# Fat Law of Attraction?



## superodalisque (Feb 8, 2014)

i was revisiting the law of attraction and the question came to my mind: can fat people have anything to do with how the world treats us? or are we just a victim of our circumstances. is one idea or the other an oversimplification?

http://www.benchmarkcoaching.com/law3.html

*You Attract Who You Are Being
*

"The world is a great mirror. It reflects back to you what you are. If you are loving, if you are friendly, if you are helpful,the world will prove to be loving and friendly and helpful in return. The world is what you are."

~ Thomas Dreier, Author

Being irresistibly attractive is about living a life that feels really good to you. Its a makeover from the inside. You will attract good things when you feel attractive to yourself and set up conditions in your life that work best for you. In other words, you dont merely attract those things that you hope or wish for; you attract the people and circumstances that match how youre operating and showing up in the world. Most of us chase after things and few of us naturally attract the good stuff that we truly desire until we start living a life that feels most appealing to us, and until we start being more like the things we want to attract. For example, if you want more happy experiences to come around, be happy. If you want to encounter more kindness from people, be kind first. If you want more respect from others, be respectful.

Its important to ask yourself, Do I really love my life? If you say, No, not completely, the next questions are, Why not? and What has to change?

Dont worry if you look good to the world; concern yourself with living a life that looks good to you. Fall in love with your life and you will be attractive to others. And the more attractive you become, still others wont be on the same page and will resist your happiness, but thats okay too. Theyre just not there yet.

Its a mistake to think your life has to be problem free before you can feel happy and peaceful. The opposite is actually true. First you work toward joy and serenity and then your life challenges lessen and disappear. Most say, When I reach my goals, I will be joyful. But you must be joyful first. You must start with the determination that you will settle for nothing less than feeling good. And when you first seek joy, all else that is good follows. Its not the other way around. You can feel joyful or serene even in the midst of turmoil.


Principle of Joy  When you feel good, you attract and manifest even more good.

Selfishly seek your own joy: Your joy is the greatest gift that you can give to anyone. Because unless you are in your joy, you have nothing to give, anyway."

~Abraham- Hicks


Tips: Radiate joy from the inside out. Let yourself feel good no matter what is happening around you. Allow yourself to sparkle and shine -- Joy is very attractive.

Question: Have you taken your life too seriously? How will you let yourself have fun again?

Affirm: I am joyful now.

Let this simple affirmation travel from your head to your heart  which can sometimes be a very long distance. It may take a little practice, because you must allow yourself to feel it too!

Try This: Try taking just a few minutes to be fully present with someone today and share a moment of joy with them. Smile more often and find at least one person to laugh with --see what happens.


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## tonynyc (Feb 8, 2014)

...............................


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## tonynyc (Feb 8, 2014)

Positive attitude goes a long way. IMO it's not so much that people of size are victims -but, one has to deal with the usual bunch of crap from ignorant folks/society and each scenario will dictate it's own set of responses. 

Everyone at some point suffers some form of slight - it's how we can each respond- the support networks that we have and the tools that we can best apply to each specific problem... 













_
I am grateful to have a support network and going to the gym has been a good source for me to blow of some steam...
_


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## YoJoshua (Feb 8, 2014)

Having delved as deeply as it's probably possible to go into AH, I should say that it doesn't seem to make any difference whatsoever whether or not one is positive or negative, goes left or right or up or down, puts a smile on it or curses or blesses God or the planet or life or death. You are a tiny creature dreaming it is a "big" creature with command over life, which in truth doesn't give a shit if you come or go, live or die, are happy or sad, are alone, destitute, are raped or killed, successful or a failure.

The law of attraction has made a fortune for its proponents, who are amazing at drawing money to themselves by taking advantage of people in serious agony. If you attend one of these workshops and experience how utterly uptight and controlled and neurotic and over-the-top the folks in charge of booking, scheduling, collecting the money and so forth are, you will see what I mean.

You are a speck, one of 7 billion humans, and the LOA convinces you that you are All-Important, the center of the very universe. It is a symptom of the disease of the Celebration of the great Self, manifesting in Facebook "likes" and the elevation of the truly horrible among us to celebrity status. Adam Sandler, murderer of children, instant celebrity, for example. 

I'm sorry not to be more positive but I have had awful, damaging experiences in the so-called New Age movements and keep as far away from them and their proponents as possible, now and always. 

If it works for you, go for it, loves.


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## lypeaches (Feb 8, 2014)

I share much of your skepticism, YoJoshua, particularly in regards to the "self as center of the universe" concept. New Age has also done some damage in my circle (as has religion, to be fair). However, I do believe that both optimism and visualization of goals are a more pleasant way to live my life, so I subscribe to them. Do they work? Dunno, but I *feel* better, so that makes it worth doing, imo.


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## LillyBBBW (Feb 8, 2014)

YoJoshua said:


> Having delved as deeply as it's probably possible to go into AH, I should say that it doesn't seem to make any difference whatsoever whether or not one is positive or negative, goes left or right or up or down, puts a smile on it or curses or blesses God or the planet or life or death. You are a tiny creature dreaming it is a "big" creature with command over life, which in truth doesn't give a shit if you come or go, live or die, are happy or sad, are alone, destitute, are raped or killed, successful or a failure.
> 
> The law of attraction has made a fortune for its proponents, who are amazing at drawing money to themselves by taking advantage of people in serious agony. If you attend one of these workshops and experience how utterly uptight and controlled and neurotic and over-the-top the folks in charge of booking, scheduling, collecting the money and so forth are, you will see what I mean.
> 
> ...





lypeaches said:


> I share much of your skepticism, YoJoshua, particularly in regards to the "self as center of the universe" concept. New Age has also done some damage in my circle (as has religion, to be fair). However, I do believe that both optimism and visualization of goals are a more pleasant way to live my life, so I subscribe to them. Do they work? Dunno, but I *feel* better, so that makes it worth doing, imo.



I agree with these sentiments. Whatever gets you by is what you should work with but I'm not inclined to believe that wearing a winning smile and lots of Beverly Johnson is going to impact the ugly in this world beyond your own.


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## HereticFA (Feb 8, 2014)

So many posts here seem to indicate keeping a positive attitude is totally useless due to everyone being surrounded by problems or evil and no upbeat attitude will stop that from happening. I see it as the problems or evil being like rainfall and a positive outlook being an umbrella. It won't prevent you from getting wet, just from getting totally soaked. That will let you recover faster when whatever "it" is happens. (And like an umbrella, a strong enough storm or crisis can still "soak" many people depending on the strength of their personal umbrella.)


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## Yakatori (Feb 8, 2014)

YoJoshua said:


> "_...Adam Sandler, murderer of children, instant celebrity, for example._"


You mean Adam _Lanza_, I think... 



YoJoshua said:


> "_...sorry not to be more positive but I have had awful, damaging experiences in the so-called New Age movements and keep as far away from them and their proponents as possible..._"


Then the problem might you. Not being able to take the good from the bad. The insight from the oversight. Which will tend follow you from one p.o.v. to the next.



lypeaches said:


> "_However, I do believe that both optimism and visualization of goals are a more pleasant way to live my life, so I subscribe to them. Do they work?_"


Whether it works by itself is up for some debate. After all, it's not like there aren't some successful & effective people out there who spend most of their time second-guessing and being miserable.



LillyBBBW said:


> ...not inclined to believe that wearing a winning smile and lots of Beverly Johnson is going to impact the ugly in this world *beyond your own.*


Ah...that is the crux of it. Because, small as we are relative to the totality of the universe, we cannot simultaneously occupy all of it. Just the space most immediately around us. New age aside, calls to mind the proverbial adage about not defiling that which sustains us.


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## lucca23v2 (Feb 8, 2014)

Negativity spreads faster than fire. I think that if you are truly happy with who you are, then you will be comfortable in your own skin. When you are comfortable in your won skin others will be comfortable around you. We can pick up other people tension which in turn will make us tense because we don't want to hurt or offend. 

Basically live by the golden rule "Do unto others as you would have others do unto you." If you treat others the way you want to be treated then you will get the same treatment and acceptance.

That being said, there are people in the world that are just miserable and will always bring others down, but this is part of the real world. Just stay true to you and the rest will work itself out.


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## tonynyc (Feb 8, 2014)

LillyBBBW said:


> I agree with these sentiments. Whatever gets you by is what you should work with but I'm not inclined to believe that wearing a winning smile and lots of Beverly Johnson is going to impact the ugly in this world beyond your own.





HereticFA said:


> So many posts here seem to indicate keeping a positive attitude is totally useless due to everyone being surrounded by problems or evil and no upbeat attitude will stop that from happening. I see it as the problems or evil being like rainfall and a positive outlook being an umbrella. It won't prevent you from getting wet, just from getting totally soaked. That will let you recover faster when whatever "it" is happens. (And like an umbrella, a strong enough storm or crisis can still "soak" many people depending on the strength of their personal umbrella.)





lucca23v2 said:


> Negativity spreads faster than fire. I think that if you are truly happy with who you are, then you will be comfortable in your own skin. When you are comfortable in your won skin others will be comfortable around you. We can pick up other people tension which in turn will make us tense because we don't want to hurt or offend.
> 
> Basically live by the golden rule "Do unto others as you would have others do unto you." If you treat others the way you want to be treated then you will get the same treatment and acceptance.
> 
> That being said, there are people in the world that are just miserable and will always bring others down, but this is part of the real world. Just stay true to you and the rest will work itself out.



*All good points and its all about balance. Would be great if a happy outlook can change things... sometimes it works and sometimes it doesn't. It can be just as stressful to maintain that cheery outlook as it is to always be angry and confrontational *


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## YoJoshua (Feb 9, 2014)

I am dreadfully sorry for saying "Adam Sandler." I mix up celebs all the time.

What I meant to type was "Adam Lanza, murderer of children." 




YoJoshua said:


> Having delved as deeply as it's probably possible to go into AH, I should say that it doesn't seem to make any difference whatsoever whether or not one is positive or negative, goes left or right or up or down, puts a smile on it or curses or blesses God or the planet or life or death. You are a tiny creature dreaming it is a "big" creature with command over life, which in truth doesn't give a shit if you come or go, live or die, are happy or sad, are alone, destitute, are raped or killed, successful or a failure.
> 
> The law of attraction has made a fortune for its proponents, who are amazing at drawing money to themselves by taking advantage of people in serious agony. If you attend one of these workshops and experience how utterly uptight and controlled and neurotic and over-the-top the folks in charge of booking, scheduling, collecting the money and so forth are, you will see what I mean.
> 
> ...


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## Yakatori (Feb 9, 2014)

I don't really like Adam Sandler either...


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## bigmac (Feb 9, 2014)

I for one think all this positive thinking, visualization, self actualization new age stuff is a load of ... .


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## superodalisque (Feb 9, 2014)

those are some great posts that made me think. i'm not so sure about this idea of being laws of attraction "self centered" per say. actually it could be considered to be the total opposite in terms of how we diagnose what is happening to us and how we are orienting our ego. generally everyone wants to make everyone else responsible for us and for our well being. we think a lot about what the world is doing to us and at has happened to us and sometimes not so much about what we are doing to the world and what we create in it with our own actions. we can be like small children crying for what we want but never considering that we look like to the rest of the world as in: do we look/act like we want real friendships and love relationships? do we look/act like we respect others? do we look/act like we want deserve and expect respect from others?


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## HereticFA (Feb 9, 2014)

bigmac said:


> I for one think all this positive thinking, visualization, self actualization new age stuff is a load of ... .


So what do you use as a personal coping mechanism when the "stuff" hits your fan? Do you just ignore it, get angry, or think about the (hopefully) bright outcome beyond the problem?


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## HereticFA (Feb 9, 2014)

superodalisque said:


> those are some great posts that made me think. i'm not so sure about this idea of being laws of attraction "self centered" per say. actually it could be considered to be the total opposite in terms of how we diagnose what is happening to us and how we are orienting our ego. generally everyone wants to make everyone else responsible for us and for our well being. we think a lot about what the world is doing to us and at has happened to us and sometimes not so much about what we are doing to the world and what we create in it with our own actions. we can be like small children crying for what we want but never considering that we look like to the rest of the world as in: do we look/act like we want real friendships and love relationships? do we look/act like we respect others? do we look/act like we want deserve and expect respect from others?



Everyone deserves respect. I see it as a human right, at least until the person is shown to not be worthy of respect due to some heinous act. However, some people can't separate themselves from their ideas and not all ideas deserve respect. (That becomes extremely pertinent in Hyde Park, where our philosophical differences are magnified.)

Whether we realize it or not, sometimes our choices in life "attract" bad things to happen to us. I think it's probably due to someone acting but failing to plan and just hoping for the best. Big Surprise ensues when Bad Things Happen (but were statistically likely due to lack of planning). 

Similar issues arise based on how we perceive ourselves. If we're down on ourselves, that will sometimes show in our body language. The appearance of slumped shoulders, hanging head staring at the ground, dressing in a lot of "black", avoiding eye contact pretty well shouts "victim - ready and waiting" to the predator Alpha types. Unknowingly it "attracts" the wrong attention. There's a few predators who don't need those signals to attack someone but they can usually be chased off or their effect ignored if you have strong self esteem.

The "acting like small children crying" is an issue that I've seen many times. All too often someone says they want X (friendship, a relationship, education, employment, etc), but then will complain that the last time they had X, it didn't work because the other party wanted them to change and they refuse. They think they're not being "genuine" if they change. All they are saying is that they are not ready yet for X, whether they realize it or not. Once they are ready to negotiate their previous non-negotiables, they've matured enough to enter into X.


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## superodalisque (Feb 9, 2014)

bigmac said:


> I for one think all this positive thinking, visualization, self actualization new age stuff is a load of ... .



the idea of self actualization and self creation is not really new age at all. it has been around for a very long time in philosophical discussions of the self ego and existence among other topics. but since the sources of those quotes are pretty offensive to some because they can be pretty hokey, i'll add these others to the mix to separate the idea from them and we can just discuss the message rather than the messenger. :



 The Brain and the Body provide us with a strong and continuous sense of self, which provides us with the freedom to create who we are.

The Ego Trick
Julian Baggini

"In proportion to the development of his individuality each person becomes more valuable to himself, and is therefore more capable of being more valuable to others."

On Liberty
John Stuart Mills


For all our frailty the command "be perfect" has sense for us. The concept of Good resists collapse into the selfish empirical consciousness."

--The Sovereignty of Good
Iris Murdoch


"Happiness is not, except in very rare cases, something that drops into the mouth, like a ripe fruit, by the mere operation of fortunate circumstances"

"To like many people spontaneously and without effort is perhaps the greatest of all sources of personal happiness. "

"Mistaken views of the world, mistaken ethics, mistaken habits of life leading to destruction of that natural zest and appetite for possible things upon which all happiness, whether of men or animals, ultimately depends".

--The Conquest of Happiness 
Bertrand Russell



"Man is condemned to be free; because once thrown into the world, he is responsible for everything he does."

--Being and Nothingness
Jean - Paul Sarte


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## superodalisque (Feb 9, 2014)

Yakatori said:


> I don't really like Adam Sandler either...



not my cup of tea either


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## bigmac (Feb 10, 2014)

HereticFA said:


> So what do you use as a personal coping mechanism when the "stuff" hits your fan? Do you just ignore it, get angry, or think about the (hopefully) bright outcome beyond the problem?




Putting on a happy face and thinking about puppies sure as hell isn't going to make things any better.


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## bigmac (Feb 10, 2014)

superodalisque said:


> the idea of self actualization and self creation is not really new age at all. it has been around for a very long time in philosophical discussions of the self ego and existence among other topics. but since the sources of those quotes are pretty offensive to some because they can be pretty hokey, i'll add these others to the mix to separate the idea from them and we can just discuss the message rather than the messenger. :
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Actually none of this makes the least bit of sense to me.


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## tonynyc (Feb 10, 2014)

bigmac said:


> Actually none of this makes the least bit of sense to me.



_Well look at it this way- "thinking constant good thoughts" works and sometimes it does not. It all depends on the situation _


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## LillyBBBW (Feb 10, 2014)

tonynyc said:


> *All good points and its all about balance. Would be great if a happy outlook can change things... sometimes it works and sometimes it doesn't. It can be just as stressful to maintain that cheery outlook as it is to always be angry and confrontational *



I agree. I believed in new age mumbo jumbo too till after years of extensive research I concluded that it doesn't work. If one prefers to exist joyfully within the bullshit status quo, that's fine I guess. Goodness knows we must choose our battles at times. As a life's philosophy though I think such sentiments do more harm than good in the long run. Sometimes all it takes is one person to stand up and shout, "HA, look! The Emperor has no clothes!" There's a time and place and at times one has to step out of their own comfort zone to boldly speak out or reluctantly hold their tongue. Sooner or later we gain the wisdom to know the difference.


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## Dr. Feelgood (Feb 10, 2014)

HereticFA said:


> The "acting like small children crying" is an issue that I've seen many times. All too often someone says they want X (friendship, a relationship, education, employment, etc), but then will complain that the last time they had X, it didn't work because the other party wanted them to change and they refuse. They think they're not being "genuine" if they change. All they are saying is that they are not ready yet for X, whether they realize it or not. Once they are ready to negotiate their previous non-negotiables, they've matured enough to enter into X.



Or, to put it another way, the one common element in all your failed relationships is you...


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## tonynyc (Feb 10, 2014)

Dr. Feelgood said:


> Or, to put it another way, the one common element in all your failed relationships is you...



that would make for this type of face at the end of the day....


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## tonynyc (Feb 10, 2014)

LillyBBBW said:


> I agree. I believed in new age mumbo jumbo too till after years of extensive research *I concluded that it doesn't work. If one prefers to exist joyfully within the bullshit status quo, that's fine I guess. Goodness knows we must choose our battles at times*. As a life's philosophy though I think such sentiments do more harm than good in the long run. Sometimes all it takes is one person to stand up and shout, "HA, look! The Emperor has no clothes!" *There's a time and place and at times one has to step out of their own comfort zone to boldly speak out or reluctantly hold their tongue*. Sooner or later we gain the wisdom to know the difference.



*LillyBBBW:*

You bring up an excellent point which I highlighted... you pretty much summed it up. 

*This type of philosophy is only as good if one were to also provide the tools and alternative options to cope *- 
this is a discussion that we've had in the DIMS boards in the past- and I've provided the link to some key threads below. I'm sure Dimmers can reply with other coping mechanism when the perpetual Happy Face doesn't work.

*It present the darker stereotype of the JOLLY FAT PERSON*



_*Earlier threads which discussed coping strategies- there are others; but, only listed three
*_

Share Your Wit


Biting Back



Verbal Judo


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## HereticFA (Feb 10, 2014)

bigmac said:


> Putting on a happy face and thinking about puppies sure as hell isn't going to make things any better.


Maybe not for you, but I know it's an absolute necessity for a lot of people. It helps keep their spirits up in the hope of better things that will come. Few people thrive on the feeling of futility.


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## HereticFA (Feb 10, 2014)

LillyBBBW said:


> I agree. I believed in new age mumbo jumbo too till after years of extensive research I concluded that it doesn't work. If one prefers to exist joyfully within the bullshit status quo, that's fine I guess. Goodness knows we must choose our battles at times. As a life's philosophy though I think such sentiments do more harm than good in the long run. Sometimes all it takes is one person to stand up and shout, "HA, look! The Emperor has no clothes!" There's a time and place and at times one has to step out of their own comfort zone to boldly speak out or reluctantly hold their tongue. Sooner or later we gain the wisdom to know the difference.


Any time you're trying to keep an upbeat attitude to overcome the fundamental fact that something can't or isn't working, your just lying to yourself. Don't Do That. But if the path you've chosen is logically achievable with some minor gaps in the process that take work to overcome, then it's appropriate to rely on an upbeat attitude to support you while you're working. But if the Emperor has no clothes that you can see, speak up. (Maybe s/he's wearing a flesh colored bodystocking.)

I've avoided most of the more New Age-ish stuff in recent decades so if they are touting something more like just having a positive attitude to make illogical things actually happen without intervention, I'm not thinking of that approach. I realized so much of that was garbage back in the 70's to 80's and I've never seriously considered it since then. I have seen at least one person waste their life since the 70's waiting for the Universe to send them the things they need and positive it would happen. She died this last December at age 60 - still waiting.


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## LillyBBBW (Feb 10, 2014)

HereticFA said:


> Any time you're trying to keep an upbeat attitude to overcome the fundamental fact that something can't or isn't working, your just lying to yourself. Don't Do That. But if the path you've chosen is logically achievable with some minor gaps in the process that take work to overcome, then it's appropriate to rely on an upbeat attitude to support you while you're working. But if the Emperor has no clothes that you can see, speak up. (Maybe s/he's wearing a flesh colored bodystocking.)
> 
> I've avoided most of the more New Age-ish stuff in recent decades so if they are touting something more like just having a positive attitude to make illogical things actually happen without intervention, I'm not thinking of that approach. I realized so much of that was garbage back in the 70's to 80's and I've never seriously considered it since then. I have seen at least one person waste their life since the 70's waiting for the Universe to send them the things they need and positive it would happen. She died this last December at age 60 - still waiting.



I was specifically thinking about putting on a sunny outlook in the midst of unreasonable and dysfunctional circumstances. These are the kinds of things that happen most often, sad to say, among family dynamics and other arenas where dysfunctional behaviors have been accepted as the norm and it's hard to figure your way around it. Somewhere in your mind you are aware that something isn't quite right about this but you're surrounded by people who are so comfortable within the paradigm of wordlessly accepting the issues with a smile and a joke - especially if they are comfortable beneficiaries within the system. You're uncertain about speaking out and when you do, they accuse you of being weak if you upset the apple cart with cry-baby complaints. I've most often heard people say things like this when they want to keep women's groups, GLBT, minorities, etc. in their place and when they say this stuff make no mistake, they mean them and not themselves.


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## Tad (Feb 10, 2014)

I'd like to suggest that keeping an upbeat attitude does not have to mean ignoring when you are standing in a pile of manure. Yes, some people use upbeat to mean "I'll ignore what I'm standing in and look at the birds in the sky" but upbeat and positive can also mean "I know I'm standing hip deep in manure, which is not good. But I'm positive that I can work my way out of this, wash it away, and avoid it in the future--a future in which the fact that I was once hip deep in manure won't bother me much."

Whether or not the positive attitude helps you get out and cleaned up, I'm not sure. Perhaps more than anything different people seem to work well with different emotions. One person will maybe do best if they stay positive and upbeat, another if they angry, another with a sort of stoic sense of resignation+determination, etc. Heck, maybe for some people whining and wingeing is what they need to do in order to keep working on their way out.

Now, when it comes to dealing with other people, it could be that what works best for you won't endear you to many other people, and that is then when you have to make a big decision: do you stick in your most comfortable mode and trust that you will be awesome in that mode, and eventually meet people who can appreciate that? Or do you learn to work in some different mode, which maybe isn't as natural or comfortable to you, but which endears you to more other people around you?

(and to note, what attitudes are appreciated in people can vary between cultures--happy and upbeat is apparently not so valued in Russia, from what I've heard, by way of example).


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## superodalisque (Feb 10, 2014)

bigmac said:


> Actually none of this makes the least bit of sense to me.



you might really enjoy reading it since most of it is a lot more practical and has more logic involved than the new age type mentality that you were talking about.


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## superodalisque (Feb 10, 2014)

Tad said:


> I'd like to suggest that keeping an upbeat attitude does not have to mean ignoring when you are standing in a pile of manure. Yes, some people use upbeat to mean "I'll ignore what I'm standing in and look at the birds in the sky" but upbeat and positive can also mean "I know I'm standing hip deep in manure, which is not good. But I'm positive that I can work my way out of this, wash it away, and avoid it in the future--a future in which the fact that I was once hip deep in manure won't bother me much."
> 
> Whether or not the positive attitude helps you get out and cleaned up, I'm not sure. Perhaps more than anything different people seem to work well with different emotions. One person will maybe do best if they stay positive and upbeat, another if they angry, another with a sort of stoic sense of resignation+determination, etc. Heck, maybe for some people whining and wingeing is what they need to do in order to keep working on their way out.
> 
> ...



yes exactly. getting stuck in a negative place can get people depressed to the point that they can't get out of a situation even when it IS possible. you see that a lot in spousal abuse cases etc...and even when things do LOOK impossible then there is the black swan. no one knows when he/she will be that black swan. I tend to think that even hoping to be a black swan is better than just giving up altogether, which has no possibility of positive change in it at all.


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## tonynyc (Feb 10, 2014)

LillyBBBW said:


> I was specifically thinking about putting on a sunny outlook in the midst of unreasonable and dysfunctional circumstances.... * I've most often heard people say things like this when they want to keep women's groups, GLBT, minorities, etc. in their place and when they say this stuff make no mistake, they mean them and not themselves*.



I had to bold that statement Lilly- you certainly get much of this ; especially, when we think of the current work, legal and other social issues that one has to deal with. 



Tad said:


> I'd like to suggest that keeping an upbeat attitude does not have to mean ignoring when you are standing in a pile of manure...
> 
> Now, when it comes to dealing with other people, it could be that what works best for you won't endear you to many other people, and that is then when you have to make a big decision: do you stick in your most comfortable mode and trust that you will be awesome in that mode, and eventually meet people who can appreciate that? Or do you learn to work in some different mode, which maybe isn't as natural or comfortable to you, but which endears you to more other people around you?



I would add this point - having an upbeat attitude is good if one chooses to be "Happy Happy" or "Not". Also the mode that one chooses to operate depends on the situation.


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## bigmac (Feb 11, 2014)

tonynyc said:


> _Well look at it this way- "thinking constant good thoughts"* works and sometimes it does not*. It all depends on the situation _



Yeah -- but so does imagining your nemesis being flattened by a runaway truck. Or, for that matter, not thinking anything.

I am not a member of the cult of positivity.


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## CleverBomb (Feb 12, 2014)

bigmac said:


> Putting on a happy face and thinking about puppies sure as hell isn't going to make things any better.


And to some extent it might make things worse. 

Consider the implications. If positive thinking can make things better, then when things don't get better it's the individual's fault -- not the fault of outside circumstances. Which is awfully close to victim-blaming, if not identical to it.


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## bigmac (Feb 12, 2014)

CleverBomb said:


> And to some extent it might make things worse.
> 
> Consider the implications. If positive thinking can make things better, *then when things don't get better it's the individual's faul*t -- not the fault of outside circumstances. Which is awfully close to victim-blaming, if not identical to it.




Yes! Exactly.


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## superodalisque (Feb 12, 2014)

so people should go around being self negative and feeling defeatist and hating on people who never even had it in their mind to do anything bad to them? stopping before they even begin? that is supposed to help them how? and who is going to want to deal with that Eor attitude?


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## tonynyc (Feb 13, 2014)

bigmac said:


> Yeah -- but so does imagining your nemesis being flattened by a runaway truck. Or, for that matter, not thinking anything.
> 
> I am not a member of the cult of positivity.



*Now you turn that "runaway truck" into one of your "fist" ... then you could be on the step to positive visualization...*




superodalisque said:


> so people should go around being self negative and feeling defeatist and hating on people who never even had it in their mind to do anything bad to them? stopping before they even begin? that is supposed to help them how? and who is going to want to deal with that Eor attitude?



*Which "hating on people" did you have in mind
*


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## bigmac (Feb 13, 2014)

tonynyc said:


> *Now you turn that "runaway truck" into one of your "fist" ... then you could be on the step to positive visualization...*
> 
> ...




When I left the gym the other day the urge to get into a good old fashioned fist fight came over me (its been over 20 years since I was last in an actual fight). Thought better of it and went to Starbucks.


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## CleverBomb (Feb 13, 2014)

superodalisque said:


> so people should go around being self negative and feeling defeatist and hating on people who never even had it in their mind to do anything bad to them? stopping before they even begin? that is supposed to help them how? and who is going to want to deal with that Eor attitude?


Sorry, that's a strawman position. 
There's nothing at all wrong with having a positive attitude.
The problem lies in believing that one's attitude controls outcomes, and specifically in situations where it does not.


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## superodalisque (Feb 13, 2014)

CleverBomb said:


> Sorry, that's a strawman position.
> There's nothing at all wrong with having a positive attitude.
> The problem lies in believing that one's attitude controls outcomes, and specifically in situations where it does not.



i understand your point. i really do. but i still think being positive is way more healthy and productive for a person than being a downer or a hater. it's much more likely that people will respond to positively than negativity. there are sooo many studies out there that show negative reinforcement and negative out look has a much worse outcome than a positive one when it comes to things like career wellness etc....mainly it's because when you're positive it's much more likely you'll actually allow something good to happen.


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## Donna (Feb 14, 2014)

Whose saying it's a one or the other proposition? I think it's more important and healthy to be authentic than to be either Eeyore or Pollyanna. Sometimes life hands one more lemons than one has enough sugar to make into lemonade. I think it's healthier to just say "Damn, this sucks" when it happens. Acknowledge the crap, try to clean it up and move the hell on.


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## bigmac (Feb 14, 2014)

Donna said:


> Whose saying it's a one or the other proposition? I think it's more important and healthy to be authentic than to be either Eeyore or Pollyanna. Sometimes life hands one more lemons than one has enough sugar to make into lemonade. I think it's healthier to just say "Damn, this sucks" when it happens. Acknowledge the crap, try to clean it up and move the hell on.



Eeyore's under appreciated -- accept in Austin.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eeyore's_Birthday_Party

https://www.google.com/search?q=eey...vjTM4zkoAT_mYBo&ved=0CDgQsAQ&biw=1280&bih=699


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## tonynyc (Feb 14, 2014)

superodalisque said:


> i understand your point. i really do. but i still think being positive is way more healthy and productive for a person than being a downer or a hater. it's much more likely that people will respond to positively than negativity. * there are sooo many studies out there that show negative reinforcement and negative out look has a much worse outcome than a positive one when it comes to things like career wellness etc...*.mainly it's because when you're positive it's much more likely you'll actually allow something good to happen.



I bolded your above statement - I'm sure anyone who has had deal with any kind of injustice would read that as utter BS...

Sounds like a sales pitch... and what of these studies you are promoting...-


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## tonynyc (Feb 14, 2014)

Donna said:


> Whose saying it's a one or the other proposition? I think it's more important and healthy to be authentic than to be either Eeyore or Pollyanna. Sometimes life hands one more lemons than one has enough sugar to make into lemonade. I think it's healthier to just say "Damn, this sucks" when it happens. Acknowledge the crap, try to clean it up and move the hell on.



Like the saying "From Lemons make Lemonade" 

you have the tools that work and move on...


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## superodalisque (Feb 15, 2014)

tonynyc said:


> I bolded your above statement - I'm sure anyone who has had deal with any kind of injustice would read that as utter BS...
> 
> Sounds like a sales pitch... and what of these studies you are promoting...-



science says it not a load of bs. i'm inclined to believe the science.

people can interpolate negativity in terms of giving up which is often the case. there are a lot of injustices in life but absolutely nothing comes of giving in to them -- even if you have to die trying.


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## superodalisque (Feb 15, 2014)

bigmac said:


> Eeyore's under appreciated -- accept in Austin.
> 
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eeyore's_Birthday_Party
> 
> https://www.google.com/search?q=eey...vjTM4zkoAT_mYBo&ved=0CDgQsAQ&biw=1280&bih=699



Eeyore is boring and irritating


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## superodalisque (Feb 15, 2014)

isn't that what positivity is anyway? having faith in yourself and the world to move on from anything. and also learning that you don't have to keep negative or destructive people as a part of your life. you have the power to get rid of them. wallowing giving in to and choosing the same old kinds of people and things who brought you down in the first place won't help. those are the kinds of choices that do bring about positive change. and yeah we do attract the wrong folk/situations into our lives--mainly because we're convinced we aren't worth more or that we can't do better. people are often more comfortable acting helpless. it would be healthier to just admit that they don't want to do the work in most cases and that change is hard. even that is positive self acceptance. not at all like having to tell yourself lies.


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## Green Eyed Fairy (Feb 17, 2014)

Kicking Eeyore in the balls would make me feel more positive.


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## tonynyc (Feb 17, 2014)

Green Eyed Fairy said:


> Kicking Eeyore in the balls would make me feel more positive.


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