# My double standard



## ripley (Nov 21, 2006)

I've done a lot of thinking lately, on "sexy" pictures here at Dims (chat and forums). I've come to the conclusion that I have a double standard.

Society today is inundated with pictures of thin women in bra and panties, in very small bikinis, in all sorts of revealing outfits. I barely notice anymore...the Victoria's Secret girls are everywhere, wearing pretty much nothing, and I don't blink an eye. It has ceased to strike me as sexual, almost.

Here's where the double standard comes in: if I see scantily clad women on the sidebar in Dims chat or in random threads here (I'm NOT talking the paysite board) it shocks me a little, still, and seems very sexual. I don't look down on it, it's a personal choice, and I've shown some flesh myself. It just strikes me, the difference in myself, how mostly naked thin women fade into the background, and how a SS woman in a swimsuit seems overtly sexual.

Perhaps it's the rarity of seeing a big woman in a bikini, or perhaps it's the sheer volume of flesh. Why is a woman in a bikini nothing to notice, but a fat woman in one is really showing her stuff? Why is a woman in a tank top and panties shown on any random movie, but I'd feel kind of weird if I just randomly put one up here of me in that, like I was pandering, or not as...I don't know, as virtuous as I should be? That a thin woman showing her flat belly is just run of the mill, but a fat woman showing hers is sexual?

Is it that the men here are so eager to let us know that we are desirable, that they make more of an issue of it? Is it that, for me, I'm not used to my body engendering a sexual response?


Has anyone else thought about this? Please, please do not slam me...I am in no way saying it's wrong for people to put up whatever pictures they want to, or for men to like it when they do. I'm just wondering if anyone else sees a difference in how they respond, thin vs. fat.


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## mango (Nov 21, 2006)

*Gday Ripley...  


Perhaps in everyday life being inundated with the same images of thin female clones - the same repetitive shapes of human mannequins but with different heads, has made them seem quite ordinary.

A curvy full-figured woman will always appear more life-like, vivacious and sexual when compared to a skinny waif.

*


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## MisticalMisty (Nov 21, 2006)

mango said:


> *Gday Ripley...
> 
> 
> Perhaps in everyday life being inundated with the same images of thin female clones - the same repetitive shapes of human mannequins but with different heads, has made them seem quite ordinary.
> ...


Dammit..it won't let me rep you..but great answer Mango!


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## Fuzzy Necromancer (Nov 21, 2006)

Well, for one thing there's more flesh to be bared. =p

I think that the cultural inundation of skinny girl images and shock value of big girls could play a big enough role to explain it. It's also possible that you internally identify fat as sexually positive.


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## activistfatgirl (Nov 21, 2006)

I've noticed the same thing when I look at different pictures. One says " oh saucy!" and the other one gives me more of a "oh, whatever, no news here" reaction. 
Sure its a double standard when we judge women and guys for baring what society says is "too much flesh" in their bikinis or light wear. If we say, "put some clothes on you nasty person," that's where its negative and part of the struggle we fight for FatAccep and SA. I don't believe a fat person should cover up more for being fat, and I think we've got to just keep baring ourselves the way everyone else does and fight for that right (the right to bear arms, thighs, dimplyness).
The reaction itself is less problematic, I hope. I don't necessarily want to lose the awe and reverence I feel when I see a whole lot of flesh. When you see a whole lot of female belly flesh in a bikini its hard not to be stunned. That awe can be a good thing. I'm sure its a fine line like everything else.


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## This1Yankee (Nov 21, 2006)

ripley said:


> Society today is inundated with pictures of thin women in bra and panties, in very small bikinis, in all sorts of revealing outfits. I barely notice anymore...the Victoria's Secret girls are everywhere, wearing pretty much nothing, and I don't blink an eye. It has ceased to strike me as sexual, almost.
> 
> Here's where the double standard comes in: if I see scantily clad women on the sidebar in Dims chat or in random threads here (I'm NOT talking the paysite board) it shocks me a little, still, and seems very sexual. I don't look down on it, it's a personal choice, and I've shown some flesh myself. It just strikes me, the difference in myself, how mostly naked thin women fade into the background, and how a SS woman in a swimsuit seems overtly sexual.
> 
> ...



I COMPLETELY GET where you are coming from. I actually just had an argument/discussion with someone about how it's *different* to see a BBW/SSBW in a bathing suit (or thong) than a skinny girl.


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## TheSadeianLinguist (Nov 21, 2006)

One of Paris Hilton's boyfriends once described her as sexy, but not sexual. I think that's sort of the problem of a post-puritanical society. In our worshipful nature of "the sexual ideal," we make it non-sexual with overexposure and prety much saying over and over, "THIS IS NOT SEXUAL."


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## bigsexy920 (Nov 21, 2006)

I have to say that yes I've felt that way, even with posting some of the more revealing pics of myself. 

I think we may feel that way because we know we are posting them to attract attention,and because it is not something we would normally do. Whereas, what we see day to day is just a way of life for a "thin" person or a Victoria Secert model. 

So maybe its the reasons why WE post them that cause the double standard in our mind.


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## Green Eyed Fairy (Nov 21, 2006)

I have only been coming around since last August- first to the chat before the forum. Seeing some of the pics to the right of the screen was ummm..... shocking? at first. Why? I go to yahoo gaming lounges and other forums- no one post pics like that (or they're accused of being she-males if they do). One day it occurred to me- this is a place not only about "fat acceptance", it's also about personal freedoms here. We have been told we can't show ourselves without being looked down upon. Hell, I get told Im too fat with plenty of clothes on. 
Here, it's not like that. I show my cleavage or my belly in the chat forums sometimes now. It would bother me now, I think, if all the people in chat suddenly stopped showing their bodies there. Where else in the world do they get that kind of freedom? Or compliments? Or appreciation? So many of those pics are presented in an "artistic" way, as well. Im impressed with how many good pics are shown there and the creativeness they used to showcase themselves. More power to them *thumbs up*

Btw, Im not more shocked by a heavier body then a thin one- I would still hold my modesty "out in the world" if I weighed 110 pounds- that's just me.


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## ripley (Nov 21, 2006)

Green Eyed Fairy said:


> I
> Btw, Im not more shocked by a heavier body then a thin one- I would still hold my modesty "out in the world" if I weighed 110 pounds- that's just me.



That's just the thing...why do I feel that a thin woman in a bikini is just part of the scenery, but a supersized one is not quite "holding her modesty"? A bathing suit is a bathing suit, for Pete's sake, lol. Perhaps it's the illicitness of it for me...showing that much flesh is not something I'd do in my day-to-day life, so doing it here seems kind of risque and just a little bit naughty.

Another part of it too, I think, is that the FAs are so eager to show us that it's more than okay for us to bare a little, that it gets so much attention when we do. I don't know if a revealing picture ever goes by without comment from someone. Perhaps it's a little illicit for them too; it's not like they'd see random fat women in their everyday lives wearing not-so-much.

I'm not saying there is anything wrong with wearing revealing outfits in chat/forums pictures. I'm just trying to examine my own feelings about it.  The fact is, I do sometimes feel like I'm not "holding my modesty" when I bare a little. Why is my big fat belly immodest, when a flat one isn't? Why is there often a marked demarcation (I perceive one, in our community) between the women who do show a bit, and the women who don't?


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## Chimpi (Nov 21, 2006)

You bring up such a good topic, ripley, and such a good, thought provoking question.

I certainly fall guilty of letting a fat woman know she looks great in a certain revealing outfit. I try to put a personal spin on it, but that is because I'd rather know the person than the body. As it is, _the way I view it, and myself_, having a preference for fat women can certainly be a depictingly fetish-like preference. However, with that said, in my opinion, it is wrong to view it as different, regardless of the fact that it is viewed as different by many, many people (myself included, sometimes).

I have always said that fat people should not be treated differently than thin people, and a fat woman in a bikini (whose belly happens to hang over that bikini) should *not* be treated differently than the thin woman wearing the bikini (whose belly is non-existant). However, my personal double standard is that I view the fat woman in a very sexual manner, much, much, *much* more than the thin woman, but only because I find it attractive and arousing.

*shrugs* Many things could be treated differently in the world. Methinks it won't happen soon, but... maybe some day....

*EDIT:*


ripley said:


> That's just the thing...why do I feel that a thin woman in a bikini is just part of the scenery, but a supersized one is not quite "holding her modesty"? A bathing suit is a bathing suit, for Pete's sake, lol. Perhaps it's the illicitness of it for me...showing that much flesh is not something I'd do in my day-to-day life, so doing it here seems kind of risque and just a little bit naughty.



The way I perceive the answer to that question is... you see quite a majority of women these days (and a VERY fair amount of that majority are the thin women) showing off plenty of skin. The short shirts, the very short shorts, the sleeveless shirts, etc etc... The simple act of showing off a hanging belly is merely disgusting and apart from what is proper. Something like that.... Of course, the last sentence is certainly not MY opinion, but methinks it is an overwhelming feeling among people. *sigh* You're right. If two woman standing side-by-side, wearing the exact same outfit (two different sizes), one a size 2, and one a size 32, are showing the very same skin areas, just one has a lot more of it. Nothing is different, other than the size. There's just a lot more to view on the 32-size woman.



ripley said:


> Another part of it too, I think, is that the FAs are so eager to show us that it's more than okay for us to bare a little, that it gets so much attention when we do. I don't know if a revealing picture ever goes by without comment from someone. Perhaps it's a little illicit for them too; it's not like they'd see random fat women in their everyday lives wearing not-so-much.



You're quite right. The Paysite Boards are very popular, and most, if not all of the responses are complimenting and hoarsing to the next article of clothing that can come off, if you know what I mean. But you'll find the hoards of men who root for those pictures on all walks of life, fat or thin. It is only a big deal when you yourself make it a big deal, whether that thought came from your own perception of what is "modest", or what another person says is "modest" or "sexy". I say, you can control the world in your mind. It is that easy!



ripley said:


> Why is my big fat belly immodest, when a flat one isn't? Why is there often a marked demarcation (I perceive one, in our community) between the women who do show a bit, and the women who don't?



To me, personally, that flat one is very immodest, and the fat one is very sexy. Neither of them are natural, and one I would rather see than the other (and that same one I would of course rather view in a certain mindset moreso than a clothed version of that bellly). But maybe that's just me. 
I will not comment on your last question.


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## Tad (Nov 21, 2006)

ripley said:


> That's just the thing...why do I feel that a thin woman in a bikini is just part of the scenery, but a supersized one is not quite "holding her modesty"?



Here is a hypothesis for consideration. Im not convinced that this is the reason, but I think that the thought that it could be part of the reason is fairly provocative.

I think in our society fleshiness is considered sexual or at least sensual, and part of the cult of thinness is some bastard child of prudishness and a strict old-fashioned type of morality where all things sexual or even sensual were frowned upon. When most models are seen in lingerie or a bikini it is not actually that provocative, because they are so thin as to not be sensual seeming. In a way they are like a child, with no real curves or size. Therefore when someone who is all toned wears almost nothing, what they are actually flaunting is mostly how asexual they are, it is a way of saying Im better because Ive driven all the devils of sensuality out of my body.

When someone exposes fleshy areas, on the contrary, it draws attention to their sensuality. It is somewhat as if they are saying Im making it impossible to ignore that I am a sensual being. I eat, I have curves that are attractive and sensual and bring sex to mind. In north American culture (at least, it extends further too) there is a strong reflex to condemn this, much like if you see someone walking down the sidewalk with a bottle of whiskey, or you see a couple kissing passionately in public. Our society does not condone sensual pleasures, and whether we realize it or not most of us have internalized that judgment.

Feel free to tear this hypothesis apart. So long as you dont make it personal, I wont take it personally.

Regards;

Ed


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## GeorgeNL (Nov 21, 2006)

Good question! Very good question! 

The answer I don't know, but I have bit my own theory. Often I asked myself why does a bbw/ssbbw attract me so much more then a thin woman? And I think, one part could the same one, as where your double standard is derived from: A BBW looks much more feminine, much more a woman. The characteristics of a female body that most men find attractive, are more pronounced for BBW (shapely arms, wide hips, shapely legs, boobs).The litteral meaning of manequin is "man-woman" e.g. a woman with male-body shape (e.g. flat, not feminine). If they cut their hair, it's hard to guess their gender. While when you see a BBW showing off, you see really a woman, no question.

I always associate (often, but not always with good reason) a BBW with a warm caring personality. A warm softness on the inside that is reflected by the same softness on the outside.

But on the other side, if you look at FAs, you see a mixture, with a relative high number of artists and engineers. Is that a coincidence? I used to believe that the reason is that we're the kind of men that are not sensitive to fashion. 
However, there is second common characteristic artists and engineers share: according to psychologists, we are very much on the male side of the spectrum. We often develop our social skill at a late age, like technique, and indeed, don't care much for fashion. No wonder we preferthe most female kind of women. 

Hope that makes a little sense.

George


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## Green Eyed Fairy (Nov 21, 2006)

ripley said:


> That's just the thing...why do I feel that a thin woman in a bikini is just part of the scenery, but a supersized one is not quite "holding her modesty"? A bathing suit is a bathing suit, for Pete's sake, lol. Perhaps it's the illicitness of it for me...showing that much flesh is not something I'd do in my day-to-day life, so doing it here seems kind of risque and just a little bit naughty.
> 
> Another part of it too, I think, is that the FAs are so eager to show us that it's more than okay for us to bare a little, that it gets so much attention when we do. I don't know if a revealing picture ever goes by without comment from someone. Perhaps it's a little illicit for them too; it's not like they'd see random fat women in their everyday lives wearing not-so-much.
> 
> I'm not saying there is anything wrong with wearing revealing outfits in chat/forums pictures. I'm just trying to examine my own feelings about it.  The fact is, I do sometimes feel like I'm not "holding my modesty" when I bare a little. Why is my big fat belly immodest, when a flat one isn't? Why is there often a marked demarcation (I perceive one, in our community) between the women who do show a bit, and the women who don't?




Ripley, I really do think you might have answered part of your question yourself in your opening post- you're used to seeing it... EVERYWHERE and have become "desensitized"? to some degree. However, us big girls always cover up (most of the time) so it takes getting accustomed to. But think about this, arent great big boobs in the bikini always getting a helluva lot more attention than the teeny ones when we're talking about "thin women only"? Could it be the same thing with the rest of the body - there's a lot more to notice, hence you do?


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## LillyBBBW (Nov 21, 2006)

Like you, I don't really know. I'm trying to place things in a different perspective in the view that maybe someone places a picture of a 98 year old woman in a thong bikini in her avatar. Paris Hilton in a thong is expected. We expect her to show off what she's got because we're conditioned to think it's something to be proud of and a thing of beauty. We don't think less of her as a person for wearing a revealing outfit. (we think less of her for other reasons but that's another issue)

The old lady however is shocking. Here's a shriveled old lady posing proudly in a sexy red bikini and most people, though they would not say so outwardly, would react differently to her. Her mental state might come into question. Maybe she's attention starved. Maybe she's being exploited and she needs the money. Some would find it funny, etc. Her body is not what one would consider ideal and yet even that body is just a body. It's niether evil or offensive but this woman is not allowed to be confident and proud and her motivations for being seen are suspect. 

I don't know I'm just thinking out loud about this. My sister this summer got called into her bosses office and lectured about her attire because of a shirt she wore one day. It was a shirt she ran out and bought after a coworker told her where to purchase it. This co worker wore it several times in the office to raves and compliments all over the place which inspired my sister go go out and get one herself in another color. My sister's body is seen as much more provocative than the coworker's teeny cheerleader type frame so her choice of clothing and motivations for wearing it were called into question but the co-worker was never spoken to and wore the shirt several times since the incident without a mention. 




ripley said:


> That's just the thing...why do I feel that a thin woman in a bikini is just part of the scenery, but a supersized one is not quite "holding her modesty"? A bathing suit is a bathing suit, for Pete's sake, lol. Perhaps it's the illicitness of it for me...showing that much flesh is not something I'd do in my day-to-day life, so doing it here seems kind of risque and just a little bit naughty.
> 
> Another part of it too, I think, is that the FAs are so eager to show us that it's more than okay for us to bare a little, that it gets so much attention when we do. I don't know if a revealing picture ever goes by without comment from someone. Perhaps it's a little illicit for them too; it's not like they'd see random fat women in their everyday lives wearing not-so-much.
> 
> I'm not saying there is anything wrong with wearing revealing outfits in chat/forums pictures. I'm just trying to examine my own feelings about it.  The fact is, I do sometimes feel like I'm not "holding my modesty" when I bare a little. Why is my big fat belly immodest, when a flat one isn't? Why is there often a marked demarcation (I perceive one, in our community) between the women who do show a bit, and the women who don't?


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## NFA (Nov 21, 2006)

Its a good point that FA's don't see fat women scantly clad through the normal course of their day. I know, that sounds obvious, but think about it. This is something that "Thin Admirers" can enjoy every day of their life. If that's what we call "normal", isn't it possible that lacking these visuals cues can have a negative impact? I'm not sure. Certainly, those images in popular culture do promote objectification of women and that's not a good thing. But, it hardly seems reasonable that either men or women should be completely deprived of any sexually appealing images. Surely a working balance can be struck. One shouldn't have to look a fat body as something unknown or alien, but that is precisely how it is presented in pop culture, most severely for fat women.

Showing that "forbidden" image here can be liberating. Both for fat women and for FA's. A degree of shock or giddiness might be expected, but I can say that it is something one can become refreshingly used to. Somethings will be different, though. I'd suggest that fat sexuality at its best eroticizes the entire body. I think the more "common" sexuality tends to be very localized and while there are expectations surpassing those specific zones, they aren't as much sexual as they are aesthetic. With FA's, it is the fat we admire and the fat can be anywhere. Indeed, it is most commonly associated with body parts our "common" culture does not view as sexualized. A fat belly is functionally different from a fat belly in this context. Fat thighs are something different from lean ones. Heck, even arms can be a very legitmate sexualized area to an FA while a "thin admirer" may think nothing of this. So, I would say some recognition of this nature isn't necessarily a bad thing. At the same time, even FA's are products of our culture. Even if these parts may have a greater meaning with FA's, that doesn't make them the same thing as the conventionally forbidden areas as detirmined by our common culture. While FA's may look at the rest of the body with more than an aesthetic interest, it doesn't mean that its the same thing as the more conventionally sexual parts of the body. Simply put, even if a fat belly sexually intrigues an FA, its not the same thing bearing one's nether regions. I think what would be the best approach is to simply try to work to normalize the fat body and the exhibition of it. Fat women shouldn't have to cover up to meet the needs of a fat-negative culture. While popular culture's attitudes toward the female body are genuinely dehumanizing in many ways, the attitude towards a fat body is dehumanizing in a different way. Neither are ideal and we should try to work towards an equality. Both between genders and among bodies.


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## QuasimodoQT (Nov 21, 2006)

Hmmm....
Yep, it's ACREAGE.
Extra bumps and rolls,
extra crevices.
Whole new map of the body.

So it's more personal, more unknown.

Good question, Ripley.


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## ripley (Nov 21, 2006)

These are some great responses, guys! Really made me think. 

Am I though only one that feels that there is a stigma against women who show a little around dims, in relation to those who don't? (I'm not talking paysite models, so please don't take the thread there.) It seems to be mostly amongst the women...I know that I have felt jealous before, in chat, when I'm talking to a nice guy, and if a woman puts up a scantily clad pic, suddenly I'm a dog, lol. There seems to be a LOT of pressure on women in our community to show a little something. I've known women in chat that say they won't show sexy pics, but then after awhile you see them come up on the sidebar with one...it's like they feel that's the only way to remain "competitive." I don't think there is anything wrong if a woman does that, but it bothers me that around these parts it seems to garner such a huge percentage of attention, and that we as women feel we need to compete with one another in that way. 

I've put up "sexy" pics myself, late at night in chat when there are few people there, and I have participated in two SYAFADD threads in the clubhouse. I have conflicted feelings about it. Part of me says that it's not really a big deal, that I have never shown anything that you couldn't see on any public beach. Part of me knows that some judge me negatively for doing it. It's a double-edged sword...is it that I am confident enough to show my body, or is it that my self-esteem is so bad that I need that attention from others?

When I do show pics like that, I don't show my face. This is because I fear the pics finding their way to some less kind part of the internet, or of someone in my real life seeing me in ways that I wouldn't go about in front of them. I know that I don't show my face for safety reasons...but having up just a body shot makes me feel weird. Like a nameless object...just a pretty arrangement of fat.

I do find it rediculous when a member of our community says they will never put up pics like that...then does an about face, and WHAMMO! all of a sudden they are doing it, and even hosting a Yahoo! group so they can do it even more. :blink: It goes to show you how much power the feelings involved in it can have, to cause such about-faces.


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## Fuzzy Necromancer (Nov 21, 2006)

I understand that, but I don't think the pressure is a conscious effort. I think it's just the natural result of a forum based off a magazine dedicated to big women showing off.


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## Ericthonius (Nov 22, 2006)

ripley said:


> I've done a lot of thinking lately, on "sexy" pictures here at Dims (chat and forums). I've come to the conclusion that I have a double standard.
> 
> [...]
> 
> Here's where the double standard comes in: if I see scantily clad women on the sidebar in Dims chat or in random threads here (I'm NOT talking the paysite board) it shocks me a little, still, and seems very sexual. I don't look down on it, it's a personal choice, and I've shown some flesh myself. * It just strikes me, the difference in myself, how mostly naked thin women fade into the background, and how a SS woman in a swimsuit seems overtly sexual.*



Welcome to _MY_ world.

It's not a 'Double-Standard', it's a preference.

I could further respond with the very Professor Higgins-ish, "By Jove... I think she's got it.", or somesuch. Yet, that wouldn't be complete. That would denote understanding but might stop at the cerebral, at cognition, whereas this is much deeper, this is something more. This is _THIS_... 

This is a whole different, "_Weltanschauung_." A 'World-View', of a greater magnatude. A way of seeing beyond looking. An outlook that enters the realm of translation or transcription in the biochemical sense of the words, of one cell talking to another.

_THIS_, is who we are...


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## LillyBBBW (Nov 22, 2006)

There are people who like to show off, I'm one of them. I have taken tons of photos of myself just for fun, some I have never shown to anyone. I simply did them because I like to do that kind of thing. Not everybody is like that but some of us are. The only thing that separates me from a paysite model is semantics. I don't want to deal with the hassle, the requests, the crooks, etc. and I don't have time to keep feeding the unquenchable furnace with updates and ill fitted clothing. What I do also effects others in my family so I'm concerned about them. 

I wasn't dropped on my head as a baby, sexually abused or surrounded by poor role models or whatever the jargon is these days - I'm just a ham and nothing more. There are people who are intelligent, worthwhile and normal in every way except that they really really like to do this kind of thing. People who don't have any desire for it at all can't relate and that's fine, but there's really nothing more to it than that. However as soon as someone posts a bikini photo, that's 12 years of college out the window for her. She could have written a bestseller about quantum physics, she could be the best friend anyone could ever have, she could have discovered a powerful formula for the cure for cancer - a stigma is taped to her forehead. She's a bottom feeder and a sleezeball just because she likes something, worse if she acts on it and/or gets paid for it which has nothing at all to do with her intelligence or value as a human being. So the woman has two choices. Imprison yourself in the thoughts and expectations of others or think for yourself and live your life. Kudos to _anyone_ who chooses the latter weather you want to pose in a bikini or you don't. 

I'm bothered by the idea that someone may feel pressured by my bikini pic being posted. I don't want anyone feeling like that. On the one hand I think if you're talking to a guy and that guy suddenly drops you as soon as Soozie Suntan walks in, I'd say Soozie did you a favor. What a jerk! On the other, I've seen this general idea that women who post bikini pics are doing so to hook men. Some people are doing it for that reason, no question. But most people are not. Some are doing it as a personal act of liberation for themselves and where else can they do that but here? If people like it that's even better, but it's not intended to be a man grabber from all the other people who choose not to do that. And it's not intended to create a competitive atmosphere. It really distrubs me that this is what it's doing. 

I really don't know what the solution is. The paysite board was put together to try to alleviate some of that but what of the rest of us who don't have a pay site and still want to post from time to time? I really don't know the answer.


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## Green Eyed Fairy (Nov 22, 2006)

ripley said:


> I've put up "sexy" pics myself, late at night in chat when there are few people there, and *I have participated in two SYAFADD threads in the clubhouse. * I have conflicted feelings about it. Part of me says that it's not really a big deal, that I have never shown anything that you couldn't see on any public beach. Part of me knows that some judge me negatively for doing it. It's a double-edged sword...is it that I am confident enough to show my body, or is it that my self-esteem is so bad that I need that attention from others?
> 
> When I do show pics like that, I don't show my face. This is because I fear the pics finding their way to some less kind part of the internet, or of someone in my real life seeing me in ways that I wouldn't go about in front of them. I know that I don't show my face for safety reasons...but having up just a body shot makes me feel weird. Like a nameless object...just a pretty arrangement of fat.
> 
> I do find it rediculous when a member of our community says they will never put up pics like that...then does an about face, and WHAMMO! all of a sudden they are doing it, and even hosting a Yahoo! group so they can do it even more. :blink: It goes to show you how much power the feelings involved in it can have, to cause such about-faces.



what is that and where is the clubhouse? 

*gets camera out and takes pics of cleavage* 

J/K but seriously want to know what SYAFADD and the clubhouse is...


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## Eclectic_Girl (Nov 22, 2006)

Green Eyed Fairy said:


> what is that and where is the clubhouse?
> 
> *gets camera out and takes pics of cleavage*
> 
> J/K but seriously want to know what SYAFADD and the clubhouse is...



"Show Your Ass For A Day" Day

The Clubhouse is a special section of the boards that you get access to when you contribute funds to offset the costs of running the site ($30 donation, I think?). SYAFADD is a way of giving people motivation to donate. Every once in a while, individuals post pictures of various body parts (doesn't have to be your ass, but can't show more than would be allowed on the paysite board), and the mods take them down the next day. Because they're in a restricted area, they're not searchable by Google and not viewable by anyone who hasn't contributed. It's the only way I would ever post a picture of my ass on the Internet.

The rest of the time, the motivation to join the clubhouse is the sparkling conversation, which tends to be a little less guarded because it's a troll-free zone.


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## Tarella (Nov 22, 2006)

Hi Ripley,

I have experienced this myself even when I was a smaller BBW. Years ago I can distinctly recall a night that my two sisters and I were all headed out to the same dance, we were all wearing almost exactly the same type of outfits (shorter mini shirt, short sleeved tank top, and a shirt over top). My mom took a look at my outfit and said, "You can't wear that, that top and skirt are too revealing". I waited for her to suggest my sisters' outfits were also too revealing but she didnt say a thing to them. I balked at her suggestion and after a few minutes said, "Why is it that I am wearing a too revealing outfit but Lorelei and Tanya, who are wearing almost the same exact thing, you never mentioned anything to them??". She said, " Well, its because you are a bigger girl Tara. You will look nicer with something more conservative". At that point I just scoffed at her and said I was wearing what I had on.

Having two younger sisters who were on the smaller and thinner side often gave me glimpses into many double standards that exist for BBW's. I think its because when we are curvy, we exude a sexuality even without trying. The curves are more apparent and more visible than same clad or unclad thinner peers no matter what we try.


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## Green Eyed Fairy (Nov 22, 2006)

Eclectic_Girl said:


> "Show Your Ass For A Day" Day
> 
> The Clubhouse is a special section of the boards that you get access to when you contribute funds to offset the costs of running the site ($30 donation, I think?). SYAFADD is a way of giving people motivation to donate. Every once in a while, individuals post pictures of various body parts (doesn't have to be your ass, but can't show more than would be allowed on the paysite board), and the mods take them down the next day. Because they're in a restricted area, they're not searchable by Google and not viewable by anyone who hasn't contributed. It's the only way I would ever post a picture of my ass on the Internet.
> 
> The rest of the time, the motivation to join the clubhouse is the sparkling conversation, which tends to be a little less guarded because it's a troll-free zone.



ahhh sounds very nice- thanks


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## ripley (Nov 22, 2006)

Lilly,

Perhaps it's just me that feels sense of competition or whatever in photos. I have heard others say though, that if they have up no pic or a face pic only, that the private messages dry up and blow away...show a little skin, and all of a sudden you're the belle of the ball. Speaking for myself, it both makes me want to do it, and also makes me feel a bit jaded and cynical and stupid.

Thanks for your reply. You often give me a new way to look at things, and I love that. 

I think sometimes men have a sense of entitlement regarding pictures. You can say "Oh, those are just the ones who are jerks anyway, be happy you get a warning" but the men who say to me "Any more pics?" in the first few minutes of conversation are innumerable. Sometimes I get contrary and don't want to put up a sexy pic just to spite them.


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## Green Eyed Fairy (Nov 22, 2006)

^^ Something funny to add Ripley- I have a yahoo photo album that I sometimes give the link to people if they express an interest in seeing pics of me.
A man in chat messaged me a while back to compliment my pic. I was flattered and chatted with him a few minutes so when he mentions seeing more pics, I gave him the link to the album. Joisey Tomata from the chat is my stepsister in reality- some of her pics were in the album.
It was funny when the guy PMs me to tell me he likes the pics that had her name under them best but didnt have much to say about the others (MY pics) 
hehehehehehhehehe- I wont ever forget that


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## Pearlover90000 (Nov 22, 2006)

I have often thought about this, and do get what you are saying.

BBW's in bikini's are showing much more woman flesh, and are sexual by nature of that shape; where as a victoria's secret model has long lines and no shape when compared to that of a bbw.

I don't know if that makes sense. 







ripley said:


> These are some great responses, guys! Really made me think.
> 
> Am I though only one that feels that there is a stigma against women who show a little around dims, in relation to those who don't? (I'm not talking paysite models, so please don't take the thread there.) It seems to be mostly amongst the women...I know that I have felt jealous before, in chat, when I'm talking to a nice guy, and if a woman puts up a scantily clad pic, suddenly I'm a dog, lol. There seems to be a LOT of pressure on women in our community to show a little something. I've known women in chat that say they won't show sexy pics, but then after awhile you see them come up on the sidebar with one...it's like they feel that's the only way to remain "competitive." I don't think there is anything wrong if a woman does that, but it bothers me that around these parts it seems to garner such a huge percentage of attention, and that we as women feel we need to compete with one another in that way.
> 
> ...


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## GeorgeNL (Nov 23, 2006)

ripley said:


> Perhaps it's just me that feels sense of competition or whatever in photos.



Oh oh, that competition between women, I've seen it often, never really understood it. Anyway, it's physical attraction only, which helps us getting over our shyness in making the first contact. But I hope it doesn't have the last word in our search for a soul mate.

One of the best sites I know, that celebrates the beauty of BBW is this one:

The Beautycurve


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## Emma (Nov 23, 2006)

Had to unlurk to say this:

I think it's because FAs have sexualised the belly and other fleshy places on BBW while on a thin woman the only places the men seem to sexualise are the boobs, ass and cooch. So seeing a womans belly out and proud here is like seeing someone posting topless at another board. 


And gone..


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## Les Toil (Nov 23, 2006)

Hey Ripley. I think the reason there's more of a reaction when we see a scantilly-clad SS woman over a thin woman is because we've been used to seeing half-naked thin chicks since we can remember. Hell, women (of any size) wouldn't be asked to put their breasts away to feed their babies on a plane if naked breasts weren't so stigmatized in this country. 

And I also agree part of the reaction is because the SS woman has more flesh to show which I suppose sexualizes her more in the eyes of most people.

And I'm sure all of these points were already covered previously in this thread.


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## lestamore (Nov 23, 2006)

Ericthonius said:


> It's not a 'Double-Standard', it's a preference.
> 
> This is a whole different, "_Weltanschauung_." A 'World-View', of a greater magnatude. A way of seeing beyond looking. An outlook that enters the realm of translation or transcription in the biochemical sense of the words, of one cell talking to another.
> 
> _THIS_, is who we are...



I kindof agree with this guy. In general I think it is less an issue of Fat/Non-Fat as it is Personally Sexualized/Aesthetic

When we see someone that we can imagine having sex with, or that we can imagine having sex as, its gonna be a different experience than seeing someone that is as separate from our sexuality as a cartoon. 

Part of this is deffinately the preference that we have for seeing fat bodies. If thats what turns us on we will think of it differently.

Also, I think there is a personal context issue too. I think that its easy to not to relate to model type girls because they are set apart culturally. However, if we did relate to them more, maybe we wouldn't be so concerned about showing what we've got. However, seeing a girl in a chat room, you can imagine that thats the kind of girl you could actually be with.. or be.

So, its a much more vivid sexual picture than seeing a naked model who 1. Isn't arousing to you and 2. You can't imagine as a person you'd ever meet.

There is also a point about how for FA's the whole body is sexualized.


As for naked pictures in chatrooms and elsewhere..
I think its a personal choice. I love taking these pictures. I love showing. I post them on a different web forum on a regular basis. Infact I discovered this board through that one. I am not shy about it. To a certain degree I don't really even care if anyone knows it, although there is deffinately a cultural stigma.. I wouldn't want a prospective employer to see my naked pics before s/he reads my resume. And I can see why people would be worried about it. I wouldn't tell my parents because they would deffinately be worried, but I'm not afraid of being morally judged. To me that is a large part of what feminism is about. I can own my sexuality.. do what makes me happy and not feel guilty because anyone disagrees.

As for competician in chat rooms.. That does suck, because it is a personal choice whether showing off is what you want. However, since the whole premise of getting BBWs and FAs together is based in the idea that a FA is likely to find a big girl's body sexually appealing, it seems strange to me that some people seem to not expect the guys to be looking. If they were going for a non-sexual experience why wouldn't they be in a chat room based on chess or fishing or rock music? To a certain degree I expect guys to be here to be turned on. 

It is a great community and absolutely there are FA's who want a greater experience than just ogling. I bet a majority of FA posters wouldn't be here if it wasn't for the awesomness of the girls that inhabit the sexy bodies around here. However, in a chat room I would expect a lot of guys to be more interested in imagining themselves with a hot girl as opposed to getting to know anyone. Naked pics facilitate this. Personally I don't mind this kind of contact. I am in it a bit for the same stuff I think sometimes.

Just realize that the guys who are being rude are really only in it for themselves and their fantasies. Whether they are worthwhile individuals or jerks otherwise, you have to take it or leave it on their terms.


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## LillyBBBW (Nov 24, 2006)

Entitlement is right. There are men out there who have NO pic in their profile, no description, etc. and will ask if you have pictures beyond the fifty you already have posted in your profile and will think you're stuck up if you won't talk to them. The same winners who are bugging you for pics are bugging us half naked chicks too and they don't mysteriously transform into the catch of the day before us either. They're just as jerky if not more so. I feel no remorse in having a guy like that think poorly of me. They assume we all put our pictures up just for them and for no other reason because of course our very existence revolves around them. *eyeroll* To them I say don't go away mad, just go away. 

If it's any consolation, I hear time and time again that nice guys pick nice girls first and are usually made uncomfortable by us more revealing chicks so you definitely have the advantage over us. Apparently there aren't that many nice guys out there but of the few, most of them are looking for the girl next door and not the display model. To get a guy like that I would have to lie about who I am which wouldn't make either of us happy. For me, being happy is what it's all about. I'd rather laugh in the light than cry in the dark.




ripley said:


> Lilly,
> 
> Perhaps it's just me that feels sense of competition or whatever in photos. I have heard others say though, that if they have up no pic or a face pic only, that the private messages dry up and blow away...show a little skin, and all of a sudden you're the belle of the ball. Speaking for myself, it both makes me want to do it, and also makes me feel a bit jaded and cynical and stupid.
> 
> ...


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## EtobicokeFA (Nov 25, 2006)

LillyBBBW said:


> Entitlement is right. There are men out there who have NO pic in their profile, no description, etc. and will ask if you have pictures beyond the fifty you already have posted in your profile and will think you're stuck up if you won't talk to them. The same winners who are bugging you for pics are bugging us half naked chicks too and they don't mysteriously transform into the catch of the day before us either. They're just as jerky if not more so. I feel no remorse in having a guy like that think poorly of me. They assume we all put our pictures up just for them and for no other reason because of course our very existence revolves around them. *eyeroll* To them I say don't go away mad, just go away.
> 
> If it's any consolation, I hear time and time again that nice guys pick nice girls first and are usually made uncomfortable by us more revealing chicks so you definitely have the advantage over us. Apparently there aren't that many nice guys out there but of the few, most of them are looking for the girl next door and not the display model. To get a guy like that I would have to lie about who I am which wouldn't make either of us happy. For me, being happy is what it's all about. I'd rather laugh in the light than cry in the dark.


Unfortunately, I guess there will always be members of my gender that can't see women beyond their sexually fantasies, to see them as real people. And, of behalf of the nice guys, we apologize for the rest of our gender. 

As for the idea that most nice guys want the girl next door, well that is not exactly true! To some nice guys, the thought of asking out the display model make them feel like the school nerd asking out the head cheerleader.


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## Green Eyed Fairy (Nov 25, 2006)

I'm glad to find out that Im not the only woman who feels the same way Lilly does about "unknown" people approaching and not willing to share information while bombarding you with questions. It makes you feel like a horse that is up for sale- check my teeth, my hooves, etc and dont be obligated to prove yourself "worthy" of my attention in the meantime. 
Most of the jerks that usually did stuff like the aforementioned to me weren't from dimensions but other realms of the internet when I had nothing but a facial pic displayed so I dont "blame" it on "revealing" pics.
Some people are just jerks- women can be asses, too, so I dont see the need for any man to apologize for other men- Im not taking responsibility for the actions of other women so I dont think men should either.
Just my opinion and I love to read Lilly's posts- she has a nice, logical, well-thought-out way in her posts


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## treesntrees (Nov 25, 2006)

As a newbie I guess Ill express some of my initial reactions. I discovered the dims after telling myself for years and years that no one would ever love me or find me sexually attractive if I gained weight and despite my best efforts I gained and keep gaining. On the one hand when I first came to dims I was shocked at how many beautiful big women there were posting and chatting to each other (and perhaps a little saucily) that I immediately wanted to join up as well as quite a few FAs out there too. It looked to me pretty clean (unlike a lot of porn sites I saw that demeaned and objectified the women's fat and for some reason I just really object to seeing penises in porn anyway but I can't stand the language around it either). It occured to me also that I felt this immense pressure to show myself - to post a pic. I don't have a digital camera so I can't do so easily right now but it definitely came to me that no one would really want to talk to me unless they knew I was a living breathing person and since I've come into fat liberation so recently I've also been pondering the idea of getting on a pay-site and putting up some tasteful artful pics of my fab fat self but I feel that that's more and more about my growing comfort with myself than other people.


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## ripley (Nov 25, 2006)

LillyBBBW said:


> If it's any consolation, I hear time and time again that nice guys pick nice girls first and are usually made uncomfortable by us more revealing chicks so you definitely have the advantage over us. Apparently there aren't that many nice guys out there but of the few, most of them are looking for the girl next door and not the display model. To get a guy like that I would have to lie about who I am which wouldn't make either of us happy. For me, being happy is what it's all about. I'd rather laugh in the light than cry in the dark.




That's the thing...I _have_ posted a couple of revealing pics, and I don't like that that might mean a nice guy would pass me by; whereas a thin woman isn't a "bad girl" for showing her belly or whatnot. (Well, maybe if she shows her whatnot. )


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## Ericthonius (Nov 25, 2006)

ripley said:


> That's the thing...I _have_ posted a couple of revealing pics, and I don't like that that might mean a nice guy would pass me by; whereas a thin woman isn't a "bad girl" for showing her belly or whatnot. (Well, maybe if she shows her whatnot. )


 
Wha? 

Like as if you were marked for life as a fallen woman, for posting a picture on the internet and will therefore be stricken from the, 'Book of Life'? Or something? Any guy who'd be _that_ judgemental of you wouldn't deserve you, first of all and secondly, what the hell would be so great about being with someone who's that sexually insecure? That a snap of you in a bikini, (Shit!?! You OWN a bikini? What kind of scarlet woman are you, anyway? WTF is your middle name? Jezebel?), posted on the 'net, could frighten him off? And again were back to him not being worthy of you. Why would anyone want a fucktard with hang-ups like that? 

There's no linkage between any picture you or anyone else may or have posted anywhere and your desirability. At least in a negative manner. How can anyone think there could be any? And if by chance there is a problem in someone's mind about this? The problem is theirs and they should seek professional help and stop trying to make people feel guilty about something there's nothing wrong with.


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## LillyBBBW (Nov 26, 2006)

That's my point also. I don't want anyone like that either but people like that do exist and in great numbers. All I have to do is go to some random board, any board, and post a sexy photo of myself in my avatar along with a link to my yahoo group, then say, "Ho hum, when will I find my prince who will love me and only me and not just my body/fat?" and they will come. It may take a few posts, but eventually some guy/girl will say, "Well if you'd put your damn clothes on maybe you might have better luck." Platitudes galore won't mask the prevailing wisdom.




Ericthonius said:


> Wha?
> 
> Like as if you were marked for life as a fallen woman, for posting a picture on the internet and will therefore be stricken from the, 'Book of Life'? Or something? Any guy who'd be _that_ judgemental of you wouldn't deserve you, first of all and secondly, what the hell would be so great about being with someone who's that sexually insecure? That a snap of you in a bikini, (Shit!?! You OWN a bikini? What kind of scarlet woman are you, anyway? WTF is your middle name? Jezebel?), posted on the 'net, could frighten him off? And again were back to him not being worthy of you. Why would anyone want a fucktard with hang-ups like that?
> 
> There's no linkage between any picture you or anyone else may or have posted anywhere and your desirability. At least in a negative manner. How can anyone think there could be any? And if by chance there is a problem in someone's mind about this? The problem is theirs and they should seek professional help and stop trying to make people feel guilty about something there's nothing wrong with.


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## moonvine (Nov 26, 2006)

Green Eyed Fairy said:


> Just my opinion and I love to read Lilly's posts- she has a nice, logical, well-thought-out way in her posts




I agree!


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## LillyBBBW (Nov 26, 2006)

moonvine said:


> I agree!



Thank you ladies so much. :wubu:


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## GeorgeNL (Nov 26, 2006)

I Fully agree with Lilly and Er.. Otherwise it wouldn't make sense to make yourself beautiful, makeup, nice clothes, etc. 

A question is, what can you gain, by showing yourself, and triggering physical attraction? How do physical attraction, friendhip and love relate to each other? To be honest, I don't know the aswer myself. 
Is this physical attraction able to lift a friendship up towards love? Or is it the mental attraction that has to do that? Could a relationship exist without physical attraction?


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## moonvine (Nov 26, 2006)

GeorgeNL said:


> I Fully agree with Lilly and Er.. Otherwise it wouldn't make sense to make yourself beautiful, makeup, nice clothes, etc.
> 
> A question is, what can you gain, by showing yourself, and triggering physical attraction? How do physical attraction, friendhip and love relate to each other? To be honest, I don't know the aswer myself.
> Is this physical attraction able to lift a friendship up towards love? Or is it the mental attraction that has to do that? Could a relationship exist without physical attraction?



My theory on the makeup and nice clothes thing is that it is something women do either for themselves or to impress other women.

Men (in general) don't care about that stuff.

As for you question, not for me, no, but maybe for someone else it might work.


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## GeorgeNL (Nov 26, 2006)

moonvine said:


> My theory on the makeup and nice clothes thing is that it is something women do either for themselves or to impress other women.
> 
> Men (in general) don't care about that stuff.


I think that is half true. Because when someone tries to look good, no matter how, that gives you the impression that she/he feels good about herself/himself. I like it when someone has a little (not too much) pride. Indeed, it doesn't really matter much how, at least not to me, cause I have no knowledge of fashion.


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## Jay West Coast (Nov 26, 2006)

moonvine said:


> My theory on the makeup and nice clothes thing is that it is something women do either for themselves or to impress other women.
> 
> Men (in general) don't care about that stuff.


 
It's true that as a man, I don't care much about makeup, but I do try to wear nice clothes. 

On the other hand, I sure do enjoy it when women look great. A BBW dressed to the nines makes my head 'splode.


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## LillyBBBW (Nov 26, 2006)

GeorgeNL said:


> I Fully agree with Lilly and Er.. Otherwise it wouldn't make sense to make yourself beautiful, makeup, nice clothes, etc.
> 
> A question is, what can you gain, by showing yourself, and triggering physical attraction? How do physical attraction, friendhip and love relate to each other? To be honest, I don't know the aswer myself.
> Is this physical attraction able to lift a friendship up towards love? Or is it the mental attraction that has to do that? Could a relationship exist without physical attraction?



I agree with Moonvine. Most women don't stand in front of the closet in the morning thinking, "Hmmm, what will the boys like to see me in today?" If someone looks good it's because they want to look good and not because they want to attract men. As for the picture takers like me, we may be fooling around with the camera and a few shots will come out SUPER good. We'll think, "Oh my gawd, Looka me! *RAWR* " We want people to see it. We want someone to say, "Wow, that looks good!" and hang it on the fridge. It's goofy.  Guys are probably wanking to it but we're not even thinking about that. We're just so happy that a picture came out really cute. It's like showing off a new leather coach bag we bought for 80% off. Somebody compliments it and we proudly say, "Only 40 bucks," and we love to hear 'em gasp and say, "Wha? That's all???" Some guys are wankin' to that too but we don't care. Seriously, it's not about you.

Ideally you want the whole package in a mate and the package design requirements will differ from person to person. There are lots of people that I like a whole lot but I'm not attracted to them physically and others for whom I am strongly attracted but there's no chemistry between us. You want to like what's outside and what's inside. That being said, any guy who has his sites set on a woman who walks around in heels and full makeup all the time is going to be in for some major disappointment.


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## Sweet Tooth (Nov 26, 2006)

Sometimes it seems just a bit disconcerting, as I'm sitting there in my PJs or sweats at 10 in the morning, looking at women all gussied up [to borrow a phrase from my grandmother]. I remember when the only "dressy" clothes I had were things to wear out clubbing, so I felt mighty uncomfortable wearing them to church or other more modest occasions.

It's not necessarily a disapproval of how certain people look in their pictures, but a sensation of incongruity between what we're psychologically there for at the time and what we're seeing on the sidebar. At least for me. [Okay, I admit... sometimes it's wanting to shout at people to take a more flattering picture or one with better lighting.  ]


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## Ericthonius (Nov 26, 2006)

LillyBBBW said:


> ... It may take a few posts, but eventually some guy/girl will say, "Well if you'd put your damn clothes on maybe you might have better luck." Platitudes galore won't mask the prevailing wisdom.



So how do we shut these _Buzzkills_ up, once and for all? There must be a way. I'd guess the tactic of direct confrontation, of telling them to go get lost, has been tried and isn't successful? Since people who are the authors of that sort of annoyannce are dyed-in-the-wool trolls, responding directly only helps feed them? Responding gives their statement legitimacy? 

One thing I am certain of though is that, "Prevailing Wisdom", is usually wrong. The _PW_, used to be that the Earth was flat and the center of the Cosmos. Witches could turn themselves into black cats and that it was these same cats who caused the Black Death. It hasn't changed much since then nor do I think it ever will. Look at the come-back Intelligent Design has made in the last few years.


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## KuroBara (Nov 27, 2006)

Eclectic_Girl said:


> "Show Your Ass For A Day" Day
> 
> The Clubhouse is a special section of the boards that you get access to when you contribute funds to offset the costs of running the site ($30 donation, I think?). SYAFADD is a way of giving people motivation to donate. Every once in a while, individuals post pictures of various body parts (doesn't have to be your ass, but can't show more than would be allowed on the paysite board), and the mods take them down the next day. Because they're in a restricted area, they're not searchable by Google and not viewable by anyone who hasn't contributed. It's the only way I would ever post a picture of my ass on the Internet.
> 
> The rest of the time, the motivation to join the clubhouse is the sparkling conversation, which tends to be a little less guarded because it's a troll-free zone.


Hey! I've donated and I've heard of the Clubhouse? I do I get there? How do I post pictures of my chocolate lusciousness?


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## KuroBara (Nov 27, 2006)

Eclectic_Girl said:


> "Show Your Ass For A Day" Day
> 
> The Clubhouse is a special section of the boards that you get access to when you contribute funds to offset the costs of running the site ($30 donation, I think?). SYAFADD is a way of giving people motivation to donate. Every once in a while, individuals post pictures of various body parts (doesn't have to be your ass, but can't show more than would be allowed on the paysite board), and the mods take them down the next day. Because they're in a restricted area, they're not searchable by Google and not viewable by anyone who hasn't contributed. It's the only way I would ever post a picture of my ass on the Internet.
> 
> The rest of the time, the motivation to join the clubhouse is the sparkling conversation, which tends to be a little less guarded because it's a troll-free zone.


Hey! I've donated and I've not heard of the Clubhouse! I do I get there? How do I post pictures of my chocolate lusciousness?


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## LillyBBBW (Nov 27, 2006)

The cruelest thing you can do to an indignant self righteous bigot is ignore them completely. Nothing incenses and outclasses a bloated ego more than taking the high road and choosing not to join them in the gutter. If the person doesn't have the grace to be embarrassed by their behavior after a while there's not much anyone can do. A sexy photo is far and away less damaging than a poisoned spirit in my view. If nitpicking over a photo or a body shape is the worst thing people can say about you then you're doing pretty good.




Ericthonius said:


> So how do we shut these _Buzzkills_ up, once and for all? There must be a way. I'd guess the tactic of direct confrontation, of telling them to go get lost, has been tried and isn't successful? Since people who are the authors of that sort of annoyannce are dyed-in-the-wool trolls, responding directly only helps feed them? Responding gives their statement legitimacy?
> 
> One thing I am certain of though is that, "Prevailing Wisdom", is usually wrong. The _PW_, used to be that the Earth was flat and the center of the Cosmos. Witches could turn themselves into black cats and that it was these same cats who caused the Black Death. It hasn't changed much since then nor do I think it ever will. Look at the come-back Intelligent Design has made in the last few years.


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## Mikey (Nov 27, 2006)

I have a double standard too...I never post scantilly clad photos of myself, just naked pictures of my dog.


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## ripley (Nov 27, 2006)

Mikey said:


> I have a double standard too...I never post scantilly clad photos of myself, just naked pictures of my dog.


My dog is such a slut. She has naked pictures all _over_ the internet. As her family, we're very, very shamed, and hope her employers never see them.


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## Ericthonius (Nov 29, 2006)

ripley said:


> My dog is ...



So I guess _this_ means I don't get to see Ripley in a 'kini?




:batting::wubu:


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## Tad (Dec 3, 2006)

edx said:


> Here is a hypothesis for consideration. Im not convinced that this is the reason, but I think that the thought that it could be part of the reason is fairly provocative.



I did a really, really, really bad job of framing that.

Not that anyone is reading this thread anymore (the argument over this cropped up on the weight boards), but some did and were hurt by what I wrote. So let me clarify:

1) That is NOT my personal opinion.

2) This was an attempt to encapsulate, in a fairly pure/extreme form, one line of thought that seems to get flirted with whenever this sort of discussion crops up. Nobody ever seems to come out and openly say it, but people kind of allude to it.

3) The purpose was to get people to look at this argument, and see if it makes any sense, and to thereby try to move the community towards treating this line of thought more openly--clarity is the friend of fair mindedness. Obviously I did not succeed, as nobody responded. Less obvious from this thread, some number of people read this as a posters opinion and were hurt by it--so obviously I was not clear at all in my intent.

4) For the record, I think the hypothesis as stated absolutely fails. It is easy to point out examples of thin women who see themselves as sensuous and are seen by others as sensuous, for example (I have at least two other reasons why it fails, but I don't see any point trotting out the whole argument at this point). Therefore, the hypothesis does not stand as stated. Now, is there any truth to it in a more limited way? I really don't know--sometimes the way the media treats things makes me wonder, but I was really hoping to get more voices looking at whether there are some, more limited, cases where something like this may be true, as well as getting some consensus that it is not true in any general or universal way.

5) Writing it the way I did has clearly been more harmful than any resulting discussion could have been helpful. Mea Culpa. I didn't think this through and I didn't execute it well. 

6) One last thought: Trying to say anything is true for all people or all of society is always silly, because our diversity is amazing. That is at least half of the point I was trying to get people to think about, so might as well clearly state it.

So, to summarize: I was setting up a straw man of sorts, and managed to stab myself in the foot with the pitchfork in the process. My apologies to anyone who has also felt poked.

Regards;

- a very chastened Ed


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## chunkeymonkey (Nov 23, 2008)

I need to bump this thread its a good read 

I have a double standard as well unless my alter ego pops out...... then its all over


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## Inflatable Girl (Nov 23, 2008)

ripley said:


> Perhaps it's the rarity of seeing a big woman in a bikini, or perhaps it's the sheer volume of flesh. Why is a woman in a bikini nothing to notice, but a fat woman in one is really showing her stuff? Why is a woman in a tank top and panties shown on any random movie, but I'd feel kind of weird if I just randomly put one up here of me in that, like I was pandering, or not as...I don't know, as virtuous as I should be? That a thin woman showing her flat belly is just run of the mill, but a fat woman showing hers is sexual?



I think you raise an excellent discussion point. Truly the site of voluminous, velvety flesh is simply still taboo and exotic. It's not something we are _allowed_ to see as erotic in mainstream movies, magazines, tv, or even porn for that matter. Hence, seeing confident, smiling, beautiful, ample women showing themselves off in bikinis, short shorts or even revealing street/club clothes still has an illicit thrill because it's not aligned with mainstream standards(poor fools  ). 
I'm certainly not proclaiming this to be the only or even the primary reason for this "double standard", but I do think it may be a contributing factor.

Having performed burlesque for many years I continue to be amazed by how many men (not FAs, mind you) come up to me and tell me how fascinated they are by my body and how they were amazed to see what I looked like in panties and pasties. I chalk this up to the allure of being the fat, confident "forbidden" fruit. Granted burlesque is intended to be sensual, and I don't mean to dilute your original point; I simply mean to illustrate the lack of opportunity we, as a culture, have to see the larger body scantily clad because the thin agenda continues to rule.

Now I will go & dream of the day where our beaches are filled with big, beautiful bodies. :wubu:


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## Ruffie (Nov 24, 2008)

I too have experienced the double standard. My boss pulled me aside one day and asked me not to wear such revealing shits cause the teenage boys I am working with might me looking at my chest. I replied with "Well most of the kids here think of me as their Kokhkum(grandma) and I hardly think they would be checking out their grannies tits. And if you are addressing this with me, how about the other two female staff members who dress in a revealing manner?"

I think it is great that women can show themselves as sensual creatures here. I would do the same if it were not for the morals clause in my contact. However, I have noted that there are some women who post nude or sexually provocative pictures almost exclusively, and then complain when men only seem to objectify them rather than getting to know them. Good guys will try to get to know the woman, but there are alot of fellas out there who form an impression out of what they see posted and they will objectify consistently. 

We above average women have a right to be who we are and post what we want. Just have to deal with the repercussions of being more than sciety feels we should be.


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## GTAFA (Nov 24, 2008)

I haven't read all the replies, so someone may already have said this: but I think it's almost political. When a white man gets elected president, who cares. But if a woman or a black man gets elected, that's news. 

Same thing here (in case you were wondering if i posted this here by some delusional accident when it belonged in Hyde Park). The exposed SS body is revolutionary, surprising, and delightful, whereas the exposed thin body is simply ho hum (excuse the pun).


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## superodalisque (Nov 24, 2008)

i agree with most of what everyone else has said. i just think if you have mo its just mo. your a woman so if you are bigger you have mo of the stuff that other women have. you have mo femininity and mo sexuality mo sensual movement that goes on show. i know when i get to people watch at bashes i'm totally mesmerized and i'm not even a guy or a lesbian. its just a lot of lovely to look at at one time. i look at little women. they are beautiful but its not exactly the same thing. i like the sidebar pix especially for that reason. i think its great to see women who might be ordinarily covered to possess that part of themselves. especially women who've been told the opposite for most of their lives. 

i would show mo than i do, but unfortunately society hasn't evolved much and its hard for a woman of any size to show herself and fully possess the freedom to feel love for herself the way that she should be able to and get the respect she deserves. most of the time if your proud of your body people think you are stupid or easy or cheap. its a shame that on the whole dims isn't really very different from most of society. i wish it were. then a lot more women would feel free to celebrate what mo they do have. thats why i love the arts cuz i feel mo free to sho mo without the same kind of penalty.


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## No-No-Badkitty (Nov 25, 2008)

Well I am guilty of posting revealing photos. 
Honestly, I used to hate having my photo taken. Even though I've never seen myself as ugly I know that the world as a whole says I am because I am fat. I guess here, I feel comfortable enough to express myself through some photography. I take the pictures, I control how I am being portrayed, which is nice. When I take my own photos, I like it and I get to show the world how I see myself. Which is nice. Instead of the world seeing me how they want to see me.
And yeah, some people will still see me as ugly because I am fat. However, since most of the people here enjoy and or are size accepting I feel comfortable enough to flaunt, what I have always known I had


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## Super Fan (Nov 25, 2008)

ripley said:


> I've done a lot of thinking lately, on "sexy" pictures here at Dims (chat and forums). I've come to the conclusion that I have a double standard.
> 
> Society today is inundated with pictures of thin women in bra and panties, in very small bikinis, in all sorts of revealing outfits. I barely notice anymore...the Victoria's Secret girls are everywhere, wearing pretty much nothing, and I don't blink an eye. It has ceased to strike me as sexual, almost.
> 
> ...



It is because the sexual parts of a woman are fat, T&A, so a woman who is very fat gives off way more sexual signals than a thin girl. Nude skeletons do not excite any one. .


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