used all over right now, Irving says. They could be used more than they are now if a source of hydrogen could be made more available. They are being used now, but they have many, many, many more potential markets in the future.
> 
> ...


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## Hawksmoor (Apr 7, 2008)

What an excellent thread! It somehow evaded my notice until now. I am a huge advocate of living as environmentally responsible as possible and have done everything I can think of along those lines. I recycle; this includes glass, plastic, cans, paper, cardboard, batteries, and hopefully light bulbs soon - assuming I can find some place locally that takes them.

I am also very vigilant about my water usage and do everything I can to keep it to a minimum. This includes not running the tap when I brush my teeth, not separating whites and colors when doing laundry (and only doing laundry when I have enough dirty clothes to fill up the entire machine), and cutting the water off in the shower after I'm completely wet and keeping it off while I lather myself with soap and my hair with shampoo. I also refrain from getting my car washed and watering my lawn and observe all state and local water restrictions.

There is always more than can be done, and I actively look for ways to be even greener than I am. It's pretty much a way of life for me.


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## SocialbFly (Apr 8, 2008)

Green as in brocolli??


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## ekmanifest (Apr 8, 2008)

SocialbFly said:


> Green as in brocolli??



No, Diana! Green as in four-leaf clovers!


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## swamptoad (Apr 10, 2008)

I don't know if this has already been shared in this sticky but I thought I'd share it here with you all.

*Grindzilla*​
*Website:​*
http://www.grindzilla.com/​
*Video:​*
http://climate.weather.com/video/?bcpid=1155389201&bclid=1236266814&bctid=1487554928​
*About Us --- (first portion)​*
Green Jobsites, parent company of Grindzilla, was formed because of the overwhelming need for an eco-friendly yet cost-effective alternative to hauling scrap building materials to our overflowing landfills. The Grindzilla can efficiently recycle those materials from C&D waste, house renovations/demolitions, pallet disposal, plastic recycling, pallet recycling, tire shredding for TDF and asphalt production and bio-energy as well as many more uses! _...further reading on website
_
*Recycle uses created by Grindzilla&#8482;​*
* Grindzilla wood can be used for _erosion control_, landscape mulch, walking paths, animal bedding, and _biomass fuel_; 
* Grindzilla gypsum can be used in the production of Portland cement, as a soil or composting amendment, flea powder, or for oil absorption.
* Grindzilla nails extracted during the grinding process can also be recycled.
* Capable of grinding plastics to create more value to recyclers


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## starrbbw (Apr 10, 2008)

While bicycling is a fantastic alternative, not all in this community can easily get on and ride a bike. 

And even though I can ride a bike...everywhere I work (I'm a substitute teacher and work part-time at Clinique) is at least 15-20 miles away by freeway so biking around is not as feasible in my community. 

I did change my lightbulbs to energy effecient ones though!


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## stan_der_man (May 1, 2008)

ekmanifest said:


> No, Diana! Green as in four-leaf clovers!





SocialbFly said:


> Green as in brocolli??




I'll 'fess, I'm more of a brocolli kinda guy myself.... Brocolli is more tasty than four-leaf clovers, although I suppose that's arguable. 





I was a good boy, I got myself a greenie reusable grocery bag from our local grocery store! So now I won't be wasting grocery bags (although the plastic bags do come in handy as little garbage bags in our trailer...)


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## stan_der_man (May 1, 2008)

One thing I heard the other day on the radio that I wanted to comment on... (Maybe this is more of a Hyde Park rant... if so forgive me.) They were talking about "green washing" (I believe it was called...) on KFI (a local Los Angeles, AM talk radio program...) This guy was taking about how he was part of an organization which rated products on how "green" they were (if the products rated were made out of recycled material, how clean the manufacturing process was... etc...) He used as an example a company that made paper towels. He got into the specifics of good (clean) manufacturing techniques, using recycled paper stock etc... I sat there listing to him talking and though to myself that there is nothing "green" about disposable paper towels. Am I totally off base on this? To me being "green" and being environmentally "friendly" is going to mean doing without many things. Disposable products (whether they are fast food rappers, disposable bags from the store, paper towels... etc.) are ultimately thrown into garbage dumps. So what is the point whether or not they are made out of recycled materials or not? The trees that were originally cut to make the first generation of products, later to be recycled, are ultimately just being thrown away one or two generations (of manufacturing...) later anyway? And this guy who is supposed to be an "expert" doesn't seem to see this? I don't know, maybe I'm taking this idea to the extreme...

Just pondering what "green" really means...


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## pagan22 (May 1, 2008)

I'm not green at all, but I try to be. I live in the country and the recycling service is $$$$$ and they have stupid rules, so we don't buy that service. I drive a big ol' Dodge pickup because it has 4WD (needed in our winters) and it's safe, so my auto insurance is really low. I refuse to get rid of it. Besides, it's a formidable beast on the roads.

On the flip side, I use all organic materials and non-harmful chemicals for my gardening. I also keep a compost pile and find uses for magazines and newspapers in the yard. Usually for killing grass for new gardens. In effect, less grass means less to mow, so I'm using less gasoline and I'm not putting more exhaust into the air. I also live only 1/4 mile from the grocery store, gas stations, bar, restaurants, and library so I walk everywhere when possible. Especially since gas hit $3.75/gal Tues.


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## pagan22 (May 1, 2008)

starrbbw said:


> I did change my lightbulbs to energy effecient ones though!



The spiral ones? I read somewhere in the paper that they actually contain mercury. It said if one busts, you need to call the 1-800# on the box to have a special cleaning crew come in and clean your floor.

In one of my classes, someone mentioned LED lights were expensive, but saved the most energy in the long run. 

http://thefraserdomain.typepad.com/energy/2007/02/led_lights_save.html


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## bigsexy920 (May 9, 2008)

Ok - So I started watching this show they have on TLC - i cant remember the name of it. But it has made me realize that Im not nearly as green as I can be. 

Since watching that show I've been making sure that all the lights, TV and computer are off during the day when Im not home ( I was leaving the TV on for dog). In addition Ive been better with recycling. I have a really small kitchen and it is taking up a lot of space. 

Does anyone have any space saving ideas? Ive been using the old big plasic container that the cat litter comes in. they stack well and they have handles so that makes it easier for me to take them down stairs. It just looks horrible in the kitchen.


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## Risible (May 9, 2008)

CG_8 said:


> I'm not green at all, but I try to be. I live in the country and the recycling service is $$$$$ and they have stupid rules, so we don't buy that service. I drive a big ol' Dodge pickup because it has 4WD (needed in our winters) and it's safe, so my auto insurance is really low. I refuse to get rid of it. Besides, it's a formidable beast on the roads.
> 
> On the flip side, I use all organic materials and non-harmful chemicals for my gardening. I also keep a compost pile and find uses for magazines and newspapers in the yard. Usually for killing grass for new gardens. In effect, less grass means less to mow, so I'm using less gasoline and I'm not putting more exhaust into the air. I also live only 1/4 mile from the grocery store, gas stations, bar, restaurants, and library so I walk everywhere when possible. Especially since gas hit $3.75/gal Tues.



I think the biggest violators of pollution are Big Business and Big Oil; currently, it seems, our government is protecting them and their foul practices (I have hopes for the next administration, that the next president, be it Obama or McCain, is sincere in wanting to protect the environment). However, I think we all need to do what we can to pitch in; sounds like you're trying, CG_8. 



bigsexy920 said:


> Ok - So I started watching this show they have on TLC - i cant remember the name of it. But it has made me realize that Im not nearly as green as I can be.
> 
> Since watching that show I've been making sure that all the lights, TV and computer are off during the day when Im not home ( I was leaving the TV on for dog). In addition Ive been better with recycling. I have a really small kitchen and it is taking up a lot of space.
> 
> Does anyone have any space saving ideas? Ive been using the old big plasic container that the cat litter comes in. they stack well and they have handles so that makes it easier for me to take them down stairs. It just looks horrible in the kitchen.



I use a basket. Bio complains about how girly it looks when he carries it out to the garage to empty it into the recycling bin, but, hey, it works, and in a stylish way!


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## Admiral_Snackbar (May 9, 2008)

biodieselman said:


> To be honest, the real reason for worm wrangling is that my garden has sucked for the last two or three years. I'm doing the same practices as when I lived in San Diego, buying trailer loads of composted chicken manure each year & deep digging it into the soil late winter between the end of fall planted crops & the start of spring plantings. Everything is the same except, living on a smaller lot, I don't have room for a compost pile. Our city supplies a separate container for landscaping green waste to be composted.


 My niece did a paper on composting and mentioned this. Are there any good sites on buying kits/designing/managing worm composting?

I know it's an option I want to consider, mainly because standard compost piles are restricted according to my neighborhood bylaws. The worm hotels are at least aesthetically pleasing, have a smaller footprint and do just as well (I think) in terms of waste processing.

Also, secondary question. I have gerbil cages and use primarily aspen bedding. Are there any sites to go to with regard to recycling or composting the used small animal bedding? I normally extend the life of each bedding round by adding in chlorophyll-soaked bedding (1 scoop of chrlorophyll bedding for every 4 scoops of standard) and found I use less of it overall and the smell isn't as strong over time. I tried using it as an inexpensive garden mulch but it didn't turn out as I would have liked (I am guessing the aspen isn't as efficient as standard mulch, or else I need to treat it beforehand).


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## Risible (May 9, 2008)

Admiral, haha, you've stumbled across one of our hobbies - vermicomposting, i.e., worm ranching!

I'll have Bio get back to you with the details.


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## pendulous (May 20, 2008)

I recycle as much as I can, use eco friendly lightbulbs, I voted Green.

I'm still waiting for an apocalyptic end though.


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## pagan22 (May 20, 2008)

Admiral_Snackbar said:


> My niece did a paper on composting and mentioned this. Are there any good sites on buying kits/designing/managing worm composting?
> 
> I know it's an option I want to consider, mainly because standard compost piles are restricted according to my neighborhood bylaws. The worm hotels are at least aesthetically pleasing, have a smaller footprint and do just as well (I think) in terms of waste processing.
> 
> Also, secondary question. I have gerbil cages and use primarily aspen bedding. Are there any sites to go to with regard to recycling or composting the used small animal bedding? I normally extend the life of each bedding round by adding in chlorophyll-soaked bedding (1 scoop of chrlorophyll bedding for every 4 scoops of standard) and found I use less of it overall and the smell isn't as strong over time. I tried using it as an inexpensive garden mulch but it didn't turn out as I would have liked (I am guessing the aspen isn't as efficient as standard mulch, or else I need to treat it beforehand).



I dunno about worm composting. I just have a regular compost pile I made out of old wooden pallets. I've never heard of neighborhood laws on compost piles before. I guess it's been too long that I've been in the country. =) 

As for the bedding, you can just toss it out into the woods to compost naturally since the smell would most likely bring a lot of predators to the area such as coyotes, feral cats, rats, and maybe some predator birds. I made the mistake once of tossing it too close to the house and we had a problem with coons and cats for the next few days. But that was in the city. 

If you wanted to try something different, you can check out Swheat cat litter. It's made from wheat and is large kernels. (Clumping too) Maybe that would work just as well for rodents as it does my cats.


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## pagan22 (May 20, 2008)

pendulous said:


> I recycle as much as I can, use eco friendly lightbulbs, I voted Green.
> 
> I'm still waiting for an apocalyptic end though.



Like Tank Girl with Water & Power. LOL


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## Admiral_Snackbar (May 20, 2008)

CG_8 said:


> I dunno about worm composting. I just have a regular compost pile I made out of old wooden pallets. I've never heard of neighborhood laws on compost piles before. I guess it's been too long that I've been in the country. =)
> 
> As for the bedding, you can just toss it out into the woods to compost naturally since the smell would most likely bring a lot of predators to the area such as coyotes, feral cats, rats, and maybe some predator birds. I made the mistake once of tossing it too close to the house and we had a problem with coons and cats for the next few days. But that was in the city.
> 
> If you wanted to try something different, you can check out Swheat cat litter. It's made from wheat and is large kernels. (Clumping too) Maybe that would work just as well for rodents as it does my cats.


CG in this earlier paragraph did you mean for can = can't? It sounded like you were saying used animal bedding of this type would draw predators or pests to the area. I haven't seen this specifically.

I did some research and it seems that standard composting would work better for me in this instance; vermicomposting requires a green/brown balance and I worry I have too large a percentage of bedding and grass clippings to have that work effectively. I am still researching the composting issue in our bylaws, but my doctor neighbor dumps his grass clippings in a vacant lot on the other side of our neighborhood property line. I also wanted to check to see what our trash company does with the bagged clippings we put on the curb.

I am also trying to convince my wife that once a compost pile gets activated and going, it doesn't smell except like rich earth. She keeps thinking that since you would use manure as a starter material, it will continue to smell like manure.


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## pagan22 (May 20, 2008)

Admiral_Snackbar said:


> CG in this earlier paragraph did you mean for can = can't? It sounded like you were saying used animal bedding of this type would draw predators or pests to the area. I haven't seen this specifically.
> 
> I did some research and it seems that standard composting would work better for me in this instance; vermicomposting requires a green/brown balance and I worry I have too large a percentage of bedding and grass clippings to have that work effectively. I am still researching the composting issue in our bylaws, but my doctor neighbor dumps his grass clippings in a vacant lot on the other side of our neighborhood property line. I also wanted to check to see what our trash company does with the bagged clippings we put on the curb.
> 
> I am also trying to convince my wife that once a compost pile gets activated and going, it doesn't smell except like rich earth. She keeps thinking that since you would use manure as a starter material, it will continue to smell like manure.



I'm saying because of the smell of their pee and poop will most likely draw unwanted animals. So just be careful where you dump it. At the time, we had bad luck attracting animals. It's natural, and the bedding is natural, so it'll break down naturally. We went back to dumping it in the garbage where it'll break down at the dump just the same. 

You bag your grass clippings? Oh no no! It is best for the grass if you keep them on the lawn. Just mow w/o a bag. 



> Grass clippings break down quickly and encourage the beneficial earthworms and microorganisms that maintain healthy grass and healthy soil. Regular core cultivation (aeration) is the best way to prevent thatch.
> 
> http://www.ext.colostate.edu/Pubs/Garden/07007.html



Mowing the grass every week picks up the older clippings if any are left thus aerating the grass. We've done this for about 10 years and our grass looks better than it did before when we were bagging it.

I've never heard of starting a compost pile with manure or any of this other fancy talk, city boy! *said affectionately* I simply constructed two bins next to each other out of pallets. I pounded in some metal stakes and attached chicken wire which went in the front. I filled up one side with my organic compost like eggs, veggies, banana peels, etc from the house and turn it every year. I've got rich black dirt now that I've been using throughout the yard. 

I think a compost turner would work best for you if you're going to spend all this time researching. 

It's easy to make one, but even easier to buy. 










Some call it a compost spinner, turner, or tumbler bin. 

Me, I have this in ye olde back yard: 








*I think you ought to contact your area master gardeners.* They would set you straight. That's where I've learned all my gardening tricks. My mom is a certified master gardener. 

You can usually find them quite easily on a Google search otherwise it'd be part of a university extension program. It's a volunteer thing and most of them have helplines either an actual phone line or e-mail.


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## Admiral_Snackbar (May 21, 2008)

Well, the composting idea was to stop having to trash our clippings; I would prefer to mulch but everyone in our neighborhood bags. 

Holy craptards, the urban tumbler is $200! It's very pretty and compact, but I do like the wooden pallet idea with the chicken wire front; surprisingly, I got the idea of the compost pile from my son's Popular Mechanics for Kids video. They showed how to make a basic one and how easy it is to get one going.


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## pagan22 (May 21, 2008)

Admiral_Snackbar said:


> Well, the composting idea was to stop having to trash our clippings; I would prefer to mulch but everyone in our neighborhood bags.
> 
> Holy craptards, the urban tumbler is $200! It's very pretty and compact, but I do like the wooden pallet idea with the chicken wire front; surprisingly, I got the idea of the compost pile from my son's Popular Mechanics for Kids video. They showed how to make a basic one and how easy it is to get one going.



Pallets are free!!! I asked a local business where I used to work if I could have some free pallets they had out back. I put them together with large twist ties. I bought this roll of plastic covered wire (thick) and just twisted it together. The stakes I used were old fence posts from a chainlink fence. And voila! 

With all this talk of compost, I checked my pile today and I've got a lot of worms in the bottom where it's the black dirt. So, there's your worm compost.


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## stan_der_man (May 22, 2008)

Here are the pictures of a batch of bio-diesel that Biodieselman showed me how to brew a couple weekends ago. I still had some petro-diesel in my tank at the time, I estimate that we ultimately filled my tank up to approx. 80% bio-diesel. The truck ran good, I really didn't feel any difference in power (in theory it could be slightly less). The truck drove up the mountain just fine. For those wondering... I would say that my exhaust smelled like microwavable popcorn with curry in it... 



These first two pictures are of me testing the PH levels. I took 3 readings to have an average to work with (once is an anomaly, twice is a coincidence and three times is a trend...)












Cranking the pump, adding methanol into the main tank containing the vegetable oil.







Positioning the finished barrel of bio-diesel for fill-up into my truck. The pump on top of the barrel runs off of 12 volt. It is powered by the truck battery.







Pumping the bio-diesel.







Posing for the final photo...


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## Admiral_Snackbar (May 23, 2008)

Canadian kid isolates a bacterial strain that can digest plastic.


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## ekmanifest (May 23, 2008)

OK - these pictures just crack me up. Not sure why exactly, but they do 



fa_man_stan said:


> Here are the pictures of a batch of bio-diesel that Biodieselman showed me how to brew a couple weekends ago. I still had some petro-diesel in my tank at the time, I estimate that we ultimately filled my tank up to approx. 80% bio-diesel. The truck ran good, I really didn't feel any difference in power (in theory it could be slightly less). The truck drove up the mountain just fine. For those wondering... I would say that my exhaust smelled like microwavable popcorn with curry in it...
> 
> 
> 
> ...


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## stan_der_man (May 23, 2008)

ekmanifest said:


> OK - these pictures just crack me up. Not sure why exactly, but they do



I'll bet it's the do-rag... 










I'm a bio-pirate... arrrrrrg! 














































Bio will kill me for 'fessing this.












The first two pictures of me drawing liquid and the one cranking the methanol pump were just poses, taken post-facto... After we finished the batch of bio-diesel and were about to put it into my truck, we realized that we should have taken some pictures of the process.


But they were realistically re-enacted... hip, ass, thigh movements and all. 



Put me into a pair of tight white pants... I can move like the Bee Gees and be in full control of my pipette...


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## biodieselman (May 23, 2008)

ekmanifest said:


> OK - these pictures just crack me up. Not sure why exactly, but they do





HEY!!! This is some serious s#*$ dude!












Stan was performing a dangerous chemical process under my tutelage!











Stan made me 100 gal of biodiesel... or *$536.00 of fuel*.











But seriously... I 'crack' up too...




... every time I



past a gas station.


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## ekmanifest (May 24, 2008)

What am I even doing in this thread??? It is way too manly for me.


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## stan_der_man (May 24, 2008)

ekmanifest said:


> What am I even doing in this thread??? It is way too manly for me.



Two guys...



...dangerous tutelage,



... hot oil,



10 ml pipettes...







If testosterone could power a car at the fraction of what gasoline now costs... this world would be a better place! :bow:



What's there not to like EK!?


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## Ho Ho Tai (May 30, 2008)

fa_man_stan said:


> Two guys...
> 
> What's there not to like EK!?



Greasy little bastards? No, not you, Stan, or you, BioDiesel. I'm referring to the ones described in this widely-circulated article.

Thieves swipe used cooking oil to brew biodiesel

By GARANCE BURKE, Associated Press Writer

Tuesday, May 20, 2008
(05-20) 14:30 PDT San Francisco (AP) --

A few years ago, drums of used french fry grease were only of interest to a small network of underground biofuel brewers, who would use the slimy oil to power their souped-up antique Mercedes.

Now, restaurants from Berkeley, Calif. to Sedgwick, Kan. are reporting thefts of old cooking oil worth thousands of dollars by rustlers who are refining it into barrels of biofuel in backyard stills.

"It's like a war zone going on right now over grease," said David Levenson . . .

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/n/a/2008/05/20/financial/f104517D02.DTL

Your efforts are of great interest (though, for me, largely theoretical) and I commend you both, not only for the effort, but presenting it all in such detail. Frankly, I don't understand how either of you (FA or BDM) find the time to do all that you do - much less drive your vehicles anywhere after going to all that work.

I have a 2000 Isuzu Trooper. Since buying it, I've put on about 70K miles, mostly front-end, from when I still worked. The last time I filled the 23 gal. tank was nearly 2 months ago, though I cheated two days ago by putting in another $5.00 worth. Since that last fill, I've probably logged more miles on my bike. Of course, I cheat a bit, letting Mrs Ho Ho log most of the family miles in her RAV-4.

While we are not hurting - yet - I hate to spend more per gallon on gas than I do on wine.

Just as a rough comparison, our favorite cooked cereal, Wheat Montana 7-grain, sold last year for about $3.00 the 5 lb. bag. Now it is nearing $10.00. I wonder what the BTU content of a 5 lb. bag of (essentially) oats, compared to, roughly, 3 quarts of gasoline? What is the energy payoff, in terms of growing, or drilling, for it, distributing it, cooking it? I might do better converting my intestines to run on gasoline!


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## biodieselman (May 31, 2008)

Ho Ho Tai said:


> Greasy little bastards? No, not you, Stan, or you, BioDiesel. I'm referring to the ones described in this widely-circulated article.
> 
> Thieves swipe used cooking oil to brew biodiesel...



I don't recall where I posted this but I'll repeat myself.:doh: I locked in my waste cooking oil supply by written contract back in 2005. I tried to sign up another two restaurants but they refused to sign a contract. I do have a standing verbal agreement with them. If I see the oil, get it out of there!

The Indian restaurant is very near my home & I stop by occasionally to check the barrel. I saw 50 gals on a Friday as I drove home from work. I returned early Saturday morning & it was all gone. After that, I had a heavy duty hinge & locking hasp welded on a new barrel to prevent what is called 'poaching'. I was surprised to discover that they produced much more oil than I realized. I rarely need to visit the other two restaurants for WVO.

Ho Ho, I recently cited a recent article from the LA Times on 'Green Crude'. According to three industry magazines I subscribe to, we may soon see biofuels made from non-food feedstocks within 2-5 years. 

I personally hope to witness Big Oil's monopoly broken. I hope to witness not just the rise of biofuels, but a laundry list of diverse supply of alternative energy produced locally. Biodiesel, cellulosic ethanol, wind, photovoltaic, etc, etc.


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## Ho Ho Tai (Jun 2, 2008)

biodieselman said:


> I personally hope to witness Big Oil's monopoly broken. I hope to witness not just the rise of biofuels, but a laundry list of diverse supply of alternative energy produced locally. Biodiesel, cellulosic ethanol, wind, photovoltaic, etc, etc.



BDMan -

I follow the various hypotheses on the extinction of the dinosaurs only at arm's length. Whether the final blow was the Yucatan meteor or what, I don't know. But my favorite is that much of it had to do with the rise of small omnivore mammals who were agile (compared to the dinos), not as dependent on external temperatures for mobility and, because of that, were always incredibly hungry. They found that dino eggs, and young, made nice, tasty omelets.

I hope that something metaphorically similar will contribute to breaking the grip of Big Oil, Big Money, and those in power who are in league with them. To confirm the efficacy of this model, one has only to look at the rise, and demise, of the Big Iron computer industry.

I just hope that it happens before the planet burns up and the cockroaches take over.


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## SocialbFly (Jun 2, 2008)

those pics are great Stan, thanks to you and Bio who posted all the good info here, i cant believe i thought..."maybe i should buy a diesel and do this myself"....did i think that??


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## Risible (Jun 2, 2008)

ekmanifest said:


> OK - these pictures just crack me up. Not sure why exactly, but they do



E, that would be because Stan is holding the Mother of All Pipettes. Somehow that busts me up too!


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## ekmanifest (Jun 2, 2008)

Risible said:


> E, that would be because Stan is holding the Mother of All Pipettes. Somehow that busts me up too!



I think it could also be the spread-eagle pose


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## biodieselman (Jun 4, 2008)

Ho Ho Tai said:


> BDMan -
> 
> I'm sending you both a link to our local paper and the text in clear (there are photos on the website.)
> 
> Augsburg College is a small, local, private Lutheran-based college of sterling reputation, given neither to hyperbole nor proselytizing....



Ho Ho Tai-

I just received the June 2008 issue of 'Biodiesel Magazine' & remembered your post. I've snipped the article & posted the link. Sounds like a major breakthrough! I'm betting senior Brian Krohn doesn't have to worry about a job or paying off student loans after he graduates. 

(Bold emphasis mine.)



> What started as a student research project at Augsburg College *may become a major change in the biodiesel industry*. A team of scientists and engineers have turned a tool for purifying and separating chemicals into a six-second process for turning the poorest quality vegetable oil into biodiesel. The first commercial-scale plant using the process should come on line this year.
> By Jerry W. Kram
> 
> Augsburg College,... has a stellar reputation as a leading undergraduate educational institution. It counts among its alumni a Nobel Prize winner in chemistryPeter Agre, class of 1970, Nobel Laureate, 2003something many larger institutions cannot brag about. This level of excellence in the sciences has led to *an innovation which may change the face of the biodiesel industry*.
> ...








> ... Newspapers didn't invent radio. Radio didn't invent TV. TV didn't invent cable. Cable didn't invent the internet. Nor will Big Oil invent cheap alternative energy. Because of ever increasing energy costs with no end in sight, some man or woman, tinkering in their garage, will invent cheaper & cheaper alternative energy....
> 
> - Bio


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## Ho Ho Tai (Jun 4, 2008)

. . . . . God!



biodieselman said:


> Ho Ho Tai-
> 
> I just received the June 2008 issue of 'Biodiesel Magazine' & remembered your post. I've snipped the article & posted the link. Sounds like a major breakthrough! I'm betting senior Brian Krohn doesn't have to worry about a job or paying off student loans after he graduates.



BDMan, that is way more info than was available in the link I sent to you. That is phenomenal. Is it real? You seem convinced. I hope they get their patents, and I hope to hell they don't sell them to Standard Oil.

By the way, Isanti is not that far from where we live, and the airport is just a bit south of here. If you want to check it out, you're welcome to stay with us. Be happy to pick you up, if you can stand riding in a gasoline powered truck. Mrs. Ho Ho makes great waffles too.

Mrs. Ho Ho says that's fine, if you don't harangue us too much about our fuel proclivities. I'm just an old fool who uses an old fuel. Besides, you couldn't be any worse than our Holland buddy, GeorgeNL, who rides a bike everywhere. He stayed here, but seemed quite happy to tour the city by gas.


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## Mgirl (Jun 14, 2008)

biodieselman and stan,
awesome...wish i had a garage big enough to do that. luckily i live in s.f. where public transportation is ample and many cars collect dust until one decides to make a trip to costco or napa.


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## CyburGoddess (Jun 17, 2008)

I do everything I can to go green.


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## Ernest Nagel (Jun 20, 2008)

Interesting perspective:

http://wheels.blogs.nytimes.com/2008/06/20/the-illusion-of-miles-per-gallon/


*The Illusion of Miles Per Gallon*

By Richard S. Chang

June 20, 2008, 10:21 am
Quiz time: Which of the following would save more fuel?

a) Replacing a compact car that gets 34 miles a gallon with a hybrid that gets 54 m.p.g.

b) Replacing from an S.U.V. that gets 18 m.p.g. with a sedan that gets 28 m.p.g.

c) Both changes save the same amount of fuel.

The correct answer is b. In fact, going from 18 m.p.g. to 28 m.p.g. saves more than twice as much fuel as going from 34 m.p.g. to 54 m.p.g. (198 gallons vs. 94 gallons), according to two management professors from Duke University.

Richard Larrick and Jack Soll ran a series of experiments to show that the current standard of miles per gallon leads consumers to believe that fuel consumption is reduced at an even rate as efficiency improves. But thats not the case.

Miles per gallon is misleading and can play tricks on our intuitions, Prof. Soll said in a press release, which also links to an interactive quiz.

Profs. Soll and Larrick offered an alternative metric: gallons per mile. Expressed in gallons used per 100 miles, 18 m.p.g. becomes 5.5 gallons per 100 miles, and 28 m.p.g. becomes 3.6 gallons per 100 miles. And the difference is suddenly obvious: nearly two gallons every 100 miles, or a difference of more than $8.

Many European countries already list efficiency in terms of volume per distance traveled (liters per 100 kilometers or L/100km). The Duke professors recommend that American automakers and consumer publications list efficiency in terms of gallons per 10,000 miles. Thus, 10 m.p.g. becomes 1,000 gallons per 10,000 miles, and 25 m.p.g. becomes 400 gallons per 10,000 miles.

Profs. Soll and Larrick offer a better illustration: If you switched from a 12 m.p.g. S.U.V. to a 15 m.p.g. S.U.V., you would save approximately 167 gallons of fuel over 10,000 miles. At a cost of $4 a gallon, thats roughly $700.

This measure makes it easy to see how much gas one might use in a given year of driving and how much gas, and money, can be saved by opting for a car with greater efficiency, Prof. Larrick said.


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## fatchicksrockuk (Jun 21, 2008)

Does anyone have experience of running a diesel car with a particulate filter on biodiesel? I am planning to switch our 21 mpg Acura RL for a 50 mpg Peugeot 407 SW. The Peugeot has a particulate filter which also uses a diesel additive. I've seen conflicting information about whether biodiesel is suitable for these engines - any advice?

We have a company near us who sell biodiesel for £1.05 a litre, compared to petrol/gasoline at £1.20 a litre, or diesel at £1.30 a litre.


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## biodieselman (Jun 21, 2008)

fatchicksrockuk said:


> ...Does anyone have experience of running a diesel car with a particulate filter on biodiesel? ...



Sorry about my long post here, but I'll answer your original question with the following lengthy, somewhat technical, article in the following post.

There are a few issues with biodiesel. If the car is used, there could be dirt in the fuel system. Biodiesel is a very good solvent, and that dirt will wind up in the fuel filter. I changed my fuel filter 4 times on my old truck after going biodiesel (over a period of about 1-1/2 years) & cut them open to inspect them. The fourth filter was still clean.

I'm running 100% homebrew. The fuel you buy may have additives to prevent gelling during cold weather. I live in LA where it never gets cold, but if I drive into cold weather, such as the local mountains, I will let the tank run near empty & buy petro-diesel. I read that many guys blend their biodiesel with petro-diesel in really cold climates.

If you burn B100 there will be about a 5% loss in power & fuel economy. Depending on the feedstock, approximately 8-10% of the hydrogen bonding spots on the carbon chain are taken up with oxygen. This is the reason biodiesel burns so much cleaner with 50% less soot generated.

I've been running B100 from the first day Ris & I bought our 2007-1/2 Cummins. The emissions are a great deal stricter than European standards starting 2007-1/2 & we'll take another huge decrease in emissions starting 2010. The Cummins already exceeds 2010 California emissions standards. Because of these new laws, Europe is having a hard time certifying their diesel cars in America. But they are coming!

Biodiesel attacks natural rubber. If there is any natural rubber seal or hose in your vehicle, over time they will swell & leak. Newer cars shouldn't have any rubber. If hoses on older cars start to leak, they were due for replacement anyways.

I don't claim to know anything about Peugeots. I do know a diesel Peugot took 2nd in the 2008 Le Mans, *1st place went to an Audi R10 running on B100 biodiesel.* First time in history! 

I know Europeans don't buy hybrids because diesel engines are cheaper & get better fuel economy, but that will change.



> The new C-Class Peugeot 308 will go on sale in early 2008 and AutoExpress is reporting that a diesel hybrid version will be available about six months later. The Focus sized 308 will have a 1.6L turbodiesel mated up to an electric motor and battery pack. There's no word on what kind of battery will be used, but start-stop capability and regenerative braking will be in place.
> 
> The four door, five seat 308 is expected to get a combined rating of 69.1 mpg and CO2 emissions of 90g/km, putting it almost on par with the much smaller Smart ForTwo CDi. That would make it by the cleanest, most efficient car in it's class, *and drivers in London wouldn't have to pay the congestion tax.* The hybrid 308 will be able on run on battery alone up to 30 mph and would be the first diesel hybrid car to go into production.



They wouldn't talk to me, must have been the 'California Bio' user name, but here is an Australian biodiesel forum. They post about Peugeots using biodiesel. Maybe they will talk to a Brit.


Mike, if you want to 'burn' a day while you're in LA in a couple months, I would be happy to demonstrate how simple it is to brew biodiesel. Dee & Donnie can lounge in the pool & Dee would love to cook for you guys. PM me or Dee (Risible) if you're interested.


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## biodieselman (Jun 21, 2008)

boring stuff about the effects of biodiesel on particulate filters.



> By Ron Kotrba
> 
> Diesel particulate filters (DPFs) are requisite emissions hardware for on-road diesel vehicles starting with the 2007 model production year, and there’s reason to think biodiesel will do well by it.
> 
> ...



The 6.7L Cummins uses a very high pressure, precisely controled fuel injection system that can have up to five direct injection events per piston stroke. Cummins will inject a little extra fuel at the end of the power stroke to generate higher temperatures during the 'regeneration cycle' to burn off soot collected in the DPF. Until the rings fully seat, biodiesel clinging to cylinder walls may make it past the rings & wind up in the engine oil. It appears 'growing oil' condition isn't a real problem unless one doesn't change oil at proper intervals. I don't know how Peugeot handles regenerating their DPF.

Here is an excellent video explaining some of the technology making new diesels cleaner than gasoline engines. Starting with the turbo, intercooler, multiple precise direct injection fuel systems, catalytic converters, exhaust gas recirculation & particulate filters.


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## fatchicksrockuk (Jun 22, 2008)

Bio, 

Thats brilliant - a lot for me to read lol. I don't think making my own is an option - the company down the road makes 2000 litres a day! I think they use all the local cooking oil! I knew about the fuel filter, just need to work out how to change it myself lol!


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## BeautifulPoeticDisaster (Jun 22, 2008)

fatchicksrockuk said:


> Bio,
> 
> Thats brilliant - a lot for me to read lol. I don't think making my own is an option - the company down the road makes 2000 litres a day! I think they use all the local cooking oil! I knew about the fuel filter, just need to work out how to change it myself lol!




BUT! The offer of food and swimming is very tempting


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## stan_der_man (Jun 22, 2008)

BigBellySSBBW said:


> BUT! The offer of food and swimming is very tempting



Food, swimming and filling my truck's fuel tank with more of Bio's home brew! 


Bio, I wanted to mention... speaking of living green... I just rediscovered our back yard! Pictures coming soon...


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## stan_der_man (Jun 24, 2008)

Interesting little tidbit I just heard from the electrician that was over this morning...


In about 2 years the state of California is going to ban incandescent light bulbs, because they use so much more power compared to other types of lighting. The only thing that had been keeping fluorescents from being universally used is that fluorescent lights couldn't be dimmed because of their transformers...

This is no longer the case:
http://www.buylighting.com/Dimmable-Compact-Fluorescent-s/113.htm

The only lights in our house that aren't fluorescents (excluding our pantry and stair area...) are on a light fixture in our kitchen that dims. I'm going to get me some of these lights!

The reason we still use incandescents in the pantry and the stairwell is because we've found that for short term usage (less than a minute) the fluorescents don't get bright enough that quickly. These bulbs aren't left on for very long and only used once or twice a day.


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## Ho Ho Tai (Jun 24, 2008)

Well - certainly not for everyone, at least yet. 

This article appeared in a SciAm e-mail newsletter, received today. I copy the synopsis and link here. I believe that this is legitimate.

FEATURE
Inside the Solar-Hydrogen House: No More Power Bills--Ever
Mike Strizki has not paid an electric, oil or gas bill-nor has he spent a nickel 
to fill up his Mercury Sable-in nearly two years. Instead, the 51-year-old civil 
engineer makes all the fuel he needs using a system he built in the capacious 
garage of his home, which employs photovoltaic (PV) panels to turn sunlight into 
electricity that is harnessed in turn to extract hydrogen from tap water.


http://www.sciam.com/article.cfm?id=hydrogen-house&sc=WR_20080624


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## biodieselman (Jun 24, 2008)

fa_man_stan said:


> ... In about 2 years the state of California is going to ban incandescent light bulbs... The only thing that had been keeping fluorescents from being universally used is that fluorescent lights couldn't be dimmed because of their transformers...



Thanks for the info, Stan. We have dimmer switches throughout the house & we have to be *very careful* to give the transformer full voltage. We still have incandescents where they are very rarely used & only intended to replace them when they burned out. Now I can replace the old fluorescents with the dimmer type & use the old fluorescents to replace the incandescents.

I don't believe many people are aware the burned out fluorescents are hazardous waste that by law are required to be disposed of properly & not in the trash.



In unrelated news, my pet peeve has fallen on hard times. Why do we use one of the most indestructable materials in the world for one use only disposable products?:doh:



> Economic troubles may be accomplishing what environmentalists have been trying to do for years.
> 
> ...The lousy economy may be accomplishing what environmentalists have been trying to do for years -- wean people off the disposable plastic bottles of water that were sold as stylish, portable, healthier and safer than water from the tap....
> 
> ...


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## Dibaby35 (Jul 9, 2008)

Your are my hero Bio..I know I don't visit here alot but I talk alot about the Biodiesel man on the internet..seems like more and more as the gas prices go up. Although I'm excited to so the hydrogen cars coming through. I have high hopes.


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## Ernest Nagel (Jul 11, 2008)

Thought a few of my fellow gearheads on this thread might appreciate the elegance of this approach?

http://news.cnet.com/8301-11128_3-9988923-54.html?hhTest=1

July 11, 2008 10:27 AM PDT

*MIT spinoff dyes glass to make solar 'windows'*
Posted by Martin LaMonica Post a comment

Researchers at the Massachusetts Institute of Technology detailed a technique that can boost solar cell output and turn colored windows into solar panels.

Published in Science magazine on Friday, the researchers have developed a way to use dyes painted on glass to redirect light.

By stacking multiple concentrators, you can optimize plates for different wavelengths. Solar cells will be placed along the edges of the plates, reducing the amount of solar cell material needed, and thus the cost of a panel.
(Credit: MIT)

By pushing light to the edges and filtering it, they can concentrate the light and squeeze more electricity from photovoltaic solar cells.

The cells are placed on the edges of the glass, rather than across the flat surface of glass, which would allow panel manufacturers to use less costly solar cell material.

It's a technique that was pursued in the 1970s but abandoned because not enough redirected light made it to the cells on plate edges.

By borrowing laser technology, the MIT researchers said they adequately direct and concentrate light to the point where they can boost solar cell output ten-fold.

The technology, which uses off-the-shelf dyes used in car paints, promises to be cheaper than traditional solar concentrators because it eliminates the need for mirrors, lenses, and trackers, said Marc Baldo, an MIT professor of electrical engineering who led the work.

Participants in the research are starting a company, Covalent Solar, to commercialize and improve the technology. MIT said that they expect to have a product available in about three years.


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## Ho Ho Tai (Jul 12, 2008)

Ernest Nagel said:


> Thought a few of my fellow gearheads on this thread might appreciate the elegance of this approach?
> 
> Published in Science magazine on Friday, the researchers have developed a way to use dyes painted on glass to redirect light.
> 
> ...



Ernest -

A very interesting idea. There have been a number of articles on this. I have not traced it to the source. I don't understand how dyes can redirect the light to the edge of the plate. If I had thought of something like this, I might have come up with something like a Fresnel Lens or ruled grating which would create total internal reflection. Once trapped between the two surfaces of the plate, the light would be ducted to the edge. But any sort of ruled grating would probably be more expensive. 

Do you understand the physics (or the optics) of what they are doing here?

On another note: your signature line ("It is difficulties that show what men are." ~ Epictetus) reminds me of something I used to say years ago (but not before Epictetus) "You can't reveal voice of a bell (the impulse response) by throwing puffballs at it - it takes a hammer stroke."


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## stan_der_man (Jul 23, 2008)

Look what we found in Santa Cruz, Calif...












Don't ask the price per gallon though.


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## fatchicksrockuk (Jul 23, 2008)

I'm now running our Peugeot on biodiesel..there's a local company (www.enfuels.co.uk) who sell it for £1.10/litre compared to £1.35/litre for regular diesel. 

Its gone well so far, though my economy has dropped from 44 mpg to 40 mg..I'm going to see how this improves once I change the fuel filter and get the car serviced.


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## biodieselman (Jul 23, 2008)

Ernest Nagel said:


> Thought a few of my fellow gearheads on this thread might appreciate the elegance of this approach?...
> 
> Participants in the research are starting a company, Covalent Solar, to commercialize and improve the technology. MIT said that they expect to have a product available in about three years.[/COLOR]



From what little I've read, they use carbon organic compounds developed for laser technology. The dyes cause the light to bounce between the layers of painted dyes on both sides, through the pane of glass itself, directing the light to the thin photovoltaic strips at the edges. Since silicone is the greatest expense in making photovoltaic panels, you could use up 1/100th less silicone by having only a thin strip of photovoltaics around the perimeter of the window. This design also eliminates any need for directional tracking of the sun. I hope this technology works out. 




Ris & I have been dreaming about 'getting off the grid' for the home ever since we 'got off the grid' by homebrewing biodiesel. We're not rich, & we have been waiting for the government to kick down some tax incentives plus technology advancements, making photovoltaics more efficient & less expensive. 

We've already replaced our leaky windows with energy efficient dual pane windows, so it's too late to replace them again. But I'm sure this solar concentrating technology will be used to make roof panels. After reading this in the LA Times I remembered your post, Ernest. I have a large south-facing roof & I'm already envisioning it covered with this technology, finally zeroing out my electric bill. If consumer groups are successful changing current laws allowing utility companies to pocket excess energy I may produce, I'll cover the whole damn south roof with this efficient technology & collect a monthly check from Edison.





Ho Ho Tai, this fits in with my dream of eliminating huge energy corporations by diversifying as much as possible our energy options by utilizing local & personal resources.



> ... California on Monday enacted a law that allows cities and counties to make low-interest loans to homeowners and businesses to install solar panels, high-efficiency air conditioners and other energy-saving improvements.
> 
> Participants can pay back the loans over decades through property taxes. And if a property owner sells his home or business, the loan balance is transferred to the next owner, along with the improvements.
> 
> ...


http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la-me-solar23-2008jul23,0,7437661.story


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## biodieselman (Jul 23, 2008)

fa_man_stan said:


> Look what we found in Santa Cruz, Calif...
> 
> 
> 
> ...



In the US, biodiesel is almost always cheaper than diesel. Unfortunately biodiesel is more available in the central & eastern states than in California. This may soon change because California is considering legislation mandating the usage of biodiesel.

Too bad we won't be going that far north on the up coming Big Sur camping trip. I anticipate diesel being pretty damn expensive along the coast, the further we get from the main highway. This Saturday, before we go to ekmanifest's party, I'm stopping at Cycle Parts West to buy a few more 5 gal gas cans. I calculate the money I'll be spending on #2 diesel, I can buy the gas cans & carry enough home brew to avoid pulling into a, (gulp!), gas station.

BTW Stan, I keep forgetting to call you with a new web site I found with an excellent tutorial on home brewing. I didn't show you the two step process that I've using. After you get comfortable with the simpler process, you'll want to start using a little more involved process for a more complete transesterfication conversion.






fatchicksrockuk said:


> I'm now running our Peugeot on biodiesel..there's a local company (www.enfuels.co.uk) who sell it for £1.10/litre compared to £1.35/litre for regular diesel.
> 
> Its gone well so far, though my economy has dropped from 44 mpg to 40 mg..I'm going to see how this improves once I change the fuel filter and get the car serviced.



Kudos for saving money, being green, circulating your money in the local economy & not funding terrorism.

I'm afraid your fuel economy won't improve. About 8-10% of the hydrogen bonding spots on the 12-14 carbon chain are taken by oxygen. This explains why biodiesel has 50% less soot, less power & lower fuel economy. The power & fuel economy loss should only be about 5% reduced. The fuel injectors are tuned to meter #2 diesel & have no way of knowing that biodiesel is a denser molecule. Even though biodiesel has less BTU/gal, the fuel injectors meter more mass per injection event. I hope you're keeping a spare fuel filter in the car. Depending on how dirty the fuel was before you bought the car, there may be quite a lot of gunk to clean from the fuel system. Once a month, do a thorough check for any swelling or wet hoses. There were due to be replaced anyway if you should see any leaking hoses.




I don't know much about diesel smog emission equipment in the UK. My old truck smelled like french fries but that is all gone with the NOX absorber, catalytic converter & soot collector. I assume you have at least a soot collector on your Peugeot if it's a newer model. Do you have any french fry smell?:eat2:

I took today off from work & made $500/hr. My 2007 Cummins meets & exceeds the new 2010 tough diesel emissions standards. The state sent me a letter saying they would pay me $500 to inspect my truck. When I got the check, I asked why is California paying me just to look at my truck. He said California is figuring out procedures on how to start smogging diesel engines. Commercial duty trucks didn't have to be smog inspected every two years like gassers. Motorcycles are next. FYI, did you know that motorcycles spew 10 times more pollution than a large SUV?


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## stan_der_man (Jul 28, 2008)

Here is what I mention to you the other day Bio... The Auto Trader now has a separate edition for "green" (or at least...) more fuel efficient cars.


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## Risible (Jul 28, 2008)

I love seeing these indicators of our (America's) transition to an alternative-energy country. Thanks, Stan, for posting this.

Bio showed me an LA Times article about a state bill passing that provides for low-cost loans for the installation of solar energy, so that the payment of the monthly electric bill (our is a flat-rate of about $130 a month, averaged from the year before) would cover the loan (no energy bill). There are, of course, some obstacles to overcome before it can be effected, but wouldn't that be great? We've longed to go solar and get off that grid for a long time now.


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## James (Jul 28, 2008)

Whilst in the US recently, I attended a conference on 'green' energy sources. My main reason for going was to learn more about the way employment networks function and how to break into them as a foreigner. I met some interesting people, picked up some useful advice and made some valuable networking contacts. 

One thing that also really stood out for me was the tone of the 'keynote speeches' that opened and closed the conference. There was a *massive *emphasis on the importance of managing the PR of environmental initiatives. Number one on the list of things to do when trying to promote an environmental initiative was to NOT talk about the environment. This sounded strange to me but it soon became clear why this was seen as such an important strategy. It seems that the environment can be seen as a divisive, politicized, or even negative thing to discuss in certain circles of business in the US? I learned that, when 'selling' the concept of environmental initiatives it is of prime importance to focus on the business opportunity side of things. There is a lot of money to be made from re-newable/sustainable energy sources but land the investment of capital is always necessary. In order to win support, the financial bottom line, coupled with notions of patriotism seem to be the primary drivers for action.

And it seems to be working very well! When it comes to energy generation, the Pacific North West seems to be well ahead of the UK. Renewables account for over 20% of current demand in Washington and Oregon. These numbers are rising as more and more land-owners realise the potential to turn their land into a cash-cow by installing windfarms. I think that we ought to take note of these large-scale business initiatives more in European circles. Clearly, by speaking the language of money, much can be achieved that would not be done otherwise. Too much relies on governmental intiative and not enough on finding ways for the private sector to make a lot of money. Unlike the mainstream in energy policy in the UK, I have no idealogical problem with encouraging some good old free market capitalism to achieve environmental objectives.


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## biodieselman (Jul 28, 2008)

I recently read an article on recycling & began to inventory the things Ris & I recycle. Of course there's the obvious, paper, cans, plastic, plastic bags, batteries, all E-waste, etc, etc. But there are other not so obvious things we recycle. Here's a short list. 

I recycle the metals from work that most techs would toss because it takes too much time & scrap steel isn't worth the effort. Clean copper is where the real money is but I didn't have any copper piping, only had a small amount of copper wiring. In the photo you can see old motors, compressors, misc steel & a small bucket of wire. It's takes less time for me to haul the metals home to store in the trailer instead of trying to find a place to dump them at the job site. I'll make one trip to the salvage yard with my personal truck.




By law we have to recycle refrigerant. It's a $25,000 fine if we are caught venting refrigerant to the atmosphere. I had one 50lb recovery cylinder fill & a second nearly filled. The black & yellow thing in the fore ground is a recovery machine that sucks out residule refrigerant gas in the green containers we buy at the parts house, condenses the gas into a liquid & pumps it into the gray 50lb recovery cylinder sitting on the scale. The empty green cylinders, along with another compressor was salvaged for cash. The two recovery cylinders are swapped for clean cylinders at the parts house. The recovered refrigerant gas is thoroughly filtered clean & resold back to us in new green cylinders. Each unique gas refrigerant molecule comes in a color coded container.




My truck has to earn its keep. It's used to pick up waste vegetable oil & barrels of methanol so it can run on recycled waste vegetable oil.




The biodiesel burning truck also pulls the trailer in the left of the photo to pick up waste chicken manure for the vegetable garden & other big hauling work. Recycling chicken manure allows me to grow fresh vegetables for our table.

I also properly recycle all the failed circuit boards from work, along with proper disposal of old mercury thermostats.




We're using kitchen waste to grow worms for worm casting as a rich fertilizer.







I don't have room for a compost heap but soon we hope to try a compost tumbler which promises to compost green material quickly. I'm loath to put in the green waste bin for the trash company to recycle. Growing 3 to 4 crops year round in the same soil, I need the fertilizer!




What do you guys recycle, if you'd care to share? Anything out of the ordinary?


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## Tina (Aug 1, 2008)

You're such a good example of how we can always do more, Bio. 

It's embarrassing to admit, but we only recycle the regular stuff. They have pickup here, and Canadians more than Americans seem to be in the recycling mode. I'm not yet sure what to do with old cooking oil (hubby had some in his cupboard when I came here that was a couple of years old -- I'm not using it; it smells!) and batteries. As a result, we're saving them until we can figure out where to recycle such things. But all containers get recycled, whether they're paper or plastic.

I have to mention that I keep eying the biodegradable cups at Costco. They're $14 for 200 of them! But we don't entertain enough to warrant it. Still, I keep pointing them out to my honey and he keeps reminding me that we don't need them, good idea though they are. I at least know where to go when we will need them, and that could be next month. How can you go wrong at that price for cups that won't last more than 6 months in the landfill before self-destructing?  Still searching for plates here...


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## rainyday (Aug 1, 2008)

Oops. Meant to put this in the gardens thread in the Clubhouse. Nevermind.


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## SocialbFly (Aug 1, 2008)

Where is the pic of your garden snake???
That thing is BIG...and to me...scary......


all i have to say is PEACHES.....


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## biodieselman (Aug 3, 2008)

Is this what you're hoping for Ho Ho? This could be another huge discovery to advance alternative energy. Hopefully, this is no joke. 



> ...A new catalyst makes it feasible to split water with solar power.
> 
> MIT chemists say the catalyst, used in conjunction with cheap photovoltaic solar panels, could lead to inexpensive, simple systems that use water to store the energy from sunlight.
> 
> ...


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## fatchicksrockuk (Aug 3, 2008)

Bio, 

Do you have any experience on remapping diesels? I've now ran our Peugeot 407 on biodiesel (100%) for about 1000 miles. On dinodiesel, I get 45 mpg. On bio, about 40 mpg. I'm wondering if I get the engine remapped whilst running bio if I could regain the lost mpg? The engine gives 136 BHP as standard, and can be remapped to 170 BHP.

Mike


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## biodieselman (Aug 3, 2008)

fatchicksrockuk said:


> Bio,
> 
> Do you have any experience on remapping diesels? I've now ran our Peugeot 407 on biodiesel (100%) for about 1000 miles. On dinodiesel, I get 45 mpg. On bio, about 40 mpg. I'm wondering if I get the engine remapped whilst running bio if I could regain the lost mpg? The engine gives 136 BHP as standard, and can be remapped to 170 BHP.
> 
> Mike



I don't know about Peugeot but there are many 'diesel tuners' made for the diesel engines used in American trucks. Creating more BHP usually requires more fuel. Your fuel economy is about right due to biodiesel having around 10% less BTU/liter than dinodiesel. 40/45=0.89%

Diesels don't require stoichiometric conditions for complete combustion. The greater BTU/liter of diesel above petrol is only a small factor in superior fuel economy. The greatest factor contributing to superior economy is the volumetric efficiencies of having an excess of combustion air. A smaller amount of fuel expands a much greater volume of combustion gas. 

Try Googling 'diesel tuners for Peugeot'. You might also search for after market air filters that duct cooler denser air from outside the car rather than from under the bonnet. Also check if there are larger diameter exhaust systems for your car. With diesels, air flow is *very* important. The easiest way to make more power & economy is by increasing air flow volume. If you do find a 'tuner' for your car, you won't see the entire benefit unless the engine breaths better. Unless the air flow is really restricted, don't expect to see a large increase in economy.

I just searched for diesel performance products for Peugeot & they're available. A 'diesel tuner' usually just re-programs the fuel injection system's computer. None the less, air flow improvements should come first.


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## biodieselman (Aug 5, 2008)

Tina said:


> ...I'm not yet sure what to do with old cooking oil (hubby had some in his cupboard when I came here that was a couple of years old -- I'm not using it; it smells!) ...



I saw this on a Good Eats episode about cooking oil.

After frying & the oil has cooled, put the oil back into the original bottle. Filter the oil using coffee filters & a funnel. Top off with new oil & store the bottle in freezer. The oil can be used 5-7 times. Make sure to throw the oil out before the oil becomes dark, stinky or smoky.  (Don't tell Ris this Tina! I've been telling her the oil is no good & that I need the used oil for my home brew.) 

Throw those old smelly  bottles of oil out with the garbage!



Tina said:


> ...I have to mention that I keep eying the biodegradable cups at Costco. They're $14 for 200 of them! ...



Thought you might be interested in this article in the latest "bioplastics MAGAZINE". I've quoted Frederic Scheer, CEO of Cereplast, located in the city of Hawthorn in LA county in older posts. He stated back then that the break even point where bioplastics are cheaper than petroleum plastics is $76/barrel oil. 



> ... Products made from Cereplast Compostables resigns meet the new US federal procurement guidlines for bio-based content... These guidelines were enacted in mid June by the United States Department of Agriculture. All companies using Cereplast Compostables resigns can be listed on the USDA "BioPrefered" web site. "BioPrefered" products are given preference by the U.S. General Services Administration (GSA), the purchasing agent responsible for billions of dollars in products which are supplied to various federal agencies...
> 
> ..."Practically speaking, tis means that federal agencies are now required to use bio-based products for their food service suppliers, and we see this as a great opportunity for our customers to expand the reach of their 'green' sales."
> 
> Scheer added, "With this new regulation, the federal government is making a strong commitment to enhance the use of bioplastics which should result in additional demand for Compostables resign from our converter customers."...




We are witnessing the beginnings of the bio-revolution. Will you, (the general you), be prepared for the bio-revolution? Will your next car be capable of burning biofuels? Many electronics products from Japan already use bioplastics, you just didn't know it.


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## CausticSodaPop (Aug 8, 2008)

biodieselman said:


> We're using kitchen waste to grow worms for worm casting as a rich fertilizer.


A wormery! Fantastic! I've wanted one for a long time but they're out of my price range at present... at least the ones I've seen in the UK are. 

I've also heard that some people keep some sort of wormery by their lavatories and throw their used toilet tissue into it along with liberal quantities of compost and allow the worms to digest that as well. Unfortunately, my wife is horrified by the idea so it looks as though it might be a while before I get to try that out.


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## Ho Ho Tai (Aug 14, 2008)

"Gentlemen, start your . . ."
Ho Ho Tai

Lab makes renewable diesel fuel from E. coli poop
CNN - Aug 12, 2008
It takes a lot of microbe poop to fill a gas tank, however. Biofuel experts tell 
CNN that processes like those used at LS9 are scientifically viable, ...

http://www.cnn.com/2008/TECH/science/08/12/bug.diesel/index.html


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## Pooky (Aug 16, 2008)

Fall is coming, what do I need to do as far as compost is concern in my little garden.

comments from Pooky


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## biodieselman (Aug 16, 2008)

Pooky said:


> Fall is coming, what do I need to do as far as compost is concern in my little garden. ...



No matter what kind of soil you have, any organic material is best as long as it's completely composted to kill weed seeds. Ideally it's best to incorporate compost into the soil but that can be a lot of work. If it's manure that still smells like manure, it would be best to work it into the soil. Spreading well rotted compost on top of the soil will be fine, allowing it to decompose all winter, allowing winter rains to leach nutrients into the soil. Next spring you'll have a nice head start on a friable seed bed to work with.

I've seen carrots & other root crops overwinter in the soil in colder climates. They use a deep layer of straw, not hay (which contains seeds), as an insulating blanket, keeping the soil from freezing. The carrots will be protected from freezing by a thick layer of straw, keeping fresh all winter in the cool soil. They reach under the straw for fresh carrots even with snow on the ground. Of course, this wouldn't work in coldest regions.

I live in a practically frost-free climate, allowing me to garden year round. Since I have at least three crops in the same soil, I use my truck & trailer to haul composted poultry manure by the cubic yard; it's too expensive by the bag. Every year I have to deep dig literally tons of composted manure into the soil or otherwise I'd quickly deplete the soil.


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## biodieselman (Aug 16, 2008)

Ho Ho Tai said:


> "Gentlemen, start your . . ."
> Ho Ho Tai
> 
> Lab makes renewable diesel fuel from E. coli poop
> ...



You beat me to the scoop on the poop Ho Ho Tai. This month's "Biomass Magazine" had an article on LS9 in San Carlos, Calif., Gevo in Pasadena, Calif., Amyris Biotechnology in Emeryville, Calif. and Synthetic Gemomics in La Jolla, Calif. When I lived in San Diego, the HVAC company I worked for had several genetic/bio-engineering accounts. You would not believe the money that is being spent on genetic/bio-engineering research. 

I'll try & summarize the article. 

Bio-petroleum would be produced from renewable feedstocks. Bio-fuel producers realize food crops are *not* the future & are looking for alternative feedstocks. Waste products from agriculture waste, municipal garbage, livestock manure, wood & paper waste, even old automobile tires are being developed as biomass feedstocks. These fuels promise to produce more energy than corn ethanol with less energy for production.

Pal from LS9 says, "You would make a fuel that was a dropin compatible with existing fuel systems." New genetic techniques enable scientists to customize an organism's biological processes to produce novel substances. This emerging technology is called *synthetic biology*, to create "designer" microbes producing biofuels that are chemically equivalent to petroleum and diesel. These companies are developing genomes from scratch, tailored to biofuel production.

Synthetic biology aims to modify biological systems or build new systems to perform novel tasks. The technology extends well beyond genetic engineering, which typically attempts to alter a few characteristics of an organism by inserting genes from other organisms.

"Synthetic biology applies more of a systems or engineering approach" Pal explains. Working from the bottom up, scientists define the biological processes they wish to build and identify the genes or sets of genes needed to produce the intermediate chemicals and control the biochemical reactions within an organism to execute the process. They then rewire the organism's genetic coding, by inserting, removing and disabling genes, to meet the design specification.

"Advances in our understanding of how genes interact and simple organisms function are making the science more targeted and effective, allowing practitioners to reengineer organism's genetic map so that it works like a fine-tuned machine." says Reiling at Amyris.

Scientists are rewiring yeast and e.coli to make biofuels. Yeast & e.coli metabolize food & store excess energy very similar to the way humans storing excess energy by converting fatty acids produced during metabolism into lipids (i.e. fats) what we know as love handles. "Fatty acids are molecularly similar to hydrocarbons, which are the building blocks of gasoline, diesel and jet fuel," Pal says. These companies are creating a miniature assembly line (metabolic pathways) to synthesize biofuel.

The process consumes 65% less energy that ethanol by eliminating the energy intensive distillation process. "LS9's goal is to create fuel that is cost competitive with oil at $40-$50 per barrel," Pal says. A small-scale pilot facility, planned for this year, will generate the performance and economic data to support investment in a large-scale commercial facility. Pal expects to have a product to market in three to four years.

IMO, we eventually change from a petroleum based economy, into a bio-based economy. I only hope that we don't loose our desire to become energy independent & stop developing alternatives if petroleum should become 'cheap' again. Support your local photo-voltaic, thermal-solar, wind, geothermal and biofuels for transportation. It will be exciting to see diverse sources of energy sprouting up everywhere, using locally available resources, to end our dependence on Big Oil & terrorist sponsoring nations, once & forever.


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## stan_der_man (Aug 17, 2008)

biodieselman said:


> I recently read an article on recycling & began to inventory the things Ris & I recycle. Of course there's the obvious, paper, cans, plastic, plastic bags, batteries, all E-waste, etc, etc. But there are other not so obvious things we recycle. Here's a short list.
> 
> ...
> 
> What do you guys recycle, if you'd care to share? Anything out of the ordinary?



I do the usual recycling of glass and plastic bottles, but a couple of times I made a run recycling scrap aluminum. It was mostly machine shop scrap (even a bucket of aluminum shreds...) but I also had odd things like old mangled aluminum screen door frames and some old vent lids and frames from an old camper I had. The recycling places on the mountain (and in Redlands) won't take block aluminum (anything other than cans...) so I went to a larger recycling place in San Bernardino. I received close to $100 for what all I had. Aluminum, brass, copper and other metals are worth a good amount of money at the moment, you'd be amazed at what your scraps can add up to!

I have to admit, I've been really bad about recycling aluminum cans though. Being the cliff dwellers that we are, we don't have much level ground to store cans next to our garage. I recently built a platform where I store our garbage cans, and made some room for an aluminum can container. The only thing I could really use is an aluminum can crusher that I could put in our kitchen. Does anybody have a good recommendation as where to get one?


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## Ernest Nagel (Aug 17, 2008)

A client installed this model in all their break rooms as part of a greening initiative. Prolly too space hogging for home use but the concept is good, I think. Horizontal crushers like this one are better than vertical can crushers because they handle bent and folded cans more easily.

http://www.cleanairgardening.com/aluminum-can-crusher.html

A wizard like you could probably fabricate something like this in no time, Stan. The vid makes its' mechanism pretty obvious, btw.


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## stan_der_man (Aug 18, 2008)

Ernest Nagel said:


> A client installed this model in all their break rooms as part of a greening initiative. Prolly too space hogging for home use but the concept is good, I think. Horizontal crushers like this one are better than vertical can crushers because they handle bent and folded cans more easily.
> 
> http://www.cleanairgardening.com/aluminum-can-crusher.html
> 
> A wizard like you could probably fabricate something like this in no time, Stan. The vid makes its' mechanism pretty obvious, btw.



That's a good setup, but a bit more price-wise than I was thinking. Speaking of fabricating... we did have some old lever like devices when our department moved at the university where I work that would have done the trick, but we threw them out. I never thought of making them into can crushers at the time. I found a couple of potential can crushers on the web, I'll post if I do get one of them.


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## stan_der_man (Aug 21, 2008)

Nothing yet on getting a can crusher... but I had to show you this. I'm always on a quest of the "ultimate flashlight" (seriously geeky... I know...) I happened upon this at a thrift shop today for three dollars (very convenient for camping BTW Bio...)





















It is a modern railroad lantern! Notice the Union Pacific logo... So you are probably wondering what this has to do with being green. Well, one of my biggest pet peeves are disposable batteries and how quickly some devices go through them... (yes, I know there is such a thing as rechargeable batteries... but they don't last forever either...  Besides, somehow I always manage to fry them... :doh: ) What's interesting about this flashlight is how it has multiple lights on it. One for a beam and another for general lighting. I'm going to try to get a LED bulb for the general light and see if it increases the life of the battery. I'm also going to try it for the beam, but I have a feeling the LED will be too dim. I'll post the results!

An interesting side note... the third bulb is just a place to put a spare bulb. I suppose there are some really scary, dark places that railroad workers have to go and having a burnt out bulb could be bad thing. Very utilitarian!


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## Ernest Nagel (Aug 21, 2008)

fa_man_stan said:


> Nothing yet on getting a can crusher... but I had to show you this. I'm always on a quest of the "ultimate flashlight" (seriously geeky... I know...) I happened upon this at a thrift shop today for three dollars (very convenient for camping BTW Bio...)



Wow, a fellow flashlightophile! Just one more reason to like you, Stan. We must go here together some time http://www.flashlightmuseum.com/. For now though content yourself with the uber geeky virtual tour. Lighthearted fun for the whole family. :happy:


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## biodieselman (Aug 27, 2008)

fa_man_stan said:


> Nothing yet on getting a can crusher... but I had to show you this. I'm always on a quest of the "ultimate flashlight" (seriously geeky... I know...) I happened upon this at a thrift shop today for three dollars (very convenient for camping BTW Bio...)...





Ernest Nagel said:


> Wow, a fellow flashlightophile!...



Agreed, I don't know what's up with men & flashlights. It's one of those gotta have tools.

Sorry I can't help you with the can crusher Stan. We don't buy soda. The few bottles or cans we do use just go into the recycle bin. Since we don't drive around shopping any more, they're not worth the fuel just for a few cans. Ris shops on-line & groceries are home delivered. We've reduced our total miles driven annually by quite a bit. 

I've been using the Petzl headlamps from REI for work. I need a bright light for my job when I'm standing on the OSHA step, doing the Flying Wallenda, working on a machine above the ceiling tiles.




I don't know how those guys hold a MiniMag in their mouth for very long. Problem is that the really bright LED Petzls are expensive & my job is really hard on them. The current one I have is broken & I'm going to try a Paklite this time.










I just ordered three of the super bright, white light LED lights with the headband. Talk about geeky.

On a totally different topic Stan, I'm trying to grow 3-4 big pumpkins to haul up to Big Sur for Halloween. One each for Sarah & Stan, one for Katie, John & Laura & one for me & Bubbles. I intend to challenge you guys to a pumpkin carving contest. Fair warning, I cheat.


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## GenericGeek (Aug 28, 2008)

biodieselman said:


> I've been using the Petzl headlamps from REI for work. I need a bright light for my job when I'm standing on the OSHA step, doing the Flying Wallenda, working on a machine above the ceiling tiles.



My son & I each have a Black Diamond headlamp, also from REI. Four ultrabright LEDs flanking one 3 Watt monster light for MORE POWER!!! (Insert Tim Allen "Home Improvement" grunt here.)

Don't forget that REI has a super-liberal return policy. If your Petzl is broken, there's a good chance that REI'll take it back, and give you a new one. One of the boys in our Scout troop left his REI Nalgene water bottle too close to the campfire, and turned it into a piece of modern sculpture. REI gave him a new one without batting an eye.

REI may not be the cheapest place to get gear, but they're worth the extra $, in my book.


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## GenericGeek (Aug 28, 2008)

biodieselman said:


> <snip> Creating more BHP usually requires more fuel. Your fuel economy is about right due to biodiesel having around 10% less BTU/liter than dinodiesel. 40/45=0.89% <snip>



AARRGGHHHH... Mixed... Units... Son of a *physicist*! Must resist! 

kiloJoules/liter => OK, BTU/gallon => I grudgingly accept, but _BTU/liter?_ Holy cow! That's *miscegenation*, Bio!


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## Ernest Nagel (Sep 2, 2008)

No real reason for posting this on this thread except that I doubt too many other people bother with stuff this geeky. Oh, and it could be damn important re our future environment.

http://www.dailytech.com/Sun+Makes+History+First+Spotless+Month+in+a+Century/article12823.htm


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## GenericGeek (Sep 3, 2008)

Ernest Nagel said:


> No real reason for posting this on this thread except that I doubt too many other people bother with stuff this geeky. Oh, and it could be damn important re our future environment.
> 
> http://www.dailytech.com/Sun+Makes+History+First+Spotless+Month+in+a+Century/article12823.htm



Heck, us Ham radio operators are looking forward to the next solar cycle. Long-distance radio propagation conditions are pretty poor when old Sol ain't spewing out so many charged particles to rejuvenate the ionosphere! On the other hand, it gives the power grid and satellite operators *far* fewer things to worry about.

So, I think it *does* have a lot to do with the "Living Green" thread: _to the extent that you can live "off the grid", the less you need to worry about the inevitable power interruptions that will occur as this cycle heats up._ In places where the power grid is notoriously fragile (like SoCal), this is something to think about.

Personally, I don't have enough solar/wind power generating capacity to *live* off-grid, but I at least have enough for emergency power -- a couple of good generators, a few small solar panels for charging my mobile phone, flashlights, my collection of gel-cell batteries, etc.

Our house is heated by natural gas (from our good friends in Canada, eh!), so I just need enough electricity to run the furnace motor & a few 100 Watts worth of electronics during a power outage. I've been periodically investing in 10W flexible solar panels (the ruggedized kind often used aboard small vessels) -- you can roll them up into a relatively small space, and even take them backpacking!


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## GenericGeek (Sep 3, 2008)

Check this out: www.otherpower.com/fuking.html

A friend of mine (who lives way out in the toolies, and gets a lot of WVO free from the local greasy spoon) has one of these "CS (Cold Start) Lister" engines. Based on an ancient British design, they're still made and used in India. It's a beautiful beast, perfect for burning waste vegetable oil & running a 7-10 kW generator head. It turns at only 650 RPM or so, and makes a rather hypnotic "Chuff... Chuff..." sound as it runs. 

View attachment fuking2.jpg


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## biodieselman (Sep 14, 2008)

> ... Still, I think it's fascinating that urea -- an additive in Mercedes' BlueTEC emissions treatment system -- serves generally the same purpose in clean diesels as it does in human engineering. Our bodies synthesize urea as a way to carry away toxic ammonia, which is a metabolic waste product ...
> 
> Similarly, Mercedes' AdBlue fluid is injected into the vehicle's exhaust, where it helps neutralize and carry away toxic nitrogen oxides (NOx), which are byproducts of high-temperature diesel combustion.
> 
> ...



My 2007.5 Cummins already exceeds California's new super tough 2010 emissions standards. Cummins uses a NOX absorber, catalytic converter & a particulate filter to eliminate all soot. A computer controls when the engine goes into "regen" to clean & purge the NOX absorber & catalytic converter. Running 100% home brew biodiesel, my giant "one ton" tow monster is cleaner & greener than a Prius!

Yes Ultra Low Sulfur Diesel is more expensive. Yes, diesel engines are more expensive but they're cheaper than a hybrid & have lots more power. According to an article in "Biodiesel Magazine", on average diesels are cheaper to drive if diesel is less than $1.30/gal than gasoline. If you want to reduce greenhouse gas emissions, drive a diesel. By purchasing a diesel, you'll be prepared to use alternative fuel when biodiesel comes available near you. Biodiesel is the future.


Soon you will start noticing clean diesel cars in the showrooms. Here's a partial list of things to come. Will you prepare yourself to be green & clean?





* When: August 2008
* Models: 2009 Jetta BlueTDI sedans and SportWagens
* Engine: 2-liter turbodiesel in-line 4
* Est. Mileage: 29/40 m.p.g. Sedan road tested at 60 MPG.
* Est. Base Price: $22,000 to $25,000






* When: November 2008
* Models: Mercedes-Benz ML320 Bluetec, other GL-, ML- and R-Class sport crossover utilities (and someday: Vision GLK BlueTec diesel hybrid).
* Engine: 3-liter turbodiesel V-6
* EPA Mileage: 18/24 m.p.g.
* Est. Base Price: $46,000





# When: Fall 2008
# Models: 335d sedan and X5 35d sport wagon
# Engine: variable twin-turbo 6-cylinder
# Est. Mileage: ?
# Est. Base Price: 





* When: January 2009
* Models: Q7 3.0 TDI utility wagon
* Engine: 3-liter turbodiesel V-6
* Est. Mileage: 18/25 m.p.g.
* Est. Base Price: $53,000






Honda (yes its true)

* When: 2009
* Models: Acura TSX sedan, other models could follow
Honda Accord Clean Diesel
* Engine: 2.2-liter i-DTEC
* Est. Mileage: 34/53 MPG
* Est. Base Price: ?





Jeep

* When: 2009
* Models: Jeep Grand Cherokee
Jeep Grand Cherokee

7. General Motors/Ford/Dodge

* When: 2009 or 2010
* Models: Light-duty pickup trucks





# When: 2010
# Models: Maxima sedan






# When: 2010
# Models: Legacy sedan or Outback wagon
# Engine: 2-liter turbodiesel flat 4
# Est. Mileage: 33/47 m.p.g. (Outback)
# Est. Base Price: $28,000 (Outback)​


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## biodieselman (Sep 14, 2008)

GenericGeek said:


> ... and gets a lot of WVO free from the local greasy spoon) has one of these "CS (Cold Start) Lister" engines. Based on an ancient British design, they're still made and used in India. It's a beautiful beast, perfect for burning waste vegetable oil & running a 7-10 kW generator head. It turns at only 650 RPM or so, and makes a rather hypnotic "Chuff... Chuff..." sound as it runs.



It's my turn to correct you, my friend. 

I drive a Waste Vegetable Oil vehicle. In alternative fuel circles, WVO is defined as biodiesel, a fuel produced by a chemical process called transesterification. 

Your friend most likely doesn't spend the time or energy to produce biodiesel & instead burns Straight Vegetable Oil. SVO vehicles have to be modified for SVO. They have two fuel tanks, one for #2 diesel & a second to hold filtered SVO. The engine is started on #2 fuel & the engine coolant heats the SVO in the tank. After the SVO is heated to the proper viscosity, it switches over to run on SVO. Before shutting down the engine, you must clear the fuel lines, injector pump & injector lines of SVO or else the engine won't start again. Unlike biodiesel, SVO* isn't* an EPA approved fuel.

The engine your buddy is running is commonly called a "hot bulb engine". They can run on almost any liquid petroleum product, even paraffin wax if you heat it to a liquid state. Here are a couple of videos of the sounds of a hot bulb engine running.


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## biodieselman (Sep 15, 2008)

:doh: I may be wrong again. It appears the CS Lister engine may be an updated variation of the old hot bulb engine.:doh:


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## stan_der_man (Sep 15, 2008)

> ... Still, I think it's fascinating that urea -- an additive in Mercedes' BlueTEC emissions treatment system -- serves generally the same purpose in clean diesels as it does in human engineering. Our bodies synthesize urea as a way to carry away toxic ammonia, which is a metabolic waste product ...
> 
> Similarly, Mercedes' AdBlue fluid is injected into the vehicle's exhaust, where it helps neutralize and carry away toxic nitrogen oxides (NOx), which are byproducts of high-temperature diesel combustion.
> 
> ...



Funny enough... I have the L.A. Times sitting right in front of me... I knew you'd find this interesting, but you beat me to posting this! :bow:


Here's a new environmental regulation I just discovered today... It appears that gas cans are now required to have ventilation tubes in their pore spouts for the purpose of containing the gas vapors. Recently at the auto parts stores here in CA I've been noticing that gas containers of smaller sizes have a label stating that the containers "are not to be used for street legal vehicles". I thought that was odd, I thought that was the purpose of these type of containers? This all came about because my old plastic gas container deteriorated and the pore spout broke, off so I decided to go to M&I Surplus in Pomona and get an old fashioned all metal "jerry can" like the Jeeps used to have mounted on them (notice that it's not available to be purchased in CA...) M&I Surplus still had the jerry cans, but the pore spouts were different (and made out of plastic, which I know is going to deteriorate in the sun again like my old one did... and it was such a pain in the ass to use... arrrrrg!) Luckily if you dig a bit deeper on this website, you can still order old fashioned metal replacement caps, rubber washers and old fashioned pore spouts for these cans. All this work just to get a gas can for the generator... :doh: I'm all for making things more environmentally friendly but sometimes I wonder if things are going too a silly extreme... (BTW... The gas can I got was $10 cheaper at M&I Surplus, than the second one I linked from Uncle Sam Outfitters ...)


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## jewels_mystery (Sep 17, 2008)

goldendiamondeyes said:


> Paul Delacroix said:
> 
> 
> > _*I am a SSBBW(425+) and I ride a Honda Ruckus and top speed I get on mine with my size is approx 30 miles a hour...beats hoffen it to town.....LOL*_
> ...


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## GenericGeek (Sep 19, 2008)

biodieselman said:


> It's my turn to correct you, my friend.
> 
> I drive a Waste Vegetable Oil vehicle. In alternative fuel circles, WVO is defined as biodiesel, a fuel produced by a chemical process called transesterification.
> 
> Your friend most likely doesn't spend the time or energy to produce biodiesel & instead burns Straight Vegetable Oil.



Negatory, Bio! He's doing all the chemistry to convert 55 gallon drums-full of dirty waste oil he gets from local restaurants into biodiesel, which he runs his 1983 (or -4 -- I forget) Mercedes turbo diesel on. Since he's a bit of a maniac, he also runs propane injection for an additional kick...

I'm glad to report that one of the Boy Scouts in our troop is also running his first car on home-brew biodiesel, as well.


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## JoyJoy (Sep 21, 2008)

Dell goes green.


> A few weeks ago Dell made its studio laptop line-up official so it seemed like only a matter of time before the desktop equivalent, the previously-leaked (in a rather blurry fashion) Studio Hybrid, was given a similar treatment. As expected that has now happened, with Dell stumping up the full details of its 'eco-friendly' desktop PC, set to rival the Mac mini, rather than the Eee Box as I wrongly speculated.
> 
> That's borne out by the choice of processors Dell has made; Core 2 Duo options rather than an Intel Atom CPU. However, despite using a more powerful CPU, the Hybrid does still keep its power draw down below 65W. Judging from the specs, we suspect that the system uses Intel's Centrino 2 (a.k.a. Montevina) notebook platform, rather than desktop components. But when it helps keep the power draw and heat output to a minimum without sacrificing performance that's a hardly much of a sacrifice.
> The Studio Hybrid also boasts features such as HDMI output (alongside as a DVI port), coupled with the options of both a Blu-ray drive option and a TV tuner - all three features Apple doesn't offer anywhere in its Mac range, let alone the Mini which Dell is attempting to rival with this machine. A slew of USB ports, Draft-N WiFi and a card-reader give the Studio decent connectivity credentials, too.
> ...


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## goodthings (Sep 22, 2008)

I have a hybrid and love it so far.


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## Ernest Nagel (Sep 30, 2008)

Just though this was kinda cool. Whenever I take those eco-footprint assessments I always wind up rating as a like a senior eco-terrorist 'cuz of all my air travel. Clearly I'm not alone though. 

http://gizmodo.com/5055160/24-hour-air-traffic-around-the-world-blows-minds-eyeballs?autoplay=true


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## stan_der_man (Sep 30, 2008)

I finally found replacement bulbs for standard flashlights! I was in the Sears tool department and came across them. They cost $14 (as opposed to an incandescent bulb that costs $1.95 for two...) They are billed as being "the last bulb you will need in your flashlight" and are supposed to be able to handle any flashlight ranging from one "D" sized battery to a 6 volt lantern. I first tried one out in my 6 volt railroad lantern and it immediately fried the wires... so I would advise not trying them in 6 volt flashlights. It was actually blazing hot when I took it out. Too much amperage I'm assuming. LEDs only need a tiny current to illuminate... possibly the polarity is backwards on this lantern... that would fry an LED. I immediately went back into the store and put on my "it ain't workin', so I'm bringing it back" face.... ("dunno what happened... I think it's defective..." I reiterated to the sales woman...) and promptly exchanged it for another one. When I got home I found my cheap little flashlight that I keep by my bedside and put the LED bulb into it. The interesting part about this is that the batteries were low, so the incandescent bulb was barely producing light, the results are impressive considering this. The LED bulb seems to be at full illumination! I will probably get a few more months out of these batteries, which would have had to be otherwise disposed of by this point. I might try some rechargeable batteries in this flashlight.

Here is the comparison.


Incandescent bulb:







LED bulb:


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## Ho Ho Tai (Oct 3, 2008)

Does this make sense? Would the land involved soon turn into a Dead Sea?

http://www.cnn.com/2008/TECH/science/10/01/carl.hodges.q.a/index.html


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## William (Oct 4, 2008)

Hi 

Most of the time Wind Power is Green, but there is always the exception






William 



biodieselman said:


> Tina suggested I start a living green thread.[/I]


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## biodieselman (Oct 5, 2008)

Ho Ho Tai said:


> Does this make sense? Would the land involved soon turn into a Dead Sea? ...



I'm with you Ho Ho, I don't think using sea water for "..._ irrigating otherwise barren coastal desert regions_..." is a good idea. Salts leaching into the soil & possibly into nearby water tables would permanently damage both. In Southern California, we've stopped destroying wetlands & are currently restoring damaged wetlands to their original state. I seriously doubt the mentioned areas are actually "barren". I've camped for years at Glamis in the desert southwest of California, which is "nothing" but dry desert blow sand. I know for a fact that which appears lifeless by day comes alive with wildlife at night. There are plants & animals in these "barren" areas that grow nowhere else in the world. It would be wrong to poison the soil with salts. There are better alternative energy solutions that will be coming online soon.




I've already posted on this article from "Biomass Magazine" & I'll talk about it briefly. The oceans are currently being studied by different organizations nation wide. There are diverse research projects on farming the ocean. Research involves growing algae and seaweed for usage of ocean "crops". Both algae & seaweed are being investigated for usage as oil feedstocks for biodiesel & as biomass feedstocks for cellulosic ethanol.

Huge advancements are being made in the usage of algae for alternative energy transportation fuel feedstocks. Solazyme is making claims that they will be producing algae/biodiesel in three years.

Ho Ho, I keep checking on Ever Cat Fuels' progress in developing the Mcgyan® Biodiesel Process. I believe they're currently building a commercial scale production facility near you. I've seen no information on when they intend to start production. I'm not sure how much heating oil is used in your state, but the National Biodiesel Board is pushing biodiesel as an alternative to home heating fuel. 

I received the October issue of "Biodiesel Magazine" today & there's more news on the progress of algae/biofuels. 



> Industry steps up algae efforts
> By Jerry W. Kram
> 
> From coast to coast, renewable energy companies are turning their attention toward the use of algae as a biodiesel feedstock. Recently, a stream of announcements revealed that various research and development efforts are underway...
> ...



The cited examples are just the tip of the iceberg. Many more companies around the world will soon be producing algae/biofuels. 

Will your next car be a clean diesel that is capable of burning 100% biodiesel with *no* engine modifications? Wouldn't it feel good to be able to honestly say, I'm reducing my impact on the environment?






Are you ready to *get off your gas*?


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## biodieselman (Oct 5, 2008)

> Electric vehicles light up Paris Motor Show...
> 
> By DAN NEIL, RUMBLE SEAT
> October 3, 2008
> ...





> Cox Enterprises switches to biodiesel hybrid vehicles
> By Bryan Sims
> 
> In an effort to continue its transition toward environmentally friendly and fuel-efficient vehicles,... Cox Enterprises Inc. added nine ... Hybrid Bucket Trucks to its vehicle fleet that are capable of running on various biodiesel blends....
> ...



These last two posts combine what I've been talking about for the last two years. Energy independence of transportation fuels *and* cleaning up pollution are entirely possible. New clean burning diesel technology, combined with a clean burning 100% algae/biodiesel fuel and hybrid technology, we would require* 60% less fuel* for our transportation needs. Did you get that? Even if we did nothing regarding alternative energy fuels, we could easily reduce our imported oil by 60%. Now I realize that all of us don't care about reducing their greenhouse gas emissions or getting 60% greater fuel economy, but you're starting to see that 100% energy independence *is entirely* possible & within our reach. An MIT study on total life cycle pollution, (including manufacturing, operating life & ultimate disposal), concluded that a 100% biodiesel/electric/hybrid is damn near as clean as a hydrogen/fuel cell car, (assuming a non-polluting method of producing hydrogen). The study was done before new clean diesel technology was available. Imagine driving a super clean, super fuel efficient car. It's no longer a dream.


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## Ho Ho Tai (Oct 5, 2008)

BDMan -

Way too much stuff in your last two posts for me to try to multi-quote. I'll just have to comment as best I can.

Thanks for all your dedicated efforts. I had meant to track the EverCat project and let it slip away. Isanti is about 35 miles north of us (Shoreview) and about as far north as North Branch, on a slightly different bearing. At the risk of sidetracking the post, I mention North Branch because it has twice been the destination of bicycle rides which Mrs Ho Ho and I made in the last few weeks. These trips were about 55 miles each. The most recent was made three days before my 71st birthday. Biodiesel? 7-grain cereal and granola.

So Isanti is an easy trip from here, regardless of your favored mode of transportation. If you and Risible want to come out and investigate in person, you could stay with us for a few days. As long as we don't touch on politics, we should get on just fine.

reil from the sea.

You may not like the idea of irrigating land with sea water because of mineral build-up (nor do I) but the salicornia plant certainly seems to have promise as an oil source. Re-reading the article, irrigation doesn't seem to be what the author has in mind. It seems more like creating artificial estuaries which would function pretty much like the natural ones. I quote that part of the article which describes the plant:

CNN: At the heart of your vision for the agriculture is a plant called salicornia. Tell us about that.

CH: It's an amazing plant. When we first started looking for plants, we looked at over 700 in some detail, and we listed them. And the only reason we had salicornia was that it was pretty.

A young lady was counting the seed, and she wiped her fingernails on a paper towel and she noticed that the towel looked oily. And she was right. It has about 30-40% very high quality vegetable oil. And so we said: 'My God, it's an oil seed crop'. It's like soy bean.

And so out of the 700 we picked 20, then we picked three, and one of the three was salicornia. And now it's the star.

Salicornia produces a high quality vegetable oil on sea water. On land it's not competitive for food production. It produces at a rate that is probably one of the most economical biofuels on the planet. We suggested it as a bio fuel in 1982. And in 1993 we actually ran a vehicle on salicornia oil and wrote a paper where I said it will be bio fuel of the future. 

Elsewhere in the article, he states:

"The problem sort of pushes us to a solution. We've either got to build sea walls, or we've got to move tens of millions of people away from the edge of the sea. But instead of that -- instead of cost -- we invest money in these new production systems, creating jobs, creating wealth, and taking big steps in solving global warming."

and:

"CH: I see seawater rivers around the world. Right now we're looking at 34 countries where we could have 50 rivers of the scale we've been looking at in Mexico and bigger. And they would come inland and they would irrigate a quantity of desert coast in an ecologically sound fashion. It would be on a scale that takes so much water inland that it would stop sea level rises in about ten years.CH: I see seawater rivers around the world. Right now we're looking at 34 countries where we could have 50 rivers of the scale we've been looking at in Mexico and bigger. And they would come inland and they would irrigate a quantity of desert coast in an ecologically sound fashion. It would be on a scale that takes so much water inland that it would stop sea level rises in about ten years."

It does seem like he is talking both about creating estuaries and irrigating desert areas. I have more doubt about the latter than the former. However, he sees it more as a matter of controlling and directing what he expects to happen anyway, because of elevated sea levels.

The notion of irrigating desert areas with sea water brings to mind a thought I had years ago, upon reading an article about farming in the Dead Sea area. The article pointed out that there are huge quantities of minerals in the soil all around that area. It occurred to me at the time (though the article didn't mention it) that there might be a lot of lithium there as well. A bit of on-line investigation proved this to be correct.

Lithium compounds are used in the treatment of depression, of course. They can be difficult because the therapeutic range between being ineffective and toxic is quite narrow. Side effects can include hallucinations, manic behavior and similar evidence of altered mental and sensory states. I wondered then, and still do, whether this might explain all the religions which have sprung up in that area.

I want to add more to this but it will have to be in a subseqent post. Dinner is on the table.


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## Ho Ho Tai (Oct 5, 2008)

Finishing off a few odds and ends.

re: electric cars. The woman who manages our townhouse association came into possession of an electric car, which she is currently selling.






It is a 1933 Detroit Electric. From the sales blurb:

"It appears this is the only Detroit Electric made in this year. The company went out of business and they were only sold on a made-to-order basis. This auto is in excellent condition."

I had no idea that ANY electrics were made that recently.

She expects to get about $45 K for it. Batteries not included.

She posted a series of photos to me. It is quite gorgeous. We'll probably go and have a look at it, though we have no intention of buying it.

Quoting your earlier quote: "... The system also combines quantum fracturing with tuned microwaves to burst the algae cells, releasing the oil inside and simplifying harvest."

Clever. Would that work on Spotted Owls? Ask Risible.


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## biodieselman (Oct 8, 2008)

Ho Ho Tai said:


> ... Quoting your earlier quote: "... The system also combines quantum fracturing with tuned microwaves to burst the algae cells, releasing the oil inside and simplifying harvest."
> 
> Clever. Would that work on Spotted Owls? Ask Risible.



Quiet! Don't plant the idea of rendering Spotted Owls for jet fuel with the U.S. Air Force! They've already contracted with Tyson Foods to render carcasses & waste meat from processing poultry, beef & pork into jet fuel. U.S.A.F. has set a goal of replacing 50% of their jet fuel with biofuel by 2016 if I recall correctly.

What has me excited is the amazing number of diverse feedstock sources for biofuels. The alternative fuel industry knows that agrifuels are not sustainable along with the unintended consequences of increasing food costs. Reading "Biomass Magazine" & "Biodiesel Magazine", it appears that what once was considered waste, is now a valuable commodity. There are way too many projects to list here, but I'll mention a few more.

1. Construction wood waste for cellulosic ethanol. 2. Disaster waste such as from Hurricane Katrina for cellulosic ethanol. 3. Cleaning up polluted water *and* making biodiesel from feeding algae fish farming fecal material & fish food that wasn't eaten. 
4.


> A feedstock with the potential to produce 10 billion gallons of biodiesel per year is literally under our noses in our nations wastewater treatment facilities. Results of first-generation studies conducted by two Mississippi State University researchers established that the existing microorganisms in wastewater treatment facilities yield about 7 percent oil from the dried secondary sludge....



Who knew that one day when I "go"...




I'll be "producing" biofuel for my clean diesel truck so that I can "go".















What has me excited is that with all the diversified feedstocks, there is *no way* Big Oil can hang onto their monopoly. Are you, (the general you) going to facilitate the destruction of Big Oil's monopoly by supporting alternative fuels? Make your next car a clean diesel, an E85 Flex Fuel, an EV electric vehicle or a combination of alternative fuel powered hybrids. Ris & I love being able to say, "our truck is powered by 100% sunshine". These cars *are* coming. I'm excited, are you?


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## stan_der_man (Oct 10, 2008)

If a bear shits in the woods and nobody is there to smell it, does it stink?

This proverbial question I'll leave up to the philosophers to answer, but I can tell you for certain that nutrients will be deposited in the soil as the shit decomposes. Unless of course you live in the desert as we do, then these droppings will dry out and for all purposes fossilize if left undisturbed.

Anyhoo...

On this note I would like to present to you a theory in ecological conservation I have devised called "Living Brown". We enjoy all these wonderful pictures of lush gardens lovingly nurtured, bearing all varieties of humongous fruits and vegetables... well I now have something to show you... you big show-offs.

In my very own garden I have an apple tree where I am developing a variety of apple I fondly refer to as "thumb apples". (Amazingly tasty actually... even surprised me...)








Other than the occasional uric acid ladened offerings of moisture donated by our small dogs...








...this tree requires no municipal water whatsoever, thus no energy is utilized in the growing process, and only 2 days per year of labour are necessary (actually, I've only done as of this date...) Much more efficient than conventional gardening if I may say so!







... note the green pole to the left of the tree. This is where much of my "garden time" is spent laying upon my hammock contemplating the new frontiers of "Living Brown".








Also, these apples are the perfect bite size morsels for small children who will happily eat them...





Oops... wrong picture... :doh:



Ehem... Happily eat them... in one joyous little bite!








More evidence of small children happily eating apples from my garden.








The only thing I recommend against using these "thumb apples" for is archery practice... unless you are reeeeeeeeaaaaaally good!








With that, I leave you with a picture of Mtmaiden heating up a batch of Stauffer's organic microwavable tater-tots and free range fish (no dyes added...)








For those curious to see further pictures of my back yard... If you must know...the rest is basically just fossilized dog shit and pine needles.


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## stan_der_man (Oct 10, 2008)

P.S. Just to another dose of envy Mr. "Biggest Veggies in the World" Biodieselman... I present to you my new "Grand Staircase to the Garbage Cans" that has recently been completed!  Waste products in my household are now quickly and efficiently disposed of!









Note the additional step I personally added for the dogs...









Just as a side note Bio... I have been reading your posts about the algae to bio-diesel experiments being conducted... and have been taking them to heart...  :bow:


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## biodieselman (Oct 11, 2008)

fa_man_stan said:


> ... In my very own garden I have an apple tree where I am developing a variety of apple I fondly refer to as "thumb apples". (Amazingly tasty actually... even surprised me...)
> 
> ...this tree requires no municipal water whatsoever, thus no energy is utilized in the growing process, and only 2 days per year of labour are necessary (actually, I've only done as of this date...) Much more efficient than conventional gardening if I may say so! ...



Is the tree loaded with blossoms in the spring? I'm betting the tree is a flowering crab apple. Did you know apples are a member of the rose family? Generally, apples 2" & smaller are called crab apples. Generally, they are genetically closer to wild apples than orchard apples. Consider yourself lucky Stan, orchard apples are prone to insect infestation & disease. Obviously the tree loves its home. However, a little water every *once* in a while wouldn't hurt.

I'm so glad you brought up "brown thumb" gardening. I've been considering a post on developing a "brown thumb" on how best to kill growing things. This winter's home improvement project is to kill our front yard grass. 

We have a front loading washing machine that uses half the water & half the detergent. We conserve water in our garden by raking up the neighbor's pine needles for free mulch. I replaced the landscaping in the pool yard with California natives & now we are killing the grass & planting Calif. natives to save more water. And I won't have to water, fertilize, mow and repeat.:doh:

If I spent the time & energy to rototill or dig up the lawn, all I would succeed in doing chopping the bermuda grass into thousands of starter grass. If I used toxic chemicals like RoundUp, it would cost lots of money and pollute the runoff water if it ever should happen to rain here. Ris & I wanted to be organic & not pollute. (Actually, I just being cheap.)

I haven't watered the lawn since March & the damn stuff hasn't died yet! I did remove the ice plant in the center bare space & removed the concrete scalloped edging. There were decades of accumulated cedar needles several inches deep under the ice plant. 




I also removed the morning glory & other plants alongside the driveway.




I stopped recycling the newspaper & have been saving them. I called the LA Times to verify that their ink was soy-based ink & contained no heavy metals. They said even the color ink was soy based. I overlapped sheets of newspaper about 5-7 layers thick & used the needles to cover the paper. It will take up to a couple of months for the paper & mulch to smother the roots, killing the lawn. When I'm ready to trench for a new irrigation system or plant, I'll just dig through the layers. I'll lay down more newspaper & rake the mulch back over the paper. The paper & mulch will eventually decay & slowly fertilize the soil. California natives don't live long in rich soil.




Currently in the pool yard, the California fuchsia show is drawing to a close after several months of non-stop blooming. The bees love it & the hummingbirds furiously fight over territorial rights. The photo doesn't do the profusion of red color justice. 




I do have a good start on our winter garden. The broccoli is doing well & the next succession planting of broccoli that Ris planted has sprouted & will be big enough to go into the ground next weekend.




The sugar snap peas are up & we'll plant another bed next weekend.




​
Winter tomatoes are a gamble I'm willing to take. If the winter is mild & if we're lucky, we may get a few tomatoes. They won't be the best quality but they sure beat store tomatoes. They've been getting an extra dose of worm tea & we're getting blossoms already.





We're still getting cucumbers. The vines are almost spent, the cucumbers aren't as sweet but haven't turned bitter yet.




fa_man_stan said:


> ... Just as a side note Bio... I have been reading your posts about the algae to bio-diesel experiments being conducted... and have been taking them to heart...



Don't laugh, there are guys trying to make algae/biodiesel at home. Another poster asked me about a book on growing algae at home but I was too lazy to respond. I apologize. It is possible to grow algae for biodiesel and ethanol at home, but the processes are difficult & require more energy to produce the fuel at home than the energy yielded. To date, it's not worth the effort. In the spring when the pool heats up & I haven't kept the chlorine levels up, I tease Ris that I'm converting the pool into an algae farm. I always thought she didn't hear me but in fact she was trying to ignore me. She knows that although I make lame jokes about *everything*, she also knows I'm half serious. I'm all outta room for emoticons, insert appropriate smiley here!


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## stan_der_man (Oct 13, 2008)

biodieselman said:


> Is the tree loaded with blossoms in the spring? I'm betting the tree is a flowering crab apple. Did you know apples are a member of the rose family? Generally, apples 2" & smaller are called crab apples. Generally, they are genetically closer to wild apples than orchard apples. Consider yourself lucky Stan, orchard apples are prone to insect infestation & disease. Obviously the tree loves its home. However, a little water every *once* in a while wouldn't hurt.
> 
> ...



As we talked about, I probably ought to water this tree more (as I just did to the periwinkle in our front yard...) This tree does burst into bloom during spring time, whitish / pink flowers if I remember correctly. The apples are small but tasty!

Your yard is coming together nicely Bio! I know exactly the problem you are dealing with crab-grass related. When we lived in San Bernardino, that was practically the only grass that would grow on the sandy soil there. It's very durable stuff!


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## Ho Ho Tai (Oct 13, 2008)

ENVIRONMENT: Iceland Finds New Ways to Trap Carbon
By Lowana Veal

The Hellisheidi power plant.

Credit:Lowana Veal

"REYKJAVIK, Oct 9 (IPS) - At the Hellisheidi geothermal power station, located about 30 km east of Reykjavik, Icelanders are developing novel ways of capturing carbon dioxide (CO2) and hydrogen sulphide (H2S) that are emitted from the plant."

But the most exciting part of this:

"Finally, yet another way has been found of using CO2 from geothermal power plants. Carbon Recycling International has just signed a contract to use CO2 from a geothermal plant at Svartsengi, about 30 km southwest of Reykjavik, to produce methanol for bio-fuel for cars. This is yet another first for Iceland in this field.

The CO2-rich steam from the Svartsengi plant will be blended with hydrogen and is then converted into methanol. The company says that it is also possible to convert the methanol to dimethyl ether (DME), which can be used as a diesel substitute. Methanol and DME will be used to substitute 10 percent of petrol and diesel respectively."

Kinda blows cornahol right out of the water! Might even lift Iceland out of it's current financial morass.

By the way: that Hellisheidi power plan? I'd sure hate to meet Hellish Heidi in a dark alley. Is that named after some sort of Icelandic troll?


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## Ernest Nagel (Nov 5, 2008)

Fuel-Making Fungus Challenges Oil Creation Theory

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,446744,00.html


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## Ho Ho Tai (Nov 5, 2008)

Ernest Nagel said:


> Fuel-Making Fungus Challenges Oil Creation Theory
> 
> http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,446744,00.html




"Letting a hundred flowers blossom and a hundred schools of thought contend is the policy for promoting progress in the arts and the sciences and a flourishing socialist culture in our land."

Whether you are a Socialist or not; whether you admire or disparage Mao, this statement rings true. In fact, it is the basis for most of human progress, long before Mao. It is a principle which the current administration seems to have forgotten. I pray that it is remembered in the next.

Instead of the scarcity of energy driving the world's economy, we suddenly have a hundred energy flowers - energy falling from the sky, from the moon, from volcanic gas, from fungus, from the trees - and, including nuclear fusion and fission, from the very stars.

BDMan, FAmanStan - where are you hiding? You have not posted to this - 'your' thread - since Oct. 13th. We have eagerly awaited your sanction of the Iceland article, and now Ernest's as well. I can understand that you are both weary from your labors, and from writing some of the monumental posts of the past. I hope that you are not morose over the election results. I hope that Obama provides just the very soil for these flowers to bloom.

Buck up, men! The world awaits your pronouncements.

(Yeah, I'm having a bit of fun with you, dontcha know? But seriously guys . . .)


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## Ho Ho Tai (Nov 5, 2008)

From Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute

Solar Power Game-Changer: Near Perfect Absorption of Sunlight, From All Angles A new antireflective coating developed by researchers at Rensselaer could help to overcome two major hurdles blocking the progress and wider use of solar power. The nanoengineered coating, pictured here, boosts the amount of sunlight captured by solar panels and allows those panels to absorb the entire spectrum of sunlight from any angle, regardless of the suns position in the sky.






A new antireflective coating developed by researchers at Rensselaer could help to overcome two major hurdles blocking the progress and wider use of solar power. The nanoengineered coating, pictured here, boosts the amount of sunlight captured by solar panels and allows those panels to absorb the entire spectrum of sunlight from any angle, regardless of the suns position in the sky.

Credit: Rensselaer/Shawn Lin​
This reminded me of something brought to the attention of us students in Optics class. If one bundles together a large group of identical polished, tapered needles so that they are tightly clustered and parallel, light hitting them undergoes multiple reflections down the shafts of the needles, a bit being absorbed at each reflection, until nearly all is absorbed with no reflection. This is true for a very wide range of frequencies, depending on the properties of the metal.

I went hunting for a reference for this and came to several attributed to R.W. Wood, in the early 20th century. All required membership to read in entirety. This is an example:

Phys. Rev. (Series I) 24, 436 (1907): Wood - A Hydraulic Analogy ...
A bundle of polished steel needles with their points all turned towards the source of light reflects scarcely any light at all, the rays undergoing multiple ...
link.aps.org/doi/10.1103/PhysRevSeriesI.24.436 -
by RW Wood - 1907

A similar effect would be obtained with bunched metal 'soda straws'.

However, I came to something else of greater interest. I invite you to check this website, using your on-page search for 'wind', 'windmill', or 'wind power'. The website is devoted to the writings of Nicolai Tesla, including many ideas presented in private correspondence.

Tesla Research​


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## 0nlnn (Nov 13, 2008)

I got them energy saver bulbs and I use macs. Yeah, Apple has this whole going green program, its pretty interesting. If yah wanna check it out, go here:http://www.apple.com/environment/


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## biodieselman (Nov 13, 2008)

Ernest Nagel said:


> Fuel-Making Fungus Challenges Oil Creation Theory...]



This research is only the tip of the iceberg, Ernest. There are far too many articles in my Biodiesel & Biomass trade magazines related to 2nd generation & 3rd generation fuels research to list. 

Things are moving so quickly, terminology is rapidly evolving. I was using agrifuels to describe 1st generation biofuels made from food source feedstocks such as corn & soybean. Industry producers know 1st gen biofuels aren't sustainable. 1st gen plants have been closing for a couple of years now due to high corn & soybean prices.

I was using the out of date industry terminology, biofuels. I've read from a couple of sources this term has evolved into 2nd gen biofuels. 2nd gen biofuels are made from nonfood feedstocks using advanced technical processes such as the one you cited. I'll cite another article below, but like I said earlier, these are just the tip of the iceberg.

Cellulosic ethanol is currently the most developed 2nd gen fuel produced from sawdust, 'black liquor' from the paper industry, crop residue such as corn stover, municipal waste (see post #443) and sustainable biomass (jatropha, camelina & switchgrass). Problem is costs are still high. The feedstocks themselves are cheap but the processing (shredding, densifying, pulverizing, handling and transportation) add costs. It appears 2nd gen biofuels might be destined for the trash heap (no pun intended), even before they get off the ground. A few 2nd gen processes will make economic sense, for example biofuel from municipal waste feedstocks is also a great first step in waste water reclamation.

Third-generation biofuels will most likely be made from... (I'll give you three guesses & the first two don't count, algae. 3rd gen biofuels, like 2nd gen, are made from nonfood feedstocks, but the resulting fuel is indistinguishable from it petroleum counterparts. They are also known as advanced biofuels or green hydrocarbons. Direct substitution means the biofuels could be used in cars, planes, you name it without modifications or additional logistical needs.


> Nov. 7 (Bloomberg) -- A solution to the world's energy problems may lie in a Chinese mushroom growing in Novozymes A/S laboratories.
> 
> The Danish company's scientists in China, Brazil, Denmark and the U.S. are testing mushrooms and lichen to find one that will turn corn cobs and sugarcane stalks into biofuel. An affordable alternative to gasoline made from plant waste would end concerns that global hunger for energy is driving up food prices worldwide.
> 
> ...



Little research has been done on lowly fungi or algae. Scarce few PhD candidates choose pond scum as their thesis. But that has changed in the last few years. Hundreds of people are scouring the earth, digging through rotting, decaying biomass searching for lowly algae, fungi & microbes to take advantage of their biological processes.

In a "The Graduate" theme. (The whippersnappers may not get this.)






"Just one word, *synthetic biology*".  Well maybe two words.






> Synthetic biology is a new area of biological research that combines science and engineering in order to design and build ("synthesize") novel biological functions and systems....
> 
> Engineers view biology as a technology. Synthetic Biology includes the broad redefinition and expansion of biotechnology, with the ultimate goals of being able to design and build engineered biological systems that process information, manipulate chemicals, fabricate materials and structures, produce energy...



Solazyme & a few other companies are claiming to have full scale commercial production facilities of algae biofuel operating by 2010. Here are two videos. The last half of the second video is about a 2008 Sundance Film Festival documentary, "Fields of Fuel", you might want to skip it.

We could reduce our transportation fuel consumption by up to 40% by switching to diesel cars. We could reduce our transportation fuel consumption by up to 60% by buying diesel/hybrids, which be available in Europe in a year or two. These diesel engines can easily be powered by 100% algae/biodiesel. Driving cars that get 70-90 mpg, we would require that much less fuel production. We keep our dollars circulating in American pockets, dramatically improving our energy dependent economy AND we reduce greenhouse gas. How can anyone argue against this?

As I've said many times before, Ris & I made our choice in 2005 not to wait for Uncle Sam. We took action to reduce our carbon footprint & get off foreign oil. When will you, the general "you", demand & support alternative energy?










Ho Ho Tai said:


> "Letting a hundred flowers blossom and a hundred schools of thought contend is the policy for promoting progress in the arts and the sciences..."...
> 
> ... In fact, it is the basis for most of human progress, long before Mao. It is a principle which the current administration seems to have forgotten. I pray that it is remembered in the next.
> 
> Instead of the scarcity of energy driving the world's economy, we suddenly have a hundred energy flowers - energy falling from the sky, from the moon, from volcanic gas, from fungus, from the trees - and, including nuclear fusion and fission, from the very stars....



Ho Ho, I don't know about you but I'm very excited. The diversity of biofuel processes guarantee the inevitable end of Big Oil's monopoly on energy. Photovoltaic & wind power costs are dropping & soon I expect them to become economically viable for the average homeowner. There are so many diverse technologies becoming available soon, I anticipate local municipal power generation monopolies will feel the heat.  (Pun intended.) 

Here's yet another example of alternative energy. California contracted an Icelandic company recently for geothermal energy production. Oh hell, couldn't find the Orange County Register article, so this will have to do. This post is getting too long so I'll stop... for now.



> ... The Utah plant is the first commercial-scale project to use Rasers technology ... it will supply power to residential homes in the Southern California city of Anaheim; subsequent phases may supply Utah. West cites higher demand in California for renewable energy...
> 
> Raser also hopes to tap into Californias own vast geothermal resources, a goal the Bureau of Land Management recently made easier to achieve when it announced a plan to make about 118 million acres of Bureau of Land Management-managed public lands and 79 million acres of National Forest System lands in 12 western states available for future geothermal leasing....


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## Ho Ho Tai (Nov 13, 2008)

biodieselman said:


> Ho Ho, I don't know about you but I'm very excited. The diversity of biofuel processes guarantee the inevitable end of Big Oil's monopoly on energy. Photovoltaic & wind power costs are dropping & soon I expect them to become economically viable for the average homeowner. There are so many diverse technologies becoming available soon, I anticipate local municipal power generation monopolies will feel the heat.  (Pun intended.)
> 
> Here's yet another example of alternative energy. California contracted an Icelandic company recently for geothermal energy production. Oh hell, couldn't find the Orange County Register article, so this will have to do. This post is getting too long so I'll stop... for now.



Mrs Ho Ho languishes in bed as I storm along through e-mail responses.

Let me just say that Of course I am excited, but less than totally optimistic. Gas prices in this (Minnesota) area are currently running around $1.85/gal. - and down to the $1.70+ range, if one wishes to chase them. This seems pretty cheap for a population who has already forgotten the agony of watching prices rise from under $1/gal through the $2.00 range (and blissfully unaware of the days when I could fill my 35 gal International for ten bucks) 

How easily these prices can be manipulated! For a while, I honestly thought that conservation and economic woes were behind the fall in oil prices Oh, yeah? Want to bet that Big Oil just decided to take some of the wind out of the windmills with 'cheap' gas?

BDMan, while your research is wonderful, you might just try reading a bit upstream in this very thread for info on the Hellish Heidi process Even here in flyoverland, we do keep our eyes open.


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## William (Nov 14, 2008)

Here is a local Green Demolition Company

http://www.greendemolitions.org/

It also helps the addiction Recovery Community and provides a Sober workplace for many.

William


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## chunkylex (Nov 16, 2008)

when i was 13 for fun i had my own Veggie Garden, Grew beans, Tomatoes and peppers. i found it to be very rewarding and it was fun watching something you worked on actually work. i think ill start again, and make my idea into reality. 

As for bike alternative, I'm not so sure your BHM,or BBW will enjoy it some may not be able to. 

For here in Miami, bikes are a death trap waiting to happen people drive crazy down here. the weather is very shifty so getting stuck in rain is awful, and i work retail i can't ride 13 miles with my uniform and get to work soaking full of sweat. 13 miles using an express way which is the most direct way lol, i do bike ride when i go to parks and just for fun.


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## stan_der_man (Nov 17, 2008)

I brought some recyclables to the local recycling center, a 20 gallon container of plastics, a 15 gallon container of glass and a garbage bag half full of crushed aluminum cans. I received slightly over $12 for my efforts! A little bit of spending money is always nice... :happy:


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## big_gurl_lvr (Nov 18, 2008)

Maybe it's a bit different from what you talk about but ... it's still ecology. When you buy a new car check how often it needs to have oil changed. Nowadays new car need oil change every 30000 km (+/- 20000miles). So figure out what's the difference in oil waste production between a car that needs oil change every 3000-4000 miles. It's especially worth if you drive a lot, cause you still need to change it every year or so. 

What I found recently is:
http://www.thetorquereport.com/2007/03/toyotas_prius_is_less_efficien.html
I was quite shocked to find how ecology un-friendly prius is. It's of course very innovative and so... but... is it worth spending so much money for that car if beside looking environment friendly it's not that good? 
If you drive compact class car with small 1.6 engine (it's average in Europe) you really can get impressive fuel consumption. I'm not talking about 1.6 diesel engines who usually will give you better economy than prius or other hybrids, especially out of town.
These few hints may help:
http://www.smartplanet.com/news/transport/10001240/top-10-eco-driving-tips-to-beat-fuel-rises.htm
Few words about diesels:
http://www.popularmechanics.com/automotive/new_cars/4237945.html
I drive diesel myself - in mid size car (here in Europe) and being honest, despite few cons when compared to gas car it's doing its job fine and usually saves me some money.


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## JudyJade (Nov 22, 2008)

I use those squily light bulbs!


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## stan_der_man (Dec 4, 2008)

With your gardening, conservation and ecological mindedness, you are a better man than I Bio! :bow:

http://www.dimensionsmagazine.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1013432&postcount=1175


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## BrunetteBeauty80 (Dec 14, 2008)

I do what I can:

*I have changed all the bulbs in the house to the CFL bulbs. We got so many free from different fairs we went to. Every time you see a PG&E booth at a fair go to it. They give you lightbulbs for free! 

*We have the front loading energy star washers and dryers. When we bought out house I wanted them so I could save my back. They use so little water it is amazing. My clothes also dry in half the time they used to!

*During the day, I have a strict rule of no lights on. Any light I get comes from the windows in the house. I am lucky to have quite a few windows. It is so nice to get fresh air and sunshine in a house. Once it is dark, I will usually turn an overhead light on to light a room. 

*During the Winter we use extra blankets to keep warm. We hardly ever turn the heater up above 60 degrees. If we are cold, we put on socks, a sweater and grab a blanket. Plus, we can cuddle that way too 

*During the Summer we keep the windows open (fresh air) and fans on. I set the air conditioning so it comes on when the house hits about 90 degrees. Just like in Winter, if it is cold put more on. If it is hot, take stuff off!

*I love to sew so I made about 20 fabric shopping bags one day. They are incredibly easy to make, and you don't have to pay the .99 to $2.00 that the stores want for their bags. Plus, I feel better knowing I don't have a stockpile of plastic bags in my house. 

*Our city has a recycling program. Every Friday they pick up the recycling along with the trash (different trucks). I am just still confused as to what is recyclable? They say cans are, but not cans that have had food items in them??? Even washed out? 

*I get all my fresh veggies from my parents (who live up the hill from us). They have five acres and a wonderful veggie garden. Nothing like going produce shopping right off the vine! 

*I drive as little as possible. I walk most places I am able to. I want to get a bike so I can ride, but just don't have the money right now. I would say on a normal week I drive about once a week. The rest of the time I carpool or walk. There have been times where I go three to four weeks without driving. 

*My local university has monthly E-cycle events where they recycle old appliances, computer components, batteries, and the like. It doesn't take much to just save up what you have to recycle and take it over there. They do it for free which is awesome!

*I recycle my aluminum cans. We, I will admit, are big soda drinkers. We save up our cans in our garage and then turn them in once a year. We usually get a pretty good amount (last time it was $136.00) and put that towards a trip away or a nice dinner. 

They aren't big things I do, just little things, but it makes me feel at least I am contributing something. I am also a big fan of Freecycle! Just yesterday I gave away a stereo, tv, and toaster oven that we no longer used!


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## Ho Ho Tai (Dec 25, 2008)

Run gals, run! It's. . .THE COLLECTOR!


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## William (Dec 26, 2008)

Photos of the Coal Sludge Spill in Tennessee

A People's Christmas was ruined and their Quality of Life ruined no matter what reparations are given.

http://cellar.org/showthread.php?t=19071 








Video

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rGmVCABMRRQ


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## sShameless (Dec 27, 2008)

Brunette Beauty - Next time you turn in your cans put it towards a bike fund, as mentioned in one of the very first posts of this thread a good one usually costs $200.

This is what we do:

We have giant organic messenger bags for groceries.

we buy organic.

we recycle everything, paper, plastic, glass, metal.

I toss food waste (everything but meat, I do not need the dogs in the garden) into my raised garden bed.

All that composting yeilded mammoth zucchinis as well as a tomato plant on steroids. With green beans, peas, and spinach to boot. This thread has inspired me to start some lettuce and see what else I can start up for containers this winter.

We have switched all the bulbs, inside and out, to CFLs.

We use LOTS of extra blankets in winter, and let the dogs sleep on the bed too.

We return the plastic pots and metal hangers to the nursery, they make their own hanging baskets, so why shouldn't they reuse too?

We mulch in our grass clippings.

Unused rooms have their doors shut and vents closed, why should I heat/cool a room we don't use?

Craigslist craigslist craigslist. We both sell and purchase from there. Try freecycle too!

I shop farmers markets and goodwill. Not only good because it cuts down on travel for produce and landfill space but good for my wallet too.

Ceiling fans are our friends.

Finally: I prefer antiques, they are usually made from real wood and not chemical infused plyboard or whatever, are unique, and depending upon your style, aren't that much more expensive that new items.


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## stan_der_man (Jan 1, 2009)

sShameless said:


> ...
> 
> Craigslist craigslist craigslist. We both sell and purchase from there. Try freecycle too!
> 
> ...



Craigslist kudos! All that you wrote sShameless, really sums up what everybody can do to be more "green"... Simply being more frugal and reusing things is the simplest way to live in a more sustainable way.

Here is something I've been meaning to give a try and I finally found a supplier... they're pricey for light bulbs but they are supposed to last at least 10 years and use a fraction of the wattage that incandescent do. I ordered a set of replacement LED bulbs for our camping trailer. These bulbs will fit into the existing incandescent bulb fixtures (which hold 1156, 12v bulbs). In this case, it's not so much the saving of cost of electricity I'm looking for, I'm hoping to increase the time I can have lights running in our trailer on a battery charge. My eventual goal is to add a solar panel (panels) and attempt to have a self sustaining system where I can run AC during the day (while the panels generate electricity) and run night at lights (while presumably not needing AC) at a minimal draw.

Here is the link...

http://www.ledtrailerlights.com/stt/1157.htm






BTW... It's always worth trying to negotiate a better price. I contacted the guy running this website and asked if he would give me a discount on purchasing 10 bulbs. He added the links for the "10 bulb discount" after my request.

Also, one interesting thing I didn't know... Apparently the white LEDs don't give off quite enough light to be put behind colored lenses (the red or amber lenses of your car for example...) You need to purchase the color of bulb for the color of your lens, otherwise the white one doesn't shine through enough (at least not up to DOT standards...) The only exception is if you have a clear lens and you would like a different color bulb behind it, like an amber bulb for a clear lens blinker. The practical aspect to using LED bulbs is that they last longer, are less susceptible to voltage fluctuations (a real problem on older scooters and motorcycles) they supposedly have a more intense light (frequency wise, or how the light is directed since multiple LED light emanates from multiple sources...) and if you have a LED dome light and accidentally leave it on it won't run your battery down.


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## cammy (Jan 6, 2009)

I live in one of the most environmentally clueless area of the country - Pinellas County, Florida. Several years ago, St. Petersburg, Fl was collecting recycling curbside and then dumping it in the landfill!!!


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## stan_der_man (Jan 23, 2009)

This is the result of installing LED lights into the trailer... (retrofitted bulbs, same fixtures) 


Here is a comparison of what the light looks like. The left section is the incandescent bulb with a much yellower look (easier on the eyes to be honest...) and the very white LED to the right. At least these bulbs don't seem to be so blue (much harsher on the eyes...) as many I have seen in the past.







What the LED bulb looks like installed...







The LED bulb to the left, the incandescent to the right.






I'm finding that the LED bulbs aren't quite as bright as the incandescent bulbs were, but having both LEDs powered on (these fixtures can be turned on with either one or two bulbs illuminated) takes much less energy than having one of the incandescent bulbs on by itself. While dry camping, the batteries should last a whole lot longer with using LEDs. Also, the LEDs generate almost no heat, so the plastic lenses on the light fixtures and the LED bulbs will last longer compared to the incandescents which get fairly hot in a short amount of time.


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## fat hiker (Feb 20, 2009)

fa_man_stan said:


> Here is something I've been meaning to give a try and I finally found a supplier... they're pricey for light bulbs but they are supposed to last at least 10 years and use a fraction of the wattage that incandescent do. I ordered a set of replacement LED bulbs for our camping trailer. These bulbs will fit into the existing incandescent bulb fixtures (which hold 1156, 12v bulbs). In this case, it's not so much the saving of cost of electricity I'm looking for, I'm hoping to increase the time I can have lights running in our trailer on a battery charge. My eventual goal is to add a solar panel (panels) and attempt to have a self sustaining system where I can run AC during the day (while the panels generate electricity) and run night at lights (while presumably not needing AC) at a minimal draw.
> 
> Here is the link...
> 
> http://www.ledtrailerlights.com/stt/1157.htm




Thanks for this - these look adaptable to other uses too. I"m thinking the market lights would make nifty tail lights for bicycles at night...


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## Ernest Nagel (Mar 16, 2009)

http://thefuelfilm.com/

If so, what did you think of it? Helpful, hurtful or just preaching to the choir?


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## stan_der_man (Mar 17, 2009)

Ernest Nagel said:


> http://thefuelfilm.com/
> 
> If so, what did you think of it? Helpful, hurtful or just preaching to the choir?



Thanks for the info Nagel! I just checked to see where "Fuel" is playing, it only seems to be at a theatre in Santa Monica at the moment... I'll keep an eye out to see if it will play at a theatre closer. My gut feeling that it may just be preaching to the choir, or this movie just a general overview of some sort. If I want specifics, there is a local bio-diesel specialist only about an hours drive from me whom I can consult...


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## biodieselman (Mar 18, 2009)

fa_man_stan said:


> ... If I want specifics, there is a local bio-diesel specialist only about an hours drive from me whom I can consult...



And who might that be Stan?

I've posted many Youtube videos of this documentary before. The title of the movie has changed from _"Fields of Fuel"_ to just _"Fuel"_. I've had it in my Netflix queue for some time now & just now found out that it's *still* playing in theaters.

If you search YouTube for "Fields of Fuel", you'll see several videos, including this video I've used for my many rants on third generation algae/biofuel.

I'm waiting for algae/biodiesel technology to become feasible for the home brewer. I've been working on Ris for several years now, preparing her for the day I convert our swimming pool to an algae production pond.


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## CleverBomb (Mar 18, 2009)

fa_man_stan said:


> Craigslist kudos! All that you wrote sShameless, really sums up what everybody can do to be more "green"... Simply being more frugal and reusing things is the simplest way to live in a more sustainable way.
> My eventual goal is to add a solar panel (panels) and attempt to have a self sustaining system where I can run AC during the day (while the panels generate electricity) and run night at lights (while presumably not needing AC) at a minimal draw.


Slick if you can pull it off... just wondering if you can get a solar array with enough wattage to support an air conditioner? If it's dry where you camp, consider an evaporative cooler (swamp cooler) instead -- far lower power draw than an air conditioner.

I ended up building one from scratch for my Vanagon -- the engine in that one didn't have any horsepower to spare to run an AC compressor! It almost worked (turned out to be a little undersized, but it proved the concept).

-Rusty


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## SocialbFly (Mar 18, 2009)

CleverBomb said:


> Slick if you can pull it off... just wondering if you can get a solar array with enough wattage to support an air conditioner? If it's dry where you camp, consider an evaporative cooler (swamp cooler) instead -- far lower power draw than an air conditioner.
> 
> I ended up building one from scratch for my Vanagon -- the engine in that one didn't have any horsepower to spare to run an AC compressor! It almost worked (turned out to be a little undersized, but it proved the concept).
> 
> -Rusty


Rusty, congrats on your 2000th post


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## CleverBomb (Mar 18, 2009)

SocialbFly said:


> Rusty, congrats on your 2000th post


Hey, I didn't even notice that!
Thanks!

-Rusty


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## biodieselman (Mar 24, 2009)

Spring is here... or coming soon to a location near you & now is the time to think about planting a Victory/Recession Garden. Below are simple instructions on how to get started.

One little thing before I start. If you're not thinking of planting a garden but you need to prune your trees, please get it done before the trees start to leaf out. If you wait, you could accidentally destroy a bird's nest. America's song bird population has suffered tremendously from domestic cat predation, many are disappearing, and they need all the help they can get.



> 2009 might turn out to be the year that more of us get back to the good earth. Sales are up, way up, at almost every online seed company, such as Burpee and The Cook's Garden.
> 
> There are so many reasons to grow your own that is makes no sense to take up space naming them. ...
> 
> ...



Here are a few photos of the last of our winter garden. Living in a frost free zone allows us to garden year round. You'll know when to plant in your area - when the nights start to warm up, or ask at your local garden center. You'll find most gardeners are eager to be helpful.

We chose broccoli varieties that produce side shoots after the main head is picked.




We had a bad winter garden this year. Southern California is having the worst drought since record keeping began. Everything transplanted beautifully but the birds devoured practically everything. Ris & I try to create backyard wildlife habitat as a natural insect control so I really shouldn't complain. Only after the fields greened up after winter rains did the birds leave the garden alone. A few things did survive.




SocialbFly, you're more than welcome to come over for dinner when the sugar snap peas are full & ripe. But you'll have to help Ris string the peas.




It's a gamble trying to grow tomatoes in the dead of winter here but sometimes it pays off.




Ris finished planting our seed starter kits for our first spring planting. Can't wait!:eat2: Bubbles is trying to keep the birds out of our garden. Or is it the cows?


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## Ho Ho Tai (Mar 24, 2009)

Mrs Ho Ho and I are sitting here, absolutely astonished by the pix of your garden! If you are looking for any more volunteers to de-string the snap peas . . .

Well, at least I can offer this sage advice (as I got it from Pete Seeger.)

GARDEN SONG

CHORUS:
Inch by inch, row by row, 
Gonna make this garden grow.
Gonna mulch it deep and low, 
Gonna make it fertile ground.
Inch by inch, row by row, 
Please bless these seeds I sow.
Please keep them safe below 
'Til the rain comes tumbling down. 

Pullin' weeds and pickin' stones, 
We are made of dreams and bones
Need spot to call my own 
Cause the time is close at hand.
Grain for grain, sun and rain 
I'll find my way in nature's chain
Tune my body and my brain 
To the music of the land. 

CHORUS 

Plant your rows straight and long, 
Season them with a prayer and song
Mother earth will keep you strong 
If you give her love and care.
Old crow watching from a tree
Has his hungry eyes on me
In my garden I'm as free 
As that feathered thief up there. 

CHORUS 

Words and Music by David Mallett
©1975 Cherry Lane Music Publishing (ASCAP)


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## biodieselman (Mar 25, 2009)

Ho Ho Tai said:


> Mrs Ho Ho and I are sitting here, absolutely astonished by the pix of your garden! If you are looking for any more volunteers to de-string the snap peas . . .



Thanks, you guys know that if you should find yourself in Los Angeles, you're more than welcome to use us as a Motel Six. If the sugar snap peas are out of season, I'm sure I could find some other garden chores you can help with.

Hottie Megan, I'm a tight wad & I tend to use whatever is available. Holes drilled in the bottom of an old plastic storage container for drainage will do for container gardening as long as it's sturdy enough. If your patio has a wrought iron fence, it could be used as a tomato trellis. 



> Many people who live in an apartment, condominium, or mobile home do not grow a vegetable garden because space is not available for a garden plot. Lack of yard space is no excuse for not gardening, since many kinds of vegetables can be readily grown in containers. In addition to providing five hours or more of full sun, attention must be given to choosing the proper container, using a good soil mix, planting and spacing requirements, fertilizing, watering, and variety selection.
> 
> Containers are available in many different sizes, shapes, and materials. All containers, whether clay, wood, plastic, or ceramic, should have an adequate number of holes in the bottom for proper drainage. Additional holes should be drilled or punched in containers that do not drain quickly after each watering. Drainage is reduced when the container is set on a solid surface such as a cement or patio floor. Raising the container one or two inches off the floor by setting it on blocks of wood will solve this drainage problem.
> 
> ...


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## Ho Ho Tai (Mar 26, 2009)

Ho Ho Tai said:


> Mrs Ho Ho and I are sitting here, absolutely astonished by the pix of your garden! If you are looking for any more volunteers to de-string the snap peas . . .



Meant to comment on that Gorgeous Flower in the last picture - the one seated on the bench. 






*How DOES your garden grow!!!*​


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## Ernest Nagel (Mar 29, 2009)

Maybe we could just all agree to meat half-way?

http://greeninc.blogs.nytimes.com/2009/03/27/meat-vs-climate-the-debate-continues/?hp

*Meat vs. Climate: The Debate Continues*
By Azadeh Ensha


At least since a 2006 United Nations report asserted that livestock is responsible for a full 18 percent of greenhouse gas emissions  a higher percentage than that caused by transportation  a debate over meat consumption and climate change has been cooking.

The latest round involves a recent editorial in the Archives of Internal Medicine by Barry M. Popkin, a professor of nutrition at the University of North Carolina. In it, Mr. Popkin revisits several studies linking meat not just with heart disease and other health issues, but also with worldwide consumption of energy and water resources  and global warming.

Water use, Mr. Popkin writes, is two to five times greater worldwide for animal-source food than for basic crops such as legumes and grains. He further argues that livestock production accounts for 55 percent of the erosion process in the United States and is also responsible for one-third of the total discharge of nitrogen and phosphorous to surface water.

He also cites the 2006 U.N. study.

Overall, scholars first question the sustainability of modern agriculture in general, Mr. Popkin writes, and second, they question the much higher energy use of producing animal foods.

Not surprisingly, the Center for Consumer Freedom, which describes itself as a nonprofit coalition supported by restaurants, food companies and consumers, issued a press release this week disputing Mr. Popkins editorial.

It is beyond dispute that any connection between meat production and global warming is a false one, said David Martosko, the groups director of research, in a phone interview.

The C.C.F. said the United Nations conclusion that 18 percent of global greenhouse gases are caused by animal agriculture was also exaggerated. The group instead points to an Environmental Protection Agency report that puts the figure for all agriculture production  including meat  at just 6 percent.

Mr. Marosko says that Mr. Popkin is stretching the truth beyond recognition.

Eating less meat isnt going to move the dial, at least not in this country. Go buy the hybrid. Pay a premium for alternative energy sources, but eating tofu instead of sirloin? Its not gonna make a difference, he said.

Mr. Popkin, when asked about the Center for Consumer Freedoms assertions, said he stood by his claims.

This is what the food industry always does  just like the tobacco industry, he said. They obfuscate without ever looking at facts.


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## Ernest Nagel (Apr 3, 2009)

Isn't science wonderful? I just LOVE this kinda shiz. :wubu:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/technology/7977585.stm

Maybe not _that_ green but if it helps us move away from internal combustion for so much of our transportation just a bit faster...


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## William (Apr 4, 2009)

Thought of the Day #93 - Wind Power and Salt Flats

http://www.catay.com/2009/04/thought-of-day-93-wind-power-and-salt.htm

William


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## William (Apr 5, 2009)

Actually 

The Salton Sea area of California adds geothermal to the energy benefits

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=102679730


William




William said:


> Thought of the Day #93 - Wind Power and Salt Flats
> 
> http://www.catay.com/2009/04/thought-of-day-93-wind-power-and-salt.htm
> 
> William


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## HottiMegan (Apr 21, 2009)

Okay Bio, i have a gardeing question for your expertise  
I eat a lot of mint. I'm sick of paying for it. I want to grow some. My problem. I live in an apartemnt that is shaded until the afternoon and i have little space. Would it be possible to raise some mint (i know it grows like a weed) in a container and set it outside all day? I was planning on going this weekend to get seeds and some soil to try it out. (also a good project for my 6 year old)
I had trouble growing tomatoes last year in containers but i suspect it was due to 2 months of almost NO sun from all the fires around. I'm going to try again on the tomatoes and grow some zucchini hopefully.


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## biodieselman (Apr 21, 2009)

HottiMegan said:


> Okay Bio, i have a gardeing question for your expertise ...



Uhh oh! I feel like I'm being put on the spot. Ris is the Container Queen.

If I recall, Ris told me you're somewhere around Redding. My God, girl! Redding gets such long, hot summers. I would suggest a form of self-watering container to help on hot, windy, low humidity days. I did a real quick Youtube search for self-watering containers & this video looked fairly inexpensive but effective.

Mint (or mentha) will be very happy in containers. Actually containers are recommended because mint is quite invasive & quickly spreads when planted in the ground. 

*Mentha* Perennial herbs and ground cover. Spread rapidly by underground stems. Once established, surprisingly drought tolerant. Grow almost anywhere but perform best in light, medium-rich, moist soil, partial shade. Propagate from runners. Keep flowers cut off. Replant every 3 years.

*Golden apple mint* All zones. To 2 ft. Use in flavoring foods.

*Peppermint* All zones. To 3 ft. Leaves good for flavoring tea. Orange mint, bergamot mint to 2 ft. Both are used in flavoring foods. Crushed leaves have slight orange flavor.

*Spearmint* All zones. 1 1/2 - 2 ft. Use leaves fresh from garden or dried for lamb, in cold drinks, as garnish, in apple jelly.

*Apple mint* All zones. 20 - 30 in. Leaves have apple-mint fragrance.

I left out the unimportant varieties.

May I suggest buying tomato plants recommended by your local gardening center suited for containers? I would imagine cherry, grape or small tomato varieties would produce more reliably in hot, dry summers.

Los Angeles has a frost-free climate which allows us to grow vegetables year round; here are some photos taken 2 weeks ago. With hot weather nearing, the last planting of our cool weather crops will fade quickly.















Sugar snap peas.:eat2::eat1:




You are most likely seeing California poppies where you live.




I don't have any photos, but this weekend we planted the first of our summer crops. Corn, zucchini, cucumbers, swiss chard, bok choy, green onions & zinnias. (Ris i*nsists* on planting a few flowers in *my* vegetable garden.) The tomatoes Ris has germinated are still too small to go into the ground, plus we didn't want to rip out producing sugar snap peas to make room for tiny tomatoes. The Sweet 100 cherry tomatoes we set out last fall have been producing small yields for a few weeks now. Over wintering tomatoes here are a gamble & we lost the bet this winter.


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## HottiMegan (Apr 22, 2009)

I grew grape tomatoes last summer they didn't make fruit until late into October. I am going to try container growing those again as well as the mint. My husband has horror stories from his youth of mint plants taking over his yard. It took root and went under the house to the front yard. I figured growing some of my own will save me a few bucks this summer. I use it a lot in my asian style salads. This weekend is my weekend to start up as much stuff as i can grow 
Thanks for the advice. I do live about 70 miles south of Redding and it's long and hot here. Usually not cool until Halloween. It's in the 90s up here already!!


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## HottiMegan (Apr 26, 2009)

Between yesterday and today i got the following:
-Patio Pink tomatoes (a pre-started one that's already a couple feet tall)
-Yellow pear tomatoes
-1 corn plant (max wanted to grow it. I hope it'll do okay in a container. It's a huge container.)
-I got a little container of cilantro to see if i can grow a good amount of that even though i can get huge bunches of it for like 37 cents.
-a windowsill green house that i will be starting my mint in. (mint was surprisingly hard to find too!!)
Max also HAD to have marigolds so we got some marigolds


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## Teleute (Apr 26, 2009)

A friend of mine is creating a browser-based game that gives points based on doing eco-positive things, with the ability to select different paths to being green. I think that bit is way cool, because a lot of people are unable to take public transportation or walk places, but that doesn't mean they can't switch to CFL bulbs or change their recycling habits or something. I hate the "well, if you're not doing EVERYTHING earth-friendly, you're basically doing NOTHING" attitude that comes across in some circles (admittedly, I live in Seattle - we get more of the eco-pretentious types  ) When the game goes live, I'll definitely post it here.


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## snuggletiger (May 8, 2009)

In the process of purchasing the house, and realizing the power bill will be high, I am becoming interested in how to lower my power bills. Like will using the sguiggly light bulbs make that much of a difference in the electric bill and raising the thermostat to 80-85 range in summertime cause the bill to go down by a noticeable measure. So any energy saving tips would be welcomed.


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## Teleute (Jun 12, 2009)

Heh.

Heh heh.

Now, THIS is the way to live green.

Earth Angel Hand Crank Vibrator

Bonus: If there's a nuclear apocalypse and you can't get batteries or power, you'll still have a functioning vibrator!


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## Tad (Jun 12, 2009)

Teleute said:


> Heh.
> 
> Heh heh.
> 
> ...



Darn it, I just repped you for something else, but this is so vastly rep-worthy  

Someone get her please!


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## Ernest Nagel (Jun 12, 2009)

edx said:


> Darn it, I just repped you for something else, but this is so vastly rep-worthy
> 
> Someone get her please!



Got her for you, Ed. Great for emergencies indeed!  Gives a (w)hole new meaning to the term "Crank her up!"


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## Ho Ho Tai (Jul 19, 2009)

BDMan and interested parties:

We have had several interesting reports in one of our local newspapers recently, on issues involving biodiesel.

The first involves a progress report on Ever Cat Fuels, currently building a pilot plant in Isanti, MN, a few miles north of our residence. Clayton McNeff, a principal in the organization, proclaims this Declaration of Energy Independence:

*"We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all people are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain inalienable rights, that among these are life, liberty, the pursuit of happiness and the right to produce their own energy..."*

The balance of the article may be accessed here: Ever Cat

The second article, though interesting and promising, is also disturbing.

"Pond scum finally gets some respect - as oil resource

Big Oil is investing in algae as a promising alternative. Will the Midwest play a role? The ante was raised this week."

I think we've seen this play before. "Diesel fuel from pond scum? That's nice, boys. Now, run along and play. We'll take it from here." 

They buy out the technology, wrap up a bunch of patents, and that's the last anyone ever hears of it. I believe that Ever Cat was pretty cagey on this issue. My recollection is that they plan to lease out the technology very broadly - let hundreds of cats out of the bag - and make it impossible for any one company to lock up the technology.

Ever Cat has a deep file of news articles from many sources - worth reading.


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## Ho Ho Tai (Aug 13, 2009)

Published on Wednesday, August 12, 2009 by The Guardian/UK
Scientists Explore How the Humble Leaf Could Power the Planet
"Researchers at Imperial College London embark on 'artificial leaf' project to produce power by mimicking photosynthesis
...

"Ultimately, Barber hopes to improve on nature's own solar cell. "If the leaf can do it, we can do it but even better," he said. "[But] it doesn't mean that you try to build exactly what the leaf has. Leonardo da Vinci tried to design flying machines with feathers that flapped up and down. But in the end we built 747s and Airbus 380s, completely different to a bird and, in fact, even better than a bird."

Photosynthesis starts with a chemical reaction where sunlight is used to split water into hydrogen and oxygen. The oxygen is released into the atmosphere while the hydrogen is used to create sugars and other organic molecules for the plant. The aim of Barber's artificial leaf project is to find an efficient way of mimicking that water-splitting reaction to create a clean and limitless source hydrogen. Unlike normal leaves, the new devices would not suck CO2 out of the atmosphere."

Do I sense a bit of hubris here? Oh, well. (Should I say HOH, well?) Here's some neat diagrams of the photosynthesis process. Humble or not, the leaf has certainly stood the test of time. 

I'm not a chemist, but it does make me wonder if we are missing a bet. Since the photosynthesis process has already done the HOH splitting for us, would it be possible to tap off some of the resulting hydrogen, as we do maple syrup? Maybe not as efficent as a high tech artificial photosynthesis project out in the desert, but, hey - there's an awful lot of trees out there doing nothing but sitting around growing, and maybe providing some shade, oxygen, and perches for the birds. I say, Let's put 'em to work!


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## fat hiker (Aug 17, 2009)

Ho Ho Tai said:


> I'm not a chemist, but it does make me wonder if we are missing a bet. Since the photosynthesis process has already done the HOH splitting for us, would it be possible to tap off some of the resulting hydrogen, as we do maple syrup?



Speaking with my biologist (all right, agriculturalist) hat on, no, not without completely re-engineering the cell. Although the press talks about leaves 'splitting off hydrogen from water', in practical reality the hydrogen is never 'free' inside the plant cells - it's always attached to some other molecule, in an intricate chain of events called photosynthesis, which starts with CO2, H2O, assorted enzymes, and sunlight, and ends up with a simple sugar or ATP. No free H2 in there, unlike the freely flowing maple syrup.

In fact, if there were free H2 inside a plant cell, I think it would rapidly develop the intracellular equivalent of the 'bends' that divers get.

Of course, completely re-engineering the cell is what the study you posted is all about....


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## biodieselman (Aug 23, 2009)

Les Toil asked for a garden update while discussing the upcoming "Big Basin Banana Slug Bash." I'll load up a link to a Photobucket album with more garden pictures tomorrow.

This marks the end of the summer garden & the beginning of the winter garden. I actually prefer the winter garden because most pests hibernate & the growing season is a more relaxed pace. As the spent summer crops are removed, cool weather crops are planted to fill the empty space.

The 5th & last planting of sweet corn went into the ground today, along with a zucchini. When I finish removing the pole beans, the last cucumbers will take their place on the trellis. Next weekend, after the broccoli size up a bit more, the first broccoli will be planted.





I sowed the first of winter's Sugar Snap peas last weekend & they have sprouted already.:eat2: Can't wait! Ris had also sprouted another basil plant.




The blackberries & peaches are gone & the asian pears are beginning to size up. :eat2: After the New Year, the Washington navel & Satsuma Mandarin oranges will ripen. The jujube should ripen next month or so & we have one fuyu persimmon on the tree I planted this spring. We plan to plant a few more fruit trees this spring. That's if we have any money left after planting the California natives this fall.








We also bought a second worm 'ranch'. Can't get enough worm tea & worm castings.




Les, if you or anyone else have any questions, feel free to ask.

Now, Les, I've shown you mine - how about showing me yours? Your ... garden, that is?


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## biodieselman (Aug 25, 2009)

Les, here's the link to our most recent garden photos I promised.


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## rainyday (Aug 27, 2009)

Do any of you know a good website or book that lists plants that are harmful to pets? I'm growing lemon grass for the first time this year and will need to overwinter it and some other plants inside to save them for next year. 

Since my cats love to chew on greens, I've done some research online and it doesn't sound harmful to cats, but I'd like to be sure, plus check on the other plants I'll have inside. (I've tried "cat gardens" and they always prefer my other plants instead, little buggers.)

Also, lesson learned this year: Don't plant catnip near your front door unless you want all the neighborhood cats visiting your porch.


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## Ernest Nagel (Aug 27, 2009)

rainyday said:


> Do any of you know a good website or book that lists plants that are harmful to pets? I'm growing lemon grass for the first time this year and will need to overwinter it and some other plants inside to save them for next year.
> 
> Since my cats love to chew on greens, I've done some research online and it doesn't sound harmful to cats, but I'd like to be sure, plus check on the other plants I'll have inside. (I've tried "cat gardens" and they always prefer my other plants instead, little buggers.)
> 
> Also, lesson learned this year: Don't plant catnip near your front door unless you want all the neighborhood cats visiting your porch.



Hope this helps, RD? http://www.cfainc.org/articles/plants.html


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## rainyday (Aug 27, 2009)

Great list. Thanks!


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## scaffiddler (Sep 9, 2009)

I think this whole idea is only going to be more available the more our world progresses/ or digresses..

As supporters of a large persons world I think it would be best to stay on top of things


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## largebob280 (Sep 9, 2009)

Nobody seems to be talking too much about energy conservation around the house in this thread. Rodale Press (the people that publish Prevention magazine these days) used to publish a magazine about green home improvements - the name of which escapes me at the moment. The magazine was published in the late 70s, which was the last time there was a serious green movement. They had some interesting suggestions for living green.

For example, they suggested building simple solar heaters to heat outside air and deliver it into a house. The heaters were essentially shallow sloped boxes facing south that were painted black on the inside with a Plexiglas cover. Cool outside air came in through the bottom, and warm air came out the top, where it entered the house through a window. Move the same type of box to the roof, and you can use it to pull outside air into a house during the summer. The name for the latter application is a "thermal chimney."

Another example of low energy use is installing water containers inside a house where they'll be exposed to winter sunlight through a window. The containers will absorb heat during the day, and re-radiate the heat at night. The same effect can be created with stone tile or brick on a floor. This technique is called "thermal mass."

You can also make fairly simple changes to conserve energy at home: compact fluorescents, as already mentioned, or even LED light bulbs save considerable energy. You can get motion detectors to replace light switches if you have to deal with people that leave the lights on unnecessarily. Flat panel computer monitors save energy and space (flat-panel TVs don't save as much electricity as you think - because you usually replace a CRT with a much bigger flat panel display). Programmable thermostats are a good idea, but be careful - some of them are so difficult to program that people never learn how to do it. If you're replacing a roof, get the lightest color roofing you can. If you're replacing an air conditioner, choose the highest SEER value you can afford. The list goes on and on...


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## Ho Ho Tai (Sep 22, 2009)

This article is 'open'. You don't need a log-in to read it.
Comments?
Scientific American September 17, 2009 
Oil Rig of the Future: A Solar Panel That Produces Oil


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## Ho Ho Tai (Sep 30, 2009)

Ever Cat's on the prowl.

"Biodiesel refinery in Isanti is ready to rev

Workers at the Ever Cat Isanti plant earlier this month were putting finishing touches on the installation.

Ever Cat Fuels aims to put a dent in the amount of oil we import by turning weeds and algae, among other things, into diesel..."

*****

"The Mcgyan technology uses no water and generates no waste," said Greg Mowry, a professor of engineering at the University of St. Thomas, who spent 25 years in industrial technology research and product development. "The implications of what Clayton & Co. are doing are huge. And they are not running to government or a huge company to sell their technology. They are doing it on their own because it is worth being done."


*****

"Ever Cat also expects to serve existing ethanol plants by turning their waste into biodiesel. What's left after traditional distillation of corn into ethanol is a fatty distillers grain, worth about 4 cents per pound, that's commonly fed to livestock"


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## SocialbFly (Oct 5, 2009)

Since we are living green, i thought this was a great place to post this  

View attachment tree.jpg


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## Ernest Nagel (Nov 5, 2009)

Is anybody acquainted with this technology? 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RXMUmby8PpU

I've got a lot of big, older trees in my yard that shed limbs like crazy, especially in the winter months. It would be great to be able to use them on the soil (or the garden I'm planning on starting in the spring) instead od sending them to a landfill.


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## Ho Ho Tai (Nov 17, 2009)

Two recent stories from a local paper:

"BioCee Inc. wins big DOE grant "
"Thinking small is BioCee's big idea"

The company's website:

"BioCee's mission is to enable the cost-effective and environmentally sound production of clean fuels, chemicals, and water treatment by harnessing the full biocatalytic potential of microorganisms."

Despite the horrible state of the country and the world, my god! We live in exciting times.


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## Ho Ho Tai (Nov 17, 2009)

from Grist: Solar power rocket science?

"SolarReserves 24/7 solar power plant

At Rocketdynes San Fernando Valley headquarters outside Los Angeles theres a whiff of the right stuffof crew-cut guys in short-sleeve white shirts and skinny black tiesin a vast room that holds the massive rocket engines that propelled John Glenn and the Apollo 11 crew into space.

In one corner of this corporate space museum stands something different, though. Its a scale model of a solar power tower, technology Rocketdyne developed a couple of decades ago as a spinoff of its work for NASA."


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## Ho Ho Tai (Dec 9, 2009)

*. . . or world, unravels.*

FINLAND: Biodiesel Breakthrough or Environmental Nightmare?
By Linus Atarah

HELSINKI, Dec 9 (IPS) - As Finnish energy major Neste Oil scales up production of its green diesel NExBTL, environmental activists fear that more land will go under palm oil plantations at the expense of Southeast Asias threatened rainforests.

Palm oil is the main feedstock that goes into the production of NExBTL of which Neste Oil expects to use 50,000 tonnes this year and scale up that figure in subsequent years.

Neste Oil claims that its NExBTL diesel is effective in reducing carbon dioxide emissions  the main green house gas (GhG) tresponsible for global warming  that are spewed into the atmosphere by fossil fuel burning automobiles.

The advantage with NExBTL is that it can be used to run both old and new diesel engines without modification and Neste Oil says it is the first energy company to come out with such a product.

While Neste Oil hopes to reap profits from NExBTL, activists and experts say it could well turn into a future environmental nightmare.


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## Ernest Nagel (Dec 30, 2009)

A bit of light at the end of a long tunnel ahead near the end.

http://www.wired.com/wiredscience/2009/12/the-lost-decade-of-algal-biofuel/

*How Algal Biofuels Lost a Decade in the Race to Replace Oil*

* By Alexis Madrigal Email Author
* December 29, 2009 | 
* 8:00 pm 

For nearly 20 years, a government laboratory built a living, respiring library of carefully collected organisms in search of something that could grow quickly while producing something precious: oil.

But now that collection has largely been lost.

National Renewable Energy Laboratory scientists found and isolated around 3,000 species algae from construction ditches, seasonal desert ponds and briny mashes across the country in a major bioprospecting effort to find the best organisms to convert sunlight and carbon dioxide into fuel for cars.

Despite meager funding, the Aquatic Species Program (.pdf), initiated under President Jimmy Carter, laid the scientific foundation for making diesel-like fuel from the fat that microscopic algae accumulate in their cells. Fifty-one varieties were carefully characterized as potential high-value strains, but fewer than half of those remain.

Just when they started to succeed is when the plug got pulled, said phycologist Jeff Johansen of John Carroll University, who collected algal strains for the program in the 1980s. We were growing them in ponds and we were going to grow enough to have them made into a diesel fuel.

The program was part of the huge investment that Jimmy Carter made into alternative energy in the late 1970s. All kinds of research avenues were explored, but when the funding shriveled during later years, knowledge, experts and know-how were lost. The setback highlights the problems created by inconsistent funding for energy research. Now, President Obama has trumpeted the American Recovery and Reinvestment Act, also known as the stimulus package, as the largest increase in scientific research funding in history. Scientists roundly applauded the billions of dollars that went into energy research, development and deployment. But what about when the stimulus money runs out in two years?

One caution is that much of this has been funded with the stimulus package, said Ernie Moniz at a Google-hosted panel on energy in late November. So, were going to have to see what happens after these next two years, because what we need is not a drop, but a further increase in R&D commensurate with the task at hand.

And thats exactly what didnt happen in the last big energy R&D push.

From organism to oil

Turning pond scum into oil isnt easy, but as a hypothetical energy system, its elegant. The theory is that algae will produce more burnable fuel on less land than regular crops, perhaps something like a thousand gallons of oil per acre instead of a few dozen from conventional plants. The food-versus-fuel debates that plague biofuels like corn-based ethanol would disappear. Plus, its possible the algae could be engineered to make high-energy fuels suitable even for airplanes. Its these possibilities that sold the Carter administrations energy officials.

Phycologists, the people who study algae, discovered that under certain circumstances, some algae start cranking out far more oil than normal. Restrict their nutrients, and for some reason they start producing lots of oil. But they also stop growing. If the scientists could keep the algae multiplying and pull the lipid trigger anyway, theyd be in fat city. But their understanding of the biology was incomplete, and the task wasnt easy. It would take some time and effort to know if and when their the process would become cheap enough to compete with crude.

Another challenge was getting the algae to keep growing without injecting a lot of energy into the system. They installed large open ponds near Roswell, New Mexico, and began trying to produce tiny algae at oil tanker scales. It worked, but there were problems. Again, it would take some time and effort to know if and when everything would work together.

The program did not get time or the money to find out. By the time Bill Clinton took office, funding for the program had dwindled to a trickle, and in 1996, the Department of Energy abandoned the program to focus all its biofuel efforts on ethanol. A dark decade fell upon the field of algal biofuel. There wasnt even money available to take care of the algal collection that had been so painstakingly created.

In an effort to salvage some of the science, a few hundred strains of algae were sent to the University of Hawaii, but the refuge proved less than ideal. When a National Science Foundation grant ran out in 2004, it became difficult to continue the laborious work of maintaining the collection. The organisms sit in rows of test tubes living and reproducing. Every two months, they have to be transferred, passaged, to a new nutrient-rich tube. Random genetic mutations can enter a population and lead to permanent genetic changes. The algae can die.

Its not exactly clear how it happened, but a review released earlier this year found that more than half the genetic legacy (.pdf) of the program had been lost. Only 23 of the 51 strains that were extensively studied during the program remain alive and extant. The losses to the rest of the algal cultures in the collection have been even worse.

The really bloody shame is that of those 3,000, there are maybe 100 to 150 strains that remain at the University of Hawaii, said Al Darzins, who heads up the resurgent algal biofuels research program at the National Renewable Energy Laboratory.

The way R&D funding has been used in the United States has hurt the efficiency of the research. Programs that started during the late 70s and early 80s were stopped in the years of low energy prices that followed. Despite the best efforts of cash-strapped researchers, not everything can be preserved and recovered, frozen cryogenically while awaiting fresh funding.

Algae comes back

While the valuable NREL archive of algae biodiversity languished in a Hawaii basement, the world around it changed. Genetic and genomic research and understanding skyrocketed. Oil demand grew, particularly in massive developing countries like China, India and Indonesia. Oil usage outpaced new oil field finds. Interest in algae-based biofuels exploded. Venture capital and corporate money flowed back into the field. On January 2, 2008, oil hit $100 a barrel for the first time. Despite some ups-and-downs, the price of oil remains substantially higher than it was through much of the 1990s. As a result, more than 50 companies are now at work on some aspect of biofuel production from algae.

In the latest move, Exxon Mobil decided to invest $600 million into a joint venture with Craig Venters Synthetic Genomics for research into next-gen algal fuels.

Over the past few years, Darzins has revived the program at NREL. Theyve been hard at work on the biology of microalgae. Graduate student Lee Elliott of the Colorado School of Mines has collected 500 new species in just the last year and a half. To a certain extent, the problems of maintaining a microorganismal library have been solved. Cryogenic freezing techniques were developed at the University of Texas UTEX Culture Collection of Algae. The NREL team has been able to freeze and then revive 91 percent of their microorganisms.

Despite the lost decade, algal oil makers are optimistic that they are about to ride a steep cost curve down to much, much cheaper biofuel. As they apply new biological knowledge and optimize growing algae, the cost will drop. And as they capture economies of scale, the costs will drop again. In the best-case scenario, when all is said and done, algal biofuel could cost $50 per barrel. But that wont happen anytime soon, and it could take a decade.

Or maybe it will remain expensive for a long, long time. There are some legitimate reasons to be skeptical of algal biofuels potential for large-scale oil production.

So far, nobody has been able to make fuel from algae for a cost anywhere close to cheap, let alone competitive. Some researchers question whether any kind of energy-conversion process based on photosynthesis will ever play a major role in our transportation energy system. One life-cycle analysis found algal biofuels would not have a positive energy balance, in other words, youd have to put more energy in than you would get out. The prominent startup GreenFuel, which grew out of Harvard and MIT research, went bust earlier this year after blowing through $70 million.

We just dont know how well algal biofuel production might work. Its true that the 18 years of research at the National Renewable Energy Laboratory yielded a lot of knowledge, but it resulted in nothing resembling a commercial product or process.

The cultivation of microalgae for production of biofuels generally, and algal oils specifically, is not a near-term commercial prospect, John Benemann, an algae scientist who worked on the final report of the Aquatic Species Program, wrote in an e-mail to Wired.com. Larger-scale algal biofuels production still requires considerable, long-term R&D.
So many questions, so little time

Just $25 million was invested over the life of the Aquatic Species Program, which is just 5.5 percent of the total money the DOE dedicated to biofuels over that time. Adjusted for inflation, the programs total budget in todays dollars was less than $100 million. To put this tiny number in oil industry context, Exxon Mobil made $142 million in profit each day of 2008.

They came up with this idea and in four years, they almost demonstrated the technological feasibility, and then the funding fell out, said Johansen, the phycologist who collected algae for the program. The maximum of funding was about $4 million a year. When I left, it was $800,000 a year. Now, there is all this biofuel work going on, and they are all going back to that public domain research. It kind of drives me crazy.

The neglect of the Aquatic Species Program and subsequent resurgence of algal biofuel interest is one of many examples that show that the lack of coherent, consistent energy policy has left the worlds most oil-dependent nation scrambling in times of crisis.

Johansen even went so far as to say that if the Reagan and Bush administrations had not ended the growth of the algal biofuels program, our country would have algal biofuels now.

Even under far less optimistic scenarios, if the Aquatic Species Program had been fully funded from its start until now, there is no question that wed know a lot more about the potential, and limitations, of algal biofuels.

Instead, were left with some lessons learned, a partially missing library of microorganisms, and a lot of questions that investors and entrepreneurs want answered before the next oil price spike.

See Also:

* Chart: How the Darpa for Energy Is Slicing Its $150-Million Pie
* Teens DIY Energy Hacking Gives African Village New Hope
* Electric Fish Turn Down Charge for Energy Efficiency
* Say It Aint So: Science, Energy on Stimulus Chopping Block
* Tapping the Vortex for Green Energy
* Happy 150th, Oil! So Long, and Thanks for Modern Civilization
* The Exxon Valdez Spill Is All Around Us
* Oil Is Not the Climate Change Culprit  Its All About Coal
* No Quick Energy Fix in Rocky Mountain Oil
* Oil Consumption to Drop for First Time in 25 Years
* Video: Installing the Worlds Deepest Drilling Oil Rig

WiSci 2.0: Alexis Madrigals Twitter, Google Reader feed, and green tech history research site; Wired Science on Twitter and Facebook.


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## biodieselman (Jan 2, 2010)

Ernest Nagel said:


> Is anybody acquainted with this technology?
> 
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RXMUmby8PpU
> 
> I've got a lot of big, older trees in my yard that shed limbs like crazy, especially in the winter months. It would be great to be able to use them on the soil (or the garden I'm planning on starting in the spring) instead od sending them to a landfill.



I remember reading about this when I was first thinking about gardening. OMG! It's been decades when I first read about this! It's a great idea if your soil is acidic. Increasing soil ph above 7 will cause nutrients such as phosphorus, iron, boron, manganese, copper, zinc and potassium to become chemically tied to the soil and less available for plant use. I would take small soil samples from various spots where you're planning to start a garden & have it tested before using wood ashes as a soil amendment.

I have a problem common to arid climates, alkaline soil. By the time the Colorado River reaches southern California many dissolved salts have accumulated, making our water very hard, which increases the alkalinity of my soil. Many sugar pines were planted in our housing track which shed heavily just when our weather starts to turn hot. I sweep up their abundant pine needles from the streets to use a free garden mulch. The neighbors think I'm nuts. But hey... it's free! My garden soil benefits from the increased acidity of the needles.

If using wood ashes will benefit your soil, please post pictures. It'd be great to show by your example, how individuals can sequester carbon at home.


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## Hozay J Garseeya (Jan 30, 2010)

I read the very first post in this thread, and although I do feel it is a bit insignificant, I feel I'm doing the little that I can right now.

I spent a weekend building a 6'x3' planter box and planted some vegetable and fruit and looking to see where it goes. It's nice to not have to depend on a grocery store, even if it is just for a few things. So I have a little garden going on in an apartment.

here are some pictures. 

this is all the lumber at home in the living room.





these are the two side panels.




these are the front and side panels put together.




this was the box after adding the base boards.




I'm always proud of my accomplishments.




and lastly, my crops so far.


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## Ho Ho Tai (Jan 31, 2010)

Hozay J Garseeya said:


> I read the very first post in this thread, and although I do feel it is a bit insignificant, I feel I'm doing the little that I can right now.



Hozay, I'd be proud to build a box like that, whether as a planter, a composter, or even a coffin. Our efforts have been limited to a few tomatoes and peppers in outdoor planters. Most wound up feeding the squirrels and raccoons, then we would be off to the farmers' market

But I'm reminded of the brave naivete of Candide, as they set out to make their garden grow. I can get teary-eyed listening to it.

CANDIDE
You've been a fool
And so have I,
But come and be my wife.
And let us try,
Before we die,
To make some sense of life.
We're neither pure, nor wise, nor good
We'll do the best we know.
We'll build our house and chop our wood
And make our garden grow...
And make our garden grow.

CUNEGONDE
I thought the world
Was sugar cake
For so our master said.
But, now I'll teach
My hands to bake
Our loaf of daily bread.

CANDIDE AND CUNEGONDE
We're neither pure, nor wise, nor good
We'll do the best we know.
We'll build our house and chop our wood
And make our garden grow...
And make our garden grow.

(ensemble enters in gardening gear and a cow walks on)

CANDIDE, CUNEGONDE, MAXIMILLIAN, PAQUETTE, OLD LADY, DR. PANGLOSS
Let dreamers dream
What worlds they please
Those Edens can't be found.
The sweetest flowers,
The fairest trees
Are grown in solid ground.

ENSEMBLE (a cappella)
We're neither pure, nor wise, nor good
We'll do the best we know.
We'll build our house and chop our wood
And make our garden grow.
And make our garden grow!


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## Ernest Nagel (Jan 31, 2010)

Anybody acquainted with this technology (Magnesium Energy Cycle)? http://inventorspot.com/articles/japan_magnesium_energy_cycle_5887

I've been soaking up all the available research on mycodiesel and feel like I've kinda gotten blind to other promising developments. What else is out there lurking just beneath the viable horizon? 

BTW thanks for the tip re checking soil acidity before adding wood ash, Bio. Unfortunately my soil Ph is near perfect as is so the technology would have no value for me.


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## steely (Feb 5, 2010)

Hozay J Garseeya said:


> I read the very first post in this thread, and although I do feel it is a bit insignificant, I feel I'm doing the little that I can right now.
> 
> I spent a weekend building a 6'x3' planter box and planted some vegetable and fruit and looking to see where it goes. It's nice to not have to depend on a grocery store, even if it is just for a few things. So I have a little garden going on in an apartment.
> 
> ...



This is very impressive! Come back and post pictures when you harvest, please. I love to grow things. :smitten:


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## biodieselman (Feb 8, 2010)

Ernest Nagel said:


> ... BTW thanks for the tip re checking soil acidity before adding wood ash, Bio. Unfortunately my soil Ph is near perfect as is so the technology would have no value for me.



Glad to be of assistance S. If you have an abundance of tree trimmings, have you considered a wood chipper/shredder? They dramatically reduce the volume of tree trimmings & of course can be used as mulch or brown material for a compost heap. One word of advice, don't go cheap as I did. An electric chipper is grossly underpowered, making they essentially useless.



Although I work in the HVAC field, I've done almost everything practical to avoid using our gas fired heater & air conditioner. My children are grown & there is not great need to keep the house warm all of the time. Since we spend most of our time in the living room, we heat the room with the fireplace. Ris loves a nice warm fire. 




​
On cold nights, Ris dresses warmly & you can see her pile of blankets on the couch. I'll light a fire on the colder nights & first thing in the morning on weekends. Occasionally we get a cold/rainy spell, (hey... it's Los Angeles, it can rain), & I have a fire for most of the day.

As I'm sure you know, the problem is that all of the heat is concentrated in the room with the fireplace. I place a small fan on the floor at the end of the hallway from the bedrooms & aim the discharge towards the fireplace. The small fan is sufficient motive force to create a convection loop sucking cold air from the bedrooms, forcing heated air into the rest of the house. I keep the spare bedroom doors closed, as well as the door to the den. I also leave the ash clean-out door open in the floor of the fireplace. The ash clean-out door on the outside of the house is held cracked open with bricks for combustion air. I'm trying to prevent cold outside air from being sucked into the house as make-up air for combustion.

We burn a cord of wood per year. This year our wood came from the cut down almond orchards of central California. The EPA stopped sending irrigation water to thousands of farms causing many farmers to cut down productive fruit trees & many fields were left fallow due to no water for irrigation. Few realize how much of the nation's food is produced in California.




All of our windows were replaced with double-glazed Hi-E windows. We also have plantation shutters covering the windows. The three dead air spaces created between the screen, double glazed window & the shutters makes a huge difference in the heat of summer & the dead of winter that we can see in our lower utility bills.




A guy has to keep a woman warm & happy in the wintertime.:wubu: Oh yeah... and Bubbles too.
Don't tell her that I like the low gas bills.


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## PatrickThomas (Feb 8, 2010)

This is a good thread and we are doing all these kind of steps to practically applying all those ecofriendly life style which is needed to survive in this hazardous environment.
_________________________________________________
wrapping supplies ~ Good things come in small packages ~


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## Ernest Nagel (Feb 8, 2010)

Just thought this was a cool site. I ordered the shampoo and conditioner bars.

http://pluckfastic.org/

Great post, Chuck! Living alone I just heat my bedroom and office most of the time. I use little radiant oil heaters with timers and they keep those rooms around 68 while the rest of the house is 62. My heating bill is less than half of what the previous occupants was. 

My yard guy uses a chipper and all the output gets used as mulch wherever needed. :bow:


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## Ho Ho Tai (Feb 9, 2010)

biodieselman said:


> Although I work in the HVAC field, I've done almost everything practical to avoid using our gas fired heater & air conditioner. My children are grown & there is not great need to keep the house warm all of the time. Since we spend most of our time in the living room, we heat the room with the fireplace. Ris loves a nice warm fire.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



BDMan (you too, Risible)

In my previous existence (prior to Mrs Ho Ho) my former wife and I lived in a single story 1100 sq. ft. ranch style, with full basement and forced air / gas heat. We had a couple of fireplaces (one up, one down) which both looked much like yours. A few years after we moved in, I got into cutting and splitting my own firewood. I had a Jonsered 80, along with the usual assortment of hand saws, axes, sledges and wedges.


I bought that thing in 1974. It had a 16" bar, which was fine for my needs. My son has it now and has put a 30" bar on it. Still works great.

I cut and split 2 -3 farmer cords a year, burning it more for recreation than for heat. After a bit, I put glass doors and a heat exchanger on the upstairs fireplace. With the furnace fan running to circulate the heat, I could keep the whole house in the 60 deg. range, with the outside temp. around zero.

Ah, those were the days.

Obviously, Risible hasn't reached 'the change' yet, or she wouldn't need all those blankets. Mrs Ho Ho . . . well, I told her that I was going to stand her in the corner, turn a fan on her, and feed her corn pellets. Wouldn't need the furnace at all.

So, you're a HVAC guy. This story may interest you - maybe a business connection.

I guess that also explains all that hot air coming from Hyde Park.

PureChoice in Burnsville has Nose for business
Company is marketing its air-quality sensors to track heating and cooling, boosting clients' energy efficiency and its sales.


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## Ernest Nagel (Mar 17, 2010)

Some really cool info and insights on organic farming:

http://blog.ted.com/2010/03/qa_with_chef_da.php :bow:


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## stan_der_man (Mar 31, 2010)

Bio, I've been meaning to ask you this... When the oak tree fell into our back yard it obliterated most of our trees including the apple tree, which is now reduced to a stump and a series of offshoots which were cut off. Can apple trees regenerate from their trunks / roots and if so is their a good way of encouraging regrowth?


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## fat hiker (Apr 1, 2010)

stan_der_man said:


> Bio, I've been meaning to ask you this... When the oak tree fell into our back yard it obliterated most of our trees including the apple tree, which is now reduced to a stump and a series of offshoots which were cut off. Can apple trees regenerate from their trunks / roots and if so is their a good way of encouraging regrowth?



Hi Stan,

The quick answer to your question is, yes, apple trees can regenerate from their roots. But, you don't want them to, as what you will get is NOT the tree that was there before. If the sprouts are coming from the trunk above the ground however, you will get the same tree.

The reason that regenerating from below the ground is not what you want is that, excepting for wild apple trees grown from seeds, apple trees never grow on their own roots - at least, not apple trees with apples that you want to eat. Nearly all eating apples - from Macintosh to Granny Smith to Cox Orange Pippin - have quite weak root systems. Plus, a full-size conventional apple tree can grow to 60 feet tall! 

To both have a stronger root system, and keep the trees down to a more manageable height, nearly all apple trees are grafts onto a 'dwarfing' rootstock. The rootstock (the part of the tree underground) is selected for disease resistance, toughness and limited size, and then the top of a desired apple tree is grafted - joined - on. On some apple trees the graft is underground, but usually it is a bump or swelling just above the ground. This bump is quite obvious on young trees, but on old trees may be nearly invisible.

So, if you're getting sprouting from the trunk, encourage and cherish it, but if the sprouts are coming from underground or below the grafting bump, keep cutting them off - unless you only want the tree as an ornament, and don't intend to eat the apples. (Apples from the trees used for rooting stock tend to be small, rock hard and bitter.)


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## biodieselman (Apr 3, 2010)

Hozay J Garseeya said:


> I read the very first post in this thread, and although I do feel it is a bit insignificant, I feel I'm doing the little that I can right now. ...



There's *no* reason to feel the least bit insignificant Hozay, we all try to do what we can. There's no single solution that fits everyone needs. I commend you for your efforts.:bow:

I'm sure we all would enjoy to see what you're planting this spring. 



stan_der_man said:


> Bio, I've been meaning to ask you this... ... Can apple trees regenerate from their trunks / roots and if so is their a good way of encouraging regrowth?



I'm afraid FH is right Stan. It would be better to plant another tree for several reasons. I would be very surprised if your apple tree wasn't a grafted tree. The scion, or fruiting tissue, rarely has a strong, vigorous rooting system. Root stocks are selected for their superior vigor & disease resistance.

From last year's description, I suspect that either the root stock has taken over or, at minimum, the tree has been abandoned for several years. An apple tree that hasn't properly pruned for years will develop intertwining branches & the fruiting crop will diminish in size & quality. The overtaking root stock will also yield smaller, less desirable fruit.

Either way, it would take 2-4 years of knowledgeable pruning to nurse an abandoned tree back to reasonable production. But a tree that has suffered this much damage, IMO, isn't worth the risk or effort. Sorry, Stan, it's a do-over.

*Changing the subject...*

I've been experimenting on methods of increasing my biodiesel yields. I increased the catalyst & I made a 120 gallon mistake. I made 120 gal of liquid hand soap that smells like Indian food. Talk about do-over!!!

This is a photo looking down into the main reaction vessel.











I save all of the circuit boards I replace from work, batteries, old electronic devices, etc., etc. I recently made another trip to the nearby Hazardous Waste Roundup that our city puts on quarterly. I took my camera to photograph the big production of people sorting the various hazardous materials, but there were so many cars in line & the line moved so fast, I didn't have time to take photos.

You guys *do* dispose of your toxic, hazardous waste old electronics in a responsible manner... right?




It's spring time & we've have a lot of rain in the desert regions of Southern California. Here are some photos taken recently near Borrego Springs following Coyote Creek in Coyote Canyon. It's unbelievable to picture this much vegetation if you could see how sparse this place is during the oppressive summer temperatures. Seeing the desert during daylight is very deceiving. The bright sun washes out the colors that photos can't do justice. There's* lots* of wildlife you don't see, bighorn sheep, coyotes, bats, insects, kangaroo rats, many birds, not to mention snakes & lizards & more. They come out at night!!! You can only truly appreciate the marvels of the desert first hand.


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## stan_der_man (Apr 7, 2010)

Thank you Fat Hiker and Mr. Bio for the apple tree information!

Also, beautiful pics Bio! A student from the Physics Dept. was recently at Joshua Tree and said that the desert out that direction was also awash in colorful, blooming flora. If you are thinking of making another trip out to the desert within the next few weeks, we should make it a joint trip!


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## fat hiker (Apr 7, 2010)

biodieselman said:


> It's spring time & we've have a lot of rain in the desert regions of Southern California. .....
> The bright sun washes out the colors that photos can't do justice.



Fabulous photos, biodieselman.

If you find the bright sun washes out the colours, one solution that is still as useful in the digital age as it was in the age of film is a polarising filter - get a "circular" polarising filter to keep your digital camera happy. 

The other solution is to play with the white balance, to reduce the amount of blue and white in your photos. Each camera does this differently, so it takes a bit of figuring to get those colours to 'pop'.

With film, I'd also use a UV filter, but those don't make much difference with digital CCDs, IIRC.


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## Ho Ho Tai (Apr 24, 2010)

This article appeared in a concatenator service. I traced it back to what I believe it the original. I'm more-or-less a mathematician (retired) but my head was swimming after a few pages. Read it and post your interpretation. Should we stock up on gasoline and biodiesel, or Kool-Aid?

From The Intelligence Daily

The Imminent Crash Of The Oil Supply: What Is Going To Happen And How It Came To Pass That We Werent Forewarned

April 23, 2010

By Nicholas C. Arguimbau


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## fat hiker (Apr 25, 2010)

Ho Ho Tai said:


> This article appeared in a concatenator service. I traced it back to what I believe it the original. I'm more-or-less a mathematician (retired) but my head was swimming after a few pages. Read it and post your interpretation. Should we stock up on gasoline and biodiesel, or Kool-Aid?
> 
> From The Intelligence Daily
> 
> ...



It's good analysis of the military's report, but some basic economics and human psychology has been ignored too. Particularly that upward arching demand line on the top of the graph - there's a whole host of unchallenged assumptions in that line! A few quickies - if an item gets to be in short supply, its price goes up, and if the price of something goes up, then you either use less of it or find a substitute. This is as true of petroleum as anything else - true, for some functions, it's hard to substitute for oil, but if the 'price is right' it can be done. 

Electric cars instead of gas burning ones is an easy example, but so is diesel fuel made from natural gas (already being demonstrated), various biofuels (wood waste into alcohol, anyone?), better insulation to cope with rising heating costs (your house), even deployment of new technologies (extracting the tar sands takes a lot of energy, currently met by burning oil and natural gas - but all they need is heat, so using nuclear reactors for that is now being planned). While those curves looks nice and definitive, reality is a messy beast - the current economic recession has put off their day of reckoning by a few years, as it has both reduced oil demand and caused many folks to become more efficient all at once. I'd invest in energy conservation, for the sake of your budget, and then in both oil companies and in alternative energy, but choose those companies who are planning ahead...


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## Ho Ho Tai (Apr 29, 2010)

fat hiker said:


> It's good analysis of the military's report, but some basic economics and human psychology has been ignored too. Particularly that upward arching demand line on the top of the graph - there's a whole host of unchallenged assumptions in that line! A few quickies - if an item gets to be in short supply, its price goes up, and if the price of something goes up, then you either use less of it or find a substitute. This is as true of petroleum as anything else - true, for some functions, it's hard to substitute for oil, but if the 'price is right' it can be done.
> 
> Electric cars instead of gas burning ones is an easy example, but so is diesel fuel made from natural gas (already being demonstrated), various biofuels (wood waste into alcohol, anyone?), better insulation to cope with rising heating costs (your house), even deployment of new technologies (extracting the tar sands takes a lot of energy, currently met by burning oil and natural gas - but all they need is heat, so using nuclear reactors for that is now being planned). While those curves looks nice and definitive, reality is a messy beast - the current economic recession has put off their day of reckoning by a few years, as it has both reduced oil demand and caused many folks to become more efficient all at once. I'd invest in energy conservation, for the sake of your budget, and then in both oil companies and in alternative energy, but choose those companies who are planning ahead...



. . . and the sort of thing I'd much rather believe.

I received a rep message on that post and decided that a modified version would serve as a response here as well.

You said "I'm glad I'm old". Yeah - even older than my wife (by a year), but 20 years younger than me (next October.) I'm not worried about me, Mrs Ho Ho, or even my kids (in their 40s.) But here comes a whole bunch of grandkids. Will they live in a Mad Max / Road Warrior / Waterworld  dystopia? (No, I've never seen any of these, or the others in the list. Read a few sci-fi versions, long ago.)

But after I posted that, I got around to reading a portion of this SciAm article from Nov. 2009. You can get the first few paragraphs here or at this link. http://www.scientificamerican.com/ar...energy-by-2030

Who and what to believe? Pie in the sky, or mud pie in your face? I think I'll still keep a bit of Kool-Aid around.


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## Ernest Nagel (Apr 30, 2010)

Thoughts for food.

http://www.foreignpolicy.com/articles/2010/04/26/attention_whole_foods_shoppers?page=0,3

*Attention Whole Foods Shoppers*
Stop obsessing about arugula. Your "sustainable" mantra -- organic, local, and slow -- is no recipe for saving the world's hungry millions. 
BY ROBERT PAARLBERG | MAY/JUNE 2010

Not only is organic farming less friendly to the environment than assumed, but modern conventional farming is becoming significantly more sustainable. High-tech farming in rich countries today is far safer for the environment, per bushel of production, than it was in the 1960s, when Rachel Carson criticized the indiscriminate farm use of DDT in her environmental classic, Silent Spring. Thanks in part to Carson's devastating critique, that era's most damaging insecticides were banned and replaced by chemicals that could be applied in lower volume and were less persistent in the environment. Chemical use in American agriculture peaked soon thereafter, in 1973. This was a major victory for environmental advocacy.

And it was just the beginning of what has continued as a significant greening of modern farming in the United States. Soil erosion on farms dropped sharply in the 1970s with the introduction of "no-till" seed planting, an innovation that also reduced dependence on diesel fuel because fields no longer had to be plowed every spring. Farmers then began conserving water by moving to drip irrigation and by leveling their fields with lasers to minimize wasteful runoff. In the 1990s, GPS equipment was added to tractors, autosteering the machines in straighter paths and telling farmers exactly where they were in the field to within one square meter, allowing precise adjustments in chemical use. Infrared sensors were brought in to detect the greenness of the crop, telling a farmer exactly how much more (or less) nitrogen might be needed as the growing season went forward. To reduce wasteful nitrogen use, equipment was developed that can insert fertilizers into the ground at exactly the depth needed and in perfect rows, only where it will be taken up by the plant roots.

These "precision farming" techniques have significantly reduced the environmental footprint of modern agriculture relative to the quantity of food being produced. In 2008, the Organization for Economic Cooperation and Development published a review of the "environmental performance of agriculture" in the world's 30 most advanced industrial countries -- those with the most highly capitalized and science-intensive farming systems. The results showed that between 1990 and 2004, food production in these countries continued to increase (by 5 percent in volume), yet adverse environmental impacts were reduced in every category. The land area taken up by farming declined 4 percent, soil erosion from both wind and water fell, gross greenhouse gas emissions from farming declined 3 percent, and excessive nitrogen fertilizer use fell 17 percent. Biodiversity also improved, as increased numbers of crop varieties and livestock breeds came into use.

Seeding the Future

Africa faces a food crisis, but it's not because the continent's population is growing faster than its potential to produce food, as vintage Malthusians such as environmental advocate Lester Brown and advocacy organizations such as Population Action International would have it. Food production in Africa is vastly less than the region's known potential, and that is why so many millions are going hungry there. African farmers still use almost no fertilizer; only 4 percent of cropland has been improved with irrigation; and most of the continent's cropped area is not planted with seeds improved through scientific plant breeding, so cereal yields are only a fraction of what they could be. Africa is failing to keep up with population growth not because it has exhausted its potential, but instead because too little has been invested in reaching that potential.

One reason for this failure has been sharply diminished assistance from international donors. When agricultural modernization went out of fashion among elites in the developed world beginning in the 1980s, development assistance to farming in poor countries collapsed. Per capita food production in Africa was declining during the 1980s and 1990s and the number of hungry people on the continent was doubling, but the U.S. response was to withdraw development assistance and simply ship more food aid to Africa. Food aid doesn't help farmers become more productive -- and it can create long-term dependency. But in recent years, the dollar value of U.S. food aid to Africa has reached 20 times the dollar value of agricultural development assistance.

The alternative is right in front of us. Foreign assistance to support agricultural improvements has a strong record of success, when undertaken with purpose. In the 1960s, international assistance from the Rockefeller Foundation, the Ford Foundation, and donor governments led by the United States made Asia's original Green Revolution possible. U.S. assistance to India provided critical help in improving agricultural education, launching a successful agricultural extension service, and funding advanced degrees for Indian agricultural specialists at universities in the United States. The U.S. Agency for International Development, with the World Bank, helped finance fertilizer plants and infrastructure projects, including rural roads and irrigation. India could not have done this on its own -- the country was on the brink of famine at the time and dangerously dependent on food aid. But instead of suffering a famine in 1975, as some naysayers had predicted, India that year celebrated a final and permanent end to its need for food aid.

Foreign assistance to farming has been a high-payoff investment everywhere, including Africa. The World Bank has documented average rates of return on investments in agricultural research in Africa of 35 percent a year, accompanied by significant reductions in poverty. Some research investments in African agriculture have brought rates of return estimated at 68 percent. Blind to these realities, the United States cut its assistance to agricultural research in Africa 77 percent between 1980 and 2006.

When it comes to Africa's growing hunger, governments in rich countries face a stark choice: They can decide to support a steady new infusion of financial and technical assistance to help local governments and farmers become more productive, or they can take a "worry later" approach and be forced to address hunger problems with increasingly expensive shipments of food aid. Development skeptics and farm modernization critics keep pushing us toward this unappealing second path. It's time for leaders with vision and political courage to push back.

GEORGES GOBET/AFP/Getty Images


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## biodieselman (May 10, 2010)

Spring is here, the soil is warming & the nights are getting warm. The race is on & soon the garden will soon be yielding summer's abundance.


The strawberries are producing a few berries . Sequoia strawberries bear heaviest in late spring & early summer.




The Better Boy tomatoes are already setting fruit. We also have planted Big Beef, Sweet 100, Red Lightening, Yellow Pear, Striped German, Japanese Black Trifele & a Sweet Seedless.








You may see last years Jalapeno in the middle row that has survived winter on the support pole that is leaning over. You can't see them but we have two more variety of peeper seedlings patiently waiting for hot weather. Were getting Romain lettuce which is tucked under the bougainvillea & escaped blackberries, to the right of the Asian pear tree. 




Soon we'll have zucchini & we also have two other varieties behind these. Last year Ris sprouted an Indian Blanket, (first year this perennial has flowered), & to its right a zinnia.







We should have a heavy grape yield this year. Last we had a lost of overcast weather & the grapes got attacked by powdery mildew. This year I sprayed them with sulfur & they look great! I weave the vines through the lattice to create shade & privacy for a little sitting room out front.









We planted several new fruit trees last year & I think we'll soon be eating nectarines.


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## biodieselman (May 10, 2010)

Cold weather got two of our tomatillo but one survived & is flowering. The two replacement seedlings are in front.






Our first corn is now in the ground! Ris sprouted the seeds in our little "greenhouse". I've got them planted with little plastic cups to protect them from the slugs & snails, which love to hide in the pine straw mulch which I had removed to lightly till the soil. I poured a little extra water in the "worm ranches" to make "worm tea". The "tea" is strong stuff & I dilute it 1/4 strength with water in the watering can for a strong start. Corn is a grass which requires lots of nitrogen. We succession plant small crops of corn about every three weeks until late summer. The small plants in the bed to the right are cucumbers which are also waiting for warm weather. Ris also has another bed of pickling cukes.









Here's a little of Ris's herb garden & a young apple tree with about a dozen fruit.








The blackberries have escaped their bed & have spread out into the cul-de-sac. We're going to have a huge crop of blackberries soon. Look how Ris's climbing roses & bougainvillea cover the wall & have grown up into the tree branches with the blackberries to the left.








Here's the view from our patio. We have California natives planted around the fruit trees. My favorite is the fried egg poppy. The only water these natives get is from the fruit trees. Oh yeah, the pool is getting warm enough for a swim after a long day working in the sun.









The California pink primrose on the right & the Mexican Sage behind them are also California natives which don't get watered. On the left is a Mediterranean lavender.


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## Power_Metal_Kitsune (May 17, 2010)

Here are our attempts at being green:

1. We reuse store bags as bathroom garbage bags.

2. We reuse gift bags.

3. We freecycle things.

4. We buy used when we can.

5. We use old food cans and tubs as fat cans.

6. We keep clothes until they fall apart, and then use them as cleaning cloths.

7. We give old magazines to my transplant center.

8. We don't buy things we won't use.

9. We bring our own bags to the grocery store.

10. We don't watch TV just to have it on.

11. We use public transit.

12. If we get extra condiments at restaurants, we take them home and use them.

13. Same with extra napkins

14. We stuff garbage bags to mega capacity before tossing trash.

15. We save unused hospital and hotel toiletries and give them to homeless shelters.

16. We only wash full clothing loads on cold only.

17. We use toiletries until they are gone.

18. We don't send paper mail unless necessary.

19. We don't send out holiday cards.

20. We don't use wrapping paper.

21. We use samples when we recieve them, and if we can't, we pass them on.

22. We try to keep our electric use to a minimum.

23. We quit smoking, so less air pollution.

24. We don't drink soda,hence less cans and bottles.

25. We give away broken items that we cannot fix, but maybe someone else can.

26. We give unused medical supplies to my transplant center.

27. We don't use plastic disposables.

28. We swap unneeded things for things we will use.

29. We don't use lighting during the day.

30. We sew our clothing, instead of tossing it when it rips.


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## Ernest Nagel (Jun 10, 2010)

Amazingly cool! :shocked:

http://www.popsci.com/cars/article/...e1pc-worlds-most-advanced-electric-motorcycle


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## biodieselman (Jun 13, 2010)

Ernest Nagel said:


> Amazingly cool! :shocked:
> 
> http://www.popsci.com/cars/article/...e1pc-worlds-most-advanced-electric-motorcycle



Damn, that's what you would call a "Widow Maker! The bike is missing something... a wheelie-bar. The instantaneous torque of an electric motor, I'm sure it's not a single phase household motor, would loop this bike in a split second if the rider isn't careful rolling on the the throttle.




Have you seen the "Killacycle" Ernest? It's almost as fast as a drag-bike but runs out of RPM on the top-end. It would take a heavy, tough transmission to handle the torque off the line but I believe the designer is knocking on the door to beat a top fuel drag bike.




​
Alternative fuel vehicles are just around the corner and they will be fun to drive.


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## Ho Ho Tai (Jun 14, 2010)

biodieselman said:


> Damn, that's what you would call a "Widow Maker! The bike is missing something... a wheelie-bar. The instantaneous torque of an electric motor, I'm sure it's not a single phase household motor, would loop this bike in a split second if the rider isn't careful rolling on the the throttle.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



When you do some forward projections and note the need for minerals for high tech batteries, then combine that with this article, world events start to come together. Mineral wealth, high tech hijinx, and Big Money - what a witch's brew! Gold, long the twinkle in the eyes of the greedy, will be mere overburden.


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## biodieselman (Jun 21, 2010)

Ernest Nagel said:


> Amazingly cool! :shocked: ...





Ho Ho Tai said:


> When you do some forward projections and note the need for minerals for high tech batteries, then combine that with this article, world events start to come together. Mineral wealth, high tech hijinx, and Big Money - what a witch's brew! Gold, long the twinkle in the eyes of the greedy, will be mere overburden.



This minerals survey was completed on 2007. Odd that the findings are only now being released. OK, OK, I know... this isn't Hyde Park.

I'm not sure how I feel about battery powered vehicles. I see Nissan advertising that the Leaf is emissions free but I know better than to believe that 'green-washing' stuff. Sure would like to get some of that BS for my garden. 

Ernest, Ho Ho, what do you guys think about battery powered cars? I'm from Tennessee & I hate to see entire mountain tops removed & the valley water-shed filled with the overburden to access coal to generate power to charge all of those batteries. I read the mining is destructive to the environment, the mineral processing is a polluting industry & they need to be replaced after 5-7 years. Have either of you seen studies on the total life cycle pollution of electric vehicles? Are we really cleaning up pollution?

Ernest, I keep forgetting to post this article on biochar.


> Biochar technology company Dynamotive Energy Systems Corp. and environmental research company BlueLeaf Inc. have completed the second round of field trials testing various effects of commercial-scale plantings of wood waste-derived biochar.
> 
> For the past two years, the companies have investigated the effects of Dyanamotive’s CQuest Biochar on certain basic physicochemical and biological soil and plant parameters, as well as the ability of biochar to retain moisture in the soil, the influence of biochar on crop and biomass yields, the influence of biochar on soil respiration, and the effects of a handling and application method of biochar on the soil at commercial farming test plots in Québec, Canada.
> 
> ...


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## Ernest Nagel (Jun 21, 2010)

And this years winner for most shameless, self-serving and deceitful exploitation of a tragedy:
http://www.slate.com/id/2256461/ :doh:

*The Ethanol TrapThe oil blowout will mean more subsidies for the corn-fuel industry. That's bad news for consumers.*
By Robert BrycePosted Thursday, June 10, 2010, at 12:14 PM ET


Corn.Corn-ethanol producers are lobbying for a bailoutThe most disgusting aspect of the blowout in the Gulf of Mexico isn't the video images of oil-soaked birds or the incessant blather from pundits about what BP or the Obama administration should be doing to stem the flow of oil. Instead, it's the ugly spectacle of the corn-ethanol scammers doing all they can to capitalize on the disaster so that they can justify an expansion of the longest-running robbery of taxpayers in U.S. history.

Listen to Matt Hartwig, communications director for the Renewable Fuels Association, an ethanol industry lobby group: "The Gulf of Mexico disaster serves as a stark and unfortunate reminder of the need for domestically-produced renewable biofuels." Or look at an advertisement that was recently placed in a Washington, D.C., Metro station: "No beaches have been closed due to ETHANOL spills.  America's CLEAN fuel." That gem was paid for by Growth Energy, another ethanol industry lobby group.

The blowout of BP's Macondo well has given the corn-ethanol industry yet another opportunity to push its fuel adulterant on the American consumer. And unfortunately, the Obama administration appears ready and willing to foist yet more of the corrosive, environmentally destructive, low-heat-energy fuel on motorists.
Advertisement

Why does the ethanol business need federal help? The answer is so disheartening that after five years of reporting on the corn-ethanol scam, I find it difficult to type, but here goes: The corn-ethanol industry needs to be bailed out by taxpayers because the industry was given too much in the way of subsidies and mandates. And now the only way to solve that problem iswhat else?more subsidies and mandates. The BP mess provides the industry with the opening it needs to win those subsidies from the federal government.

In its 2005 energy bill, Congress dramatically increased the mandates (and subsidies) for corn ethanol. That resulted in a surge of new construction. Led by German financial giant WestLB AG, banks poured billions of dollars into new distilleries, which quickly created an ethanol bubble that mirrored the U.S. real estate bubble. Over the past five years, U.S. ethanol production capacity has more than tripled and now stands at more than 13 billion gallons per year. But that's far more capacity than the U.S. motor fuel market can absorb. In March, nearly 1 billion gallons of ethanol production capacity was sitting idle. And yet, according to the Renewable Fuels Association, the industry has about 1.4 billion gallons of additional distilling capacity under construction.

The bankruptcy court is the best place to comprehend the oversupply of ethanol. Over the past 18 months or so, bankruptcy casualties have included VeraSun, the second-largest producer in the United States; Pacific Ethanol; Aventine Renewable Energy; and others.

In industry parlance, the corn-ethanol sector is facing a head-on collision with the "blend wall." Ethanol producers depend on gasoline sales because their product must be mixed with conventional fuel. But thanks to the recession and the end of Americans' love affair with large SUVs, U.S. gasoline demand is flat or declining. That has left a smaller pool of gasoline to absorb all the alcohol the ethanol industry is producing. Or as Bob Dinneen, the president of the Renewable Fuels Association, has put it, "[W]e have lots of gallons of ethanol chasing too few gallons of gasoline."

Now the industry is counting on a president beleaguered by the made-for-TV crisis in the Gulf of Mexico to help it out. And he appears ready to do just that. On April 28, six days after the Deepwater Horizon rig sank, President Obama visited an ethanol plant in Missouri and declared that "there shouldn't be any doubt that renewable, homegrown fuels are a key part of our strategy for a clean-energy future." Obama also said, "I didn't just discover the merits of biofuels like ethanol when I first hopped on the campaign bus."

The strongest indication that an ethanol bailout is imminent came last Friday when Agriculture Secretary Tom Vilsack (former governor of Iowa, the nation's biggest ethanol-producing state) said, "I'm very confident that we're going to see an increase in the blend rate."

The "blend rate" refers to the federal rule that limits ethanol blends to no more than 10 percent for standard automobiles. Commonly known as "E10," the fuel contains 90 percent gasoline and 10 percent alcohol. The Obama administration bailout, which would come via approval from the EPA, will likely allow gasoline retailers to blend up to 15 percent ethanol into U.S. gasoline supplies.

And that's where the corn-ethanol mess becomes truly outrageous and depressing. The United States now has about 250 million motor vehicles. Of that number, only about 7.5 million are designed to burn gasoline containing more than 10 percent ethanol. And there is evidence that even 10 percent ethanol may be too much for the other 242.5 million. Last year, Toyota recalled more than 200,000 Lexus vehicles because of internal component corrosion that was caused by ethanol-blended fuel.

In addition to problems with their cars, consumers may soon find that more ethanol in their gasoline will result in the fouling of smaller engines. The Outdoor Power Equipment Institute, which represents companies that make lawnmowers, snowblowers, chainsaws, and the like, opposes the bailout of the ethanol industry. It says that increasing the amount of ethanol in gasoline "could damage millions of forestry, lawn and garden, and other small engine products currently housed in consumers' garages."

An increase in the ethanol blend rate is opposed by one of the oddest coalitions in modern American history. Last year, more than 50 groupsincluding the Sierra Club, National Petrochemical and Refiners Association, Competitive Enterprise Institute, Grocery Manufacturers Association, Friends of the Earth, National Chicken Council, and the Association of International Automobile Manufacturerssigned a letter that was sent to Vilsack, EPA administrator Lisa Jackson, Energy Secretary Steven Chu, and Obama's energy advisor, Carol Browner. The coalition members said that they oppose "any administrative or legislative efforts to increase the current cap on the amount of ethanol permitted to be blended into gasoline" until "comprehensive testing programs" have been done.

The damage caused by increasing use of ethanol won't be limited to ruined boats, snowblowers, weed whackers, and lawnmowers. The EPA itself has admitted that increased use of ethanol in gasoline will result in worse air quality. You read that correctly: The agency in charge of protecting the environment in America concluded in April 2007 that total emissions of key air pollutants such as volatile organic compounds and nitrogen oxides will increase because of expanded use of ethanol. (Read the key EPA document here.)

Yes, it's madness. And none of this even considers the effect that the ethanol rip-off is having on food supplies. Earlier this year, the Earth Policy Institute estimated that in 2009, the U.S. ethanol industry consumed 107 million tons of grain, or about 25 percent of total domestic grain production. That amount of grain, said the Institute, "was enough to feed 330 million people for one year at average world consumption levels."

BP's disaster in the Gulf of Mexico will force the offshore oil and gas industry to dramatically improve its safety procedures. That's a good thing. But if it only serves to strengthen the corn-ethanol industry, it will be a squandered opportunity, and another tragedy for the nation.


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## Ernest Nagel (Jun 21, 2010)

biodieselman said:


> This minerals survey was completed on 2007. Odd that the findings are only now being released. OK, OK, I know... this isn't Hyde Park.
> 
> I'm not sure how I feel about battery powered vehicles. I see Nissan advertising that the Leaf is emissions free but I know better than to believe that 'green-washing' stuff. Sure would like to get some of that BS for my garden.
> 
> ...



Bio, there's an excellent article in July's Scientific American titled "Plug-in Hybrids, Their Dirty Secret". The gist of it, seems to me, is whatever minor eco-advantage and economy all-electrics offer is very contingent on regional energy sources. 

"In six regions heavy contributions from coal mean that plug-in cars will emit at least as much in the way of greenhouse gases as would ordinary hybrids." p. 54 Lots more to give pause re these high-dollar golf carts.

Sorry I couldn't find a link.

Thanks for the bio-char info, btw.


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## NurseVicki (Jun 30, 2010)

missaf said:


> I do have questions about how to start container gardening. I live in an apartment with a patio, and have shade just about 50% of the day. I can't invest a whole heap of money into container vegetable gardening, but it would be nice to know what containers can be home made, if I can grow in the winter, and what best would grow in the conditions I have.



I also have a small patio which is about half sun, half shade ! I am in Texas . This year I am growing okra, climbing spinach, patio tomato , Swiss chard, broccoli , bell and banana peppers! and lots of herbs and of course some flowers! I love to see what comes up and keep them all alive is very much my goal! I love being able to eat a few fresh veggies from my garden I wish I had a bigger plot and being in an apt i am always looking for ways to grow more!


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## annetang (Jul 5, 2010)

I like the idea of living green. 
But it seems that we are still making little significant efforts comparing with the damage we created.
Living green is a kind of life style or attitude, not a promotion slogan. So, action is urgently needed!


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## HottiMegan (Jul 13, 2010)

I just watched this video of how a couple lived for a year virtually trash free. Pretty cool. Makes my recycling efforts look bad!
http://news.yahoo.com/video/portlan...e-s-experiment-trash-free-for-a-year-20840219


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## NurseVicki (Jul 24, 2010)

HottiMegan said:


> I just watched this video of how a couple lived for a year virtually trash free. Pretty cool. Makes my recycling efforts look bad!
> http://news.yahoo.com/video/portlan...e-s-experiment-trash-free-for-a-year-20840219


 dont feel bad we all have a larger foot print them we would like to!


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## biodieselman (Aug 6, 2010)

It's long past due for a garden update. This was a great year for the garden. No extremely hot & dry weather, & minimal insect pests.

This is the first full year for our nectarine tree & it produced early & heavy!

The blackberries have escaped & were very sweet, fresh & fully ripe.




Ris is showing off with her blackberry cobbler that *I* got up at 5:30am to pick. She is seen here pulling the seedlings out of our starter trays that she had seeded earlier. I think she secretly enjoys telling me where to stick them.




Here's Ris slaving away over a hot stove, canning the excess blackberries the following weekend. I'm an early riser & while I let her sleep in for the weekend I picked a ton of berries. I swear I heard the birds squawking at me before sunrise to go back inside, imploring me to leave "_our_ blackberries" alone.




A few weeks later, the beginnings of the "summer excess" can be seen. The corn has silk, the tomatoes are threatening to weigh down their wire fencing, & the pole beans are waiting to overwhelm us with their heavy bounty.




This was also a good year for the cucumbers. Ris's pickling cucumbers are hiding behind the Swiss chard. She also seeded some dill, seen to the left of the chard; she used it to put up some delicious refrigerator pickles. Right now she is currently making dill pickles using the old-fashioned fermenting process.




We were pleasantly surprised to see so many apples on our year-old tree. I haven't done it yet, but I'm going to use uni-strut & wire so I can espalier the apple tree over the block wall. You can also see the peach tree full of fruit to the left. I hack it back every year trying to keep it to a "small" size.




There's nothing like the fragrance of a sun-warmed vine- ripe tomato. Ris seeded an heirloom variety called German Striped which is a yellow-&-red beefsteak type. In her right hand, which is too dark to see, is another heirloom called Japanese Black Trifele. It's a dark purple tomato with green shoulders. Both tomatoes were an experiment this year, and both did extremely well & are absolutely delicious. The Japanese Black is also a heavy producer.





Here's a better view of some of the seven varieties of tomatoes we grew this year.




There's nothing quite like fresh vine-ripe grapes. Truly fruit of the gods.




Well, Ris has finished seeding more starter cells & it's time for me to put them in the little greenhouse to the left. There are no photos of me as I'm covered with mud & dirt. Ris gets all the glory, I get all the dirty work. (picture a smiley emoticon here)
Notice the large zucchini leaves in the background & the Asian pear tree to the far right. Asian pears ripen late fall. We selected our trees to bear at different times of the year to spread out the harvest.



This weekend we'll be, or I should say "I", will be picking the last of the peaches and doing the menial kitchen work prepping the peaches for Ris to work her magic making her peach jam. Ris may get the credit, but I'm the one who will enjoy the fully ripe produce that we've preserved for the winter.


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## Ernest Nagel (Aug 7, 2010)

Pretty encouraging development re solar. 

http://www.kurzweilai.net/new-solar...paign=c7879a921c-UA-946742-1&utm_medium=email


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## crayola box (Aug 10, 2010)

That garden, wow!


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## Ernest Nagel (Aug 13, 2010)

Another interesting solar development. http://www.physorg.com/news200890025.html

One thing I worry about as solar attains greater efficiency though is how it will be used to deal with developing water shortages. If you can run a condenser to "efficiently" extract water from atmospheric humidity how much can you remove before it begins to influence weather cycles? I know, it's a long ways down the road before this is even potentially an issue but one of the ways we got in the situation we're in is by neglecting to consider the long range implications of emerging technologies.


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## biodieselman (Aug 13, 2010)

Ernest Nagel said:


> ... One thing I worry about as solar attains greater efficiency though is how it will be used to deal with developing water shortages. If you can run a condenser to "efficiently" extract water from atmospheric humidity how much can you remove before it begins to influence weather cycles? ...



We have already changed the weather around cities with our use of cooling towers for mechanical air conditioning & industrial process cooling.




The American Society of Heating, Refrigerating and Air-Conditioning Engineers, or ASHRAE, has collected detailed weather data from cities around the world for dacades & publishes them in the_ "ASHRAE Handbook Fundamentals"_. The topics covered rotate every four years as technology changes. The Handbook titles are Refrigeration, HVAC Applications, HVAC Systems and Equipment & Fundamentals.

We use water in large AC systems for large buildings & industrial applications. We see water as a "common" substance but water is a *very* unusual molecule. It takes 970 BTUs to change water to vapor & we take advantage of water's unusually large Heat of Vaporization in cooling towers. Massive quantities of heat from a large building or industrial process can be rejected to the atmosphere with a small cooling tower. You may have noticed large plumes of "steam" in the distance on a cool morning rising from a cooling tower. 

Our use of cooling towers pumps *tons* of water vapor into the atmosphere every day. Since cooling towers are also rust factories, they have a life of about 15 years. The efficiencies of a cooling tower depends upon atmospheric conditions, especially the amount of humidity in the atmosphere.

We have measurably increased the average humidity in the atmosphere surrounding our cities that when cooling towers require replacement, we must select larger & larger cooling towers due to the fact that increased atmospheric humidity reduces the evaporation rate, thus the efficiency of cooling towers.

I know, I know. Too much information.

Ernest, I appreciate the updates on photovoltaic technology. Ris & I have been wanting to install a photovoltaic system on our home for years now but the costs are still too high for us. We dumped Big Oil at the gas stations by me home-brewing biodiesel. We try to grow as many vegetables & fruits as our small yard allows. But we also want to get off the electrical grid.


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## biodieselman (Aug 13, 2010)

Too late to edit the above post; I meant to say it takes 970 BTUs to change *one pound* of water to vapor.


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## BBW_Bunny (Aug 22, 2010)

Well, let's see.. living green.

I buy a lot of local produce. There's a farm not to far from us and I buy everything I can from them. I use re-usable bags instead of plastic. I've recycled everything possible for the past 25+ years. We don't do a lot of driving. I work from home, so no commute = less gas used. I have my own garden where I grow beans, tomatoes, cucumbers, green and jalapeno peppers. I scaled it back from last year because it was more than we could eat. In the winter I keep the heat set to about 60 degrees and we don't use the ac in the summer. Oh.. when I shower, I get wet, turn the water off, soap up and then turn it back on to rinse.. 

I think that's about it. lol


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## Ernest Nagel (Sep 10, 2010)

Not exactly back-to-basics but promising. Living "off the grid" gets a little more feasible every year and not just for the survivalists and tree-huggers.

http://www.kurzweilai.net/future-fo...paign=2d2dc39a88-UA-946742-1&utm_medium=email


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## biodieselman (Sep 14, 2010)

Ernest Nagel said:


> Not exactly back-to-basics but promising. Living "off the grid" gets a little more feasible every year and not just for the survivalists and tree-huggers. ...



I recently watched a program on a large commercial hydroponics farm growing multicolored bell peppers on the History Channel or the Science Channel, I don't recall which. It was a huge conditioned greenhouse with mechanized lifts that traveled between the crop rows. They could tend, monitor & harvest with ease. There was no soil & nearly no pests which was controlled with beneficial insects. The technology required was amazing. 

Near my home in LA, several homes were converted into "cash crop" farms utilizing modern hydroponics along with equally elaborate lighting & air filtration systems attempting to control escaping odors. Neighbors aren't stupid. They noticed the foil covered windows with bright light managing to escape along with the distinct odor of a plant with leaves of seven.




I read about them in the police blotter section of the newspaper.


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## biodieselman (Sep 14, 2010)

Our garden is a state of change. The summer crops are winding down yet it's a gamble starting up the winter garden. It all depends on the fickle Southern California weather.

You can see that the cucumbers are spent but the tomato vines are 9' high & yielding very heavy crops this year. Ris doesn't like dried tomatoes & if work picks up we plan on purchasing a pressure canner & a dehydrator for next year's excess.




We squeezed in a couple more zucchini plants before the weather turns too cold at night. The two black cubes are composters which have swallowed up an amazing volume of plant material to fertilize next spring's plantings. 




I'm also a "slum lord" with three 5 story worm "condos". Ris grinds up all kitchen waste & trimmings & an occasional banana or two. They also require "brown" material for the carbon content. Torn up La Times is perfect when there are no brown leaves. These bins got a thick layer of newspaper two weeks ago & it is almost gone! Leaves from the trees & grapes are starting to fall & they will be worm food. 





My beautiful wife just finished starting our first broccoli of the fall. Bubbles is dutifully on watch to keep the cats from pooping in our garden.  (insert winky emoticon)




Here are the cells Ris planted the broccoli seeds in being kept warm at night in our tiny greenhouse.




This is the third & last planting of sweet corn for this year. The greenbeans are spent & I'm in the process of stripping all of the dried beans for Ris to shell & store. The tomatoes are on an 8' high fence & they are reaching at least one foot beyond the 8'. This has been an excellent year for tomatoes.




Carrot seeds are tiny & are planted only 1/4" to 1/2" deep. Because they are so difficult to see to broadcast evenly, I mix them with a large volume of builders sand, stirring the seeds into the sand. I can now see how evenly they are planted. Early small carrots are pulled to give the remaining "shoulder" room to grow. If the weather cooperates, I'll have a miniature redwood forest of carrots before winter. They will keep perfectly all winter in the soil until pulled. I'm showing half of the bed planted to give you an idea of what I'm doing before I finish.




These fruits are called jujube or Chinese dates. They turn mahogany colored when they are ripe. Chinese also eat them as a dried "date" but I prefer them just before they start to dry up. They have a very intense dried apple flavor. They are a medicinal fruit with all sorts of beneficial properties. I gotta say they do soothe an upset stomach. They tend to bear alternate heavy crops & last year was the heavy crop. But the tree is still young.




We carefully selected all of our trees to bear consecutive yields. The prickly pear cactus is nearing ripeness. We make prickly pear sorbet which is so sweet, no sugar is required. We basically just freeze the juice for sorbet. Ris is planning of canning prickly pear jelly. Oh!!! I can already feel those tiny thorns!!! But very exotic, very good!!!

We purchased a sickly Meyer lemon tree too early in the spring. The nurseryman guaranteed the tree would recover after being planted but it almost died. I managed to nurse it back to health & we're hoping for lots of lemons next year.

Don't pay attention to my biodiesel drums & firewood pile alongside the house.




Gophers killed our fig tree & I had to replant another tree. I don't have enough images to show the wire basket I fashioned to protect the roots. The Kadota variety bears two crops each year with the second crop being smaller in yield. A few are just ripening with a few more to come. Fig trees grow very fast & soon this will become a huge tree with more figs than we can possibly eat out of hand. I think Ris is going to need lots of help trying to can all of the figs. Figs are food of the gods & I'm puzzled why Americans don't enjoy them more other than yucky fig newtons.


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## trucrimsongold (Sep 15, 2010)

I could go on and on and cite facts related to the bogus made up science that keep carpet baggers like Al Gore in billionaire status and all but I have way to many real important things to do like cut my grass every week because of the record amounts of both sun light and rain we get. I also have to take apart my carburetor on my ATV because of that stupid corn crap gas ethanol that the government has forced into our gas stations because it's greener, gimme a break, how is junking auto engines with that crap good for the environment. I'll take hi-test jet fuel blasting hi-octane gas over this green feel good ethanol and doubling our junkyards any day.


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## SocialbFly (Sep 24, 2010)

Bio and Ris, your garden was amazing this year...next year, i hope to put a couple of raised beds in my back yard, the sun is morning, and shaded afternoon...i may have to put a bed on the side of my house for tomatoes..better sun...

i have missed visiting...i know why you have extra produce, lol...i wasnt there spiriting it away...hugs and love to you both...well, all three of you...i miss you guys...


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## Ho Ho Tai (Dec 24, 2010)

I'm forever trying to chomp my way through back copies of various magazines, including Scientific American. Thus, I just read this brief article, initially published in Jan. 28, 2010 Nature. I haven't seen it posted at Dimensions, though I may have missed it. The cute thing about this approach (differing from biodiesel from algae) is that cellulose is converted directly to biodiesel, via GM e. coli. The BD floats to the surface and is easily harvested.

SciAm April 2010 Biofuel from bacteria

Biofuel from Bacteria

E. coli turned into cellulose-chomping biodiesel refineries

By David Biello | March 1, 2010 |


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## biodieselman (Feb 13, 2011)

SocialbFly said:


> Bio and Ris, your garden was amazing this year...next year, i hope to put a couple of raised beds in my back yard, the sun is morning, and shaded afternoon...i may have to put a bed on the side of my house for tomatoes..better sun... ...



As you well know, raised beds have so many advantages. Easy on the back, assures good drainage, increased soil temperatures for extending the growing season, earlier & later crops. Concentrates water & fertilizer where it's needed most.



SocialbFly said:


> ... i have missed visiting...i know why you have extra produce, ...i wasnt there spiriting it away...hugs and love to you both...well, all three of you...i miss you guys...



We're looking forward to your visit next week.



I know the rest of you guys don't want to hear it, but it's already spring in Los Angeles. These photos were taken a month ago in mid January.




This is the end of our winter garden. Navel oranges sweeten up t his time of year. We also have lemons & limes. The carrots are starting to size up & we should use them up before the lengthening day light & warmer temps force them to go to seed. 




The navel orange crop was very heavy this year & during a strong wind storm a large branch broke. I'll be able to save the tree.




Here's some of the last broccoli planting.




We didn't get a killing frost this year & the tomatoes still produce a smattering of tomatoes. I stopped pruning the vines towards the end of fall & let them grow wild. The excess growth protects the vines underneath from any light frost, allowing the few that got pollinated to ripen on the vine. 









You might be able to see some Yellow Pears, Sweet 100s & a Black Japanese Trifele.

Here's a Red Lightening. It's a small tomato with yellow & red striped flesh.




With the warmer weather, these tomatoes are starting to slowly ripen. They don't compare to summer tomatoes but they are better than anything the store offers.




Here's a bed of carrots. You look for the widest shoulders to harvest which makes room for the remainder.




It's kind of hard to see due to the "sun storm" when this photo was taken but the nectarine is blossoming.




I covered the front yard with a thick layer of newspaper & bark mulch to kill the lawn for water conservation but the paper whites punched right through. You know it's spring time when the narcissus flower.


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## Tracyarts (Feb 20, 2011)

This year, the amount of space I have for gardening in my back yard doubled because the shed that was taking up all of the other sunny corner got moved. I do container gardening mostly because that's just what's easiest for me to physically manage. 

I'm adding a lot of new stuff now that it's spring here. A second Meyer lemon tree in the ground, and a dwarf satsuma tree in a large pot. Two very large rectangular containers against the back fence, with lattice attached to the fence behind them, so I can plant cucumbers at the back and zucchini at the front of those containers. Assorted peppers in large pots too, a few different kinds of tomatoes in five gallon buckets, and the usual herbs I like to cook with in various shapes and sizes of pots. I just planted some carrot seeds in a few large deep pots, will see if they come up in the next couple weeks. And some lavender and bee balm in larger pots too, to attract bees and butterflies into the garden. 

That's pretty much all I can fit in the sunny spaces. I need to research what I can grow in the areas that only get a few hours of sun every day. It's tough because I live in a hot and humid climate and by the end of May it's just too hot for some things. Especially tomatoes. This year, I went with faster maturing varieties and am getting them in their buckets today. If we get a late freeze, we can cart them onto the patio and cover them. I eventually want to expand my kitchen garden some into the front yard, because aside from a rose bed in front of the house, there is no landscaping whatsoever. But, that will be a project for next year. 

Tracy


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## Ho Ho Tai (Feb 28, 2011)

News from our very own EverCat. BDMan, why don'tcha come up for a visit?


The One-Stop Shop Biodiesel Plant

The One-Stop Shop Biodiesel Plant
1 Comment Posted by Joanna Schroeder  February 16th, 2011

With the explosive growth expected in the biodiesel industry this year, many investors are looking to update their technologies as they bring their biodiesel plants online. Those looking for a one-stop shop for an entire biodiesel plant should look at two seemingly unlikely partners: McGyan Biodiesel and Biodiesel Analytical Solutions (BAS).

There is much talk in the biodiesel industry that the days of the single feedstock producer are nearing an end. The new emerging technology  multiple feedstock technologies. One such technology is the McGyan technology, a multi-feedstock technology that was first proven out in Ever Cat Fuels, a biodiesel producer located in Isanti, Minn. The plant went online in November of 2009 and was one of only two biodiesel plants that stayed in production last year.

(story continues at link)


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## biodieselman (Mar 17, 2011)

We order bioplastic utensils for camping & parties but the plastic turns too soft to use in hot foods. The bioplastics we used before went into the trash where it would decompose in landfills. This discovery is a big deal because it can be recycled in existing recycling programs.







> It's an environmental as well as a marketing achievement: using 100% agricultural waste to make a top-quality plastic bottle that can then be placed back in the existing recycling system.
> 
> "It's closing the loop," said Allen Hershkowitz, .... "It's the beginning of the end for petroleum-based plastic bottles." ...
> 
> ...


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## budbunny (Apr 11, 2011)

I am ALLLLL about living Green !!! I firmly believe that we should reuse and recycle... Our resources aren't going to live on forever...we have to be MacGyver~ish and find new ways of being self-sustainable... I tried growing basil instead of having to buy it...it grew mold...but hey, that's a lesson for next time. I try to be as self-sustaining as possible...but I can't slaughter my own organic cows or fish whenever meat tempts my palate lol =)


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## Tracyarts (Apr 14, 2011)

This is what we've managed to do for this season with our backyard container garden. We got an early start here, so vegetables are starting to flower and set fruits already. 






In the blue storage containers we have zucchini and eggplant. In the olive green containers behind them against the fence, there are cucumbers growing up the lattice and some smaller variety bush bean plants too. 






On the other side of the yard, I have various tomato plants in five gallon buckets. 






Catty-corner from the tomatoes are pots of assorted peppers along with some cilantro and dill.






Some of the herbs I'm growing this year, thyme, oregano, and mint. I also have basil, Thai basil, catnip, two kinds of chives, rosemary, lemon balm, bee balm, and lavender. 






And a bunch of baby tomatoes, these are "Sweet 100" cherry tomatoes I believe. 

Tracy


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## fat hiker (Apr 14, 2011)

Nice garden!

How do the Sweet 100s do for you? How big are the tomatoes? We're grown 'Santa' grape tomatoes the last four years with good success (the cool damp summer they didn't ripen, but neither did any other tomatoes) but they sprawl something awful, even with stakes and posts. Do Sweet 100s sprawl much?


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## Tracyarts (Apr 15, 2011)

This is the first season I have grown the sweet 100's. I'm not sure exactly how big the tomatoes will get as the babies are still growing, but I'm guessing about an inch across like most cherry tomatoes. They are forming in clusters, like grapes, so the ones at the back of the clusters are almost as big as they'll get and the very tips of the clusters still have unopened flowers. And they certainly are sprawling. I had the buckets too close together and the four sweet 100's plants literally twined together and even in with other plants. I had a hard time separating them to give them some more room. They've outgrown the cages already and I have had to start tying them to the fence to keep them from flopping over and breaking off. They're growing more like vines than bushes. Last year I grew mostly heirloom varieties and none of them got as tall as these sweet 100's.

Tracy


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## Ernest Nagel (Apr 23, 2011)

A very worthwhile article I hope you will all consider sharing.

http://www.scientificamerican.com/article.cfm?id=pogue-use-it-better-unload-your-old-gadgets

*Use It Better: How to Unload Your Old Gadgets*

Places that will recycle your obsolete electronicsand they might even pay you for it

By David Pogue | April 22, 2011 | 10


The beautiful thing about disposing of your old electronics is that doing the right thing gives you more than a rosy feeling; it can actually pay you. The trick is to hand off your own gear immediately, while it still has some value.

For example, suppose you had a 32-gigabyte AT&T iPhone at the time the Verizon iPhone 4 came out. You could have sold it to online buy-back site Gazelle.com for $430, which would have easily covered the AT&T fee for terminating your contract early. Similarly, buyback sites NextWorth and ReCellular.com were offering $155 for a year-old iPhone 3GS, or $145 for a working BlackBerry Bold 9700.

For older, less valuable gear, just remember: Best Buy, Radio Shack, or Target. These chains accept your old electronic junk, either in-store or by mail. Here are the details on the Best Buy program, Radio Shacks program, and Targets. They do more than accept your junkthey actually pay you for it, in the form of a gift card or future-purchase discount.

The Web is filled with other ways to get rid of your aging gear and feel good doing it. Three examples:

Freecycle.org. Like a CraigsList for freebies. List the stuff you dont want anymore; interested parties come by your place to take it off your hands.
Cellphonesforsoldiers.com. Turns in used cellphones to Recellular.com, which pays the organization with calling cards that soldiers overseas can use to call their families.
911cellphonebank.org. Provides old phones for emergency use by, for example, domestic-violence victims.


Unloading your old gadgets through any of these outlets is infinitely better than the default graveyard for them: the back of your gadget drawer.


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## Ernest Nagel (May 14, 2011)

I doubt it's the only factor in play but what if it's a big one? Right up there next to "don't excrete where you eat" should be "don't eradicate what fills your plate". (Mods, please kindly move if this isn't the best place for this post.)

http://www.fastcompany.com/1752894/are-cell-phones-killing-all-the-bees

*Are Cell Phones Killing The Bees? *[Updated]
BY Ariel SchwartzWed May 11, 2011
New experiments find that cell phone signals may confuse bees. What does this mean for our food supply?

Do you enjoy eating? Then you may not be too happy if bee populations plunge. That's because out of the 100 crops that provide 90% of the world’s food, over 70 are pollinated by bees--and according to the UN, local drops in the bee population are being reported by beekeepers all over the planet. And the whole thing may be our fault: A new paper (PDF) from Swiss researcher Daniel Favre claims that part of the problem is our obsession with cell phones.

According to Favre, a researcher at the Swiss Federal Institute of Technology, phone signals may confuse honeybees so much that they become fatally disoriented. Favre and his team performed 83 experiments that recorded honeybees' reaction to nearby cell phones in off, standby, and call-making mode. The result: Honeybee noise increases by 10 times when a phone call is made or received. Normally, an increase in noise, or "worker piping," is used as a signal for bees to leave their hives. But in this case, it just makes them confused. Favre explains:

Worker piping in a bee colony is not frequent, and when it occurs in a colony, that is not in a swarming process, no more than two bees are simultaneously active (Pratt et al. 1996). The induction of honeybee worker piping by the electromagnetic fields of mobile phones might have dramatic consequences in terms of colony losses due to unexpected swarming.

A similar report in 2008 showed that bees won't come back to their hives when cell phones are placed nearby--another hint that handsets disrupt bee orientation. There isn't too much we can do about this without dismantling our cell phone culture, and that's never going to happen. In any case, neither of these studies conclusively prove that cell phones are behind all the recent bee deaths.

Bayer's clothiandin, a pesticide used to pre-treat corn seeds, is also thought to be killing honeybees. And the UN suspects that several other factors are all working together to kill bees, including air pollution (this can disorient bees), virulent fungal pathogens that are spread via trade, and climate change (altered rainfall patterns can change plants' flowering times, which in turn affects nectar supplies). It's possible, in other words, that modern society in general is to blame for the death of the bees. So unless we shut down all of our factories and power plants, nix international trade, stop using pesticides, and turn off our cell phones, we may need to find some other pollination solution--or some more cell-phone and climate change-friendly bees.

Update: Daniel Favre emailed us the following statement regarding his study:

"Active mobile phone handsets have a dramatic impact on the behavior of the bees, namely by inducing the worker piping signal.In natural conditions, worker piping either announces the swarming process of the bee colony or is a signal of a disturbed bee colony. For future experiments, in complement to the present original study and in order to reach more 'natural' conditions, mobile phone apparatuses should be placed at various increasing distances away from the hives. We should ask ourselves, whether the plethora of mobile phone masts also have an impact on the behaviour of the honeybees. Among other factors such as the varroa mite and pesticides, signals from mobile phones and masts could be contributing to the decline of honeybees around the world. I am calling the international scientific community for more research in this field."


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## TheNowhereMan (May 23, 2011)

Well, for starters I walk to work whenever possible. On top of that I compost all applicable food waste from both my personal and work kitchens. I even save the oil from the friers to give to a buddy of mine who converts it into fuel for his car.

I plan on adding a few solar panels to the roof of my house sometime in the near future and installing a windmill in my yard to collect energy as well. 

Just trying to do whatever I can to get me off the grid.


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## Tracyarts (May 31, 2011)

" You must live in a frost free or near frost free zone to have plants this far along this early in the season. Have you tried to grow winter vegetables? "

We're in zone 9, with mild winters and brutally hot and humid summers. So we have two growing seasons here really. Before it gets too hot, and after it cools down a bit. 

I haven't tried winter vegetables yet because we've just started to get into gardening and are learning as we go. But we're planning a fall/winter garden this year. Carrots for sure, more bush beans as I was told they grow well here in cooler weather, lettuces, and probably some more tomatoes.

One thing that has been a really great resource is the fact that every week there is an organic market outside a local health food store, and even backyard gardeners can come sell their excess produce if they want. So, I can see first hand what grows well here, and when is the best time to grow it. Also, the vendors all love to talk about what is working and not working in their garden, and those who have been at it for a while love to give advice and suggestions to us newbies. 

We're renting the house we live in from my inlaws, and have been given permission to do some edible landscaping in the front yard if we want as long as we do it in a way that maintains at least some amount of "curb appeal" in case they have to put it on the market. We don't live in a neighborhood with a HOA and as far as I know there aren't many landscaping restrictions in the city ordinances. Right now the front yard is a blank slate with full sun and a standard suburban lawn. They want to put a tree in, so I've been researching what fruit trees grow best here, and there is plenty of space to put in borders and beds which can be filled with a mix of herbs, flowers, and vegetables. 

Tracy


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## Ernest Nagel (Jun 1, 2011)

Bio, we used a similar tool to clear campsites when I was in Scouts. We called them grass whips. The standing rule was never to raise them higher than your waist on backswing or foreswing. I assumed the reason was for safety and it was, but not from each other, it was from TICKS. Swinging wildly scatters them like crazy and they wind up all over you. I bet a scythe would be better for that as well? Be sure to have Ris check your scalp and other hard to reach/see places closely.


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## biodieselman (Jun 1, 2011)

Ernest Nagel said:


> Bio, we used a similar tool to clear campsites when I was in Scouts. We called them grass whips. The standing rule was never to raise them higher than your waist on backswing or foreswing. I assumed the reason was for safety and it was, but not from each other, it was from TICKS. Swinging wildly scatters them like crazy and they wind up all over you. I bet a scythe would be better for that as well? Be sure to have Ris check your scalp and other hard to reach/see places closely.



Ha!!! *Now* you tell me!

I was really getting into it, (I confess it can be a workout!), decapitated thistles were flying everywhere & a couple of times they landed on my head & got me good on the back of my neck. Good thing I took the precaution of snorting an extra shot of my Flonase allergy spray. None the less, the thistles made me itch!

I guess you could've called me a...



.

I was doing my best at a Billy Bob T. impression but maybe the reference is too old.

Our family would tend the old graveyard where my grandparents were buried in rural Tennessee. I used a scythe & it made quick, easy work of the brush. I've been wanting to buy one but the hardwood handle is $80 & the blade is another $80.


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## Ernest Nagel (Jun 2, 2011)

Bio, have you thought about making one from scratch? http://www.scytheconnection.com/adp/snathmaking/index.html

I made several machetes back in the day and generally found them superior to anything I could buy for a reasonable price "off the shelf". I also recall seeing several scythes at a firefighters surplus store years ago.


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## Tracyarts (Sep 6, 2011)

I spent the weekend working in my garden, getting some more of my Fall/Winter crops planted. I already had some tomato plants going, as well as some cucumber seedlings. But there was still time to get a few more tomato plants into their containers, along with some zucchini and pepper (poblano and jalapeno) plants. I also planted a bunch of bush bean seeds and Swiss chard seeds today. Put in a few more herbs (thyme, rosemary, mint, and oregano), and a couple more pots of lemon balm. I have kohlrabi seeds to plant this coming week, and will probably go back to the nursery and pick up a packet of beet seeds since it'll be time for beets and radishes to get going in a couple more weeks. And it'll be time to finish up with carrots, spinach, and lettuces in October. 

Come February, we're going to start doing work on the front yard, to combine edible and decorative landscaping. Sunday, we went to a local nursery that carries a lot of native plants, along with other plants that are especially suited to our climate and got some great ideas for things that are not only easy to grow, and drought resistant, but attract butterflies, hummingbirds, and bees as well. So, plenty to plan for!

Tracy


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## Tracyarts (Nov 21, 2011)

I did really well with my early Fall plantings, and now it's about time for my Winter veggies to start really making some progress. 

Here's a photo of what I picked over the past few days:







I got cucumbers, the last two eggplant, the first handful of poblano peppers, and a nice haul of both green and burgundy bush beans. Everything was grown in containers, a lot of them repurposed containers. The cucumbers and eggplant were grown in large storage bins I got for a steal because the lids were missing. The poblano peppers were grown in large plastic flower pots. And the bush beans in five gallon buckets. 

For Winter, I have some red leaf lettuce that's coming along nicely in flower pots, some broccoli in five gallon buckets, kohlrabi in large flower pots, radishes in oval shaped shallow planters as well as repurposed small storage bins, and a LOT of thriving beets in long plastic window-box planters I bought for next to nothing on clearance. There are some planters of Swiss chard that are piddling along, as well as more window boxes of spinach that are also piddling along. I was told it's because we're still getting highs in the low 80's and it's too warm for that stuff still. Hopefully it'll start to grow now that we're going to finally get a lasting bit of cooler weather. And finally carrots that are also just piddling along. Again, I think the heat is stunting them.

But all in all, I'm really impressed at how well so many things are doing for me in this second season. 

Tracy


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## Ernest Nagel (Jan 29, 2012)

Low hanging fruit.

http://www.sciencenews.org/view/gen...to_reduce_methane,_soot_could_have_big_effect


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## Ernest Nagel (Feb 26, 2012)

Everybody else already familiar with this trick? I'd forgotten it's what my grandmother used.

http://www.agardenforthehouse.com/2011/06/got-weeds-use-vinegar-not-roundup/


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## fat hiker (Feb 27, 2012)

Ernest Nagel said:


> Everybody else already familiar with this trick? I'd forgotten it's what my grandmother used.
> 
> http://www.agardenforthehouse.com/2011/06/got-weeds-use-vinegar-not-roundup/



As the postings in the column note, vinegar is fine for some weeds, especially young ones with thin leaves, but not for others. It's a good thing to try first.

I do, however, want to strongly protest his disposal suggestion for any leftover Roundup. He suggests taking it to the dump. HELL NO, that's worse than spraying it on weeds, if he means just put it in the landfill. It needs to go to a hazardous waste disposal site or station, when it is in concentrated form.


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## Ho Ho Tai (Aug 14, 2012)

Well, somebody's got to raise this moribund, but always interesting, thread from the dead, and it may as well be me.

*Will Natural Gas Be the Automotive Fuel of the Future?*

What do you think of the premise and discussion in this SciAm article? I've been following companies like Westport Engineering (WPRT) and Cummins (CMI) the latter of which I maintain a small position. Even with the chaos caused by fracking, does this technology hold sufficient promise (at least, for trucks, locomotives, shipping, stationary engines - all large displacement piston engines) to reduce the 'footprint'? Should we support it or damn it?


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## Webmaster (Dec 10, 2012)

Not sure if that qualifies as "green," but driving the Prius and consistently getting 50mpg certainly feels pretty green.


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## Ho Ho Tai (Apr 24, 2013)

Time to reboot this thread.

Interesting article. Any comment

From 'The Scientist' Bacteria Make Diesel Molecules

"The mechanism by which the genetically engineered microbes expel the hydrocarbons from their cells remains a mystery, but the major challenge is to scale up the process to produce synthetic diesel molecules at the low cost and high volumes required to make it a viable alternative to fuels made from fossil sources."


Hmmmm!


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## fat hiker (Apr 27, 2013)

I read about that too, in another forum. As long as the bacteria need a sugar foodstock, the process probably won't become commercial. But if a way to have the bacteria feed on cellulose (waste wood, food waste, paper waste, or grass/hay/biomass), then they'll really be onto something.


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## bellybob (Dec 28, 2015)

Never "cooked" fuel. Just thinned, filtered and added cetane boost to veggie oil. There's better engery in veggie oil than the piss they sell as fuel.


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## bellybob (Dec 28, 2015)

Here's some of many ways to recycle tanks/vessels and drums..
Just make sure they are safe from any fire hazard before cutting..


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## Kristal (Dec 28, 2015)

Living green 

View attachment download.jpg


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## Ho Ho Tai (Dec 28, 2015)

Kristal said:


> Living green








Would you call that 'tongue in cheek' or 'tongue in bowl'?


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## Kristal (Dec 28, 2015)

Ho Ho Tai said:


> Would you call that 'tongue in cheek' or 'tongue in bowl'?



Both - lol

(Seriously speaking though, my workplace is very green conscious with strict rules that they enforce)


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## bellybob (Dec 28, 2015)

Live green for the green and maybe you'll have some green. 

View attachment Currency.jpg


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## Pattie Vincent (Dec 3, 2016)

Tina said:


> *Thank you very much, biodieselman!
> 
> I made this thread sticky, because whether one agrees whether there is such a thing as global warming or not, it cannot hurt to do what we can to be good to our wonderful planet.
> 
> ...



Hi Tina, 

Hope you don't mind. I found this nice article - and I think that it is a good source of information too. 

Some things we just take for granted. In most stores now they ask you if you want your receipt printed or emailed to you. I usually just say printed out of habit because I double check my receipts now and then with my credit card statements or just to be sure I have them when I need to return something. Who would have known that if I ask the cashier to just email it to me, I would be helping to save the environment!


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## fat hiker (Dec 5, 2016)

I occasionally have receipts e-mailed - but I often find that the store then starts sending me unsolicited email offers, which I have to cancel.

Paper receipts, on the other hand, can be recycled. 

But the other ideas are good.


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## Tracyarts (Dec 7, 2016)

We got a "smart" thermostat over the summer. We'd called our electricity provider to ask about money saving options and they offered us a free Nest brand thermostat as part of a trial program in our area. 

It's really neat, and has saved us money and cut our power usage. I like that a little green leaf shows up on the display panel or app when you're in power saving mode. I find myself dealing just fine with it being a little warmer or cooler in order to see that leaf. 

And every month, we get a usage report that also ranks us in the percentage of electricity consumers in our area, and gives suggestions based on our data to conserve even more electricity by altering the programming settings. 

We like it so much, that if we can't take it with us when we move, we'll willingly pay full retail price for another one.


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## Maddog (Feb 24, 2017)

Interesting to see how much has changed within 10 years. Biodiesel is dead, at least for cars (might be interesting for planes). I'm a huge fan of electric cars, and hope that we will see a breakthrough within the next 5 years, with all the new models in the pipeline.


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## fat hiker (Feb 27, 2017)

Maddog said:


> Interesting to see how much has changed within 10 years. Biodiesel is dead, at least for cars (might be interesting for planes). I'm a huge fan of electric cars, and hope that we will see a breakthrough within the next 5 years, with all the new models in the pipeline.



Indeed. I already know people who have a Nissan Leaf as their sole family car, using the savings in fuel to pay for the odd rental, or belonging to a car-sharing company for those longer journeys or where they need a larger vehicle (zipcars.com, vrtucar.ca, communauto.com). The longer range of the Chevy Bolt, the new Leaf, the new e-Golf, let alone the Tesla 3, will make this more and more practical and desireable.

Did you know that, in Germany, Tesla's Model S outsells Mercedes-Benz and BMW's luxury electric sedans by a 3-1 ratio?


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