# So, I have a few questions.



## GirlWithoutAPlanet (Dec 12, 2010)

Hello all at Dimensions!

I've browsed your forums a few times and I have a few burning questions I'd love for some of you to answer. This post might be wordy but please read!

First, I'll offer a disclaimer. I'm not obese and I don't ever intend to be. HOWEVER, I am mildly overweight and sometimes struggle to keep my weight in check. Currently, I'm 22, 5'3", and 150-160 lbs., US size 8. I'd prefer to be 120-130 and a US 4, which I was a few years back. It is not always SUPER easy for me to keep my weight down. I like to eat- not going to lie- although I avoid stuffing myself. I AM good about fitness and exercise; and in all honesty I tend to believe that while human beings come in a variety of acceptably healthy shapes and sizes, being enormous really can't be that healthy. Given all this though, I am NOT here to judge anybody for their size, come down on them for their choices, or to belittle or abuse anyone. This much is clear.

Now, for my question. I noticed in several threads (particularly one about the reality of dating a BBW) how many women identified factors and situations which indicated to me that their size and weight made life very, very hard. I've seen women here discuss how difficult it is to find cars to accommodate them, how hard it is to go to the movies, and how flying is a downright harrowing and incredibly stressful experience- all due to their size. For many BBWs (SSBBWs, in particular), even going to a restaurant is something that requires meticulous planning in advance. Music festivals and Renn Faires are hard too because of all the walking involved.

Now, there are a multitude of other situations mentioned but I'm not going to get into the nitty-gritty right now. But my issue is this: clearly, being this big makes life very difficult. Being an SSBBW, it seems, one can never, on a whim, say "let's go out to eat!" or "let's see this flick!". A joyful, fun event like a music festival becomes a burden when you can't walk. Now, my question is: given all of these difficulties, what is it that inspires or motivates you to remain the size you are or even to gain weight? Do you ever feel like you're missing out? I'm really, genuinely curious and I'm eager to hear your answers. And I reiterate, I'm not here to pass judgment or make anybody feel crappy- I've been on the other end of that stick and it's never fun. Have at it, ladies and gents!


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## EvilPrincess (Dec 12, 2010)

Not sure what you are looking for, and please note that the answers to your questions are given time and time again in many different threads. You should spend some time reading to get a better understanding of the issue and of this community. 


/moderator


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## AnnMarie (Dec 12, 2010)

I didn't strive to get fat and I'm not going to spend my life depriving and punishing myself, making food into "good" and "bad" value judgements to meet a societal norm that's based on very little in terms of social "acceptableness". 


I like me, and yes, some things are harder. But I find ways around it if it's something I really want to do. Do I wish theater seats were a bit larger? Hell yes. But I'm not the only one - my thin friends want more room as well... the difference is that room isn't a luxury want to me, it's a need. 

I'd brace yourself for a storm - some of your phrasing is already condescending and judgmental sounding, intentional or not (and I'm willing to give you the benefit of the doubt based on your overall context and tone).


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## indy500tchr (Dec 12, 2010)

I think that many of "us" come here for support and help with the challenges we seek in our lives. Just like you said in your post. You even struggle to keep your weight in check. There are lots of people here on this board just like you. We don't choose to be as big as we are but because of medication or lifestyle it has happened and have accepted themselves for who they are despite societies shunning. 

There are some who do choose to be "this fat" but that is their choice...consequences and all. Just like smokers or drinkers who get lung cancer or liver disease, obesity sometimes comes with difficulties in life. Have you ever asked a smoker or drinker why they do what they do to their bodies?

I use those two addictions because for me personally food is an addiction and has been for my entire life. That is why I am "this fat". I've accepted myself and love me for who I am and live my life in the healthiest way I can.

Also, on a side note...please don't pigeonhole bbw's and ssbbw's into categories of "can" and "can't". Just because you are bbw or ssbbw doesn't mean you always have to think about going out or have mobility issues. If you truly want the answers to your questions I'd do some further reading on the boards b/c I have a feeling that this thread is going to end up being a shitstorm.


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## mossystate (Dec 12, 2010)

I mean, what ' obese ' woman wouldn't want to dive right in and defend her existence to you. 

Being " really genuinely curious " is not a prize for the HUMAN BEINGS you are leering at.


*" I like to eat- not going to lie- although I avoid stuffing myself. I AM good about fitness and exercise; and in all honesty I tend to believe that while human beings come in a variety of acceptably healthy shapes and sizes, being enormous really can't be that healthy. Given all this though, I am NOT here to judge anybody for their size, come down on them for their choices, or to belittle or abuse anyone. This much is clear.* "

Clear as mud. You are good and you don't stuff yourself, like all us obese types. 

So, are we now going to hear about a television show? This is just sounding all too familiar.


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## gobettiepurple (Dec 12, 2010)

*sits in the corner with popcorn and waits for the mayhem to ensue . . .

"the suspense is killing me, I hope it'll last!" - The Importance of being Earnest

:eat2:


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## GirlWithoutAPlanet (Dec 12, 2010)

@EvilPrincess: I'll keep that in mind. Thanks.

@MossyState: TV show? I'm confused. If you think I'm a spam bot or recruiting for some B.S reality TV show (which I hate, quite frankly) it's not accurate. 

@ Indy: Thank you for your thought provoking response. Truly, it gave me pause. "It is their choice...consequences and all". As quite the libertine, I understand this. However, you quote smokers and drinkers in your response. I WOULD ask this question. But the issues those particular addictions arouse are different- for a drinker, one wonders how they drive, for example. A drunk can ruin their lives in a real hurry. A smoker needs to take frequent cigarette breaks. It's not quite the same kettle of fish as the inability to walk for long periods of time- but it CAN be equally damaging, and I acknowledge that.


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## cinnamitch (Dec 12, 2010)

mossystate said:


> I mean, what ' obese ' woman wouldn't want to dive right in and defend her existence to you.
> 
> Being " really genuinely curious " is not a prize for the HUMAN BEINGS you are leering at.
> 
> ...



Well hell now i am hungry. I am bad, but thats good.


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## indy500tchr (Dec 12, 2010)

GirlWithoutAPlanet said:


> A smoker needs to take frequent cigarette breaks. It's not quite the same kettle of fish as the *inability to walk for long periods of time*- but it CAN be equally damaging, and I acknowledge that.



I guess you've never met a smoker with emphysema.


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## GirlWithoutAPlanet (Dec 12, 2010)

@Indy: POINT. I have, you win this round.


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## CastingPearls (Dec 12, 2010)

Sounds like you're collecting data for research.
I'm nobodies lab rat and I hope none of the BBWs and SSBBWs here put themselves in the position of being one either.


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## cinnamitch (Dec 12, 2010)

indy500tchr said:


> I guess you've never met a smoker with emphysema.



You know it is amazing how "unhealthy" we are and yet i worked at a nursing home where one of the residents has emphysema and was on oxygen and would go outside to smoke WHILE WEARING THE OXYGEN. We had to respect his decision that smoking might blow him up but by law we had to be out there while he smoked because his health was bad enough that he often dropped his cigarette. We went round and round with the state inspectors and his doctor and finally got an order that if he wanted to smoke , he had to be able to get out there without help. Now tell me if that isn't as bad or worse than being really obese


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## cinnamitch (Dec 12, 2010)

CastingPearls said:


> Sounds like you're collecting data for research.
> I'm nobodies lab rat and I hope none of the BBWs and SSBBWs here put themselves in the position of being one either.



If my life is going to be on display for the general public it's going to be with me wearing a g string and using a stripper chair( i don't think i can use the pole)


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## Buffie (Dec 12, 2010)

Why does there have to be a motivator? For me fat is genetic.

As for this "very difficult" life you're imagining... I wouldn't describe my world that way at all.

I experience occasional inconveniences and annoyances related to my weight but everyone has their own set of headaches no matter the body type. 

My life has way more "difficulties" related to being left-handed. Doesn't mean I'll start using my right one.


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## gobettiepurple (Dec 12, 2010)

cinnamitch said:


> You know it is amazing how "unhealthy" we are and yet i worked at a nursing home where one of the residents has emphysema and was on oxygen and would go outside to smoke WHILE WEARING THE OXYGEN. We had to respect his decision that smoking might blow him up but by law we had to be out there while he smoked because his health was bad enough that he often dropped his cigarette. We went round and round with the state inspectors and his doctor and finally got an order that if he wanted to smoke , he had to be able to get out there without help. Now tell me if that isn't as bad or worse than being really obese



So much worse . . . if the guy used oxygen and stopped smoking, in theory he would eventually get better.

There is no cure, "magic", medicinal, or otherwise, that can "cure" fatness . . .

I think thats why we embrace it, fat is a state of being, not a disease.


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## mossystate (Dec 12, 2010)

cinnamitch said:


> Well hell now i am hungry. I am bad, but thats good.



Just you get to that lonnnng walk after the feast! Yes, even in all that snow, missy!!
---

So, GWAP, I have a few questions.

How did you come across Dimensions?

How much, exactly, have you read out here? If you had done much _research_, you would have seen how so many quite fat women do lots of things you think are way out of their reach and abilities. 

You mention someone winning this " round ". Are you honing some sort of verbal Kung-Fu skill? 

Does it blow your mind to pieces when you see an " enormous " human being walking...lots?

Do you begrudge an " enormous " human being a motorized scooter, so they can more fully live their lives, because, I know you are concerned about " enormous " people not experiencing the joys you experience.

That should hold me for now.


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## cinnamitch (Dec 12, 2010)

mossystate said:


> Just you get to that lonnnng walk after the feast! Yes, even in all that snow, missy!!
> ---
> 
> So, GWAP, I have a few questions.
> ...



Pfft I barely walk when there isn't snow and you want me to walk in snow.. Oh you stinker you!. Oh and tyvm you said Kung Fu and I am singing Kung Fu Fighting to myself now. I'm gonna get you good for that one. I want a motorized scooter but i fear i would do bad things with it, like pick up drunk sailors. I do like your questions however, so i will let this little incident slide. Why oh why must we keep being treated like a freak show? OMGshessofatshesgonnadiedontsherealizethatandthankgodimnotthatfat. :doh:


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## mossystate (Dec 12, 2010)

cinnamitch said:


> Pfft I barely walk when there isn't snow and you want me to walk in snow.. Oh you stinker you!. Oh and tyvm you said Kung Fu and I am singing Kung Fu Fighting to myself now. I'm gonna get you good for that one. I want a motorized scooter but i fear i would do bad things with it, like pick up drunk sailors. I do like your questions however, so i will let this little incident slide. Why oh why must we keep being treated like a freak show? OMGshessofatshesgonnadiedontsherealizethatandthankgodimnotthatfat. :doh:



Drunk sailors draped over your scooter basket!! Ask if he has a brother, then swing by to get me. * beep beep *

those dudes were fast as lightning


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## LovelyLiz (Dec 12, 2010)

I'd like to echo the questions of how you found this forum, and why the hell you care.


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## gobettiepurple (Dec 12, 2010)

mcbeth said:


> I'd like to echo the questions of how you found this forum, and why the hell you care.



What she said . . . with emphasis!


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## trucrimsongold (Dec 12, 2010)

good night... sweet dreams casting pearls


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## LovelyLiz (Dec 12, 2010)

trucrimsongold said:


> good night... sweet dreams casting pearls



This post wins the thread.


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## mossystate (Dec 12, 2010)

this thread has it all...already


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## CastingPearls (Dec 12, 2010)

mcbeth said:


> This post wins the thread.


Does that mean I win this round? HA HA HA HA HA


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## LovelyLiz (Dec 12, 2010)

CastingPearls said:


> Does that mean I win this round? HA HA HA HA HA



Your earnest but misguided manfriend wins the thread. But as you were the inspiration, you get an honorable mention.


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## HayleeRose (Dec 12, 2010)

Well, let me start off by saying, im not skinny, nor will I ever be skinny or even aspire to be skinny. I am not going to make my world revolve around what I should or shoulnt eat\do because im a fattie. Im almost 300lbs, I have no problem walking or standing for long periods of time. I can honestly say I probably love myself(including my body) more than most the people half my size. I find it insulting that you have been visiting the site for a while, as if its some "freak show" (like someone else said). Again, why come here in the first place?


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## luscious_lulu (Dec 12, 2010)

I think I'm going to stalk Mossy, quote everything She posts & say "what she said"


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## FatAndProud (Dec 12, 2010)

Wow, I love how you direct your question toward the "obese"...as though we're not individuals and we're all the same, collectively. 

Everyone carries fat differently. Everyone behaves differently. Everyone lives differently. You can't assume because a person is fat that they're going to die because of x medical anomaly, that they have diabetes, or that they are uncontrollable eaters. That would be equivalent to someone generalizing/stereotyping any other minority group. 

Dimensions is about size acceptance - something the general public cares nothing about. Size acceptance for BBW/BHM/SSBBW AND thin people alike. We're all humans, we're all functional, and we all love/are loved. To judge someone by the number on a scale is ridiculous. Quite frankly, unwarranted judgements will ultimately lead to a shallow, lonely life for those that exclude anyone out of their social circle because of a superficial reason, such as weight.

We do not have to justify to you - or anyone - as to why we're fat and why we stay fat. Why do you care so much about what others think? Why do you deny yourself a simple pleasure such as food? Why do you let your feelings of weight get the best of you? Are you happy with yourself? We could ask the same of you, my dear.


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## FatAndProud (Dec 12, 2010)

Also, whoever is obese...wanna go out for pizza and stuff ourselves until we can't walk...because, you know, that's what we do.


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## Mishty (Dec 12, 2010)

GirlWithoutAPlanet said:


> Hello all at Dimensions!
> 
> I've browsed your forums a few times and I have a few burning questions I'd love for some of you to answer. This post might be wordy but please read!



okay.....



> First, I'll offer a disclaimer. I'm not obese and I don't ever intend to be. HOWEVER, I am mildly overweight and sometimes struggle to keep my weight in check. Currently, I'm 22, 5'3", and 150-160 lbs., US size 8. I'd prefer to be 120-130 and a US 4, which I was a few years back. It is not always SUPER easy for me to keep my weight down.* I like to eat- not going to lie- although I avoid stuffing myself. I AM good about fitness and exercise; and in all honesty I tend to believe that while human beings come in a variety of acceptably healthy shapes and sizes, being enormous really can't be that healthy.*


When's the last time you did stuff yourself? 



> Given all this though, I am NOT here to judge anybody for their size, come down on them for their choices, or to belittle or abuse anyone. This much is clear. Now, for my question. I noticed in several threads (particularly one about the reality of dating a BBW) how many women identified factors and situations which indicated to me that their size and weight made life very, very hard. I've seen women here discuss how difficult it is to find cars to accommodate them, how hard it is to go to the movies, and how flying is a downright harrowing and incredibly stressful experience- all due to their size. For many BBWs (SSBBWs, in particular), even going to a restaurant is something that requires meticulous planning in advance.


This is _our_ board to discuss the problems in our every day lives that try to hold us back or restrict us. Do you go to boards dedicated to dwarfism or gigantism and ask them the same questions? 




> Music festivals and Renn Faires are hard too because of all the walking involved.


Renn faires......
Have you ever been to one? 'Cause every time I attend I see fatties in wench costumes, big men in king capes, and chubby fairies and nymphs by the groves. 



> Now, there are a multitude of other situations mentioned but I'm not going to get into the nitty-gritty right now.


let's get into the nitty-gritty right now.



> But my issue is this: clearly, being this big makes life very difficult. Being an SSBBW, it seems, one can never, on a whim, say "let's go out to eat!" or "let's see this flick!". A joyful, fun event like a music festival becomes a burden when you can't walk.


Naw, we have scooters. beep beep 



> Now, my question is: given all of these difficulties, what is it that inspires or motivates you to remain the size you are or even to gain weight? Do you ever feel like you're missing out? I'm really, genuinely curious and I'm eager to hear your answers.


I like being fat because I find it _sexy_, and unique. true story. I like standing out. I want to gain weight because I'm a freak of sexual nature and it's also _sexy_. 



> And I reiterate, I'm not here to pass judgment or make anybody feel crappy- I've been on the other end of that stick and it's never fun. Have at it, ladies and gents!


Thanks for stopping by, please feel free to ask anymore non-judgmental questions you might have, fat people are on stand by, er...sit by.


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## tonynyc (Dec 12, 2010)

GirlWithoutAPlanet said:


> Hello all at Dimensions!
> 
> I've browsed your forums a few times and I have a few burning questions I'd love for some of you to answer. This post might be wordy but please read!
> 
> ...



There seems to be a comfy and familiar theme with your post.. My question to you ... "how do you feel about SSBBWs , eating and public transportation"


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## indy500tchr (Dec 12, 2010)

tonynyc said:


> There seems to be a comfy and familiar theme with your post.. My question to you ... "how do you feel about a SSBBWs , eating and public transportation"



OMG! I didn't even think! :doh: I should have broken out the croissants already!


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## tonynyc (Dec 12, 2010)

indy500tchr said:


> OMG! I didn't even think! :doh: I should have broken out the croissants already!



*Yep... never too late for that * :happy: :happy:


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## olwen (Dec 12, 2010)

GirlWithoutAPlanet said:


> Hello all at Dimensions!
> 
> I've browsed your forums a few times and I have a few burning questions I'd love for some of you to answer. This post might be wordy but please read!
> 
> ...




If you have to ask, then your coping skills probably aren't that great.


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## luscious_lulu (Dec 12, 2010)

tonynyc said:


> There seems to be a comfy and familiar theme with your post.. My question to you ... "how do you feel about SSBBWs , eating and public transportation"



OMG! Yes!

*Eats her croissant in a very public place*


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## Carrie (Dec 12, 2010)

GirlWithoutAPlanet said:


> Music festivals and Renn Faires are hard too because of all the walking involved.


My goal is actually to eat myself into immobility so I don't ever have to attend a Renn Faire.


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## Fat Brian (Dec 12, 2010)

Its true though, there are some hot SSBBWs at ren faires.


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## CastingPearls (Dec 12, 2010)

I really like how a standard by which we are measured (heh) is the ability (and desire) to attend a Renn Faire. I'm guessing we're all bereft of good taste too.


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## superodalisque (Dec 12, 2010)

GirlWithoutAPlanet said:


> Hello all at Dimensions!
> 
> I've browsed your forums a few times and I have a few burning questions I'd love for some of you to answer. This post might be wordy but please read!
> 
> ...



i think this is an excellent question and cuts to the chase when it comes to nearly everything here. if its such a misery for someone and they hate their fat life so much and everything is so hard then why? beautiful! i'm an ssbbw/midsized bbw myself and even i wonder. you're going to find that a lot of people won't answer this but just attack the question because its a tough one that requires a lot of introspection that people just might not like to do. or maybe they have done it and don't like the answer they came up with.

i enjoy my weight and don't and haven't found my weight to be a big burden. it doesn't make me hate my body and never has. i enjoy it out in public. i enjoy it in private. i like how i look nude or clothed. i don't worry so much about fitting into things because i have had a lifetime of accommodating myself and not being ashamed or embarrassed about asking for special consideration when i need it--and thats not often. i can honestly say there is nearly nothing i can't find a way to do. i'm pretty independent in my fat. part of that is taking control for myself, not making any excuses, not psyching myself out when it comes to participating in life and not looking around so hard for disapproval. i think sometimes its all too easy for people to dwell entirely too much on themselves and their difficulties. they forget that other people also have their own. it can often make then unkind and not very generous to themselves or anyone else.

i think weight gets blamed for a lot of things but honestly i think its more the person than the weigh that determines the quality of life. if a person truly hates something about themselves they should find a way to change it. if they aren't willing to do whatever it takes to change it then they need to find a way to enjoy their life without bringing along negativity or making other's emotionally responsible for their condition. but truthfully, people who don't take hold of their own happiness would probably be in misery if they were small too because thats just where their head is. it took me a long time to figure that out. i'm glad i know now.

i think anyone who finds their life such a misery should really be assessing seriously what exactly it is they have to take hold of. but unfortunately its often easier to have justifications and make excuses than it is to be responsible and/or do something.


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## superodalisque (Dec 12, 2010)

Fat Brian said:


> Its true though, there are some hot SSBBWs at ren faires.



4-6 nice FAs with a litter would solve that issue toute suite


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## imfree (Dec 12, 2010)

tonynyc said:


> There seems to be a comfy and familiar theme with your post.. My question to you ... "how do you feel about SSBBWs , eating and public transportation"



Good question, Tony, the OP's post does kinna' have that smell to it! Sorry I can't Rep you yet.


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## imfree (Dec 12, 2010)

imfree said:


> Good question, Tony, the OP's post does kinna' have that smell to it! Sorry I can't Rep you yet.



I'll forgo the croissants in favor of a nice 16" Canadian bacon and pineapple pizza, dripping grease on offended passengers in public transport, however.


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## Admiral_Snackbar (Dec 13, 2010)

Starting a thread like this as an obvious outsider polling for data for god knows what sort of study/report/Oprah episode is sort of the online equivalent of saying you want to get your face carved off at a sushi chef training school. 

_Caveat sollicit&#257;re_! 

P.S. *superodalisque* don't let yourself get punk'd.


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## natepogue (Dec 13, 2010)

mossystate said:


> > *" I like to eat- not going to lie- although I avoid stuffing myself. I AM good about fitness and exercise; and in all honesty I tend to believe that while human beings come in a variety of acceptably healthy shapes and sizes, being enormous really can't be that healthy. Given all this though, I am NOT here to judge anybody for their size, come down on them for their choices, or to belittle or abuse anyone. This much is clear.* "
> 
> 
> 
> Clear as mud. You are good and you don't stuff yourself, like all us obese types.


My god, one of the most ridiculous things you've ever written mossystate.


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## Dmitra (Dec 13, 2010)

Please do not feed the trolls all the croissants. They are MINE!

Thank you.


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## Linda (Dec 13, 2010)

trucrimsongold said:


> good night... sweet dreams casting pearls





Bwahahaha. Ron should win a trophy for this post.


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## superodalisque (Dec 13, 2010)

Admiral_Snackbar said:


> Starting a thread like this as an obvious outsider polling for data for god knows what sort of study/report/Oprah episode is sort of the online equivalent of saying you want to get your face carved off at a sushi chef training school.
> 
> _Caveat sollicit&#257;re_!
> 
> P.S. *superodalisque* don't let yourself get punk'd.



who cares if it is an outsider? i know that i have actually wondered this myself. why should we mind if someone plumbs us for info? at least they are actually talking to us and asking us instead of just having someone else who hasn't a clue talk about us. if the answers are the truth then whats the big deal? are people worried about exposing that truth? probably. why should we be so secretive about our real opinions? whats the problem with engaging with people on the outside at least sometimes? hey, we do this to people from the inside as well when we are afraid to talk about something. its very obvious. 

i'm not embarrassed about my true feelings or to say what they are to anyone. i'm not ashamed to be fat or my reasons why. i'm not afraid of what comes with it or to fight for my rights if i need to. this is why we have no real discussion anymore. hiding from talk and debate doesn't do anyone any good. what is the purpose of a forum anyway. the hushings and quietings here are depressingly like some kind of censorship. there is too much fear and paranoia. if a person is really fine with being fat why hide? why avoid? if someone is too afraid to engage with others inside OR outside ( a a misnomer since no one is really an outsider in a public forum) why bother being here? even if it is someone from the Oprah show or something like it why should anyone be so afraid to tell the truth about how they feel? why be afraid of the discussion? why not be open at least to healthy debate on all levels? nothing is ever going to change unless people stop acting like they have something to hide or like the movement is some kind of lie they have to tell themselves to keep going. maybe it is a lie for some. who knows? a lot of people here need to answer this question honestly --at least for themselves. if they don't at least have the strength to do stand up and answer that question with integrity in front of anyone then maybe they have no right to offer up advice or opinions to others seeking help. getting punked for cause is better than punking yourself on a daily elemental basis.

PS: what are you afraid will happen if people answer? will someone say that SA is a sham and those people really don't like who they are? will the inherent conflicts between what people say do and feel become exposed? maybe thats a good thing if its true. there needs to be some relationship between what is said and what is done and what is felt. the ability for a lot of people here to suspend logic and keep the inconsistencies going is not helpful or healthy for anyone on the inside or the outside. running from things doesn't help either. the idea that anyone can't just come here and ask a question but has to think exactly like a specified group of people here think, have their same experiences or reality in order to pose a question is just plain goofy. maybe if people really start playing they'll muddy up the playground?


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## Admiral_Snackbar (Dec 13, 2010)

superodalisque said:


> who cares if it is an outsider? i know that i have actually wondered this myself. why should we mind if someone plumbs us for info? at least they are actually talking to us and asking us instead of just having someone else who hasn't a clue talk about us. if the answers are the truth then whats the big deal? are people worried about exposing that truth? probably. why should we be so secretive about our real opinions? whats the problem with engaging with people on the outside at least sometimes? hey, we do this to people from the inside as well when we are afraid to talk about something. its very obvious.



I care because "external" media rarely gets it right. Fat acceptance stories are slotted in somewhere between "Extreme Living/Sideshow" and "who is the father" daytime TV stories. Maybe I'm not hip to current events but can someone point to at least one recent, balanced and positive-themed story about fat acceptance?



> i'm not embarrassed about my true feelings or to say what they are to anyone. i'm not ashamed to be fat or my reasons why. i'm not afraid of what comes with it or to fight for my rights if i need to. this is why we have no real discussion anymore. hiding from talk and debate doesn't do anyone any good. what is the purpose of a forum anyway. the hushings and quietings here are depressingly like some kind of censorship. there is too much fear and paranoia. if a person is really fine with being fat why hide? why avoid? if someone is too afraid to engage with others inside OR outside ( a a misnomer since no one is really an outsider in a public forum) why bother being here? even if it is someone from the Oprah show or something like it why should anyone be so afraid to tell the truth about how they feel? why be afraid of the discussion? why not be open at least to healthy debate on all levels? nothing is ever going to change unless people stop acting like they have something to hide or like the movement is some kind of lie they have to tell themselves to keep going. maybe it is a lie for some. who knows? a lot of people here need to answer this question honestly --at least for themselves. if they don't at least have the strength to do stand up and answer that question with integrity in front of anyone then maybe they have no right to offer up advice or opinions to others seeking help. getting punked for cause is better than punking yourself on a daily elemental basis.


 I said nothing about hiding in my original post. My perspective was that the tone of the OP seemed someone was fishing for information. Rather than do some legwork as the secondary poster/mod suggested, searching through existing debates, they chose to frame the question with some sort of solidarity perspective as a way to encourage responses.

I have found that even within fat acceptance groups there are varying levels of acceptance. My personal acceptance starts to fade where quality of life issues arise. I don't want to get bigger because I know unequivocally that there are pre-existing health issues that made life very dangerous for me at the 300-350 mark. I don't need or want to be thin, but I know there's an upper weight limit where I would not be happy in the day-to-day.

I would never suggest to someone that they need to lose weight to be at a certain level, because there's no steady state for anyone. There are people who weigh 400 lbs and are perfectly healthy. Others at that weight have severe health issues and losing weight isn't a lifestyle preference so much as a life-maintenance preference. That is not a decision for me to make, and it certainly isn't a way I would choose to slot larger people into some sort of category.



> PS: what are you afraid will happen if people answer? will someone say that SA is a sham and those people really don't like who they are? will the inherent conflicts between what people say do and feel become exposed? maybe thats a good thing if its true. there needs to be some relationship between what is said and what is done and what is felt. the ability for a lot of people here to suspend logic and keep the inconsistencies going is not helpful or healthy for anyone on the inside or the outside. running from things doesn't help either. the idea that anyone can't just come here and ask a question but has to think exactly like a specified group of people here think, have their same experiences or reality in order to pose a question is just plain goofy. maybe if people really start playing they'll muddy up the playground?


There's no fear in answering at all, so I'm not sure where you're coming at with this. All I was saying is to come into Dims, posing the questions they did with no pretense, other than "heyy, I have weight issues, I see you all have weight issues, too!" is someone being very lazy or coming in with an agenda. Some of us have a spider-sense and it was tingling all over when I read the OP.

Again, my troll-fu tends to be a bit more accurate than some, and drawing very emotional responses from replies may be what SA is doing. I'd like to think their interest is honest and sincere, but I don't know. I would just hate for people to make very deep, heartfelt responses and have it fall on deaf ears because such a response would skew their data, or at worse trigger some sort of Nelson Muntz "Ha haa" reaction.


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## superodalisque (Dec 13, 2010)

Admiral_Snackbar said:


> I care because "external" media rarely gets it right. Fat acceptance stories are slotted in somewhere between "Extreme Living/Sideshow" and "who is the father" daytime TV stories. Maybe I'm not hip to current events but can someone point to at least one recent, balanced and positive-themed story about fat acceptance?
> 
> I said nothing about hiding in my original post. My perspective was that the tone of the OP seemed someone was fishing for information. Rather than do some legwork as the secondary poster/mod suggested, searching through existing debates, they chose to frame the question with some sort of solidarity perspective as a way to encourage responses.
> 
> ...




if an honest discussion happens what does it really matter what other people do with it. people will say what they like anyway. its what we can get out of it thats important. aren't you tired of running from what other people might say about fat yet? when will you be free of that worry ? are we in some kind of fat closet here together? in a forum for discussion ducking and dodging issues is counter productive. in a place thats supposed to be for conversation and debate fear of what the world might or might not do with it is a problem. may as well stay home and not ever communicate with anyone if it always has to be one way. also how do you know that if we are honest it will always be twisted. even if it is we won't die from it. it won't kill us. we're grown ups and we've seen it before. but how can you blame people for not understanding if you won't even engage a discussion? you can't have it both ways. you want understanding? sometimes you have to risk a little something. 

i think all of this fake worry about tone is a cop out for when people ask something that others don't want discussed or don't want to answer. this IS the legwork. its not fishing to come to a site devoted to body image to ask the participants. this is a part of the legwork. it only makes sense. this is one of the ways people find things out now. posing a question to people who care is not fishing. if the person were looking to be negative there are plenty of posts and quotes already right here to be used. you don't have to look far. they'd take less time to find than it does to register to post. maybe someone has a genuine question in their minds. i know i do and often wonder the same thing. i'm not even thin and i can't quite understand it. do you?

and as far as i know when ever someone asks pointed questions like this there is always a lot of rifling around and derailment even. maybe its time to stop making excuses for running and just discuss whatever it is thats laid out there or leave it to people who want to. it might be good for the OP and the rest of us too. thought police telling people what they should or should not ask or whether they should answer or not are choking the air out of this place and making it boring anyway. the air in a hermetically sealed place gets stifling after a while. maybe we should open a window sometimes.


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## Heyyou (Dec 13, 2010)

superodalisque said:


> if an honest discussion happens what does it really matter what other people do with it. people will say what they like anyway. its what we can get out of it thats important. aren't you tired of running from what other people might say about fat yet? when will you be free of that worry ? are we in some kind of fat closet here together? in a forum for discussion ducking and dodging issues is counter productive. in a place thats supposed to be for conversation and debate fear of what the world might or might not do with it is a problem. may as well stay home and not ever communicate with anyone if it always has to be one way. also how do you know that if we are honest it will always be twisted. even if it is we won't die from it. it won't kill us. we're grown ups and we've seen it before. but how can you blame people for not understanding if you won't even engage a discussion? you can't have it both ways. you want understanding? sometimes you have to risk a little something.
> 
> i think all of this fake worry about tone is a cop out for when people ask something that others don't want discussed or don't want to answer. this IS the legwork. its not fishing to come to a site devoted to body image to ask the participants. this is a part of the legwork. it only makes sense. this is one of the ways people find things out now. posing a question to people who care is not fishing. if the person were looking to be negative there are plenty of posts and quotes already right here to be used. you don't have to look far. they'd take less time to find than it does to register to post. maybe someone has a genuine question in their minds. i know i do and often wonder the same thing. i'm not even thin and i can't quite understand it. do you?
> 
> and as far as i know when ever someone asks pointed questions like this there is always a lot of rifling around and derailment even. maybe its time to stop making excuses for running and just discuss whatever it is thats laid out there or leave it to people who want to. it might be good for the OP and the rest of us too. thought police telling people what they should or should not ask or whether they should answer or not are choking the air out of this place and making it boring anyway. the air in a hermetically sealed place gets stifling after a while. maybe we should open a window sometimes.



Why so many paragraphs? Just say "F**K em." So wordy!


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## tonynyc (Dec 13, 2010)

Heyyou said:


> Why so many paragraphs? Just say "F**K em." So wordy!



Because... Superodalisque is a classy lady... though if she were to ever do a posting with curse words.... that would be an EPIC event...


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## Heyyou (Dec 13, 2010)

tonynyc said:


> Because... Superodalisque is a classy lady... though if she were to ever do a posting with curse words.... that would be an EPIC event...



But she puts too many words in. Like an artificial attempt to sound important. And sometimes, profanity captures feeling and conviction. I motion she can use less words. That is all.


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## Jes (Dec 13, 2010)

Admiral_Snackbar said:


> I would never suggest to someone that they need to lose weight to be at a certain level, because there's no steady state for anyone. There are people who weigh 400 lbs and are perfectly healthy. Others at that weight have severe health issues and losing weight isn't a lifestyle preference so much as a life-maintenance preference. .



For a while now, I've wanted to pose the question: how do you define the term 'health' here at Dims. I think it's a fair question to ask and I'd be curious as to the responses... but I suppose I'll leave that topic for now.

I don't know if the OP is that goofy kid who lives with Mom and talked of hating that he was a 98 lbs weakling (calm down, tiny toddy, no one is talking about you) and wants a fat chick unless she's a fat chick, or if it isn't. Either way, my answer the stays the same:

It's no secret that I don't see myself in a lot of places at Dims b/c my experiences and viewpoints differ. That fact can sometimes make it challenging to keep in lockstep with some of the dominant voices and ideologies here. There is room and tolerance for minority viewpoints, though not much in my opinion. I bring those opinions to this question.

But ultimately, my feeling is that the world is not a friendly place for fat people and it can be damaging to be told we're not worthwhile, we're not important, we're not desireable, we're somehow not human. It gets old. And so I think everyone deserves a 'place' to come, and just be. Be free of some of this obsessive fat hatred and fear mongering. A place to be a person who talks about politics or sex or movies or anything else without being a FAT person who talks about those things. See what I mean? Most of us are fat, or ok with fat people, and that common denominator, just like in a math problem, can be removed here, to allow room for other parts of who we are to express themselves.

So I think that's one reason Dims exists and one good thing I take from it.


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## CastingPearls (Dec 13, 2010)

Linda said:


> Bwahahaha. Ron should win a trophy for this post.


Don't encourage him please. Please.


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## superodalisque (Dec 13, 2010)

Heyyou said:


> But she puts too many words in. Like an artificial attempt to sound important. And sometimes, profanity captures feeling and conviction. I motion she can use less words. That is all.



i've learned here that if i don't put in a lot of words then its even easier for people to read into what i say. i'm not writing to please you but myself. if you don't like it don't read it. no harm no foul. by having long posts i weed out people who don't care enough since i'm not writing to them. i kinda like that. as for importance, yes i am important. i hope you are too. i know i'm important enough that i don't need to feel i have to dumb anything down to make anyone else comfortable. and i'm sure i don't have to because people aren't intelligent enough here. i just like fleshing out my points. if you think i'm full of it thats your business because i really don't care.  i don't feel the need to be like you to like myself.

even though i have been known to drop a few bombs myself, i feel profanity is lazy and often meaningless. but thats my opinion. everyone has to express themselves in their own way.


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## Famouslastwords (Dec 13, 2010)

My side hurts.


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## tonynyc (Dec 13, 2010)

Famouslastwords said:


> My side hurts.



Take two of these


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## Famouslastwords (Dec 13, 2010)

tonynyc said:


> Take two of these



Have you been reading my facebook page Tony? <.< >.> <.< >.> <.< >.> <.< >.> <.< >.>


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## tonynyc (Dec 13, 2010)

Famouslastwords said:


> Have you been reading my facebook page Tony? <.< >.> <.< >.> <.< >.> <.< >.> <.< >.>



:happy: :happy: :happy:


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## CastingPearls (Dec 13, 2010)

Famouslastwords said:


> My side hurts.


It's gas .


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## Famouslastwords (Dec 13, 2010)

CastingPearls said:


> It's gas .




Are you setting me on fire?


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## Mishty (Dec 13, 2010)

Heyyou said:


> But she puts too many words in. *Like an artificial attempt to sound important.* And sometimes, profanity captures feeling and conviction. I motion she can use less words. That is all.



you are one rude little fuck head sometimes....


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## mossystate (Dec 13, 2010)

Supero, IF the person were looking to be negative? lol Really? I think many of us want certain conversations to be had out here, but for some of us, tone does matter and we are not being fake in not wanting to do direct business with trolls who are either sock puppet accounts, or just wanting to gawk at the monkeys in cages. See, that doesn't translate, for _some of us_, as wanting to stick our heads in a pile of whatever. I would love to see more discussion out here about some very difficult matters, but not when it is pitched this way. Doesn't mean there are only a few brave and truly concerned souls...and it doesn't mean that everybody who makes up the Thought Police ( very interesting you used that toy ) is doing anything more than what they/we are doing. Sometimes a whatever is just a whatever.

GirlWithoutAPlanet...mission complete?


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## AuntHen (Dec 13, 2010)

Carrie said:


> My goal is actually to eat myself into immobility so I don't ever have to attend a Renn Faire.



haha




FatAndProud said:


> Wow, *I love how you direct your question toward the "obese"...as though we're not individuals and we're all the same, collectively. *
> Everyone carries fat differently. Everyone behaves differently. Everyone lives differently. You can't assume because a person is fat that they're going to die because of x medical anomaly, that they have diabetes, or that they are uncontrollable eaters. That would be equivalent to someone generalizing/stereotyping any other minority group.
> 
> Dimensions is about size acceptance - something the general public cares nothing about. Size acceptance for BBW/BHM/SSBBW AND thin people alike. We're all humans, we're all functional, and we all love/are loved. To judge someone by the number on a scale is ridiculous. Quite frankly, unwarranted judgements will ultimately lead to a shallow, lonely life for those that exclude anyone out of their social circle because of a superficial reason, such as weight.
> ...




like *The Borg *from Star Trek.... a collective of fatties hahahaha


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## tonynyc (Dec 13, 2010)

Heyyou said:


> But she puts too many words in. Like an artificial attempt to sound important. And sometimes, profanity captures feeling and conviction. I motion she can use less words. That is all.



By insulting one of the nicest people here... you come off like an asshole



imfree said:


> I'll forgo the croissants in favor of a nice 16" Canadian bacon and pineapple pizza, dripping grease on offended passengers in public transport, however.



Bring that 16" tastiness during rush hour... it won't last one stop


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## CastingPearls (Dec 13, 2010)

FTR, this fatty has looked inward and has not been found wanting (are you gonna eat that donut?) I'm pleased with me warts and all and don't need to navel gaze to such a degree that I know the cotton content in the lint that resides there. There are plenty of people in the world, on these forums and in this thread telling me what I'm doing wrong by not being a good scout and at the end of the day, it's my opinion that matters only.

I don't need to verify my existence to anyone and furthermore if I desire to share my opinion that the OP is bullshit and others should beware, that is as much my choice as it is for someone to feel free to continuously post and create schizophrenic threads questioning the particular shade of the color of the fat sky and how it affects our significantly enormous footprint on the world at large. Puns fully intended.

I feel no guilt for the degrees of hate, love, indifference or compassion for myself or others that I express, fantasize or think about and would appreciate it if I didn't have to feel like every thread has become a lesson on enlightenment or a shooting gallery for self-haters or haters of fat that wrap themselves up in some noble mantle of curiosity, concern and false empathy.

Also I use the word 'fuck' with wild abandon and think it's far classier to be honest with oneself and still say, "No I don't like this, fuck you", than to attempt to shame others into doing something they don't want to do under the suggestion or accusation of being fearful or under arrest by imaginary thought police.

I don't owe an explanation to anyone but consider this a fucking Christmas gift and have a nice day.


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## imfree (Dec 13, 2010)

tonynyc said:


> By insulting one of the nicest people here... you come off like an asshole
> 
> 
> 
> Bring that 16" tastiness during rush hour... it won't last one stop



You got it friend, I can only consume about 2/3rds of one of those delightful excesses:eat2:, myself, so that leaves some to share! Have a couple* BIG* slices,to go with your ride, Tony!


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## Fat Brian (Dec 13, 2010)

Heyyou said:


> Why so many paragraphs? Just say "F**K em." So wordy!



What is you're problem with her posts ? Do you have a limit on how many words a day you can read or something ? Shes verbose, deal with it .


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## Fat Brian (Dec 13, 2010)

Okay, enough of this, can we please start posting lolcatz and Worf facepalming now ?


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## ashmamma84 (Dec 13, 2010)

CastingPearls said:


> FTR, this fatty has looked inward and has not been found wanting (are you gonna eat that donut?) I'm pleased with me warts and all and don't need to navel gaze to such a degree that I know the cotton content in the lint that resides there. There are plenty of people in the world, on these forums and in this thread telling me what I'm doing wrong by not being a good scout and at the end of the day, it's my opinion that matters only.
> 
> I don't need to verify my existence to anyone and furthermore if I desire to share my opinion that the OP is bullshit and others should beware, that is as much my choice as it is for someone to feel free to continuously post and create schizophrenic threads questioning the particular shade of the color of the fat sky and how it affects our significantly enormous footprint on the world at large. Puns fully intended.
> 
> ...



Damn it, someone rep her!


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## luscious_lulu (Dec 13, 2010)

Hey CastingPearls - I can't rep you, but I want you to know I fucking love you. :bow:


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## spiritangel (Dec 13, 2010)

CastingPearls said:


> FTR, this fatty has looked inward and has not been found wanting (are you gonna eat that donut?) I'm pleased with me warts and all and don't need to navel gaze to such a degree that I know the cotton content in the lint that resides there. There are plenty of people in the world, on these forums and in this thread telling me what I'm doing wrong by not being a good scout and at the end of the day, it's my opinion that matters only.
> 
> I don't need to verify my existence to anyone and furthermore if I desire to share my opinion that the OP is bullshit and others should beware, that is as much my choice as it is for someone to feel free to continuously post and create schizophrenic threads questioning the particular shade of the color of the fat sky and how it affects our significantly enormous footprint on the world at large. Puns fully intended.
> 
> ...



round of applause I agree and darn it couldnt rep you either have to spread it around


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## spiritangel (Dec 13, 2010)

CastingPearls said:


> FTR, this fatty has looked inward and has not been found wanting (are you gonna eat that donut?) I'm pleased with me warts and all and don't need to navel gaze to such a degree that I know the cotton content in the lint that resides there. There are plenty of people in the world, on these forums and in this thread telling me what I'm doing wrong by not being a good scout and at the end of the day, it's my opinion that matters only.
> 
> I don't need to verify my existence to anyone and furthermore if I desire to share my opinion that the OP is bullshit and others should beware, that is as much my choice as it is for someone to feel free to continuously post and create schizophrenic threads questioning the particular shade of the color of the fat sky and how it affects our significantly enormous footprint on the world at large. Puns fully intended.
> 
> ...



round of applause I agree and darn it couldnt rep you either have to spread it around


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## imfree (Dec 13, 2010)

ashmamma84 said:


> Damn it, someone rep her!



Repped her, but she deserves more, Guys!


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## tonynyc (Dec 13, 2010)

imfree said:


> Repped her, but she deserves more, Guys!



I would rep Casting Pearls-but, Nacho took her rep... This is Nacho's fault...


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## imfree (Dec 14, 2010)

tonynyc said:


> I would rep Casting Pearls-but, Nacho took her rep... This is Nacho's fault...



Never try to blame a Main Coon Cat for anything! They have a tendency to sneak up on your shoulder while you're lying asleep and purr you into forgiveness!:happy: Those sneaky little s**its! I'm tellin' ya', they own people by being cute and cuddly. I hope no one's angry at me for derailing this trainwreck thread:doh:. I think It's time to make a 2 lb batch of spaghetti, with 4 qts tomato sauce-based homemade sauce and have a Dimm's spaghetti eatin' meetin' on a public airline flight!:eat2:


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## Famouslastwords (Dec 14, 2010)

Ok now that we've been derailed back to the studio for our regularly scheduled thread. 

View attachment 246620.jpg


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## tonynyc (Dec 14, 2010)

imfree said:


> Never try to blame a Main Coon Cat for anything! They have a tendency to sneak up on your shoulder while you're lying asleep and purr you into forgiveness!:happy: Those sneaky little s**its! I'm tellin' ya', they own people by being cute and cuddly. I hope no one's angry at me for derailing this trainwreck thread:doh:. I think It's time to make a 2 lb batch of spaghetti, with 4 qts tomato sauce-based homemade sauce and have a Dimm's spaghetti eatin' meetin' on a public airline flight!:eat2:



What happened to the Pizza


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## imfree (Dec 14, 2010)

tonynyc said:


> What happened to the Pizza



Maine Coon Cats *LOVE* pizza. Alleigh softly climbed on my shoulder, purring loudly, while I was asleep. I awoke, smelling Canadian bacon and pineapple all over that %#)(&*#!!! cat!.....


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## Inhibited (Dec 14, 2010)

Agree with Superodalisque .. oh and i wish you were my Dr Tony i like your what you prescribe...


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## superodalisque (Dec 14, 2010)

mossystate said:


> Supero, IF the person were looking to be negative? lol Really? I think many of us want certain conversations to be had out here, but for some of us, tone does matter and we are not being fake in not wanting to do direct business with trolls who are either sock puppet accounts, or just wanting to gawk at the monkeys in cages. See, that doesn't translate, for _some of us_, as wanting to stick our heads in a pile of whatever. I would love to see more discussion out here about some very difficult matters, but not when it is pitched this way. Doesn't mean there are only a few brave and truly concerned souls...and it doesn't mean that everybody who makes up the Thought Police ( very interesting you used that toy ) is doing anything more than what they/we are doing. Sometimes a whatever is just a whatever.
> 
> GirlWithoutAPlanet...mission complete?



thats your take on it and thats a valid point but IMO it doesn't really matter if the person means to be negative. its a good question. why not give the people who haven't had the chance to sharpen their teeth on debates like this as practice for the outside world. i still think all of this shutting people down thing is stultifying and presumptuous of what other people want. sometimes a good debate actually based on the issue instead of personalities you have no way of truly knowing about is good for you.

this need for other people to agree with the "tone" approach and question before it gets considered is limiting to other people. whats the problem with just giving the people who want the chance to to discuss it? this isn't the only thread here. if you don't feel you should answer the question thats fine. but don't tread on the rights of others to discuss if they want. i respect your reason and the reasons of others here. but the purposeful derailing of threads so that other people can't or won't participate isn't a good thing most of all because the appropriate question is not the determination of a self elected few to determine. the mods allowed it to be posted and that should be enough. everyone should have a choice instead of worrying about ideas and chances for debate being turned down by people who think they know best what should be discussed and by whom. if you don't want to discuss it yourself --then don't. leave it to the rest of us. whats so hard about that?

if there is really nothing to be afraid of then why not just discuss it based on actual debate and not on personal attack of the op?


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## superodalisque (Dec 14, 2010)

HayleeRose said:


> Well, let me start off by saying, im not skinny, nor will I ever be skinny or even aspire to be skinny. I am not going to make my world revolve around what I should or shoulnt eat\do because im a fattie. Im almost 300lbs, I have no problem walking or standing for long periods of time. I can honestly say I probably love myself(including my body) more than most the people half my size. I find it insulting that you have been visiting the site for a while, as if its some "freak show" (like someone else said). Again, why come here in the first place?



hey there are elements here who are making this site out as a freak show and they like it that way so why the surprise? we have people who feel freakish in their body. we have people who feel like freaks because they like a fat body. we have people who are just freakily kinky and love it . they have no issue with that at all. we have a broad spectrum of people. 

i think the idea that all of the people here on this site feel or want to feel normal and should be treated as such is a nice one but thats not whats going on in reality. so if someone comes in and doesn't quite understand all of the fine points of how a portion of the people here feel it should really work who could blame them? maybe people have forgotten where exactly they are.

another thing is that a lot of people who support fat people still have the exact same feelings the poster does anyway. they are about as pro fat people as you can get but they still wonder why, if people are so miserable why do they do it?


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## mossystate (Dec 14, 2010)

superodalisque said:


> thats your take on it and thats a valid point but IMO it doesn't really matter if the person means to be negative. its a good question. why not give the people who haven't had the chance to sharpen their teeth on debates like this as practice for the outside world. i still think all of this shutting people down thing is stultifying and presumptuous of what other people want. sometimes a good debate actually based on the issue instead of personalities you have no way of truly knowing about is good for you.
> 
> this need for other people to agree with the "tone" approach and question before it gets considered is limiting to other people. whats the problem with just giving the people who want the chance to to discuss it? this isn't the only thread here. if you don't feel you should answer the question thats fine. but don't tread on the rights of others to discuss if they want. i respect your reason and the reasons of others here. but the purposeful derailing of threads so that other people can't or won't participate isn't a good thing most of all because the appropriate question is not the determination of a self elected few to determine. the mods allowed it to be posted and that should be enough. everyone should have a choice instead of worrying about ideas and chances for debate being turned down by people who think they know best what should be discussed and by whom. if you don't want to discuss it yourself --then don't. leave it to the rest of us. whats so hard about that?
> 
> if there is really nothing to be afraid of then why not just discuss it based on actual debate and not on personal attack of the op?



Maybe I am just following your line of thinking and not coddling people. If they want to speak up - they will, they should. Maybe I am following your line of thinking and am treating people like they are able. Why are you now so intent on knowing what's best, and when? Supero, come on. We are talking here about an over the top post. You know there have been conversations out here that many people would be more comfy not seeing. Could it be that there are simply not as many people as either of us would like wanting to talk about certain issues? Or that some folks will not be spoken to in a way that feels abusive to them? It's not always about the subject matter. It's not always that you are brave and others are scared. 

The OP, whomever she/he is, was not simply ' wondering '. You know this, and no amount of trying to scold people for not swallowing it ( to get to the ' real ' meat of the matter, of course ) is going to make some of the very valid and important conversations happen. If you are seeing that tone does matter to many, then maybe there is a different way to go about things? Ya think? Then, you ( general you ) will know just how scared, or interested, how many people are...or are not.


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## superodalisque (Dec 14, 2010)

mossystate said:


> Maybe I am just following your line of thinking and not coddling people. If they want to speak up - they will, they should. Maybe I am following your line of thinking and am treating people like they are able. Why are you now so intent on knowing what's best, and when? Supero, come on. We are talking here about an over the top post. You know there have been conversations out here that many people would be more comfy not seeing. Could it be that there are simply not as many people as either of us would like wanting to talk about certain issues?  Or that some folks will not be spoken to in a way that feels abusive to them? It's not always about the subject matter. It's not always that you are brave and others are scared.
> 
> The OP, whomever she/he is, was not simply ' wondering '. You know this, and no amount of trying to scold people for not swallowing it ( to get to the ' real ' meat of the matter, of course ) is going to make some of the very valid and important conversations happen. If you are seeing that tone does matter to many, then maybe there is a different way to go about things? Ya think? Then, you ( general you ) will know just how scared, or interested, how many people are...or are not.




theres a big difference in saying that the poster should maybe present it in another way or use different words and purposeful derailing of an entire thread just because... this thread was derailed like many others. sometimes extended context needs to be overlooked in order for the chance of discussion to occur. its not occurring now--thats my point. an opportunity was lost that did not have to be. its just as easy to take over a thread and answer it how you want and give it the tone you'd like it to have in your response. going by that the only really obviously negative or rude stuff i've seen has not been from the op. and even if it is meant badly for sure what about the opportunity to discuss with others and educate others. there are a lot of people reading who don't post and have no idea what the past posts of ops look like and don't care. there sure more people involved than just the op. maybe if there wasn't so much posturing about and focusing attention on the past politics and imagined motives of ops here overall some good discussions could get rolling. IMO the focus is just in the wrong place and it makes it even more likely that new people coming in will never post and take part fully in the forums. you can't imagine how many people have said they are afraid to because of all of the open hostility toward new people or those who don't tow a certain line. 

sometimes ferment gets great discussion going and interest happening that wouldn't otherwise. sanitized homogenized posts and threads get little readership and little interest and almost no participation because its all full of the acceptable platitudes that mean little or nothing. its easy to see. sure it may be acceptable to some but it gets nothing accomplished or discussed.

it is interesting that threads are derailed because people don't like the particular question. but my point is who is asking others to necessarily like the question or the tone? all participants are being asked is to respond or not respond. everyone doesn't have to like or agree with everything that gets discussed. if that were true nothing would---which is whats tending to happen. because as we have seen none of us will be able to come to a full agreement on whats appropriate in terms of question or tone. so that should be put aside and left up to people independently to choose to respond or not to respond to items without interference from those who feel they know best what everyone else really wants or finds acceptable without actually knowing. i know its a radical idea but just maybe they should be given the chance to actually decide for themselves?

i sometimes wonder who the trolls really are anyway. are they ones constantly here growling under the drawbridge or those just passing through on their journey in life trying to make some sense of things.


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## Heyyou (Dec 14, 2010)

superodalisque said:


> theres a big difference in saying that the poster should maybe present it in another way or use different words and purposeful derailing of an entire thread. this thread was derailed like many others. sometimes extended context needs to be overlooked in order for the chance of discussion to occur. its not occurring now--thats my point. an opportunity was lost. as we have seen sometimes ferment gets great discussion going and interest happening that wouldn't otherwise. sanitized homogenized posts and threads get little readership and little interest and almost no participation because its all full of the acceptable platitudes that mean little or nothing. its easy to see. sure it may be acceptable to some but it gets nothing accomplished or discussed.



All smiles and wordy. Holiday cheer is always good. :happy: I too find applications in literary expression great and rewarding, even to self. 

If it was me making the post, and it wasnt, I would have said "People can say what they wish." 

Sometimes your posts contain so many words to say an idea that re-reading is necessary. 



tonynyc said:


> one of the nicest people here...





> FTR, this fatty has looked inward and has not been found wanting (are you gonna eat that donut?) I'm pleased with me warts and all and don't need to navel gaze to such a degree that I know the cotton content in the lint that resides there. There are plenty of people in the world, on these forums and in this thread telling me what I'm doing wrong by not being a good scout and at the end of the day, it's my opinion that matters only.
> 
> I don't need to verify my existence to anyone and furthermore if I desire to share my opinion that the OP is bullshit and others should beware, that is as much my choice as it is for someone to feel free to continuously post and create schizophrenic threads questioning the particular shade of the color of the fat sky and how it affects our significantly enormous footprint on the world at large. Puns fully intended.
> 
> ...



Hard to argue with that. Fat and happy.



superodalisque said:


> I don't feel the need to be like you to like myself.



Neither do I! I would not like myself if i did.


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## HayleeRose (Dec 14, 2010)

The thing is is that this is a person who has nothing to do with this community and has came in generalizing everyone, basically saying that we dont know how to excersise, that we over eat, and that we cant ive normal lives. To say that we are all just too scared to discuss this topic is so off base. At least for me, and as ive seen others post, we dont need to justify why we are fat to anyone, rather its another fat person or not. And the fact that she hasnt even came back and had a "discussion" shows the OP really wasnt genuinley interested.


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## mossystate (Dec 14, 2010)

No opportunity was lost. A number of people who " derailed " the thread would be/are more than fine discussing more than a few Important Topics. Again, put it out there without particular attached ugly. It doesn't have to be blasted with Purell. And, instead of continuing to derail ( and there are many ways to derail a thread that have nothing to do with humor or pictures ) - why not just dive back in and discuss. Just be prepared for ways of responding that will upset you.


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## superodalisque (Dec 14, 2010)

HayleeRose said:


> The thing is is that this is a person who has nothing to do with this community and has came in generalizing everyone, basically saying that we dont know how to excersise, that we over eat, and that we cant ive normal lives. To say that we are all just too scared to discuss this topic is so off base. At least for me, and as ive seen others post, we dont need to justify why we are fat to anyone, rather its another fat person or not. And the fact that she hasnt even came back and had a "discussion" shows the OP really wasnt genuinley interested.



i understand what you're saying and i appreciate it. but,wasn't there a time when you had nothing to do with the community? isn't this a public forum not just for the fat? and haven't people made generalizations regarding the op without knowing for sure? lets face it the person got these generalizations from this site. read it and see. its still a valid question based on where we are and the discussions here. so why not clear it up then? i'm sure there are others who want it cleared up too. after all you don't have everyone here saying they eat a small number of calories and are exercising a lot. lets be real. hey, we aren't even allowed to discuss dieting or WLS here in the open. just because someone hasn't been here everyday reading every post and doesn't know the reality of being very fat themselves first hand doesn't mean they are the enemy. don't be surprised if people get a negative stereotype of us if we shut then down and exclude them. thats a kind of prejudice as well. maybe she didn't come back because she obviously wasn't welcome.


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## Heyyou (Dec 14, 2010)

mossystate said:


> No opportunity was lost. A number of people who " derailed " the thread would be/are more than fine discussing more than a few Important Topics. Again, put it out there without particular attached ugly. It doesn't have to be blasted with Purell. And, instead of continuing to derail ( and there are many ways to derail a thread that have nothing to do with humor or pictures ) - why not just dive back in and discuss. *Just be prepared for ways of responding that will upset you.*



I agree with this. Someone will present something you dont particularly like, and all that means is that they spoke it and that was fine. Nothing wrong in them doing so. This is true.


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## superodalisque (Dec 14, 2010)

mossystate said:


> No opportunity was lost. A number of people who " derailed " the thread would be/are more than fine discussing more than a few Important Topics. Again, put it out there without particular attached ugly. It doesn't have to be blasted with Purell. And, instead of continuing to derail ( and there are many ways to derail a thread that have nothing to do with humor or pictures ) - why not just dive back in and discuss. Just be prepared for ways of responding that will upset you.



maybe the people who derail are willing to discuss but what about people who might have liked to who are discouraged because they are new and might say the wrong thing because they don't know what lingo will set people off. like i said the regulars are not the only people here.

i'm used to being upset here. its old hat


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## Jes (Dec 14, 2010)

superodalisque said:


> this need for other people to agree with the "tone" approach and question before it gets considered is limiting to other people. whats the problem with just giving the people who want the chance to to discuss it? this isn't the only thread here. if you don't feel you should answer the question thats fine. but don't tread on the rights of others to discuss if they want. i respect your reason and the reasons of others here. but the purposeful derailing of threads so that other people can't or won't participate isn't a good thing most of all because the appropriate question is not the determination of a self elected few to determine. the mods allowed it to be posted and that should be enough. ?



I think this was an excellent post; gave me lots to think about.


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## TraciJo67 (Dec 14, 2010)

Here we go 'round the mulberry bush


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## mossystate (Dec 14, 2010)

superodalisque said:


> > maybe the people who derail are willing to discuss but what about people who might have liked to who are discouraged because they are new and might say the wrong thing because they don't know what lingo will set people off. like i said the regulars are not the only people here.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


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## superodalisque (Dec 14, 2010)

from an Ayn Rand nut like me:


The Wreckage of Consensus:

http://www.aynrand.org/site/PageServer?pagename=reg_ar_wreckage


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## olwen (Dec 14, 2010)

superodalisque said:


> thats your take on it and thats a valid point but IMO it doesn't really matter if the person means to be negative. its a good question. why not give the people who haven't had the chance to sharpen their teeth on debates like this as practice for the outside world. i still think all of this shutting people down thing is stultifying and presumptuous of what other people want. sometimes a good debate actually based on the issue instead of personalities you have no way of truly knowing about is good for you.
> 
> *this need for other people to agree with the "tone" approach and question before it gets considered is limiting to other people. whats the problem with just giving the people who want the chance to to discuss it?* this isn't the only thread here. if you don't feel you should answer the question thats fine. but don't tread on the rights of others to discuss if they want. i respect your reason and the reasons of others here. but the purposeful derailing of threads so that other people can't or won't participate isn't a good thing most of all because the appropriate question is not the determination of a self elected few to determine. the mods allowed it to be posted and that should be enough. everyone should have a choice instead of worrying about ideas and chances for debate being turned down by people who think they know best what should be discussed and by whom. if you don't want to discuss it yourself --then don't. leave it to the rest of us. whats so hard about that?
> 
> if there is really nothing to be afraid of then why not just discuss it based on actual debate and not on personal attack of the op?



I'm sorry, but I don't agree. How you talk to someone matters as much as what you say and you know that. Screaming at someone who's already angry and hyped up just escalates the problem, but approaching that same person with a calm voice and toned down body language will calm them down and they will be more receptive to what you have to say. Why should this basic social skill go out the window when discussion how we feel about our fat?

I could argue that you have been derailing this thread by telling everyone what you think we should say and how you think we should behave, rather than encouraging people--in some other tone, I might add--to actually discuss the question. Maybe reframe the question in another thread or take a poll asking people if they feel comfortable being seen thru a petri dish? I guarantee you, had the OP framed the question differently, we wouldn't be having this particular discussion. Tone matters whether you like it or not. 

What's so hard about you letting people say they don't feel comfortable answering questions about the deepest feelings to an unknown poster, and just leaving that be?


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## superodalisque (Dec 14, 2010)

olwen said:


> I'm sorry, but I don't agree. How you talk to someone matters as much as what you say and you know that. Screaming at someone who's already angry and hyped up just escalates the problem, but approaching that same person with a calm voice and toned down body language will calm them down and they will be more receptive to what you have to say. Why should this basic social skill go out the window when discussion how we feel about our fat?
> 
> I could argue that you have been derailing this thread by telling everyone what you think we should say and how you think we should behave, rather than encouraging people--in some other tone, I might add--to actually discuss the question. Maybe reframe the question in another thread or take a poll asking people if they feel comfortable being seen thru a petri dish? I guarantee you, had the OP framed the question differently, we wouldn't be having this particular discussion. Tone matters whether you like it or not.
> 
> What's so hard about you letting people say they don't feel comfortable answering questions about the deepest feelings to an unknown poster, and just leaving that be?



if they don't feel comfortable then don't answer without attempting intefere people who would like to. how difficult is that?


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## olwen (Dec 14, 2010)

superodalisque said:


> if they don't feel comfortable then don't answer without attempting intefere people who would like to. how difficult is that?



But you realize that at this point you are interfering yourself? You've been here long enough to know how threads like this tend to go. If you really really wanted to discuss it, you could have waited for the commotion to quiet down, stop posting to the thread and then started a new thread yourself in a more even tone. People know you and might feel more comfortable giving you honest answers rather than a perfect stranger.


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## CastingPearls (Dec 14, 2010)

May we never confuse honest dissent with disloyal subversion. ~ Dwight D. Eisenhower


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## superodalisque (Dec 14, 2010)

olwen said:


> But you realize that at this point you are interfering yourself? You've been here long enough to know how threads like this tend to go. If you really really wanted to discuss it, you could have waited for the commotion to quiet down, stop posting to the thread and then started a new thread yourself in a more even tone. People know you and might feel more comfortable giving you honest answers rather than a perfect stranger.



sorry sometimes i just get tired of the unnecessary commotion period. i might know but why does everyone need to put up with forum tantrums all of the time? why do we have to do all of this subterfuge and start whole other threads and wade through a minefield of wording and "tone" for people to pick apart for something that doesn't violate any forum rules just to discuss something we want to talk about . this stuff is tiresome and a ridiculous thoughtless waste of other people's time especially when you don't want to discuss something. its down right disrespectful of others.


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## olwen (Dec 14, 2010)

superodalisque said:


> sorry sometimes i just get tired of the unnecessary commotion period. i might know but why does everyone need to put up with forum tantrums all of the time? why do we have to do all of this subterfuge and start whole other threads and wade through a minefield of wording and "tone" for people to pick apart for something that doesn't violate any forum rules just to discuss something we want to talk about . this stuff is tiresome and a ridiculous thoughtless waste of other people's time especially when you don't want to discuss something. its down right disrespectful of others.



Bottom line, fatness is a deeply personal (and loaded) issue, and to most a negative one, and everyone has different coping skills. You can't expect everyone to behave the way you do about it. 

And come on, really, would you walk up to a perfect fat stranger and say "Well, I'm not as fat as you cause, you know I eat right and exercise, but like, I wonder, how can you stand to be just so so fat, like, isn't it hard and junk?" To me, that's more insulting than whatever else is going on in this thread. The thread started out from a place of disrespect. The question can be asked, but not in a dismissive way. I don't see what's so hard about knowing how to talk to people in a way that gets them to open up to you.


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## superodalisque (Dec 14, 2010)

olwen said:


> Bottom line, fatness is a deeply personal (and loaded) issue, and to most a negative one, and everyone has different coping skills. You can't expect everyone to behave the way you do about it.
> 
> And come on, really, would you walk up to a perfect fat stranger and say "Well, I'm not as fat as you cause, you know I eat right and exercise, but like, I wonder, how can you stand to be just so so fat, like, isn't it hard and junk?" To me, that's more insulting than whatever else is going on in this thread. The thread started out from a place of disrespect. The question can be asked, but not in a dismissive way. I don't see what's so hard about knowing how to talk to people in a way that gets them to open up to you.



fat isn't a license not to use logic from time to time. fat doesn't mean you can never control your emotions. fat is not a pass to always do as you like. fat does not make it okay to always have tantrums just because someone says something people may not agree with. we are all above 18 and just maybe we can act like it at least once in a while. meeting disrespect with worse disrespect is not better than the first act.

your analogy makes no sense. this is a forum. people discuss all kinds of touchy issues with strangers--like sex, fetishes, weight etc... where exactly is it that people think they are? and the poster didn't word the question that way --you did. maybe the need to recharacterize what the op said has more to do with how people here feel about how the public views them moreso than how they are actually viewed. its not the ops problem that people assume they are disgusting to anyone who asks them why they do fat if fat is hard as they make it out all over these forums. thats a perfectly reasonable question.

part of the reason people open up is that they are already open to communicate. finding reasons to hate before a discussion can be had is not exactly openess.


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## olwen (Dec 14, 2010)

superodalisque said:


> fat isn't a license not to use logic from time to time. fat doesn't mean you can never control your emotions. fat is not a pass to always do as you like. fat does not make it okay to always have tantrums just because someone says something people may not agree with. we are all above 18 and just maybe we can act like it at least once in a while. meeting disrespect with worse disrespect is not better than the first act.



Who said fat was an excuse to behave like a fool? This has nothing to do with fat actually. This could be a discussion about gender bias, or religion, or parenting skills. The topic at hand has nothing to do with how a person talks to another person. Why do you keep coming back to that anyhow? Seems like you are the only one assuming that all fat people use their size as an excuse to do whatever it is you think they shouldn't be doing. That right there is an offensive assumption because, again, we all handle this being fat thing differently and you would be less frustrated if you just understood and accepted that....I don't know what else to tell you.


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## superodalisque (Dec 14, 2010)

olwen said:


> Who said fat was an excuse to behave like a fool? This has nothing to do with fat actually. This could be a discussion about gender bias, or religion, or parenting skills. The topic at hand has nothing to do with how a person talks to another person. Why do you keep coming back to that anyhow? Seems like you are the only one assuming that all fat people use their size as an excuse to do whatever it is you think they shouldn't be doing. That right there is an offensive assumption because, again, we all handle this being fat thing differently and you would be less frustrated if you just understood and accepted that....I don't know what else to tell you.




it kinda sounded like you said so when you basically said fat was a sensitive issue and people handle it differently. in this context it gave me the impression that its felt that if someone dislikes something that somehow challenges fatness in people its okay to behave any way one wants on a forum. 

sometimes if people are too quick to take offense and are out of control they cut off discussion--simple as that. everyone has the right to get upset, not like something etc... but being calculated and purposeful about stopping discussion among others is not defensible especially when you don't have to take part fat or not. you are or were a mod. you know that if there was something truly openly offensive in what the op said it would have been removed. there wasn't. you know better than that. it was carefully worded. people just didn't like the opinion it expressed.


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## olwen (Dec 14, 2010)

superodalisque said:


> it kinda sounded like you said so when you basically said fat was a sensitive issue and people handle it differently. in this context it gave me the impression that its felt that if someone dislikes something that somehow challenges fatness in people its okay to behave any way one wants on a forum.
> 
> sometimes if people are too quick to take offense and are out of control they cut off discussion--simple as that. everyone has the right to get upset, not like something etc... but being calculated and purposeful about stopping discussion among others is not defensible especially when you don't have to take part fat or not. you are or were a mod. you know that if there was something truly openly offensive in what the op said it would have been removed. there wasn't. you know better than that. it was carefully worded. people just didn't like the opinion it expressed.


 
What was said really isn't the issue, it's the tone. If you really don't think the tone has anything to do with the tenor of the responses, then that's how you feel. Like I said, I don't know what else to tell you.


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## tonynyc (Dec 14, 2010)

So while this debate rages on... has the op found a Planet?????


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## superodalisque (Dec 14, 2010)

olwen said:


> What was said really isn't the issue, it's the tone. If you really don't think the tone has anything to do with the tenor of the responses, then that's how you feel. Like I said, I don't know what else to tell you.



no one has any way of knowing someone's tone unless they can hear them speak. saying that a person can be certain of someone's tone is bogus. its presumptuous to think a person truly know someone's tone-especially when they've never met them and know little about them at all. IMO its also pretty patronizing to tell someone you don't like their tone. its just another way of saying that you disapprove of what they said and they should stop. not liking or not agreeing with what someone says is not enough of a reason to try and stop them from stating their opinions. sometimes you just don't get to chose people's opinions or how they present them. as adults we should know that by now. and evenif everyone is right about the tone of the op it still doesn't mean that tone can't be taken.

what we do have control over is how we respond and how we are able to counter that way of thinking in ways that make at least some sort of rational sense not always based on knee jerk emotional reactions. its good practice for whats needed out in the real world. sticking fingers in ones ear and yelling la la la! doesn't make efficient or meaningful or mature debate especially when its just easier and more respectful to everyone else to just leave the room and let people deal with it who actually have something to say about it.


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## olwen (Dec 14, 2010)

superodalisque said:


> no one has any way of knowing someone's tone unless they can hear them speak. saying that a person can be certain of someone's tone is bogus. its presumptuous to think a person truly know someone's tone-especially when they've never met them and know little about them at all. IMO its also pretty patronizing to tell someone you don't like their tone. its just another way of saying that you disapprove of what they said and they should stop. not liking or not agreeing with what someone says is not enough of a reason to try and stop them from stating their opinions. sometimes you just don't get to chose people's opinions or how they present them. as adults we should know that by now. and evenif everyone is right about the tone of the op it still doesn't mean that can't tone can't be taken.
> 
> what we do have control over is how we respond and how we are able to counter that way of thinking in ways that make at least some sort of rational sense not always based on knee jerk emotional reactions. its good practice for whats needed out in the real world. sticking fingers in ones ear and yelling la la la! doesn't make efficient or meaningful or mature debate especially when its just easier and more respectful to everyone else to just leave the room and let people deal with it who actually have something to say about it.



We're not going to change each other's minds so let's just agree to disagree.


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## superodalisque (Dec 14, 2010)

olwen said:


> We're not going to change each other's minds so let's just agree to disagree.



i knewthat i couldn't. it was not my intention to change your mind , just not to let this thing go on continually unchallenged and to let people know how someone else might think about it. we can agree on disagreeing


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## LordQuas (Dec 16, 2010)

I love how people make assumptions about the tone of someone's post as if you actually HEARD the person speak the words in question. I find it fascinating that Dimensions preaches acceptance but so many members seem to be chomping at the bit to rip apart a thread like this instead of either just answering the question or not posting in the thread at all. Attacking the OP isnt constructive and just makes you look bitter and angry when you don't even give the person a chance to defend themselves.


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## LovelyLiz (Dec 16, 2010)

LordQuas said:


> I love how people make assumptions about the tone of someone's post as if you actually HEARD the person speak the words in question. I find it fascinating that Dimensions preaches acceptance but so many members seem to be chomping at the bit to rip apart a thread like this instead of either just answering the question or not posting in the thread at all. Attacking the OP isnt constructive and just makes you look bitter and angry when you don't even give the person a chance to defend themselves.



It is interesting to note, however, that the OP hasn't logged on since about an hour after she posted this thread. Some people will say this is because the negative harpies drove her away, some will say it's because she wasn't really interested in a two-way conversation where people questioned her premises. Either way, though, we can't give her a chance to "defend" herself if she doesn't log in and choose to engage.


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## superodalisque (Dec 16, 2010)

the op really shouldn't have to defend herself. the language was respectful. its not her fault that she is smaller than many of us here. thats not a personality trait, just her reality. if people are assuming she's making more of it then thats on them really and what they think of themselves v the thin. its not the problem of the op if some people take exception to the word obese etc... i also know people who don't like the word fat either. but i'm one of those who does not crumple if someone says that i am obese because by definition i am. for me it only describes my size , my BMI or maybe for some my morbidity index. but the word does not define me. so it doesn't bother me. my whole life does not consist of that. if the question was an interesting one as many have stated it doesn't really matter. ops are just a spur to conversation. no matter their tone they can't determine the tone in which we choose to answer. there is too much intolerance here and its not just coming from imagined outsiders. lack of acceptance goes both ways and the judgments go both ways. 

example: i have a personal friend who is not a super that made the mistake of mentioning leg infections and cellulitus in a post somewhere. another member took it to mean that the person was downing her since she had just dealt with a bout of it. she didn't realize that the person's mother was supersized and she had been taking care of her wounds for number of years at home. but because the other member's focus was always on herself, on her own struggle and people attacking her she couldn't conceive that another person could be making those statements except to ridicule her. you never know whats going on with people. sometimes its not about ridicule. even if it is there is someone out there who has the same question not based on any negative thoughts who could learn something of importance.

the question could be about trying to understand a loved one who is fat. we don't even give people a chance to learn anything here that might make another fat person's journey easier because we are so busy worrying about ourselves our own insecurities and our own pain. we act as though we are psychic and have all of the answers about other people we've never truly known and never met. thats big a problem. when people do that to us based around presumptions they have about what we think just because we are fat we often take offense. we might never come back to "defend" ourselves either. i don't see any difference in that and what has happened with the op. its evident many didn't want to have an actual conversation, just villify her and pick her apart. 

it shouldn't be someone else's problem if we are tender about fat issues. maybe at least those of us who've been around a while working on ourselves especially should be getting over that at least a little and growing a tougher skin. its probably a lot healthier than taking everything so personally that you can't have a conversation or even imagine that someone just might have another reason to ask a question than to make fun of a fat person. not everyone is looking to ridicule us. we aren't freaks to everyone believe it or not. there are some folks who might even think we are capable of answering a tough pointed question. even if someone was trying to be insulting why should they be able to make us so easily angry and willing to throw out the baby with the bathwater? we aren't weak little retarded children that always need to be handled gently like we are a special case. we're fully functioning human beings able to take care of ourselves. we are adults and perfectly capable of fielding anything anyone has to say point by point. we don't have to shut everyone up run away and close off a thread to do it either.

nothing the op said about what she noted in the forums was a lie anyway. so what was there really to defend?


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## LordQuas (Dec 26, 2010)

mcbeth said:


> It is interesting to note, however, that the OP hasn't logged on since about an hour after she posted this thread. Some people will say this is because the negative harpies drove her away, some will say it's because she wasn't really interested in a two-way conversation where people questioned her premises. Either way, though, we can't give her a chance to "defend" herself if she doesn't log in and choose to engage.



I completely agree with you and Im not really trying to defend the OP, I just get annoyed with how quickly some people jump to conclusions here without even trying to consider a point of view that isn't their own. You're absolutely right though, by not responding to the majority of the thread she all but invites the negativity that has ensued.


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