# Shortage of Fat College Students



## bigmac (Sep 8, 2009)

Thatgirl08's recent post titled _"I can't be the only fat person to go to college"_ got me thinking. I looked back over my educational history and came to the conclusion that -- at least in the institutions I attended -- there is indeed a shortage of fat people on campus. Of the approximately 1100 students who passed through the doors of Lewis & Clark Law School while I was in attendance *only one (1)* would have been classified as class 3 obese (i.e. morbidly obese).

I searched to internet for demographic data and found a 2002 JAMA article with the following statistics based on 2000 data: 

*Education Level and Percentage of Class 3 Obesity (2000)

-- Less than High School, 3.4%

-- High School Only, 2.4%

-- College, but less than 4 years, 2.2%

-- 4 Years of College or more, 1.2% 

Source: Freedman DS, et al. Trends and Correlates of Class 3 Obesity in the United States from 1990 through 2000. JAMA 2002;288:1758-1761. * Note: class 3 obesity is a BMI over 40, often referred to as (and I hate this term) morbid obesity.

The college grad statistics are consistent with my personal observations. They go further and show that the least educated segment of society is almost 300% more likely to be morbidly obese. I've read many commentaries hypothesizing as to why poor people are fatter than rich (i.e. can't afford good food, good food not available in poor neighborhoods, limited opportunities for recreation or exercise ....). However, I have not read any commentary regarding why fat people don't go to college in representative numbers. 

Thatgirl08's post identified lack of physical accommodation as a potential barrier. This made me think that it might be more productive to ask why fat people aren't pursuing education in representative numbers as opposed to looking for reasons poor people are fat. Therefore, I'd like to ask the Dimensions Community if they can Identify other barriers fat students face and, also, how to best address these barriers.


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## dcoyote (Sep 8, 2009)

I have to say that I've seen plenty of big gals, myself included, and large men at my college. I have never see anyone very big that might fit into that classification though. I can tell you though, my school sucks for being fat. Everything is up hill-both ways! Really, it is. Whomever decided to cave a college out of the highest hill in the town is a jerk. This is West Virginia too, so everything is high on hills, but this is a bit much. It's sad to say, but I think some of the larger people that were here transferred out of the school partially for that reason. I've even seen the fit guys and gals huffing and puffing up all the stairs.
Oh, and the elevators are so slow that it takes more time to go up it than it does for me to go up three or four flights of stairs. It really sucks when you have a class at the bottom of the hill, than have a class right after it on the top of the hill on the 2nd, 3rd or Nth floor. oy vey


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## moore2me (Sep 8, 2009)

Big Mac,

I don't know how the population looks around your schools in California, but in Arkansas, Louisiana, Mississippi, and Alabama (the Deep South) there are plenty of students that are fat. And yes, some of us do go to college and get upper level degrees, regardless of what one JAMA article might say.

'Yall have a nice day.


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## Keb (Sep 9, 2009)

Not going to college was never even an option on the table in my family; it was simply understood that a bachelor's was the next step after high school. I mean, I did briefly say, "hey, some people take a year off and see the world, wouldn't that be neat!"--but that thought didn't go anywhere.

Of course, I went to a high school where about 97% of the students went directly to college afterwards, so I was pretty much surrounded by the assumption that college would happen.

And I'm definitely way above a 40 BMI. Was then, too.

I do think lower numbers of obese people are in college because obesity rates rise with age, and more college students are young people. Why it isn't representative after the fact, though, as these numbers would indicate, baffles me.


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## olwen (Sep 9, 2009)

Could have something to do with where your school is. Not sure what the overall population in Oregon is. Where I am there are fat students, since this is a rather large city. 

Also, one could consider the type of school. How many fat students would there be in nursing school, an engineering school, a technical college, Art school, two year community college, business school, ect as opposed to law school?


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## MatthewB (Sep 9, 2009)

I go to college in Rhode Island, and I can safely report that, up here, there is no shortage of chubby chicks.


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## FatAndProud (Sep 9, 2009)

This thread angers me. It implies that SKINNY people think that fat people are uneducated. I say burn skinny. LONG LIVE THE FATTIES. Gah, when will skinny people get off their high horse and fall down some stairs? Amirite?


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## kayrae (Sep 9, 2009)

FatAndProud said:


> This thread angers me. It implies that SKINNY people think that fat people are uneducated. I say burn skinny. LONG LIVE THE FATTIES. Gah, when will skinny people get off their high horse and fall down some stairs? Amirite?



No, you're not right. *ahem* Please don't make this be an anti-skinny bashing. This website is a size-acceptance site, not only fat-acceptance.


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## FatAndProud (Sep 9, 2009)

Ok, but let me ask you this. Where is the thin statistics for education? I'm not into one sided studies. I don't think it's fair to base your judgements upon ONE study that obviously has not correctly utilized the scientific method. I don't know...


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## bigmac (Sep 9, 2009)

moore2me said:


> Big Mac,
> 
> I don't know how the population looks around your schools in California, but in Arkansas, Louisiana, Mississippi, and Alabama (the Deep South) there are plenty of students that are fat. And yes, some of us do go to college and get upper level degrees, regardless of what one JAMA article might say.
> 
> 'Yall have a nice day.



I never meant to imply that individual fat people don't succeed at higher education. (In fact my wife (Petunia805) weighed over 500 pounds when she started at California State.) My point is that based on their prevalence in the population fat students are under represented much as African American men are also under represented in college (and over represented in prison). Civil rights leaders rightly see the under representation of African Americans in college as a problem that needs to be addressed -- the fact that many individual African Americans succeed in college does not undermine the fact that as a group they lag. Likewise, I think its great that fat people are succeeding in collage and beyond. However, this doesn't mean that as a demographic group fat people are not lagging educationally. Other demographic advocacy groups identify obstacles and barriers to educational success (both with the group and external) and they advocate for remediation. Fat people must do the same.

I'll start by identifying one issue I think may be a significant barrier. I think there are many fat people with the potential to do very well in college or grad school who self select themselves out. Self-esteem issues have been frequently discussed on this board. Its not unreasonable to suppose that fat people suffering from low self-esteem don't see college as an option and, therefore, don't even apply. 



olwen said:


> Could have something to do with where your school is. Not sure what the overall population in Oregon is. Where I am there are fat students, since this is a rather large city.
> 
> Also, one could consider the type of school. How many fat students would there be in nursing school, an engineering school, a technical college, Art school, two year community college, business school, ect as opposed to law school?



Portland Oregon, where my law school is located, is a major metropolitan area with substantial number of large and very large people in the general population. Indeed demand forced Portland to become one of the first cities to buy extra-large bariatric ambulances. Large people are present in the community in large numbers -- but only one went to law school while I was there.

Since any type of undergrad degree can be used for admission to law school (I was an earth science major) self selection based on earlier choices shouldn't be an issue. My hypothesis is that fat people how could be successful are choosing not to apply in representative numbers.

I'm putting forward one potential reason for underrepresented -- I'm sure there are many others too.


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## 1300 Class (Sep 9, 2009)

The University of Queensland had plenty of "bigger" people, including oneself.








> My point is that based on their prevalence in the population fat students are under represented much as African American men are also under represented in college (and over represented in prison). Civil rights leaders rightly see the under representation of African Americans in college as a problem that needs to be addressed -- the fact that many individual African Americans succeed in college does not undermine the fact that as a group they lag. Likewise, I think its great that fat people are succeeding in collage and beyond. However, this doesn't mean that as a demographic group fat people are not lagging educationally. Other demographic advocacy groups identify obstacles and barriers to educational success (both with the group and external) and they advocate for remediation. Fat people must do the same.


No, no, no. Affirmative action is quite possibly the worst thing that could be advocated. The equality of oppurtunity, not the equality of the quota.


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## Vespertine (Sep 9, 2009)

Interesting slant on the usual conversation of poverty and weight. There are likely many subtle barriers. Physical accommodation is one aspect, I went to school with a ssbbw who had mobility issues, and her dorm was not much closer than mine, at the farthest possible point from anything. In retrospect, I have a hard time believing the housing people would be so insensitive? I haven't thought of this in years. It snowed heavily and she missed a lot of classes--it is /hard/ trudging up the hill in two feet of snow and ice (you know I hated it), and she couldn't do it. She didn't even last the semester, iirc. You know she also got torrents of verbal abuse from the other students, also. No one ever bothered me, but I was kinda scary looking back then.

The social aspect can be hard for the usual reasons, especially in the beginning before you get some good friends. I did know plenty of fellow fat students, but the statistics in the OP do say fat people are underrepresented in higher education. I would agree self-esteem probably plays a role, before a person applies, while they're at school, and if they'll go on...of course it would.

I would be curious to see what the percentage of fat people going to school looked like, if there are big inequities there across ethnicity and class.

ETA: Also, thinking about class, if a fat student came from a family with fat people, statistically less wealthy, possibly due to employment discrimination, it could be extra difficult for the family to afford college. Just a thought.


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## annabellethecat (Sep 9, 2009)

bigmac said:


> I never meant to imply that individual fat people don't succeed at higher education. (In fact my wife (Petunia805) weighed over 500 pounds when she started at California State.) My point is that based on their prevalence in the population fat students are under represented much as African American men are also under represented in college (and over represented in prison). Civil rights leaders rightly see the under representation of African Americans in college as a problem that needs to be addressed -- the fact that many individual African Americans succeed in college does not undermine the fact that as a group they lag. Likewise, I think its great that fat people are succeeding in collage and beyond. However, this doesn't mean that as a demographic group fat people are not lagging educationally. Other demographic advocacy groups identify obstacles and barriers to educational success (both with the group and external) and they advocate for remediation. Fat people must do the same.
> 
> I'll start by identifying one issue I think may be a significant barrier. I think there are many fat people with the potential to do very well in college or grad school who self select themselves out. Self-esteem issues have been frequently discussed on this board. Its not unreasonable to suppose that fat people suffering from low self-esteem don't see college as an option and, therefore, don't even apply.
> 
> ...



When I went to community college 1984-1986 in Southern California, there where very few fat students, but this college is in an affluent beach town. When I went to a "UC" four year college 1987-1989 it was the same. Although there was some diversity, most of the students were white and middle class and up. Although I was "smaller" then, about 210 lbs, I felt out of place and was sometimes teased and taunted. I can remember a few very heavy students there but only maybe 3. One nasty roomate I had called me a "fat, ugly shithead". There was alot of fat hatred there and I can understand that many fat college age people may be afraid of going to college and stay away to protect themselves from abuse.


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## Friday (Sep 9, 2009)

I can't imagine how when 60% of the population is overweight they can claim that there are that few fatties in school. I graduated HS in '74 fer criessake and I promise you that out of a graduating class of 400 (give or take), at least 50% were 'fat' by today's standards (I just went and gave my senior annual a quick look and 3 out of 8 varsity cheerleaders definitely qualified as chubby) and at least 1 out of 10 was clinically obese. It's just another case of 'statistics' being manipulated to support some whackjob's nutty opinion.


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## butch (Sep 9, 2009)

I sometimes have a hard time reading statistics, but those stats suggest that over 90% of 'morbidly obese' people don't even make it to high school? Or, if that is the percentage of 'morbidly obese' people that make up the portion of the population overall at any particular school, then less than 4% of the population is considered 'morbidly obese'? How can that be, when the media tells us we're all becoming super fat fatties?

In any event, there is debate in academic circles about the chicken or egg thing linking fatness to lower SES. Are people fat because they're poor, or poor because they're fat?

In my case, I'd definitely say my lower SES is because I'm fat, if I compare myself to my peers from high school. However, I am also in possession of a graduate degree, and so theoretically I should make more than someone with a Bachelor's degree, regardless of weight.

That would be an interesting study, comparing salaries of thin and fat people with graduate degrees, and seeing how the salaries of fat people compare to those without graduate degrees.

I am currently working on another graduate degree, and I can say there aren't many 'morbidly obese' students among the grad students and the undergrad students. There were more students fitting the bill at my undergrad university, but undergrad is a state school, and my current school is a private university, so the difference might be there.


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## Hathor (Sep 9, 2009)

In my years at CC, me and my now friend/roommate were the biggest girls in the classroom. Thinking back, we were the only fatties in our program. 

Wow.. that's just weird.


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## TraciJo67 (Sep 9, 2009)

According to the same site, less than 3% of the population has a BMI of 40 or more (something I find hard to believe, actually). If we accept that statistic as valid, then I think it would naturally follow that the percentage enrolled in college would be right in line with the statistics that you quoted -- without any further explanation being necessary (i.e., analysis of why people are fat, self-esteem of fat people, etc).



bigmac said:


> Thatgirl08's recent post titled _"I can't be the only fat person to go to college"_ got me thinking. I looked back over my educational history and came to the conclusion that -- at least in the institutions I attended -- there is indeed a shortage of fat people on campus. Of the approximately 1100 students who passed through the doors of Lewis & Clark Law School while I was in attendance *only one (1)* would have been classified as class 3 obese (i.e. morbidly obese).
> 
> I searched to internet for demographic data and found a 2002 JAMA article with the following statistics based on 2000 data:
> 
> ...


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## Miss Vickie (Sep 9, 2009)

Bigmac, interesting idea for a thread. I noticed lots of people who were various sizes of fat when I was in college (I graduated 5 years ago). I attended a public school, a nursing program, and while we weren't the majority, there were still a lot of us. We have nursing students come to our facility for their clinicals and I still see a fair number of fat nursing students. Again, not the majority but not probably 2-3 out of 7-8 students. I was definitely the fattest girl in my cohort, but I had good company, too!



FatAndProud said:


> This thread angers me. It implies that SKINNY people think that fat people are uneducated. I say burn skinny. LONG LIVE THE FATTIES. Gah, when will skinny people get off their high horse and fall down some stairs? Amirite?



No. You're not right. If you want to be angry, then be angry at whatever it is that keeps fat people down. It's not thin people doing that. It's a societal problem that involves ALL of us. Besides, there were probably fat scientists participating in putting together that study, too. 



FatAndProud said:


> Ok, but let me ask you this. Where is the thin statistics for education? I'm not into one sided studies. I don't think it's fair to base your judgements upon ONE study that obviously has not correctly utilized the scientific method. I don't know...



Well, if x percent of people are fat, then I think you can assume that the rest of the people are thin, right. I agree that it's probably a faulty study (and it's certainly outdated) but why bash on thin people? Does slamming thin people make it better for fat people? Hardly.



butch said:


> I sometimes have a hard time reading statistics, but those stats suggest that over 90% of 'morbidly obese' people don't even make it to high school? Or, if that is the percentage of 'morbidly obese' people that make up the portion of the population overall at any particular school, then less than 4% of the population is considered 'morbidly obese'? How can that be, when the media tells us we're all becoming super fat fatties?



Yeah I don't get it. Either the study is flawed (likely) or outdated (definitely) or the media is overstating things (dingdingding). Lots more people watch the news when there is exciting stuff to hear about, and legions of fat folks taking over is (apparently) exciting. 



> In any event, there is debate in academic circles about the chicken or egg thing linking fatness to lower SES. Are people fat because they're poor, or poor because they're fat?



It's an interesting question. If most poor people live in inner cities where fresh food isn't available, and mass produced food is cheaper, then it perpetuates fatness in people who would otherwise be smaller if they ate a healthier diet. One of the things I liked seeing when I was on WIC was a special veggie voucher we'd get each summer for free veggies that was accepted at the local farmers markets in Seattle. It was great because it got us free veggies, and it supported local farmers. I think there are ways that we can help poor people eat better, rather than punish them with fat tax, but it takes creativity.

But... hmmmm... yes... which came first? Hard to say. Being fat doesn't help you land work, that's for sure, particularly in poor economic times. But again, when people have less money, it's harder to eat fresh, organic food, join a gym, etc etc etc. Maybe it's a way of educating people (ALL people!) to eat better with less?



> In my case, I'd definitely say my lower SES is because I'm fat, if I compare myself to my peers from high school. However, I am also in possession of a graduate degree, and so theoretically I should make more than someone with a Bachelor's degree, regardless of weight.



Maybe it's because you're fat but maybe it's because of the degree. What's your degree in, butch? There are some degrees that are great for finding jobs (nursing comes to mind, obviously) and some that aren't so good. It doesn't mean that they aren't awesome degrees, but it can be harder to find a job with, say, a history or English degree.



> I am currently working on another graduate degree, and I can say there aren't many 'morbidly obese' students among the grad students and the undergrad students. There were more students fitting the bill at my undergrad university, but undergrad is a state school, and my current school is a private university, so the difference might be there.



I wonder why this is. I know it's NOT because fat people aren't smart or motivated. Maybe it's concern about the accommodations? Or is it energy level? It'd be interesting to talk to people of size who want to go to school but choose not to.



TraciJo67 said:


> According to the same site, less than 3% of the population has a BMI of 40 or more (something I find hard to believe, actually). If we accept that statistic as valid, then I think it would naturally follow that the percentage enrolled in college would be right in line with the statistics that you quoted -- without any further explanation being necessary (i.e., analysis of why people are fat, self-esteem of fat people, etc).



I noticed that too, Traci. I think the study is definitely flawed, probably because it's underestimated enormously the number of fat people in general. It's an outdated study, too, but I don't think the numbers have increased THAT much.


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## Melian (Sep 9, 2009)

Purely observational, here, but I was disappointed by the lack of fat classmates in my undergrad program. It was pre-med/life sciences, the class size was approximately 400 in first year, and there were 2-3 fat girls and ONE fat guy. And the fat guy was a total tool, so undergrad was FFA hell.

Now, in my grad program at another university, I have met one fat guy and zero fat girls, despite the fact that there are maybe 40 of us in the department.


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## Ned Sonntag (Sep 9, 2009)

I seem to recall an article at Salon that Huntington, wait, no, Wheeling... is THE fattest city in America... this is a great thread. The whole topic of Social Class is overlooked mocked or tweaked in Mainstream Media, and a college education is still the big dividing line... The campus in 'mellow'Madison WI is touted as the MOST flat and therefore wheelchairfriendly...


dcoyote said:


> I have to say that I've seen plenty of big gals, myself included, and large men at my college. I have never see anyone very big that might fit into that classification though. I can tell you though, my school sucks for being fat. Everything is up hill-both ways! Really, it is. Whomever decided to cave a college out of the highest hill in the town is a jerk. This is West Virginia too, so everything is high on hills, but this is a bit much. It's sad to say, but I think some of the larger people that were here transferred out of the school partially for that reason. I've even seen the fit guys and gals huffing and puffing up all the stairs.
> Oh, and the elevators are so slow that it takes more time to go up it than it does for me to go up three or four flights of stairs. It really sucks when you have a class at the bottom of the hill, than have a class right after it on the top of the hill on the 2nd, 3rd or Nth floor. oy vey


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## Dr. Feelgood (Sep 9, 2009)

butch said:


> I sometimes have a hard time reading statistics, but those stats suggest that over 90% of 'morbidly obese' people don't even make it to high school? Or, if that is the percentage of 'morbidly obese' people that make up the portion of the population overall at any particular school, then less than 4% of the population is considered 'morbidly obese'? How can that be, when the media tells us we're all becoming super fat fatties?



Butch, I think part of the problem is that bigmac is talking about two different things. First, he mentions anecdotal evidence that there were few morbidly obese individuals attending Lewis and Clark Law School along with him. This has nothing to do with educational levels and/or obesity nationwide: it's his lead-in to his second point, the statistics on the percentage of people at each educational level who were considered morbidly obese. What we're missing is the other half of the picture, namely what percentage of the population _as a whole_ is considered morbidly obese. We are continually being told that 60% of the population is overweight OR obese, but this includes an awful lot of people whose BMIs are in the mid-20's. It appears from the statistics that a larger percent of m.o. people have no high school education than have a higher level, but this may not be so: what is being expressed is the percentage of _each educational group_ that is m.o., and we don't have the full picture until we know how big each group is. Since most states mandate education to the age of 18, the number of people without a h.s. education is liable to be very low -- so that even very few m.o. individuals might appear to be a high percentage.


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## msbard90 (Sep 9, 2009)

Well I just calculated my bmi and it's 41. I most certainly wouldn't consider myself "morbidly obese". I know that it is a medical term, and I might be, but I think the public views morbid obesity as a person who is extremely extremely extremely overweight. I know a lot of girls and guys who are chunky or fatter that go to my school that might technically qualify as morbidly obese, so maybe there's only 1 or 2 "obviously" (please don't take my explanation the wrong way) super obese people, but there are a lot more that we wouldn't consider obese that are.


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## HottiMegan (Sep 9, 2009)

I would say i was the fattest person at like 340lbs in the business department at Chico State. I also took a ton of English classes and art classes, so there were some fat people in those departments. Being a woman itself was a minority but a fat woman, i don't remember seeing any women of size in the oodles of classe i took in the business classes.

The chairs were primarily those folding chairs that have a little desktop that wraps around part of your body. it was a tight squeeze so i usually just took the desk part down and wrote on my lap. Most classes were less than 90 minutes long so it wasnt too horrid.


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## crayola box (Sep 9, 2009)

Dr. Feelgood said:


> Butch, I think part of the problem is that bigmac is talking about two different things. First, he mentions anecdotal evidence that there were few morbidly obese individuals attending Lewis and Clark Law School along with him. This has nothing to do with educational levels and/or obesity nationwide: it's his lead-in to his second point, the statistics on the percentage of people at each educational level who were considered morbidly obese. What we're missing is the other half of the picture, namely what percentage of the population _as a whole_ is considered morbidly obese. We are continually being told that 60% of the population is overweight OR obese, but this includes an awful lot of people whose BMIs are in the mid-20's. It appears from the statistics that a larger percent of m.o. people have no high school education than have a higher level, but this may not be so: what is being expressed is the percentage of _each educational group_ that is m.o., and we don't have the full picture until we know how big each group is. Since most states mandate education to the age of 18, the number of people without a h.s. education is liable to be very low -- so that even very few m.o. individuals might appear to be a high percentage.



Thanks, i had been wondering the same thing about these stats. I will also add emphasis on the fact that while we hear that 60% are overweight or obese we rarely hear a statistic isolating the percentage of the population that is "morbidly obese" as opposed to the three groups (overweight, obese, m.o totaled together) in which case the study Bigmac quoted may not be off by as much as it appears on first glance. As for the last part I think the number of people with a high school diploma may be lower than you think though I think the conclusion you draw is still valid. I did want to mention that the compulsory education age is 16 in 26 states and 17 in others so that in less than half the states it is 18. 

Overall though I think my experience has been about the same as others, no lack of fat students at my school. Sure, only a handful of them would be considered clinically morbidly obese, but I think if you rounded up a group of strangers off the street, while many of them may be fat, the number considered M.O by clinical standards would probably only be in the single digit percentages as well.

Lastly I think the O.P mentioned something about a correlation between the numbers and access, referring to perhaps fat people opting out of college because it doesn't accommodate them or they fear it wont accommodate them, while this may be the case for those with severe anxiety, or those with mobility issues I think for the majority of fat folks this is really not the case. After a certain weight it obviously is an issue because of stairs, small desks and other things that I am sure have never even occurred to me, but since the majority of "fat" people probably fall under the 250 mark (assuming more people fall into the overweight or obese category than the M.O category- not on Dims but in the general population), and the percentage of the population probably shrinks as the numbers go to 300lbs, 400lbs etc. college is no more of a physical hurdle for most fatties than is any other activity, and in many places no more of a physical comfort issue than it is for someone thinner. At the same time I don't discount the fact that there is a correlation between poverty rates and obesity rates in the country and how that impacts the statistics. Hmm I don't think I am making my point clearly but hopefully the idea comes through...


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## bigmac (Sep 9, 2009)

Lots of good responses and so little time to respond. First, it would be great to have more complete and more up to date data -- unfortunately the JAMA study was all I could find. I see lots of potential for senior projects and graduate thesis's for the social science students out there. Now on to some specific responses. 



Australian Lord said:


> No, no, no. Affirmative action is quite possibly the worst thing that could be advocated. The equality of opportunity, not the equality of the quota.



I never mentioned or advocated affirmative action -- I just wanted to discuss probable reasons fat people are under represented in higher education. For me removing barriers, be they physical or psychological, is an essential component of equal opportunity. 



Friday said:


> I can't imagine how when 60% of the population is overweight they can claim that there are that few fatties in school.



One of the problems related the flood of "obesity epidemic" news stories is that statistics for overweight (just a little chubby), obese (slightly fat), and morbidly obese (fat to very fat) people are almost always grouped together. The vast majority of the overweight are only a few pounds over weight. These are not the people I'm talking about. Somewhere between 3 and 6 percent of the population is morbidly obese (BMI > 40 or more than 100lbs overweight). 



butch said:


> I sometimes have a hard time reading statistics, but those stats suggest that over 90% of 'morbidly obese' people don't even make it to high school? Or, if that is the percentage of 'morbidly obese' people that make up the portion of the population overall at any particular school, then less than 4% of the population is considered 'morbidly obese'? How can that be, when the media tells us we're all becoming super fat fatties?



The do not show that over 90% of the morbidly obese don't even make it to high school. They show that in the year 2000 3.4% of people without high school diplomas were morbidly obese (an over representation since at the time such people made up less than 3% of the total population). See my response to Friday's post regarding the media issue. 



TraciJo67 said:


> According to the same site, less than 3% of the population has a BMI of 40 or more (something I find hard to believe, actually). If we accept that statistic as valid, then I think it would naturally follow that the percentage enrolled in college would be right in line with the statistics that you quoted -- without any further explanation being necessary (i.e., analysis of why people are fat, self-esteem of fat people, etc).



For argument sake lets accept the 3% number. To be equally represented 30 out of every 1000 students would have to have a BMI > 40. The JAMA statistics show that only 12 out of every 1000 college graduates has a BMI > 40. In other words the graduation rate of such students is only 40% the expected rate.

My personal experience at grad school is even more stark. Using the 3% number one would expect that 33 of the 1100 students would of had a BMI > 40. Only one (1) did -- just 3.03% the expected rate.


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## joswitch (Sep 9, 2009)

Australian Lord said:


> The University of Queensland had plenty of "bigger" people, including oneself.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



"Affirmative action" is not the only "remediation"... both in thatgril08 and this thread people have already ID'd accomodations and "micro-transport" (lifts, campus shuttle buses) as issues... Fixing these does not = "Affirmative action"


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## tonynyc (Sep 9, 2009)

Australian Lord said:


> The University of Queensland had plenty of "bigger" people, including oneself.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Problem is that even when you had the era of no (AA) there was never a level playing field.


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## tonynyc (Sep 9, 2009)

bigmac said:


> Thatgirl08's recent post titled _"I can't be the only fat person to go to college"_ got me thinking. I looked back over my educational history and came to the conclusion that -- at least in the institutions I attended -- there is indeed a shortage of fat people on campus. Of the approximately 1100 students who passed through the doors of Lewis & Clark Law School while I was in attendance *only one (1)* would have been classified as class 3 obese (i.e. morbidly obese).
> 
> I searched to internet for demographic data and found a 2002 JAMA article with the following statistics based on 2000 data:
> 
> ...



_
BigMac:

Problem with this study is that it's very easy to abuse statistics. We've seen cases of this with The Bell Curve.

In addition, there current issues that may alter some of the initial findings...

1. the recession may prompt more folks to go back to school.

2. the rise of 'online' degrees - folks can literally study at the comfort of their own home. 

3. If we are goingto go by BMI heck wouldn't some of the athletes fit the profile....

_


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## bigmac (Sep 9, 2009)

Keb said:


> Not going to college was never even an option on the table in my family; it was simply understood that a bachelor's was the next step after high school. I mean, I did briefly say, "hey, some people take a year off and see the world, wouldn't that be neat!"--but that thought didn't go anywhere.
> 
> Of course, I went to a high school where about 97% of the students went directly to college afterwords, so I was pretty much surrounded by the assumption that college would happen.
> 
> ...



Excellent example of good parenting. My parents also simply expected that my bothers and I would go to college -- and we did -- even though we went to a high school were only 15% of the graduates went to 4 year college (for some reason my father quit his job as a math professor in New York and moved us to a farm in rural Alberta -- people did strange things in the 70s).

Unfortunately, not all high school students are as lucky as us. My darling mother in law repeatedly told my wife that college was not for her -- her POS stepfather brought home a Taco Bell uniform as graduation present. With her family being so negative she didn't realize that college was even a possibility until years later. Both her mother and stepfather didn't think their fat daughter would amount to anything unless she lost weight (and she wasn't even that fat in high school -- about 200lbs).

Regarding your second point -- the JAMA data looked at adults of all ages and separated them by educational attainment. Fat people were over represented in segment with the least education and underrepresented in the segment with the most.


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## katherine22 (Sep 10, 2009)

bigmac said:


> Lots of good responses and so little time to respond. First, it would be great to have more complete and more up to date data -- unfortunately the JAMA study was all I could find. I see lots of potential for senior projects and graduate thesis's for the social science students out there. Now on to some specific responses.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



I am finishing up a graduate degree most of it done online. When I attended my colloquiums I saw fat professors as well as fat adults earning advanced degrees. Maybe there appears to be less fat people in undergraduate school and high school since there are less fat people in that age cohort.


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## superodalisque (Sep 23, 2009)

do you think your lack of fat students is a regional thing? i' d have to say that at least 1/4 of my students are fat where i am in the south. i also agree with what Katherine said about a lot of fat folk in graduate school. its kind of nice to think that the old undereducated stereotype might just be on its way out.


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## thatgirl08 (Sep 23, 2009)

This is an interesting thread. Thanks for starting it BigMac.

From my observations at my school, I can tell a pretty good percentage of the people there are some varying degree of fatness. I'm far from being the biggest.. I've noticed quite a few guys and girls who have at least 50, if not more, pounds on me. It's strange because at my high school I was definitely the biggest girl in my graduating class and I can only think of a few throughout my entire four years there that were my size and only one that was bigger than me and since she graduated 2 years before me, I was easily the biggest girl at my high school. I've only noticed one extremely large person at my school, he's probably about 450 and maybe a bit taller than me... 5'8" or 5'9" and I noticed he seemed to have some mobility issues but looked like he was getting by okay albeit slowly. 

Some of my friends and ex-classmates (from HS) go to regular 4 year colleges or universities and one thing I've noticed is that there is significantly less fat people.. some chubby ones, yes but no one over 250 probably (of course this is based on who I meet or see in pictures.) My cousin is about 230 5'5" and she told me she was one of the biggest in her sorority.. she goes to a fairly pretigious private school in Ohio. For some reason, it seems like fat people are more likely to go to CC than a four year school off the bat.. I assume this has something to do with the socioeconomic factor of fat people being more poor as a whole. 

As far as reasons why fat people don't go to college.. I'd say nervousness surrounding mobility/accomodation issues would probably be pretty significant, especially for those who are SS. However, part of me wonders if self esteem problems could be to blame too or maybe social anxiety or problems meeting/making/keeping friends. College is a social place, with TONS of people and activity, I think if you were shy or had self esteem issues that could be very intimidating and you might want to avoid it all together. Obviously self esteem problems are not limited solely to fat people but it is a very real issue that many fat people face at some point in their lives.


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## mithrandirjn (Sep 23, 2009)

I graduated my undergrad program in 2007, and I don't think these numbers are completely empty.

I mean, let's just use cold, hard logic here: the majority of students on any given campus in an undergrad are between the ages of 18-23, which means most have faster metabolisms. Huge numbers of these schools also grant access for students to gyms and fitness/rec centers (which I took advantage of a lot while in school). Many, many students also don't bring cars to school if they live on campus, and thus walk almost everywhere.

And let's not forget, either, the overriding issue of being a poor college student, which I remember leading me to nights of sitting down to a dinner of popcorn and some celery I had in the fridge topped with peanut butter.

And, finally, many students in college (obviously not all, by any stretch of the imagination) come from backgrounds that can at least partially afford to pay for a college education, and, typically, the more affluent the background, the less likely the person will be obese. 

This is obviously not meant as "obese = poor", especially given what I just said about poor college students being skinny in many cases, but the logic is there to support this. Doesn't mean the numbers are all accurate or haven't been fudged with at all, but a combination of youth/metabolism, active lifestyle, lack of funds for going out to bars, access to rec centers, and various other factors often mean that you won't find many students on campus who qualify as more than just moderately obese.

As pure anecdotal evidence, I guess I can just say I knew plenty of people on campus (and I was on a HUGE campus that basically was located in two different towns) who were clearly overweight, but very, very few who could've qualified as overly obese.


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## thatgirl08 (Sep 23, 2009)

mithrandirjn said:


> I graduated my undergrad program in 2007, and I don't think these numbers are completely empty.
> **SNIP FOR LENGTH**As pure anecdotal evidence, I guess I can just say I knew plenty of people on campus (and I was on a HUGE campus that basically was located in two different towns) who were clearly overweight, but very, very few who could've qualified as overly obese.



You're basing this a lot on stereotypes of college students and campuses so I thought I'd bring up two common ones that go against what you're saying.

1. College students party a lot.. alcohol has lots of calories in it, especially when mixed with other things like soda or juice, plus drunk food runs, and of course if weed is introduced into the equation, it's an appetite stimulant, etc.

2. Freshmen 15?


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## KnottyOne (Sep 23, 2009)

I don't know if my college was weird, or skewed or what, but I can honestly say that there was a complete shortage. I went to a small private college of about 7,000 undergrads in Philadelphia, and I can honestly say, there was like NOOOOOOO fat people there. In my 4 years I can honestly say that there were no more than 50 truly fat people (over 300ish lbs) who went to school there during my time, and most of them were linemen for the football team. 

There were some chubby people but not a lot. All and all it was weird, most people were really skinny, tons of bean poles and really athletic people. I don't know if thats because there weren't a lot of people, or because it was private or what, but it was weird, barely any fat or chubby people, I just kinda scratched my head and went with the flow.


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## thatgirl08 (Sep 23, 2009)

Also another point I want to bring up.. it probably has a lot to do with where your school is located & what the majority of people there major in. For example, at a local SUNY near me 2 of the top 3 majors are physical education and dance (the third being nursing or something) Of course that school is likely to have more people on the smaller side. I'm not saying all fat people = out of shape but I'm sure most people wanting to be professional ballerinas and gym teachers are on the thin side.


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## mithrandirjn (Sep 23, 2009)

thatgirl08 said:


> You're basing this a lot on stereotypes of college students and campuses so I thought I'd bring up two common ones that go against what you're saying.
> 
> 1. College students party a lot.. alcohol has lots of calories in it, especially when mixed with other things like soda or juice, plus drunk food runs, and of course if weed is introduced into the equation, it's an appetite stimulant, etc.
> 
> 2. Freshmen 15?



The freshman 15 would not account for somebody weighing over 300 pounds. If a guy or girl who's in the typical teenage weight range goes to college and gains even up to 30 pounds, it wouldn't put them at that level.

Now, if they get to school and make major league changes to their eating and living habits? Obviously, they could gain significantly, but the vast majority of college students aren't going to gain that much just because of drinking a lot and eating dining hall food for a few semesters.


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## MatthewB (Sep 24, 2009)

Just in case anybody's listening, I counted fifteen fat female college students on my campus today... and that's _not_ counting the ones with a little paunch on 'em.


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## 1300 Class (Sep 24, 2009)

> Just in case anybody's listening, I counted fifteen fat female college students on my campus today... and that's not counting the ones with a little paunch on 'em.


All in the name of like research.


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## FatAndProud (Sep 24, 2009)

MatthewB said:


> Just in case anybody's listening, I counted fifteen fat female college students on my campus today... and that's _not_ counting the ones with a little paunch on 'em.



lol i hope you weren't a creep about it. i'd feel weird being "counted" lol


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## Brach311 (Sep 24, 2009)

Our school has about 25,000 students and it is REALLY spread out and I have noticed that there is a definite shortage of curvy girls...I kinda summed it up to all the walking that must be done to get to our classes must be keeping everyone pretty trim.


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## bmann0413 (Sep 24, 2009)

I dunno, I've seen plenty of overweight people in my school.


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## cheekyjez (Sep 24, 2009)

Something I had at uni were the Access, Outreach, and Target Schools programmes, which focussed on picking up students from non-traditional (i.e. rich and white) backgrounds. They did presentations at the schools, guides on applying, and things like tours and shadowing programmes. 

In my first year, I had a shadow from an inner city state school who didn't really know what he wanted to do. He then applied to my college, aced the entrance exam and got 1st Class Honors in his exams every year. If he hadn't shadowed me for a week, he'd never have applied.

There's no affirmative action there - kids from worse schools don't get "bonus points" on the entrance exam - but it raises awareness that yes, Oxford is for YOU, among smart people who feel they've got no chance because of their background.

Why do I bring this up? Well, maybe some kind of outreach would make college more attractive to heavier folks. TG08 was really worried about fitting the seats - an opportunity ahead of time to check them out would quell that. Fortunately, she wasn't so worried about it that she didn't show up or didn't apply, but there are people who do. Which, in purely utilitarian terms means that society loses someone who could discover a clean way of generating energy.


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## thatgirl08 (Sep 24, 2009)

mithrandirjn said:


> The freshman 15 would not account for somebody weighing over 300 pounds. If a guy or girl who's in the typical teenage weight range goes to college and gains even up to 30 pounds, it wouldn't put them at that level.
> 
> Now, if they get to school and make major league changes to their eating and living habits? Obviously, they could gain significantly, but the vast majority of college students aren't going to gain that much just because of drinking a lot and eating dining hall food for a few semesters.



Although probably generally true, I'm just saying the freshmen fifteen wouldn't exist if every college student was starving, walking everywhere & taking advantage of school gyms.


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## mithrandirjn (Sep 28, 2009)

thatgirl08 said:


> Although probably generally true, I'm just saying the freshmen fifteen wouldn't exist if every college student was starving, walking everywhere & taking advantage of school gyms.



Hah, true, but hence the title "Freshman". I know it's only anecdotal, but I know that happened to me; I got to college, had a TON of meals on my meal plan, had to get used to a new lifestyle, etc., and gained weight my first year.

By the time I was more settled in, I started losing weight due to my lifestyle, and, later, gym trips.


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## moore2me (Sep 28, 2009)

mithrandirjn said:


> I graduated my undergrad program in 2007, and I don't think these numbers are completely empty.
> 
> I mean, let's just use cold, hard logic here: the majority of students on any given campus in an undergrad are between the ages of 18-23, which means most have faster metabolisms. Huge numbers of these schools also grant access for students to gyms and fitness/rec centers (which I took advantage of a lot while in school). Many, many students also don't bring cars to school if they live on campus, and thus walk almost everywhere.
> 
> ...



I never thought much about it until Mithrandirjn's piece, but that's probably true in that college students being usually younger and more active will probably have the lowest BMI of their lives. As we get older and more sedentary (tied to our jobs & homes, etc.) our weight tend to go up. I know mine & my college mates have. So, the future fatties are at college, they may not have developed fully yet.

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And, just an little story the younger women in the readership out in DIMMER Land. *I think it is great that we are having this discussion about weight discrimination. *

Why, you ask? Because some of the colleges I tried to get into in 1974 *had blatant SEX discrimination*. I applied to three states trying to get into veterinary schools. In each case, the student bodies were comprised of approximately 95% men. The were few slots for women & even fewer slots for "chubby" women. After being interviewed & tested, etc., I realized my chance of getting picked for veterinary class was equal to being married to the Prince of Monaco.

Now, I believe the classes are more balanced to reflect the population in that women and men are more of a 50/50 balance. But, only thru discrimination laws was this possible.

Also, I have seen a small amount of the struggle of *African American* *students who have faced racial discrimination*. I am white so I cannot know the total fight in getting an equal education. But, let me say that I lived in the Little Rock, Arkansas area during the Central High School crisis. And, I understand that during the 70's and even perhaps decades after that, black women were discriminated against in the higher education system even more than my group.


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## MatthewB (Sep 28, 2009)

thatgirl08 said:


> Although probably generally true, I'm just saying the freshmen fifteen wouldn't exist if every college student was starving, walking everywhere & taking advantage of school gyms.


A lot of girls I've been talking to _do_ take time out to go to the school gyms, so... unfortunately, your point doesn't stand.


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## thatgirl08 (Sep 28, 2009)

MatthewB said:


> A lot of girls I've been talking to _do_ take time out to go to the school gyms, so... unfortunately, your point doesn't stand.



Well, maybe in your neck of the woods but clearly that cannot be true for every college girl at every college or like I said, the freshmen fifteen wouldn't exist. Just speaking from my personal experience here, but none of my friends go to the gym at my college (or at all actually)


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## squeezablysoft (Mar 31, 2016)

*So far I have only been to visit my university-to-be (it is official though, I've been accepted for this fall  ), but I did spy a few bigger students, I would say less than in the general population though. In fact I sat next to a BBW in the art class I visited and had supper with an adorably husky fellow, here he is holding my food for me to photograph (so far I have eaten 4 meals on campus and photographed all of them). He ate 3 or 4 burger patties and that was it, said he was on a diet "I usually only eat vegetables and chicken. It's horrible." I told him I didn't think he needed a diet, he said thank you and blushed a little.* 

View attachment Yum.jpg


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