# Dear FAs in Hiding:



## activistfatgirl (Jan 3, 2007)

I'm curious if other fat women or BHMs would share if they've had experiences with FAs still in the closet or ashamed of their attraction. I think something just snapped tonight and I'm feeling that raw frustration. Been there?

Here's a little letter: 

Dear Fat Admirers (FAs),

Why are you hiding? I know you hold me now, but Ive never met your friends. Youve met all of mine--they like you. Youre sweet, affectionate, into me. Then, why do you always stay at my house? Its always my bed, my sheets that you make love to me on. What are you afraid of?

Dear FA that pretends I dont exist when you run into a high school friend at a concert. I have to jab you in the back to give you your ticket. Your friend has to usher your attention towards me. I smile and act playful, as always in denial and constantly forgiving. Ive still never talked to you about this. I still hold back tears of embarrassment when I think about how quickly youd pretend you were with someone else.

Dear FA that drives an hour to see me but has never invited me to your apartment, do you know how much I hate that I let this go on for a year? I did sleep on your bed once. It was winter break, the house was empty, and it was ok for me to be naked, quaking, walking, being. I didnt get mad until months later.

Dear FA that has a ton of fat girls on his profile--be it Myspace or Friendster or whatever. Thats great! Youre out! People know that you like fat girls! Why arent any of your real life friends on your profile too? Oh, right, because this is the part of the internet that you are open about being with fat girls--among fat girls. Do you have another one without the fatties?

What would you do if they found all the messages and lovesick comments you send to your lovely zaftig internet pals? And the real question is: would you laugh at the jokes they made about it and play it cool?

Dear FA that wants to fuck fat girls but not date them. Im constantly sorrowful I didnt know how to pick you out sooner, and consistently frustrated when you slip by now. You dont deserve this.

Dear FA that talks to me anonymously online and says Im cocky for not wanting to talk to you. Im not cocky. Im fragile and insecure like many. I simply believe in myself a bit more than that. And Ill never trust a man who doesnt reveal his true identity, because, again, what are you afraid of? 

Dear FA that doesnt think Im good enough. Why are you still seeing me? Why do I let you?

Dear FA that keeps it on the down low. I promise to get naked and streak your next family gathering, should you not understand that I deserveno demand, to be at your side next time, not in your wet dreams.


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## supersoup (Jan 3, 2007)

you are beautiful, and this is brilliant.


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## Fuzzy Necromancer (Jan 3, 2007)

Um, I'm open, even talkative, about being an FA, and this post still makes me feel guilty and slightly afraid for my intact blood vessels. o.o

I can tell there's a lot of hot molten lead of emotion forged into knife-sharp words by determination and intelligence.


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## starwater (Jan 3, 2007)

Thank you for this.


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## MsGreenLantern (Jan 3, 2007)

Oh how I feel your pain! 

The last two guys who said they liked me were all about the lovein' and hung out at my place with all my friends, but the moment we were at a party together....it was like I didn't exist. I never got introduced to their friends or anything!

If I pressed the issue of dating they just drifted away. But they loved to do things with lights on, to touch my big belly, to wrap their arms around me etc. I know they were closeted still. 

Someday I'll find a REAL FA man. :wubu: I'm very hopeful.


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## SoVerySoft (Jan 3, 2007)

Beautifully written. And dead on.

Can't rep you till I spread some around.


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## activistfatgirl (Jan 3, 2007)

Fuzzy Necromancer said:


> Um, I'm open, even talkative, about being an FA, and this post still makes me feel guilty and slightly afraid for my intact blood vessels. o.o
> 
> I can tell there's a lot of hot molten lead of emotion forged into knife-sharp words by determination and intelligence.




Hiya FN, I like the molten lead analogy nice. I'm burning! Sizzle!

No need for guilt though, I do want to say. This applies only to those whom think it applies to, ya know?


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## MisticalMisty (Jan 3, 2007)

SoVerySoft said:


> Beautifully written. And dead on.
> 
> Can't rep you till I spread some around.



got her for you and me!


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## saturdayasusual (Jan 3, 2007)

Boys are stupid.  </immaturity>

Yet when you find one that's the opposite of all those bad things, it's oh so worth it.


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## Ample Pie (Jan 3, 2007)

MisticalMisty said:


> got her for you and me!




ditto to that.


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## snuggletiger (Jan 3, 2007)

Some of us guys love Big girls very much :wubu:


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## BBWTexan (Jan 3, 2007)

I'd give you every bit of rep possible if it would let me.... I should immediately start spreading.


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## djewell (Jan 3, 2007)

note to self: don't have above mentioned qualities


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## admirer (Jan 3, 2007)

My wife is a big girl--and gorgeous too!

I am always letting gals know they need a few pounds and disussing my affinity for voluptuousness and curves. I always say, "What fun is a road without curves? Curves are what make life worth living!"

My head turns for BIG BEAUTIFUL women.

I am a PROUD FA, and I am most adoring and attentive when my wife is NOT one one of her slef-angering and fruitless diets.

I suppose if she did not diet and accumulated all the weight she has lost and gained, she'd be around 800 pounds or so....

ANYWAY, you are beautiful. ALL HAIL DELICIOUS, SOFT AND GORGEOUS FATTIES! I LIVE FOR YOUR GRACE AND ALLURE!!!

Your curves keep a man like me HAPPY!!

LOVE< STEVE


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## Russ2d (Jan 3, 2007)

Great post AFG,

I also have a big problem with stealth FAs, whether they be the ones who want sex with a fat girl but don't want to be seen in public, or live a lie with a thin girlfriend and hide from her what he's really attracted to. They make the rest of us men look bad.

I will tell you that I do not hide my FA-ness.. my friends all know, my work all knows- I've had huge battles at work with other men who tried to talk me out of my "preference"

I am a militant no apologies live life to the fullest FA


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## VanilaGorila (Jan 3, 2007)

Lets stop labeling men as "FA" and that might help. I admire WOMEN and if they happen to be wrapped in fabulous curves, so be it. I don't admire the fat in them; I admire THEM.


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## toni (Jan 3, 2007)

I can identify with this post on so many levels. I have felt this way too many times. I always blame myself for being dumb and falling victim to the "closeted FA". I do not understand why men fight their internal longing. If a fat woman makes you happy why not be with her? Why end up with a thin woman just so you can torture yourself (and her) for the rest of your life? It is not fair for us, for the FA or the thin woman he is using. I hope one day our society will open up it's eyes and accept everyone for who they are and who they want to love.


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## Jack Skellington (Jan 3, 2007)

I'm not hiding. I'm just anti-social.


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## NFA (Jan 3, 2007)

Anyone want to know why I come down on closet FA's so hard? This is why. I've known women who were treated like this. It is deplorable and it is inexcusable. Frankly, its emotional abuse. If an FA is in the closet and stays their alone, at least the only person they hurt with their stupidity is themselves. If they EVER dare try to make their problem someone else's, then they are revealing their complete moral depravity. It makes me upset and it makes me angry, and I won't stand for it. You do NOT treat a woman like this. You do NOT treat any person like this. I don't care if they let you do it them. That doesn't excuse you and it doesn't make it okay. It just makes it sad and tragic and I hope the women who go through this can learn that they don't deserve this and they don't have to put up with it. Then me, I can only hope they will someday learn how stupid and horrible they were and can do a lot to bring their karma back in order.

I am forever grateful that I never "knew enough" to build myself a closet. That I was openly checking out fat girls in grade school. That I never hid a crush because the crushee was fat. That I sent fat girls carnations on "Secret Admirer Day" and meant it and made sure I wasn't very secret. They I dated fat girls in high school and wrote about fat acceptance for the school paper my Freshman year. It was the smartest thing I ever did, and all I had to do was absolutely nothing.


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## PhillyFA (Jan 3, 2007)

I have never dated a thin woman in my life. As a teenager and even in my 20's, I was laughed at by other guys because I liked fat girls. I never let it bother me. The girls I went out with were always at my house, and I always brought them around my friends. I'm happily married to a SSBBW, but I wish she was as confident as some of the lovely ladies on this board. She certainly deserves to be.


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## fatlane (Jan 3, 2007)

What about FAs going undercover to fight terrorism or organized crime? YOU WANT THEM OUT OF HIDING, HUH? 

Answer my question, AFG, if you have the guts to do so. And then post pix plz of said guts tanx.


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## UMBROBOYUM (Jan 3, 2007)

I'm an FA and proud. If you want to talk you can im me at umbroboyum on aim.


FAs are closeted for similar reason like others, fear of reject and truth. That being said, there will always be that guy who likes fat chicks but is to afraid to say it cause everyone else will make fun of him. I've been teased and luaghed at and out right insulted for being an FA, But I don't care, I love women fat or thin... preferably fat. 

-Jon


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## activistfatgirl (Jan 3, 2007)

fatlane said:


> What about FAs going undercover to fight terrorism or organized crime? YOU WANT THEM OUT OF HIDING, HUH?
> 
> Answer my question, AFG, if you have the guts to do so. And then post pix plz of said guts tanx.



Ok, Ok, FL's right. If you're an FA and in hiding for political reasons, I'll give you a second chance.

And I will certainly NOT post pix of my guts here tnx! I'm being serious! *huff*


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## supersoup (Jan 4, 2007)

VanilaGorila said:


> Lets stop labeling men as "FA" and that might help. I admire WOMEN and if they happen to be wrapped in fabulous curves, so be it. I don't admire the fat in them; I admire THEM.



that's all well and good chocolatemonkeyman, but she's talking about FA's, not just men that appreciate women period. the two are completely different. a man claiming to be an FA, to love women of size and be accepting and in admiration of them to his s/o, but hiding this from others is TOTALLY different than a man that appreciates women period doing the same. if you are told to your face that your size is one of your more beautiful physical attributes, something that you've most likely been ashamed of at some point in your life, and led to believe by said person that you are desirable, wanted, sexy, and amazing all due in part to your size, and then shunned when around his friends/family/people outside the 'size realm', it cuts far deeper than if you were with a man that just appreciates women period. if you're with a man that just loves women, you most likely won't be led to believe that your fat is beautiful, again, something you have most likely been embarrassed about at some point in your life, and in all honesty, it would probably never get to the point of you being around his friends or family.

my two cents, and yes, i already know, you don't care.


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## fatlane (Jan 4, 2007)

activistfatgirl said:


> Ok, Ok, FL's right. If you're an FA and in hiding for political reasons, I'll give you a second chance.
> 
> And I will certainly NOT post pix of my guts here tnx! I'm being serious! *huff*



ok nice compromise u cn email me teh pixxorz k?


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## collegeguy2514 (Jan 4, 2007)

i know nobody knows me from some other random member with no rep, but i'd like to throw my $.05 (adjusted for inflation) into the mix. 

AFG, im sorry you've met/been with some shitty guys. i think its pretty fucking lame that a guy wouldnt introduce you to his friends, or any of the other stuff you mentioned. a guy like that has no balls, and hey, who wants a guy with no balls? 

dont get me wrong, im not perfect. i dont wear Tshirts that say "i like fat chicks". i dont walk up to every cute fat girl i see and say "wow, you're really pretty, and you've got a huge ass! wanna go out saturday night?" and i do keep some secrets online. 

but, when i was dating a fat girl, i did introduce her to all my friends. she came to my place often. i even held her hand in public. i did nothing to hide the fact that i really liked her, or that i liked the fact that she was big. 

even though there are some shitty, ball-less FA's out there, i think there are plenty more that wont be ashamed to be seen with you, who'll gladdly let you sleep in their bed, and who will be your knight in shining armour, or whatever the current girly fantasy is. 

chin up kiddo, you'll find him.


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## DenverBHM (Jan 4, 2007)

brilliant statement, AFG. i think all FA's are at least a little guilty


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## swordchick (Jan 4, 2007)

AFG, I understand your feelings. I was in love with an undercover FA for years. I felt that there was something wrong with me. Now, I know that he has the issues. I will not put myself through that anymore. It hurts too much. And there are too many man who will love you as you are, without hiding it.


RUN away from him!


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## Russ2d (Jan 4, 2007)

_Lets stop labeling men as "FA" and that might help. I admire WOMEN and if they happen to be wrapped in fabulous curves, so be it. I don't admire the fat in them; I admire THEM._

Good response Supersoup but since it's directed at me I'll take a small bite from this newb... No, let's not stop "labeling" men as "FA"...we need more men honestly declaring their love of FAT women, that's right love of the FAT these women have... what do you think this board is about newb? You think you're on Oprah? Looking for applause for your BS VanilaGorila .... grow some balls... enough time wasted, moving on


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## wrestlingguy (Jan 4, 2007)

Back around 1998, a few of my buddies thought it would be fun to have a t-shirt made up for me to wear on the boardwalk that summer in Atlantic City. All it said was "I'll take the fat one".............I LOVED it, and wore it that entire summer, much to the concern of my buddies, who all thought I'd gone off the deep end.

I was thinking about a business opportunity recently, and thought that printing shirts with this slogan might be a cool idea, that FA's would love it, and I might make a few bucks developing a line of fat girl support shirts for men.

My question is, things have changed since '98. Would the shirt today say "I WANT the fat one"???? If so, would the guys have the testiculars to wear it, or have times not changed as much as I thought?


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## Cosmic~Wombat (Jan 4, 2007)

Preach on!!!!

Seen "FA's" most of my life claim to love a big girl then pull me asside and say things like "wish I had your courage to go out with such a large woman.. what do your friends say" 

First my friends don't say shit (maybe they know better)

Second, I don't care what they think (They just better not make it verbal)

Third, Courage? What does courage have to do with it?

I have always dated large women, all the way back to middle school. It never occured to me to worry about what other people thought so I wasn't ever in the closet. 

Best wishes from me and Cosmic Jans


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## waldo (Jan 4, 2007)

Russ2d said:


> Great post AFG,
> 
> I also have a big problem with stealth FAs, whether they be the ones who want sex with a fat girl but don't want to be seen in public, or live a lie with a thin girlfriend and hide from her what he's really attracted to. They make the rest of us men look bad.
> 
> ...




Many years ago there was an article in Dimensions describing stealth FAs as those who pursued fat women without actually admitting to anyone usually including the woman herself that he preferred her fat. The ideal situation for a stealth FA (especially one with feeder/encourager tendencies) is to marry a thinner woman and then have her fatten up after marriage. So what we are talking about here is a bit different story, closet FAs who are acting in the shadows. Obviously not cool. The girls get half a relationship, which some may consider better than nothing. In the end it will lead to a lot of hurt and frustration if they are looking for something long-term, because these type of situations (dating on the down-low) can not last for the long term.

I know what you mean by people trying to talk you out of your preference. Parents would often be the worst for this. Or hoping it is just a phase you will grow out of.

Great post by AFG, particularly pointing out the guys who fawn all over the fat girls on Myspace and other online groups. I see some of these girls have hundreds of guys on their Myspace friend list and hundreds of comments on their Myspace pictures about how beautiful and sexy they are and then the same girl is complaining that she can't find any decent guys to date. It doesn't add up. There are clearly a lot of guys out there living in denial of their fat attraction.


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## NFA (Jan 4, 2007)

DenverBHM said:


> brilliant statement, AFG. i think all FA's are at least a little guilty



That's extraordinarily cynical and judgemental. I'll thank you to know that NOT all FA's are even a little guilty of expressing shame for their preference or projecting shame onto a partner.


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## activistfatgirl (Jan 4, 2007)

NFA, I wanted to respond to your earlier post. I love reading what you write, and feel very happy about your passion and drive in doing the FA thing the right way.
One thing I've always wanted to talk to you about is being cautious about being a hero to fat girls. Sure you're out. Sure you've got it down, you know? You're confident and defiant at a world that tells you you should not like fat women. 
But always remember that there's a process that fat women have to go through, and you can't necessarily fix it for them, you know?
If I had met you when I first came on Dims a few years back it would have been no different than the in the closet FAs I met and talk about in my open letter. You would have been this very wonderful person that I couldn't imagine disagreeing with, because I did not yet know how to love myself outside the opinions of others--and those first months of realizing people could be attracted to fat me made me extremely vulnerable--both to closet FAs and strong, opnionated FAs like yourself. We see this over and over with fat women and BHMs who stumble upon this world.
Instead, I've had a chance to go through a process of learning self love and reliance first. Now, a few years later, I can see you as a peer, a friend, not someone with the salving balm.
I think sometimes its ok to let fat women talk for themselves and feel the pain. No army of great FAs can save us from that. And while it sounds nice, I wouldn't choose it.


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## Dark_Hart (Jan 4, 2007)

AFG, I understand your feelings






thanks for sharing :blush:

kisses, :kiss2: 
Dark_Hart


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## one_shy_writer (Jan 4, 2007)

Confessional time. It wasn't because I was embarrassed of him, or because I didn't want my friends to think I was weird. It was because I couldn't deal with the ridicule from people that refused to get to know how good a person he was... the people who just saw a very fat man and immediately wrote him off as lazy, unclean, ambitionless... the people who wouldn't care that he was college-educated, with a good job, and a HUGE heart... it wasn't that it made me feel bad about myself, but more that it KILLED ME to hear people talking badly about him. The kicker was when I did invite him to a party, and my MOTHER of all people took me aside and started making cracks about his weight. I told everyone I was running to the store for more ice... I just wanted to cry in the car for a while.

Three years later, I recently admitted all of this to him. And because he's the greatest person I know, he forgave me. My biggest regret in life to date is that our lives are in places too different now to try at a relationship, because I'm not afraid anymore. Too little, too late...


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## PhillyFA (Jan 4, 2007)

DenverBHM said:


> brilliant statement, AFG. i think all FA's are at least a little guilty



I don't think you should say "all FA's are at least a little guilty." I got ridiculed by people for being an FA, and I never, ever let that bother me. I never "hid" my girlfriend from my family or friends. I'm not guilty at all, and I kinda resent you saying it.


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## Cosmic~Wombat (Jan 4, 2007)

PhillyFA said:


> I don't think you should say "all FA's are at least a little guilty." I got ridiculed by people for being an FA, and I never, ever let that bother me. I never "hid" my girlfriend from my family or friends. I'm not guilty at all, and I kinda resent you saying it.




^5s Philly. I never hid the fact that when I was created for some reason I was attracted to larger women. It is what it is and some accept the fact and follow where the eyes look and some don't and regret it for life.

Great post.


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## ZincDink (Jan 4, 2007)

I think I've been pretty open about being an FA over the years. I've had discussions with my male friends that didn't understand why I was dating fat women.

Having said that, shouldn't the ladies let their men be embarrassed about them for at least as long as the ladies were embarrassed by their own bodies? That gives most guys several years to work it out. 

This comment applies more to the younger bbws among us. Those that are older might want to expect more out of their men from the start.


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## MisticalMisty (Jan 4, 2007)

ZincDink said:


> Having said that, shouldn't the ladies let their men be embarrassed about them for at least as long as the ladies were embarrassed by their own bodies? That gives most guys several years to work it out.



Not just no, hell no. A man never has the right to date anyone they would be embarrassed to be seen with in public. I don't care if the girl has low self confidence, she doesn't deserve to date someone that would be embarrassed and no self respecting man would purposely date a woman they were embarrassed by. 

If a guy needs years to work it out..he needs to be single during those years because he has not right to thrust his issues upon a woman he's dating.

Can I just say that this as to be the most asinine thing I've read in a really long time.


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## indy500tchr (Jan 4, 2007)

MisticalMisty said:


> Not just no, hell no. A man never has the right to date anyone they would be embarrassed to be seen with in public. I don't care if the girl has low self confidence, she doesn't deserve to date someone that would be embarrassed and no self respecting man would purposely date a woman they were embarrassed by.
> 
> If a guy needs years to work it out..he needs to be single during those years because he has not right to thrust his issues upon a woman he's dating.
> 
> Can I just say that this as to be the most asinine thing I've read in a really long time.




HERE HERE Misty! I totally agree with you on that one. Well put pretty lady


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## The Obstreperous Ms. J (Jan 4, 2007)

Amen Misty!!!

:bow: :bow: :bow:


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## snuggletiger (Jan 4, 2007)

Silly question. what's the point in hiding? If people can't accept you for your likes and dislikes, then are these the people that you really need to please and be around?


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## NFA (Jan 4, 2007)

My indignation towards closeted FA's isn't as much about being a "white hat" for BBW's as it is being a hero for myself. I strongly believe that when men behave badly, it is the responsibility of other men to stand up and say so. Far too often, men stay silent when the culture of masculinity presents sexist and abusive attitudes. There were times I stayed silent myself in locker rooms and such, and I'm not the least bit proud about that. Men who don't have negative or abusive attitudes towards women need to speak out and be a part of the solution. We cannot just sit back and say its someone else's problem. It doesn't effect us personally, so we should just keep our mouths shut. I realized this was wrong a very long time ago and I feel I have a duty to speak up to my fellow men.

If men don't speak up, if they see these things as just a woman's problem, then its easy for those who engage in the inappropriate behavior to dismiss the criticism of women. For many, its something they are already inclined to do. They need to understand that this is not just women who have a problem with the inappropriate behavior, but everyone does. Just as I feel I have a responsibility to strongly support racial equality, as a man, I feel I have a responsibility to strongly support gender equality. At its heart, I think the behavior of closeted FA's is both born out of fat prejudice and sexism. Both of which I feel I have a personal responsibility to oppose.

I honestly don't do it to get credit or kudos from BBWs. Really doesn't cross my mind. I don't want to be a hero. I want to be a responsible member of my gender and a responsible FA. Closeted FA's give all FA's a bad name and honestly that is what bothers me the most. My second concern is still not with BBWs, but actually for the closeted FA's, themselves. Even if they aren't being jerks are trying to have things both ways, they are denying themselves something really, really wonderful and fufilling and for no reason. If anyone thought I was a hero to BBWs, I hate to have to tell them they are wrong, but I really want to be a hero to myself and to other FA's.


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## NFA (Jan 4, 2007)

MisticalMisty said:


> Not just no, hell no. A man never has the right to date anyone they would be embarrassed to be seen with in public. I don't care if the girl has low self confidence, she doesn't deserve to date someone that would be embarrassed and no self respecting man would purposely date a woman they were embarrassed by.
> 
> If a guy needs years to work it out..he needs to be single during those years because he has not right to thrust his issues upon a woman he's dating.
> 
> Can I just say that this as to be the most asinine thing I've read in a really long time.



Must spread around, but I hope others can rep you for that.


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## indy500tchr (Jan 4, 2007)

snuggletiger said:


> Silly question. what's the point in hiding? If people can't accept you for your likes and dislikes, then are these the people that you really need to please and be around?



Why do people hide any of their preferences? Because society looks down on them...Peer pressure...Not wanting to be different. 

I wished for a very long time I could hide myself b/c of what the world thought of me but I've learned to LOVE myself for who I am. This is the only body I am gonna have in this world so I better enjoy it while I can. 

FA's have the luxury of having the choice to hide their "abnormal" preference (abnormal according to most of the world) and some just choose to keep it that way no matter who it may hurt.


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## PhillyFA (Jan 4, 2007)

ZincDink said:


> I think I've been pretty open about being an FA over the years. I've had discussions with my male friends that didn't understand why I was dating fat women.
> 
> Having said that, shouldn't the ladies let their men be embarrassed about them for at least as long as the ladies were embarrassed by their own bodies? That gives most guys several years to work it out.
> 
> This comment applies more to the younger bbws among us. Those that are older might want to expect more out of their men from the start.




So, if I understand you correctly, and I'm really not sure I do, so bear with me. For example, a BBW was embarrassed by her body for 5 years. She meets a FA who is in the FA closet. It is OK for the guy to stay in the FA closet for 5 years, because that is the amount of time the BBW was embarrassed/insecure about herself. 

If that is what you are saying, that is the absolutely the most fucked up thing I have ever heard. The only thing I could think of what an FA would have to work out is getting over his embarrassment of being with a BBW. I never had that problem, so I don't know. 

And really, if a man/woman is embarrassed by his woman, then shame on them. I know my wife is self consious about the way she looks, despite the billion and one times I have told her how absolutely gorgeous she is. I wish she could see herself thru my eyes, then she'd see what I see. She doesn't need me *adding* to her insecurities. I would *LOVE* for my wife to wear more revealing clothing, or a bikini to the beach. I wish she could look at herself in the mirror and say "I am a beautiful woman." Hell, I wish she could look into a mirror and just be able to say "I look good today." I make sure I tell her that every day. I wish she wouldn't think that people look at her & stare, and laugh at her, or think she is a "disgusting fat slob." 

Now she doesn't think that way all the time either, but I know those thoughts go thru her head. And that, my friends, is really fucking pitiful.


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## indy500tchr (Jan 4, 2007)

NFA said:


> Must spread around, but I hope others can rep you for that.



Don't worry I took care of that


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## Ample Pie (Jan 4, 2007)

I've never been very good at hiding anything...okay, that isn't true. I can be good at hiding things, but it makes me feel very uncomfortable and unhappy and, eventually, angry with myself when I do. I suppose that makes me not very understanding of people who feel they need to hide. It just seems like lies to me and I can't stand liars/lies.


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## Ample Pie (Jan 4, 2007)

indy500tchr said:


> Don't worry I took care of that


times two.


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## PhillyFA (Jan 4, 2007)

A man never has the right to date anyone they would be embarrassed to be seen with in public. I don't care if the girl has low self confidence, she doesn't deserve to date someone that would be embarrassed and no self respecting man would purposely date a woman they were embarrassed by. 

If a guy needs years to work it out..he needs to be single during those years because he has not right to thrust his issues upon a woman he's dating.

Can I just say that this as to be the most asinine thing I've read in a really long time.


Well said Misty. If someone is embarrassed by their partner, they are really shallow human beings, and I hesitate to call them that. And on a side note, you really DO make fat look damn good!!!


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## UncannyBruceman (Jan 4, 2007)

There's no closet big enough to contain my love for Melissa and for fat women as a whole.

She has had her share of closet cases, too...much like all of you girls may have had at one time or another. Even before I got online and started posting here, I still don't feel like I was ever closeted at any time throughout my years. If anything, I was embarrassed to date a THIN girl. Yes, my first date was with a thin girl when I was 17, and I hated it. Luckily I had friends with me to soften the blow. Anyway, all the women after her were fat, and all of them met my parents and my friends as soon as the opportunity arose. 

Of course, I don't condone the behavior of a closet FA, but Dimensions hasn't reached ALL men just yet...though we are getting closer and closer. What DOES bother me, though, is that we are likely to have an alarming amount of closet cases within our own ranks. A lot of the men in here like to wave the flag and boast and brag...but when I go to the dances and events and such, I'm only one of a small handful of men in the room. When you see how sexually diverse Dimensions is and then go to the dances and see that there's seven women for every one man, it leads one to believe that some of those closet doors are locked tight. 

There have been multiple occasions in which I've publicly and privately invited men to attend the dances in Massachussetts and New York (I'm looking out for you, girls!) and the responses I got sounded something similar to Porky Pig's famed closing statement at the end of a Looney Toons short. They've all got an excuse.

I don't have all the answers, unfortunately. All I can do for now is suggest getting tough on your seemingly closeted boyfriends. Ask them if they're embarrassed to be around you, and threaten them..."if you can't handle a relationship with a fat girl, then I'm going to find someone who can". Any outcome will be for the best, because if he leaves you, then you can find an FA who's confident with himself, or, he'll stay, wake the fuck up, and come to peace with his orientation like I have. While I was never closeted, I was not always this overt. My conversations with Heather Boyle over the years were extremely influential, and now, I've got personal friends taking an interest in fat sex.


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## Krissy12 (Jan 4, 2007)

The first post by AFG just took the words out of my mouth. So beautifully written and so true as well. 

It's just so sad and hurtful when you find out the person you like and who you thought liked you, is ashamed that he finds you attractive. 

Especially when there are so many hot and wonderful men who will love you for who you are. Who will worship you for your mind AND love your body as well. 

Much like the men on this board...*hugs you all*


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## waldo (Jan 4, 2007)

NFA said:


> My indignation towards closeted FA's isn't as much about being a "white hat" for BBW's as it is being a hero for myself. I strongly believe that when men behave badly, it is the responsibility of other men to stand up and say so. Far too often, men stay silent when the culture of masculinity presents sexist and abusive attitudes. There were times I stayed silent myself in locker rooms and such, and I'm not the least bit proud about that. Men who don't have negative or abusive attitudes towards women need to speak out and be a part of the solution. We cannot just sit back and say its someone else's problem. It doesn't effect us personally, so we should just keep our mouths shut. I realized this was wrong a very long time ago and I feel I have a duty to speak up to my fellow men.
> 
> If men don't speak up, if they see these things as just a woman's problem, then its easy for those who engage in the inappropriate behavior to dismiss the criticism of women. For many, its something they are already inclined to do. They need to understand that this is not just women who have a problem with the inappropriate behavior, but everyone does. Just as I feel I have a responsibility to strongly support racial equality, as a man, I feel I have a responsibility to strongly support gender equality. At its heart, I think the behavior of closeted FA's is both born out of fat prejudice and sexism. Both of which I feel I have a personal responsibility to oppose.
> 
> I honestly don't do it to get credit or kudos from BBWs. Really doesn't cross my mind. I don't want to be a hero. I want to be a responsible member of my gender and a responsible FA. Closeted FA's give all FA's a bad name and honestly that is what bothers me the most. My second concern is still not with BBWs, but actually for the closeted FA's, themselves. Even if they aren't being jerks are trying to have things both ways, they are denying themselves something really, really wonderful and fufilling and for no reason. If anyone thought I was a hero to BBWs, I hate to have to tell them they are wrong, but I really want to be a hero to myself and to other FA's.



I have often found myself being silent at hearing the derogatory comments of other men regarding women and one does tend to feel ashamed for not speaking out. And I agree about this tendency to avoid these issues as 'someone else's problem'. This is somewhat analogous to the moderate Muslim majority who supposedly turn a blind eye to the extremists within their ranks. There is a duty to speak up for what is right. I wish there was something more effective than chastisement to convince these guys to come out in the open. As you say, it would be as much (or maybe more) for their own benefit as the women to which they are attracted.



Krissy12 said:


> The first post by AFG just took the words out of my mouth. So beautifully written and so true as well.
> 
> It's just so sad and hurtful when you find out the person you like and who you thought liked you, is ashamed that he finds you attractive.
> 
> ...



Unfortunately, as Bruce pointed out, there are actually far too few open and honorable FAs to go around for all the beautiful fat women who are wanting to hook up with them.
I guess someone needs to get to work on that clone NFA project that was recently suggested on another thread.


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## BBWTexan (Jan 4, 2007)

UncannyBruceman said:


> I don't have all the answers, unfortunately. All I can do for now is suggest getting tough on your seemingly closeted boyfriends. Ask them if they're embarrassed to be around you, and threaten them..."if you can't handle a relationship with a fat girl, then I'm going to find someone who can". Any outcome will be for the best, because if he leaves you, then you can find an FA who's confident with himself, or, he'll stay, wake the fuck up, and come to peace with his orientation like I have.



I think this is the real trick. It's hard and it's kind of scary because you risk losing them completely, but in the end it's the best thing to do. There will come a time in this type of situation where it all starts to wear you down - you realize that he'll probably never want to take that next step with you. In the meantime he'll search out someone who fulfills more of what he considers societal norms, but she loses too because she'll never satisfy him physically and his mind will always be elsewhere. Not only do fat girls not deserve this, but the girls these guys end up with are equally as undeserving.

It's not an easy process, and from someone who's been there, it can take a while to digest. But each and every time this realization is thrown in your face, it will wear down your tolerance just a little bit more. Eventually you'll have had enough of feeling inferior and you'll realize that instead of him being with you until something better came along, it was the other way around. And let me tell you ladies, that feels good!

I feel a bit sorry for these guys because they are the ones losing out, but at the same time they need to just get over it. If you brought home someone of a different race and your family and friends gave you a hard time about it, you'd consider them feeble-minded and possibly racist. However, if they gave you a hard time about bringing home someone who is fantastic, but just happens to be overweight... well, that seems to be okay. My take on it is that if your friends and family have nothing better to do than sit around and judge people based on appearance alone, then they're just pretty miserable people to begin with. I personally choose not to associate with people like that and I'd certainly never place any value on their opinions.

BTW... Glad to see you here Bruce!


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## Spanky (Jan 4, 2007)

Wow. AFG stirrin' the pot again. Just great!

My comments would be that...

1. I don't think most adolescents could ever admit in high school or earlier that they were not concerned with what their peers thought in much (or some) of what they did. The way they dress, talk, walk, date, cars they drive, sports or clubs they're in, music they liked, etc. Adolescence is this way. They are becoming adults, but not quite adults. They are socially immature and lean on the mob (and try to stay with the mob) to strengthen themselves and feel secure socially. 

2. One of the benchmarks IMHO in becoming an adult is learning to be secure in oneself and one's actions, and not give a rip of what other people think. I am not sure I am completely there. I guess I would only know through life's tests. It takes time, sometimes a whole lifetime, and some never reach that point completely. 

3. I cannot speak from any experience, only observation, and it will sound obvious, but being fat in this society has become a huge social burden, fully UNDESERVED, and must be a daily struggle I cannot begin to understand. I try to in my own small way by being here for support and reading the comments made by intelligent adults on this board daily. 

4. Being an FA, unless fat themselves, can't even come close when trying to equate the burden with being fat all of the time. It is not even in the same universe.

5. With all of that said, any of the "men" AFG mentioned may be physically grown men, but socially adolescent. The old mob (society beyond highschool) still rules them. I would put these men in a similar (not same) category with men who feel the need to replant hair on their heads or wear rugs. Why do they do this? Because society says bald is NOT beautiful. In this case, they are embarrassed to be out with THEMSELVES. 

6. The major problem with being socially adolescent is whether you project that onto another person, like a BBW or BHM. A closet (F)FA, a social adolescent, or a bald guy with a rug is doing nothing hurtful until they bring that other person in. In the case of the bald guy, he is hurting no one by bowing to social pressures he brings upon himself. Until they bring that other person into a problematic relationship, they are just struggling along with their own development not hurting anyone. 

No cans for AFG, so I am donating rep on behalf of AFG to Krissy12 since AFG took the words out of her mouth in the first place... 

- Spanky


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## Cosmic~Wombat (Jan 4, 2007)

Spanky said:


> Wow. AFG stirrin' the pot again. Just great!
> 
> My comments would be that...
> 
> ...




me in bold sorry if anyone is offended.. (not really sorry)


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## Cosmic~Wombat (Jan 4, 2007)

<b> is me </b> is when I stop talking


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## Fuzzy Necromancer (Jan 4, 2007)

DenverBHM said:


> brilliant statement, AFG. i think all FA's are at least a little guilty



No, I'm not. Have you met me? Do you personally know everybody on the planet who considers fat women attractive? Then don't inform us of guilt.


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## UncannyBruceman (Jan 4, 2007)

Fuzzy Necromancer said:


> No, I'm not. Have you met me? Do you personally know everybody on the planet who considers fat women attractive? Then don't inform us of guilt.



I echo this sentiment. When it comes to being a closet case, I am guilty of nothing. Every fat girl I've ever been with was proudly introduced to friends and family. Anyone who didn't approve was simply cut off.


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## ciaobella (Jan 4, 2007)

Thank you for this post!

I have felt this in the past about a closeted FA, the kind who was so into fat girls he is the one who introduced me to this site. Yet he was never secure in his choice, afraid of what I don't know, don't care, probably of other people's opinions.

In the end his love for my curves helped bring me out of the closet in the sense that that was the pivotal moment when I decided it was ok to want to be fat, contrary to what people had been telling me my whole life. I wish I had been the one to bring him out of the closet some days, others I wonder if he ever will get there. Either way I'm happy, I met the love of my life, a man who is proud to show me off to everyone he knows.  

Guess what I am saying is that for me the whole experience was bitter sweet, and perhaps in time it will be for you too.


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## Regular Bill (Jan 4, 2007)

Thats the only thing I can think of that keep's anyone in the closet. You have every right to be angry. You also have the right,as others have said, to have someone who wants you in their life no matter what. Don't settle for second best.


Bill


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## GPL (Jan 4, 2007)

You are so right, AFG, and we ALL know it... Now if we all act like real FAs it would be a lot easier and a lot more respectfull against BBWs.
You did your name ActivistFatGirl a big honour with this post, lol!!

GPL.


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## supersoup (Jan 4, 2007)

Fuzzy Necromancer said:


> No, I'm not. Have you met me? Do you personally know everybody on the planet who considers fat women attractive? Then don't inform us of guilt.



high fives to you sir, and to bruceman as well.


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## Green Eyed Fairy (Jan 4, 2007)

I <3 AFG

I'm having a hard time imagining what was going on in the minds of some of those d*cks that made her feel this way....

*bops them all in the nose with her fairy wand*


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## MisterGuy (Jan 4, 2007)

The OP is really well-written and a good look at a woman's feelings on the subject. I have to admit that when I was younger, I was definitely closeted. I'm not looking for any sympathy on the subject, because what FAs have to go through in terms of self-actualization, fat women have to go through times a zillion, but let it be said that the amount of peer-pressure out there against being attracted to larger women is staggering. From the moment you're aware of women, you're aware that there's something shameful about women being overweight, and about liking those women. 

I think it's fairly normal for a lot of FAs (myself being one) to be closeted and conflicted through their teens and early/mid twenties--a time in your life when most people place too much emphasis on what others think of them. I'm now 31, have been dating a big woman for a while, and could care less what people think of me and my tastes in things, but it took a while. If I were to guess, I'd say my experience is perhaps more common than that of some of the posters in this forum who never thought twice about it or cared what others thought. 

This isn't at all meant to excuse the behavior the OP describes, just my .02 on the subject and to provide another perspective.


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## cactopus (Jan 4, 2007)

supersoup said:


> ...if you're with a man that just loves women, you most likely won't be led to believe that your fat is beautiful, again, something you have most likely been embarrassed about at some point in your life, and in all honesty, it would probably never get to the point of you being around his friends or family.
> 
> my two cents, and yes, i already know, you don't care.



Which brings up an interesting point I was facing since my own relationship probably won't last. I was talking to my mother who is a wonderful sweetheart and I love and cherish my very close relationship with her. She's not a large person so this wouldn't directly affect her comments but she was suggesting that if I needed to find someone else that I shouldn't let that person ever know about my FA'ness (or by tangent participation in the community however that is done) because said target of my affection wouldn't ever feel like she was my "one and only". While I can see some point to her argument, I think I'd set myself up for great potential future pain.

Who knows, though?


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## cactopus (Jan 4, 2007)

wrestlingguy said:


> My question is, things have changed since '98. Would the shirt today say "I WANT the fat one"???? If so, would the guys have the testiculars to wear it, or have times not changed as much as I thought?



I've wrestled with the idea of it being thought too crass but I think I'd be tempted to slip one of these on:

http://www.dumptruckstuff.com/dumptruck_guys/dumptruck_guysimages/dumptruck_blacktshirt.jpg


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## Danyull (Jan 4, 2007)

Hmm, I suppose its not that I'm ashamed of it, I guess its socity and how people see you, I mean if people like figured out I liked large women, it shouldn't be hard considering how much I've hinted it out, I've had three large and beautifull girlfriends, and I've even told my friends I'd rather have a larger woman to a slimer one.

I'm just a kind of guy who as open as I am about the matter, I'm still feel like I hide something, or feel ashamed of something, not of the woman, but of myself, I'm not the greatest looking guy, and never have been, I sppose its my own size as well, I'm slim, and I guess people see it as out of place for me =/

I'm not sure, but what you've said certiainly has put a diffrent perspective on the matter.


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## eightyseven (Jan 4, 2007)

First things first... I love so much of what has been said in this post and AFG's original statement was so strong and well-put. Kudos to everyone who has commented... this is one of those threads that you just cannot help but read all the way through.

I just wanted to throw something else into the mix. Yes, we know being in the closet is not a healthy thing for both the person in the closet and the people that become intertwined in the closeted person's personal life. But, let's too recognize that being in the closet is generally a product of social pressure. Yes, their actions (much like the ones AFG is describing) are hurtful and wrong, but does that mean they are awful people? Personally, I don't think so. I do think it means that they're living in fear, which WE know is entirely irrational but THEY may not. These cannot be terrible people because they are meeting others and developing some sorts of relationships. So, instead of alienating them and passing them off as jerks who just want to get some, let's each do our parts in creating a culture that doesn't require that GOOD people have to be afraid of their preferences and feelings. I'm not making excuses, I'm just saying that some of the best and most positively vocal FA's and FFA's have been in the closet at one point in their life. Yes, they need to mature. Why not help the process along? That is all.


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## supersoup (Jan 4, 2007)

cactopus said:


> Which brings up an interesting point I was facing since my own relationship probably won't last. I was talking to my mother who is a wonderful sweetheart and I love and cherish my very close relationship with her. She's not a large person so this wouldn't directly affect her comments but she was suggesting that if I needed to find someone else that I shouldn't let that person ever know about my FA'ness (or by tangent participation in the community however that is done) because said target of my affection wouldn't ever feel like she was my "one and only". While I can see some point to her argument, I think I'd set myself up for great potential future pain.
> 
> Who knows, though?



oy, i don't know about that!! i don't see how this possible new mate wouldn't think they were your one and only, but that's just me. i can understand a man not being up front at first, and saying right off the bat, 'hey, i'm an FA', but if you told her later on, i know personally, i wouldn't think i wasn't your one and only.

i think the main thing to remember is if you call yourself an FA, then be an FA. at the end of the day, does it really matter what anyone thinks of your preferences? no. at the end of the day is anyone else but you left to reflect on your life choices? no. fuck what anyone thinks. i know lots of people think i'm disgusting, but on the other hand, there's lots that love how i look. so fuck those that hate me, and thank you to those that think lovely things of me. that's why i love this site. it's changed me tremendously in the short time i've been here. 

you've got one shot in this shithole, make yourself happy, screw everyone else.

end rant.


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## Ample Pie (Jan 4, 2007)

Being in the closet may not make you awful, just fearful. But being in the closet and still wrapping your shame-filled life up with someone else is pretty awful. It's like NFA said, people who stay in the closet and keep it to themselves only hurt themselves, but the someone who unleashes his/her closetedness on other people--specifically people who should be treated as partners and with real concern--IS hurting other people and that is awful.


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## Danyull (Jan 4, 2007)

Rebecca said:


> Being in the closet may not make you awful, just fearful. But being in the closet and still wrapping your shame-filled life up with someone else is pretty awful. It's like NFA said, people who stay in the closet and keep it to themselves only hurt themselves, but the someone who unleashes his/her closetedness on other people--specifically people who should be treated as partners and with real concern--IS hurting other people and that is awful.



Though, I'm adamant about posting this, but its just something on my mind.

Even a person who is proud enough to step out of that proverbial closet can easily be knocked back into it, people critisize, gossip and throw around abuse all the time, but if it ends up being about a persons FAness, in todays socity its seen as a joke for a FA to admire a large woman, and many people can use this against you, and eventually hurt the person who took that risk to come out the closet, theres a higher chance of the worse happening vs the good. There may be good that does come out of it, but what about the long run?


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## supersoup (Jan 4, 2007)

i just don't understand. 

why does it matter what someone else thinks? i just can't compute it. so what if someone has a problem with it? are you going to live your life making choices for yourself that make others happy, and not you? that's ridiculous. fuck other people. if someone cracks a joke, you crack a kneecap, and you make different friends. it really isn't a hard thing to do. and if your family is in on the making fun, you alienate until they accept. people that live their lives for others are a waste, just like the people that are 'forcing' them to act as such.


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## eightyseven (Jan 4, 2007)

Rebecca said:


> Being in the closet may not make you awful, just fearful. But being in the closet and still wrapping your shame-filled life up with someone else is pretty awful. It's like NFA said, people who stay in the closet and keep it to themselves only hurt themselves, but the someone who unleashes his/her closetedness on other people--specifically people who should be treated as partners and with real concern--IS hurting other people and that is awful.



Again, I agree with you. But look at the root of the problem that is closeted people "unleashing" on others. It's desperation. It's a cry for help. Usually, when people cry for help and are really honest about needing it, there is somewhere for them to go to understand what they need to do to stop hurting themselves and others. Do you think closeted people WANT to hurt themselves and others? I don't think so. Yes, closeted people should not entagle their "shame-filled" lives with other people who obviously deserve to be treated wonderfully, like anyone else. However, what do you expect these people to do? Most people who can't recognize that they have a problem also don't know how to act properly in regards to that problem. Everyone wants to meet others and be satisfied on an emotional and physical level. Instead of criminalizing closet FA's for being confused and afraid, let's treat them like someone who's questioning their sexuality- WITH SUPPORT. That's the only way they're going to learn to love themselves and others in a proper fashion. I'm not saying support what they're doing, but support their quest to find themselves in POSITIVE ways. Guide them, be a force in their lives. Be frank with them. Bring them to Dimensions. Anything.


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## Danyull (Jan 4, 2007)

supersoup said:


> i just don't understand.
> 
> why does it matter what someone else thinks? i just can't compute it. so what if someone has a problem with it? are you going to live your life making choices for yourself that make others happy, and not you? that's ridiculous. fuck other people. if someone cracks a joke, you crack a kneecap, and you make different friends. it really isn't a hard thing to do. and if your family is in on the making fun, you alienate until they accept. people that live their lives for others are a waste, just like the people that are 'forcing' them to act as such.



Even though I take into account what you say, not everyone has that outlook on life, not everyone is the kind of person to do that, I can take a joke, and I'm as sarcastic as hell and would normally reply with something that they'll be to dumbfounded to reply back at, and as much as I don't care about what people say, I'm just saying there are those closet hangers, those that are easily startled back into that closet.

I have accepting friends one of them is sarcastic and as stubbborn as me but his not an FA he thinks his a regular comidian =/

But I for onr would easily go out with a woman of anysize.

Again I'm just mentioning, there are those who arer like how I said.


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## wrestlingguy (Jan 4, 2007)

eightyseven said:


> First things first... I love so much of what has been said in this post and AFG's original statement was so strong and well-put. Kudos to everyone who has commented... this is one of those threads that you just cannot help but read all the way through.
> 
> I just wanted to throw something else into the mix. Yes, we know being in the closet is not a healthy thing for both the person in the closet and the people that become intertwined in the closeted person's personal life. But, let's too recognize that being in the closet is generally a product of social pressure. Yes, their actions (much like the ones AFG is describing) are hurtful and wrong, but does that mean they are awful people? Personally, I don't think so. I do think it means that they're living in fear, which WE know is entirely irrational but THEY may not. These cannot be terrible people because they are meeting others and developing some sorts of relationships. So, instead of alienating them and passing them off as jerks who just want to get some, let's each do our parts in creating a culture that doesn't require that GOOD people have to be afraid of their preferences and feelings. I'm not making excuses, I'm just saying that some of the best and most positively vocal FA's and FFA's have been in the closet at one point in their life. Yes, they need to mature. Why not help the process along? That is all.



That may be true for some, eighty seven, so I guess I must have just been lucky in that I was never in the closet. I was raised to treat the person I was with with the respect that they deserved, which meant your family & friends got to meet them. My dad.......not an FA, but what a guy!

I guess my issue here is that fat people always seem to be the ones making the adjustment, so the world MIGHT change. Sad fact is, it usually doesn't. Every fat person has had to feel the same humiliation over & over again. At least most of baseball stopped that shit with Jackie Robinson, if ya get my point.

BTW, I've always loved that shirt, Cactopus. Wish I had thought of it first. Back to the drawing board.


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## Still a Skye fan (Jan 4, 2007)

activistfatgirl said:


> I'm curious if other fat women or BHMs would share if they've had experiences with FAs still in the closet or ashamed of their attraction. I think something just snapped tonight and I'm feeling that raw frustration. Been there?
> 
> Here's a little letter:
> 
> ...




Well put...however, I'm not hiding anywhere and plan on looking around better in 2007.


Dennis


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## NFA (Jan 4, 2007)

eightyseven said:


> Again, I agree with you. But look at the root of the problem that is closeted people "unleashing" on others. It's desperation. It's a cry for help. Usually, when people cry for help and are really honest about needing it, there is somewhere for them to go to understand what they need to do to stop hurting themselves and others. Do you think closeted people WANT to hurt themselves and others? I don't think so. Yes, closeted people should not entagle their "shame-filled" lives with other people who obviously deserve to be treated wonderfully, like anyone else. However, what do you expect these people to do? Most people who can't recognize that they have a problem also don't know how to act properly in regards to that problem. Everyone wants to meet others and be satisfied on an emotional and physical level. Instead of criminalizing closet FA's for being confused and afraid, let's treat them like someone who's questioning their sexuality- WITH SUPPORT. That's the only way they're going to learn to love themselves and others in a proper fashion. I'm not saying support what they're doing, but support their quest to find themselves in POSITIVE ways. Guide them, be a force in their lives. Be frank with them. Bring them to Dimensions. Anything.



I expect those people to keep their shame to themselves and not make it someone else's problem. A closeted FA who stays there alone is just stupid. I'm not going to avoid calling them stupid, because that IS what they are. I can't sugercoat it or treat them with kid gloves over it. They are denying themselves something extraordinarily wonderful for no good reason. If that's not stupid, I don't know what is. I'm not going to worry about their feelings getting hurt trying to get them to realize what they are doing to themselves. They are making a mistake and sometimes you just have to say that.

BUT, any closeted FA who tries to have it both ways is being selfish, manipulative, and emotionally abusive. I won't stand for that. If they want my respect, they'll need to stop what they are doing, apologize to the parties they hurt if possible, and start trying to be a better person. Because so long as they think there was nothing wrong with dating BBW's from the "closet", they aren't a good person. They are exhibiting abusive behavior and I'm SURE not going to be afraid of hurting their feelings by saying so. I don't think they are unredeemable people. I think everyone can find some redemption for their bad actions. But they do need to understand and be sorry about the pain the caused people. If they cannot see that and understand it, then they are no different from someone who is doing that currently. Its emotional abuse, plain and simple. I don't care if its a "cry for help" or an act of "desperation". They are emotionally abusing another person in a very serious way, and as a society I don't think we can tolerate that. These people won't see the error of their ways if everyone is too afraid to tell them they are in error with their ways. There is a point where people need to take responsibility for their actions and for the harm they cause others. If someone is willing to do that, great. They are taking an important step and I applaud them for it and urge them to continue the effort to make ammends. But if they don't or won't, then I'm going to call them out for it. Because its wrong. And I can't stay silent about that. If you are ashamed of being an FA, that's a mistake. But you are your own victim. If you try to live in shame while getting sex in the shadows, you've decided that instead of suffering yourself, you'll make someone else suffer. No. That is unacceptable behavior. And it demands to be called unacceptable.

As to men who stay in their self-made closets out of fear of social stigmas as Daynul describes, I don't have sympathy for them. It really is a problem of their own making and constructing a closet to hide in serves no useful purpose. For all this talk about FA's closets, the fact remains that a fat person enjoys NO such luxury. They cannot hide from being fat. They have to deal with it every day of their lives. They deal. I just don't think its right for an FA to claim a closet for themselves when the objects of their interest, and the direct object of the shame they are responding to, can't. But again, they are really only hurting themselves, so I denounce that very purely out of the hope that it'll knock some sense into the closet dwellers. Look at this way, closet-dwellers. If someone insults you for being next to a fat person, they are insulting YOU. Get indignant. Get offended. That's how you respond to people insulting you. By running off to a closet, you just adopt the attitude that this is all someone else's problem and you can run away from it and hide. Well, its not someone else's problem. Its YOUR problem. The scorn shown your dates is scorn being shown YOU. Don't cower away in shame. Get angry! Take it personnally, because it IS personnal. As long as you look at it as someone else's problem, you'll never break out of your closet. But still, for a reality check, no one is going to insult you. Oh, they might joke, but friends do that. They might insult your date. Feel free to take that personnally, but its still not directly about you. Fact is, no one cares what the women you date are shaped like. If they do, then they care about who YOU are and you need to respond appropriately.


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## Fuzzy Necromancer (Jan 4, 2007)

Danyull said:


> Though, I'm adamant about posting this, but its just something on my mind.
> 
> Even a person who is proud enough to step out of that proverbial closet can easily be knocked back into it, people critisize, gossip and throw around abuse all the time, but if it ends up being about a persons FAness, in todays socity its seen as a joke for a FA to admire a large woman, and many people can use this against you, and eventually hurt the person who took that risk to come out the closet, theres a higher chance of the worse happening vs the good. There may be good that does come out of it, but what about the long run?



Once said, nothing can be unsaid. When you're out of the closet, you stay out.


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## Danyull (Jan 4, 2007)

Fuzzy Necromancer said:


> Once said, nothing can be unsaid. When you're out of the closet, you stay out.



True that.. Thoug there are those that fear it, and can somehow cover it up, like, "It was just a joke" or "It never happened" Beleve me I live in regret for denying myself that time, and I will never allow it to happen again. I met this girl Laura Early four years ago, we were pretty good friends and she was definatly on the over weight side, but she was cute. I invited her round to mine one day, and we made out, soon after I asked her out. But me being the arogant guy I was at the time, denied everything at school. I crushed her. Its hard for me to say something like this, but I'm using it to show you as an example of what can become of it. And yes it does bring me to the verge of tears each time I remeber it.

Hold on a tick, Fuzzy necromancer?

Your litterally every where.

Gaia, PAWG, DA, here. o.o


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## Regular Bill (Jan 4, 2007)

I am glad I'm an uncloseted FA because I wouldn't want to be on the business end of that fairy wand of yours!!  






Green Eyed Fairy said:


> I <3 AFG
> 
> I'm having a hard time imagining what was going on in the minds of some of those d*cks that made her feel this way....
> 
> *bops them all in the nose with her fairy wand*


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## activistfatgirl (Jan 4, 2007)

Green Eyed Fairy said:


> I <3 AFG
> 
> I'm having a hard time imagining what was going on in the minds of some of those d*cks that made her feel this way....
> 
> *bops them all in the nose with her fairy wand*



Only a few were dicks. Some I still love. 

But, a bop could do some good!  Thanks Green Eyes!


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## activistfatgirl (Jan 4, 2007)

eightyseven said:


> Again, I agree with you. But look at the root of the problem that is closeted people "unleashing" on others. It's desperation. It's a cry for help. Usually, when people cry for help and are really honest about needing it, there is somewhere for them to go to understand what they need to do to stop hurting themselves and others. Do you think closeted people WANT to hurt themselves and others? I don't think so. Yes, closeted people should not entagle their "shame-filled" lives with other people who obviously deserve to be treated wonderfully, like anyone else. However, what do you expect these people to do? Most people who can't recognize that they have a problem also don't know how to act properly in regards to that problem. Everyone wants to meet others and be satisfied on an emotional and physical level. Instead of criminalizing closet FA's for being confused and afraid, let's treat them like someone who's questioning their sexuality- WITH SUPPORT. That's the only way they're going to learn to love themselves and others in a proper fashion. I'm not saying support what they're doing, but support their quest to find themselves in POSITIVE ways. Guide them, be a force in their lives. Be frank with them. Bring them to Dimensions. Anything.



Ben you have some a warm heart and will make a great counselor if that's what you choose to do.
Of course this is what we do everyday around here at Dimensions. Many, many new folks to FAdom come here and ask for help, and we discuss. We dialogue. Thread after thread of talking through different scenarios. BBWs talk about their take, experienced FAs round it out. This is the stuff of this website.
However, I hope you can understand that when I do that for a closet FA, I'm happy. When I do it for a closet FA that is my boyfriend, my first love, my new hot date, the great guy I never knew was in a closet...that's a different story. My post is not about criminalizing anyone. It's about recognizing a shared experience as a fat woman and saying "I can't do this right now" or "I'm tired". If you want to pick up the pieces of those fine closeted FAs, I'll send you their numbers. 

As far as shared experiences, I've had so many, many, many kudos from women who said the understood. A really wonderful and cathartic process this is, and I'm very glad to know there's a few women reading this that are like I was 5 years ago. Maybe this can save some pain.

And maybe there's some closeted FAs who will think about what they need to be defiant to cultural norms. To you I can say: good luck! But don't call me until you're ready, hoss.

To everyone else who has commented, there are so many good pieces here. I could never comment on them. I nod at you all.


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## Spanky (Jan 4, 2007)

activistfatgirl said:


> To everyone else who has commented, there are so many good pieces here. I could never comment on them. I nod at you all.



<pops head up> Is it dogs in hats time yet??

<looks around with crickets chirping in the background> Uh, just kidding.

<disappears back in hole>


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## activistfatgirl (Jan 4, 2007)

Spanky said:


> <pops head up> Is it dogs in hats time yet??
> 
> <looks around with crickets chirping in the background> Uh, just kidding.
> 
> <disappears back in hole>



I'd be so mad if you posted a dog in a hat now since this thread is going wonderfully. I'd have to write an angry Dear Spanky letter and post it. :batting:


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## Tooz (Jan 4, 2007)

Kind of on topic, kinda not. Can we tack on a scolding for FAs (or whatever you call them) who don't have the courage to talk to an obviously single bbw/bhm/whatever? Been discussed elsewhere, but I feel it kinda has part here, too.


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## VanilaGorila (Jan 5, 2007)

supersoup said:


> that's all well and good chocolatemonkeyman, but she's talking about FA's, not just men that appreciate women period. the two are completely different. a man claiming to be an FA, to love women of size and be accepting and in admiration of them to his s/o, but hiding this from others is TOTALLY different than a man that appreciates women period doing the same. if you are told to your face that your size is one of your more beautiful physical attributes, something that you've most likely been ashamed of at some point in your life, and led to believe by said person that you are desirable, wanted, sexy, and amazing all due in part to your size, and then shunned when around his friends/family/people outside the 'size realm', it cuts far deeper than if you were with a man that just appreciates women period. if you're with a man that just loves women, you most likely won't be led to believe that your fat is beautiful, again, something you have most likely been embarrassed about at some point in your life, and in all honesty, it would probably never get to the point of you being around his friends or family.
> 
> my two cents, and yes, i already know, you don't care.



Then your so called "FA in hiding" or whatever, is a contradiction of terms. If a man is in "hiding", he isn't an "FA", he's got some kind of fetish and he uses you as a release in private. Maybe I am an "FA" 'cause I'd take my woman to the nicest wine bar here in Ventura, grab her butt at the bar then take her dancing at Bombays.


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## babyjeep21 (Jan 5, 2007)

Wow.... This is incredibly powerful. Thank you for sharing!


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## liz (di-va) (Jan 5, 2007)

Chimin in from the peanut gallery to say it's so fab to see a thread where people are talking and exhanging experiences from different parts of the woods and tout...so fabulous. Reading it avidly. Warms me cockles. And AFG thanks for starting it (BEEN THERE).

My one thought to add: People in the closet about anything who stay there, even if they're not unleashing themselve on others, sure do hurt themselves. Hurts the universe for people to not let out the love and lust. Don't think it's what God wants. Easier said than done in this life (I'm firmly convinced you can stay closeted even as a fat person--in a way), but let the juices flow!


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## SchecterFA (Jan 5, 2007)

I would be open about being an FA, but first I would have to get over being so extremely reserved about anything regarding sexuality. I don't know if you could call it genophobia or what, but I have some hang-ups regarding intimacy.


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## Ample Pie (Jan 5, 2007)

I still say, being in the closet and not letting that affect other people only hurts one person--and that's their choice and none of my business, but this thread isn't about that. It's about closet cases who let their ashamedness affect other people--and that's a choice, and making that choice, in my opinion, is cruel. 

I really am sorry some people choose to stay in the closet. I'm sorry some people are afraid enough to think they have to stay in the closet. I feel bad for them. Until they start unleashing their fear and insecurity on other people. Then, I don't have pity, just disgust.

Essentially, being closeted shouldn't be "criminalized" but being selfish and destructive of others--which I think it what AFG's earlier comments indicated--that's a whole other ball of wax. They're two seperate issues.


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## supersoup (Jan 5, 2007)

VanilaGorila said:


> Then your so called "FA in hiding" or whatever, is a contradiction of terms. If a man is in "hiding", he isn't an "FA", he's got some kind of fetish and he uses you as a release in private. Maybe I am an "FA" 'cause I'd take my woman to the nicest wine bar here in Ventura, grab her butt at the bar then take her dancing at Bombays.



it most definitely is not a contradiction in terms sir. there are many women here that can tell you about the closeted FA's they've been involved with, as well as the closeted FA's themselves that are on this board!!


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## PhillyFA (Jan 5, 2007)

VanilaGorila said:


> Then your so called "FA in hiding" or whatever, is a contradiction of terms. If a man is in "hiding", he isn't an "FA", he's got some kind of fetish and he uses you as a release in private. Maybe I am an "FA" 'cause I'd take my woman to the nicest wine bar here in Ventura, grab her butt at the bar then take her dancing at Bombays.



I don't see where taking your woman to a bar and then grabbing her butt and taking her dancing makes you an FA. To me, being an FA is loving a woman of size, and wanting to spend every moment with her. Taking her places is great, and you should go out and NOT be afraid, worried, embarrassed, as to what other people think of you because you are with her. 

I love the soft feel of my wife, and the way her body jiggles when she walks. I love watching her put on a pair of jeans. And making love...well, I mean, WOW!!! But I love her for more than just her body. First of all, I defy any man to look into her eyes and not get completely lost, it's just not possible. I love her sense of humor, even though we don't always think the same things are funny. How she doesn't find the Three Stooges funny is beyond me, but I live with it. And the most important thing of all, she's my best friend. 

Now I'm not saying that I haven't been to a bar with my wife and grabbed her butt, cause then I'd be lying. But that isn't what makes me an FA.


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## cactopus (Jan 5, 2007)

supersoup said:


> i just don't understand.
> .... fuck other people. if someone cracks a joke, you crack a kneecap, and you make different friends. it really isn't a hard thing to do. and if your family is in on the making fun, you alienate until they accept. people that live their lives for others are a waste, just like the people that are 'forcing' them to act as such.



OK where do I sign up for the fan club and newsletter?

Couldn't have said it better myself.


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## The Obstreperous Ms. J (Jan 5, 2007)

May I suggest National FA Coming Out Day?? You know, pick a day to wear a FA /size positive shirt?

I remember in college, my junior year, this one girl came to class one day wearing a "I'm not a lesbian, but my girlfriend is" t-shirt on National Coming Out Day. Man, I was in awe of her bravery.(I didn't know she was! and trust me, it was a very small college and we were together in EVERY class since we had the same major)
She fielded questions all day. People snickered, people were in shock, but most importantly, her friends stayed close to her and supported her decision to come out.
It soon became a non issue. That is what she is. Cool. Good for her.

I'm all for people taking the grassroots approach to it, maybe if we all pick a day and just do it...


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## The Obstreperous Ms. J (Jan 5, 2007)

Seriously y'all. Where is OUR Stonewall?!?!?!? Where is OUR Woodstock??? Where is OUR parade???


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## GPL (Jan 5, 2007)

Those of you who have seen the UK programm "Chubby Chasers" last year, with HeatherBBW, BeaBea and lots of other BBWs in it, will remember the guy who took this SSBBW lady over to his house and fed her to immobility against her will and locked her up in one of his rooms. This guy dated several SSBBW's and never showed them to friends or family. The woman never saw anyone during the time she was kept in his house. Not only was this guy too afraid for showing his preferations and fetishes, he also kidnapped this woman!! The thought to this programm came into my mind with this thread...

If you cant deal with your preferences, please leave the bigger ladies alone and date a skinny girl!

GPL.


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## Fuzzy Necromancer (Jan 5, 2007)

Danyull said:


> True that.. Thoug there are those that fear it, and can somehow cover it up, like, "It was just a joke" or "It never happened" Beleve me I live in regret for denying myself that time, and I will never allow it to happen again. I met this girl Laura Early four years ago, we were pretty good friends and she was definatly on the over weight side, but she was cute. I invited her round to mine one day, and we made out, soon after I asked her out. But me being the arogant guy I was at the time, denied everything at school. I crushed her. Its hard for me to say something like this, but I'm using it to show you as an example of what can become of it. And yes it does bring me to the verge of tears each time I remeber it.
> 
> Hold on a tick, Fuzzy necromancer?
> 
> ...



You forgot fanfiction.net and the fluid fantasy forum.  

Anyway, how does that make me everywhere? It only shows that I'm at as many forums as you are. o.0

I just use the same name throughout, unlike some people. Minor exceptions for alloted length, like NecromancerFuz on writing.com and R.M.G.C.L.F. on the Wizards of the Coast boards.

*shakes head*

What shame.


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## itsfine (Jan 5, 2007)

I don't think I've ever had to deal with a closet FA. 

But if a guy did something like that to me, I'd probably kill him. 









(totally kidding there. I'd really just forget about him!)


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## UncannyBruceman (Jan 5, 2007)

supersoup said:


> if someone cracks a joke, you crack a kneecap, and you make different friends. it really isn't a hard thing to do. and if your family is in on the making fun, you alienate until they accept.



Already done it. Out of the many friends who have met my girlfriends in the past, only ONE of them dared to question my FA tendencies. To make a long story short, I basically said "if I were gay, would you question me as to why?". When she said "no", I replied by saying "well this is also an orientation, so leave it alone". And she did.

I think the secret to avoiding jokes from your friends is to be as verbal about it as you can. While my friends are quite used to seeing me with fat girls as dates or steady girlfriends, it wasn't really until recent years that I started sharing my orientation in a conversation. Years ago, when asked "why fat girls", my answer would be "that's what I like". But that's not enough, seemingly, because people will still think "he must think that he can't do any better". And that's precisely why I changed my answer. Now, when asked, I say "I love how they look, I love how they feel, and the sex is fucking out of this world". I've seen many sets of eyes light up since I started putting it in those words, and I can honestly say that my friends respect and even admire my orientation. They see a man who takes great pride in something that is not widely accepted, and they respect that. I've got more support from my friends now than I have ever had in the past, and it's a wonderful feeling; they're all dying to meet Melissa!!

My parents came around, too. I'm not all that comfortable talking to them about fat sex, to be honest, but my last girlfriend was just so sweet and kind that she got them to look beyond her size and love her as one of their own. I have no doubt that Melissa will do the same when she meets them.


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## UncannyBruceman (Jan 5, 2007)

VanilaGorila said:


> Then your so called "FA in hiding" or whatever, is a contradiction of terms. If a man is in "hiding", he isn't an "FA", he's got some kind of fetish and he uses you as a release in private. Maybe I am an "FA" 'cause I'd take my woman to the nicest wine bar here in Ventura, grab her butt at the bar then take her dancing at Bombays.



It's not exactly a contradiction. So many FA's out there will date a fat girl but they will avoid public places. They know what they want, but can't handle it. Not all FA's are at ease with their orientation as we are (between groping our women in the bar, taking them to dinner, to dances, etc). I can't say that I was ever like that, but I know someone who is. He hasn't been to the nightclub in a few years, but not too long ago, he'd show up once a month with a slightly chubby girl on his arm. But he never introduced them to anyone and he always had a vacant look on his face. Next thing I know, when my ex did a photo shoot for BigCuties in 2003, another friend of mine said "Jay found Karen's pictures on this site...had no idea why he was looking, though...". I knew why. I knew exactly why. Since that happened, I haven't seen him. Maybe he was embarrassed, I can't say. And I wouldn't have gotten mad at him for leaking the "secret" out, either. It would have been nice to know that I wasn't the only FA at the club. Wherever he is now, I hope that he has come to peace with his orientation. He's very friendly and very handsome, it'd be a shame for the ladies to lose out because he was ashamed of being an FA.


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## The Obstreperous Ms. J (Jan 5, 2007)

UncannyBruceman said:


> . Wherever he is now, I hope that he has come to peace with his orientation. He's very friendly and very handsome, it'd be a shame for the ladies to lose out because he was ashamed of being an FA.



Bruce, make sure you send along my info along to his FA, I'll drag him out of the closet and he will thank me for it   

Just doing a public service, folks. No need to thank me


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## NFA (Jan 5, 2007)

On the "but you can do better/you can't do better" line some FA's get subjected to, I'm reminded of my favorite comeback I've never gotten to use because no one every gives me a hard time about being an FA. (I'll get asked about it, but usually out of genuine curiosity)

"I can't do better than a fat woman. I just mean that differently than you do."


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## Renaissance Woman (Jan 5, 2007)

It was mentioned briefly before, but here's the main thing that gets me about the "hiding" FAs. They CAN hide. I can't. I'm fat all day, every day, everywhere I go. No hiding that. I can't confide in select number of close friends or family about the fact that I'm fat, I can't go out with a guy who secretly knows I'm fat, I can't post on a message board about being fat and then go out looking all skinny, and most important, I haven't had the option of taking my sweet time to come to terms with my size. I've been coping with it all my life. 

Therefore, I don't have a lot of sympathy for the closet FAs. If you don't have the balls to be open about who you are, why should I feel sympathetic when I haven't had the luxury of being looked upon as being "normal" and you have simply by keeping your mouth shut? Why should I be understanding about you needing more time to come to terms about your secret preferences when I haven't had any time at all to develop my confidence after being berated about my size since I was a child? 

Gah, this hits one of my hot buttons. I need to stop now before this rant gets too out of control.


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## MisticalMisty (Jan 5, 2007)

It's crude..but I told a guy once that if he didn't have the balls to be with me in public.....his balls were coming nowhere near me.

LOL

I don't mince words much


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## Renaissance Woman (Jan 5, 2007)

MisticalMisty said:


> It's crude..but I told a guy once that if he didn't have the balls to be with me in public.....his balls were coming nowhere near me.
> 
> LOL
> 
> I don't mince words much


You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to MisticalMisty again.


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## furious styles (Jan 5, 2007)

hmm. was I hiding now?

*dances around 1900's style waving hands with a hat and cane*

here i am!!!


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## The Obstreperous Ms. J (Jan 5, 2007)

MisticalMisty said:


> It's crude..but I told a guy once that if he didn't have the balls to be with me in public.....his balls were coming nowhere near me.
> 
> LOL
> 
> I don't mince words much



You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to MisticalMisty again.

You are just drawing aces, lil' lady


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## The Obstreperous Ms. J (Jan 5, 2007)

Renaissance Woman said:


> It was mentioned briefly before, but here's the main thing that gets me about the "hiding" FAs. They CAN hide. I can't. I'm fat all day, every day, everywhere I go. No hiding that. I can't confide in select number of close friends or family about the fact that I'm fat, I can't go out with a guy who secretly knows I'm fat, I can't post on a message board about being fat and then go out looking all skinny, and most important, I haven't had the option of taking my sweet time to come to terms with my size. I've been coping with it all my life.
> 
> Therefore, I don't have a lot of sympathy for the closet FAs. If you don't have the balls to be open about who you are, why should I feel sympathetic when I haven't had the luxury of being looked upon as being "normal" and you have simply by keeping your mouth shut? Why should I be understanding about you needing more time to come to terms about your secret preferences when I haven't had any time at all to develop my confidence after being berated about my size since I was a child?
> 
> Gah, this hits one of my hot buttons. I need to stop now before this rant gets too out of control.




I wish I could give you a hug right now.


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## Renaissance Woman (Jan 5, 2007)

mfdoom said:


> hmm. was I hiding now?
> 
> *dances around 1900's style waving hands with a hat and cane*
> 
> here i am!!!


My rant isn't directed at you open FAs, Love. You're the ones I dig. <3

Now will you sing Ragtime Gal like that frog from the cartoon?


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## furious styles (Jan 5, 2007)

Renaissance Woman said:


> My rant isn't directed at you open FAs, Love. You're the ones I dig. <3
> 
> Now will you sing Ragtime Gal like that frog from the cartoon?



_Hello! ma baby, Hello! Ma honey, Hello! ma ragtime gal.
Send me a kiss by wire, baby my heart's on fire!
If you refuse me, Honey, you'll lose me, then you'll be left alone;
Oh baby, telephone and tell me I'm your owwwwwwwwn_

seriously though. i haven't bothered to read through the whole thread, but personally i've never had a reason to hide it. maybe it's because i don't care about the opinions of insignificant people


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## NFA (Jan 5, 2007)

Renaissance Woman said:


> It was mentioned briefly before, but here's the main thing that gets me about the "hiding" FAs. They CAN hide. I can't. I'm fat all day, every day, everywhere I go. No hiding that. I can't confide in select number of close friends or family about the fact that I'm fat, I can't go out with a guy who secretly knows I'm fat, I can't post on a message board about being fat and then go out looking all skinny, and most important, I haven't had the option of taking my sweet time to come to terms with my size. I've been coping with it all my life.
> 
> Therefore, I don't have a lot of sympathy for the closet FAs. If you don't have the balls to be open about who you are, why should I feel sympathetic when I haven't had the luxury of being looked upon as being "normal" and you have simply by keeping your mouth shut? Why should I be understanding about you needing more time to come to terms about your secret preferences when I haven't had any time at all to develop my confidence after being berated about my size since I was a child?
> 
> Gah, this hits one of my hot buttons. I need to stop now before this rant gets too out of control.



That's why I have little sympathy for it, either. If a gay person is in the closet, they actually can meet and be with another closeted gay person. Not saying its great, but its equal. Fat people don't have a closet to retreat to. Well, unless it was an actual, physical closet. That's the fat woman's option to retreat from social scorn. The FA's only concern is being seen near someone who is the object of social scorn. So, the risks they face are small compared to fat people, and the cost of a closeted life not remotely as invasive as those endured by a fat person who would literally have to retreat from the world. Its not fair. Its arrogant. And really, its stupid. The FA in the closet just hurts themselves as long as they don't take the odious step of having it both ways and retreating in shame but fufilling their desires in private. FA's just don't have it that hard. I say that AS an FA. Being open about it is the smartest thing I have ever done, and I didn't even realize I was doing it. Honestly, FA's, being open about this will bring you so much joy. Just do it already.


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## moonvine (Jan 5, 2007)

Renaissance Woman said:


> It was mentioned briefly before, but here's the main thing that gets me about the "hiding" FAs. They CAN hide. I can't.



They can only hide if we allow it. If we insist on being taken out in public, being introduced to family/friends, etc, as a condition of dating them, they can't hide. They can put up or shut up. We have the power here, in my opinion.


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## activistfatgirl (Jan 5, 2007)

mfdoom said:


> _Hello! ma baby, Hello! Ma honey, Hello! ma ragtime gal.
> Send me a kiss by wire, baby my heart's on fire!
> If you refuse me, Honey, you'll lose me, then you'll be left alone;
> Oh baby, telephone and tell me I'm your owwwwwwwwn_



This is probably the cutest mental image ever.


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## Renaissance Woman (Jan 5, 2007)

moonvine said:


> They can only hide if we allow it. If we insist on being taken out in public, being introduced to family/friends, etc, as a condition of dating them, they can't hide. They can put up or shut up. We have the power here, in my opinion.


Not quite. We can insist all we want, but if they won't do it, it means a bunch of cute fat girls sitting home alone on a Saturday night while closet FAs cruise BBW porn sites.


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## furious styles (Jan 5, 2007)

activistfatgirl said:


> This is probably the cutest mental image ever.



the best part is I have a deep voice and I can sing it almost exactly like Bill Roberts did in the cartoon. 



Renaissance Woman said:


> Not quite. We can insist all we want, but if they won't do it, it means a bunch of cute fat girls sitting home alone on a Saturday night while closet FAs cruise BBW porn sites.



damn. speak it girl.


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## moonvine (Jan 5, 2007)

Renaissance Woman said:


> Not quite. We can insist all we want, but if they won't do it, it means a bunch of cute fat girls sitting home alone on a Saturday night while closet FAs cruise BBW porn sites.



Well, I didn't say you'd always have a partner (I haven't had a date in 2 years). But I'd rather not have a date than be treated badly. Others are free to make different choices and I totally understand that. But it is still a choice. If my choice is being treated badly, or being alone, I choose being alone. It took me a while to get there though.


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## liz (di-va) (Jan 5, 2007)

Rebecca said:


> Essentially, being closeted shouldn't be "criminalized" but being selfish and destructive of others--which I think it what AFG's earlier comments indicated--that's a whole other ball of wax. They're two seperate issues.



I dunno if that was directed if what I said, but of course I agree with that. I just meant--the harm these folks do themselves is the extra icing on the stupid cake. But it's the not the question under discussion...


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## supersoup (Jan 5, 2007)

mfdoom said:


> _Hello! ma baby, Hello! Ma honey, Hello! ma ragtime gal.
> Send me a kiss by wire, baby my heart's on fire!
> If you refuse me, Honey, you'll lose me, then you'll be left alone;
> Oh baby, telephone and tell me I'm your owwwwwwwwn_
> ...



holy crap. that was way cute.

marriage, now?

and kudos on not caring about insignificant people's opinions. i'd rep you, but i needs to spread it around.


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## Ample Pie (Jan 5, 2007)

liz (di-va) said:


> I dunno if that was directed if what I said, but of course I agree with that. I just meant--the harm these folks do themselves is the extra icing on the stupid cake. But it's the not the question under discussion...



For the record, my comments were not directed toward you or your comments


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## liz (di-va) (Jan 5, 2007)

Rebecca said:


> For the record, my comments were not directed toward you or your comments



Whee! okay.  Let's go leave stinky things in the (FA) closets. Maybe banana peels.


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## waldo (Jan 5, 2007)

activistfatgirl said:


> Ben you have some a warm heart and will make a great counselor if that's what you choose to do.
> Of course this is what we do everyday around here at Dimensions. Many, many new folks to FAdom come here and ask for help, and we discuss. We dialogue. Thread after thread of talking through different scenarios. BBWs talk about their take, experienced FAs round it out. This is the stuff of this website.
> However, I hope you can understand that when I do that for a closet FA, I'm happy. When I do it for a closet FA that is my boyfriend, my first love, my new hot date, the great guy I never knew was in a closet...that's a different story. My post is not about criminalizing anyone. It's about recognizing a shared experience as a fat woman and saying "I can't do this right now" or "I'm tired". If you want to pick up the pieces of those fine closeted FAs, I'll send you their numbers.
> 
> ...



While I sympathize with the viewpoint of the women who have posted on this thread regarding their frustrations with closet-FAs, I do not think that the atmosphere created by all this rightous indignation will encourage any closet FAs to want to discuss their issues here. Not that there is a lot to be accomplished by discussing it on here anyway. It always seems to come down to the same arguments. "Why are you worried about what others think? Screw your friends if they can't accept it. They aren't the kind of people you want for friends anyway. How could your family not accept it if they really love you?" No one really brings anything different to this discussion.


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## AnnMarie (Jan 5, 2007)

waldo said:


> While I sympathize with the viewpoint of the women who have posted on this thread regarding their frustrations with closet-FAs, I do not think that the atmosphere created by all this rightous indignation will encourage any closet FAs to want to discuss their issues here. Not that there is a lot to be accomplished by discussing it on here anyway. It always seems to come down to the same arguments. "Why are you worried about what others think? Screw your friends if they can't accept it. They aren't the kind of people you want for friends anyway. How could your family not accept it if they really love you?" No one really brings anything different to this discussion.



Because you can only boil down a subject so many times until it all comes down to the same solution. You either accept your preference and live without apologies or you hide it and risk damaging yourself and others by linking desire with shame. 

Do you have something new to bring to the discussion, since the rest of us seem to have hit a wall? I'm sure many would welcome a fresh perspective if you have one to share. 

We'll wait, it's ok.


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## MisticalMisty (Jan 5, 2007)

waldo said:


> While I sympathize with the viewpoint of the women who have posted on this thread regarding their frustrations with closet-FAs, I do not think that the atmosphere created by all this rightous indignation will encourage any closet FAs to want to discuss their issues here. Not that there is a lot to be accomplished by discussing it on here anyway. It always seems to come down to the same arguments. "Why are you worried about what others think? Screw your friends if they can't accept it. They aren't the kind of people you want for friends anyway. How could your family not accept it if they really love you?" No one really brings anything different to this discussion.


 
I've personally used the "you have to live your own life" spill many of times to no avail. 

I realize that being a non-conformist is no easy task. It's hard to go against the norm and society and be your own person with your own preferences. It's easy to be a cookie cutter person who walks, talks and thinks like every other person on the planet. But it makes you a liar. 

If you are denying yourself the opportunity to be with your true preference proudly, you're lying to yourself, your friends and your family. How? you may ask. If you are dating someone you are not remotely attracted to...but in keeping up appearances, you pretend that you are happy and attracted you are lying to the world. You're deceiving everyone around you and no one deserves to be lied to. 

What terrible conclusions do you for see occurring? That your family is going to disown you and you will be the black sheep of the family? That your friends are going to want to have you committed or will never speak to you again? That when you're walking down the street someone is going to yell slurs at you and threaten your life? Seriously? I mean what is so terrible about dating a fat person? 

NOTHING. We aren't contagious. Your family can't catch the fat disease from us. Just because you like fat women doesn't mean your friends will catch the fat-liking disease and will have to date big girls. There is ABSOLUTELY NO REASON why an FA or FFA should feel that they have to hide who they are dating. 

Is it easier to deny yourself and date who everyone else wants you to date? Sure..but *the easiest path is never the right path to true happiness. 
* 

That's why we continue to have the same arguments about the issue. It's because men and women continue to use lame excuses about friends, families and society. Quite frankly, it shows how much of a coward they can be and an inability to be their own person.


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## Renaissance Woman (Jan 5, 2007)

waldo said:


> While I sympathize with the viewpoint of the women who have posted on this thread regarding their frustrations with closet-FAs, I do not think that the atmosphere created by all this rightous indignation will encourage any closet FAs to want to discuss their issues here. Not that there is a lot to be accomplished by discussing it on here anyway. It always seems to come down to the same arguments. "Why are you worried about what others think? Screw your friends if they can't accept it. They aren't the kind of people you want for friends anyway. How could your family not accept it if they really love you?" No one really brings anything different to this discussion.


Every single person who has posted in the introduction thread, or has created one saying "hi, I'm new" or "first time poster, long time lurker" has been warmly welcomed. Not one board regular has ever replied with "screw you and your delay in posting!" 

Openness is rewarded. I don't see how you can come to the conclusion that we're creating an atmosphere where an FA is going to be afraid to post.


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## MisticalMisty (Jan 5, 2007)

Renaissance Woman said:


> Every single person who has posted in the introduction thread, or has created one saying "hi, I'm new" or "first time poster, long time lurker" has been warmly welcomed. Not one board regular has ever replied with "screw you and your delay in posting!"
> 
> Openness is rewarded. I don't see how you can come to the conclusion that we're creating an atmosphere where an FA is going to be afraid to post.



He's referring to the instances when those are used in the threads relating to closet fas. He's right..those things have been said..and on numerous occasions..but there doesn't seem to be any other argument..


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## weetabix (Jan 5, 2007)

Dear Activist Beautiful Girl,

It's a shame that a lot of what you are saying is still true to some extent. Mind you I will miss it when it's gone. These attitudes are going, in another 10 years they willbe gone. I remember (no I sound old) when I started www.feeder.co.uk when www.feeder.com went off line it was something like 1995 or 1996. We are years on from that now. In those days I was as shy as the people you are writing to. I remember Iin 1986 fancied this girl, black hair and beautiful eyes, she was so lovely it hurt just to think about her. I was at collage, we all went on a picnic at the seaside and drank wine and the beautiful girl and I got off with each other. What I did not know then, I was about 20, was that as well as her beauty I fancied her because she was fat. That had not even registered with me, just that she was so lovely I could die.

Later when we looked at what had happened she told me she thought her eyes we cross eyed and she was ugly and fat. I believed her. Her lack of confidence in herself affected me because I had lack of confidence in realtionships and what my mother and mates would think if I went out with a fat ugly boss eyed non-blond.

What a weak lame stupid idiot I was. In actual fat this girl was as beautiful as you could ever want and she just had a body image problem which she burdened me with. I should have been strong and trusted what I knew to be try and not been weak and feable minded.

You can trust that a lifetime on from this I am not the weak useless 20 year old I once was. I know an attractive woman when I meet her. I have great strength in this. I do make a bullsup of life but I do it in my own right and don't take my lead from the weakness of others. I have strength of 10 men, oh alright what I mean is I pass on some of my confidence to some of my mates who are not so confident about loving a BBW. My beautiful girlfriend Suze is hard to hide. She must be about 30 stones and it's quite obvious we fancy the pants off each other (yeah black hair and beautiful eyes, love her so much it hurts). People accept us, they gain strength from us, we are both strong people. 

I say to any FA's that are hiding; 
Do you think that the BBW's are able to hide?
Do you think that something bad will happen if you come out as an FA?

I say come on hit me, right in the jaw, maybe you will knock me down. Take your best shot. Do I care? It feels so good to stand up for what you believe in. Other people really are not so strong. FA be a man and get to make love with a BBW and be proud.

Happy New Year,
Weetabix.


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## weetabix (Jan 5, 2007)

UncannyBruceman said:


> Years ago, when asked "why fat girls", my answer would be "that's what I like". But that's not enough, seemingly, because people will still think "he must think that he can't do any better". And that's precisely why I changed my answer. Now, when asked, I say "I love how they look, I love how they feel, and the sex is fucking out of this world". I've seen many sets of eyes light up since I started putting it in those words, and I can honestly say that my friends respect and even admire my orientation.



I recon that 1 in 5 are FAs if not more. I also think that a great number of women would grow fatter if they thought there was acceptance. Nothing bad does happen when people know you are an FA. However until they 'twig' then they do have this idea that you 'could do better'. My idea of better is fatter ;-)

I totally and absolutely know that FA's worry and need not.

Parents are probabaly the biggest worry. I have managed to keep my preferance for fat girls a total secret from them. They never noticed that my ex-wife was over 300lbs and my soul mate is nearly 500lbs. They still think these women are normal 180lbs women, but I do notice that they take the trouble to provide a strong chair so on a subliminal level they might have noticed.

FA's, please, really, just go for it, life just gets better and fatter.

Regards,
Weetabix.


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## activistfatgirl (Jan 5, 2007)

Weetabix and AM and Misty and Ren and others--great comments.

I'm really loving the posts from FAs that talk about dealing with the challenges head on. I'm not one to say that FAs don't have some challenges, but our frustration as fat women stands firmly. Its encouraging to hear these stories though and recognize the power in owning up to your convictions and ultimately, desires.


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## Esme (Jan 5, 2007)

You brought a tear or two to my eyes AFG... on several levels.
Thank you.


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## UncannyBruceman (Jan 6, 2007)

mfdoom said:


> _Hello! ma baby, Hello! Ma honey, Hello! ma ragtime gal.
> Send me a kiss by wire, baby my heart's on fire!
> If you refuse me, Honey, you'll lose me, then you'll be left alone;
> Oh baby, telephone and tell me I'm your owwwwwwwwn_



Best post in the history of Dimensions. Bar none. :bow: :bow: :bow: :bow: :bow:


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## waldo (Jan 6, 2007)

weetabix said:


> I recon that 1 in 5 are FAs if not more. I also think that a great number of women would grow fatter if they thought there was acceptance. Nothing bad does happen when people know you are an FA. However until they 'twig' then they do have this idea that you 'could do better'. My idea of better is fatter ;-)
> 
> I totally and absolutely know that FA's worry and need not.
> 
> ...



When considering what percentage of men could qualify as FAs, one needs to decide what constitutes a BBW. A lot of guys like a size 12-14 'thick' woman but are turned off by a 250 pound BBW. Are they FAs? If so I am thinking the percentage of guys who are at least part FA could be even higher than 20%. If an FA is only a guy who lies the bigger women, obviously there are a lot fewer (Probably 5-10 %) but many many more than are out and open about it.

I find it interesting that even this guy, who in his other post, described himself as totally comfortable with his preference after all these years admits to being unable to discuss it with his parents. He'd rather get punched in the face than tell his Mom he is attracted to fat chicks?  

Yeah, parent can be funny with how they will be in denial about their kids. I remember when I told my Mom I was into fat women and she recalled accidently having come across one of my BUF magazines years earlier and thinking at the time 'there is no way my son could be into this'. LOL. Guess what Mom, you were wrong


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## waldo (Jan 6, 2007)

AnnMarie said:


> Because you can only boil down a subject so many times until it all comes down to the same solution. You either accept your preference and live without apologies or you hide it and risk damaging yourself and others by linking desire with shame.
> 
> Do you have something new to bring to the discussion, since the rest of us seem to have hit a wall? I'm sure many would welcome a fresh perspective if you have one to share.
> 
> We'll wait, it's ok.



Thanks for your patience. LOL

Sorry, I got nothin. So I guess my point is just forget about it. If the FAs want out of the closet they know what they need to do. No point in beating a dead horse here. Maybe put up a sticky, 'Instructions for coming out of the closet' or something. LOL

Now of course the topic of this thread is different because there can be something gained by the frustrated BBWs sharing their feelings on the topic. Just don't expect it to jar very many closet FAs into a different course of action. They will possibly go away thinking 'yeah it sucks, I wish I could do better'. But next day it will likely be business as usual for them.

I have gained a little additional perspective on part of the difficulty here. Last night they did a big story on the role of the desire for fame on the show 20/20. They reported on a survey which found that when they asked school kids if they could be more intelligent, better looking or famous, a surprising number choose being famous. Further, a surprising number said they would rather be the assistant to a celebrity than a CEO or Senator. So we live in a culture that admires celebrity among all else. And how many celebrities do we know who are admitted FAs? How many celebrities do we know who are confident fat women able to resist the Hollywood pressure to be thin? Who are the role models for FAs? Sure it is easy to use the old argument that you need to be your own person, but not so easy for most of us to put into practice as we are all largely a product of our environment.


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## waldo (Jan 6, 2007)

NFA said:


> On the "but you can do better/you can't do better" line some FA's get subjected to, I'm reminded of my favorite comeback I've never gotten to use because no one every gives me a hard time about being an FA. (I'll get asked about it, but usually out of genuine curiosity)
> 
> "I can't do better than a fat woman. I just mean that differently than you do."



I would say " No I can't do any better, because to me they don't come any better". This makes it a little clearer what you mean.


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## Butterbelly (Jan 6, 2007)

AFG, you also brought a lot of tears to my eyes with this posting. I've dated men like this in the past, and even dated a FA, who was out of the closet, that had some of these qualities as well.

I will never understand why people have to be ashamed of who they are. So, you like fat girls? Who cares? I can't imagine someone gunning you down for that. And the way I look at it...if your friends find out you like fat girls and constantly tease you about it, then they aren't people you should be calling "friends." 

I dated a guy who would never introduce me to his friends, yet they knew I existed and knew I was a "larger" girl. I specifically asked why I hadn't met one particular friend of his and the response I got should have been a big red flag to me: "If he meets you, he'll never let me live it down that you're a bigger girl and he'll tease me about it." I remember feeling ashamed after he gave me that response, and instead of saying "obviously he can't be a 'good' friend of yours, and you need to grow up and I need to move on," I responded with "what a jerk." And, unfortunately for me, I always wondered if he was ashamed to be seen with me, since we rarely ventured out in public together, except to go to the grocery store and have dinner occasionally. I just wish I'd been a lot smarter when it came to this situation, I wouldn't have wasted so much time, energy, and tears on this man.


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## Chimpi (Jan 6, 2007)

activistfatgirl said:


> But always remember that there's a process that fat women have to go through, and you can't necessarily fix it for them, you know?
> If I had met you when I first came on Dims a few years back it would have been no different than the in the closet FAs I met and talk about in my open letter. You would have been this very wonderful person that I couldn't imagine disagreeing with, because I did not yet know how to love myself outside the opinions of others--and those first months of realizing people could be attracted to fat me made me extremely vulnerable--both to closet FAs and strong, opnionated FAs like yourself. We see this over and over with fat women and BHMs who stumble upon this world.
> *Instead, I've had a chance to go through a process of learning self love and reliance first. Now, a few years later, I can see you as a peer, a friend, not someone with the salving balm.*
> I think sometimes its ok to let fat women talk for themselves and feel the pain. No army of great FAs can save us from that. And while it sounds nice, I wouldn't choose it.



For some reason, I found this post to be particularly touching, on many levels. But you are right, Tiffany. There is always a process. The negative attitudes, not necessarily regarding you as a fat woman, but negative attitudes in general will always be there to help you learn a better way - A different way for you as an individual. Beautiful post. 



NFA said:


> My indignation towards closeted FA's isn't as much about being a "white hat" for BBW's as it is being a hero for myself. I strongly believe that when men behave badly, it is the responsibility of other men to stand up and say so. Far too often, men stay silent when the culture of masculinity presents sexist and abusive attitudes. There were times I stayed silent myself in locker rooms and such, and I'm not the least bit proud about that. Men who don't have negative or abusive attitudes towards women need to speak out and be a part of the solution. We cannot just sit back and say its someone else's problem. It doesn't effect us personally, so we should just keep our mouths shut. I realized this was wrong a very long time ago and I feel I have a duty to speak up to my fellow men.
> 
> If men don't speak up, if they see these things as just a woman's problem, then its easy for those who engage in the inappropriate behavior to dismiss the criticism of women. For many, its something they are already inclined to do. They need to understand that this is not just women who have a problem with the inappropriate behavior, but everyone does. Just as I feel I have a responsibility to strongly support racial equality, as a man, I feel I have a responsibility to strongly support gender equality. At its heart, I think the behavior of closeted FA's is both born out of fat prejudice and sexism. Both of which I feel I have a personal responsibility to oppose.
> 
> I honestly don't do it to get credit or kudos from BBWs. Really doesn't cross my mind. I don't want to be a hero. I want to be a responsible member of my gender and a responsible FA. Closeted FA's give all FA's a bad name and honestly that is what bothers me the most. My second concern is still not with BBWs, but actually for the closeted FA's, themselves. Even if they aren't being jerks are trying to have things both ways, they are denying themselves something really, really wonderful and fufilling and for no reason. If anyone thought I was a hero to BBWs, I hate to have to tell them they are wrong, but I really want to be a hero to myself and to other FA's.



Where I agree with you on many of your points in this thread, I just have to chime in and say this - Not all men, particularly those who are fond of fat women, can attest to their acceptance of their preference early on. There are those people, like yourself, who are more on the fronthand side of things, where you can rely on them to stand proud in anything they do; every walk of life. There are also those who do not learn or understand but for quite a few years. It takes them longer to comprehend how their actions affect other people, and how consequences come out of those negative actions. And how those consequences drill them deeper into the infinity, only to need more time to break free. This can be said for a man who likes fat women, or even a women who likes to write about nudity.
Also, referring to "closeted FA's give all FA's a bad name and honestly that is what bothers me the most". I hear you on that one. Many times I have been compared and even called and equal to such closeted 'Fat Admirers', and I do not appreciate it. But, you win some... you lose some. 


Though, I can say the same, to reciprocate it upon some fat women I have come across. I do not appreciate it when a woman of size [or any woman, for that matter] cannot appreciate herself as who she is because of occurrances and propaganda fed to her. Though, I understand that certain things stab deeper than others, and I am sure that hearing "You need to lose weight... You would be more desirable" can be quite the stab - You're beautiful as you are! Be if you, activistfatgirl, as a fat woman... You, NFA, as a proud Fat Admirer and activist of personal nature... You, collegeguy2514, as a fat guy... Insecurities are everywhere. Not only does it take time to heal and accept, it also takes much understanding of other parties, and I will of course have to agree with the original poster in that said 'closet FA's' SUCK! 



UncannyBruceman said:


> There have been multiple occasions in which I've publicly and privately invited men to attend the dances in Massachussetts and New York (I'm looking out for you, girls!) and the responses I got sounded something similar to Porky Pig's famed closing statement at the end of a Looney Toons short. They've all got an excuse.



Bruce, I am eagerly waiting to have the necessary funds to attend the Massachussetts and New York bashes... *sigh* Though, i do like the mention of Looney Toons' Porky Pig. 

*---------*

On my own personal experience, I was asked a question, one, by someone whom I deeply love and would give the world for; someone I trust blindly (and deservingly so). When releasing to said person that I loved fat women and only desire to be with fat women, said person asked "Even if there are health risks involved?" This stung like a bullet, because when you are with a partner, you wish to not put them through any pain of any kind - and if your preference causes harm unto your partner, you become agonized. My dealings with my past have continued to agonize me, yet, I still remain faithful to my nature, my heart, and my preference.

... I have no point in my post anymore, so I'll post it here and continue to read (I am only on page 4...)


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## moonvine (Jan 6, 2007)

waldo said:


> When considering what percentage of men could qualify as FAs, one needs to decide what constitutes a BBW. A lot of guys like a size 12-14 'thick' woman but are turned off by a 250 pound BBW. Are they FAs? If so I am thinking the percentage of guys who are at least part FA could be even higher than 20%. If an FA is only a guy who lies the bigger women, obviously there are a lot fewer (Probably 5-10 %) but many many more than are out and open about it.



Size 12-14 is average sized, so I'd say no, someone who prefers size 12-14 women is not an FA - he's an average sized woman admirer, to coin a phrase.


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## Ruby Ripples (Jan 6, 2007)

activistfatgirl said:


> I'm curious if other fat women or BHMs would share if they've had experiences with FAs still in the closet or ashamed of their attraction. I think something just snapped tonight and I'm feeling that raw frustration. Been there?
> 
> Here's a little letter:
> 
> ...




Because you let him.


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## Ruby Ripples (Jan 6, 2007)

MisticalMisty said:


> Not just no, hell no. A man never has the right to date anyone they would be embarrassed to be seen with in public. I don't care if the girl has low self confidence, she doesn't deserve to date someone that would be embarrassed and no self respecting man would purposely date a woman they were embarrassed by.
> 
> If a guy needs years to work it out..he needs to be single during those years because he has not right to thrust his issues upon a woman he's dating.
> 
> Can I just say that this as to be the most asinine thing I've read in a really long time.




Agree 110%!!


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## NFA (Jan 6, 2007)

waldo said:


> I would say " No I can't do any better, because to me they don't come any better". This makes it a little clearer what you mean.



See, I prefer making them think about what I mean. If these hypothetical people were pestering me, I'd hardly feel a necessity to talk down to their level so they can keep up. I'd much rather get the "What is that supposed to me... Oh." response.


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## Eclectic_Girl (Jan 6, 2007)

NFA said:


> See, I prefer making them think about what I mean. If these hypothetical people were pestering me, I'd hardly feel a necessity to talk down to their level so they can keep up. I'd much rather get the "What is that supposed to me... Oh." response.



Stupid rep system has thwarted me from repping you for the past two days, NFA, so I'll just say that I got your meaning just fine the first time out.

Nothing wrong with forcing the sheep to think about their assumptions.


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## AnnMarie (Jan 6, 2007)

Chimpi said:


> ... I am eagerly waiting to have the necessary funds to attend the Massachussetts and New York bashes... *sigh* Though, i do like the mention of Looney Toons' Porky Pig.



I didn't forget your PM.... just haven't had much time, but I'll answer!


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## moonvine (Jan 6, 2007)

Eclectic_Girl said:


> Stupid rep system has thwarted me from repping you for the past two days, NFA, so I'll just say that I got your meaning just fine the first time out.



I can almost never rep NFA. Must go spread some rep around.


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## Totmacher (Jan 6, 2007)

Well, you could always rep me in the meantime.


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## cactopus (Jan 6, 2007)

moonvine said:


> I can almost never rep NFA. Must go spread some rep around.



Silly me I just figured out how to do that... and I'm a technology guy.

Feh.


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## NFA (Jan 7, 2007)

> Where I agree with you on many of your points in this thread, I just have to chime in and say this - Not all men, particularly those who are fond of fat women, can attest to their acceptance of their preference early on. There are those people, like yourself, who are more on the fronthand side of things, where you can rely on them to stand proud in anything they do; every walk of life. There are also those who do not learn or understand but for quite a few years. It takes them longer to comprehend how their actions affect other people, and how consequences come out of those negative actions. And how those consequences drill them deeper into the infinity, only to need more time to break free. This can be said for a man who likes fat women, or even a women who likes to write about nudity.



There is a difference between a man who builds a closet and stays in there, and one who builds a closet and tries to date fat women secretly. The former is stupid, and I'm not afraid to tell them such. I don't think they are horrible people. The only people they are hurting are themselves. That's why its stupid. At the worst, what they are doing is disrespectful. Its not hurtful to anyone outside themselves. I'll respond to those guys with tough love, but I don't think need to beg forgiveness for denying themselves something. They need to apologize to themselves, is all. I don't really care about that. I just care about getting them to see that they are just making themselves unhappy over nothing.

Men who try to date fat women while trying to live in shame of who they are, however, are hurting someone else and I see no useful reason to have compassion for emotionally abusive and manipulative behavior. See, the guy who stays in the closet is making a choice to hurt themselves while not dealing with their own issues. The guy who dates BBWs on the down-low is not dealing with his own issues, but is making the choice to hurt someone else because of it. You just can't get it both ways. Either wallow in self-pity, or date fat women. Doing both is such a complete dodge of responsibility as to be offensive even if it wasn't causing so much emotional pain. No. I don't have room in my heart for compassion for men who are emotionally abusive towards women and think their behavior is justified or excusable. And I'm not about to apologize for that, either. This is enormously different from a guy sitting alone wishing he could date fat girls but is too wrapped up in his own self-hatred to do so. Because this is emotional abuse we're talking about. I have to call a spade, a spade here. I cannot accept excuses. Men need to take responsibility when they are abusive towards women. Emotional abuse is not okay just because its not physical abuse. Emotional abuse can cause a lot of hurt and a lot of damage. All men have a responsibility to do what they can to speak out against it. And those who do this have to take responsibility for what they've done. I'm all about forgiveness if a person shows they have earned it. Making excuses doesn't earn forgiveness. There is no excuse for this behavior. I don't want to hear about how hard it was to deal with people seeing them next to a fat woman. I dont care if they really wanted to get laid by a fatty and how that made it okay to do so via emotional manipulation. Because that's what we're talking about here. They wanted to act on their physical desires, but didn't want to confront the psychological barriers. No. You don't get to do that and have it be okay. Its selfish, cowardly, and hurtful. Look, I want these kind of men here and learning how to do things right. I want these guys to see the mistake that they've made. I want them to know that there is a right way to behave and that what they did was wrong and hurtful. I don't see how someone does that if I respond to them by worrying about THEIR feelings and trying not to upset them and making excuses for them. I just don't see what good that does.


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## elle camino (Jan 7, 2007)

in regards to the original post: girl, i am a pretty nails-for-breakfast type of lady, but what you said there honestly did make tear up for a few seconds. 
i hate admitting that the thing that's ended almost every single one of my relationships (and almost-relationships) with guys is the whole 'i don't know you in public' thing, from them. 
i consider myself beautiful, but i had to reconcile myself a long time ago with the fact that i'm just not someone many guys want to be seen with.
i don't doubt that there are FAs out there who wouldn't do that (NFA, etc), but i don't know any of them, and the chances of me meeting one are slim to none.
so what do you do, you know? do you stick to your guns and refuse to date a guy who's ashamed of you, even though it means going without physical affection into the indefinite future? or do you cave in and try to ignore it?
i still haven't figured that one out. not sure i ever will.


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## isotope (Jan 7, 2007)

Hey, 

Some of us have very nice closets that we stay in not because of fear, but because of the sweet surround sound we got setup.

And a DVR was just installed.

So, we'll be hanging out for awhile. Atleast until Jessica Simpson thickens up a little more and comes in said closet.


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## waldo (Jan 7, 2007)

Chimpi said:


> On my own personal experience, I was asked a question, one, by someone whom I deeply love and would give the world for; someone I trust blindly (and deservingly so). When releasing to said person that I loved fat women and only desire to be with fat women, said person asked "Even if there are health risks involved?" This stung like a bullet, because when you are with a partner, you wish to not put them through any pain of any kind - and if your preference causes harm unto your partner, you become agonized. My dealings with my past have continued to agonize me, yet, I still remain faithful to my nature, my heart, and my preference.
> 
> ... I have no point in my post anymore, so I'll post it here and continue to read (I am only on page 4...)



This is a fresh perspective on the issue which is not to be disregarded lightly. While we can sit here and argue amongst ourselves about the validity of the health/obesity link, the medical evidence continues to build, so it is clearly accepted in society as a whole. What this means is that it will be increasingly difficult to gain societal acceptance for the FA orientation, particularly for the more extreme preference for SSBBW. And yes I have also had this argument presented to me


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## MisticalMisty (Jan 7, 2007)

elle camino said:


> none.
> so what do you do, you know? do you stick to your guns and refuse to date a guy who's ashamed of you, even though it means going without physical affection into the indefinite future? or do you cave in and try to ignore it?
> i still haven't figured that one out. not sure i ever will.



I've stuck to my guns and I have been single for 5 full years. Is it hard? Hell yes. Do I regret it..no. I'm not ashamed of myself and I'll be damned if I date someone who's ashamed of me just to have someone to warm my bed. I'd rather be alone than be with someone who could damage me in any way. I believe that being with someone who's ashamed of you will lead to some kind of long term damage.


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## ClosetFA (Jan 7, 2007)

Hi...

I really have a fair bit to say on this topic and owing to my newly set-up login I think it's fair to assume that I have problems admitting my inner FA.

I have caused untold damage to various lovely BBW over the past few years. I am the prime candidate for not introducing them to my friends or only staying at their houses....basically the whole list described in this mail. 

I am extremely sorry but I need to put forward my side, which isn't pretty and is somewhat spineless but I'd appreciate all of your comments and criticisms.

1. I have been visiting Dimensions web boards and chatting on/off since 1997. I've basically been a long time fairly inactive community member of the BBW scene.

2. A few years back I met a BBW in a bar and she came back to my house. All of my friends seen me do it and thought it was a joke or some game I was playing. As a result a few of my 'friends' were members of a fairly large music band with a large following. They wrote a song about how I slept with a fat girl.

After this thin girls were constantly coming up to me and being outright abusive to me. I had untold number of people just laughing at me in the city. I'd get pointed out walking down the street and people talking behind my back.

Everytime I caught up with my friends they would always ask 'How fat was she?'

But this lead on to my proffessional career.

2. Work found out about this and a number of my clients were none to impressed by this 'lack of professionalism' as one termed it. I actually lost work out of this and some of the guys I worked with were quite not happy with me at all.

All of the girls at my firm were thin, tall, kind of model looking girls who stopped taking me serious. They all had it in for fat girls and didn't hold back in telling the larger girls in the streets or clubs.

Before a work function with clients and partners I was told that I was NOT to bring any obese or even large girls. The boss expressely called me in to his office to tell me this. His exact words at the end were 'You're a good looking guy. Don't lower yourself to whatever girls you find on the dancefloor at 3am'

In the end I actually decided to leave my job.

3. In my whole entire extended family of parents, sisters, uncles, aunties, cousins etc...not one of them are big. There is literally no larger girls in the family and I once took home a girlfriend who was a size 14 and everyone had words to be about the girls size!! Even some comments in front of her.

They're always cracking fat jokes along with my friends and I can't change them.

4. In terms of sexual attraction I am completely attracted to BBW's. Thin girls just do not do anything for me at all. I can appreciate a thin girls face but her body as a whole is not a turn on.

However, I am super active. I run 5 times a week and I play multiple sports, go hiking, rock-climbing and also run part of a fitness school outside of work. What I really like is for a girl to do the same things as I do and come along when I do things. But I get caught off with some of the BBW's who can't come rock-climbing or running. 

Ahhhhhh....it make it near impossible. I end up hanging around with thin girls as they're doing the same activities that I'm doing. And on occassions I get asked out by them and everyone is like 'wow she's hot'. In the end I have terrible s*x and it's a huge let-down for everyone!!


In the end I've found countless obstacles that I haven't been willing to overcome. Am I to rid myself of my friends, my family, my career my hobbies, my sports???

That's my overall rough story and I'm sorry for the damage I've caused but I'm just not man enough to stand up to everyone in the fear that it causes more damage than it's worth.

For the record I am obviously single, male and 27 years old.

Thanks for reading.


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## ZainTheInsane (Jan 7, 2007)

I used to be this way...I must admit it, I was a closet FA.
However due to living life, failures, successes, and dating a multitude of women, of all walks of life, I've finally discovered that it doesn't at all help when one doesn't date someone you find attractive.
I finally told my friends about a year and a half ago now. Most were understanding, heck, some even knew or suspected already. The only ones who didn't seem to understand were under the age of twenty, and age in my mind, where popularity contests still seem to rage.
So yeah, my family knows, my friends know, and every new girl I date, whether I end up dating them for a long time, or just for a couple dates, gets to meet at least a few of my friends, and if we date long enough they get to meet everyone of my close friends, my family, and anyone else I can tell about them.:bow: 

Ha, needless to say, I'm single at the moment, but the next girl I meet, whomever she may be, will get the same treatment. Kindness, courtesy, affection, passion, hyperactivity, a little dose of my special brand of insanity, and everything else I have to offer. :wubu: 

Though, my parents have said, "Don't bring a girl to our house unless you're looking to marry her!"


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## UncannyBruceman (Jan 7, 2007)

ZainTheInsane said:


> Though, my parents have said, "Don't bring a girl to our house unless you're looking to marry her!"



That's still more support than some of us FA's get from our parents. Mine had criticized it for a number of years, now they just accept it. A friend of mine told his mother over the summer and she didn't talk to him for a month.

Glad to see that you were able to step out of your closet, though.


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## MisterGuy (Jan 7, 2007)

The thing that I figured out, after a while being kind of closeted, is that if you're totally honest and open about your preference, not only do people not care, but they find it kind of cool. Most people inherently appreciate the strength it takes to openly swim against the tide, and they respect you for it. And the assholes who would like to give you a hard time about it have nothing because when you openly talk about how you like fat women, you're taking their ammunition away from the outset.


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## ZainTheInsane (Jan 7, 2007)

UncannyBruceman said:


> That's still more support than some of us FA's get from our parents. Mine had criticized it for a number of years, now they just accept it. A friend of mine told his mother over the summer and she didn't talk to him for a month.
> 
> Glad to see that you were able to step out of your closet, though.



Ouchy...well, see, it all came down to the fact that my dad noticed fat girl porn sites on the computer. (We had one computer in the house at the time, AND I was 15 or 16. So I didn't know how to hide history and such. Note: I have my own computer now, and yes I was embarrassed when he asked about it.)
Anywho, he asked me what it was, and I told him...after much hesitation...that it was pornography. In the meantime I was blushing and sweating like crazy.

Then he laughed, and told me, "Whatever floats your boat, just don't download anything, and don't let your mother see you."

Since then, I've tended to only date plump, chubby or fat girls, so gradually everyone in my family became cool with it. My sisters just hope whomever she is, she has a great personality, and is fun. My dad is supportive, and just tells me to make sure I do things honorably and honestly. My mother...well she has several fat sisters, and sorta hates the idea of being fat, so she tolerates it. 

I love my family, and I'm glad I didn't have an experience like your friend's
My only regret is having been in the closet so long despite my family being okay with the idea. I figure what most families should care about is the love their son/daughter has for whomever they date. And to support their children.


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## liz (di-va) (Jan 7, 2007)

MisterGuy said:


> The thing that I figured out, after a while being kind of closeted, is that if you're totally honest and open about your preference, not only do people not care, but they find it kind of cool. Most people inherently appreciate the strength it takes to openly swim against the tide, and they respect you for it.



I feel like this is pretty true! And not pointed out enough, maybe?I dunno, amidst all the challenges we're talkin about. I know it's true as a fat girl, too--if you're open and honest about feeling good about yourself you do get props for it. Not the primary reason to do anything of course, but still--non-asshole people will respect it.


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## MisticalMisty (Jan 7, 2007)

ClosetFA said:


> In the end I've found countless obstacles that I haven't been willing to overcome. Am I to rid myself of my friends, my family, my career my hobbies, my sports???
> 
> That's my overall rough story and I'm sorry for the damage I've caused but I'm just not man enough to stand up to everyone in the fear that it causes more damage than it's worth.



No, but you better not EVEN think about dating a fat girl or just fucking one. Ruin your own life..not ours.

If you aren't man enough to stand up to everyone..then you aren't man enough to date me..or any other fat girl.


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## NFA (Jan 7, 2007)

ClosetFA said:


> That's my overall rough story and I'm sorry for the damage I've caused but I'm just not man enough to stand up to everyone in the fear that it causes more damage than it's worth.



Fine. Deny yourself all the happiness in the world just because you friends might (gasp!) kid around with you. Cause gosh, I've never heard of friends teasing each other. Clearly you are a beseiged soul. Oh, and your family might not approve of who you are dating? Another incredibly unique situation. I totally get how you cannot deal with a scenario no one must have ever had to deal with before. Surely, no fat woman could possibly know what you have to deal with being ocassionally seen next to fat women.

Look, you want to make a stupid choice, then knock yourself out. But NEVER EVER date a fat woman again. That's the price for your self-pity. I don't care how horny you are. You NEVER get to date a fat woman while cowering in the closet. That's the message here. I don't care why you think your self-constructed closet is justified. I don't care if someone wrote a song about you. I don't care if you aren't attracted to thin women. You made the choice to stay in your closet. You stay there. Alone. Thats the bargain you've made. You don't get to have it both ways.


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## liz (di-va) (Jan 7, 2007)

ClosetFA said:


> That's my overall rough story and I'm sorry for the damage I've caused but I'm just not man enough to stand up to everyone in the fear that it causes more damage than it's worth.



Boy, how did I miss this post the first time around. Good golly.

First of all, I admire you for saying what you did--in a way. There is nothing happy about hearing it on my end nor does it let you off the hook for anything, but it took guts to admit this much.

Everything you've described as a reason why you're in the closet is an obstacle, not a wall. If you job is fat-prejudiced, switch jobs. Or change your work place (you do know that kind of prejudice is illegal, as well as amoral, yes?). Your actions show irrevocably that you care more about your job, your family, and what other people think than your own happiness, which is incredibly sad, but that's not the point of this thread, really, it's about what happens to others. As you know. NFA and Misty are right: don't even think about draggin any more fat girls down the path with you. That is the price you pay. You're gonna be miserable regardless--sounds like you'll be married to a skinny girl soon in any case, but if you have this much self-awareness, act on it. Karma is forever, dude.

Here's hoping you wake up enough to change your life and it doesn't take some nasty brush with death or something to do it--who knows. *Nothing is that scary*. Just do it.

rantyrant


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## liz (di-va) (Jan 7, 2007)

The other reason maybe it's good you posted Closet, is that on a practical level it'll help women know what they're dealing with when they see it. Sooner.


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## Ample Pie (Jan 7, 2007)

NFA said:


> Fine. Deny yourself all the happiness in the world just because you friends might (gasp!) kid around with you. Cause gosh, I've never heard of friends teasing each other. Clearly you are a beseiged soul. Oh, and your family might not approve of who you are dating? Another incredibly unique situation. I totally get how you cannot deal with a scenario no one must have ever had to deal with before. Surely, no fat woman could possibly know what you have to deal with being ocassionally seen next to fat women.
> 
> Look, you want to make a stupid choice, then knock yourself out. But NEVER EVER date a fat woman again. That's the price for your self-pity. I don't care how horny you are. You NEVER get to date a fat woman while cowering in the closet. That's the message here. I don't care why you think your self-constructed closet is justified. I don't care if someone wrote a song about you. I don't care if you aren't attracted to thin women. You made the choice to stay in your closet. You stay there. Alone. Thats the bargain you've made. You don't get to have it both ways.





MisticalMisty said:


> No, but you better not EVEN think about dating a fat girl or just fucking one. Ruin your own life..not ours.
> 
> If you aren't man enough to stand up to everyone..then you aren't man enough to date me..or any other fat girl.





I must spread reputation around before I can rep either of you again...but consider yourselves at least mildy worshipped for the moment


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## supersoup (Jan 7, 2007)

NFA said:


> Fine. Deny yourself all the happiness in the world just because you friends might (gasp!) kid around with you. Cause gosh, I've never heard of friends teasing each other. Clearly you are a beseiged soul. Oh, and your family might not approve of who you are dating? Another incredibly unique situation. I totally get how you cannot deal with a scenario no one must have ever had to deal with before. Surely, no fat woman could possibly know what you have to deal with being ocassionally seen next to fat women.
> 
> Look, you want to make a stupid choice, then knock yourself out. But NEVER EVER date a fat woman again. That's the price for your self-pity. I don't care how horny you are. You NEVER get to date a fat woman while cowering in the closet. That's the message here. I don't care why you think your self-constructed closet is justified. I don't care if someone wrote a song about you. I don't care if you aren't attracted to thin women. You made the choice to stay in your closet. You stay there. Alone. Thats the bargain you've made. You don't get to have it both ways.



oy, so well said my good sir.

misty, i'm out of rep for you my dear, DAMN IT ALL!!!


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## Green Eyed Fairy (Jan 7, 2007)

MisticalMisty said:


> I'd rather be alone than be with someone who could damage me in any way. I believe that being with someone who's ashamed of you will lead to some kind of long term damage.



A- f**king-men



Btw, I have trouble buying that story posted by ClosetFA

His very first post???? Maybe his first post as THAT screen name.....

just my two cents


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## UncannyBruceman (Jan 7, 2007)

You're kidding me, right? SOMEONE SOUND THE TROLL ALARM!!!



ClosetFA said:


> 1. I have been visiting Dimensions web boards and chatting on/off since 1997. I've basically been a long time fairly inactive community member of the BBW scene.


I find it very hard to believe that any FA, closeted or not, would have a hard time making friends here and finding the confidence to be a little more open about his orientation.



ClosetFA said:


> 2. A few years back I met a BBW in a bar and she came back to my house. All of my friends seen me do it and thought it was a joke or some game I was playing. As a result a few of my 'friends' were members of a fairly large music band with a large following. They wrote a song about how I slept with a fat girl.


So your friends are The Dropkick Murphys and "The Spicy McHaggis Jig" is entirely based on you?



ClosetFA said:


> After this thin girls were constantly coming up to me and being outright abusive to me. I had untold number of people just laughing at me in the city. I'd get pointed out walking down the street and people talking behind my back.


Right. Because it's considered a sexual offense to like fat girls...it's worse than being a convicted rapist, or even worse, having child pornography on your computer. By the way, when you say "the city", are you referring to the high school cafeteria or do you live in a city that has a population of below 350 people?




ClosetFA said:


> 2. Work found out about this and a number of my clients were none to impressed by this 'lack of professionalism' as one termed it. I actually lost work out of this and some of the guys I worked with were quite not happy with me at all.
> 
> All of the girls at my firm were thin, tall, kind of model looking girls who stopped taking me serious. They all had it in for fat girls and didn't hold back in telling the larger girls in the streets or clubs.
> 
> Before a work function with clients and partners I was told that I was NOT to bring any obese or even large girls. The boss expressely called me in to his office to tell me this. His exact words at the end were 'You're a good looking guy. Don't lower yourself to whatever girls you find on the dancefloor at 3am'


Yeah, I know what you mean. I, for one, would NEVER want a lawyer representing me in court if I knew that his wife or girlfriend was thin. That's just wrong. PS...discrimination within a firm? Hmmm...sounds to me like "Philadelphia" is due for a sequel!!



ClosetFA said:


> However, I am super active. I run 5 times a week and I play multiple sports, go hiking, rock-climbing and also run part of a fitness school outside of work. What I really like is for a girl to do the same things as I do and come along when I do things. But I get caught off with some of the BBW's who can't come rock-climbing or running.


That's preposterous. Melissa can run 36 miles per hour and goes sky-diving twice a month. I guess you never went back to work, seeing how you have so much time for all of this...



ClosetFA said:


> That's my overall rough story and I'm sorry for the damage I've caused but I'm just not man enough to stand up to everyone in the fear that it causes more damage than it's worth.
> 
> For the record I am obviously single, male and 27 years old.
> 
> Thanks for reading.



You're welcome. Don't post in here ever again.


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## waldo (Jan 7, 2007)

Green Eyed Fairy said:


> A- f**king-men
> 
> 
> 
> ...



I found that post came off almost like a parody. Either that or some kid making stuff up, in an obviously unconvincing way.


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## Angel (Jan 7, 2007)

I read about halfway through the thread and got so angry that I didn't even bother responding. I'd rather take on Vince anyday than some of these guys. You know, it's one thing if a guy is young and hasn't even began to accept his FAness, but it is a completely different thing when a *coward* screws around with fat chicks on the sly - is leading a double life - and is too ashamed or afraid for his friends, family, and colleages to find out. 

It ticks me off how some of these *cowards* peruse Dimensions chat and web boards for one reason, thinking they can find an insecure and easy lay among the BBW here. All they have to do is compliment and lie their way into a female's heart; get what they want; then move on to the next unsuspecting female. It does happen over and over and over again.

And I am really tired of those who make excuses for these slimeballs, snakes, and *cowards*. 

I've always told FAs, "I AM FAT, and I have never had the option of hiding who I am." If any so-called FA is ashamed to be seen with me, then he is NOT worth my time or emotions.

These *cowards* are never going to change as long as others coddle them and make excuses for their actions; or as long as BBW allow themselves to be treated in such ways. 

At one time, we were all new to Dimensions, and new to all the attention; but eventually we have to realize that we are far more worth what some of these *cowards* have to offer. 


Edited to add: Some of these *cowards* may not actually have sex with the BBW they persue, but they will lead them on, say things to make the BBW beleive that he truly cares or loves them, just so that he has someone to talk to, to cyber with, or simply for his own ego boost. Some guys just want to see how many women they can get to fall for them. They will say any and everything, but they never intend to follow through with anything they say. *COWARDS*


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## NancyGirl74 (Jan 7, 2007)

Excellent thread....I'm not sure what to say about or to closeted FAs except that having been a "closeted fat girl" for 30 some years I kinda know what it's like. It's tough to just come out singing and dancing to the wonders and joys of fatdome. So, what do you do? You take it slow. You find one person at a time who will be supportive of you. You sort out those who will love and try to understand you from those who won't. You work your way up one step at a time until you are ready for that singing and dancing stage. It's slow going and each person will get there in their own time. For myself I think it will be a life long process. My closet is safe and comfy and very, very boring but it's where I've been living for a long, long time. I'm sure it is the same for anyone hiding in their "closet" no matter what their reason. 

Bottom line...I feel for the closeted FA, I really do. God knows change is hard. However, while there is no shame in once having been closeted there can only be shame for staying there. Be brave. It's not so bad. Well, it's scary as hell but it is also so liberating...liberating to be yourself. Good luck. Again, excellent thread.


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## Tooz (Jan 7, 2007)

If I got tangled up with a guy like that...I'd bitch slap him into next month.

GROW A SPINE, FOR GOD'S SAKE.

Seriously.


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## waldo (Jan 7, 2007)

NancyGirl74 said:


> Excellent thread....I'm not sure what to say about or to closeted FAs except that having been a "closeted fat girl" for 30 some years I kinda know what it's like. It's tough to just come out singing and dancing to the wonders and joys of fatdome. So, what do you do? You take it slow. You find one person at a time who will be supportive of you. You sort out those who will love and try to understand you from those who won't. You work your way up one step at a time until you are ready for that singing and dancing stage. It's slow going and each person will get there in their own time. For myself I think it will be a life long process. My closet is safe and comfy and very, very boring but it's where I've been living for a long, long time. I'm sure it is the same for anyone hiding in their "closet" no matter what their reason.
> 
> Bottom line...I feel for the closeted FA, I really do. God knows change is hard. However, while there is no shame in once having been closeted there can only be shame for staying there. Be brave. It's not so bad. Well, it's scary as hell but it is also so liberating...liberating to be yourself. Good luck. Again, excellent thread.



Wow, that was great. What an intelligent and wise outlook. :wubu:


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## Michael Lightbringer (Jan 8, 2007)

This is the post that made me sign up for an account with Dimensions. I've been a reader here for a couple of years or so. I went to one Heavenly Bodies party last year and had a one night stand. Then I went back to lurking on the forums and keeping to myself.

I seriously thought about attending the NYE party Heavenly Bodies threw. I didn't. Instead I spent it with my brother and nephews. Something inside me clicked and I let him know about my attraction to large women as well as small.

Then I read this post. Something in me clicked again. I decided to sign up here and use my current internet handle. I'm not sure what I expect from all of this. I just had to get it off my chest that your post affected me.



activistfatgirl said:


> I'm curious if other fat women or BHMs would share if they've had experiences with FAs still in the closet or ashamed of their attraction. I think something just snapped tonight and I'm feeling that raw frustration. Been there?
> 
> Here's a little letter:
> 
> ...


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## Make_Lunch_Not_War (Jan 8, 2007)

Michael Lightbringer said:


> Then I read this post. Something in me clicked again. I decided to sign up here and use my current internet handle. I'm not sure what I expect from all of this. I just had to get it off my chest that your post affected me.



Ultimately, that's the quiet, almost whispered benefit of these discussion boards; helping both FAs and BBWs learn to accept themselves and their feelings.


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## activistfatgirl (Jan 8, 2007)

Michael Lightbringer said:


> This is the post that made me sign up for an account with Dimensions. I've been a reader here for a couple of years or so. I went to one Heavenly Bodies party last year and had a one night stand. Then I went back to lurking on the forums and keeping to myself.
> 
> I seriously thought about attending the NYE party Heavenly Bodies threw. I didn't. Instead I spent it with my brother and nephews. Something inside me clicked and I let him know about my attraction to large women as well as small.
> 
> Then I read this post. Something in me clicked again. I decided to sign up here and use my current internet handle. I'm not sure what I expect from all of this. I just had to get it off my chest that your post affected me.



Well, welcome Michael Lightbringer. This is why I posted it, so someone would read it and have it make sense to them in a new way. Hope you enjoy your stay!


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## Spanky (Jan 8, 2007)

Green Eyed Fairy said:


> A- f**king-men



TIME OUT!

It took me awhile to understand this comment, darling. 

First I thought you were giving sexual intercourse with XY chomosome humans an A- grade. 

Then I thought it was a royal statement regarding kings and men. 

Then, finally, I realized you were just being religious.  

Just being slow on the uptake,

Span- f**king - ky  

Now back to your regularly scheduled rants and raves...


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## liz (di-va) (Jan 8, 2007)

Michael Lightbringer said:


> This is the post that made me sign up for an account with Dimensions. I've been a reader here for a couple of years or so. I went to one Heavenly Bodies party last year and had a one night stand. Then I went back to lurking on the forums and keeping to myself.
> 
> I seriously thought about attending the NYE party Heavenly Bodies threw. I didn't. Instead I spent it with my brother and nephews. Something inside me clicked and I let him know about my attraction to large women as well as small.
> 
> Then I read this post. Something in me clicked again. I decided to sign up here and use my current internet handle. I'm not sure what I expect from all of this. I just had to get it off my chest that your post affected me.



Way 2 go! Congrats on telling your relatives and signing up here. Good will come of all of it, I am sure.


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## Green Eyed Fairy (Jan 8, 2007)

Spanky said:


> TIME OUT!
> 
> It took me awhile to understand this comment, darling.
> 
> ...



hahahahahahha yeah those Southern Baptists sure have a hold on me..... 


Sorry for the confusion 

***I tried to rep you Spanky but it wouldnt let me


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## Littleghost (Jan 8, 2007)

liz (di-va) said:


> Whee! okay.  Let's go leave stinky things in the (FA) closets. Maybe banana peels.


HEY NOW. I haven't been in my closet in years, literally or figuratively. I just got the thing cleaned out, don't go ruining my good vibe.


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## Littleghost (Jan 8, 2007)

NFA said:


> On the "but you can do better/you can't do better" line some FA's get subjected to, I'm reminded of my favorite comeback I've never gotten to use because no one every gives me a hard time about being an FA. (I'll get asked about it, but usually out of genuine curiosity)
> 
> "I can't do better than a fat woman. I just mean that differently than you do."



I too have yet to use mine, so: "How can I do better than a goddess??" accompanied by a genuinely confused face.


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## lemmink (Jan 9, 2007)

While I've come out to my boyfriend I'm otherwise more-or-lessly in the closet, and my boyfriend sure as fuck isn't going to tell other people about it (he finds it highly embarrassing; it's our little secret). I've been lurking around Dimensions since foreverago, and sure it told me that I wasn't a complete deviant but it didn't make me any more willing to get out there and proclaim to the world my sexual tastes because the world outside the internet was still the same bloody world. That's like saying that because I made a profile on gaydargirls, it'd be real bloody easy to tell my mom ZOMG I AM HAVING SEX WITH TEH WOMENZ LOLLERSKATES. Sorry, but NO. 

I don't think a lot of people actually GET how bloody hard it is for some FAs. Yes, being open about stuff seems really easy for people for people who don't have to deal with these issues. For the rest of us, it isn't. If it was, I wouldn't have spent so much dang hell time trying to teach myself how to be sexually interested in thin people and fucking up their lives. If it was so damn easy, why the heck are these things still happening, why are FAs still in the closet, why are women/men still getting brainfucked by them?

This kind of argument seems to come up pretty regularly on these boards, but this is the first time I've seen people go right in and attack the hell out of the people who are taking the first step to admit that yes, they have been bastards and they don't know what to do. :doh: 




Incidentally I'm not bitching about the initial bitch on this post - yeah, I see that it sucks like hell when you get fucked over by a closet FA.


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## elle camino (Jan 9, 2007)

*regarding closetFA's post:*

i consider myself both an intuitive and resolute person, but this honestly had me totally stumped for a bit. 
on one hand, this guy paints a picture of some kind of parallel universe where nobody he works with, nobody he's friends with, nobody in his family is fat. now honestly unless he's from a famine-plagued third world country, that right there is crazy talk. then he gives us examples of _totally_ over-the-top abuse from his family, friends, and co workers as a result of dating a fat girl. like, i can see maybe your friends giving you some shit because of who you date, or your boss maybe _asking_ about your love life, but this whole 'wrote a song about it' and 'threatened my employment' crap is just...too much. way too much. 
the whole thing adds up to total BS.

however, on the other hand you have one question: why on earth would somone come here, read this thread, and decide to register and post JUST to spin some ridiculously outlandish yarn about something which he MUST have known would upset people? it makes no sense at all.

unfortunately, the fact that this is taking place on the internet renders hand #2 basically empty. the internet is where people fake their deaths, lie about having children and then kill them off, and generally unleash all manner of idiotic, nonsensical, absurd drama on their fallow man just for the sake of killing a little time and garnering a little attention. 

so.
my conclusion: closet FA is very very likely (to say the least) a big fat fibber.


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## itsfine (Jan 9, 2007)

I never even knew that there was such a thing as a closet FA.

If a guy dated me and didn't let me meet his friends, I'd just assume he was hiding something weird...or didn't have any friends. haha. This conclusion ends in me not wanting to date the guy. 

Anyway, I have never been treated this way, and don't plan on it happening anytime soon so I'm going to continue to not worry about it


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## ClosetFA (Jan 9, 2007)

Hi,

I know that my previous post caused quite an emotional and angry response...not to mention people not believing me. That's fine. I wasn't asking for anyone to believe me as it's my own personal situation.

I generally chat here (although infrequently) under a different name. Like my original post suggested I am a closet FA. 

I thought...and rightfully so...that by telling my own situation that it would anger people. It has angered most of you. 

If you wanted a truthful account...even though it sounds stupid and false then how could I post it under my normal chat name. You would crucify me!

It's not me personally who is anti BBW's. In fact I am the complete opposite. I just haven't had the balls to tell everyone about it....although I'm sure they more than suspect.

The firm I worked for previously was marketing based and did many fitness and health related products (among other things). I personally find fitness, sports and healthy products interesting to myself.

However, on a sexual note I lend myself to the feeder category! So how can I reconcile the two? As my English teacher would have said 'It's a juxtaposition of incompatibles'

The problem with this is that my family are fitness oriented and so to are my friends and work. This fitness (dare I call it community) are the worst for treating fat as evil.

I apologize for any offence that I have interned upon everyone but I gave a factual account.


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## Renaissance Woman (Jan 9, 2007)

lemmink said:


> I don't think a lot of people actually GET how bloody hard it is for some FAs. Yes, being open about stuff seems really easy for people for people who don't have to deal with these issues. For the rest of us, it isn't. If it was, I wouldn't have spent so much dang hell time trying to teach myself how to be sexually interested in thin people and fucking up their lives. If it was so damn easy, why the heck are these things still happening, why are FAs still in the closet, why are women/men still getting brainfucked by them?
> 
> This kind of argument seems to come up pretty regularly on these boards, but this is the first time I've seen people go right in and attack the hell out of the people who are taking the first step to admit that yes, they have been bastards and they don't know what to do. :doh:


Lemmink, I think you've got it a bit harder with the bisexual thing on top of the FA thing, so you get a bit more slack. BUT....

I have to go back to the point I made before. No, it's not easy to go against what family/friends/society are shoving down your throat as being "attractive" and follow your own desires. But it's still a hell of a lot easier than getting crap about your appearance and assumptions about your lifestyle, eating habits, and personal morality every day simply by going about your daily business like anybody else. 

Average-sized FAs can go incognito, as it were, most of the time. Us fat people can't. And therein lies the difference, my friend. This isn't meant as an us-vs-you kind of thing, 'cause that would be shooting myself in the foot. But you've got to understand why there's not as much sympathy as you'd ideally like from a lot of us fat folks. And along those same lines, the FAs need to understand why a whole bunch of fat people don't have high self-esteem, confidence, etc., that they'd think they should have based on all their great positive attributes. Getting crap all of one's life about size tends to diminish the value of everything else we bring to the table. And that takes time to work through as well. 

This is NOT an attack, but just trying to clarify and help understanding.


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## lemmink (Jan 10, 2007)

I get that that wasn't an attack, RW  I appreciate your post. I do have to say again that I wasn't criticising the OP - I can see that kind of thing is a bitch. I'm sorry it happens to people. I think it sucks that people get treated like shit for what they look like. I know that fat people have a myriad of reasons to be shitty at FAs who treat them badly. I do acknowledge that. Honest.

I also don't think being an FA can be compared to being fat (except in the way Nancy suggests). But I do think that being an FA can be compared to being bisexual... although I guess that's a point for a whole 'nother thread. 

Anyway, I'm sorry for kind of side tracking things. 



Reason I had my little yell there was because it does piss me off when FAs are leapt on if they admit that they have problems coming out. I can relate to almost everything ClosetFA said, and the rest of it is stuff of my (very frequent) nightmares. I come from a fitness-crazed/fashion-model family/friendship group who are also extremely anti-fat. Trust me, that shit happens.


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## MisticalMisty (Jan 10, 2007)

lemmink said:


> Reason I had my little yell there was because it does piss me off when FAs are leapt on if they admit that they have problems coming out. I can relate to almost everything ClosetFA said, and the rest of it is stuff of my (very frequent) nightmares. *I come from a fitness-crazed/fashion-model family/friendship group who are also extremely anti-fat*. Trust me, that shit happens.



I don't have the time I need to post a careful response to this so I will write the first thing that pops into my head and revisit it later. The bolded text is what really stuck out to me. 

You many only come from a group of these kind of people. But I come in contact with this people every minute of every single day. Friends, family, strangers, people on the news, my coworkers who are counting every last weight watchers point because GOD FORBID they look like me someday.

So really, have your plight...I'm not saying that you don't have a right to feel the way you do or that any other fa doesn't have the right to feel the way he does. BUT LEAVE US FAT PEOPLE ALONE. Quite frankly, I call bullshit with this comment and every other "whoa is me comment" 

I have the balls to stand up to those people and say "I'm fat, I love it and I'll be damned if I change myself for you or anyone else." Now, I want a man that will say something similar. "Hey, yes I love fat girls and I'll be damned if I change myself for you or anyone else."


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## Mikey (Jan 10, 2007)

wrestlingguy said:


> Back around 1998, a few of my buddies thought it would be fun to have a t-shirt made up for me to wear on the boardwalk that summer in Atlantic City. All it said was "I'll take the fat one".............I LOVED it, and wore it that entire summer, much to the concern of my buddies, who all thought I'd gone off the deep end.
> 
> I was thinking about a business opportunity recently, and thought that printing shirts with this slogan might be a cool idea, that FA's would love it, and I might make a few bucks developing a line of fat girl support shirts for men.
> 
> My question is, things have changed since '98. Would the shirt today say "I WANT the fat one"???? If so, would the guys have the testiculars to wear it, or have times not changed as much as I thought?



I think either slogan would work...you also might want to make one that is gender specific..ie, "I'll take the fat chick..." for those who don't want an encounter of the other preference. (not that there is anything wrong with that) I think you could make a financial killing on the proposition...it would probably liberate a lot of the 'closeted masses."


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## LoveBHMS (Jan 10, 2007)

a play on one of those old 70's era t-shirts that said "I'm with stupid" that had a horizontal arrow.

They could be marketed to non-closeted FA's and say something like "I'm with the fat girl" or "I'm with the fat chick" and on the back say "Want to make something of it?"


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## isotope (Jan 10, 2007)

I've told my friends "Hey, I like some meat on my women."

True, I haven't dated anyone what you would really call fat. I'd say most of the girls i've been with are from average to chubby, however, it's because i just haven't ran into a girl bigger than that who i was into and was into me. 

But if i did, I wouldn't have a problem with dating her openly. Why? It's called being yourself, it feels good.

I'll probably get alot of crap from my friends. But the thing is, I already get crap for other things i do. That's why they're my friends. And if they dont want to be my friend simply because the size of my girlfriend, then they're not really the people i thought they were. 

This isn't really directed at anyone, just sort of my own little rant on it's own.


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## Green Eyed Fairy (Jan 10, 2007)

I can't stand men who sneak around on the internet...

*cough*Closet *cough*


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## LillyBBBW (Jan 10, 2007)

Your life is a living hell my friend. I am totally feeling for you but my reach is just a wee bit shy. Seriously, leave the fatties alone. Just because your life is shit doesn't make it okay for you to poison others with it. Give up cable TV, High speed internet and one take out meal a month. Invest the money you save in a plump cross town hooker from time to time and a box of condoms. Your secret is safe and so are innocent people. Please don't keep hurting people, it's not nice and it builds up and will come spilling out of the closet in plain view of everyone eventually - this I promise you. It won't be convenient and the evil you caused to the people you hurt will be more appalling to everyone than the original reason you hide. Just like my Pastor always says: "Your sins find you out."




ClosetFA said:


> Hi,
> 
> I know that my previous post caused quite an emotional and angry response...not to mention people not believing me. That's fine. I wasn't asking for anyone to believe me as it's my own personal situation.
> 
> ...


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## fatgirl85 (Jan 10, 2007)

I have been out and in the open for 6 months, feels great


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## James (Jan 10, 2007)

activistfatgirl said:


> I'm curious if other fat women or BHMs would share if they've had experiences with FAs still in the closet or ashamed of their attraction. I think something just snapped tonight and I'm feeling that raw frustration. Been there?
> 
> Here's a little letter:
> 
> ...



seriously good post AFG.... I think some headbutt action might go some way towards remedying this...

and I get what u mean about the myspace duality... this makes me raise an eyebrow too when i come across it. If u'd like to join my *sole *myspace account then PM me. I'll send a FR and gladly add you!


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## activistfatgirl (Jan 10, 2007)

James said:


> seriously good post AFG.... I think some headbutt action might go some way towards remedying this...
> 
> and I get what u mean about the myspace duality... this always makes me raise an eyebrow when i come across it. If u'd like to join my *sole *myspace account then PM me. I'll send a FR and gladly add you!



Remember, James, headbutting is affectionate! :wubu: 

I'd love to join your myspace friend army!

Re: Myspace. Its shocking how many well known FAs here at Dims have a fatty account and a real friend account. Shocking.


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## lemmink (Jan 11, 2007)

Please don't get me wrong, Misty - as I said before, I'm not trying to make a comparison between the experiences of being an FA with being fat, & I certainly wouldn't wish dating (or heck, *being*) a closet FA on anyone, fat or thin. I've been fairly open on here (as have a few other people) about being a pretty crappy date before I eventually 'came out' to my partner, and I'm certainly not proud of it. 

I comment & make suggestions on threads here all the time about people worried about telling their partner/friends/family about their FAness because they think they'll react badly. I really don't think it's such an uncommon or bad thing on Dimensions to express fear of coming out as an FA or to admit that it's difficult. 




MisticalMisty said:


> You many only come from a group of these kind of people. But I come in contact with this people every minute of every single day. Friends, family, strangers, people on the news, my coworkers who are counting every last weight watchers point because GOD FORBID they look like me someday.
> 
> So really, have your plight...I'm not saying that you don't have a right to feel the way you do or that any other fa doesn't have the right to feel the way he does. BUT LEAVE US FAT PEOPLE ALONE. Quite frankly, I call bullshit with this comment and every other "whoa is me comment"


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## TheNowhereMan (Jan 11, 2007)

When a man is out with the guys and one spys a thin skank strolling along and comments how he thinks she's sexy and all agree but you. It does tend to make you feel a little outta place. For along time I'd fake it and go along with them. But I'm coming out of the closet as it were and letting people know. It's hard sometimes but I've got a wonderful girl behind me now and she's making it alot easier.


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## waldo (Jan 11, 2007)

activistfatgirl said:


> Re: Myspace. Its shocking how many well known FAs here at Dims have a fatty account and a real friend account. Shocking.



The argument could be made that you owe it to the other members here to 'out' the scoundrels, particularly if they have been lying on here that they are completely open about their FA preference to friends and families.


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## LillyBBBW (Jan 11, 2007)

waldo said:


> The argument could be made that you owe it to the other members here to 'out' the scoundrels, particularly if they have been lying on here that they are completely open about their FA preference to friends and families.



*Squeals* Ooooooooo! *rubs hands together* A public outing! Yeah, do it so we can throw rocks at 'em. :eat2:


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## Canadian (Jan 11, 2007)

activistfatgirl said:


> Re: Myspace. Its shocking how many well known FAs here at Dims have a fatty account and a real friend account. Shocking.


I had considered this back in the day, when I actually used myspace with any regularity. But here me out. 

The reason was that I was "friends" with a bunch of paysite girls, and some of them started posting "preview-style" pictures in my comments, linking people back to their websites. I had no interest in having porn all over my myspace page. So I considered having a regular page, with all my friends, and then another page that I could have with webgirls on it, and not care if there was porn on it.

I then found the feature that disabled the ability to post pictures in my comments and just went with that instead. I might guess this is the reason some other guys have two different myspace accounts, though.

Cheers.


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## Shala (Jan 11, 2007)

I have never dated an FA(although I really wont to...and soon!) But when I think back, I may have run across a closet FA. He was the typical charming, overly handsome guy every guy wanted to be and every girl wanted to be with. And we had this connection. Wow did I ever fall hard.

Long story short, in the end he broke my heart. Well I guess it wasn't just in the end....he was breaking off little bits every moment we were together. 

I wish that just once he could have admitted he really dug a fat girl.


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## activistfatgirl (Jan 11, 2007)

LillyBBBW said:


> *Squeals* Ooooooooo! *rubs hands together* A public outing! Yeah, do it so we can throw rocks at 'em. :eat2:



Well guys, Its a tough call. I was talking with someone about this, and as Canadian attests, there's a natural desire to hide very sexually charged content from your normal life, particularly if it includes pictures. Canadian mentions he created a catch all profile and changed settings to disallow the steamy pictures that could get him in throuble.

Here's the thing: I get why it makes sense to have a sep. profile for paysite and girls who show pics on myspace as a marketing tool/fun. BUT an entirely separate profile for all fatties, while not including fatties that are your friends and don't show pictures? How can that be justified.

I'm not interested in outing anyone. A few folks I'm thinking of are some of the FAs I talk to the most here. I'd rather they speak for themselves.


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## LillyBBBW (Jan 11, 2007)

activistfatgirl said:


> Well guys, Its a tough call. I was talking with someone about this, and as Canadian attests, there's a natural desire to hide very sexually charged content from your normal life, particularly if it includes pictures. Canadian mentions he created a catch all profile and changed settings to disallow the steamy pictures that could get him in throuble.
> 
> Here's the thing: I get why it makes sense to have a sep. profile for paysite and girls who show pics on myspace as a marketing tool/fun. BUT an entirely separate profile for all fatties, while not including fatties that are your friends and don't show pictures? How can that be justified.
> 
> I'm not interested in outing anyone. A few folks I'm thinking of are some of the FAs I talk to the most here. I'd rather they speak for themselves.



I've seen them too to be honest. I'm not even a hard core MySpacer and I noticed them. I don't care enough about it or them to make a fuss but it is pretty amusing. If you really want to press their grapes ask to sub to their strait account if you know where it is and see what happens. This will clear up the picture for you in a hurry. Then report back! :eat2: I still wanna throw rocks at 'em.


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## activistfatgirl (Jan 11, 2007)

LillyBBBW said:


> I've seen them too to be honest. I'm not even a hard core MySpacer and I noticed them. I don't care enough about it or them to make a fuss but it is pretty amusing. If you really want to press their grapes ask to sub to their strait account if you know where it is and see what happens. This will clear up the picture for you in a hurry. Then report back! :eat2: I still wanna throw rocks at 'em.



Let me tell you a story. In one case, that's already been done. One female dimmer-not a paysite girl & no crazy pics on her profile- was telling me that by mistake she added herself to a Dim FA's real account with all of us his friends and stuff. He promptly denied her and sent her an invite to his appropriate FA account where he houses us Dimfolk.


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## LillyBBBW (Jan 11, 2007)

activistfatgirl said:


> Let me tell you a story. In one case, that's already been done. One female dimmer-not a paysite girl & no crazy pics on her profile- was telling me that by mistake she added herself to a Dim FA's real account with all of us his friends and stuff. He promptly denied her and sent her an invite to his appropriate FA account where he houses us Dimfolk.



I am so not shocked. Not surprising that some of them are among the ones who sass the loudest around here but then scatter like roaches as soon as the lights go on.


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## Carrie (Jan 11, 2007)

activistfatgirl said:


> Let me tell you a story. In one case, that's already been done. One female dimmer-not a paysite girl & no crazy pics on her profile- was telling me that by mistake she added herself to a Dim FA's real account with all of us his friends and stuff. He promptly denied her and sent her an invite to his appropriate FA account where he houses us Dimfolk.



To quote myself, ugh. Just....ugh.


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## Shala (Jan 11, 2007)

activistfatgirl said:


> Let me tell you a story. In one case, that's already been done. One female dimmer-not a paysite girl & no crazy pics on her profile- was telling me that by mistake she added herself to a Dim FA's real account with all of us his friends and stuff. He promptly denied her and sent her an invite to his appropriate FA account where he houses us Dimfolk.



So disappointing. I have no idea who the culprits are. But its disheartening to me to think of these things while I'm reading posts I adore from FA's I've come to respect.


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## snuggletiger (Jan 11, 2007)

The Obstreperous Ms. J said:


> Seriously y'all. Where is OUR Stonewall?!?!?!? Where is OUR Woodstock??? Where is OUR parade???



And the non hidden ones will get gipped on Parade day. I swear I always seem to belong in the wrong groups. I want there to be a WRONG/NOBODY SUPPORTS YOUR GROUP day  I could get behind that.


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## waldo (Jan 11, 2007)

activistfatgirl said:


> Here's the thing: I get why it makes sense to have a sep. profile for paysite and girls who show pics on myspace as a marketing tool/fun. *BUT an entirely separate profile for all fatties, while not including fatties that are your friends and don't show pictures? How can that be justified.*
> I'm not interested in outing anyone. A few folks I'm thinking of are some of the FAs I talk to the most here. I'd rather they speak for themselves.



So how about it guys? Anyone willing to fess up now? I doubt it.



LillyBBBW said:


> I am so not shocked. Not surprising that some of them are among the ones who sass the loudest around here but then scatter like roaches as soon as the lights go on.



By sass the loudest I assume you mean beat their chest about how proud and open they are about being an FA and how easy it is to be open about it and how cowardly those in the closet are. Or did you mean something else?

I think what we have here supports what I said earlier in this thread that the atmosphere here is not conducive to FAs discussing theirs fears and working toward coming to terms with themselves. The distain shown for fully or semi closeted FAs causes these young guys to do what seems like the smart thing by telling the ladies what you want to hear. But then as Bruce points out, so few of them show up at the dances or do anything else to prove they really are all what they claim.

Thanks to ActivistfatGirl for shedding some truth on the situation :bow:


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## moonvine (Jan 11, 2007)

activistfatgirl said:


> Re: Myspace. Its shocking how many well known FAs here at Dims have a fatty account and a real friend account. Shocking.



I think you should out them. (Sorry, I just now saw your post where you said you weren't interested in outing them. Rest assured if I find out who they are *I* will out them. Cowards.)


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## moonvine (Jan 11, 2007)

lemmink said:


> I comment & make suggestions on threads here all the time about people worried about telling their partner/friends/family about their FAness because they think they'll react badly. I really don't think it's such an uncommon or bad thing on Dimensions to express fear of coming out as an FA or to admit that it's difficult.



I don't think it is bad, as long as you don't "date" fat people secretly and screw up their lives in the process - or "date" thin people you aren't really attracted to because you're scared of what your family and friends will think if you date the people you're really into. If people have a hard time with coming out of the closet, they should not date until they can get themselves together, IMHO. Lily's prostitute suggestion was a good one. That way no one gets hurt.


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## moonvine (Jan 11, 2007)

Canadian said:


> I then found the feature that disabled the ability to post pictures in my comments and just went with that instead. I might guess this is the reason some other guys have two different myspace accounts, though.
> 
> Cheers.



I guess this is a freakish thought, but if people are going to be spreading pictures all over my MySpace account that I didn't want there, I just wouldn't friend them or would ..what's the word..unfriend them? defriend them?

I used to have a BBW yahoo group and didn't allow paysite related postings there, because I didn't want them there. It was not appropriate for the group.

I only have a cat myspace (that Em maintains for me cuz I don't have time to)...hopefully no one will put porn pics on it, heh.

Kitties Myspace


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## LillyBBBW (Jan 11, 2007)

Just for shits and giggles I went over to my MySpace page just to see. I always knew I had a few guys on there where every single friend in their cue is a fat girl or fatgirlproductions.com kinda site. It never bothered me really, they're young and feeling themselves out I guess. I don't know 'em but I let 'em in anyway. I looked a little further and so far *most* of the fellas on my friends list seem on the level. Some of them have all their real life friends and skinny chicks displayed on the main page but when you delve a little further you see the fatties buried way out in back which one could find reason to quibble about but I'm not particularly moved. 

Anyway, I felt that enough piss and vinegar has been sprayed around here, and *well* deserved in my view, for all the perpetrators out there but among them are a whopping majority of people who are up front and doing their thing. I just thought that these people should be positively highlighted.


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## activistfatgirl (Jan 11, 2007)

There are a lot of folks being up front, LillyBBBW. 

I'm going to make that my new gauge for following up with flirty boys. Luckily my favorite flirt receivers added me to their generic "this is really me!" pages, and for that, I shall not post naked pictures to their sites, but in discreet emails with smileys.

A couple others are in the other category, so I'll just end transmission on the Smiley train.

Some people are missing out. That's all I've got to say.

PS. I just got the saddest message from a Dims woman saying that its stuff like this that has diminished her view of this community. That's very sad to me. I can't fix that. But I do know that I'm just going to take more seriously who and how I talk to FAs online, and in real life. Yay for lessons learned!


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## LillyBBBW (Jan 11, 2007)

Some of these guys with the fattie sites also post other risque material and information about themselves. The language is profane, they're nude, there's toilet humor, feet, BDSM, etc. It's unclear as to weather they keep their friends away to sheild them from the fat girls or from the rest of the freak show they have going on there. :blink:

Wow, this has been entertaining. I've never really looked at my MySpace before. Pretty cool.


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## James (Jan 11, 2007)

activistfatgirl said:


> There are a lot of folks being up front, LillyBBBW.
> 
> I'm going to make that my new gauge for following up with flirty boys. Luckily my favorite flirt receivers added me to their generic "this is really me!" pages, and for that, I shall not post naked pictures to their sites, but in discreet emails with smileys.
> 
> ...



well call me unoriginal... (or stupid) but my name is "James", my profile on here is "James" (with a pic of "me"... looking stoopid!), my myspace account is "James" and I have only ever had one account for *friends*... and basically erm... what you see is what you get!

Very glad to have you on there AFG btw


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## supersoup (Jan 11, 2007)

myspace is like crack, and closet fa's that hurt others are stupid.

that's all.


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## moonvine (Jan 11, 2007)

supersoup said:


> myspace is like crack, and closet fa's that hurt others are stupid.
> 
> that's all.



I hate MySpace, so perhaps I'd best not try crack.


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## supersoup (Jan 11, 2007)

moonvine said:


> I hate MySpace, so perhaps I'd best not try crack.



ohhhhh i despised it as well, but in a moment of weakness, created a page. it is now like an addiction. oy!! steer clear of it at all costs!


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## activistfatgirl (Jan 11, 2007)

James said:


> well call me unoriginal... (or stupid) but my name is "James", my profile on here is "James" (with a pic of "me"... looking stoopid!), my myspace account is "James" and I have only ever had one account for *friends*... and basically erm... what you see is what you get!
> 
> Very glad to have you on there AFG btw



And this why we like you, James. IF THAT'S YOUR REAL NAME!!!


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## James (Jan 11, 2007)

activistfatgirl said:


> And this why we like you, James. IF THAT'S YOUR REAL NAME!!!



oh yeah...lol

right... 

/looks for birth certificate...

lol


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## MisticalMisty (Jan 11, 2007)

This myspace phenomenon is totally new to me. I never thought that the guys around here would do something so decitful. I just feel really sad and really disappointed. I can understand not wanting the paysite previews. But turn the codes off or something. 

I consider myself one of the biggest cheerlearders for FAs around these parts. However, now I just feel kinda..numb.


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## Ample Pie (Jan 11, 2007)

James said:


> well call me unoriginal... (or stupid) but my name is "James", my profile on here is "James" (with a pic of "me"... looking stoopid!), my myspace account is "James" and I have only ever had one account for *friends*... and basically erm... what you see is what you get!



Same here, although my name is Rebecca, not James.


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## snuggletiger (Jan 11, 2007)

Myspace.....hmmm never heard of it


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## Shala (Jan 11, 2007)

James said:


> well call me unoriginal... (or stupid) but my name is "James", my profile on here is "James" (with a pic of "me"... looking stoopid!), my myspace account is "James" and I have only ever had one account for *friends*... and basically erm... what you see is what you get!
> 
> Very glad to have you on there AFG btw



I'd call it just plain honest. I'm the same way...I just don't have it in me to create other personas, etc. I'm just...me. Maybe its naive sometimes to be so open but I cannot help it.


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## activistfatgirl (Jan 11, 2007)

So. Wow, this has become a painful, beautiful, interesting, heart-wrenching, wonderful endeavor.

So here's some words from a young FA who wants to post about not being entirely open about his preference in all walks of life, someone who's struggling. Someone here. He said he didn't think he could bear posting on this thread.

_"I do think, however, that as someone who just needs a little support to be open about his FA preference, I fear that noting that I'm not entirely out about it will get me nothing but scorn." _

My response: _"I don't disagree, and I don't know how to fix that."_

And fixing? Not me. I can't do it. I'm very tired and emotionally exhausted and I don't have the energy to help this wonderful FA. But how can we create safe space for FAs to talk about their struggles?

I know I've bristled at all the accounts of "how hard it is", many of us have. Because we're fat. We can't hide, all of that. But still, I recognize the space that's needed for FAs to flourish and grow. 

As I said to this person, you can't run from the stinging comments on this thread. This is real life and we've all got reasons to be hurt and I love the honesty here.

Maybe some of the FA men can start a coming out thread of some sort, I don't know. Share some experiences?

I hope we can all find what we need, and young FA, I hope you find yours. I'm going to take a little break and reflect.


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## supersoup (Jan 11, 2007)

activistfatgirl said:


> So. Wow, this has become a painful, beautiful, interesting, heart-wrenching, wonderful endeavor.
> 
> So here's some words from a young FA who wants to post about not being entirely open about his preference in all walks of life, someone who's struggling. Someone here. He said he didn't think he could bear posting on this thread.
> 
> ...



that makes me sad, because yes, he probably would get scorned. the only thing that bothered me with this thread was closeted fa's hurting others by their behaviors, but above is the flip side of the issue. they DO need space to flourish and grow, i guess i never really thought of it that way. i hope you do get the support you need, mystery fa man, cause eventually being able to be completely open about what you like will only lead to good things, that i'm sure of!!


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## Giraffes?Giraffes! (Jan 11, 2007)

You know.... This post. 

This is one of those posts that I really would have loved to have been able to comment on. 

Sadly, due to the fact that I dont spend enough time on this website, by the time I DO come across a topic as thought provoking and as wrenchingly raw and honest as the one AFG brought to the table all those pages and pages ago, everything, seemingly, that could possibly be said, every shred of analysis and conjecture has already been offered.

I will say this though: As a too-seldom poster and occasional visitor to this board, I am so pleasantly flummoxed by the level of debate and/or conversation consistently exhibited by it's posters. Dimensions' community really has more than it's fair share of agile minds.

However, conceding the fact that the opportunity to get this under the wire has long past- 

That was a beautiful, moving, aching and human post, AFG. After reading it I felt totally exposed.... Not because I behave or have behaved like the young man in question necessarily (who has deservedly been filleted by your pen and wit) but because, like any nation, race, organization or community, the fault of one is, to an extent, the fault of all.

An embarrassingly significant portion of FAs are closeted- cloistering off their self described "fetish" as if it were some horrific love-that-dare-not-speak-it's-name. We as FAs are collectively responsible for that mentality, just as society at large is responsible for creating an environment where having a preference for fat girls is a mockable and tauntable offense. 

And, of course, there is a degree to which I have struggled in the past, as i'm sure many of us have, in my journey to totally own and be confident in my predilections. I certainly have never had a secret girlfriend or kept an "FA" persona aside from my regular one, but the impulse to not want to dive headfirst into the sea of criticism and cockeyed looks one gets as a young man trumpeting the virtues and charms of the biggest girls in the class... is one I am familiar with.

Anyway... I hope that things get better for AFG on the guy front. There are real men out there, from time to time. I keep faith as well that we _are_, as a society, becoming, slowly, incrementally, more respectful and tolerant of the choices and preferences of others. That may be Pollyannaish in this day and age of groupthink... but the bigger trend, I think, is positive. 

Oh, and a quick addendum/confession: I _DO_ keep a separete myspace account for dating (just created it recently, in fact.) But it has nothing to do with shame I feel regarding chasing after fat girls-- quite to contrary, all my friends know how I feel about that. I mock THEM for the girls they date (what _does_ one do with a 95 pound pixie, I wonder?) Rather, I do it because I use my regular myspace page for networking. It isnt always gravely serious, but i'd like to keep it free from the embellishments that often result in the seeking of romance. If any conversation or relationship takes any sort of root, I have no reservations about adding them to my regular page. There are those, i'm sure, that might look at this as a copout, but I assure you it is not. Ask my college roommates what sort of girls i'm into. They'll have no problem telling you. In detail. 

Anyway, this went on for far too long, and still probably qualifies as too little, too late. But i'm glad I got to throw my hat into the ring. Thanks for bringing this to the table, AFG.

-Martin

P.S. NYC is finally getting cold. About time.


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## supersoup (Jan 11, 2007)

Giraffes?Giraffes! said:


> You know.... This post.
> 
> This is one of those posts that I really would have loved to have been able to comment on.
> 
> ...



i love the name martin. there aren't enough of you.

that's all.


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## Giraffes?Giraffes! (Jan 11, 2007)

Why thanks.



supersoup said:


> i love the name martin. there aren't enough of you.
> 
> that's all.


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## weetabix (Jan 11, 2007)

TheNowhereMan said:


> When a man is out with the guys and one spys a thin skank strolling along and comments how he thinks she's sexy and all agree but you. It does tend to make you feel a little outta place. For along time I'd fake it and go along with them. But I'm coming out of the closet as it were and letting people know. It's hard sometimes but I've got a wonderful girl behind me now and she's making it alot easier.



I believe my friends can tell the sort of woman I like. They only have to look at 30 stone Suze to get an idea. We even make a game of it when spotting women when out in the street, I always take the fat one. It's also interesting that probably most men are quick to say a woman is too thin and happier to express preference for a plump one. However mostly they are not into SSBBW, which is to be expected. I think it's progress that men can be open and honest about preferring plump women.

It's the job of us out FAs and out SSBBW  to create the environment and set the scene for closit FA's and shy BBW to know how things can really be. You know, if you are an FA, know this; some of your friends are closit FA's and plenty of BBW don't know they are attractive.

We do something about this every time anyone learns how we feel.

Regards,
Weetabix.


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## weetabix (Jan 11, 2007)

ClosetFA,

You are a construct of all the worst case ClosetFA tendancies us FA's have ever experienced. I think all FA's will secretly understand where you are coming from although most will strongly fight those feelings and win.

Considering how strong the sexual desire for BBW is in an FA, it would seem odd that an FA cannot overcome the problems you have given. Are you seriously telling me that your mum and dad and your mates and your job are more important than than making big huge fat love with a sexy BBW? You must have a pathetic wimpy sex drive. Are you sure you are an FA?

Like I said, I don't think you are a real person but a great talking point. You have prompted some great responses in this thread and I am sure that it will have had a positive effect on the real closet FA's out there. I was one whilst I was still working out what made me happy. 

ClosetFA, you could lose the respect of your family, friends and work mates if you come out as an FA. So what? And anyway they actually get over it, you're not as important as you might imagine. You will be yesterdays news in a day or so. Longer term you will be free to love a BBW and fatten her into SSBBW.

Go for it


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## liz (di-va) (Jan 11, 2007)

weetabix said:


> Considering how strong the sexual desire for BBW is in an FA, it would seem odd that an FA cannot overcome the problems you have given. Are you seriously telling me that your mum and dad and your mates and your job are more important than than making big huge fat love with a sexy BBW? You must have a pathetic wimpy sex drive. Are you sure you are an FA?



I think you have a point here Weetabix, but I can't stop giggling...this is the Let Your Dick Lead You argument for closeted FAs. Not too different from a macho double dog dare, in a way. Hehehehe. K, back to regular programming.


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## weetabix (Jan 11, 2007)

Waldo,

Yes I don't really discuss things with my parents, usually best to say as little as possible or else get a lecture. Having said that, I can now do what I like because I don't have to listen to lectures from my family.

A few years ago my father decided to try and find out why I did not get on with my brother. First he asked me, I said that I don't mind my brother but he does not seem to like me. Then he asked my bother why we did not get along. My father came back to me and sat me down and got me to agree to accept everything he was to tellme without comment or argument. I agreeded. He then proceded to reel off a long list of my faults, about 30 things ranging from drink driving through sexual affairs running a pornographic web site through to piedophilia (is that the love of pies?). My father said that when I had sorted out my life my brother would then accept me back into the family. I was shocked by this and vowed to cut back a little on the drink driving and womanizing, both had been costing me a fortune, not to mention the cost of running the website.

After a few weeks of anguish I said Fuck em'. I will keep my evil vices and just dump my brother. I am sure his life is no worse for not seeing me and mine is also greatly lightened by not having his pious cleanliness cramping my style.

So if you do decide to do your own thing then you may well find that someone close to you trys to put you straight. For BBW and SSBBW it's definitely worth it, one of those things you wish you had done sooner. 

I remember when I was 10 there was a beautiful SSBBG (girl) at school who I was in love with. Christine was the proper SSBBW shape only as a 10 year old would be. In a show and tell type lesson she revealed her cousin modeled in the Gypsy Bra advert on TV. The teacher said, Christine you have such a pretty face if you lost the weight you could be as beautiful as your cousin. I was incensed, she was easily as beautiful as the girl with the big boobies in the advert we all loved. It was simply insane that she would be MORE BEAUTIFUL is she was not fat. I knew then I was an FA. However my best friend was a closet FA. He was one of those really funny people, he christened her Moon Base Alpha (Space 1999 SiFi TV series), yes she was very big and completely round like the moon. We were all cruel to her when really I wanted to go out with her and show her all my love. However the last laugh was when he married a Female Feeder and she made him put on tonnes of weight. He became a closet Feedee and became too fat to be seen by his old friends! If I met her again I would try and make it all up to her.

So the moral is, it's tough on yourself to be honest and probably tough on others. However being a closet FA is worse for some and very bad for yourself.

Regards,
Weetabix.


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## TheNowhereMan (Jan 11, 2007)

weetabix said:


> I believe my friends can tell the sort of woman I like. They only have to look at 30 stone Suze to get an idea. We even make a game of it when spotting women when out in the street, I always take the fat one. It's also interesting that probably most men are quick to say a woman is too thin and happier to express preference for a plump one. However mostly they are not into SSBBW, which is to be expected. I think it's progress that men can be open and honest about preferring plump women.
> 
> It's the job of us out FAs and out SSBBW  to create the environment and set the scene for closit FA's and shy BBW to know how things can really be. You know, if you are an FA, know this; some of your friends are closit FA's and plenty of BBW don't know they are attractive.
> 
> ...


Yeah when I told my girlfriend about me being an FA she was rather happy but still talks of dieting T-T


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## LillyBBBW (Jan 12, 2007)

Somewhere on this planet as be speak someone is being beaten and sodomized because they believe in something other than the status quo. I know it's a little insensitive but I just can't find any empathy at all for people who will embrace whatever society chooses for them. Everybody has something. There's always something that every person living on this planet can point to and say, "I've faced ridicule and prejudice over this." Some people face things head on, some never gave a shit anyway and then there are some so sensitive that they keep it to themselves and, "Yes Ma'am," the whole world till death. You can create an atmosphere where everybody can sit around and talk about how hard it is to be fat and how difficult it is to face the public. People who want change are already mad enough to be doing something and taking a stand. Being among other likeminded and fabulous people who are doing the same is fuel enough. People who prefer to twang on the lyre and sing, "Woe is me," will stay there. They're doomed and no amount of "Way to go Charlie" or out and proud people are gonna fix them. I can see somebody young and still making their way along but people are coming in here at 25 or 40 for goodness sake, looking to talk about how to break the news to their family! At that age their issues are just too deep. See a doctor. 

I'm sorry. It's ugly, but that's my opinion. 




activistfatgirl said:


> So. Wow, this has become a painful, beautiful, interesting, heart-wrenching, wonderful endeavor.
> 
> So here's some words from a young FA who wants to post about not being entirely open about his preference in all walks of life, someone who's struggling. Someone here. He said he didn't think he could bear posting on this thread.
> 
> ...


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## waldo (Jan 12, 2007)

LillyBBBW said:


> .............. I can see somebody young and still making their way along but people are coming in here at 25 or 40 for goodness sake, looking to talk about how to break the news to their family! At that age their issues are just too deep. See a doctor.
> 
> I'm sorry. It's ugly, but that's my opinion.



So should we say the same to the women who are over 25 and still coming to grips with being fat?


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## LillyBBBW (Jan 12, 2007)

waldo said:


> So should we say the same to the women who are over 25 and still coming to grips with being fat?


 
Honestly? Yes. Some people will just never do it. They're 60 and they still hate being fat. Okay for everyone else, not them. There's nothing you can do or say for people like that. Seriously.


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## Cosmic~Wombat (Jan 12, 2007)

I thank heaven for my parents. They raised me to be me.. like who and what I like. I can say with 100% honesty that I never had a problem being open about my big girl attraction. Meh.. everyone has issues I reckon


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## James (Jan 12, 2007)

LillyBBBW said:


> Honestly? Yes. Some people will just never do it. They're 60 and they still hate being fat. Okay for everyone else, not them. There's nothing you can do or say for people like that. Seriously.



Damn Lilly, you're a harsh one arent ya?!Are you sure there is NOTHING you can do in those cases?

I've gotta admit though, in my experience there's been nothing I could have done to make my exes feel happy with the way they looked.... and I tried... a lot... 

ultimately you cant love people, properly, if they dont love themselves...

s'what I think anyway...


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## Blackjack (Jan 12, 2007)

LillyBBBW said:


> See a doctor.



It's nice to know what it is that I need to take that last step to proudly and publicly admitting that I dig fat chicks. I thought that all I'd need was a little support from people, when in fact I need a psychiatrist.


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## supersoup (Jan 12, 2007)

James said:


> Damn Lilly, you're a harsh one arent ya?!Are you sure there is NOTHING you can do in those cases?
> 
> I've gotta admit though, in my experience there's been nothing I could have done to make my exes feel happy with the way they looked.... and I tried... a lot...
> 
> ...



i agree, which is why i am so glad i found this place. in the short time i've been here i've come to be completely comfortable with who i am and how i look and i love it!! i never had self confidence issues really bad, but definitely wasn't comfortable with me like i am now.


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## BigBeautifulMe (Jan 12, 2007)

There are two types of closet FA's. 

The kind that are in the closet out of youthful, adolescent fear.

The kind that are in the closet, despite maturity; who are intentionally hiding their dates (read: one-night stands) from friends and family; who are emotionally abusive to the fat girls they date, either intentionally or unintentionally, because they are ashamed. 

Type #1 stands no chance with me because I want a confident man, not some adolescent pussy who's too worried about what mommy thinks;

Type #2 stands no chance with me because I don't date egotistical, abusive assholes.

If all fat women were willing to stand up for themselves and what they deserve - better yet, if all fat women KNEW they deserved SO much better - these men would never have dates.

It is so sad to me that all women don't know they deserve better - I've been there. It took me a while to learn that I did. I actually let myself be someone's "weekend girl" while he dated other, more acceptable women on the weekdays. 

There is nothing I regret more in my life than not learning at a younger age that I deserved better. 

Now I know. Ladies, you deserve better, too. Men, if you want what you claim to - attractive ladies confident in their size and their own skins - the only way you will ever begin attracting women like me is if you get your butt out of the closet.


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## MisticalMisty (Jan 12, 2007)

waldo said:


> So should we say the same to the women who are over 25 and still coming to grips with being fat?



A fat person not coming to grips with their fat really doesn't effect anyone in any detromental way except themselves. 

Some closet FAs still date fat girls on the sly..or at least fuck them when they need an itch scratched. They are throwing their issues onto someone who doesn't deserve it. Granted, a woman has to take responsibility for her own life and realize who she's with..etc. However sometimes it takes a while to understand what's really going on with a guy. I mean it's normal for it to take a few weeks or months to meet friends or family if you are finally serious with someone. When you get to that point in a relationship, one or both of you is usually really smitten. 

That's usually when the lightbulb clicks on and a girl realizes that she's dating a closet case..and unless he's ready to take the step out of his self imposed prison, she's in for a world of hurt.

So comparing fat people who can't handle their fat and closet FAs is like comparing apples and oranges.


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## MisticalMisty (Jan 12, 2007)

Blackjack said:


> It's nice to know what it is that I need to take that last step to proudly and publicly admitting that I dig fat chicks. I thought that all I'd need was a little support from people, when in fact I need a psychiatrist.



That's not what she meant and you know it..good gravy man..lol


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## James (Jan 12, 2007)

BigBeautifulMe said:


> Type #1 stands no chance with me because I want a confident man, not some adolescent pussy who's too worried about what mommy thinks;



crikey...lol

talk about nail being hit on the head there...

I know what my mum thinks about the girls i've gone out with in the past. The first one, back in my teens, provoked the wholly crap reaction "maybe you're going through a phase James and will grow out of it?"

yeah thanks mum... really helpful! lol...

my mum got her head round the other three gfs i've had... eventually... but you cant spend your life worrying about what your mum, dad, friends, church etc... think... 

to quote Frank Zappa:

"If you wind up with a boring, miserable life because you listened to your mom, your dad, your teacher, your priest or some guy on TV telling you how to do your sh*t, then YOU DESERVE IT"


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## LillyBBBW (Jan 12, 2007)

I know I seem like an awful person. Maybe I am, I don't know. But when someone hates being fat you can-not change that, I don't care how much you love them or dress them up. THEY have to change it and want it to change without looking into the faces of others for reassurances. No foundation of self confidence is more flimsy than one that is built out of what someone else thinks. What THEY think is what needs to change and if they think they are hideaous freaks there's not much anyone can do. 




James said:


> Damn Lilly, you're a harsh one arent ya?!Are you sure there is NOTHING you can do in those cases?
> 
> I've gotta admit though, in my experience there's been nothing I could have done to make my exes feel happy with the way they looked.... and I tried... a lot...
> 
> ...


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## MisticalMisty (Jan 12, 2007)

James said:


> to quote Frank Zappa:
> 
> "If you wind up with a boring, miserable life because you listened to your mom, your dad, your teacher, your priest or some guy on TV telling you how to do your sh*t, then YOU DESERVE IT"



AMEN! If you were here right now I probably would have kissed you for that..LOL

Just so you know


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## MisticalMisty (Jan 12, 2007)

LillyBBBW said:


> I know I seem like an awful person. Maybe I am, I don't know. But when someone hates being fat you can-not change that, I don't care how much you love them or dress them up. THEY have to change it and want it to change without looking into the faces of others for reassurances. No foundation of self confidence is more flimsy than one that is built out of what someone else thinks. What THEY think is what needs to change and if they think they are hideaous freaks there's not much anyone can do.



You're not an awful person Lilly. You're speaking the truth and everyone knows it's hard to swallow at times.

That's why it's aggravating to hear some men have a FA hero complex. You can't fix a woman that doesn't like her body. Granted, being with you may open her eyes to how desirable she can be, but it's up to her to find herself desirable and to realize that she's deserving of positive attention from the opposite sex.


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## James (Jan 12, 2007)

LillyBBBW said:


> I know I seem like an awful person. Maybe I am, I don't know. But when someone hates being fat you can-not change that, I don't care how much you love them or dress them up. THEY have to change it and want it to change without looking into the faces of others for reassurances. No foundation of self confidence is more flimsy than one that is built out of what someone else thinks. What THEY think is what needs to change and if they think they are hideaous freaks there's not much anyone can do.



nah Lilly, you dont seem awful... you are telling it how it is. I prefer confident girls, I'd want to be their bloke, the guy who is their equal ... not the thing that provides validation... 

and this attitude might be partly why I'm single i think..! lol


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## LillyBBBW (Jan 12, 2007)

MisticalMisty said:


> You're not an awful person Lilly. You're speaking the truth and everyone knows it's hard to swallow at times.
> 
> That's why it's aggravating to hear some men have a FA hero complex. You can't fix a woman that doesn't like her body. Granted, being with you may open her eyes to how desirable she can be, but it's up to her to find herself desirable and to realize that she's deserving of positive attention from the opposite sex.



That's what I mean. There's a difference between "a closet FA who wants to come out but unsure of how to start" and "a closet FA who wants to hide and here's why....".


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## waldo (Jan 12, 2007)

MisticalMisty said:


> A fat person not coming to grips with their fat really doesn't effect anyone in any detromental way except themselves.
> 
> Some closet FAs still date fat girls on the sly..or at least fuck them when they need an itch scratched. They are throwing their issues onto someone who doesn't deserve it. Granted, a woman has to take responsibility for her own life and realize who she's with..etc. However sometimes it takes a while to understand what's really going on with a guy. I mean it's normal for it to take a few weeks or months to meet friends or family if you are finally serious with someone. When you get to that point in a relationship, one or both of you is usually really smitten.
> 
> ...



I guess my point was that I didn't care for the way Lilly set this number of 25 years old as a time when an FA should have worked through their issues. Now if they are at 40 and still in denial/closet that is pushing it. On the other hand it is rarely too late for someone to change if they really want to bad enough. But like Lilly said, it is the individual who needs to do it because they really want to and noone else can do it for them. And the older they get, the less likely big changes in course will happen.

Regarding going to a doctor, many years ago I was in therapy and seeing a woman psychologist. So one day I mentioned to her that I am strongly attracted to fat women and working through that is one of my issues among others. She really didn't have much to say, but her eyes sure did bug out. Maybe there are psychologists who specialize in these types of issues who could be of more help.


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## MisticalMisty (Jan 12, 2007)

waldo said:


> I guess my point was that I didn't care for the way Lilly set this number of 25 years old as a time when an FA should have worked through their issues. Now if they are at 40 and still in denial/closet that is pushing it. On the other hand it is rarely too late for someone to change if they really want to bad enough. But like Lilly said, it is the individual who needs to do it because they really want to and noone else can do it for them. And the older they get, the less likely big changes in course will happen.
> 
> Regarding going to a doctor, many years ago I was in therapy and seeing a woman psychologist. So one day I mentioned to her that I am strongly attracted to fat women and working through that is one of my issues among others. She really didn't have much to say, but her eyes sure did bug out. Maybe there are psychologists who specialize in these types of issues who could be of more help.



I can understand. Your 20's are supposed to be about finding yourself. That includes finally cluing in on who you like and the type you ultimately want to be with for the long haul.

As far as therapy, I'm not sure if that would help people or if it wouldn't. Again, as you've mentioned along with several others, it's about what's the right thing for ourselves.


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## NancyGirl74 (Jan 12, 2007)

To me age isn't the basis for which we should judge people on the choices they make. In my opinion, if a 40 year old closeted FA is still screwing fat girls in seedy hotels then his shame should be in that he's a dog and not that he's a dog at 40. On the other hand, if the 40 year old FA is making steps to grow and change even if the rate is painfully slow he still gets credit for the attempt. And by this I do not mean he's using his real name at that seedy hotel instead of a fake one. I mean he's slowing introducing his lifestyle to his friends and family. Slow steps are better than none and respect can be given for the effort. 

On the other hand...if I knew of some guy (I don't care if he's 20 or 50) who treated a friend of mine like she was something to be ashamed of I'd be furious. Understanding and empathy only goes so far. If you are still treating women like dirt after you KNOW what you are doing is wrong...well, you're an asshole. There is no excuse, no reasonable argument that can be made that would justify knowingly and continually hurting other people. At that point you are not just a closeted FA any more. You are in fact a selfish person with little to no moral character...regardless of your age.

To anyone in their closet by all means stay there if you are not ready to come out. But _do not_ let your shame become someone else's just because you don't have the testicular fortitude to try to be a better, stronger, kinder person.


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## bigsexy920 (Jan 12, 2007)

Very well Said Nancy. 

But girls ...... DONT LET THEM TREAT YOU THAT WAY..... don't be the girl in the seedy motel.....Big or small we all deserve better. Of course if you like that sort of thing .. by al means ... have at it


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## MisticalMisty (Jan 12, 2007)

NancyGirl74 said:


> To me age isn't the basis for which we should judge people on the choices they make. In my opinion, if a 40 year old closeted FA is still screwing fat girls in seedy hotels then his shame should be in that he's a dog and not that he's a dog at 40. On the other hand, if the 40 year old FA is making steps to grow and change even if the rate is painfully slow he still gets credit for the attempt. And by this I do not mean he's using his real name at that seedy hotel instead of a fake one. I mean he's slowing introducing his lifestyle to his friends and family. Slow steps are better than none and respect can be given for the effort.
> 
> On the other hand...if I knew of some guy (I don't care if he's 20 or 50) who treated a friend of mine like she was something to be ashamed of I'd be furious. Understanding and empathy only goes so far. If you are still treating women like dirt after you KNOW what you are doing is wrong...well, you're an asshole. There is no excuse, no reasonable argument that can be made that would justify knowingly and continually hurting other people. At that point you are not just a closeted FA any more. You are in fact a selfish person with little to no moral character...regardless of your age.
> 
> To anyone in their closet by all means stay there if you are not ready to come out. But _do not_ let your shame become someone else's just because you don't have the testicular fortitude to try to be a better, stronger, kinder person.





bigsexy920 said:


> Very well Said Nancy.
> 
> But girls ...... DONT LET THEM TREAT YOU THAT WAY..... don't be the girl in the seedy motel.....Big or small we all deserve better. Of course if you like that sort of thing .. by al means ... have at it



Exactly ladies. It's up to us to break the cycle. If you choose to be the woman who will sleep with a guy in a seedy motel room because you don't feel you deserve better..then he will in turn try to find another fat girl who he thinks feels the same way and he can use the same way.

Granted..I'm not making a blanket statement about all men here. But we teach people how to treat us and if fat girls continue to let themselves be used and abused and don't stand up for themselves then the cycle will continue.


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## Green Eyed Fairy (Jan 12, 2007)

waldo said:


> So should we say the same to the women who are over 25 and still coming to grips with being fat?




I thought about this and one thing occurred to me:
Even though I have had to work very hard to come to grips with my weight (but my self loathing of the past goes way beyond my weight, to be totally honest), I would not be ashamed to be seen out with a BHM. I wouldn't let my friends or family put down any man I chose to be with just because he didn't meet their weight requirements. There is a difference between not being satisfied with yourself and being ashamed of another human being just because someone told you to.....


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## LillyBBBW (Jan 12, 2007)

All I'm saying is, there comes a point when a person of reasonable intelligence begins to figure some things out for themselves. a) they're sick and tired of being sick and tired of people telling them how to live their life. And b) their conscience can't allow them to ritualistically abuse other human beings that they have grown particularly fond of. It involves a level of selfishness and concern for others to come to those realizations. The problem is some people have selfishness and concern for others the wrong way. The fatigue of being abused via another person's mind control usually manifests itself in the 20's and the tender buds of rebellion begin to show. Usually. But folks who are comfortable in using women and bowing before false royalty, it will never even occur to them that women are not toilet paper. Sure a guy can be a late bloomer or an epiphany can strike at any time but how many times does that happen? It's rare. 



waldo said:


> I guess my point was that I didn't care for the way Lilly set this number of 25 years old as a time when an FA should have worked through their issues. Now if they are at 40 and still in denial/closet that is pushing it. On the other hand it is rarely too late for someone to change if they really want to bad enough. But like Lilly said, it is the individual who needs to do it because they really want to and noone else can do it for them. And the older they get, the less likely big changes in course will happen.
> 
> Regarding going to a doctor, many years ago I was in therapy and seeing a woman psychologist. So one day I mentioned to her that I am strongly attracted to fat women and working through that is one of my issues among others. She really didn't have much to say, but her eyes sure did bug out. Maybe there are psychologists who specialize in these types of issues who could be of more help.


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## Cosmic~Wombat (Jan 12, 2007)

counts.. :doh: Guess this is a tighter group than I remember


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## Cosmic~Wombat (Jan 12, 2007)

We have about a million fat girls out here.. in our wonderful world.. how many of you are single? Far more than those that are taken. So if the guys would ass up and say hey you are hot it would end all the single bullshit that happens here. Things never change. The same Dimensions world is in a constant repeat. If you want a fat girl then go get a damn fat girl if you don't then don't.. but don't bitch about it on a fat girl board because in the end.. every city.. every town.. every county has fat women. Stop tossing off to the pics and get yourself a fattie.. really.

I do expect to be banned after this post.. and that is ok.


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## James (Jan 12, 2007)

Cosmic~Wombat said:


> If you want a fat girl then go get a damn fat girl if you don't then don't.. but don't bitch about it on a fat girl board because in the end.. every city.. every town.. every county has fat women. Stop tossing off to the pics and get yourself a fattie.. really.



just being fat dont make a girl sexy dude... i know a lot of girls who are fat but i can count on a few fingers (not even a hand) those who i'd connect with... i havent met any in my town tho thats for sure...


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## Cosmic~Wombat (Jan 12, 2007)

James said:


> just being fat dont make a girl sexy dude... i know a lot of girls who are fat but i can count on a few fingers (not even a hand) those who i'd connect with... i havent met any in my town tho thats for sure...



then you aren't looking.. every town has a hot big girls. I got one, you can too.. everyone can't be Cat or AnnMarie.. fact is you need to find some point of reality and move on.. there are many fat girls here.. go get one.. GO GET ONE!!!! How hard is it?


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## Prime4347 (Jan 12, 2007)

Re-delurking here to give the perspective of another closeted FA.

First off, the type of behavior listed off in the beginning of the thread is inexcusable. I am wondering, however, if anyone else thought that some of these guys may be less interested in keeping their fat girlfriend hidden from their friends and more interested in keeping her hidden from their *wives*. It's happened to a couple of friends of mine.

As for why I'm in the closet, it's not because I fear social reprisal. The few friends that I have told about this have been very accepting. In fact, they've been far too enthusiastic in their acceptance, but I'll save that for another thread. I'm simply in the closet because I don't think this is other people's business. 

Yes, I like heavy women. I also like red heads and women who wear glasses. I don't go around telling my friend, "I think red heads are totally hot." If one of my friends, asked, I'd be honest, but, thus far, no one has asked. If someone asked me if the lady with the glasses was hot, I wouldn't say, "Yes, I'm attracted to women in glasses." I'd simply say "Yes." If I'm luck enough to find a relationship with a wonderful BBW, I'm not going to introduce her as my "charming, fat, and brilliant girlfriend." She'll be my "charming, sexy, and brilliant girlfriend."

I guess what I'm trying to say is that, while I'm well aware that a lot of closeted FA's have done a lot of horrible things for a lot of stupid reason, I'm also aware that even more two-legged men have done a lot of horrible things for a lot of stupid reasons. I'm just want people to not lump us all together.

PS: By this point in my life, I should know better than to post when I'm ticked. Oh well.


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## AnnMarie (Jan 12, 2007)

Cosmic~Wombat said:


> then you aren't looking.. every town has a hot big girls. I got one, you can too.. everyone can't be Cat or AnnMarie.. fact is you need to find some point of reality and move on.. there are many fat girls here.. go get one.. GO GET ONE!!!! How hard is it?



Cosmic, I think all James is saying is that being fat alone isn't enough. It's not necessarily about face or body even specifically (although of course that plays a role, we all like certain things) but more about attitude, likes, dislikes, confidence, vibe, style, etc. 

You know that "sexy" is something that exudes from people, and I honestly think it's good that James knows that and is willing to look for it as a package thing, not just the outer package alone. He's got the reality thing, I think he's just saying that it's not as easy as seeing a fatty at the supermarket, there has to be more going on.

And although I know you're speaking generally to people here, James isn't someone who doesn't get out and look and try and meet... he's a great guy, super social, friendly, insanely smart, cute as hell, tall as an oak tree, compassionate and caring and he's going to make a sassy fat girl a very happy woman soon enough. 

To be clear, I think your points are somewhat valid for sure... there are tons of guys who just woe is me all the time about how there are no fat girls when in fact we are EVERYWHERE... but just saying that in my limited experience, James is a misplaced target for the talk.


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## furious styles (Jan 12, 2007)

everyone has trouble meeting a partner who's good for them. since when did THAT become fa-specific? @[email protected]


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## supersoup (Jan 12, 2007)

mfdoom said:


> everyone has trouble meeting a partner who's good for them. since when did THAT become fa-specific? @[email protected]



shyeah, amen to that.




and i must know why your handle is mfdoom. pleases?


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## LillyBBBW (Jan 12, 2007)

You are not a closeted FA. 




Prime4347 said:


> Re-delurking here to give the perspective of another closeted FA.
> 
> First off, the type of behavior listed off in the beginning of the thread is inexcusable. I am wondering, however, if anyone else thought that some of these guys may be less interested in keeping their fat girlfriend hidden from their friends and more interested in keeping her hidden from their *wives*. It's happened to a couple of friends of mine.
> 
> ...


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## wrestlingguy (Jan 12, 2007)

Prime4347 said:


> Re-delurking here to give the perspective of another closeted FA.
> 
> First off, the type of behavior listed off in the beginning of the thread is inexcusable. I am wondering, however, if anyone else thought that some of these guys may be less interested in keeping their fat girlfriend hidden from their friends and more interested in keeping her hidden from their *wives*. It's happened to a couple of friends of mine.
> 
> ...



Okay, I applaud you for the first paragraph. A lot of married men have the token skinny girl as a wife, only to find several years later that the fat girls they've been staring at is really their physical preference, and for the reason of the kids, the cost of divorce, the ridicule they face for dumping the skinny wife for the fat chick, they stay married, and hide the fat girl from the rest of the world.

Since that first comment was dead on, I'm going to take it easy on you. Unfortunatley, my friend, other people will make your personal life their business. At some point they are going to wonder if you're gay, by not having a girl by your side, fat or not. That, in and of itself, is not a bad thing.........A long time ago, someone posted on this board that being an FA is like being gay.....you love what you are, but feel you have to hide it, for fear of reprisal or ridicule.

Next point: what's wrong with introducing your girlfriend or wife as my charming, fat, and brilliant girlfriend."?? I think the fat part would be obvious to whoever met her. I think you're not being forthright with your real feelings.
Look, my wife has modeled in the past, and is modeling now. Several years ago, my father (bless his soul), called me because someone had mailed him a photo of my wife, that had a caption that read "does this thong make my butt look big?". He asked me to verify if it was her in the photo.

I proudly said, yeah......doesn't she look GREAT????? Case closed.

Fast forward to yesterday. A good friend of mine who is not a FA contacted me on MySpace to add me as a friend. I warned him in advance not to say a damn thing about all of my fat friends. I spoke with him on the phone today, and he told me that he had nothing to say, except that my wife was the smallest of the bunch. I asked him how he knew, and he told me that he took the time to look at all the profiles of the fat girls on my page, to which I responded that maybe he was really a FA in hiding. He laughed, but said that all of the girls were pretty, regardless of their weight.

That's my point. Beauty is beauty, as one sees it. I don't shove it down 
people's throats, but I certainly don't hide it. My wife is 330 lbs., which is hard to hide. All of my friends love her, they all think she's hot, they acknowledge she's fat, but she's still hot.........and they're right.
This world is a cruel place at times, but I don't give a shit....I love who I love, and I've at least made my world change for me.


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## MisticalMisty (Jan 12, 2007)

wrestlingguy said:


> Okay, I applaud you for the first paragraph. A lot of married men have the token skinny girl as a wife, only to find several years later that the fat girls they've been staring at is really their physical preference, and for the reason of the kids, the cost of divorce, the ridicule they face for dumping the skinny wife for the fat chick, they stay married, and hide the fat girl from the rest of the world.
> 
> Since that first comment was dead on, I'm going to take it easy on you. Unfortunatley, my friend, other people will make your personal life their business. At some point they are going to wonder if you're gay, by not having a girl by your side, fat or not. That, in and of itself, is not a bad thing.........A long time ago, someone posted on this board that being an FA is like being gay.....you love what you are, but feel you have to hide it, for fear of reprisal or ridicule.
> 
> ...



Very well put..:bow:


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## AnnMarie (Jan 12, 2007)

mfdoom said:


> everyone has trouble meeting a partner who's good for them. since when did THAT become fa-specific? @[email protected]



Exactly my point, it's not all about "grab the closest fatty"... lol


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## furious styles (Jan 12, 2007)

supersoup said:


> and i must know why your handle is mfdoom. pleases?



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MF_DOOM

although i only chose that name because the handle i'd usually use was taken by a rather prominent member. (judge dre)


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## supersoup (Jan 12, 2007)

mfdoom said:


> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MF_DOOM
> 
> although i only chose that name because the handle i'd usually use was taken by a rather prominent member. (judge dre)



ahhhh, i thought so. thanks sir!


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## LillyBBBW (Jan 12, 2007)

MisticalMisty said:


> Very well put..:bow:




I understood Prime's post as if to say he just dates the women he likes without the need to 'introduce' people to the fact that he's an FA. His girlfriend is his girlfriend and that's that. Why he thinks that's closeted I haven't a clue.


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## waldo (Jan 12, 2007)

Prime4347 said:


> Re-delurking here to give the perspective of another closeted FA.
> 
> First off, the type of behavior listed off in the beginning of the thread is inexcusable. I am wondering, however, if anyone else thought that some of these guys may be less interested in keeping their fat girlfriend hidden from their friends and more interested in keeping her hidden from their *wives*. It's happened to a couple of friends of mine.
> 
> ...



So by saying

"If I'm luck(sic) enough to find a relationship with a wonderful BBW, I'm not going to introduce her as my "charming, fat, and brilliant girlfriend." She'll be my "charming, sexy, and brilliant girlfriend.""

do you mean that you have yet to have a relationship with a BBW? If so, you could be considered still somewhat "in the closet" despite having discussed your feelings with a few people. Otherwise, I agree with Lilly you don't sound much like you would be a closetFA.


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## MisticalMisty (Jan 12, 2007)

LillyBBBW said:


> I understood Prime's post as if to say he just dates the women he likes without the need to 'introduce' people to the fact that he's an FA. His girlfriend is his girlfriend and that's that. Why he thinks that's closeted I haven't a clue.



OH I agree with you Lilly...and I almost posted about him not being closeted..but you bet me too it.


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## Prime4347 (Jan 12, 2007)

Now that I've had some diner and calmed down, I should probably clarify a few pieces.

As to why I considered myself closeted, there are two factors, the first of which requires me to apologize. I, and I suspect some of the other "closeted" FA's, occasionally get the feeling that there isn't a middle ground on being out. We get the idea that, if we aren't preaching it on every street corner, then we are traitors to the community. Obviously, this isn't true and I want to apologize to everyone for acting as though it was.

The other reason that I consider myself closeted is that, as Waldo astutely ascertained, I have never had a relationship with a BBW. I would like to point out that this isn't through lack of effort on my part. The simple fact is that the only woman who has ever agreed to a second date with me happened to be fairly slender. I went out with her for her personality, not her looks, and we wound up breaking up over her personality, not her looks.
If having a relationship with a BBW is necessary to be out of the closet, it may be a while, as my incompetence with the opposite sex goes far and beyond any issues about being an FA.

Finally, I wanted to go ahead and agree with most of Wrestlingguy's critque of my post. I have had people question my heterosexuality in the past. I'd also like to point out, though, that every person that I've come out to has, closely there after, asked me if I was sure that I wasn't just gay. The only bit that I'll defend is my hypothetical, where I was describing the imaginary girlfriend as "sexy and brilliant" as opposed to "fat and brilliant." First, as you pointed out, whoever I'm introducing her to could see that for themselves. I feel that it would be a little redundant to mention. I also think that sexy makes a clearer statement of my feelings. After all, I've seen non-FAs dating BBWs who called their girlfriends fat, but certainly not in a complimentary manner. Calling her fat doesn't give my opinion on her weight, but calling her sexy does. I can understand your argument, but I think that either adjective is acceptable (beyond the ridiculous minutiae that I've attacking).


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## superodalisque (Jan 13, 2007)

ALL I have to say is what my Daddy taught me. A man who is so afraid of other people's opinions is not a man. And, he does not deserve to have a good woman.

Peace Out 

http://www.myspace.com/superodalisque


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## Eclectic_Girl (Jan 13, 2007)

Prime4347 said:


> Now that I've had some diner and calmed down, I should probably clarify a few pieces.
> 
> As to why I considered myself closeted, there are two factors, the first of which requires me to apologize. I, and I suspect some of the other "closeted" FA's, occasionally get the feeling that there isn't a middle ground on being out. We get the idea that, if we aren't preaching it on every street corner, then we are traitors to the community. Obviously, this isn't true and I want to apologize to everyone for acting as though it was.
> 
> ...




Interesting distinction there, Prime. 

I've always associated the closet with shame, not lack of experience. If you know what you like and aren't ashamed of it, even to the point of discussing it with close friends, then I'd say you're not in the closet. Especially since, as you said, you'd tell anyone who asked about your preferences.

I'm behind all the FAs who preach it to the masses, just as I'm behind all the fat folks who are publicly fat-positive. But I don't think that breaking out the megaphone is the only way to support and be part of the community. Some people are not wired to be loud about what they like - doesn't mean they're ashamed, just reserved. It's more important to be yourself and explore what *you *like than to represent for someone else. If the size acceptance movement requires that we reduce our complex individuality down to braying about a single issue, well, count me out.

And for the record, to my ears "fat and brilliant" sounds unnecessarily defensive. ("Look, she's fat, okay? And that's the way I like it. Wanna make something of it?") Hearing my (also hypothetical) boyfriend say that would make me uncomfortable, because it puts part of what is private (i.e., his specific sexual attraction to me) in the public sphere. It's as if he said, "This is my girlfriend. She has large breasts, which I enjoy fondling." 

Context matters, too. Even "sexy and brilliant" can be too much if, say, I'm being introduced to his parents. But if it's casually dropped in idle banter around his good friends? Purrrrrrrrr.....


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## waldo (Jan 13, 2007)

Prime4347 said:


> Now that I've had some diner and calmed down, I should probably clarify a few pieces.
> 
> As to why I considered myself closeted, there are two factors, the first of which requires me to apologize. I, and I suspect some of the other "closeted" FA's, occasionally get the feeling that there isn't a middle ground on being out. We get the idea that, if we aren't preaching it on every street corner, then we are traitors to the community. Obviously, this isn't true and I want to apologize to everyone for acting as though it was.
> 
> ...



This all makes a lot of sense. Your situation is a lot like mine in my younger days. I believe you have set yourself up for an ultimately successful transition to being a 'practicing' FA because you have already diffused the concern over how you are going to tell close friends about your FA orientation. But the longer it goes before you actually get involved with a fat woman, the easier it will be for people to assume you may have moved out of that 'phase'. The situation with having trouble with women wanting to be involved with you could be because the bigger girls more often than not have low self-esteem and may want to push you away before you can dump them (which they may assume is inevitible), or they may sense you are an FA which they may see as too weird to want to deal with - conventional wisdom continues to be that we are sexual deviants. This is where meeting girls through a place like Dimensions is good because the women here obviously are accepting of FAs.

As far as there being no middle ground, I disagree. I have seen guys post here that they do not overtly discuss their FA preference but rather prefer to let their actions (dating a BBW while treating her with respect and kindness) speak for themselves. This approach has been met with overwhelming approval when mentioned here. However, I think it is important to be willing to discuss it as appropriately, like if someone challenges you as to why you are dating that fat chick. You shouldn't just say because of her great personality and/or pretty face. And should be those things plus her sexy voluptuous body.


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## cactopus (Jan 13, 2007)

Prime4347 said:


> ...Finally, I wanted to go ahead and agree with most of Wrestlingguy's critque of my post. I have had people question my heterosexuality in the past. I'd also like to point out, though, that every person that I've come out to has, closely there after, asked me if I was sure that I wasn't just gay. The only bit that I'll defend is my hypothetical, where I was describing the imaginary girlfriend as "sexy and brilliant" as opposed to "fat and brilliant."......



When I was younger and in high school I was out/de-closeted amongst friends but when I got to college and discovered alt.sex.fat and the community I came out rather "flamboyantly". I guess it was an identity and a new world I could identify with and I embraced it with vim and vinegar. To that end I still have trouble with how people could connect liking large women with male homosexuality. (I had even more problem with this because I have a high voice, like to cook, hate sports, and I'm generally neat). Given those physical points I could understand but the logical person in me would dictate that a closet homosexual would be interested in waifs and man-like women. (for lack of a better description)

But I suppose for the bulk of the morons who wished to insult me in those days thought really didn't go that deep.


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## LillyBBBW (Jan 13, 2007)

waldo said:


> <snipped>.....However, I think it is important to be willing to discuss it as appropriately, like if someone challenges you as to why you are dating that fat chick. You shouldn't just say because of her great personality and/or pretty face. And should be those things plus her sexy voluptuous body.



I agree. While I don't think it's necessary for every FA to wear a T-shirt and send out announcements to everyone, there are certain assumptions that could be made if you just mention a wonderful personality and love of dead Russian philosophers when referring to your beloved. People assume that yeah, the chick is fat but her effervescent personality somehow makes up for it - and she probably has talents in the sack. Maybe you don't care enough about what pea brained people think which is fine, but it might not be a comfortable place to be for your girlfriend to be looked at as a charity case. You might not necessarily have to swing a towel over your head and say, "I like 'em thick and juicy," but you could say something subtle like, "I think she's perfect just the way she is," and leave it at that.

EDIT: By the way, thanks for speaking up Prime. I think in our rabid haste to string up the ones that make us all crazy we forget to acknowledge that there are many forms of outness that don't require membership or a photo ID. (though if someone were to make one up I think it would be fun )


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## Big D Guy (Jan 14, 2007)

I only happened on this thread about 3 hours ago and was so intrigued by it that I read all of the quotes. As was mentioned by one poster after about page 5 or so, there were many that I could comment on, but would like to mention these two.

I had to give James rep points for figuring this one out a decade before me.


James said:


> I've gotta admit though, in my experience there's been nothing I could have done to make my exes feel happy with the way they looked.... and I tried... a lot...



But that leads me to ask if MisticalMisty would elaborate on her definition of a "FA hero complex".


MisticalMisty said:


> That's why it's aggravating to hear some men have a FA hero complex. You can't fix a woman that doesn't like her body. Granted, being with you may open her eyes to how desirable she can be, but it's up to her to find herself desirable and to realize that she's deserving of positive attention from the opposite sex.



From my own perspective, I had bigger problems during adolescence than if someone made fun of me for who I dated. I was happy just to have *A* date so I never developed any problems with admitting my preferences in women.


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## James (Jan 14, 2007)

AnnMarie said:


> Cosmic, I think all James is saying is that being fat alone isn't enough. It's not necessarily about face or body even specifically (although of course that plays a role, we all like certain things) but more about attitude, likes, dislikes, confidence, vibe, style, etc.
> 
> You know that "sexy" is something that exudes from people, and I honestly think it's good that James knows that and is willing to look for it as a package thing, not just the outer package alone. He's got the reality thing, I think he's just saying that it's not as easy as seeing a fatty at the supermarket, there has to be more going on.
> 
> ...



look who is sucking up to the prof now eh? You are still in trouble young lady!


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## NancyGirl74 (Jan 14, 2007)

Big D Guy said:


> But that leads me to ask if MisticalMisty would elaborate on her definition of a "FA hero complex".



I don't want to put words in Misty's mouth so forgive me if this is not what she means by "FA hero complex". I _*think*_ what she is trying to say is that a FA might feel hero-like towards fat women because he finds them attractive when he assumes no one else will. _I do not mean all FA's when I say this._ However, my ex had a touch of this hero complex. He would say things like, "I love you for you. I don't care that you are fat." or "I love this part of your body. I don't find is disturbing at all." I feel as if he thought he was the only one in the world who would find me attractive and I should be grateful. I know he didn't mean to be backhanded with his compliments but that is how it felt to me. He was proud to take me out and show me off to friends which I loved about him but it was little comments like what I mentioned above that made me cringe inside. So, when Misty mentioned FA hero complex I immediately thought of those situations with my ex. I _know_ he never meant to be hurtful. I'm sure cared for me but I'm equally sure he thought he was doing me a big favor by being my boyfriend...Frankly, it was the other way around (hee hee I kid).


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## cactopus (Jan 14, 2007)

NancyGirl74 said:


> I don't want to put words in Misty's mouth so forgive me if this is not what she means by "FA hero complex". I _*think*_ what she is trying to say is that a FA might feel hero-like towards fat women because he finds them attractive when he assumes no one else will. ....



I prefer the small part which you mentioned later which I tend to do myself. I call it being an anti-closeted FA. I make sure that we are always seen together enjoying ourselves immensely. The comments I make in public aren't size related, however, but are just what any guy and girl should say to one another in public. I'll show affection and complement her as any guy would compliment a non BBW. Most importantly (to get the oomf required) I have to mean it to my core... but I get such joy out of two things... complimenting my mate sincerely and making her feel wonderful about herself and I suppose the other part about rubbing it in the faces of the miserable sods who would say something if I looked like a target (wasn't exuding happy body language).

It's closely related to always wanting the fantasy chance to spy a great looking BBW next to a mainstream attractive woman (who is conveniently bitchy but totally attracted to me) and dissing her for the BBW. Anything to return the favor of putting a nice rolling broadside in their wall of confidence.


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## MisticalMisty (Jan 14, 2007)

Big D Guy said:


> But that leads me to ask if MisticalMisty would elaborate on her definition of a "FA hero complex".



It's an FA that feels that if he dates a fat girl and shows her how desirable she is to him, that she will somehow become confident in who she is and her body.

Granted, my experience with my first fa led me down that path, but he isn't the one that changed my mind about my body and how I felt about it...I did.


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## NancyGirl74 (Jan 14, 2007)

MisticalMisty said:


> Granted, my experience with my first fa led me down that path, but he isn't the one that changed my mind about my body and how I felt about it...I did.





Darn it! I swear I've been spreading the rep around but it still won't let me give it to you! Consider yourself repped in spirit. :bow:


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## MisticalMisty (Jan 14, 2007)

NancyGirl74 said:


> Darn it! I swear I've been spreading the rep around but it still won't let me give it to you! Consider yourself repped in spirit. :bow:



LOL..Nancy just send everyone you know to this post...

Kidding.

Just answering a question..that's all. But thank you nonetheless


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## Big D Guy (Jan 14, 2007)

MisticalMisty said:


> It's an FA that feels that if he dates a fat girl and shows her how desirable she is to him, that she will somehow become confident in who she is and her body.



After reading nearly 300 posts my brain was quite fuzzy (more than usual). It was sounding to me like we were not supposed to compliment BBW's or tell them that we are attracted to them.


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## PiscesGirl (Feb 14, 2007)

I'm sooooo glad I don't have a myspace. 

_R-E-S-P-E-C-T...find out what it means to me..._:kiss2: 

Fat or thin, no women should put up with such treatment.

If we don't allow this behavior they don't get anywhere, see what I'm saying.


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## Russ2d (Feb 14, 2007)

> It's an FA that feels that if he dates a fat girl and shows her how desirable she is to him, that she will somehow become confident in who she is and her body.



I know what you're trying to say but the wording is bad here Misty because by this definition we need MORE so-called FA hero complexes out there, much more. Of course FAs instill confidence in fat women- common sense, and a good thing, you're making it sound bad.



> Granted, my experience with my first fa led me down that path, but he isn't the one that changed my mind about my body and how I felt about it...I did.



Give me a break.. the more I think about it the more I'm with you Big D. I don't know how this thread has morphed from closet FAs into this crap but this is beginning to piss me off.

If you're an FA then you have to learn to be tough and honest because the world views you as a freak. And if you find a fat woman you don't hide her you love her and show her off to the world like a man. And if she doesn't appreciate you and twists your compliments into some sort of self-ego trip then you dump her and find someone who will love you back.


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## MisticalMisty (Feb 14, 2007)

Russ2d said:


> I know what you're trying to say but the wording is bad here Misty because by this definition we need MORE so-called FA hero complexes out there, much more. Of course FAs instill confidence in fat women- common sense, and a good thing, you're making it sound bad.



No, you don't. There is a reason that it's called SELF esteem and SELF confidence. True confidence can only come from within. So don't think that giving us compliments or dating us automatically makes a fat woman confident, that's not how it works. I'm not making it sound bad, you're just giving men credit for something they have no control over. I will give you that an FA can give a fat girl a different perspective about her body, but no one can make another person confident. That goes for women making men more confident as well.

The last thing we need are men with hero complexes. We just need men to be men....fat girls don't need saving...we just need men that are open about their preference, who aren't ashamed to date us and who will be proud to date us.

You almost make it sound as if fat girls should be grateful that you want to date us..and if that's your intent....that's a sad thing indeed.


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## MissToodles (Feb 14, 2007)

Someone can shower you with all the compliments in the world, but Misty is correct. Unless you can find the self esteem deep inside of you, all those blandishments won't do a thing. No one can really help fill the gaping void. It's just a band aid for a much bigger problem.


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## wrestlingguy (Feb 14, 2007)

MisticalMisty said:


> No, you don't. There is a reason that it's called SELF esteem and SELF confidence. True confidence can only come from within. So don't think that giving us compliments or dating us automatically makes a fat woman confident, that's not how it works. I'm not making it sound bad, you're just giving men credit for something they have no control over. I will give you that an FA can give a fat girl a different perspective about her body, but no one can make another person confident. That goes for women making men more confident as well.
> 
> The last thing we need are men with hero complexes. We just need men to be men....fat girls don't need saving...we just need men that are open about their preference, who aren't ashamed to date us and who will be proud to date us.
> 
> You almost make it sound as if fat girls should be grateful that you want to date us..and if that's your intent....that's a sad thing indeed.



Well said, Misty. Here's an interesting sidenote that supports your thoughts. When I met my wife, she had yet to retire from paysite modeling. We talked at length about her modeling, and her reasons for doing so. While some of her reasons were economic, one of the things she mentioned was that she like hearing how pretty she was from all the guys. Well, several months later, and about 20,000 e-mails and messages, and those "compliments" had worn thin, as few of them contained any message other than "you have a beautiful body".
What became important to my wife was someone thinking she was a good person. This has nothing to do with beauty. This has to do with self esteem, and your personal values in life. She realized at that point that beauty doesn't validate you. Only YOU can validate you. Now, while I always give my wife compliments, I realize when she's not feeling good about herself, and how that has nothing to do with me. That being said, why should the rest of the world be so different?
I don't get insulted when she downplays my compliments. That may have to do with my own self esteem, which again has nothing to do with looks (no one has tun up to me recently and screamed "hey, it's Brad Pitt!"). My confidence is an extension of me, and my self worth. 
I only think that this is so new for so many guys, that I feel that not all of this has been thought out for many of them.


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## moonvine (Feb 14, 2007)

wrestlingguy said:


> What became important to my wife was someone thinking she was a good person.



I think this varies from person to person. I know I am a good person, and I often hear I am a good person from others. I like to hear I'm pretty.


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## Green Eyed Fairy (Feb 14, 2007)

MisticalMisty said:


> No, you don't. There is a reason that it's called SELF esteem and SELF confidence. True confidence can only come from within. So don't think that giving us compliments or dating us automatically makes a fat woman confident, that's not how it works. I'm not making it sound bad, you're just giving men credit for something they have no control over. I will give you that an FA can give a fat girl a different perspective about her body, but no one can make another person confident. That goes for women making men more confident as well.
> 
> The last thing we need are men with hero complexes. We just need men to be men....fat girls don't need saving...we just need men that are open about their preference, who aren't ashamed to date us and who will be proud to date us.
> 
> You almost make it sound as if fat girls should be grateful that you want to date us..and if that's your intent....that's a sad thing indeed.



The problem with hero complexes is that the whole insinuation is that they are doing us some kind of favor to date us- or that's how I view it. A man should date me because he likes me how I am- I don't need any favors.


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## LoveBHMS (Feb 14, 2007)

I didn't think of it as a "hero complex", but I did (wrongfully) think that if I could convince him he was good looking, he'd start to feel good about himself.

I eventually realized that it did not matter one bit what I thought of him, it matterd what he thought of himself. Even if he had been convinced that I truly thought he was hot, it did not matter because he was not happy with how he looked. He wasn't waiting for some woman to come along and tell him he was sexy because it didn't matter. His mind wasn't going to change, and even if, at best he'd said "Wow, she really thinks I'm hot" it was not going to translate into "Well, if she thinks I'm hot then I must be, because her opinion is that important. Therefore, I now am happy with my appearance, and that is solely from that attentions of this great chick."

Does not work that way.


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## LillyBBBW (Feb 14, 2007)

Great post LoveBHM. While I know a lot of people who with good reason feel that they induced a change in their sweety's attitude once they helped them realized how sexy they are, they need to understand that it's because they happened to find a winner. It doesn't always work that way.




LoveBHMS said:


> I didn't think of it as a "hero complex", but I did (wrongfully) think that if I could convince him he was good looking, he'd start to feel good about himself.
> 
> I eventually realized that it did not matter one bit what I thought of him, it matterd what he thought of himself. Even if he had been convinced that I truly thought he was hot, it did not matter because he was not happy with how he looked. He wasn't waiting for some woman to come along and tell him he was sexy because it didn't matter. His mind wasn't going to change, and even if, at best he'd said "Wow, she really thinks I'm hot" it was not going to translate into "Well, if she thinks I'm hot then I must be, because her opinion is that important. Therefore, I now am happy with my appearance, and that is solely from that attentions of this great chick."
> 
> Does not work that way.


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## Dravenhawk (Sep 14, 2007)

I have to respond to your letter dear. I am moved here

Here's a little letter: 

Dear Fat Admirers (FAs),

Why are you hiding? I know you hold me now, but I’ve never met your friends. You’ve met all of mine--they like you. You’re sweet, affectionate, “into” me. Then, why do you always stay at my house? It’s always my bed, my sheets that you make love to me on. What are you afraid of?

I have no fear. I do not hide. You would be welcomed into my home


Dear FA that pretends I don’t exist when you run into a high school friend at a concert. I have to jab you in the back to give you your ticket. Your friend has to usher your attention towards me. I smile and act playful, as always in denial and constantly forgiving. I’ve still never talked to you about this. I still hold back tears of embarrassment when I think about how quickly you’d pretend you were with someone else.

I do not retreat nor backpeddle. Everyone I am friends with knows I am a FA I have been a FA since jr. highschool. My bbw love would be introduced with pride not shame.

Dear FA that drives an hour to see me but has never invited me to your apartment, do you know how much I hate that I let this go on for a year? I did sleep on your bed once. It was winter break, the house was empty, and it was ok for me to be naked, quaking, walking, being. I didn’t get mad until months later.

My home is your home. SSBBW and BBW welcome anytime ... always

Dear FA that has a ton of fat girls on his profile--be it Myspace or Friendster or whatever. That’s great! You’re out! People know that you like fat girls! Why aren’t any of your real life friends on your profile too? Oh, right, because this is the part of the internet that you are open about being with fat girls--among fat girls. Do you have another one without the fatties?

Sorry love I am a bit behind the times... Never made a myspace page.

What would you do if they found all the messages and lovesick comments you send to your lovely zaftig internet pals? And the real question is: would you laugh at the jokes they made about it and play it cool?

I have been the butt of fat jokes from the FA side of life People I call my friends know that talk that is abusive or hurtful to BBWs is not funny.

Dear FA that wants to fuck fat girls but not date them. I’m constantly sorrowful I didn’t know how to pick you out sooner, and consistently frustrated when you slip by now. You don’t deserve this.

I perfer to get to know you first. Our minds and spirits have to come together first. I am a bit of an old sap friends say but hey the sex has no value if there is no connection other than physical -- boy did I learn that the hard way

Dear FA that talks to me anonymously online and says I’m cocky for not wanting to talk to you. I’m not cocky. I’m fragile and insecure like many. I simply believe in myself a bit more than that. And I’ll never trust a man who doesn’t reveal his true identity, because, again, what are you afraid of? 

If you dont want to talk to me that is fine. Whatever you feel comfortable with I have lots of time. I don't talk smack to others it is rude and insensitive.

Dear FA that doesn’t think I’m good enough. Why are you still seeing me? Why do I let you?

You are GOOD and you are ENOUGH and if I were fortunate enough to have a BBW who believes in herself as much as I believe in her, that would give justification to continue seeing such a person.

Dear FA that keeps it on the down low. I promise to get naked and streak your next family gathering, should you not understand that I deserve—no demand, to be at your side next time, not in your wet dreams.

My cherished love would always be at my side, in my heart when it gets tough, and a part of my soul. As for streaking at my next family gathering I would have to shuck my clothes and we could run mad dawg through the house screaming something silly.

Finially in closing I have to sak the question SSBBW who feels no shame about her size Where are you?

Dravenhawk


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## Gspoon (Sep 14, 2007)

activistfatgirl said:


> I'm curious if other fat women or BHMs would share if they've had experiences with FAs still in the closet or ashamed of their attraction. I think something just snapped tonight and I'm feeling that raw frustration. Been there?
> 
> Here's a little letter:
> 
> ...



I have my own answers for these here letters of concern

1. I don't care where my plus size girlfriend may be, I will always want to hold her and make sure she is safe and secure in my arms, around my friends or not.

2. I can actually say that this probably happens to most girls, having been to concerts, I realize that most guys want to be guys at my concerts (That I go to) and dont want to have to worry about their girlfriend's safety.

3. I wish I could get a my girlfriend to sleep in my house as much as hers, but it isnt my place, so it isnt my decision

4. If I had a myspace page with a bunch of plus size girls, and my girlfriend found out, I am a dead man.

5. I want to have sexual with fat girls, and I have with the same one... for 3 years! She is my first plus size girl and she was my first! So, Life is good 

6. Huh? I like talking to fat girls online!

7. I think my girlfriend is too good for me, so I fight to make sure I am a near fraction compared to her whole love.

8. I told my parents I am an FA, and I get angry when they say to me that she should lose some weight. And if she did streak infront of my family... I would send her to my room >)


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