# Fat Boy dating discussion...



## PolarKat (May 16, 2006)

Okay fellas.. 

While reading through the posts, this line by Wanderer caught my attention
_"I'm sorry for blowing up like that, but when your weekends consist mostly of babysitting "_. This line hits quite hits quite close to home. So I'd like to get a conversation going on about your situations, expierience etc, and opinion.. See where you guys are @, and share ideas..

I've gotten to a point where I'm just going to give up on the woman thing. I mean I just completely suck at it. 
It's close to 10yrs since I've been in any sort of serious relationship, and in the last 6 years I can count "dates" on one hand. When I look at all my friends, they hooked up with someone through friends, or at work. That well has been dry for ages. In essence I'm just fending for myself. They're also totally useless for help in the matter, their ideas to help are beyond useless.

I reasoned that it's just simple odds. If the odds are 1 in 20 then you just have to meet 20 people. Problem is walking up to random women and saying "Hi" doesn't seem to work at all aside from getting a smile, and watching them scurry away. Clubs & Bars have proven useless, especially when you're going with married couples (no single friends left).. 
I even switched jobs last year in hopes of making some sort of change, but it just bit me in the ass.. and now I'm stuck in "officespace" where the only women who show an interest are married.. Tried the online dating thing.. regular dating sites.. I'm ignored.. BHM (ha! yeah..) BBW sites, ignored by the women.. yet my inbox seems to attract plenty of men.. (I'm male and hetero.. There's a slight problem there..). 

I don't know.. maybe my Social standing/character/personality/hobbies is incompatible with women, maybe I really don't have anything to offer?

What would I have to fix with me? And how would I go about meeting new people?


----------



## LoveBHMS (May 16, 2006)

if you go around thinking there's something wrong with you, then other people's first inclination is going to be to try to figure out what that is.

In other words, it starts with your attitude.

Now, I'm not one to say 'It's all attitude' because it's not. You may not try to dress nicely, take care of hygine, engage in things that interest you, or even leave the house that often. It's too easy to say "if you like yourself others will like you too!" But it does start with attitude. If you go around saying you're flawed and you've given up, then why should any woman give you a chance? Most healthy women don't want a fixer upper or to play Princess Charming and come along and rescue you from being unhappy. Healthy women are looking for a good guy with whom they have compatibility and chemistry.


----------



## missaf (May 17, 2006)

Polar, you might have seen my thread about being one of the guys? It kinda sounds like we are in the same situation. 

I'm pretty much ready to stop looking. I won't do bars, and I want to date a friend, so I'll just continue being the me that I love, and maybe someday a smart guy will see just what he's been missing... me


----------



## Wanderer (May 17, 2006)

missaf said:


> Polar, you might have seen my thread about being one of the guys? It kinda sounds like we are in the same situation.
> 
> I'm pretty much ready to stop looking. I won't do bars, and I want to date a friend, so I'll just continue being the me that I love, and maybe someday a smart guy will see just what he's been missing... me



In case you couldn't guess from that little explosion that inspired this thread, that's my situation as well. Mind you, I'm desperate for conversation, so I'm still considering the bars... if I can find one appropriate to my age group. Somehow, a place that blasts Techno loud enough to drown out a jet plane isn't all that desirable...

You understand, for most of my life I've had someone around to talk to. Friends, family, somebody. But with Mother dead for over a year now, my two sisters married (and the younger one calling me almost exclusively to babysit), my friends only getting together twice a week... trust me, by this point the chance to talk to someone older than 6 is not to be passed up just because I don't drink. (Online is nice, folks, but just not the same as being able to see someone's face.)

On a lighter note, is anyone besides me familiar with fatfurs? They're people who like fat cartoon characters, and some of them are FAs and FFAs as well.

Yours truly,

The late-night,

Wanderer


----------



## PolarKat (May 17, 2006)

LoveBHMS said:


> if you go around thinking there's something wrong with you, then other people's first inclination is going to be to try to figure out what that is.
> 
> In other words, it starts with your attitude.
> 
> Now, I'm not one to say 'It's all attitude' because it's not. You may not try to dress nicely, take care of hygine, engage in things that interest you, or even leave the house that often. It's too easy to say "if you like yourself others will like you too!" But it does start with attitude. If you go around saying you're flawed and you've given up, then why should any woman give you a chance? Most healthy women don't want a fixer upper or to play Princess Charming and come along and rescue you from being unhappy. Healthy women are looking for a good guy with whom they have compatibility and chemistry.



There's nothing wrong with me .. well I'm a bit too hairy.. but If I was still in my 20's that attitude would have been/was an issue then.. even so, when I was uncomfortable in my own skin, I actually did much better at the dating game, than now. I mean being a fat guy all your life, it's just simple, either you get used to it.. or you just end it.
Dress nicely.. Well.. for a tall, massive.. and real fat guy, you can only do so much with the clown clothes they sell.. I shower daily, brush and floss, deoderant, hint of cologne, don't wear the same anything twice w/o wash. My hair would be considered messy since I started growing it again last year and it's not quite long enought for a full ponytail yet.. and it does that 70's thing when it's humid. 
well educated, well spoken, intellectual, financially stable.. house is almost paid.. Grew up in the low end always in debt working class so I'm not one who was handed anything on a platter..

I really don't think there's something wrong with me that's obvious, aside from winning the lotto, and yard work.. I doubt there's much more fixing to do.. I'm just having a horrible time meeting someone that actually has an attraction to me..."The chemistry". Either I'm not meeting enough, or the right people, or I'm blowing my chances at hello, and not knowing why. 

I never have a problem going out, and I was serious. If there's a woman I find attractive walking down the street I will smile and say hello... Thing is, when everyone you know is married... going out becomes "tea parties" or BBQ's on the newely built deck whilst mingling amongst the married people. That's socially a dead end, unless you want to end up on Jerry Springer.. and going out by yourself.. well.. 



missaf said:


> Polar, you might have seen my thread about being one of the guys? It kinda sounds like we are in the same situation.
> 
> I'm pretty much ready to stop looking. I won't do bars, and I want to date a friend, so I'll just continue being the me that I love, and maybe someday a smart guy will see just what he's been missing... me



Yup, I'm very simmilar in that regard, I find it strange, getting into relationships with strangers. I'd like to get to know people without the mask, and playing games.. so to speak.. So I always dated friends, actually my longest/most serious relationship was with my best friend.. There's no "bones in the closet" or any of those trust issues, no shyness or anxiety.. But if you burn that bridge.. it burns both of you quite well in the process...but that's a whole other topic.. Problem is.. over the years all my friends got married, including their friends.. so I've had to go at it from scratch.. and I'm failing miserably at it... Really have no clue where and how to start going about meeting new people on a level that you're going to talk to them again. 



Wanderer said:


> In case you couldn't guess from that little explosion that inspired this thread, that's my situation as well. Mind you, I'm desperate for conversation, so I'm still considering the bars...



It's a miserable thing.. and everyone comes to rely on you.. When Valentines day rolls around.. I've got an answering machine filled with messages from friends & family asking to babysit.. When I hear "What are you doing this weekend?" It used to mean.. Go boating/fishing.. movie.. etc.. now it's just checking to see if I'm free to babysit!


----------



## missaf (May 17, 2006)

Hey now, hair is sexy, especially sexy hairy bellies!

If you're hanging out a lot with married couples, ask them to maybe bring a single lady for you to chat with at the party? That way it's a group meeting place and ya never know?

Just an idea!


----------



## inertia (May 17, 2006)

okay, i'm going to provide some totally trite and unhelpful suggestions now.

You know how people always moan that, when you're single no-one looks twice at you but then if you get paired up you suddenly become really attractive and you wonder were they all were when you were single?

If you don't need anyone, you're far more likely to attract people. If you do need someone, like you think you do, then at least act like you don't. 

Why do you need a partner anyway? Decide you don't need one. Act like you don't need one.

Like everyone says: get a hobby or three. Ones that involve leaving the house. Pretend you're not doing it for the sake of meeting people, though. Pretend to yourself. Make your life so that you fill the space they'd occupy. Then they'll turn up and mess everything up. 

When I met my boyfriend, he acted like he couldn't be less interested in me. I was flapping around him like a particularly irritating butterfly ('look at me! look at me!') and he stood side-on to me, hardly looking at me, giving only cursory answers to my questions. He didn't need or particularly want a girlfriend: he was always busy with his job and his music promotions business.

Now I've taken over his life FNAR. We're moving in together. I've ruined his world!

p.s. i think you should cut your (head) hair short, but that's just, like, my opinion.

p.p.s. apologies for (post) length.


----------



## Big-Phil (May 17, 2006)

inertia said:


> If you don't need anyone, you're far more likely to attract people. If you do need someone, like you think you do, then at least act like you don't.



I think you are quite right  It is amazing how many people find me attractive when I am seeing someone.. Even ladies who don't normally go for the larger gent, seem to be more interested ;o)


----------



## William (May 17, 2006)

Hi LoveBHMS

I think it is important to carry yourself with confidence or acceptance, but there are real social biases that BBWs and BHMs have to deal with that personal persona does not effect.

The key is to ignore the people with biases (who needs them anyway!!) and keep trying until you find good people. Also stop looking in places where you find to many "bias people"

William






LoveBHMS said:


> if you go around thinking there's something wrong with you, then other people's first inclination is going to be to try to figure out what that is.
> 
> In other words, it starts with your attitude.
> 
> Now, I'm not one to say 'It's all attitude' because it's not. You may not try to dress nicely, take care of hygine, engage in things that interest you, or even leave the house that often. It's too easy to say "if you like yourself others will like you too!" But it does start with attitude. If you go around saying you're flawed and you've given up, then why should any woman give you a chance? Most healthy women don't want a fixer upper or to play Princess Charming and come along and rescue you from being unhappy. Healthy women are looking for a good guy with whom they have compatibility and chemistry.


----------



## Fat Gary NYC (May 18, 2006)

inertia said:


> You know how people always moan that, when you're single no-one looks twice at you but then if you get paired up you suddenly become really attractive and you wonder were they all were when you were single?
> 
> If you don't need anyone, you're far more likely to attract people. If you do need someone, like you think you do, then at least act like you don't.
> 
> Why do you need a partner anyway? Decide you don't need one. Act like you don't need one.



Very wise advice, I think. I believe that things happen when you don't expect them, when you're not thinking about it, when it's the furthest thing from your mind.

Unfortunately for me, it's not easy advice to take, because I'm always thinking about it, hoping, and so forth. Not only is it _not_ the furthest thing from my mind, but it's so close that if it gets any closer I might have to _marry_ it!  

As badly as I want to have a girlfriend and be in a relationship, I would love to just accept the fact that as of this moment, as of this second, I'm alone, and go on with my life from there, whatever will be will be, que sera sera, yada yada yada, baba booey.



inertia said:


> If you do need someone, like you think you do, then at least act like you don't.
> 
> Why do you need a partner anyway? Decide you don't need one. *Act like you don't need one.* _(Emphasis added.)_



I wish I knew how. Any advice?


----------



## AZ_Wolf (May 18, 2006)

Fat Gary NYC said:


> I wish I knew how. Any advice?



Just find things you like and do them.

If you're focusing on other stuff, you won't give off such a needy air.

Though this is coming from someone who doesn't buy into the whole "when you're not single, everyone comes out of the woodwork" schtick. I've only had one woman hit on me while I was taken in my life, and she actually did it while being *on the same 4-person college bowling team as myself and my then-girlfriend*. So there was more at work there than just my being taken. She might have just been nuts. Or didn't care if I was available or not.  

It all boils down to how much in circulation you are. If you just work and buy groceries and come home and do the same things every week, it doesn't matter how at ease you are with yourself, you're not going to meet anyone (unless you hit a fluke on the internet, which while possible, isn't really a good bet to take).


----------



## Wanderer (May 20, 2006)

missaf said:


> Hey now, hair is sexy, especially sexy hairy bellies!
> 
> If you're hanging out a lot with married couples, ask them to maybe bring a single lady for you to chat with at the party? That way it's a group meeting place and ya never know?
> 
> Just an idea!



<chuckle> If my friends knew any single women, they probably wouldn't be hanging out with the guys so much, MissaF. Trust me, I've canvassed my friends, and they don't know anyone that isn't taken. Even my married sister has no idea... heck, she never even went to a singles bar.

Well, except The Cave, and that, er, isn't the crowd I'm going for... <blush>

Yours truly,

The wolfish,

Wanderer


----------



## Wanderer (May 20, 2006)

inertia said:


> okay, i'm going to provide some totally trite and unhelpful suggestions now.



You may fire when ready, Gridley! Seriously, it's not like I can do any worse, right? <laugh>



inertia said:


> You know how people always moan that, when you're single no-one looks twice at you but then if you get paired up you suddenly become really attractive and you wonder were they all were when you were single?



<sigh> I wouldn't know. The only relationship I've had that lasted more than one date ended because it improved the girl's popularity... not mine. I've been "just a friend" for so long, I don't think I'd know what to do with a GF if I had one.



Inertia said:


> If you don't need anyone, you're far more likely to attract people. If you do need someone, like you think you do, then at least act like you don't.
> 
> Why do you need a partner anyway? Decide you don't need one. Act like you don't need one.



<LAUGH> I'm pretty sure I can't get one! Nah, I just want someone to talk to that's old enough to have a serious conversation with and young enough to be able to hear me. Maybe dinner, a movie, dancing... just a social outing. I gave up on physical relationships when it became clear I could only attract gay men. And that the ones I attracted weren't usually interested in talking...



Inertia said:


> Like everyone says: get a hobby or three. Ones that involve leaving the house. Pretend you're not doing it for the sake of meeting people, though. Pretend to yourself. Make your life so that you fill the space they'd occupy. Then they'll turn up and mess everything up.
> 
> When I met my boyfriend, he acted like he couldn't be less interested in me. I was flapping around him like a particularly irritating butterfly ('look at me! look at me!') and he stood side-on to me, hardly looking at me, giving only cursory answers to my questions. He didn't need or particularly want a girlfriend: he was always busy with his job and his music promotions business.
> 
> ...



It's hard to know, since the post has no associated quoting. Were you talking to me about the hair? <chuckle> It's nice to see that someone's willing to say something about the picture. I normally would wear my hair back, but I'm out of elastics... and you caught me between shampoos. I'll try and get a better-looking picture out here in the near future.

As for hobbies, I'm focused almost exclusively on getting a job that's longer-lasting than the school year. Not that I mind being a crossing guard, heavens no... but having a paycheck during the summer would make things a little easier to handle. Currently, I'm living mostly by means of the limited inheritance my mother left me... which is enough to have fun with, if I didn't have to worry about the bills. Applying to every job in the area doesn't leave a whole lot of time for hobbies... though I'm currently active in a D&D game, and gamemastering a D20 Modern (Future) campaign, and trying to get back to my writing.

Yes, writing. I'm something of an author, and I've even been published a few times (though the only one I got paid for was non-fiction for Pyramid). Mostly, I write fiction with a common theme of transformation... from fantasy to science fiction. You can find my older stories here if you'd like to read them. (The archive hasn't been updated in years by this point, but it's all I've got.) Just look for Wanderer... that's me. Warning, though: Some of the other stories are adult in every sense of the word, though not mine. Just be careful.

But really, seriously, honestly: I just want someone to talk to. I'm all alone here, and conversation is awfully limited when you're talking to yourself. My friends only meet for gaming twice a week, and I simply don't know many social locations in my area... 35 years of being a Mama's Boy doesn't lend itself to a vast amount of experience in such matters.

There, you see? Your post wasn't so long... 

Yours truly,

The laughing,

Wanderer


----------



## Kiki (May 20, 2006)

Wanderer said:


> Nah, I just want someone to talk to that's old enough to have a serious conversation with and young enough to be able to hear me. Maybe dinner, a movie, dancing... just a social outing. I gave up on physical relationships when it became clear I could only attract gay men. And that the ones I attracted weren't usually interested in talking...
> 
> As for hobbies, I'm focused almost exclusively on getting a job that's longer-lasting than the school year. Not that I mind being a crossing guard, heavens no... but having a paycheck during the summer would make things a little easier to handle. Currently, I'm living mostly by means of the limited inheritance my mother left me... which is enough to have fun with, if I didn't have to worry about the bills. Applying to every job in the area doesn't leave a whole lot of time for hobbies... though I'm currently active in a D&D game, and gamemastering a D20 Modern (Future) campaign, and trying to get back to my writing.
> 
> ...



I say join a writer's group. That way you get to meet new ppl, talk to grown-ups and share some of your material too. And mostly those groups are all about going for a drink afterwards so it'll be a regular social outing for you too! Just a thought.


----------



## William (May 20, 2006)

Hi 

There are several computer groups in my area that look interesting.

William




Kiki said:


> I say join a writer's group. That way you get to meet new ppl, talk to grown-ups and share some of your material too. And mostly those groups are all about going for a drink afterwards so it'll be a regular social outing for you too! Just a thought.


----------



## Kiki (May 20, 2006)

William said:


> Hi
> 
> There are several computer groups in my area that look interesting.
> 
> William



Exactly. Even the most solitary hobbies can become social.


----------



## Big-Phil (May 21, 2006)

Kiki said:


> Exactly. Even the most solitary hobbies can become social.




 yep, too true.... although I can't find a local group for extreme ironing


----------



## PolarKat (May 21, 2006)

Okay so the overall thing looks like get out and do hobbies.. 
Well I'm out quite a bit, and have quite a few hobbies.. but they're all male or isolated things.. what are some good ideas alternate hobbies that contain females?


----------



## missaf (May 22, 2006)

PolarKat said:


> Okay so the overall thing looks like get out and do hobbies..
> Well I'm out quite a bit, and have quite a few hobbies.. but they're all male or isolated things.. what are some good ideas alternate hobbies that contain females?




Well, what are your hobbies? I mean, I'm a totally geeky girl and I do most things guys do, but in that enviornment, I'm only being one of the guys. Do you want to talk up something like flower arranging ot meet girls, or cooking classes?


----------



## Wanderer (May 22, 2006)

Kiki said:


> I say join a writer's group. That way you get to meet new ppl, talk to grown-ups and share some of your material too. And mostly those groups are all about going for a drink afterwards so it'll be a regular social outing for you too! Just a thought.



<chuckle> Care to guess how many writers' groups there are in Mesquite, Texas? Because I can't find a one. There are computer groups (I'm strictly an end-user), a community theatre (I was in our production of Dearly Departed), and... that's about it. The colleges have a few groups, but they're primarily for college students. There may be some in Dallas, but if so, they're remarkably well-hidden...

When I worked for Greyhound, or any other place with many people, I could at least socialize at work. But now, as a crossing guard, I only talk to people in thirty seconds or less.

I swear, sometimes I wish I'd become a firespotter like my mother wanted me to... at least then I'd be lonely *all* the time, and have a chance to get used to it, right?:>

Nah. I just wish there were more people around here that were near my age. And by the time I get to the age of most of the people here, *they'll* be dead, and I'll be too old to reasonably socialize with all the young whippersnappers dressing badly and playing their music too loud. Goshdurnit!;>

Any other ideas? I mean, anything I can actually find around here I'll try. (Except maybe the swinger parties... always struck me as a dangerous idea, in the age of AIDS...)

<sigh> This is why I asked, "Anyone here from Dallas that know a good singles bar". I don't drink alcohol, mind you (which isn't a bad deal; most bars give you cola for free), but at least there'd be other people around.

Yours truly,

The isolated,

Wanderer


----------



## PolarKat (May 25, 2006)

missaf said:


> Well, what are your hobbies? I mean, I'm a totally geeky girl and I do most things guys do, but in that enviornment, I'm only being one of the guys. Do you want to talk up something like flower arranging ot meet girls, or cooking classes?



I'd say sleeping.. cooking and eating.. yet I'm being deprived of them  

I'm little over geeky, but I'm also well rounded (had too!) in interests... Hobbies in general.. Astronomy,Fixing up/Collecting old videogames/pinball, arcades/pool, bass/guitar/piano, programming, build little electronic gizmo's that impress no-one, anime/scifi.. on the flip side.. grease monkey, boating, fishing/hunting, camping, cooking, snowmobiles..

as you can see these are mostly things where you don't actually meet any new people in the process. I took an art class a nights, but that was well.. mainly older ladies.. Sci/Com/Game conventions.. I rarely attend anymore, but the women there are usually doing their best at avoiding the onslaught of nerds.. 

Ideas like flower arangement sound good.. as long as I don't mention it to the guys! But those are the ideas I'm looking for... What do women do for extra cirricular activity (leaving out bars/clubs)?


----------



## missaf (May 25, 2006)

There's a lotta funky things out there to try if you're interested, even taking community college classes for self-enrichment. You get to know people over the course of a semester!

I've heard of one guy going to restaurants and getting to know waitresses as a regular.

Flower arranging and artsy fartsy stuff? What about arts and crafts stores?

Geeky stuff, too? You could check out internet cafe's for gaming nights, or yahoo groups in your area?

Besides all that, it's a shame we live so far apart, it sounds like we'd have a blast


----------



## PolarKat (May 25, 2006)

missaf said:


> There's a lotta funky things out there to try if you're interested, even taking community college classes for self-enrichment. You get to know people over the course of a semester!


I've got the booklet sitting next to me.. yet I have industrial robotics, and digital animation circled  I think I need to change my frame of mind a bit!



missaf said:


> I've heard of one guy going to restaurants and getting to know waitresses as a regular.
> Flower arranging and artsy fartsy stuff? What about arts and crafts stores?
> Geeky stuff, too? You could check out internet cafe's for gaming nights, or yahoo groups in your area?


The waitress thing a close friend of mine suggested the other day, I was thinking of that as a morning coffee thing, it's at least a good method to practice flirting.. and I didn't even think of internet cafe's.. that's proably a good balance with having a bit of a comfort zone..



missaf said:


> Besides all that, it's a shame we live so far apart, it sounds like we'd have a blast


I agree  although.. If I end up in your neighbourhood sometime, I'll annoy you to show me around!


----------



## Tad (May 26, 2006)

missaf said:


> There's a lotta funky things out there to try if you're interested, even taking community college classes for self-enrichment. You get to know people over the course of a semester!



I think the key is finding something that you can find enjoying, which also has women in it. If you don't find it enjoyable, you will not show at your best. I don't think you have to be good at it--if you can honestly enjoy and appreciate flower arranging beyond as a way to meet women, awesome. If not, well, I think they'll all be able to tell why you are there. Also, I suspect flower arranging is something where you will find a lot more married women.

From my experience, creative writing groups are good--I took one through a university when I was a new grad in a strange city, and I enjoyed the class, and some of us kept on meeting as a group for the next year, and it was at least half women in the group, and most of them were young and single. Writing as a hobby is something that requires free time, so I think it tends to attract more single folk. Or maybe it was just that this course was offered through a university, and younger folk are more apt to look at taking courses that way?

When I was in my final year at university I took a night class in children's literature, in no small part to meet women, but also because I like a lot of kids books. I enjoyed the class, and met some nice people, although shortly into that term I started dating someone I met somewhere else, so I can't comment on how easy it would have been to actually get a date from that environment. Although there were quite a few married women looking to have or who had just had kids in the class.

I happened to meet my wife in the university debating club. Not something usually available to non-students, but a good example of something that draws a mix of both genders.

Another thing to look at is charities, and similar volunteer activities. For example, annual walkathons, "run for the cure" and that type of event always need people to take registrations, man checkpoints, and so on--and usually you are working in groups. Then there are political campaigns, my friends in politics report no shortage of single women working on the campaigns of some candidates--aside from political beliefs, try to choose someone charismatic and apt to appeal to younger folk. One good thing about the political thing is that if you can speak eloquently about your political/philosophical beliefs, it can be a good way of making initial connections.

Finally, have you considered exercise classes? These are notoriously full more of women than men. Choose something really, really, beginner, and you will get lots of credit for trying to live a healthier life, and it will probably be good for you. Just try to choose one in an area where there are apt to be a lot of single folk. Going to the community centre in the middle of a suburb of single family homes is probably not a great place, but a community centre or gym near a college might work. It could be low impact aerobics, tai-chi, beginner tai-bo, water exercise, etc.

Oh, and one more thing, even if these don't lead to a date, they could lead to leads on a new job! 

Regards;

-Ed


----------



## PolarKat (May 26, 2006)

edx said:


> Another thing to look at is charities, and similar volunteer activities. For example, annual walkathons, "run for the cure" and that type of event always need people to take registrations, man checkpoints, and so on--and usually you are working in groups. Then there are political campaigns, my friends in politics report no shortage of single women working on the campaigns of some candidates--aside from political beliefs, try to choose someone charismatic and apt to appeal to younger folk. One good thing about the political thing is that if you can speak eloquently about your political/philosophical beliefs, it can be a good way of making initial connections.
> 
> Finally, have you considered exercise classes? These are notoriously full more of women than men. Choose something really, really, beginner, and you will get lots of credit for trying to live a healthier life, and it will probably be good for you. Just try to choose one in an area where there are apt to be a lot of single folk. Going to the community centre in the middle of a suburb of single family homes is probably not a great place, but a community centre or gym near a college might work. It could be low impact aerobics, tai-chi, beginner tai-bo, water exercise, etc.
> 
> Oh, and one more thing, even if these don't lead to a date, they could lead to leads on a new job!



Thanks Ed, those are some other good one's that I wouldn't have though of.. now all we need is an election  But when you mentioned community center, it sparked an idea. Most of the stuff localy is french only, and while I am fluent with french when it comes to day to day stuff, I always find myself having trouble keeping up when people switch to the local slang/accent in a social environment.. maybe some sort of french oral course.. just the question is, would that just be filled with new immigrants... who can't speak english or french..


----------



## William (May 26, 2006)

I think a Community Center would be a great place to look for females that may be BBW or FFA

William




PolarKat said:


> Thanks Ed, those are some other good one's that I wouldn't have though of.. now all we need is an election  But when you mentioned community center, it sparked an idea. Most of the stuff localy is french only, and while I am fluent with french when it comes to day to day stuff, I always find myself having trouble keeping up when people switch to the local slang/accent in a social environment.. maybe some sort of french oral course.. just the question is, would that just be filled with new immigrants... who can't speak english or french..


----------



## PolarKat (May 28, 2006)

A questions to the ladies about mannersisms, when you meet a stranger. what are the positive one's and negative one's, (eye contact.. stances.. etc..).

and as Intertia mentioned mentioned.. what is more preferable short hair or long hair?


----------



## missaf (May 28, 2006)

PolarKat said:


> A questions to the ladies about mannersisms, when you meet a stranger. what are the positive one's and negative one's, (eye contact.. stances.. etc..).
> 
> and as Intertia mentioned mentioned.. what is more preferable short hair or long hair?



Good questions!

The appearance of confidence is very important to me. A loose and relaxed body stance, and not tense usually catches my attention, because it means you're comfortable in your own skin. If he's making eye contact with me, I'd of course hope for a smile and he'd get the same right back 

I've never met a guy with long hair that was attractive to me, short and classic usually catches my eye, that and guys who are bald and are confident about it is cool, too!


----------



## Obesus (May 28, 2006)

Ya' know what most people want to be around? Someone with perk, step, pep, bounce, positivitude and energy flying out of the sockets! Most folks are just moping around, kinda' depressy and such and the experience of someone just having a grand ol' time and radiating sparks and perkitude is novel and attractive to 'em. They are saying to themselves.."Well, gosh, I want to get me some of whatever he is having...it just turns out that that something IS you!"
Well, then you say to me, "Rev....I can't just turn that stuff on with a light-switch...!" I would have to agree 200% and say.."Well sure enough, you can't force that kind of energy; you have to be in a situation where you can just naturally BE that way...around something that just delights the heck out of you!" It is whatever delights you and sparks your child-like wonder that will allow you to be yourself with no self consciousness and suddenly to be attractive to others! Something that fascinates the heck out of you...could be obscure Surrealist films of the 1920's or being mascot for an all-women roller derby team! Who knows, but you?!
The other thing is to absolutely stop looking for dates. Make the "as if" assumption that you already have a zillion cute little ladies lined up and then act "as if"....it really really really makes a difference in attitude..we use that trick over here all the time and it works...it creates a playful attitude, instead of the slightly anxious "Gotta getta date..." thing that most folks walk around with! Women can sense that a mile off..yup, they can! The worst part of this is making sure that you are tastefully dressed and well-groomed and that isn't so hard...ask a female employee at the local big and tall store what she thinks would look good on you...hint hint, wink wink, nod nod, say no more!


----------



## PolarKat (May 29, 2006)

missaf said:


> Good questions!
> 
> The appearance of confidence is very important to me. A loose and relaxed body stance, and not tense usually catches my attention, because it means you're comfortable in your own skin. If he's making eye contact with me, I'd of course hope for a smile and he'd get the same right back
> 
> I've never met a guy with long hair that was attractive to me, short and classic usually catches my eye, that and guys who are bald and are confident about it is cool, too!



I was out with a friend yesterday toy shopping, we were talking about this and he mentioned that "I lost my touch", and I was comming off negative. I didn't notice it all until he brought it up.. It's seems that If I'm doing it consciously I'm okay, but when I'm not "thinking ahead" I'm in trouble. I think the lack of trying for the last while has made me more "rusty & self concious" than I thought.. 




Obesus said:


> Well, then you say to me, "Rev....I can't just turn that stuff on with a light-switch...!" I would have to agree 200% and say.."Well sure enough, you can't force that kind of energy; you have to be in a situation where you can just naturally BE that way...around something that just delights the heck out of you!" It is whatever delights you and sparks your child-like wonder that will allow you to be yourself with no self consciousness and suddenly to be attractive to others!


Nice Post BTW!..

Things is.. I can.. I'm always reving @ 200%, I usually have to throttle back.. Converstaion with women isn't problem, I'm a real good listener, and I'm a little too versed on "Girly" topics. In the past anytime we'd go out to clubs I'd always be talking to a few women. Being the largest of the pack, you learn charisma and how to bottle butterflies to compete.. plus you get used to the rejection, and take them up on the "friends" offer.. plus I always prefered it that way so you actually get to know them, and if you match.. then character does win out.. but I was a lighter fellow then, and there seems to be a weight line for most "ordinary" women that I've crossed since, and my outings have dimminshed since everyone I know Is married. 



Obesus said:


> Make the "as if" assumption that you already have a zillion cute little ladies lined up and then act "as if"....it really really really makes a difference in attitude..we use that trick over here all the time and it works...it creates a playful attitude, instead of the slightly anxious "Gotta getta date..." thing that most folks walk around with! Women can sense that a mile off..yup, they can! The worst part of this is making sure that you are tastefully dressed and well-groomed and that isn't so hard...


I think that's the practice I'm missing spending too much time being a workaholic and not enough random flirting.. Problem is the tastefully dressed.. It's those big fellow clown clothes. Most of my clothes are nicer stuff. I even have nice fitting RL T-shirts I use for work (I've torn too many good shirts!!).
Just the pants.. or I should say belly is the problem.. can't tuck, it looks like crap with the poofy belly space on pants, and questionable with tighter fitting jeans.. and the hair might be an issue


----------



## missaf (May 29, 2006)

'Kat you sounds like an awesome guy, and it sounds like at one point you had your flirt on, so it's time to give yourself permission to get out there, look your hawt-est and get that flirt thang back on


----------



## Obesus (May 29, 2006)

I'm hearing that you're a pretty interesting fellow and certainly pleasant to be around, so we are down to some fundamentals...the clothing is critical, since folks tend to judge us at first by grooming and visual presentation...this is a case where it may be actually easier, better and more affordable to buy clothing online...just stick with some classics...nice blazer, jeans, button-down shirt...just a sense of basic style and hip-osity...I wish my ex-wife Suzi could do some style consultation with you..she is a whiz-bang! I just did a little experiment with looking for clothes online and there was no shortage of decent classic type clothing that wasn't too horribly outrageous in price. This may be an area the Board here can help yo with....and it would be a good thing for all of our lads to ponder, since this is important for everyone...

You have a good point that regardless of visual presentation, once you cross a certain size-line, women do tend to be less likely to flirt, unless they truly are out and out FFA's. We all know that FFA's are out there...but far less likely to glom onto big lads without a few positive body-language and social signals. We have discussed this in some detail on the "Where you at, FFA's?" thread and I think Miss Estrata may have a point over there with her opinement on internet dating services....it may actually be a way to just increase the mathematical odds of meeting someone who is also looking and a lot of FFA's who may be really to the shy side may be hiding out there...who knows? It is worth a shot at least on an experimental basis. Being a mad scientist can be fun!

Buffetbelly, our esteemed mentor, has also mentioned elsewhere, that it is vital to get some keywords like "teddy-bear type man" into internet ads to hit that cuddleacious-type archetype deep in the back-brain! I do agree that all of this can be a really tough nut to crack for really big men, but you seem to have a lot going for you and MissAF hits the nail on the head...you do need to get out of the cubicle or workspace and frammus them ladies all over the place! Wooo-ha!

(I should talk, since I do 55-60 hour weeks, ach!...as a matter of fact I am taking my own advice and cutting the insane schedule back for some quality socializing time, nevermind the creative work, lectures, etc)

There is one other factor of no small importance....location, location, location. I live in a Califoria city where everyone lives at the gym and being fat is really unusual....I tend to be the largest person around for miles on most days and I am not all that big. There is not a whole lot of support for being fat in the general vibe, despite our reputation for tolerance. If you are in an area where there is a general obsession with thinness, that may be something of a problem...but even Frisco has pockets of obvious fat acceptance, such as the Valencia Gulch politico-hip bi-zone...

Oh, that brings up another concept...are you at all active with size acceptance meetings? If there isn't one around for a zillion miles, that may be part of the problem...try organizing a group in your area just once a month...Meetup or Tribe or another social type Internet thingy may be a way to start...I am even thinking about going back to the impossible dream of getting a size-acceptance Meetup going in SF despite the ridiculous odds of anyone else ever actually showing up! The Magick Meetup is swimmingly successful, with a great core group...whew...I am going to chew on this one until it gives!


----------



## Ladyrose1952 (May 29, 2006)

*PolarKat*, I know just how you feel, but I am never giving up on the *man thing*. I have been in *Dry Dock* much longer than you and it is all because I don't choose to date a man just for sex.

I have been on my own now for twenty years and I know that there is absolutely nothing wrong with me... ( I don't think so anyway....LOL) I do know that I am also sucky at my choices of men so that also is a deterrent for me to find that man for me. My past experiences with men speak very loudly for themselves and it is hard to break past that phsycological barrier that I have built up through the years...

Don't give up my dear, you are young yet and there truely is someone out there for you as there is for me, we just have to figure out a bit harder how to achieve that goal.


----------



## Lynne Murray (May 29, 2006)

Wanderer, I just had to reply to the your message mentioning being a writer. I'm old enough to be your mom (old enough to be most everyone's mom here, it seems) but I am also an author and I was very amused to find out in one book on writing that publishing one's work is a good way "to meet chicks." Evidently the word "author" has the same latin root as "authority" and women like a man who is an authority. Unfortunately, men don't like that in women, but that's my problem not yours.

However, looking into my own heart (and the hearts of several other women writers I know) I must say that men who show up at writers' groups and events can usually find women to talk to. In my experience, the female-to-male ratio among writers' groups is usually way skewed towards the female, and not all of these women are middle-aged like myself. And, furthermore, some of the older ones might think you're a nice guy and want to fix you up with their daughters, nieces, babysitters, etc. This is perhaps NOT the case with science fiction writing groups and events (I don't know about those but my impression is that those have a high male-to-female ratio...hmm... but I digress...)

Now, if I remember correctly, you said you live in Mesquite, Texas, so you may not find a writers' group in the immediate neighborhood, but here's a link to some online and in Texas

http://www.writersleague.org/writersresources.htm

This may sound totally dumb, and I could be wrong, but if you could hack going to a Romance Writers of America event, you'd find it was "raining women," to paraphrase the song. Okay, so you'd have to ignore the Fabio-esque covers and stuff, but you could talk writing with some women who are very interested in writing and men and romance. Plus you're published (the old authority thingie...) and you could probably have a spirited discussion about where and how and online and all that stuff. It's got potential, Wanderer, don't rule it out. As I always say (and have often experienced) the first thing you try may not be the answer, but it may put you on the path that leads to the answer.

Okay, heading off to write and look up science fiction conventions.

Good luck all!

Lynne


----------



## Obesus (May 29, 2006)

Nice to see you back on the board over here! 



Lynne Murray said:


> ...This is perhaps NOT the case with science fiction writing groups and events (I don't know about those but my impression is that those have a high male-to-female ratio...
> ...Okay, heading off to write and look up science fiction conventions.



You are absolutely correct, that the SCi-FI/Horror/LovecraftCOC contingent is just about 95% male, so that is not really a great resource, unless you are just absolutely a "fiend"...such as moi!  

You bring up a concept that has been kicked around the boards, though, which is a BHM/FFA micro-mini ad hoc get-together somewhere in the real world...we got to the point where we just about decided on Vegas in the Fall....and I still think that is a great idea...an opportunity for folks to just talk face to face about what is going on out here in the world of BHM/BBW/FFA's, etc. I know it is one of my visionary concepts, but if nothing like this ever happens, folks who need some kind of socializing...even male to male peer support and bonding...will always be out there like lost lights at sea...I'll put a focus on it around this here joint.

I do think that writer's conventions and groups are both a good thing for the soul and for the dating prospects...in that order! :bow: Meanwhile, I want to thank you for the tips on those great books and I need to get back to my own cheesy sci-fi epic...I am just at the point where Frederick V of the Palatinate has confronted the two Catholic monks in the burned-out forest and the obscure but critical Dan Brown Da Vinci Code kinda' pre-revelation moment is about to happen!  :shocked:


----------



## William (May 29, 2006)

hi Obesus

I would say that there would be a better chance of finding a FFA at community events and community organizations.

William




Obesus said:


> Nice to see you back on the board over here!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## Lynne Murray (May 29, 2006)

Hi Tim, 

I've been lurking more than anything. But I find the efforts to put together meetings interesting. 



Obesus said:


> ... a BHM/FFA micro-mini ad hoc get-together somewhere in the real world...we got to the point where we just about decided on Vegas in the Fall....and I still think that is a great idea...an opportunity for folks to just talk face to face about what is going on out here in the world of BHM/BBW/FFA's, etc. I know it is one of my visionary concepts, but if nothing like this ever happens, folks who need some kind of socializing...even male to male peer support and bonding...will always be out there like lost lights at sea...I'll put a focus on it around this here joint.



I don't know how many people on this forum have been involved in various different events. For myself (and I am both an older person and an introvert, so "just being with people" doesn't necessarily make me feel better) the amount of effort just to attend such things has always seemed so out of proportion to the pay-off that I found myself attending fewer events. For example, every "co-ed" event I have ever been to around size acceptance has been roughly 90% female (and that's counting the couples). This would seem to be the sort of events that the BHMs would want to attend IF they liked BBWs. 

Events in the non-size acceptance focused world have a larger population, but as many opportunities for feeling separate as for solidarity. I remember going to a very nice North Beach restaurant with 11 other large women and two men (both of the men were there with their spouses/significant others). As we swept into the place in our respendent poundage we got major attention from other diners. One woman told her husband, "Put your eyes back in your head!" which is a remark that I will always treasure. But would I want to repeat that experience, at today's prices? Um, no.

I have never been involved in planning these events, because I did enough organizing in my fanatical youth to last me several lifetimes. The people who do put them together really put in a lot of effort, and I can imagine burning out from the amount of work involved. I've never been able to get together more than a few people to go to already-arranged events, but even that takes some coordination. 

What occurred to me is that it would help to include some kind of spicy(preferably free or very cheap) incentive event of interest. You're sort of doing that with your magickal meet up in that people have a subject of interest to form around. Theoretically if meetings in Vegas were coordinated around the Vegas bash events, that would be a draw also.

When I thought of that, I wondered if here in S.F. Good Vibrations still holds workshops the way they used to on things of possible interest. So that, for example, people could have dinner and then go to an appealing G.V. event. (My recollection was that some of the events were on somewhat tame subjects, like flirting or kissing, others well, less tame.) I remember bringing three friends to a slide show for the Women En Large book many years ago. We had a good time. But I looked at the GV website and found they now charge a minimum of $25/per person for the formerly free events! Eeek!

Okay, I don't get out much, so I have no useful suggestions. Next thing you're going to tell me is a cup of coffee costs more than a dollar now!

Returning to hermetical lair,
Lynne


----------



## Obesus (May 29, 2006)

You have some really good points and excellent historical insight...the whole size-related get-together thing is something that I tend to have nightmare memories around from way back in the 1980's...and it usually does tend to be mostly women who are willing to come out for an event...but I am betting with this population, that the opposite might be true...that it would mostly be big men...you just can't win.

I think that at least the slight _effort _to create an ad-hoc on-the-fly hit-and-run type event with absolutely minimal planning might be worth the effort. It is largely a reflection of the perennial problem with the BHM community that Buffetbelly and several other elders of the tribe have pointed out in the past...men do not trouble themselves to either talk to each other or come out for anything unless they are in the last stages of sheer desperation for dates or socializing. Since this is a perennial issue on the Board here, let it at least be said that someone tried to generate some interest. 

The actual solution to the dating problems of big men will have to happen on an individual basis, but some sense of support out there can be an important resource for isolated individuals. I think the kind of flirting and dating workshops that Good Vibrations has are a wonderful resource, but as you point out...they are getting pricier and pricier...and coffee is waaaay over a dollar down at Muddy Waters!  

The community-building and individual dating problems are related to each other over here and both just require patience and lots of it...building some kind of simple peer-support or supportive structure is difficult and maybe the NAAFA Big Men SIG is the better place to do it, although I am not sure how that is doing...maybe a stop over there might be enlightening! 

OK then...back to the kittens and I shall go back to the Cinder Bunny area to check on the fabulousness of her happiness level!


----------



## PolarKat (May 30, 2006)

missaf said:


> 'Kat you sounds like an awesome guy, and it sounds like at one point you had your flirt on, so it's time to give yourself permission to get out there, look your hawt-est and get that flirt thang back on



You're my angel here!! Since I've first came on (all negative and disgruntled) you've been an great positive force. It feels great to have an intelligent and beautiful woman compliment :wubu: and take interest. Would be even better if we had working transporters  




Obesus said:


> You have a good point that regardless of visual presentation, once you cross a certain size-line, women do tend to be less likely to flirt, unless they truly are out and out FFA's. We all know that FFA's are out there...but far less likely to glom onto big lads without a few positive body-language and social signals.


FFA's are women, and they aren't some sort of magical creature.. well I still have yet to meet one in person.. so they might be magical! where was I going with this.... yeah.. It's a given that they have the same expectations as anyone else. But this is a personal battle more than anything else. My frame of mind was different then, since then I've litterally dug my own hole. When I was in my early 20's I'd go vacation in Virgina Beach quite often, and at 300lbs didn't have any issue being shirtless on the beach.. today.. it's a different story.. I avoid beaches.. I need to gain back that attitude again, I replaced being social with hiding in my cubical for so long.. I've become a hermit..



Obesus said:


> There is one other factor of no small importance....location, location, location. I live in a Califoria city where everyone lives at the gym and being fat is really unusual....I tend to be the largest person around for miles on most days and I am not all that big. There is not a whole lot of support for being fat in the general vibe, despite our reputation for tolerance. If you are in an area where there is a general obsession with thinness, that may be something of a problem...but even Frisco has pockets of obvious fat acceptance, such as the Valencia Gulch politico-hip bi-zone...



(Montreal) Location sucks.. I wouldn't say it's generally a fat thing, it's more a subconcious "shallow thing".. chubby women are more common, but overall males tend to be thin if they're under 50 yrs, It's reflected in the stores, you can't find men's jeans over 42 in any non B&T shop, but you will find a women's 22+ in the same shop. There isn't a "thin" obsession, but there definately is a "Haute couture" obsession.



Obesus said:


> Oh, that brings up another concept...are you at all active with size acceptance meetings? If there isn't one around for a zillion miles, that may be part of the problem...try organizing a group in your area just once a month...


I know there's one SA group here stumbled on them by accident a while back by accident, while out playing pool.. just.. they were all women, and I only noticed thin men among them.. so... large men.. I've met very few my whole life here.. that would even have an issue with it..



Ladyrose1952 said:


> PolarKat, I know just how you feel, but I am never giving up on the man thing. I have been in Dry Dock much longer than you and it is all because I don't choose to date a man just for sex.
> I have been on my own now for twenty years and I know that there is absolutely nothing wrong with me... ( I don't think so anyway....LOL) I do know that I am also sucky at my choices of men so that also is a deterrent for me to find that man for me. My past experiences with men speak very loudly for themselves and it is hard to break past that phsycological barrier that I have built up through the years...


Can't do that either.. even if I were being used.. did I just say that I don't define my being by it's sexuality. There's quite a few thing up on the list before that. Plus, I wouldn't trade the single time off either. There's there's definately something about getting to know yourself when you're "alone" for a long period of time. I can see a lack of this in alot of people I know, and it accounts for alot of the tension they have in their realtionships since they have this dependancy on having someone with them all the time..

Quite a few of my picks have also been questionable, I've gone down in flames a few time.. and we're talking "ride of the valkyrie & Napalm", but lookng back at it, I don't think it was more the person who I picked, I think it was more myself ingoring, or not noticing.. or not bailing out when I should have..


----------



## PolarKat (May 30, 2006)

One other little item.. just wondering why the other big fellows haven't chimed in?


----------



## missaf (May 30, 2006)

PolarKat said:


> One other little item.. just wondering why the other big fellows haven't chimed in?




It's Memorial Day Weekend for the Americans, they're all too busy stuffing their faces.


----------



## Wanderer (May 30, 2006)

Oh, before I get underway: Would you believe I can't find an Internet cafe anywhere? Mesquite's seen a total of one startup, and the place died before I could get in the door. The only one I can even find online is somewhere in Garland (not far) and charges $5/hour to use their computers (not fair!).

I could try Wi-Fi (I have a Vaio laptop... my only 'puter since a corrupted registry crashed my desktop), but most places don't give you actual access; they give you a means to access your wireless account with your laptop. That lets out every Borders and Starbucks in Dallas County. Still, I hear Genghis Grill has real Wi-Fi... now if I can just get over there...



Lynne Murray said:


> Wanderer, I just had to reply to the your message mentioning being a writer. I'm old enough to be your mom (old enough to be most everyone's mom here, it seems)



I wouldn't be too sure; my mother didn't have me until she was 35. 



Lynne Murray said:


> but I am also an author and I was very amused to find out in one book on writing that publishing one's work is a good way "to meet chicks." Evidently the word "author" has the same latin root as "authority" and women like a man who is an authority. Unfortunately, men don't like that in women, but that's my problem not yours.



<chuckle> Pity we're not closer together, or it'd be neither; the first thing I look for in a woman is a keen intellect, and that pretty well means they're going to have their own opinions. Ah, well, my usual perfect combination of time and place. 



Lynne Murray said:


> However, looking into my own heart (and the hearts of several other women writers I know) I must say that men who show up at writers' groups and events can usually find women to talk to. In my experience, the female-to-male ratio among writers' groups is usually way skewed towards the female, and not all of these women are middle-aged like myself. And, furthermore, some of the older ones might think you're a nice guy and want to fix you up with their daughters, nieces, babysitters, etc.



It's a nice idea, I admit. I could certainly use the variety while handing out applications.



Lynne Murray said:


> This is perhaps NOT the case with science fiction writing groups and events (I don't know about those but my impression is that those have a high male-to-female ratio...hmm... but I digress...)



It's been said, but bears repeating: Science fiction has a distinct paucity of women in it. For all that some of the best writers are female (Andre Norton, Anne McCaffrey), an annoyingly large number of amateur writers are male. The running gag is that it's because of all the gadgetry in "standard" science fiction stories; you know, the same reason there are more guys on the Internet. 



Lynne Murray said:


> Now, if I remember correctly, you said you live in Mesquite, Texas, so you may not find a writers' group in the immediate neighborhood, but here's a link to some online and in Texas
> 
> http://www.writersleague.org/writersresources.htm



Found and favorited. A lot are in Austin, naturally (the Hollywood of Texas, with all that implies), but a few things in Dallas.



Lynne Murray said:


> This may sound totally dumb, and I could be wrong, but if you could hack going to a Romance Writers of America event, you'd find it was "raining women," to paraphrase the song. Okay, so you'd have to ignore the Fabio-esque covers and stuff, but you could talk writing with some women who are very interested in writing and men and romance. Plus you're published (the old authority thingie...) and you could probably have a spirited discussion about where and how and online and all that stuff. It's got potential, Wanderer, don't rule it out. As I always say (and have often experienced) the first thing you try may not be the answer, but it may put you on the path that leads to the answer.



Nice idea, though the next several events for RWA are in Atlanta, GA. That's, er, a _little_ far. Their offices may be in Spring, TX, but they don't seem to have much of a presence here.



Lynne Murray said:


> Okay, heading off to write and look up science fiction conventions.
> 
> Good luck all!
> 
> Lynne



<chuckle> I'll need it. Thanks muchly for the suggestions, many of them very good. Hopefully I'll get some time and money together soon and put them into practice.

<shrug> Yeah, sounds real comitted, huh? But the school year's over, and that means no more paychecks until next school year begins. Unless I manage to find some job in the meantime, of course... I hear some jobs actually have insurance these days. Is that true? 

Yours truly,

The uninsured, unemployed, and frankly uncomfortable,

Wanderer


----------



## glampriss (May 30, 2006)

*I wish you the best of luck. I think I waited my whole life for my husband..it takes time. The quick fix hyper social antics one sees in movies and on TV are not accurate and leave many people feeling lonely at worst and frustrated at best.. 

I think genderless hobbies could help... like cooking classes, computer classes, etc There are art classes that aren't totally girly/crafty. You can take up glass blowing, oil painting... 

See it might not be where you go and how often, but what kinds of people these activities or places attract. I used to go to nightclubs and I'd wonder why I was always ignored... well a plus sized girl at rock shows back in the 90's wasn't cutting it. Those places attracted men who liked tall blondes with a narrow waist.. it wasn't my crowd.. If I only knew about bbw dances back then.. Do you have them in you area? That might be a place to start.*


----------



## Qit el-Remel (May 30, 2006)

Wanderer said:


> On a lighter note, is anyone besides me familiar with fatfurs? They're people who like fat cartoon characters, and some of them are FAs and FFAs as well.


_*Qit waves.*_ Hi!

-Qit


----------



## Wanderer (May 30, 2006)

Qit el-Remel said:


> _*Qit waves.*_ Hi!
> 
> -Qit



Oh, hi, Qit! Fancy running into you here!

How's it going?

Yours in passing,

The wolfish,

Wanderer


----------

