# Lesbians more likely to be fat?



## lemmink (May 1, 2007)

No one else seems to have picked this one up that I can see (but please close this if I'm wrong!):

http://www.news.com.au/dailytelegraph/story/0,22049,21640474-5006007,00.html

_They reviewed smaller studies that have suggested a higher prevalence of obesity among lesbians and the possible reasons why.

"The results of these studies indicate that lesbian women have a better body image than do heterosexual women,'' they wrote. _

Daily Telegraph.


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## BigBeautifulMe (May 1, 2007)

It's all that box-munching. Cardboard is starchy, you know.

(KIDDING!) I think there's a certain freedom to knowing you don't have to fit standards of beauty that are generally thought to be held by males.

Although other women, I think, can also be the harshest judges of other women's bodies.


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## Friday (May 1, 2007)

I agree BBM, but I think that women are harder on each other when they see each other only as competition rather than as possible mate material.


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## missaf (May 1, 2007)

True Friday, but many fatties have overcome the societal hurdles of women judging the skin-deep beauty and stupid trends in beauty that don't last. We see the beauty in every fat woman and look at us here, we all compliment each other in the most sincere ways possible 

It's not that we're fat, it's the personality that goes with it -- we're not superficial.


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## Red (May 1, 2007)

It could be true, I mean, I know a coulple of fat lesbians.


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## fatgirl33 (May 1, 2007)

I guess the statistics don't lie, but in our "local" lesbian community, I don't see it. Sam and I are two fat lesbians, but I don't see an oddly large proportion of other large ladies in our queer community. Unfortunately I think most of the same issues apply, even if lesbians aren't trying to be thin to impress a man.

Certainly I don't feel any more comfortable bring up topics like weight gain being a turn-on with lesbians than I do with heterosexuals.

As I think about it more, I've probably met more "marginally" overweight lesbians (like 20 lbs overweight) than there are rail-thin, runway-model types, so maybe it's true, maybe there is less pressure to be a skeleton?  

Brenda


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## cute_obese_girl (May 1, 2007)

I think there is definitely less pressure to stay thin in the lesbian community. The reason I think is because women tend to become interested in a person as a mate based more on emotional reasons than on physical attraction. One of my best friends is a lesbian and I have seen who she and her friends choose to date over the years. What has emerged is I have noticed that their "type" is a certain personality, not a physical type. However, when it comes to my male friends I can describe their "type" in physical terms more often than personality.

Bottomline: In most cases I think men approach those they are physically attracted to and then get to know them. For women they decide to get to know a person better based on the ideals/personality they are attracted to and then physical attraction comes as a result of that.

I don't think either way is better or worse, its just a matter of what works for you.


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## Lastminute.Tom (May 1, 2007)

hmm, interesting, personally I know more fat lesbians than I do fat straight girls, I think -mentally calculates- . . . . -gives up mentally calculating and counts on fingers- . . . crikey! I know twice as many (in local area) although out of all the women in my local area that I know I think I'd only two of them would qualify as obese, and one is a lesbian and one is straight. now I just need to draw some "fun" pie charts and we can all sit down and have a quarterly review.


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## Bagalute (May 1, 2007)

My gf went to lesbian party where a friend of hers was working like two weeks ago. She wasn't hit on all night (or so she says  ) which of course I can hardly understand...

To me it makes sense that lesbians are not as much slave to a male-made female beauty standard as many other women are.


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## Ned Sonntag (May 1, 2007)

Lotta folks are bisexual and if Rosie O'Donnell chubbiness is a signifier of dykedom, then women who woulda gone either way might end up in gay relationships because of how they are perceived...


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## butch (May 1, 2007)

There is a pretty well know study that shows that the largest incidents of dieting behavior (and thus, the biggest preoccupation with being thin) are found among people who want men to find them attractive. So, heterosexual women and homosexual men are most likely to be invested in a thin ideal because their mates and potential mates are more likely to be attracted to thin partners.

However, as Brenda/fatgirl33 says, the lesbian community is not overflowing with fat women, and in fact, recent trends have shown that lesbians (and straight men, as we're aware) are increasingly getting caught up in our societies' rush to physical perfection (also know as thin, taut, and muscular) as the mean, not the ideal, of human embodiment.

In fact, I'd argue that, this idea of lesbians being more likely to be fat is more of our culture's way of trying to reinforce a stigmatic stereotype against lesbians and, to some degree, all women in gender solidarity. We're all familiar with the hateful lesbian representations-the ugly, mannish, FAT, man hater, the 'femi-nazi' of Limbaugh or the 'hairy pits feminist' of Coulter. Since this stereotype is used by critics to discredit all feminists, then it stirs up a lot of division among women, and has a lot of women today behaving like feminists while refusing the label because heaven forbid they be considered fat, ugly man haters. Think back to the 70's and the whole 'Lavender Menace' fear at NOW and other mainstream feminist organizations. This sort of disassociation between actions and identities is not good, as we've witnessed with the most recent statistics that show the gender wage gap is not getting much better. And us fat women in particular have an even larger gender wage gap, so it is important to think critically about what it means to claim these labels: feminist, lesbian, fat, etc.

In any event, my point is, I wouldn't take these sorts of studies and media reports seriously, because they are working to maintain a spurious stereotype that conforms to heterosexist beliefs about queer women, and not to show a 'liberated space' less beholden to the body tyranny of 'mainstream' society. Yes, queer female space has pockets of resistance to the thin imperative, but then again, Dimensions, a space primarily for heterosexual fat people, has more traffic than any other fat positive site on the 'net, I'd say, so what does that say about fat acceptance?


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## Still a Skye fan (May 1, 2007)

Hmmm...I don't know about the "fat lesbian" claims but I just got back from a trip to a comic book convention yesterday.

A young female friend of mine was flying in from California to attend the show. She used to live in my area of Upstate New York and was attending college when I met her via a comic book club I used to help run. She attended some meetings and I got to know her.

She finished college in 2000-2001 (I forget the exact year), met a girl online and deliberately moved to California to be with her.

Now, I hadn't seen this girl in at least six years and she was never more than a casual friend at best but we still chatted online over the years.

Anyway, I recalled her being an average sized girl when she was in college. She's about 5'5" or 5'6"...not exactly skinny and not even chubby back then.

So, I see her at the show and meet her partner for the first time and we get reacquainted over the weekend and I was privately pleased to see that she had gained at least 50 pounds or more since the last time I saw her. She was hardly BBW sized but she probably will be before too much longer. She's a very pretty and sweet girl and I was delighted by her new double chin, round face and wonderfully curvy, thick figure...yeah, my inner FA had a good weekend (LOL).

Her partner was a very sweet and kinda shy slim girl. I could tell they were nuts for each other and I envy anyone who gets to enjoy such happiness (Yeah, I'm still trying).

So, these girls have been together for years but only one got heavy while the other was slender.

My friend is also a video game addict, rarely exercises and has a very healthy appetite. We ate in the mall food court across from the hotel and she could definitely put it away...yes, I like good appetites on girls. She even commented on the fact that she liked to eat too much while rubbing her belly (through her t-shirt). This tends to be a good recipe for gaining weight and it clearly is with her.

I don't know too many other lesbians but they tend to be various builds.

I suppose there could be something to the thing about not being affected by the demands of society to be thin and beautiful for their men.

It could also be her lifestyle of little exercise and too much good/bad food. She's just not overly concerned about her weight and I think that's great.

Anyway, I had a pleasant weekend with her and hope I manage to see her again sometime.


Dennis


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## ashmamma84 (May 1, 2007)

In my small area of the world, most of my lesbian friends aren't fat -- if anything they are average to thin in body build. I'm sorry but reading that study makes me wonder how is it so that it every got published...

That said, I am a fat lesbian; my partner on the other hand is slightly overweight, some wouldn't consider her thin/average.

ETA: Lesbians come in different colors, heights, etc. So wouldn't it be logical to think that we come in varying body builds, weights, too?


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## alienlanes (May 1, 2007)

Hmm! Interesting that some researchers are claiming the "fat lesbian" stereotype is statistically valid, and equally interesting that a lot of posters, particularly the ones who _are_ fat lesbians, disagree. I don't know the answer -- although my gut instinct is to trust my fellow Dimmers over a bunch of social science technocrats -- but it's an interesting question.

I've always assumed that there's at least a grain of truth to the stereotype, but that may be because my sample is skewed; as a het FA with punk/indie leanings, I've mistakenly tried to flirt with more than one pierced-and-tatted chubby girl who turned out to be batting for the other team . 



butch said:


> In fact, I'd argue that, this idea of lesbians being more likely to be fat is more of our culture's way of trying to reinforce a stigmatic stereotype against lesbians and, to some degree, all women in gender solidarity.



Agreed. As the _Bell Curve_ controversy demonstrated, there's always a market for "scientific" studies which reinforce reactionary stereotypes. I don't want to lump these researchers in with that whole crew without actually having read their paper, and if I did read it I wouldn't know enough about public health research methods to competently critique it, but even if their findings are accurate, one wonders how they decided to research this particular question.


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## fatgirl33 (May 2, 2007)

butch said:


> In any event, my point is, I wouldn't take these sorts of studies and media reports seriously, because they are working to maintain a spurious stereotype that conforms to heterosexist beliefs about queer women, and not to show a 'liberated space' less beholden to the body tyranny of 'mainstream' society.



I would agree with that, and it also serves to remind us that the daily news outlets are not really scientifically-minded - we read about scientific studies every day, and statistical controversies about this and that, but really these outlets aren't usually qualified to judge/make these claims. They just pull whatever comes off the news wire that is a little sensational and might pull someone in to read their rag.

Isn't that how the whole weight-loss industry works?  

Brenda


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## Athena9950 (May 3, 2007)

I've noticed this to be true. I'm one of the only thin lesbians I know. Also the only Greek-Jewish ones but that's another story. LOL

View attachment Bandnight%2520019.jpg


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## BitsyAintMyName (May 3, 2007)

I haven't met many fat lesbians but I know there are plenty out there. In my area a goodly number of the women, regardless of sexual preference, are BBW's and I don't go around asking them if they're lesbians. *lol* Plenty of people think I'm one because I dress like a dude and hang out with men. The fact that I'm a BBW only gives this false notion more credence. Can't a girl wear trousers and hang with her favorite boys without being called a lesbian?


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## Allie Cat (May 4, 2007)

This could explain why it's so hard for FAs to find dates...  

=Divals


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## Waxwing (May 4, 2007)

I've definitely felt a more accepting vibe from the lesbian community when it comes to bodies. I'm not sure how it is here in Boston but in San Francisco there is a greater sense of freedom to just be whatever size you are. I feel strange making that kind of generalization but that's how I've felt around my lesbian friends. 

The curious thing is that if straight women are more likely to diet and be focused on weight, you would think that the potential conquests (straight men) would generally desire very thin women. I've not found this to be the case. The men I know don't like the super thin look. 

Straight women seem to do it for themselves, and for each other, but not for the men. You don't hear men say "yeah she's nice but she has no business wearing that", but you hear that kind of thing from straight women all the time. 

Curiouser and curiouser.


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## Green Eyed Fairy (May 4, 2007)

Could it be that lesbians don't feel the same pressure to please men that us heterosexuals do? Other than some true concerns about health or lifestyle- that is usually what all the bruhaha about being model thin is for- men. Or to brag to other women that you wear a smaller size than they do *rolls eyes*


Btw, I'm totally hetero and I'm fat 

*feels cleansed after confessing*


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## Waxwing (May 4, 2007)

Green Eyed Fairy said:


> Could it be that lesbians don't feel the same pressure to please men that us heterosexuals do? Other than some true concerns about health or lifestyle- that is usually what all the bruhaha about being model thin is for- men. Or to brag to other women that you wear a smaller size than they do *rolls eyes*
> 
> 
> Btw, I'm totally hetero and I'm fat
> ...



But men don't seem to like that thin. I think it's definitely more about being able to brag that you wear a smaller size than your friends. It's stupid.


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## OfftoOtherPlaces (May 4, 2007)

No one seems to have said this yet, so I will--

OMG fat lesbians :smitten: :smitten: :smitten: 

Btw, the great thing about lesbians/bi girls (esp. FFAs) is that, as a straight guy, you can say to one, "Hey, I like that girl," and your friend will say, "No, I don't go for that... but I would so jump HER OVER THERE"-- and you just oggle this poor passerby for a minute straight.


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## Green Eyed Fairy (May 4, 2007)

Waxwing said:


> But men don't seem to like that thin. I think it's definitely more about being able to brag that you wear a smaller size than your friends. It's stupid.



Oh, a lot of the men here in the south seem to love them that thin- but then some of them also seem to love 12-13 year olds too so perhaps they aren't good comparisons to the rest of the men in the world 


And thank you WW for what you said about my avatar in another thread


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## bigplaidpants (May 4, 2007)

butch said:


> There is a pretty well know study that shows that the largest incidents of dieting behavior (and thus, the biggest preoccupation with being thin) are found among people who want men to find them attractive. So, heterosexual women and homosexual men are most likely to be invested in a thin ideal because their mates and potential mates are more likely to be attracted to thin partners.
> 
> However, as Brenda/fatgirl33 says, the lesbian community is not overflowing with fat women, and in fact, recent trends have shown that lesbians (and straight men, as we're aware) are increasingly getting caught up in our societies' rush to physical perfection (also know as thin, taut, and muscular) as the mean, not the ideal, of human embodiment.
> 
> ...



OK. I was going to rep butch, but this deserves public acknowledgment. It's gotten some already.

This is just great, high-octane, top drawer critical/queer theory. <bows to butch> Way to reverse the gaze and turn the hidden value assumptions inside out.

This is the kinda high quality critque you'd find in a fine academic conference....and from one who knows what she's talking about. 

The last question is superb. Kudos. Heteronormativity does have a submerged fat-phobia as a *necessary* componant. :bow: 

<bigplaidpants gets up to poor some more coffee>


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## mollycoddles (May 4, 2007)

I'm a scrawny little thing, but maybe that's because I've been self-identifying as bi for too long? Gosh, maybe now that I've made the switch, I'll magically gain weight. Maybe this is what I need to do to get my partner to gain! 




butch said:


> There is a pretty well know study that shows that the largest incidents of dieting behavior (and thus, the biggest preoccupation with being thin) are found among people who want men to find them attractive. So, heterosexual women and homosexual men are most likely to be invested in a thin ideal because their mates and potential mates are more likely to be attracted to thin partners.
> 
> However, as Brenda/fatgirl33 says, the lesbian community is not overflowing with fat women, and in fact, recent trends have shown that lesbians (and straight men, as we're aware) are increasingly getting caught up in our societies' rush to physical perfection (also know as thin, taut, and muscular) as the mean, not the ideal, of human embodiment.
> 
> ...



I think this about hits the nail on the head.


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## Green Eyed Fairy (May 4, 2007)

bigplaidpants said:


> OK. I was going to rep butch, but this deserves public acknowledgment. It's gotten some already.
> 
> This is just great, high-octane, top drawer critical/queer theory. <bows to butch> Way to reverse the gaze and turn the hidden value assumptions inside out.
> 
> ...



Yeah, I tried to rep Butch but it said I'd given out too much rep today....


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## RedVelvet (May 4, 2007)

Athena9950 said:


> I've noticed this to be true. I'm one of the only thin lesbians I know. Also the only Greek-Jewish ones but that's another story. LOL
> 
> View attachment 19399




Egads.....arent YOU cute...


ahem....

hi.


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## Athena9950 (May 4, 2007)

RedVelvet said:


> Egads.....arent YOU cute...
> 
> 
> ahem....
> ...



Hey honey! LOL


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## Waxwing (May 4, 2007)

Yeah, I'm going to be chasing Athena now. Quite a lovely girl!


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## RedVelvet (May 4, 2007)

Waxwing said:


> Yeah, I'm going to be chasing Athena now. Quite a lovely girl!



HEY!...I SO called dibs...!

Jeeeeeez!!


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## Waxwing (May 4, 2007)

RedVelvet said:


> HEY!...I SO called dibs...!
> 
> Jeeeeeez!!



 

Okay, okay. Can I envy your love from afar? Can I write bad livejournal poetry about it?


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## Athena9950 (May 4, 2007)

Girls! Girls! There's room for two BBWs in my bed!


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## RedVelvet (May 4, 2007)

Athena9950 said:


> Girls! Girls! There's room for two BBWs in my bed!




I'll bring the rope and cuffs.......I'm helpful that way...


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## Red (May 4, 2007)

can we make that three? (sorry couldnt resist!)


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## Athena9950 (May 4, 2007)

Are you a BBW? THE BED MIGHT BREAK! LOL


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## RedVelvet (May 4, 2007)

Waxwing said:


> Okay, okay. Can I envy your love from afar? Can I write bad livejournal poetry about it?




No darling...I say we have a torrid affair our own selves..

I'm greedy that way.


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## Athena9950 (May 4, 2007)

RedVelvet said:


> No darling...I say we have a torrid affair our own selves..
> 
> I'm greedy that way.



Me or her? If me, okay! How big are you?


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## Green Eyed Fairy (May 4, 2007)

^^now, I WILL fight over RedVelvet...... :wubu:


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## RedVelvet (May 4, 2007)

Athena9950 said:


> Me or her? If me, okay! How big are you?




Oh oh!...size question...point loss!

Waxwing....I'm yours!

............aint I a fickle bitch?


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## Red (May 4, 2007)

Athena9950 said:


> Are you a BBW? THE BED MIGHT BREAK! LOL



Hell yeah, who needs a bed when there is a big ol' floor to be made use of!


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## RedVelvet (May 4, 2007)

Green Eyed Fairy said:


> ^^now, I WILL fight over RedVelvet...... :wubu:




Bless You, sugarbutt.......I smother you with kisses. 

View attachment kisskiss.jpg


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## Green Eyed Fairy (May 4, 2007)

*heart in my hand for RedVelvet*  :kiss2: :bow:


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## Waxwing (May 4, 2007)

RedVelvet :wubu: 

And Athena, we can probably fit everyone in the bed. I'm a small girl. We'll save room for our gorgeous BBW!


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## RedVelvet (May 4, 2007)

Waxwing said:


> RedVelvet :wubu:
> 
> And Athena, we can probably fit everyone in the bed. I'm a small girl. We'll save room for our gorgeous BBW!





Heh.....pussy puppy pile.


(yes...I DID just type that...)


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## Red (May 4, 2007)

Well then...















....................................................... blimey! :blink:


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## RedVelvet (May 4, 2007)

HIJACKING COMPLETE...


My apologies to Butch....given her magnificent Queer Theory post...I didnt want to diminish that...


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## Waxwing (May 4, 2007)

RedVelvet said:


> HIJACKING COMPLETE...
> 
> 
> My apologies to Butch....given her magnificent Queer Theory post...I didnt want to diminish that...



We're a fantastic object lesson.


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## Athena9950 (May 4, 2007)

Wha? I didn't mean it like that...the bigger the better! Dammit...another opportunity squandered. 

Yeah, I'm a small girl too! I'm tall but very thin...runner's figure! 

I actually love my body soooo much. Easy to find clothes!


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## Waxwing (May 4, 2007)

Athena9950 said:


> Wha? I didn't mean it like that...the bigger the better! Dammit...another opportunity squandered.
> 
> Yeah, I'm a small girl too! I'm tall but very thin...runner's figure!
> 
> I actually love my body soooo much. Easy to find clothes!



I always wanted to be tall. Alas, it wasn't in the genetic cards.


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## RedVelvet (May 4, 2007)

Athena9950 said:


> Wha? I didn't mean it like that...the bigger the better! Dammit...another opportunity squandered.
> 
> Yeah, I'm a small girl too! I'm tall but very thin...runner's figure!
> 
> I actually love my body soooo much. Easy to find clothes!






Sugar..you are missing the point....."how big are you?" as a nearly first question to a new aquaintance....doesnt fly well with me, sweet young thing.....may not bother others..but its my deal...

If you knew me well...you would know all........

thats all I'm sayin.


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## RedVelvet (May 4, 2007)

Waxwing said:


> I always wanted to be tall. Alas, it wasn't in the genetic cards.



Adorable, wicked smart and funny is tho.....so....not bad, girl.


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## Athena9950 (May 4, 2007)

RedVelvet said:


> Adorable, wicked smart and funny is tho.....so....not bad, girl.



And rudeness is in my genetics. Sorry Velvet! I'm such a skinny Jew-bitch.


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## Waxwing (May 4, 2007)

RedVelvet said:


> Adorable, wicked smart and funny is tho.....so....not bad, girl.



:blush: 

I just fell over! *does dance around house*


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## butch (May 4, 2007)

Wow, the flirting on this thread is something fierce. Welcome, Athena (always been my favorite Greek God, btw), I look forward to hearing more from you here on the boards. A humble reminder to all my flirtatious friends at Dims-this fat queer chick likes flirting too. I may not be any good at it, but I needs the practice.

And thanks for the kind words and rep, folks. Coming from you smart folks, it's doubly appreciated.


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## lemmink (May 4, 2007)

I thought the most interesting part of this article was the fact that lesbians they surveyed have better body image, and are comfortable with their weight - whatever it is.


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## BigBeautifulMe (May 4, 2007)

butch said:


> There is a pretty well know study that shows that the largest incidents of dieting behavior (and thus, the biggest preoccupation with being thin) are found among people who want men to find them attractive. So, heterosexual women and homosexual men are most likely to be invested in a thin ideal because their mates and potential mates are more likely to be attracted to thin partners.
> 
> However, as Brenda/fatgirl33 says, the lesbian community is not overflowing with fat women, and in fact, recent trends have shown that lesbians (and straight men, as we're aware) are increasingly getting caught up in our societies' rush to physical perfection (also know as thin, taut, and muscular) as the mean, not the ideal, of human embodiment.
> 
> ...



Excellent, excellent post, butch. You never cease to amaze me with your intellect, especially with what you have to say about queer and gender theory. If I ever need any information on the topic, I know where to find it.  You're amazing. Have some rep.


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## Jes (May 4, 2007)

butch said:


> Wow, the flirting on this thread is something fierce. Welcome, Athena (always been my favorite Greek God, btw), I look forward to hearing more from you here on the boards. A humble reminder to all my flirtatious friends at Dims-this fat queer chick likes flirting too. I may not be any good at it, but I needs the practice.
> 
> And thanks for the kind words and rep, folks. Coming from you smart folks, it's doubly appreciated.


No, no--you have to work it like you own it, butchiebutch. Walk into this thread, grab someone by the hair and declare: I AM THE QUEEN OF FLIRTING. BOW BEFORE ME. 

now you try it!


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## butch (May 5, 2007)

Jes said:


> No, no--you have to work it like you own it, butchiebutch. Walk into this thread, grab someone by the hair and declare: I AM THE QUEEN OF FLIRTING. BOW BEFORE ME.
> 
> now you try it!



I'd rather be the king of flirting, or maybe just the sausage king of Chicago. But point well taken, since I hear hair pulling works as well away from the playground, too.

BigBeautifulMe, thank you for the kind words. I was just re-reading a November NYTimes article today with a picture of a very smart you-know-who, btw. She's too smart and cool for words.


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## Red (May 5, 2007)

lemmink said:


> I thought the most interesting part of this article was the fact that lesbians they surveyed have better body image, and are comfortable with their weight - whatever it is.





I agree, it is very interesting. I admire it a lot.


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## BigBeautifulMe (May 5, 2007)

TYVM, Butchie.   You left out "stunningly beautiful." *snark*


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