# Girly yucky stuff.



## Emma (Jan 26, 2006)

Do any of the ladies here find they have erratic periods due to their size. Mine have always been crazy but it's going on 6 months since I've had one. Just wondering if anyone else has this problem.


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## MisticalMisty (Jan 26, 2006)

Unfortunately yes...I went 4 years without one because I had become so heavy and was producing so much testosterone...I would advise you to go ahead and see your OBGYN. I had to have uterne polyps removed last year because the years of not having a period. I was embarrased to go the dr...never again! I'm on birth control and now I'm regular and my periods are normal.


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## Emma (Jan 26, 2006)

I've been to my doctors, had blood tests and a scan. I've not actually got polycystic ovaries. I've got a few of the symptoms though. Excess hair, lack of periods, and other yucky stuff.

Oh wait I misread your post. You weren't going on about pcos, lol. Heh i've had scans and shit.

second edit: the doctor won't put me on birth control.


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## TraciJo67 (Jan 26, 2006)

CurvyEm said:


> Do any of the ladies here find they have erratic periods due to their size. Mine have always been crazy but it's going on 6 months since I've had one. Just wondering if anyone else has this problem.



Yes, I had that problem. Not only would I skip some months, others I would menstruate twice ... or for weeks at a time. 

Six months is really a long time to be without a period. Really, you need to go to the doctor and figure out what's going on with your body. It could be a simple matter of needing some hormone shots.


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## BBWMoon (Jan 26, 2006)

Misty, you're smarter than me.

I'm still hiding behind my rock. *It's a nice rock.*

How long? You don't want to know. (Uncertain if I can have kids...)


I suggest everyone be stronger than me and carry a hammer, so when 

they're mean to you, you just bop them over the head.


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## Emma (Jan 26, 2006)

Can I join you behind your rock?


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## MisticalMisty (Jan 26, 2006)

BBWMoon said:


> Misty, you're smarter than me.
> 
> I'm still hiding behind my rock. *It's a nice rock.*
> 
> ...



 the only thing that really helped me go is I found a woman..and she was really nice and I felt really comfortable..I'm now with a man...and I just had my annual last month..and he was very nice and kept me calm...so..GOOOOOO!


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## altered states (Jan 26, 2006)

CurvyEm said:


> Do any of the ladies here find they have erratic periods due to their size. Mine have always been crazy but it's going on 6 months since I've had one. Just wondering if anyone else has this problem.



For the record, it's not mine. I haven't been to Blackpool in years.


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## Emma (Jan 26, 2006)

tres huevos said:


> For the record, it's not mine. I haven't been to Blackpool in years.



:shocked: :shocked: :shocked: :shocked: :shocked: :shocked: :shocked:


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## ChickletsBBW (Jan 26, 2006)

ugh... yes

I'd say most large women that I know including myself have had some sort of these problems at least once..
I used to have 2-3 weeks of heavy flow.. (what i now refer to as my "niagra falls" time period) lol 
I got on birth control to see if that would help and was on it for over a year and it really didn't do much to help me be regular or anything.. so.. I asked my Dr.. what else could I try? He said i could try Depo.. ooh.. I love it.. 
I've been on depo for about 3 years now. Because of my weight, I get my shot every 8 weeks instead of the normal 12 weeks 

Em.. you REALLY need to get a second opinion about birth control. Unless you have terribly high and uncontrolled blood pressure or some other underlying problem.. I don't know why your Dr would say you shouldn't be on BC.


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## Robin Rocks (Jan 26, 2006)

I'm one of the fortunate, or unfortunate depending on how you look at it, that is completely regular. Other than my cycle is only about 26 days long versus 28 days. I'm in so much pain the first two days and think I'm hemmorrhaging but after those two days it's pretty smooth sailing for the remainder 3-4 days of it.

Speaking of depo, I tried it for about six months and had to stop it because I gained over 20 pounds and wasn't doing anything differently. My ob/gyn said weight gain was a side effect. Another side effect is calcium loss. I took a calcium pill while on it.


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## LillyBBBW (Jan 26, 2006)

Heh, looks like I might be the bastard child in this family get together. My 'aunt flo' has impeccable timing, you could set your watch to her. Although, like me, she's heavy as hell and hangs around here way too long for my tastes.

I took birth control pills a few years ago and suffered from serious complications and was hospitalized. I can never touch them. My sister has to take birth control all the time though because if she didn't her 'aunt flo' would never show up. She's got PCOS.


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## RedHead (Jan 26, 2006)

CurvyEm said:


> Do any of the ladies here find they have erratic periods due to their size. Mine have always been crazy but it's going on 6 months since I've had one. Just wondering if anyone else has this problem.



When I was at my heaviest (over 300) my cycles were normal and like clockwork - now that I've had WLS it's sporatic - it also could be my age (40) and I could be starting the "change of life"

On a personal note; about the "having kids" my doctor told me (when I was heavy) that it wouldn't be easy to get pregnant, but he had some suggestions that would help. Anyway I never used his service - I decided not have my own kids.

I hope that helps, but most importantly - please go see an OBGYN - just get checked out and rule out anything else!


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## Vince (Jan 26, 2006)

We haven't had these disclosures since Evoc posted about her plumbing problems. Do you ladies have no shame discussing your taboo business in a public forum! Why, I just don't know where to look. This place is starting to sound like a hen's party! Oh, commisserations to all you hapless sufferers. Thanks for sharing!


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## LillyBBBW (Jan 26, 2006)

Well whadda you know. Looks like we've cause almighty Vince to shield his eyes. You can't operate the machine unless you know how it works.


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## ChickletsBBW (Jan 26, 2006)

ah yes... look what came out of the hole in the wall.
and i'm pretty sure Em made it clear on the post that her topic was about girly yucky stuff.. so.. you looked.. lol

ANYWAY..
Yes i've heard Depo makes some people gain weight..
however.. I've been fat lol and I don't think I gained any when I started using it.. no more weight from regularly not exercising, unhealthy foods etc lol (i've been about this same size since um... 01?)
and yes I take 1200mg of calcium a day.. but it's all worth it for me.


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## Jes (Jan 26, 2006)

Vince said:


> . Do you ladies have no shame discussing your taboo business in a public forum!



Well, I guess we figured you don't, so we don't!


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## Vince (Jan 26, 2006)

Being an avid corporeal engineer I am keen to learn about the disorders of the female body. Let us make today gynaecology day!


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## Andromeda (Jan 26, 2006)

Here's a possible explanation of why BBWs may go without menstrual cycles for a while:

Adipocytes (fat cells) produce a neurohormone called leptin, which is believed to be a permissive factor in activation of pubertal axis AND maintenance of reproductive function.

When you have a lot of these cells, you can make so much leptin that its receptor becomes desensitized, hence menstruation may stop or start occurring at irregular intervals.

We've been discussing the topic to death in neuroendocrinology seminars lately, so I thought I might share


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## AnnMarie (Jan 26, 2006)

No issues at all since going on the pill when I was about 19. 

Prior to that, horrible.... horrible. About twice a year, and excrutiating (doubled over on bathroom floor in my dorm, pretty sure I was dying) pain. 

Since then, been on the pill, low estrogen variety, and it's clockwork. Occasionally it's still sort of crampy and unpleasant, but I've been told that's due to a tipped uterus. 

Good luck, Em, but don't let it go on indefinately without getting something regular happening. 

(Oh, and yeah, I don't get the no on the pill thing... I've been on for about 16 years, and been told by more than one doctor that they wouldn't take me off based on my past history of trouble... I also don't smoke, so there is no combined issues they're concerned over.)


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## saucywench (Jan 26, 2006)

BBWMoon said:


> Misty, you're smarter than me.
> 
> I'm still hiding behind my rock. *It's a nice rock.*
> 
> ...


 
Allie, I am reading between the lines here, but I take it that you are avoiding seeking treatment by a physician out of fear of being chastized about your weight. I can't tell you how dismayed and sad this makes me feel.

Please do not let this hold you back from seeking the care that you owe yourself. You must first adopt the attitude of being your own best advocate, and that entails standing up for yourself. There is nowhere in any medical code of ethics that would suggest that it is acceptable to treat a fat patient any differently than a person of any other size. The NAAFA site has a Declaration of Health Rights for Fat People. I would first familiarize myself with the contents of this document. Print a few copies out to have on hand. Then get on the phone and start calling around. You live in Brooklyn, right? Work in Manhattan? Maybe each of those boroughs has its own medical board, or medical society. At the very least, the county will have one. Call and see if they have recommendations of fat-friendly doctors. If you are restricted through your work insurance as to which providers you can see, call their info line and ask them the same thing. When you get a few names and numbers down, start calling and simply get blunt with them. Ask them outright if they have any specific policies on the care and treatment of fat patients. If they appear clueless to your inquiry, simply move on and do not waste any more time with them. Clinics or doctor's offices who treat fat patients on a regular basis should not find this question odd, and should answer you with reassurance and put you at ease.

I would also suggest familiarizing yourself with the Hippocratic Oath, which in many teaching centers medical residents swear to (or some version of it) during graduation ceremonies. I have included both classic and modern translations below:
*Classic Version of the Hippocratic Oath*

I swear by Apollo Physician and Asclepius and Hygieia and Panaceia and all the gods and goddesses, making them my witnesses, that I will fulfil according to my ability and judgment this oath and this covenant: 
To hold him who has taught me this art as equal to my parents and to live my life in partnership with him, and if he is in need of money to give him a share of mine, and to regard his offspring as equal to my brothers in male lineage and to teach them this art - if they desire to learn it - without fee and covenant; to give a share of precepts and oral instruction and all the other learning to my sons and to the sons of him who has instructed me and to pupils who have signed the covenant and have taken an oath according to the medical law, but no one else. 
I will apply dietetic measures for the benefit of the sick according to my ability and judgment; *I will keep them from harm and injustice*. 
I will neither give a deadly drug to anybody who asked for it, nor will I make a suggestion to this effect. Similarly I will not give to a woman an abortive remedy. In purity and holiness I will guard my life and my art. 
I will not use the knife, not even on sufferers from stone, but will withdraw in favor of such men as are engaged in this work. 
Whatever houses I may visit, I will come for the benefit of the sick, *remaining free of all intentional injustice*, of all mischief and in particular of sexual relations with both female and male persons, be they free or slaves. 
What I may see or hear in the course of the treatment or even outside of the treatment in regard to the life of men, which on no account one must spread abroad, I will keep to myself, holding such things shameful to be spoken about. If I fulfil this oath and do not violate it, may it be granted to me to enjoy life and art, being honored with fame among all men for all time to come; if I transgress it and swear falsely, may the opposite of all this be my lot.
*A Modern Version of the Hippocratic Oath*

I swear to fulfill, to the best of my ability and judgment, this covenant: 
I will respect the hard-won scientific gains of those physicians in whose steps I walk, and gladly share such knowledge as is mine with those who are to follow. 
I will apply, for the benefit of the sick, all measures which are required, avoiding those twin traps of overtreatment and therapeutic nihilism. *I will remember that there is art to medicine as well as science, and that warmth, sympathy, and understanding may outweigh the surgeon's knife or the chemist's drug.*

Please don't waver about this. Good luck. (And if I misread, incorrectly, please let me know.)


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## BBWMoon (Jan 26, 2006)

Wow, Saucy. You told me in chat that you posted to me, and I'm shocked to see you took so much thought and time into it. Thank you so much!

Well, because it's been fifteen years now since the crap hit the fan, so to speak, I don't have a problem sharing some information. (I mentioned it a few years ago, as well... I remember).

I was sexually molested as a small child by close friends of my family. All emotion aside, it affected the way I grew up in my body. It IS NOT the REASON I am big, but it attributes to the fact. I was very timid when it came to my physical development, the best I can describe it, is I never quite left the ugly duckling stage. I never felt, (Probably will never feel) really good in my own skin.

It affected me both mentally and physically. First, mentally. I was ashamed of my body. For instance, My Mother changed the laundry detergent to TIDE, which I was unknowingly HIGHLY allergic to. I was little and can you believe that I suffered with this for a long period of time? My Mother finally saw that I had scratched my legs to oblivion. Also, When I became of age (Period @ 9), I didn't tell anyone. I just knew what to do. Eventually I told my Mom.

This affected me during school as well, I just daydreamed myself into the walls and even though my grades suffered, life didn't really change.

When I gained weight as a Teen, I lost my period. It would come back, every now and again. I wasn't concerned.

Long story, short. In my early 20's the story of my abuse came out. My mother found a letter I had written, tucked inside one of my books. (I never expected anyone to ever find it). One of the abusers had been a Catholic Priest, and it was a long emotional road ahead.

This is when my body clock completely haulted. A few years went by, and I visited a fatphobic Doctor, who put me through four months of unbelievable womanly hell, then to a fatphobic specialist who degraded me in front of his thin nurse, while I lay on his table. Heck, I was 250lbs? PLEASE!
He stopped my clock again.

I'm being poetic here, but at that point, I didn't give a damn about my clock, because my body was still learning to tell time!

Then again, after I turned 30, I found another Doctor... but that lasted a short run.

I'm slowly doing things for myself, Wow, especially these past few months. I guess I'm sick of feeling run down with my back, and in pain. SO I CAN be my own advocate... when I want/need to.

But I have to push myself, because I can so very easily exist behind layers of pain, or discomfort for long periods of time... even with a smile on my face.(This is not a gift but a result of what happened when I was a Child).

My childhood wasn't all that bad... I think I did the best that I could, and I'm a pretty content adult now. I have a great career, I love to travel, I have quite a few goals (accomplished and yet to accomplish) and I'm a nice person.

But when it comes to doing things _for myself_...


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## Jes (Jan 26, 2006)

I feel for you, dear. I have 2 good friends who also experienced abuse as children (sexual) and every year, during their annual gyn exams, they just cry the entire way through. From start to stop, they weep. They've each built a relationship with a doctor who knows he's not hurting her or degrading her--he doesn't get scared anymore when they cry. And the docs have said it's not so uncommon at all for women to just cry during the whole event (for the same reason they are0


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## FreeThinker (Jan 26, 2006)

Vince said:


> Being an avid corporeal engineer I am keen to learn about the disorders of the female body. Let us make today gynaecology day!


*'Disorders'?*

(I may be playing into his hands by posting this, but) Grow up!

Act your _age_, *Vince*, not your _I.Q._

Sometimes I'm ashamed to be a male...


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## BBWMoon (Jan 27, 2006)

Jes said:


> I feel for you, dear. I have 2 good friends who also experienced abuse as children (sexual) and every year, during their annual gyn exams, they just cry the entire way through. From start to stop, they weep. They've each built a relationship with a doctor who knows he's not hurting her or degrading her--he doesn't get scared anymore when they cry. And the docs have said it's not so uncommon at all for women to just cry during the whole event (for the same reason they are0




I'm not someone who would cry in front of a Doctor. And actually, I don't have sexual hang ups as a result of my past, either. My issue is control.

I'm in control of my body, and I let very few professionals near me enough to judge me. If I get beyond that, then I'm comfortable.

(For instance, my regular Doctor is good, now. & my podiatrist!)

Now to find a good gyno...


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## Janet (Jan 27, 2006)

Hi. I have to second what Mystical Misty said. I went for a long time without periods and without going to the doctor--and when I finally did, they had to do a D & C because I had developed simple hyperplasia (overgrowth of the lining of the uterus). What is scary is that if the overgrowth is left unchecked for a long time, the cells can begin to morph and become cancerous.

I was lucky--and Em, this doesn't happen in 6 months---it took a few years, but still, just be aware.

I do have PCOS and part of my problem is unopposed estrogen. Birth control pills just make me bleed uncontrollably, so I've resorted to using natural progesterone cream. I rub it on for about 10 days and then stop (it simulates the bodies natural rise and sudden drop of progesterone after ovulation) and usually have a period about a week later. (Oops I haven't done this in awhile--it's time, ugh.)

I also have sexual abuse in my history--and horrible experiences with insensitive doctors who blamed everything on me being fat. For years, I let those things prevent me from taking care of myself--and by the time I got up the nerve to get help, the situation was more scary than any memories of abuse or fatphobic humiliation would have been. (Ok, maybe not, but let me say it for dramatic emphasis anyway  

As I read this thread, I am so impressed with the wealth of experience and wisdom here. I am proud to be a part of it--and it's nice to be able to share some of this stuff with people who understand.


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## BigGirlSea (Jan 27, 2006)

Em-

I would talk to the doctor about this again or get a second opinion from someone else. Also it is completely possible to have PCOS without the cysts... and you can be treated for this without the cysts as well. 

If I don't do something to induce a period (provera) I don't know how long I would go before I have one. My endocrinologist, naturopath, GYN, regular doc and the reproductive endo I have seen all reccomended not going longer than three months without bleeding. It's really important that your uterine lining get shed regularly. 

I also firmly believe that if I had gotten my menstural irregularities treated when they first started (at about 20 and the doctor said - don't worry about it just make sure you have a period every three months) I could have avoided some of the problems I have now - especially weight gain which I am sure was PCOS related. ICK!

Good luck!


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## Emma (Jan 27, 2006)

Vince said:


> We haven't had these disclosures since Evoc posted about her plumbing problems. Do you ladies have no shame discussing your taboo business in a public forum! Why, I just don't know where to look. This place is starting to sound like a hen's party! Oh, commisserations to all you hapless sufferers. Thanks for sharing!



I think you'll find i made it clear when I posted that it was 'girly yucky stuff'. I don't know a lot of other big ladies to ask, so here is best. 

If you dislike the place so much... go away!


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## LillyBBBW (Jan 27, 2006)

Vince said:


> Being an avid corporeal engineer I am keen to learn about the disorders of the female body. Let us make today gynaecology day!



Now THAT made me laugh. If the conversation so far hasn't scared you away you are to be commended.


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## LillyBBBW (Jan 27, 2006)

BBWMoon said:


> I'm not someone who would cry in front of a Doctor. And actually, I don't have sexual hang ups as a result of my past, either. My issue is control.
> 
> I'm in control of my body, and I let very few professionals near me enough to judge me. If I get beyond that, then I'm comfortable.
> 
> ...



It's nice when you have a good doctor that you have a rapor with. Especially for a gyno, it's when and where you are most vulnerable. I made the mastake of staying with a few fat phobic doctors that I wasn't comfortable with and they turned out to be very bad doctors. Bear in mind that even the best doctor in the world is no good if you're scared to go to them. I know I'm preaching to the choir on this but just to reenforce, if you don't feel comfortable with your gyno, find another.


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## mybluice (Jan 27, 2006)

I am going to be the odd one in this post, I have regular periods like clockwork every 28 days and they last 3-4 days...very light and no cramping (thank god). I was like this before I started taking birth control and since taking birth control have remained the same. I only take the birth control because I am so fertile I could get pregnant just by a man being in the same room j/k. I found the best physician's assistant at the gyno office I go to, she will fight for you if you won't do it for yourself.

I guess my main reason for posting is I want you to know that had my mom not gone to the gyno on a regular basis even though she is 69 and no longer having periods I would have lost her last year to uterine cancer. So, no matter what your weight or whether or not you have periods it is so important to have a yearly to catch these things.


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## TallFatSue (Jan 27, 2006)

CurvyEm said:


> Do any of the ladies here find they have erratic periods due to their size. Mine have always been crazy but it's going on 6 months since I've had one. Just wondering if anyone else has this problem.


I have a fat-friendly gyno, have regular exams and so far so good. Some years my periods were verrrry erratic, and some years they were so regular I swear they know the calendar and adjust for leap year too. Now as I approach menopause, all bets are off. I just went 3 or 4 months with no period, and then suddenly last week I had one with about triple my usual flow for the first 2 days, as if it were making up for lost time (thank goodness my vacation is next week). On the bright side, I had almost no cramps for a change. Now I'm trying to eat some iron-rich foods (short of eating anvils) to replenish the iron in my blood. I'd like to know what experiences other women have had with menopause.

Sue



FreeThinker said:


> Act your _age_, *Vince*, not your _I.Q._


Oy vey! Is he still here? I love the ignore feature, but if he's still poking his, er, nose into stuff I'd prefer not to write any more about this personal issue.


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## BBWMoon (Jan 27, 2006)

TallFatSue said:


> (short of eating anvils)




This was so funny. You crack me up, Sue!


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## JoyJoy (Jan 27, 2006)

BBWMoon said:


> Well, because it's been fifteen years now since the crap hit the fan, so to speak, I don't have a problem sharing some information. (I mentioned it a few years ago, as well... I remember).
> 
> I was sexually molested as a small child by close friends of my family. All emotion aside, it affected the way I grew up in my body. It IS NOT the REASON I am big, but it attributes to the fact. I was very timid when it came to my physical development, the best I can describe it, is I never quite left the ugly duckling stage. I never felt, (Probably will never feel) really good in my own skin.
> 
> ...


 
Wow, Allie, we have so much in common. My memories of my childhood are very cloudy. I suffered abuse at the hands of my father, which actually stemmed from my allergic reactions to several different types of soaps, bubble baths, etc. This caused me to detach myself mentally from my physical self for most of my life. 


I spent most of my childhood being ashamed and painfully self-conscious. I just knew that people were always looking at me and thinking how odd I looked; so I wrapped myself up in those layers you wrote of. I was so completely immersed in my bubble of self-protection that I allowed much of my life go by without allowing myself to experience many of the joys of growing up...swimming, playing sports, being involved in social activites...I just would NOT put myself out there. I was in girl scouts for awhile, but my mother would have to FORCE me to go to meetings, and forget trying to sell cookies (back then, in small-town Kansas, it was still safe to go door-to-door). I attempted playing on the girls basketball team in the 7th grade, but that didn't last long. I think I played in 2 games and then quit because I couldn't handle the pressure of being in shorts in front of all of those people. I was always a thin child and teenager, but had convinced myself that I was fat and ugly, and that my body was something to be ashamed of. 

These feelings continued into adulthood, and are part of what wrecked my marriage. I know this has been the mantra of many here, but it wasn't until I found Dimensions (many, many kudos to Conrad) and interacted with strong, vibrant and beautiful women, that I realized that I had nothing to be ashamed of and how important it is to take care of myself, physically as well as emotionally. The scars of the past are well-healed now, but I still deal with the effects they have had on me. I still prefer my solitude much of the time..but now it's because I know that is my nature, and not because I'm hiding or protecting myself from anything. All that time spent in my own little world definitely made me who I am today: a person who does things in my own time, in my own way, (sometimes appearing irresponsible or neglectful), and usually against "the crowd". But I usually like the sound of my own proverbial "drummer".

All that being said, I realize my post is a bit off-topic..I apologize for that, Em..I'm not trying to hijack the thread. Allie's post struck a chord in me and I felt compelled to reply. I guess one message I'm trying to convey (which is on-topic, after all) is how important it is to not let a negative body image or fear of doctors keep you from seeking medical care. As Allie said, control is a huge issue in my life, and part of that control is allowing myself to be subject to whatever discomfort I must in order to ensure my own health. I know well what it's like to stay away from the doctor out of fear or insecurity, or whatever excuse I can come up with at any given time...but it's only to my own detriment that I do so. 

Em...in regard to your question (finally!) Yes..I've always had erratic periods, but they began when I was 15 and very thin..so I don't know that my weight has anything to do with that. I do now have many of the signs of pcos (excess hair, irregular period, etc), although I haven't been diganosed with it. If you haven't already, I encourage you to see a physician to talk about it openly and see what he says. 

I love that we can all be so open with each other...as I've said before, this place really does rock!


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## bigsexy920 (Jan 27, 2006)

Thanks for sharing girls :bow:


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## Emma (Jan 27, 2006)

I've had blood tests and scans of my insides to check for PCOS, but i've not got it.

The excess hair REALLY bothers me. I wonder if many big women have that too? 

The only thing the doctor has said is wrong with me is excess testosterone caused by my weight.


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## LillyBBBW (Jan 27, 2006)

CurvyEm said:


> I've had blood tests and scans of my insides to check for PCOS, but i've not got it.
> 
> The excess hair REALLY bothers me. I wonder if many big women have that too?
> 
> The only thing the doctor has said is wrong with me is excess testosterone caused by my weight.



I have excess hair issues too though my tests also come out normal. I remember reading about a year or so ago that there has been some arguing among researchers as to weather or not the criteria for PCOS testing is raised a bit too high. Could be truth or it could be another scam for more research money, you never can tell in this sick sad world.

But I digress. Yes, I have a significant chin hair problem though I don't have any other symptoms of PCOS besides. It seems a common enough phenom for a lot of people, not just fat.


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## Jane (Jan 27, 2006)

I'm 52 years old, have one child, 27. I always had regular periods, until I developed uterine fibroids. I nearly bled to death before I got treatment. My iron was so low, the doctor couldn't believe I didn't pass out.

I was put on Depo Provera, and loved it. I was on it for years and years. Then I turned 50. The doctor won't give me Depo anymore, so now I'm having erratic periods, none for six months, have them for three months....typical menopausal stuff, but no more of the attempting to bleed to death.

My best suggestion is to write a COMPLETE medical history and take it in to your first doctor's visit. Make sure they READ IT, asking questions as they go. This prepares the doctor for where you're coming from and what you expect. Also, it's so much easier than thinking of all of it sitting in the waiting room or once you get into the exam room.


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## dreamer72fem (Jan 27, 2006)

I am one of those who have never been to a doctor for the womanly things. I NEED to find a fat friendly one because I know things are exactly normal. And I know that has alot to do with my weight...but many have told me that getting on the pill will help. But I am also afriad to go because someone may not be normal. I rarely have the problem of not having periods often..I sometimes have the opposite of getting them and having them FOREVER. It can get quite maddening at times. 
And Em I hear ya about the excess hair....I HATE IT. 
Stacey


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## olivefun (Jan 27, 2006)

Vince said:


> We haven't had these disclosures since Evoc posted about her plumbing problems. Do you ladies have no shame discussing your taboo business in a public forum! Why, I just don't know where to look. This place is starting to sound like a hen's party! Oh, commisserations to all you hapless sufferers. Thanks for sharing!



The idea that a part of our anatomy could be considered taboo, is new to me.
Any part. 

If men had periods, we would hear a lot more about how painful cramps are. This affects half the population.

Sometimes I think that if men had to see their own blood on their hands once a month, every month for years, for decades, they would see menstruation differently. Maybe it would be an issue of compassion.

Where else can we talk about how this affects us fat women, if not here?

Vince this thread is not intended for you.

Just don't read this thread.


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## toni (Jan 27, 2006)

Since this thread is girlie yucky stuff, I have a question. It is a little off topic but kind of still relates. Is there anyone here who has or has had an IUD? I really need a form of birth control, my system works pretty well now, I do not want to start messing with my hormones and chemical functions, so I do not think the pill, patch or shot is right for me.


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## Tina (Jan 28, 2006)

Toni, I've had an IUD and it worked pretty well. But what has been working even better is the Nuva Ring. It has a low dose hormone in it and you can either leave it in for three weeks, take it out and have a period then put a new one in in a week, or some just keep replacing it every three weeks if they don't want to have a period. That facet of it comes in very handy at times, when the b/f is in town. You might ask your gynie if maybe it could work for you.


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## toni (Jan 28, 2006)

Thanks for the info Tina, I am going to research this a little more. This looks a lot better then the IUD. I want to go into the doc with armed with all the info I can find.


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## LillyBBBW (Jan 28, 2006)

I can't take hormones of any kind. I finally decided on an IUD with no hormones and it has been fine. I've had no problems whatsoever and I've had it for about 12 years now.


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## toni (Jan 28, 2006)

Lilly, don't think I am a weirdo or anything but how did it feel when it was inserted? Did it hurt? Can you notice it at all? I am the biggest baby when it comes to pain.


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## Emma (Jan 28, 2006)

dreamer72fem said:


> And Em I hear ya about the excess hair....I HATE IT.
> Stacey



Yeah makes me feel like a freak. It has me in tears at least 3 times a week.


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## LillyBBBW (Jan 28, 2006)

toni said:


> Lilly, don't think I am a weirdo or anything but how did it feel when it was inserted? Did it hurt? Can you notice it at all? I am the biggest baby when it comes to pain.



I won't lie to you toni, it 'smarted.' Putting it in was not nearly as painful as I had imagined so that was pretty ok. But afterwards your body tries to position itself and get used to this new object so you'll have cramps for about a day. I took Advil and this took care of it though. After that process I've had no reminders that it's there. I had x-rays of my hip area last year and was astonished when I saw it there in the photo. I'd forgotten all about it. (my sex life = non-existant; so it's easy to do)


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## olivefun (Jan 28, 2006)

Yesterday when I posted the last message, I hadn't seen what went before, just the first few posts. 

I do want to urge you to go to your doctor. If you haven't one who you communicate properly with, find another. It is really worth it. 

I make my pap test and gynecological check up appointment every year at around valentine's day. Makes it easy to remember. 

I've had a problem with cushing's disease. It is unpleasant and often misdiagnosed because it is so rare.* Obesity, irregular periods, depression and excess hair growth* are common symptoms. 

Take a look here. 

http://www.niddk.nih.gov/health/endo/pubs/cushings/cushings.htm 
* 
The important thing is to find a proper doctor that can diagnose this and other unusual ailments.* 

The last time my test results showed cushings disease (june 2004) my life expectancy was a matter of a few months. 

Had I not caught it when I did, I would not be here to share this with you.

In my case, the cause of the excess cortisol was a brain tumour that had been removed in a hurry. I am fine now, but had I not been as vigilant, or had I a doctor that wasn't as on the ball, the results would not be as good. I won a few lotteries at that time and am very grateful for the good health I enjoy now.


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## Jane (Jan 28, 2006)

Excellent point olivefun. I'm so glad you posted this.


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## Jes (Jan 28, 2006)

CurvyEm said:


> Yeah makes me feel like a freak. It has me in tears at least 3 times a week.



I realize there are diffs between the US and UK in terms of medical treatments and availability of meds BUT there are several things I've seen advertised recently. An Rx cream which inhibits hair growth (takes 8 weeks to work, generally), commercially-available cheap (i.e., less than 10 bucks) lotions which reduce hair growth (Biore made one, I believe, though I know nothing more than that), laser treatments (pricey, but I say: if you have the money, pricey is worth it for anything that makes you cry 3x/week), etc.


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## LillyBBBW (Jan 28, 2006)

Jes said:


> I realize there are diffs between the US and UK in terms of medical treatments and availability of meds BUT there are several things I've seen advertised recently. An Rx cream which inhibits hair growth (takes 8 weeks to work, generally), commercially-available cheap (i.e., less than 10 bucks) lotions which reduce hair growth (Biore made one, I believe, though I know nothing more than that), laser treatments (pricey, but I say: if you have the money, pricey is worth it for anything that makes you cry 3x/week), etc.



My sister was in the same state over her chin hair. She finally paid to have laser hair removal which worked for a bit. She's had five sessions and the hair, although not as thick as before, still grows there. She says it wasn't a *total* waste of money but it wasn't the solution she had hoped. I had a feeling the realities wouldn't measure up to the hype. Another friend of mine swore that it gets rid of her hair forever, then a few months later I saw hers growing in again. It does get rid of the hair but it's merely temporary. For that kind of money I'd expect to be as bald as an eagle.

Another friend of mine shells out the money to have electrolysis on hers and says she's satisfied with that. I may look into it but for me it's merely something I think about once a week or when I have to go somewhere. Having dark skin makes it a bit easier to get away with though it's still an icky problem.


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## EvilPrincess (Jan 28, 2006)

LillyBBBW said:


> My sister was in the same state over her chin hair. She finally paid to have laser hair removal which worked for a bit. She's had five sessions and the hair, although not as thick as before, still grows there. She says it wasn't a *total* waste of money but it wasn't the solution she had hoped. I had a feeling the realities wouldn't measure up to the hype. Another friend of mine swore that it gets rid of her hair forever, then a few months later I saw hers growing in again. It does get rid of the hair but it's merely temporary. For that kind of money I'd expect to be as bald as an eagle.
> 
> .


 
I have been keeping up with this thread but have not posted, I know what everyone means about the excess hair! 

I had a hairy chin, side burns, mustache, and arms that would make any manly man proud. I waxed, plucked, and shaved. I was miserable. I finally went and did the laser hair removal. (Dermatologist who know what they were doing)..... I could not be happier. Yes, new hair does grow but it is so much better! It made all the difference in my life (I would not suggest the bikini line laser hair removal, only tried it once and I heard Angels :shocked: ) I would do the rest again, and I wish I had done it earlier. It was worth every penny, and even double that. My arms turned out best, I no longer have long dark hair. Oh yeah, it only works on dark hair.


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## LillyBBBW (Jan 29, 2006)

EvilPrincess said:


> I have been keeping up with this thread but have not posted, I know what everyone means about the excess hair!
> 
> I had a hairy chin, side burns, mustache, and arms that would make any manly man proud. I waxed, plucked, and shaved. I was miserable. I finally went and did the laser hair removal. (Dermatologist who know what they were doing)..... I could not be happier. Yes, new hair does grow but it is so much better! It made all the difference in my life (I would not suggest the bikini line laser hair removal, only tried it once and I heard Angels :shocked: ) I would do the rest again, and I wish I had done it earlier. It was worth every penny, and even double that. My arms turned out best, I no longer have long dark hair. Oh yeah, it only works on dark hair.



I should also add that just a few short years ago laser hair removal was not compatable with people of color or people who have natural blonde hair. The technology used for dark skin is brand spankin' new and the method is used differently. (milder) I fully expected that my sister's results would be a bit less dramatic. 

She is happy with her result as well and glad she went through with it.


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## EvilPrincess (Jan 29, 2006)

LillyBBBW said:


> I should also add that just a few short years ago laser hair removal was not compatable with people of color or people who have natural blonde hair. The technology used for dark skin is brand spankin' new and the method is used differently. (milder) I fully expected that my sister's results would be a bit less dramatic.
> 
> She is happy with her result as well and glad she went through with it.


 
One place for me it really didn't work was under the arms. Not sure why but I have heard that from other people too. Even after multiple treatments..... of and did I mention! OWWWWW, it is not pain free. But then anything is better than that awful thing they invented the "EPI-LADY" Anyone ever tourture themselves with that thing?


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## BeautifulPoeticDisaster (Jan 29, 2006)

I skimmed most of the posts, but I don't have my contacts in or my glasses on so forgive me if I repeat alot of people, lol.

I didnt see anything mentioned about PCOS (polycystic ovarian syndomre), but then again Im practically blind right now, lol.

Howeve, I have been dignosed with PCOS. Been looking for adr who would take my missing periods and then my 6 months of hemoraging seriously and not just a consequence of my size. Well I found him. He ran all sorts of blood tests and this and that. Turns out I do have enough of the symtoms of pcos to be diagnosed. Theres the missing perionds, the long hemoraging times when I finally get one, then theres the beard I seem to grow, the the mood swings (Im also bipolar though) and mostly insulin resistance which promotes weight gain in the abdomnal area.

All of this said. I am now on Provra. A hormone. I take it 10 days before my period. I bleed heavy for 4-7 days and Im done. Its a miracle. I am also on metformin to stablize the insulin problem. Met can also help with regulating a period.

I did see some of the women here are on B.C....I WISH! My symtpoms were so bad I was having to take 3 BC pills a day..which isnt good for anyone.

The one thing I can say is...don't wait for your drs help. Do some research on your own. Find a couple of things that could be going on and then take it to your dr and let him know your health as a woman is very important to you. That's what I did. I have done thourough research with quoted sources and all. I took it to my dr and said-this is what is happeneing-this is what I think it could be-how do WE find out? And he got on the ball and did all sorts of blood work, and alas, I have been regular for about a year.

Good luck on figuring it out, but once you do, it's awesome.


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## Deidrababe (Jan 29, 2006)

I too had lots of problems when I was younger.....I had it non-stop for months and months and months and months...Horrible..

then I went on Provera - took it every other month, only got my period every other month, it was VERY heavy though but still, every other month, so that was good.

THEN, I went on the pill about 9 years ago. Clockwork baby! Very light sometimes non-periods sometimes with some cramps, but I'll take it.

You NEED to see a Dr. if you are not having a period. The build up could actually cause cancer - I've KNOWN it to happen. 

good luck Em.

Hugs,

Deeds


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## LillyBBBW (Jan 29, 2006)

Thanks for the info BigBelly! Actually someone did mention PCOS on here. A lot of people have been tested for it and though they have lots of symptoms the tests came back negative which leaves most of us at square one. Someone else posted about a rare disorder with symptoms similar to PCOS that one might want to ask their doctor about. Every bit of information helps.

Thanks for sharing what you know and by the way, I LOVE your Avatar!


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## Miss Vickie (Jan 29, 2006)

CurvyEm, it does seem that we have lots of crazy menstrual stuff going on, but I work with women (nurses -- obstetrical nurses, mind you, so we talk about this stuff all the time) and I think that it happens to women of all sizes. It seems the "periods every 28 days lasting 5 days" is just an average and not truly representative of what most women experience. That being said, if you've been scanned and your ovaries are fine, then that's good; however it's my understanding that PCOS involves not just the ovaries but a whole spectrum of problems that affect the whole body. You might check out www.soulcysters.com. It's a wonderful, informative website about PCOS; from there I learned that it's still possible to have PCOS even with non-cystic ovaries. And sometimes they can treat some of the symptoms to make a huge difference in quality of life.

I get so sad when I hear women say they don't get medical care because of fear of chastisement regarding their weight.  I wish some of my health car provider colleagues would "get it" that some of the stuff they say is counterproductive; sadly, though, there are insensitive dolts in every walk of life. That being said, I'd like to encourage any woman fearful of seeing a Big Bad Gynie, to maybe check out a nurse midwife. Nurse midwives can act as primary care providers to women of childbearing age and can do all the same stuff that we need for basic care -- prescribing birth control, doing annuals, ordering mammograms, stuff like that. In some states the must practice with a physician but in my state (Alaska) they can practice independently. In my experience -- as a patient and as a nurse who works with them daily -- they tend to be kinder, gentler, and have a more natural, holistic approach to the female body. Now, it's always possible to get a "dud" but I've not yet met one who wasn't kind, sweet and very helpful. So I'd like to encourage those of you who have doctor phobias to consider a midwife. They're not just for pregnant patients! 

LillyBBBW, like you my periods have been like clockwork. The only problem I've had is that I tend to bleed heavily, and for long periods of time; this has gotten worse as I've gotten older (a common occurrence with perimenopause, I'm told). Since my WLS I've had a harder time with getting sufficient iron in, and so the anemia I've had for years has gotten worse of late -- probably because of both the bleeding and the lack of iron. I've had lots of tests done recently, and we're looking at endometrial ablation to fix the problem; that's where they go in and cauterize the endometrium so it no longer "produces". It should only be done on someone who is sure they're done having kids (Which would be me -- I'm SOOOO done). It decreases or makes cease entirely bleeding in the majority of women who have it.

Toni, the Mirena IUD is an excellent choice, and it's one we recommend at work to women who don't want to hassle with pills, barrier methods, and who want a reliable method of birth control. Yes, it has progesterone, but it doesn't act systemically on the body - it stays pretty locally in the uterus and ovaries to decrease the lining and make the cervical mucus inhospitable to sperm. In some women it seems to stop ovulation entirely, but that doesn't happen to everyone. Anyway, I had one (to control my bleeding -- it didn't, so now it's back out) and it hurt really bad for about a second going in, then it felt okay. Maybe a little cramping. (Keep in mind, though, that I've had three kids; I don't remember if you've given birth before but I've heard it can be very painful if you haven't had kids -- but again, once it's in and they let go of the cervix it shouldn't hurt anymore; also, you can take Motrin prior to the procedure which is supposed to help, too). Once it's in you can't feel it, your partner shouldn't be able to feel it, and it works very well to prevent pregnancy. I did notice some spotting for the first couple of months, which is fairly common, so be prepared for that.

Sorry this post is so long. Can you tell that women's health care is one of my favorite topics?


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## MisticalMisty (Jan 29, 2006)

I may be the only person experiencing this..but do any of you have darkening of the skin under your fat..I have it under my arms..my breasts and my belly. It's more pronounced under my belly and my armpits. I was just curious if this was happening to others..or am I just a freak


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## BeautifulPoeticDisaster (Jan 29, 2006)

MisticalMisty said:


> I may be the only person experiencing this..but do any of you have darkening of the skin under your fat..I have it under my arms..my breasts and my belly. It's more pronounced under my belly and my armpits. I was just curious if this was happening to others..or am I just a freak



Yes, thats also a sign of insulin resitance. I have it mostly under arms, around neck, wrist, and under som folds. But my situation is complicated by psoriasis, so I had red under my folds too. not too attractive, but it was the hand I was given so I play it accordingly


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## Miss Vickie (Jan 29, 2006)

Have you guys had your insulin levels checked? It's not commonly done, but you can get fasting insulin along with fasting glucose levels done, which can give a more true picture of what's going on as far as blood sugar control is concerned. If your body is pumping out a ton of insulin in order to control your sugars that's not good because it runs the risk of wearing out the pancreas. And insulin resistance CAN be treated -- both nutritionally with chromium, zinc and other natural substances -- or pharmaceutically with Glucophage or other diabetic type medications. The bummer about insulin resistance is that it contributes to weight gain, and weight gain also contributes to it. It's like a vicious circle, you know? Also, insulin as a hormone stimulates appetite and then stimulates fat storage too.

Checking insulin levels isn't commonly done by most general practitioners, but you can ask about it. I actually had a four hour glucose/insulin tolerance test. It showed that while my blood sugars were spot on, my body was having to make a LOT of insulin to get the coverage I needed. With a family history of Type II Diabetes and heart disease, this was important information for me to have. That kind of endocrine imbalance also seems to coincide with hypertension, high cholesterol, and fat deposition in the tummy; it has something to do with being more androgenic, which also seems to coincide with the excessive hair, hair loss, and wonky periods. You might want to google "Syndrome X" and see if any of those symptoms apply to you.


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## MisticalMisty (Jan 29, 2006)

Miss Vickie said:


> Have you guys had your insulin levels checked? It's not commonly done, but you can get fasting insulin along with fasting glucose levels done, which can give a more true picture of what's going on as far as blood sugar control is concerned. If your body is pumping out a ton of insulin in order to control your sugars that's not good because it runs the risk of wearing out the pancreas. And insulin resistance CAN be treated -- both nutritionally with chromium, zinc and other natural substances -- or pharmaceutically with Glucophage or other diabetic type medications. The bummer about insulin resistance is that it contributes to weight gain, and weight gain also contributes to it. It's like a vicious circle, you know? Also, insulin as a hormone stimulates appetite and then stimulates fat storage too.
> 
> Checking insulin levels isn't commonly done by most general practitioners, but you can ask about it. I actually had a four hour glucose/insulin tolerance test. It showed that while my blood sugars were spot on, my body was having to make a LOT of insulin to get the coverage I needed. With a family history of Type II Diabetes and heart disease, this was important information for me to have. That kind of endocrine imbalance also seems to coincide with hypertension, high cholesterol, and fat deposition in the tummy; it has something to do with being more androgenic, which also seems to coincide with the excessive hair, hair loss, and wonky periods. You might want to google "Syndrome X" and see if any of those symptoms apply to you.



I have my blood work done consistently...but there is never anything wrong with my blood sugar.....and I don't have high blood pressure, cholesterol ..so I dunno. But thanks for the info!


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## Jes (Jan 29, 2006)

MisticalMisty said:


> I may be the only person experiencing this..but do any of you have darkening of the skin under your fat..I have it under my arms..my breasts and my belly. It's more pronounced under my belly and my armpits. I was just curious if this was happening to others..or am I just a freak



Do you just mean from friction (or skin resting on skin)?


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## Ceres (Jan 29, 2006)

may be the only person experiencing this..but do any of you have darkening of the skin under your fat..I have it under my arms..my breasts and my belly. It's more pronounced under my belly and my armpits. I was just curious if this was happening to others..or am I just a freak  


hello!yes it is normal..i have it too..is caused by a lack of oxygen..the skin doesnt breath...i have it under my breasts...i use natural fiber for my underwears because also using bras made 100%synthetic stuff can make it worse..and itchy!!!you can use some moisturizer after you bathe or shower..it should help...ceres


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## Tina (Jan 29, 2006)

Can also be caused by PCOS.


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## AnnMarie (Jan 29, 2006)

Tina said:


> Toni, I've had an IUD and it worked pretty well. But what has been working even better is the Nuva Ring. It has a low dose hormone in it and you can either leave it in for three weeks, take it out and have a period then put a new one in in a week, or some just keep replacing it every three weeks if they don't want to have a period. That facet of it comes in very handy at times, when the b/f is in town. You might ask your gynie if maybe it could work for you.



I have to ask, if you can tell me.... how do you get it out?? I had this image in my head of needing salad tongs or a 2nd party for assistance, and since that's not in the cards as a single girl.... I've just got to know. You can PM if you don't want to tell here, but I'm really curious since it seems it's really UP there.... ??

LOL


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## Tina (Jan 29, 2006)

Heh. Sex in the City style, eh? 

Not hard, you just reach in with a finger, catch the part of the ring that's facing forward and pull with the tip of your finger. My cervix is pretty deep and I have shortish fingers and I'm able to do it just fine. When you put it in, it rests just beyond the pubic bone, not far back.


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## Miss Vickie (Jan 29, 2006)

I think it's not unlike getting a diaphragm out, although not as slippery.


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## Tina (Jan 29, 2006)

True. A bit easier, though, and easier to put in, too.


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## MisticalMisty (Jan 29, 2006)

Jes said:


> Do you just mean from friction (or skin resting on skin)?




I'm sure it's a little of both actually..


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## OppositesAttract(fa) (Jan 30, 2006)

Ladies and CurvyEm,

I worked some years back at a health food store where the owner was consistently recommending dermally applied progesterone to her female customers, with same being well suited for balancing female hormonal conditions.

As such, following is a link to -- and description cut and paste of -- a dermally applied progesterone product boasting a superior overall formulation:

http://back-to-nature-herbs.com/female/progestacare.html

"Your body needs natural progesterone to counter-balance the toxic effects of estrogen dominance. *Life-flo*'s Premium progesterone cream, *Progestacare*, for pre menopause PMS Relief, Hotflashes, Infertility, Migraines, Fibrocystic Breast, Skin Care, and Acne. For women, who suffer from hysterectomy symptoms, menstrual conditons, female health conditions, hormone deficiencies, menopause hot flashes, osteoporosis or thining bones, pms. Reduces breast cancer risk, hair loss, fat gain from estrogen dominance, menopause acne, migraine headaches, and much more."

It may sound too good to be true, but this product does fulfil one criterion that many effective natural products share, which criterion is the FDA's having _cracked down_ on what marketers are allowed to specify when articulating its benefits!

Just my two pennies in the pot,

Michael

-

Article of Further Interest (edited and with emphasis added as seemed appropriate):

http://vrp.com/art/782.asp

Progesterone: Natural Hormone is First Choice
Elemental, Versatile & Bio-Identical to that Produced by the Body
Ward Dean, MD

Some of the most common symptoms experienced by women in the peri- and post-menopausal period are problems with weight gain, fatigue, loss of libido, depression, headaches, joint pain and mood swings. Other frequent problems include uterine fibroids, cancer, fibrocystic breast disease, menstrual problems, autoimmune disorders, pre-menopausal bone loss and a high incidence of osteoporosis. These symptoms and diseases often have a common cause -- an imbalance between the primary female sex hormones, progesterone and estrogen. Progesterone and estrogen, along with DHEA, pregnenolone, and cortisol are classified as steroid hormones. Progesterone is a precursor to most steroid hormones and performs a myriad of different functions.

Estrogen regulates the menstrual cycle, promotes cell division, and causes the development of secondary female characteristics during puberty. In non-pregnant pre-menopausal women, only 100-200 micrograms of estrogen are secreted daily. But during pregnancy, much more is secreted.

Progesterone is made in the ovaries of menstruating women, and by the placenta during pregnancy. About 20-25 mg of progesterone are produced per day during a womans monthly cycle and up to 300-400 mg are produced daily during pregnancy.

An important difference between estrogen and progesterone is that high amounts of estrogen are toxic to the body and can cause a number of harmful side effects. On the other hand, progesterone has a balancing effect that prevents excess estrogen from being toxic and harmful to health, and is relatively free of serious side effects, even in high amounts.

During the third trimester of pregnancy, women secrete 20 times more progesterone than during the last two weeks of their normal menstrual cycle. Despite the discomfort of carrying excess weight, many women describe that they never felt better in their lives than during the third trimester of their pregnancies! The reason is that the high levels of progesterone at this time produce increased energy and a state of serene well-being. But after delivery, when progesterone production drops suddenly, many women develop postpartum depression due to extremely low levels of progesterone.

Estrogen Dominance - Key to the Puzzle
Many women suffer from a syndrome known as Estrogen Dominance. According to Dr. John Lee, who has pioneered research in this area, estrogen unopposed by progesterone results in a number of adverse effects. These include hypertension, salt and water retention, abnormal blood clotting, excessive body fat, hypothyroidism, painful breasts, fibrocystic breast disease, increased risk of endometrial cancer (cancer of the uterus) and breast cancer.

Estrogen dominance usually occurs at the age of menopause, when progesterone production falls to approximately 1% of its pre-menopausal level. At this time, the production of estrogen falls to about 50% of its premenopausal levels. This dramatically alters the estrogen: progesterone ratio, causing estrogen to become toxic without progesterone to oppose it. As a result, the risks for breast and uterine cancer, fibrocystic breast disease, ovarian cysts, uterine fibroids, cervical erosions and/or dysplasia, and osteoporosis increase.

Orthodox physicians usually consider menopause primarily as an estrogen deficiency syndrome, and consequently treat menopausal symptoms only with synthetic estrogen. The real cause of many menopause-related problems may not be a lack of estrogen, but a lack of progesterone. Furthermore, the problems of estrogen dominance are not confined only to peri- and post-menopausal women. Today, it is extremely common for women to experience recurring menopause-type complaints 10 to 15 years before menopause. Women as young as thirty years of age often complain of menopause-type problems. This is known as pre-menopause syndrome.

Premenstrual and Pre-menopausal Syndromes
In 1931, scientists investigating problems of menstruation identified a symptom complex that included extreme fatigue, depression, and irritability, which was often experienced by many women during the premenstrual period. They labeled this symptom complex premenstrual tension (PMT). As research continued, it became evident that this syndrome included more than 100 documented symptoms. Consequently, the name was changed to premenstrual syndrome (PMS). The most common PMS complaints are weight gain, bloating, irritability, depression, loss of sex drive, fatigue, breast swelling or tenderness, cravings for sweets, and headaches.

Two English physicians--Drs. Katharina Dalton and Raymond Greene--published the first medical report on PMS in 1953. Dr. Dalton observed that injecting progesterone relieved her own menstrual migraine headaches. Dr. Dalton then injected progesterone in other women and found that their PMS was also cured. Other researchers such as Dr. Joel Hargrove at Vanderbilt went on to show a 90% success rate in relieving PMS symptoms with an oral supplement of progesterone!

*The scientists* also *identified a chronic condition similar to PMS which they called pre-menopause syndrome. They identified two primary causes: [1] anovulatory cycles (i.e., a cycle that does not result in the release of an ovum, or egg)*; and [2] adrenal gland exhaustion due to chronic, excessive stress. *In an anovulatory cycle, a woman does not ovulate, and there is no corpus luteum. With no corpus luteum, there is no progesterone secretion. Therefore, women with anovulatory cycles are truly progesterone deficient prior to menopause.* Adrenal gland exhaustion from chronic excessive stress may also contribute to a progesterone deficiency. A combination of anovulatory cycles and adrenal gland burnout often results in the symptoms of estrogen dominance early in life in the form of the pre-menopause syndrome.

Progesterone can alleviate and prevent both premenstrual and pre-menopause syndromes. Progesterone secretion in women is highest during the two weeks before menstruation. With insufficient progesterone to block the toxic effects of estrogen, PMS often results. Raising the level of progesterone by supplementation (orally, by injection, or topically) often provides dramatic relief from PMS.

. . .

Natural vs. Synthetic Progesterone
Theres a world of difference between natural progesterone and synthetic progesterone, the type most frequently prescribed by orthodox physicians. Provera^(TM), the most frequently prescribed synthetic progesterone is not really progesterone at all--it is a progestin. Progestins are synthetic progesterone-like compounds that are manufactured by pharmaceutical companies. These synthetic progesterone analogs are far more powerful than the bodys own natural progesterone and are metabolized as foreign substances into toxic by-products. These synthetic progesterones can interfere with the bodys own natural progesterone, creating other hormone-related health problems and further exacerbating estrogen dominance. *Side effects of synthetic progesterone include* increased risk of cancer, abnormal menstrual flow, nausea, depression, *masculinizing effects*, and fluid retention.

Natural progesterone is identical to what the body produces. It is manufactured in scientific laboratories from wild yams and soy beans... Adverse side effects are very rare with natural progesterone. The only side effect of concern is that it might slightly alter the timing of the menstrual cycle, when taken inappropriately.

The Progesterone Solution
PMS, premenopausal syndrome, and osteoporosis can have the common cause of estrogen dominance and relative progesterone deficiency. Consequently, they can often be prevented or mitigated by supplementing the body with physiologic dosages of natural progesterone (approximately 20-30 mg./day) to overcome the estrogen dominance and reestablish hormonal balance.

Natural progesterone can be administered orally, topically, or by injection. However, I believe that the best way is topically (transdermally)...

Equivalent dosages of transdermal natural progesterone are 5 to 7 times more effective than orally ingested natural progesterone. Only 10-15% of the orally ingested progesterone reaches the bloodstream. Therefore, it is necessary to take much higher doses, 100-200 mg./day of oral progesterone to obtain the equivalent benefit of 20-30 mg./day of transdermal progesterone.

Once progesterone reaches a saturation level in the underlying skin tissue, it diffuses into the capillaries, then passes into the general blood circulation for use by the body. Some women feel effects in less than a week of usage. For those who are especially deficient in progesterone, it may take two to three months to restore optimum levels.


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## OppositesAttract(fa) (Jan 30, 2006)

Dimensions babes,

Just a little dose of humor to hopefully lighten up a touchy subject.

Honing my bedside manners,

Michael


GAL PAL: ...I might turn out to be a total psycho and let me tell you when I get pm, you better watch out [nailbiting emoticon]
GAL PAL: those hormones are hellish things!! hahaha
MICHAEL: what is that emoticon waving at me!
GAL PAL: timeout!
GAL PAL: hahahahaha
MICHAEL: ! lol 
GAL PAL: that is what you would be doing to me when I get into a pre-menstrual ...psycho fit
MICHAEL: there are [formulations] that can help in that regard
MICHAEL: progesterone may be rubbed into a woman's wrists as needed
GAL PAL: do you think they really do help? I heard about evening primrose then that starflower oil was much better. Ahh they all cost a lot
GAL PAL: ohhhh
GAL PAL: I never knew about that
GAL PAL: mmm now theres a thought. Me sitting all teeth gnashy, and you gently rubbing my wrists 
MICHAEL: I worked at a health food store where the (female) owner shared knowledge of same with customers
GAL PAL: great
MICHAEL: oh but I am not sure I would want to touch the stuff!
GAL PAL: [sorry but we're going to skip this part]
GAL PAL: hahahaha
GAL PAL: see you are much more subtle than me!
GAL PAL: [sorry but we're going to skip this part]
GAL PAL: one of my sisters was put on hormone treatment for endometriosis, and the doctor left her too long on it. She actually got a deeper voice and developed a muscular body like madonna
MICHAEL: doctors, grrr
GAL PAL: she was quite happy about the body but not that her neck thickened and she got a deep voice
GAL PAL: yes should have only been on it six months, she was on it nearly two years
GAL PAL: but it reversed within a few months of coming back off again...
MICHAEL: hormones are tricky to play with, all right...
MICHAEL: that is why it is best to take compounds that are precursors for same...
MICHAEL: so the body can make its own as appropriate
GAL PAL: I see


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## OppositesAttract(fa) (Jan 31, 2006)

With over 24 hours now with nary a peep spoken, perhaps I will chime in again. 

Firstly quoting http://vrp.com/art/469.asp:

"Polycystic Ovaries 
"A 29-year-old woman presented with excessive facial/body hair growth, acne, and weight gain about the waist. Suffering these problems since puberty, she had been on several low-fat/high-carb diets, resulting in rebounds and even more weight gain. Menstrual periods were irregular. Saliva testing during the second half of the menstrual cycle (luteal phase) indicated high-normal estradiol, low progesterone, and high androgens, both DHEAS and testosterone. Further examination by her doctor revealed cystic ovaries. Dietary modification (removal of refined carbohydrates, pastas, chips, pastries, sodas etc.) and use of natural progesterone restored normal menstrual cycles and resolved the cystic ovaries."

And finally, seeing on http://www.vrp.com/det/21012.asp how that at least one progesterone cream formulation has been saddled with UK and Canadian import restrictions, could it be that the powers that be are ***MESSING**WITH**THE**WRONG**CROWD**  :doh::shocked:  !?!*


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